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I believe so. I believe sexual orientation has nothing to do with one's ability to be a good parent (or a bad one). I have a video for you to watch.
Tell me what you think.
If you are for it, why?
IF you are against it, why?
Yes, they should, as they long as they pass the home study, like any other prospective adoptive parent.
I have no problem whatsoever with it, or with gay marriage.
Agreed, SmartAndFun. Thanks for sharing.
I didn't watch the video because my internet is too slow, and at the risk or starting an argument, I am against gays or lesbians adopting.
NOT because they won't make good parents - they may well make fantastic parents - but because that child when he or she goes to school is going to be made to suffer daily.
Children are horrendously cruel to other children who are different.
By different, kids with glasses get tormented, kids with red hair, kids who are fat.
A kid with two mothers or two fathers will never hear the end of it.
Kids are at school for what - 12 years? 12 formative years, 12 years that could shape the rest of their lives.
It's OK for the rich to adopt, they probably can afford to arrange private tuition, but for Joe Public, I think the risk is too great, unless the child is somehow brought up with enough confidence to withstand it.
When schools were integrating, should the black parents have backed off because the ridicule (and you better believe it, honey, they were called everything in the book) that their children would face? What does it take for equality in our country. It's unfortunate what children must suffer, but, 1) Often what children display is what they learn at home and 2) Children can be tough, especially if their parents are well-involved in their lives, and building them up and filling them with love every day. I was made fun of for all different reasons growing up, but eventually it ended. Only the occasional thing here or there. I am fine now, stronger even, and more compassionate and understanding because of it.
I was tormented because my parents came from funny-sounding countries no one had heard of and we ate funny food. I have no regrets and I hope to G-d my parents don't.
The whole black/white thing is not something I have experience of. In my school, there was one or two black kids, but no-one thought anything of it.
Guess that's an adult thing as someone says, it depends what you hear in the home, and we'd never heard of racism!
Then what about hetero couples who are physically disabled? Should they not be allowed to adopt since their kids will get made fun of for having parents who look different because they are in wheel chairs, or sound different because they have an electrolarynx to help them speak?
Maybe the red-haired, glasses-wearing people shouldn't be allowed to procreate either, because their offspring will get made fun of or having those traits?
You have taken my argument slightly out of context, but point taken (for the sake of harmony) LOL
Yeah sorry... I'm just trying to say that the "they'll get made fun of" excuse doesn't really fly, IMHO. Everybody gets made fun of for something, and plenty of things that people were made fun of for years ago no longer have a stigma, because people like the kid in the video were sensible enough and brave enough to stand up for what is right. You can't let the threat of being made fun of stop you from going after your dreams, that's all.
It's probably just me that is out-of-step with the modern day realities. For the last 2 years I have barely stepped across the threshold, and have neither TV nor newspapers, so don't pay any attention to me whatsoever.
Perhaps indeed times have changed.
A couple of months ago, I read online about a kid (aged about 14) in Glasgow, in one of the roughest areas, whose school expelled him for turning up dressed as a girl.
Seems he has gender issues and is preparing for a sex change operation. The school were fully informed, but on the given day this lad turned up wearing a skirt, he was sent home as being unsuitably dressed.
All the kids in the school were in uproar and staged a protest - this is a far cry from bullying brats who look down on those who are 'different'.
I was so proud to read of those pupils objections to the horrendous attitude of the school.
Times have changed, and for the better. I just wanted to hug this kid when I read about him.
I'm sorry if I sound like a complete class A d-bag, but that is a terrible argument; particularly about rich people being able to adopt and regular citizens not. When I was in elementary school, I was beat up, made fun of, teased- you name it. And I came from a hetero family. In HS, one of my boyfriends was the most popular kid in school, test tube baby he was; he was the son of two lesbians. One being a crack head at that. I think a lot of this has to do with area and honestly, being a lesbian (I came out at the end of HS, after the boyfriend:]), birds of a feather flock together. From my personal experience, homosexual parents will try to find the best match for their children. Most of these people live in more progressive areas anyway.
That young man talks a good talk, but he's not telling the truth when he said being raised by lesbians has had no effect on his character. It has, for one, quite obviously made him very defensive about something that's inherently wrong. So now he feels the need to make some sort of excuse for how others perceive him.
