Why do you just sit back and watch as an innocent child dies, every 3 minutes, on our planet?
C'mon, be a good god thing and speak to us so that we may ALL understand your reason....ok?
you didn't seriously expect Him to be here, did you? lol
Qwark, again that is a destruction caused by man.
You can ask this question a thousand different ways, the answer is still the same.
Men are accountable for the horrors they cause. If men didn't commit these crimes, every 3 minutes, you'd have no reason to post the same question again.
Let's not just generalize the men. Humankind is destroying itself.
Yes, I agree. When I said "men," I meant all mankind. Forgive me, I'm for the Midwest. It is just the way I think.
So we are made in gods image then?!
Sorry just couldn't help myself
What crime did man commit that was so grievous that their children should suffer the agony of terminal cancer, or other conditions like that?
are you serious? this question is easily answered. read history books.
What history books?
The babble certainly isnt a history book.
What about the loa worm, which can only survive in the eyeball of children.....
History books in the sense that the horrible acts committed by mankind is easily identifiable. I don't understand why someone has to ask what we've done so horrible?
None of modern mans accomplishments can answer for the children who are born with life threatening, debilitating, and painful conditions.
I am only saying in response to the first question "what have we done so terrible.." This is a question that shouldn't need to be asked. You know and I know the horrors of our earth. We don't need to sit around acting all self-righteous asking what we've done so terrible.
You have to ask?
Exposure to chemicals, pesticides, smog, industry, electricity, eating wrong, need more?
I expected that, oh so trite, obtuse response.
You deserve every intended insult flipped your way.
I'm glad to oblige.....:-)
Whats up with you? Now you wish me ill will?
Amazing. You don't even know me.
Well, I do not wish those things for you.
You see, that is why I say you deserve to be insulted.
I never, never, wished ill will to befall you!
If I new you, I might even like you....for a moment.
Your shallowness and inability to read and understand without predisposition, makes you, a person who is surrounded by an aura of frustrating, detestable religious bigotry.
I detest self imposed ignorance and those of your ilk reek of it.
I do not wish you any ill will...not at all!
I hope I make that clear...ok?
Holy crap dude I think your tinfoil hat is too tight
He gets real defensive, when intelligent people blow holes in his own intelligent design.
Qwark, however the next time you think I deserve a public lecture by you. I'd reconsider, and send it in an email. However, since you started a public lecture, let me finish it before I head for Spring Break.
I cannot help the fact that you always ask the same questions. Nor can I help the fact that HubPages is an outlet for educated individuals. It is not my fault that their are times, you are out willed and out smarted. Furthermore, I understand how that all can make you angry with me. Anger only leads to senseless aggression and illogical behavior. Perfect example of how that works, is your shallow, hate filled public spam towards me.
I feel for you. However, you should be blaming yourself for not furthering your own education, on certain subject matters. It is not my fault, that your mind is at an educational disadvantage, and emotional immaturity.
I do see how you would want to blame your faults on someone else too. You just chose the wrong person.
qwark, you really double talk a lot. telling her she 'deserves any insult flipped her way and being glad to oblige' is definitly wishing her ill will. why would you say its not?
She misread something I wrote and hijacked a thread to spread around that I am a racist..all because she read something with a lack of understanding....I never mentioned anything racist..or anything about any people..others thought because she said I had that it must be true and started attacking me for it.
It's a dangerous situation ..........
The only dangerous person here is you. I am the one who inferred that you were a racist. No her. I did. Spreading lies and slander about people, is a dangerous situation for you.
Anyhow- you made a comment that basically said that THOMAS is only a white man's name. That is Racist. There I SAID it again. Not IE, me.
I also ask you if Henry was only a white man's name, and you rebuttal by making threating comments and implying that I was stalking you. I made 1 comment to you, and you flipped out.
It is YOU, who people should be avoiding. Talk about your dangerous personality. I don't think you have any idea, of what you sound like on this forum. You are like fingers on a chalk board.
I can see why you are jealous of IE, you and Qwark both.
She is smart when it comes to religion. She has a degree in it you should know. Be sides that though, she is an excellent debater who calls it like she sees it. Insecure and unintelligent people usually do have a problem with people like her.
Deborah get a life. Stop your stupid slandering remarks towards her. It was me, not her! Another thing, nobody highjacked your thread. YOU said something extremely stupid, and got busted for it.
Own up to your mistakes, and quit blaming your mishaps on other people.
That is just ridiculous and idiotic behavior.
I hate the forum for this very reason. I'm outta here. I'll wait another 2 to 3 weeks again. Hopefully some of these ill witted losers will be gone. One can only hope.
Why do you think Deborah is such a racist? What did she write to make you perceive her as such? Sources, please?!
Gee you must be her..the same person. No doubt about this now...
I saved my posts and not once did I say..."THOMAS is only a white man's name. "
My remark was that IE's thought that Christ had a last name was ridiculous....not once mentioned anyone's color..just that there were no last names back then..
