What is the difference between liberal and conservative morality?

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  1. peoplepower73 profile image82
    peoplepower73posted 2 weeks ago

    I have been on these forums for years and have observed the difference between conservative morality and liberal morality and now with Trumpism, there is a third morality.

    Conservatives could care less about Jan.6 while liberals continue to bring it up. Why is that? Because liberals believe what they saw and heard on that day. Trumpers could care less about it.  In fact, they say, Trump is president now so let’s move on. In other words, look, the other way because Trump is going to do great things for this country, in fact, they are giddy about it. But to liberals it’s about the truth and accountability. 

    Trumpers could care less about Trump’s criminal acts. What is important to liberals’ moral compass is not important to Trumpers moral compass. The fact that he has lied over 30,000 times in his first term means nothing to them.  Trump has freed 1,500 criminals from jail and now he is giving some of them prime positions in his administration.  It is a strange love fest. It is apparent that if you show love to Trump, he will show it back to you. Apparently he needs to be adored by his followers, regardless if they have been convicted just like him.  To me, that is a sign of extreme narcissism.

    The bottom line is that liberal values are based on truth and facts and liberty for all no matter what gender or sex you are.  Nature never does anything in a straight line.  But Trump is legislating nature with his decrees about only two genders. Trumpers are only concerned about a woman’s vagina and preventing necessary life-saving abortions. Trumpers are only concerned about the fetus.  Once the child is born, they could care less, because they will become part of the nanny state.

    Trumpers define their America and patriotism by closing the borders to those who they think don’t belong here and deport them.  The 14th  amendment clearly states that American citizenship is a birthright for all people who are born on American soil.  Trump has announced he wants to end it. Not only would this unravel 150 years of American law, it would loosen a significant cornerstone of the Constitution’s interpretation of American identity.

    Now he has taken away John Bolton’s security detail that was protecting him from Iranian attacks because Bolton saw what Trump is really about and bad mouthed him. Now Bolton can be exposed and killed by Iranian terrorists.  Trump is revengeful for those who tell the truth about him. I’m sure he has no problem sleeping at night because he has no conscious. His brain is not wired for remorse.

    While Trump was campaigning, he kept saying he knew nothing about Project 2025, but now we are seeing it unfolding every day with our eyes and ears. It is being implemented every day he is in office and will continue for his term in office. 

    But in my book, he is and will always be a lying narcissistic master con-artist who has bought his way out of being convicted for many criminal acts. He has the billions to buy the best lawyers in town. They have helped him distract, delay, defend deny, and deceive until he was elected president.

    If you stole a loaf of bread, you would go to jail, but not when you have billions and can buy your way out of it and become the president of the United State of America. It will be interesting to see how Project 2025 unfolds and what lasting effects it will have on all of us. I know one thing for sure. The petroleum industry does not want Drill Baby Drill, because they say we currently have the world’s largest stock pile of oil and they don’t want to spend any more money or effort increasing it.

    Trump dropped out the Paris Accords which is all about global warming, but he and his people don’t believe in that.  However, he is going to have to deal with the effects of it as it has created severe weather conditions in America. Politicians call it climate change, but worldwide it is global warming as ocean temperatures become warmer.  It is getting colder in the east and warmer in the west. 

    I live in SoCal where the winds and hot weather have created a literal holocaust. I know he hates our state and our governor.  It will be interesting to see how he deals with that and with no FEMA to pay for the damages to people and structures.

    I know this is not going to change any Trumpers minds, but this forum gives me a way to express myself and my observations of what I think is happening to our country in terms of the differences in moral justice..

    1. Sharlee01 profile image85
      Sharlee01posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

      I’m not going to delve into my deeper views, but I’ll try to lightly respond to your post.

      It’s clear you’ve spent a lot of time thinking about these issues, and I can appreciate that you feel strongly about them. However, it's important to keep in mind that people’s perspectives, especially regarding politics and morals, are shaped by a variety of experiences and values. When it comes to Trump supporters, it’s not about ignoring the truth or accountability, but rather about focusing on what they see as positive contributions or progress, even while acknowledging flaws.