No child should have to do that.
No, gays should not be allowed to adopt.
The nuclear family of Father, Mother, and a biological child/children is ideal. Barring that, it should be a Father, Mother, and adopted children for whom there was no way for their biological parents or parent to raise them.
The idea of adoption should be (as previously always has been) based on what's best for the child. It's not best for them to be raised in a situation that's even more confusing for them than the one(s) they came from. A Father is a Father, a man. A Mom is a Mom, a woman. Have people become so silly that they can't even fathom that anymore?!
Can't jump from one bad circumstance to the next.
My guess is the young man is defensive because closed-minded people have been ostracizing his family for most of his life, and his parents are discriminated against in that they are not allowed to legally marry, among other things.
You say "The nuclear family of Father, Mother, and a biological child/children is ideal."
Do really mean that? That adopted children are not as "ideal" as biological ones? If so, all I can say is wow.
It is because of mindsets like yours, that there continues to be hate in this world. You put finite definitions on everything, have no open space for "different," and ostracize anyone who doesn't fit the mold you believe some Cosmic Being put into place. You're no better than the people who beat gays or taunt gay parents. The only thing that makes you different is you're not physically doing it yourself. But I bet if God didn't write in that book of yours that you should physically harm your brother, you'd be right there kicking them in the stomach and painting "fags shouldn't be parents" on their foreheads. It's ideas like yours that cause ignorant people to cause havoc in this world.
Will you be our children's godmother, Brenda?
No worries, our children will be raised Jewish.
Oy! As if being raised gay isn't going to have them persecuted enough! *ducks*
Seth and I have raised our adopted son according to GayJew teachings and he's turning out fabulous...
S/he might be an ethnic minority, too, for good measure.
LMAO! Ok... You win. I thought having a bi-racial wiccan, two disabled children, and a white conservative christian 12 year old (brought up by a republican Methodist and his catholic girlfriend) and a bi-sexual UU ultra liberal mother married to a right wing straight arrow baptist husband was sufficient but you really do have me beat!
Let's raise a glass to diversity! Fruit juice for me though.
When I have children, our family will be quite the mix. My boyfriend is a "white", bi-sexual, metalhead, buddhist, with a hint of mysticism and a deep interest in Esoteric thought (and a Rasta, you can guess why), I'm a Free thinker, who's slightly Secular, with Agnostic tendencies, and an interest in Eastern thoughts/beliefs, also with a hint of mysticism. So, if we ever have kids, who knows how they'll turn out!
Um, your Benetton ad family in real-life trumps my potential-but-still-evolving family unit. Raise your glass of Welch's with me for a toast!
Brenda Durham: You couldn’t be more incorrect, misinformed, ignorant and bigoted. Just because someone speaks up or speaks out does not mean they are being defensive. It means they believe in something and are advocating a cause or a message. Honestly, you are the one that seems confused. Homosexuals are not inherently wrong – they’ve been around for hundreds of thousands of years; it’s natural for a certain portion of the population and definitely not a choice. It even happens in nature – outside of humans.
We, as humans have sexual relations for more than just procreation, and we aren’t the only creatures on this planet that do so – so the argument that sex is just for procreation, thus making it only for men and women is invalid since two people of the same sex can and do perform in these activities.
Gays should absolutely be allowed to adopt. If they want children that don’t have parents and will love them and raise them, then they should be allowed to have them. If your ideal family is a mother and a father – that’s great for you – do so with yourself. In my experience, no child has been confused while being raised by same sex couples, including the young man in the video. "A Thousand Words" is correct that people like you generate hate in this world. Try not to be so close-minded and bigoted and you might not get so defensive about other people advocating their rights and freedoms.
To jdflom: You pretty much said what I have in mind. Two thumbs up! You forgot to add "clueless" to you list of "incorrect, misinformed, ignorant and bigoted."
Wow. You guys pretty much said it all! Please, tell me, why is it popular for celebrities, the people our children look up to, to raise adopted kids in a single parent household? Here wait! I also have a family to throw in the mix! My best lesbian friend is ready to have a child and I am donating my eggs to her. She wants me to play a mother roll to this kid. Aww shucks, what is our beautiful future child going to do?!