Hubpages staff has my post and knows what I said...
For those who don't know....IE wrote a hub saying JESUS had a twin brother and their last name was Thomas..I stated that they didn't have last names back then..So IE said that I (deborah) didn't think (as she called it) "colored people" could have the last name Thomas. (Which is so far off from what I said it's not funny).
So her now very obvious A.E., RK stated I am a racist.
Some people need a new identity to say what they normally would/could not say..
Oh so now I'm a shemale. That's your argument? You are a sad sick silly individual. You cannot argue rationally with me or RK, so now you make public claims of knowing I have tits with a penis? And I guess rk's 12 inches is now just part an over grown labia minor? What an...!
Hi friend IntimatEvolution
You have a positive thinking. You don't have to wish badly for others for nothing.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
Re read what I wrote friend. I have no freaking clue what you are implying. I don't wish ill of anyone. I think I said that. So slow down, and read before you post a comment.
Quark, the message from God is that he gave the job of caring for children to us.
Seriously, I'm not joking..ok?
Do you consider this god you worship to be omniscient?
Can you answer that for me, honestly?
Hi friend Valerie F
I agree with you.You have a positive thinking.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
The typical believer's response to this is: You can't blame it on God, because He gave man free-will.
So why would he give man free-will? Being omniscience, he already knew what the outcome would be.
Of course, God is way too awesome for you and me to understand! That's why he may sometimes appear foolish to us!!!
AS you know, I'm not a believer in mythical supernatural divinities.
You made a very strong point about this fairytale god thing;
"Being omniscience, he already knew what the outcome would be." ('course ya misspelled omniscient)
So this god thing knew that all these kids were gonna die, some horridly, when "it" created them.
"It's" a friggin monster!
I don't understand, qwark. death is a part of life and some die sooner than others.
Look up the word "omniscient."
Then come on back..
..be glad to chat with ya then..:-)
yeah, and? I still don't understand the problem. death is a part of life, whether or not God knew it in advance. We could flip the situation, you know. Why are babies & kids still dying when Evolution has obviously taught us we are at the top of the food chain? Why are babies & children still dying even after we have evolved this far into our consciousness?
Simple & easy answers usually tell you the most. Death is a part of life.
You know I don't know what this god thing is, nor does anyone else.
If this fictional god thing is, in the minds of believers, both omnipotent and omniscient, it had the "power," along with our imagined creation, to create "perfection."
If this god thing knew the pain and suffering his "children" would suffer, being a "caring, loving fictional god, it could have snapped it's fingers and before it all happened, taken the empathetic route and created a perfect world with perfect humans.
Instead, this "imagined" god thing, knowing of the pain, suffering and death it's children would suffer, seemingly thought,"oh what the hell, I could create perfection, but, just for fun, I won't." From what I read into your comment, you havent studied your corrupted bible...:-)
I was not suggesting God didn't know of a childs death prior to it happening. I was leading to the flip of the situation.
So, why didn't God create a perfect world? That is the question you really want answered, right? Ok, here is my take on the subject: (I don't know where I heard the story in which I base my beliefs, but it wasn't the church I went to as a child)
God created earth to teach a lesson to Satan, believing people who are given free will will be more faithful than not and Satan believes if given the truth people will choose against the word of God.
Therefore, the pain and suffering of the world is to be blamed on Satan, not God.
Oh, and, you didn't answer my questions in regard to children dying IF there is no God.
What you just offered, meant to me that you are a "follower" not a studied, educated thinker.
In saying that, my intention is not to insult you, it is just the impression you make when you say things like: "
(I don't know where I heard the story in which I base my beliefs, but it wasn't the church I went to as a child)"
Your response has given me a much better picture of you and why you respond as you do.
lol sounds like I made an idiot of myself i do that sometimes, and I appreciate your pointing it out without saying it!
anyway, I meant "this story"
God created earth to teach a lesson to Satan, believing people who are given free will will be more faithful than not and Satan believes if given the truth people will choose against the word of God.
I did not mean the entire Bible. And yes, you are right. I do not study the Bible, I follow the Bible. But that doesn't mean I am not interested in other views - if it did, I wouldn't be here in this forum.
I appreciate your honesty!
The majority, of god believing humanity, are followers.
You have alota company.
If you have an opportunity, and are truly interested, you must study the evolution of man and his propensity for beliefs in the supernatural.
The "anomaly" consciousness is totally responsible for it.
It is not an easy "trip" into understanding.
To understand "why" you will have to study the various facets of man's millions of years of evolution and the reasons involved his "becoming" a conscious creature.
Thanks for being "rational." :-)
PS...You did not make an "idiot" of yourself.
the reason is simple, Quark, you are a product of capitalism.