      The moral differences you point out aren’t always as simple as you might perceive. For example, many conservatives view the issue of abortion and gender through a different lens, prioritizing the protection of life and freedom of speech, but that doesn’t mean they lack empathy or care about other issues. There’s also often a tendency to assume motives and intentions without considering the broader context of the political landscape.

      As for the 14th Amendment, there’s ongoing debate about immigration policy, and while you may not agree with Trump’s stance, it’s important to recognize that others feel just as strongly about border security and the rule of law. On matters of character, many conservatives also call out Trump when they disagree with his actions. It’s not all about blind loyalty, but rather about focusing on what they believe he can do for the country.

      While you may see Trump’s actions through a critical lens, others interpret them differently, sometimes seeing them as necessary for preserving certain values. That being said, I think it’s worth noting that adopting a superior attitude toward those who disagree with you isn’t helpful in fostering productive dialogue. Everyone deserves respect, regardless of their political stance, and treating people with an open mind can go a long way in understanding where they’re coming from. It’s essential to have a balanced view of both sides of the discussion instead of assuming one side has a monopoly on morality or truth. We all need to remember that healthy discourse is rooted in respect for differing views, not just in reinforcing our own.

      1. peoplepower73 profile image82
        peoplepower73posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

        What you have said in so many words is there is a difference in conservative  and liberal moral values. While experience may play a minor role in those values, I believe they are imbedded in our DNA. What is morally important to Trumpers politically is not as important to me politically and vice versa. 

        We are driven by fulfilling our needs because it makes us feel good when they are fulfilled. When they are not fulfilled it makes feel bad.
        Trumpers love to go to his rallies because it fulfills a need in them and also a need in him... I on the other hand would not go to one if he paid me to go. It's what cognitive dissonance is all about. I had a need to write and post this forum because it fulfills a need in me.

        I have a conservative friend who says, I respect your opinion, but don't try to change mine.  That is cognitive dissonance at work.

        Thanks for dropping by.

        1. Sharlee01 profile image85
          Sharlee01posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

          I wanted to share that I can see you put a lot of thought into your original post. I feel that more threads like this would be a positive thing.

          Thank you for sharing your thoughts so thoughtfully. I completely understand what you’re saying about the difference in moral values between conservatives and liberals, and how deeply rooted those values can feel—almost like they’re part of who we are. I also think you’re right that we’re driven by fulfilling our needs, and those needs vary widely depending on our beliefs, experiences, and what resonates with us personally.

          It’s interesting how you describe the dynamic at Trump rallies and how they fulfill something specific for his supporters. Even though that’s not something that appeals to you, your perspective helps highlight how we all seek connection and validation in different ways. I also appreciate your point about respecting opinions while not trying to change someone else’s—it reflects a healthy way to approach differences, even when cognitive dissonance is in play.

          Thanks again for posting this—it’s always good to hear different viewpoints. I hope others stop in and share.

          1. Ken Burgess profile image69
            Ken Burgessposted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

            You're a good person, you try to find common ground and express opinions in a moderate light.

            Just wanted to say that.

            The old saying: "two wrongs don't make a right"...

            Its one thing to have many negative feelings towards Trump or "the right".

            The problem, as I see it, was the willingness to be completely blind to the corruption and criminal acts of "their side" the last 4 years.

            Whether it was about reckless spending and inflation.

            Or the Border being open in fact, if not in words/propaganda.

            Or the starting of new wars and the sabotage of negotiations and treaties.

            Or the cover up that "they" put into office a man with dementia.

            Three elections of them ignoring the people on "their" side, giving the voters Clinton rather than Sanders... or Biden rather than Sanders... or Harris rather than a real Primary.

            Its a head scratcher for sure...

            But clearly by 2024, the majority of Americans had finally caught on.