No I do not believe so. As a baby, as an infant, it may not make any difference, but as soon as the child learns that there are two sexes, that there is a mommy and a daddy in most normal families, then the child is going to become curious and confused, wondering where its mommy figure is, unless of course you bring the kid up in an all gay male community and society. The kid will see female as something strange and possibly frightening.
What about the single parent with this perspective?
In the case of a single parent, a child has known mother and father, but has lost one due to whatever the circumstances. Seldom if ever would the courts permit for a one parent adoption of a child, but the court has very little it can do if a biological parent desires or must raise a child alone.
I think what tsmog might be pointing out is in the case of a single parent, those children do not become confused or scared of the gender of the parent who is not present in their life, as you were theorizing in your earlier post, Dave. I think it's kind of ridiculous to say that a child would become scared of women if raised by two men, or scared of men if raised by two women.
Tsmog, sorry if I'm not correct. Please chime in if you'd like to clarify.
Um.. catch up on Hollywood. Hot new trend is adopting foreign babies via single mothers.
While I appreciate your response, and respect your view, I have to disagree. Consider what Tsmog said. What about single parents? It certainly is somewhat of a different situation. But, with the same logic, would a child then grow up believing that it's "weird" to have two parents? Can you come to such a conclusion without any background knowledge of individuals, and how they raise their children?
Did you watch the video?
Also, I'm including two-mother situations as well. I suppose I should've said "Gay and Lesbian," to be clear. Let's just throw the whole GLBT out there.
I'm for it. In fact, my same-sex partner and I are in the process of trying to adopt.
Congrats. I hope all goes well for you and wish you guys the best of luck.
Hey best of luck from me too, despite my opinion as stated above, I do think gays will make good parents (because you are such gentle people). I just worry about the school aspect.
I think we're no different from any other prospective parent who has to "work at it" (let's just say having a baby when you're a gay couple never happens by accident!). In fact, studies demonstrate this to be the case.
There are lots of things that kids are tormented about. Having gay parents, especially for us here in San Francisco, is decreasingly one of them. It's probably different from when we were kids, when there was a lot more pressure on kids to conform in every way.
There had better be pictures of the lucky wee one! And an address where many plush animals may be bestowed.
You bet! We have no idea how long our wait will be, but we're patient.
*grins* Wanna borrow one of mine to tide you through? I got em in all shapes, sizes and genders. I'll be restocking soon too
@livelonger - Congratulations! I'm so happy for you!
Thank you! The excitement is keeping the waiting bearable.
Although I think gay couples should be able to adopt, I am not sure about livelonger...
Although his avatar pic is small, it looks to me as though he is forcing a young person to sew for him... no doubt as part of a child factory scheme.
No.. they should not be able to adopt...
their homosexualitiness will rub off on the children via osmosis, or transmit itself through family game-play such as can be found in Twister.
Best that the children be housed within the confined of orphanages, where their heterosexuality will be safeguarded through lack of any parental contact or affection.
Greek One, you are pure mental! (that is NOT a personal attack, btw, in Scotland that is actually quite a nice thing to say to someone!)
Livelonger, yeah I forgot you live in a forward-thinking cosmopolitan community, so things should be fine at school - though there would still be difficulties in other areas that are more backward - best of luck whatever happens, bringing up children is not easy regardless of your home situation.
I found the story again - he was 17, not 14 - http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scott … -23695000/
This is the way I look at it... I would be the same mother whether I was married to a man or a woman. If -heavens forbid- something would happen to my husband or my marriage and I entered a relationship with a woman should my children be taken away from me?
If no, then it is silly to say that gays shouldn't adopt.
If yes, then that's a completely different argument that my blood pressure just can't handle today.
Absolutely, being homosexual is not a choice,thats how they were born, so i believe that homosexuals should have the right to have a family, the same way any other couple would have the right to have a family.
I think that the whole homosexual issue with whatever is extremely narrow minded and doesn't belong in the world of today. We are all human beings with feelings and somebody's sexual preference should NOT be an issue.
PS, I'm originally from Holland where gay people get married and adopt children. Probably cause it's not one of those over christian countries where churches still have a say in the matter of things.
Love hugs and smiles for all
Homosexuals should be allowed to adopt children, but only homosexual children.
