Should a woman get an abortion if she was....

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   gmwilliamsposted 12 years ago

   I do not HAVE a comprehension problem.  Obviously you and Margolyn have!  I have had  more than enough of this utter inanity from you two!  Begone!

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      Cassie Smithposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      No.

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2. 60

   TMMasonposted 12 years ago

   Cranfordjs wrote:
   
   "Who cares! 12-20 percent of all known pregnancies end in miscarriage. Jesus is the ultimate abortion-er." 
   
   
   So you missed the big book God gave us, to tell us all about, in no uncertain terms, the fractured, broken, creation we live in? What you are talking about is a part of this fractured Nature.

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      autumn18posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Do we need a book to tell us that there are wrong, bad, broken things in this world? We can't observe and experience them to know that they happen?

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         TMMasonposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         He was blaming God.
         
         I simply pointed out that God has warned us and been clear this is a broken creation, and there are consquences to it.
         
         That is all.

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3. 60

   Ghoztposted 12 years ago

   That was very well said.  Kudos!

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4. 60

   PENTOPAPERSposted 12 years ago

   Their are so many people on here who believe that being informed will provid epeople with better options. There was a young woman on a Oprah show and she was repeatedly raped by her father and uncle and ended up having a baby from this horrific  situation. When the baby was born she would throw up around it and assumed it was normal. When the show aired the boy was around 5 or 6 and she would still vomit when she was around the child and the child knew that he was making his mother sick. This is one scenario.
   
   In education, there are many unwanted children whom never learn because they don't have food, their parents are on drugs, they are being raped at home and other host of reasons. These children often times come from unwanted or unplanned pregnancies.
   Teachers then get blamed for these same children not being able to succeed in the classroom.  No one is adopting these said children.
   
   The people that do adopt mostly go to other countries to do so.
   
   No woman should be encouraged with "proper" misleading information to have a baby she doesn't want. The baby wont save her or make her a better person if she needs therapy, has no food, no housing, been raped repeatedly etc. Mothers have to be happy in order for the family to be happy. Regardless of your beliefs the mother is the earth in the family. Her happiness dictates how happy the children will be. You can research statistics and check the facts through out the world on how violence against women is directly linked to family unit surviving.

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   1. 83

      gmwilliamsposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      To Pentopapers:  You are so right.  This is why I state that NO WOMAN should be forced to have a child if she is raped.  That is abuse to the milnillionth degree.  Any "human" being who advocates such a thing is totally barbaric indeed.  Women who are forced to endure pregnancy and have that child suffer severe psychological repercussions.   I repeat the example of actress Eartha Kitt, who was the product of rape.  She related in her autobiography that she was constantly abused and scapegoated by her immediate family.  She further relayed that the abuse continued until she ran away from home as a teenager.
      
      Children who are unwanted tend to be abused both verbally and physically.  They are also scapegoated by their parents and other family members.  Have you heard of the scapegoated child syndrome.  Well, this is when one child is singled out for differential treatment by their parents-differential treatment of the most abominable kind.   These children are sometimes killed by the mother through horrific physical abuse.   This is totally inhumane.  Yes, I am going to say this- the mother would have been better off if she had aborted the child than to have it and abuse it in such a fashion.
      
      Abortion in its early stages is not murder at all.   There are some instances in which abortion is permittable such as rape.   As I have said before, NO CHILD should be unwanted and all pregnancies should be anticipated with joy, not to be endured onerously.   I have said my piece, Amen.   I want to add to all have a Happy and Joyous New Year!

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5. 78

   jesimpkiposted 12 years ago

   I feel that it would be the woman's choice.  If she couldn't handle the emotional stress of having to care for a child that was the product of something horrific, keeping the child could be more damaging to her mentally over time.  If she however chose to love the child and care for it, then more power to her because that would be a very strong woman indeed.

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6. 73

   Mighty Momposted 12 years ago

   But this thread is not about abortion in general or the father's rights to a child begotten (for lack of a better modern word) within a relationship.
   It is about how to deal with the sexual consequences of a violent crime.
   The father in question has committed a crime against the pregnant woman.
   
   Just curious, but does anyone here advocate that the rapist should have paternity rights?
   He certainly didn't consider the rights (or humanity)of the woman when he impregnated her against her will.
   Without looking it up, I would imagine that he would legally forfeit any legal rights because he is a criminal. But that is probably not the case.
   