            1. Sharlee01 profile image85
              Sharlee01posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

              In my comment to PeoplePower, I addressed his thoughts on the differences in moral values between conservatives and liberals, recognizing how deeply rooted and personal those values can be. I shared my agreement that our priorities often stem from a mix of innate beliefs, learned experiences, and what resonates with us personally.

              Your comment brings up a different, though related, issues—how blind loyalty to one’s political side can lead to ignoring corruption and mismanagement. I completely agree with this perspective, and I think it’s an important point to consider. Blind allegiance often results in overlooking serious issues, like reckless spending, the chaos at the border, the mismanagement of foreign conflicts, or questionable leadership choices.

              What makes this topic different is that it moves beyond personal moral values and focuses on the practical consequences of refusing to hold one’s own side accountable. I’ve seen how this has played out, from policy failures to the sidelining of popular candidates within the Democratic Party, like Sanders in favor of Clinton or Biden. Your thought about voters finally catching on by 2024 resonates with me because I agree with that thought 100%.

              1. Ken Burgess profile image69
                Ken Burgessposted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

                It was the character assassination of anyone who stepped out of line and questioned what was going on.

                Elon Musk is the primary example of this, he was a 'Lefty'... he was pursuing EVs and Solar Energy and Peace not War stuff, no debating this.

                He was also very open minded, and this led to his becoming Public Enemy #2 right behind Trump... because he would expose corruption when he found it, like the Twitter Files... or he would call out BS when California told him he had to shut down his facilities because of Covid, well after the time when other States had reversed that trend and removed restrictions due to the Pandemic... and so on...

                I think another big one was how the Biden Administration went on the attack against him because he would not unionize Tesla and he would not support their DEI initiatives... and when you are building cutting edge technologies like Neuralink and Space X you don't have a place for idiocy like DEI, you need the best most competent people for the job, regardless of race or sex, or the government's quota system.

                On a side note, employees in Tesla and Space X (and I know plenty of them) are now millionaires because they got stocks, in addition to a hefty salary.  They wouldn't get anything like that working for GM or Ford or NASA even.

                Instead of embracing him, they went out of their way to destroy him...

                1. Sharlee01 profile image85
                  Sharlee01posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

                  Yes, the comment was definitely a character assassination, but is this really new? Haven’t we heard all of People Power’s grievances—and more—already? I could have argued and pointed out my own views on each issue, but honestly, I’ve pretty much beaten that dead horse countless times. It should be clear that we have two sides here on the HP forum, and it’s also obvious that we’re not going to change each other’s minds. I feel like you already know how I feel about most of the issues surrounding Biden, Trump, and both parties.

                  My comment to People Power was really about drawing a civil line in the sand. What I mainly wanted to point out was, “It was interesting how he describes the dynamic at Trump rallies and how they fulfill something specific for his supporters. Even though that’s not something that appeals to him, his perspective helps highlight how we all seek connection and validation in different ways. I just wanted to remind him that we all have different perspectives on these issues.

                  I agree with your thoughts on Elon Musk. It's clear that over the past decade, the left has really tried to cancel people, but I feel that era is behind us. They've ended up looking foolish, especially when it comes to going after Musk. He's clearly a genius, an entrepreneur, and a humanitarian. Their attempts to cancel him totally backfired, and in a way, they did us a favor. The left and Democrats look ridiculous—they lost and were outdone by a man they tried so hard to cancel. I’m not sure why more people don’t see that.

                  I recognized this, which is why I was confident Trump would win. I also believe he'll accomplish historic things in his next four years—and he'll make it all look effortless.

                  1. peoplepower73 profile image82
                    peoplepower73posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

                    I have had a lot of (CBT) Cognitive Based Therapy. It is actually very simple. When you view Trump, you see your glass half full because you are expecting all the good things he is going to do for the country and it makes you feel good. 

                    When I view Trump, I see his glass half empty and it makes me feel bad because I focus on the bad things he has done and I'm afraid of  what he is going to do with the country.. 