That's ridiculous Ron... they should be able to children regardless of their orientation....
but so as to safeguard the youngsters from homosexual influences, they should not be adopted until they are at least 18 years old and be able to make their own decisions
Everyone should be able to have the opportunity to adopt/have children. I do not think it should matter what gender you are, what relationship you are in, or their orientation. What matters is the childs welfare. If a kid is bullied at school because he has two mums, who is to say that thoes bullies would not find something else to pick on if his parents were straight?
Equality is so important in this world. Our modern day surroundings allow us to be/do whatever we want! Therefore, if a child has two mums/dads, as long as it is loved and well looked after then it is fine. Thoes who are homophobic really need to open there eyes as they are the ones (it seems) who are living in the cupboard...
Why would anyone object to those caring, loving and gentle homosexuals adopting children ?? It is those uncaring, unlovely and hard-faced christians that should be prevented from even getting near children let alone adopting them, didn't we learn anything from those religious orphanages and childrens homes that were run as personal pleasure parlours for perverts ?
My answer is absolutely yes. I know, and am very close to, a married gay couple who has adopted two baby girls from China. The girls are now six and nine years of age. Jeff and Denny are awesome parents, and the girls love them. They tell me that the only people (and their children) who treat them and the girls as well rudely and with contempt is a group of fundamental christians starting a house church that live on their street. I agree with A Thousand Words that many times children are "taught" at a very early age by their parents to be bigoted bullies.
There are plenty of children in need of a loving home. If the home is peaceful and loving it doesn't matter their sex orientation.
Short, concise, and to the point. Love it. Agreed, 100%
I mean, if the children were placed in foster care to begin with, it's most likely because their heterosexual parents aren't any better. . . unless, of course, they've died . . . just sayin' . . . who's to judge?
...or the parents are Heat fans, and therefore are insane
Obviously I don't fall in that category . . . since I'm not a parent.
who would want to procreate with a Heat fan?
I don't know, Greek? But your team stinks and you have kids, so maybe there is hope for little ol' me!
I don't see any reason why not. As long as a child is bought up in a safe, loving environment, then it doesn't matter who their parents are. Children need stability more than anything else, there are plenty of kids out there with a mom and dad who often lead miserable lives. The bullying factor is significant, children are often to quick to pick on anything they notice that is different. But you will always have bullying of some sort, even if the child comes from a 'normal' home.
Yes, they should be able to. I really don't see why this should be problematic for some.
For people that say that a mother and a father are a must and are the best - what about all those single parents - are those kids in any way weirder (or whatever?).
People say that those children would suffer in school as they would have been teased by other people. Well true, kids tend to mock everything they can. We had a girl in our class that had a skin disease and looked well a bit funny. Kids were mean. I was not. My parents taught me to accept people for who they were and not mock them because everyone else does it. We had overweight people, I never pointed fingers. Point is my kids (if I will have them) wont judge those kids as I wont give them the mindset to. Kids who mock different kids don't just develop such behavior randomly. IMHO.
I think any heart that will love and care for a child should have the ability to help a child that has been given up or mistreated. Honestly, I think we have become very nosey as a society. I personally do not give people an application in order to classify them. I try to remember that I am not the one whose judgement matters.
Imagine... I like you. You can be a good friend to me but before we move forward, please answer the following...
Choice for Presidency?
Opinion on Welfare?
and the list goes on....
I'd have to say the opposite. Why SHOULDN'T they be allowed to? It doesn't matter who's against or for being gay/lesbian. It shouldn't have anything to do with the bible. This is a question of liberty. Sorry for the mini rant, but I always see things like "should they be allowed to..." Usually the answer is yes for me, unless it's physically hurting someone else.
Since gay people cannot produce a child in the same fashion that breeders *cough cough* ahem.. heterosexuals can, allowing more gay family adoptions will get more kids into homes!! C'mon! This can be a beautiful thing and a win win!
And on that note, what about IVF? When "daddy" becomes an unknown entity that mommy ordered offline and had you created in a little dish, how much harder is that to explain then the principle of heterosexual parents? Weak arguments on nuclear family standards
Yes. Homosexuals should absolutely adopt. If they are lucky enough to be adopted by some fabulous gay men, their house will always be clean and free of pet hair, their appearance always primp and proper, and they will never go to school in mismatched clothing.
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