   Any rapist's rights advocates among us???

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7. 73

   Mighty Momposted 12 years ago

   Let's get real here, people.
   The vast majority of rapes do not get reported.
   Most rape victims will never get the satisfaction of seeing their rapist brought to justice or spend time behind bars.
   So she's already behind the 8-ball emotionally. She's a crime victim and is left to deal with a senseless crime against her body.
   Then she finds out she is pregnant as a result of that rape.
   The psycho-socio-economic impact of that fact is HUGE.
   It's not like being down with a cold for 7 days.
   We're talking being pregnant for 9 months. That has physical and psychological implications.
   Then she has to give birth.
   Unless you've done it you have no idea how traumatic labor and delivery are.
   Then, after all that, it is also traumatic to give up a child for adoption.
   And in this case she would be giving away a baby who could end up having daddy's genes and grow up to be a rapist as well.
   WHY?
   Why, when there are already hundreds of thousands of kids in need of protection and care through adoption or foster care.
   
   I'm sorry, but this view of rape victims as nothing more than incubators for babies who may grow up and be productive citizens (but just as possibly may be premies, born addicted or born with 1000 strikes against ever having a happy life) is just cruel.
   
   If a diehard pro-life woman wants to carry the baby to term that is her choice.
   But no one can/should judge a woman who has already been criminally violated for doing anything and everything she can to put the trauma behind her and try to heal herself. That, in and of itself, is a full-time job.
   I say that from personal experience -- and my rape was "easy" compared to most.

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      anjegirlposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Boy this thing is en fuego,
      
      Happy New Year Everyone!!!
      
      Mighty Mom you are always the Voice of Reason in the Storm. Bless you momma. You too, Ms.Williams and may God hold and keep safe the victims of this horrible crime. I told my story a few pages back and like dozens of others who have innocently come onto this forum to have dialog and answer a very, very deeply emotional,I was hijacked by Margolyn and her wrath. More about that in a minute.
      
      I have been raped twice forty years ago in the early 70's in college and my first rape made me pregnant with a mixed race baby. I had not had a happy childhood, my mom was dictatorial and I was her scapegoat child. Everything that went wrong in the world was somehow my fault.I had two younger brothers and mom treated them like gold and they all had an amazing life. The four of them,mom,dad and my brothers,were soooo happy and yet my life was always like I was outside (the house) watching this perfect little family on the inside that I could never be part of. I spent 60 years groveling to be a part of this perfect little family. Both of my parents went to Heaven unexpectedly in the past four years and I am estranged from my brothers.
      
      My mom took me for the first ever abortion at KU Med center. There was no discussion: we just went. If I had been in control of the decision which I was not, I knew then and know today that I did the right thing.And I am certainly not LIMPING through life as Margolyn has suggested happens to all of us.
      
      I have a lot of male genes, not enough to make me a lesbian but certainly enough to make me a tomboy.I played with animals and not dolls and I played and was great at sports at a time when very few girls were in sports and when my parents bought a cattle ranch when I was six, I rode like the other ranch hands and bailed hay and built fence and worked cattle with the men and boys and my mom who herself had an overabundance of male genes.For forty years I have worked with men and have never been a secretary. I have a secretary.
      
      I never wanted to birth my own child and I didn't. Do I wish that I would have had that child four decades ago. Hell no. God never intended all women to have babies. Literally hundreds of parents have told me from coast to coast that they envied me and that they were sorry that they had children. My mom made the right decision for me and I have always been glad I did not have any children. Since I started grade school,I have been bringing home other peoples children and have taken in almost one hundred over 6 decades. I am very proud of that.I have motherly instincts but was horrified at the "idea" of birthing a child. I haven't know many girls who felt like I did and do about birthing a child, but when a guy says,"the mom should just carry that baby and give it to the father" I want to come through the pages of the screen. You do it!!! My body is not an incubator. I agree that today's kids use abortion as birth control and that only 5% of rapes are reported. That is evident from these comments,but if you are not capable of getting pregnant or birthing a child I do not want to hear what you have to say. You can't get it! If you have not been raped, you cannot get that either and if you were raped and had or did not have that child you cannot tell the next woman what to do. 
      