                    However, when you view Biden, you see his glass half empty because you are only focused on the bad things you think he has done and it makes you feel bad.

                    When I view Biden, I see his glass half full, because I focus on the good things he has done as president and for the country and it makes me feel good.

                    CBT also has to do with framing.  If you look at a picture of people sun bathing on the beach and it has a black frame around it, you know something is wrong and it makes you feel uneasy. However if you view the same picture and it has a bright cheery colored frame around it that is very pleasing, then you feel good.

                    That is precisely what politicians do. They frame their narratives to make themselves look good and make their opponents look bad, based on ones values and belief systems.

                    The idea is to look for the good things in people and events so that you feel good.  I can't do that with Trump and I'm sure you can't do that with Biden because we have too much invested in our values and belief systems. So we are back to cognitive dissonance.

                    That will be $50.00 for this session please.

    2. DrMark1961 profile image99
      DrMark1961posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

      Fifteen years ago I would have agreed with you on a lot of this but I do not think you have noticed how much the Democrats have changed. As several people on the left have complained lately "I did not leave the party. The party left me."

      The bottom line is that Democrat liberal values are based on lies, a refucsal to accept basic biology, and supprt a view that any woman that wants to get pregnant has the right to murder he baby.  Trump is trying to legislate some of those things that most people in your country agree with, and as long as the leftists claim that men can walk around girls locker rooms naked as long as they claim to be a female, pornography is okay in school libraries, and other ludicrous things like that, the Dems are handing him the power to change what he wants.

      If you have problems with Trump being in power, you should be blaming Biden and the people that controlled what he was allowed to do and say.

      1. peoplepower73 profile image82
        peoplepower73posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

        You want to blame democrats for Trump being elected and yet you made this statement: "Trump is trying to legislate some of those things that most people in your country agree with." From what I can see so far, it's not about most people agreeing with Trump.  Please define "most people."

        It is about him doing what he always wanted do, by satisfying his own ideals as to how the country should be run. Everybody is just along for the Project 2025 ride that has been years in the making by conservatives. It has nothing to do with democrats or Biden. It has to do with the republicans master plan to takeover the country.

        I just wonder how many people who are being deported actually voted for Trump?  He used them to increase his vote count. How many of those people had menial jobs that no red blooded American would want, but yet are necessary for running our economy?

        1. DrMark1961 profile image99
          DrMark1961posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

          Most people is defined by the majority of voters in the US.
          If there were unseen voters out there that did not agree with the way he thinks the US should be run they could have gotten out of the house and voted. They did not  because the candidate that the Democrats selected, with absolutely no votes, was not a person who supported their values.
          Despite what some people think, it was not all about inflation. If the Dems were not so interested in telling all males that they are misogynists and did not refuse to accept basic biology about crossdressers that are pretending to be women, they would have had a much better chance of winning the election.
          You comment on the illegals working at jobs that no red blooded Amercian wants but anything he does, including deporting the illegals that have come to your country to continue their gang activity, is on the shoulders of the Democratic party, the ones who so effectively got Trump elected.

          1. Credence2 profile image81
            Credence2posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

            A majority of voters supported Biden in 2020, did you respect their choice of candidate and proposed direction in the same manner?

            1. DrMark1961 profile image99
              DrMark1961posted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

              No, and if leftists want to get on here and complain about things that is fine and certainly their right. What he said, however, was " From what I can see so far, it's not about most people agreeing with Trump.  Please define "most people." I answered that question quite clearly.
              You can answer it if you want. Your answer will be different but fundamentally the same. I certainly doubt that many people agree with everything he does 100% of the time. A recent survey revealed that 65 percent of Americans, and not just the voters, agreed that illegal aliens that commit crimes should be deported. (Yes, I realize it matters how you frame the question.)

          2. gmwilliams profile image83
            gmwilliamsposted 2 weeks agoin reply to this

            I just want to congratulate you on your 100 score.  That is beyond phenomenal.

 
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