      I opened the first rape crisis center in Lake Tahoe from my home and ran it for ten years until the government wanted in on it. I counseled these girls for free and still do. No government intervention. I wrote a hub asking this same question and have a poll running on it as well. As of two days ago when I was last on this stuff 80% of the people believed the mom should get an abortion. I have begun counseling two young girls since I published my hub and mighty mom has been counseling,advising and encouraging so many of you through her efforts to bring this subject into the LIGHT. I have never seen a talk show on rape or abortion and that is really hard to wrap your brain around if you really think about it. Oprah did a few shows on women who had been raped using politically correct verbage like "sexual assault" or "molestation" etc. Even though she was a victim of childhood rape even Oprah didn't say it on TV.
      
      I am encouraged to see people talking about such a deeply painful subject for the one in three women in America and the one in twelve men in America who have been or will be raped. Bravo to all of you who are here and on Mighty mom's hub and on my hub openly and honestly and so bravely telling your stories and searching for healing and answers. I had two amazing therapists who got me beyond sooo much stuff with my childhood and then the rapes. But the most healing one can get comes from helping others for whom rape is fresh. There is absolutely healing after rape and in the next few days I am going to write a hub offering many of the techniques I used to get over it and go on with my life. No limping here, Margolyn.
      
      As a teen and in my early twenties I was horrified at the idea of getting pregnant, so I didn't have sex, much to my long term boyfriends dismay, but I DID NOT want a child and no one was handing out birth control like today. Kids today are lazy about birth control and Maury Povich has produced a show for a decade which only airs shows looking for some teenagers babydaddy and some of them are on their 20-25th DNA tests and still can't find their baby's daddy. Ridiculous and a serious lack of parenting in these homes. I decided at age 15 when reading in the Farmers Almanac that we were beginning to overpopulate the planet and that this would eventually lead us to worldwide starvation. I have continued to follow this very real ever encroaching problem in the world and today we have a billion more people on the planet than we are growing food to feed and more than a million children in America tonite will go to bed hungry. Overpopulation and unwanted children in America is one of the major reasons that our country is plummetting economically I am about to write a hub about this.
      Some of you got in on the tail end of a two day argument that myself and several others had with Margolyn when I first came to this forum and just like so many others, I first believed that the picture was of her. I have repeatedly said that my profile picture is my niece and that I would use my picture if my computor would recognize my scanner to do so. Have to call HP and spend hours on the phone. So the woman in her picture is about half her age at 67 and she has been jumping in and out of this forum for 8 months and that is all she does on Hub pages and when people see her sweet picture and think she is in her 30's they jump in and try to save her from herself and her anger and what always happens is that she eventually pisses off tons of ppl. and then she uses her two favorite phrases when she starts her
      
      MOMMY, MOMMY, WHY DID YOU KILL ME----AND THEN SHE ADVOCATES THAT THESE YOUNG GIRLS  "KILL THEIR RAPISTS"  and then when people try to help her again thinking she is young and very angry, she just keeps saying the same thing over and over.
      
      I recently found a way to access all of one persons comments on a forum and you can see this is the only thing she has to say and her comments and her picture are deceiptful and confusing to all the new people who come here for the first time. So Mighty mom, Ms. Williams and I are all following her actions because she has said some very wreckless things here and goads and guilts young girls who chose to abort their babies of their rapes and tells everyone who will listen that they have to do what she did and sadly she is still angry and getting her anger out on this forum.
      
      I called a friend of mine last week who is a lawyer advocate for unwanted children and asked her if Margolyn's repetitive goading is cyber-bullying and if it is against the law to advocate that a woman kill her rapist. I already knew all of this to be true but wanted to hear from a lawyer. Her answers were yes, and Hell yes!! Both charges carry serious legal consequences and I have already been saying that here and she went on to tell me that each incident can be charged as separate offenses and she has said this over and over again for 8 months to many many victims of rape.
      
      My friend said that the Secret Service has jurisdiction over cyber-bullying and that her actions are clearly that when put into context with each new person she does it with and that to advocate that a victim murder her rapist is two crimes: advocating murder and a hate crime and again she with every new victim there is potential for a new charge and again, I have been telling her this for a week now.It is one thing to say these things once but to do it ad infinitum for 8 months is a compilation of those crimes and could each be considered as a separate charge. So let's all see how this plays out,shall we?
      
      Happy New Year little angels and may we pray for peace and love for all the victims of these unthinkable crime of rape. Analise

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