80% of the world is impoverished, not because there is not enough food or water or wood to make homes, it is because MEN -not God- have made slaves of their fellow man and forced him to accept this thing called labor -to work for his food, the air he breathes, the wood to make a home.
Yes and while children die daily on the streets of NYC or the alleys of shanty India, you sit fat and full, staring oh so magnificently at the stars you did not create.
pay the ransom with your own blood and sweat, then tell another they are at fault.
qwark i see your up to it again lol. i wonder about you sometimes. your pot stirring stick seems to be a log.
its easy to blame the inanimate for the failures of mankind or the process of nature. i mean we gota blame something right?
i much rather put the blame on the ones with the potential to actually do something about it . all these failures of men belong to men alone. thing is this . on earth . we have no men . only children crying out why.
btw good morning qwark buddy good to see you.
Hahaha...I am Paul Bunyan stirring with my log..oh yes!
You are, or course, right when you say the responsibility falls squarely upon man!
You Know I think of this god thing as being a character from a terrible fairy tale..
Thanks for the "thoughtful," response...lolol :-)
Whats wrong in dying ?
We all have to die.
Death is just a passage to another dimension, meditate to understand this.
Hi friend qwark
God is not a thing as you said. The Creator-God Allah YHWH has created everything with a specific purpose. If one understands the attributes of the Creator; there is no reason for one to be skeptical.
Does Skepticism has any answer to it? They neither have it; nor they can stop it.
They simply have no physical tools to know it.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
Who does this? You qwark? Do you sit back and watch children die? Are you waiting for God to come and stop these crazy people from killing the children and each other?
Whatever though... I suppose it is just easier for you to blame the god you believe doesn't exist then it is to just accept that their are just really bad people in the world and God cannot make you do anything.
God doesn't force the hand to commit crimes okay! So get over whatever hatred you have for the 'religious' and move on to being a lover instead of someone who plagues the internet with more of the "I blame religion for death and and illnesses and all the bad stuff in the world."
Obviously, if you believe this then you believe in a God just not a very good one.
Quark, have you seen this movie? you might like it.
Death is the door to god, its not something bad .When you understand death , it become your friend..
One day God while examining his ant farm, thought, these ants are not doing what i wanted them to, they are warring and being disagreeable and i am not getting what i want from them. I will set them loose in the wild.
So god put his ants out into the wild. Free of their "garden" farm he left them to do whatsoever they will.
And the ants went merrily on their way.
and governed themselves.
and warred with other nations of ants.
some got greedy and started collecting material wealth from around the 'world'.
And eventually ants started to die, some were killed by the wars of the warring ants, some were slowly starved to death by the greedy ants, Other ants has bad dispositions and oppressed other ants.
All the while god sighed and said "this is what they wanted?". "If i put them back in their ant farm they will not be happy, they will be like prisoners that i will have to watch over day and night and punish frequently". "Their ways are totally not my ways".
How shall i make a way for the ants, i want, to live in my "garden" ant farm?
Therefore did God send his son to die on the cross that whosoever believeth should not perish but have everlasting life
You must be desperate for attention to go searching for a thread that is 40 hours old. Or bored. Either or both works. It's funny to see though.
You must be desperate for attention to go searching for a response that is 3 sec old. Or bored. Either or both works. It's funny to see though
You must be desperate period. I hadn't finished correcting this post and you already had your response, short and foolish as usual, without thought and quit ignorantly posted. Are you bored or furiously trying to justify yourself or do words of negativity give you a sense of thrill? Cmon cagsil.. find your life outside of here, other people are trying to do some good, you your just trying to tear down. pathetic people tear down its in the bible yknow.
22070 posts.. that means about 440,700 words lol Keep up the good work buddy
As per usual. Your comments are useless. Enjoy. I just found it funny. And, as for me searching for a thread that is 3 seconds old.
You managed to make yourself look foolish. And, apparent you didn't need my help. So, with that enjoy. You're not worth my time.
Gotcha on the ropes have i. I know what i say makes sense to the saved people, i really don't expect all unsaved people to grasp what god is doing. Don't give up, or lie to me saying im not worth your time, Like i have done something wrong, lol. thats totally unsaved behavior I know you will always read my posts and react in some way. I'm okay with that so keep up the good questions i enjoy answering whatsoever stumps you about the god i serve. Cheers!
Brotheryoc…My guess is that a person of your bent would fit snugly into the slot of a reforming alcoholic or illicit drug addict, which is o.k. of course.
But, why the dickens would he try and vindicate himself of such prior abuses by becoming a jesus freak and spouting mythical biblical material in some sort of senseless defense of his downfalls. Its just dumbo.
Hell…I wouldn’t mind giving my life for the sins of mankind too, if I could get it back shortly, like jesus did. After all, what would I have contributed or accomplished.
Such non-sense cuts across the grain of common sense.
As it happens I smoked pot, did acid as a teen and that's it. I stayed away from cocaine and speed because of its addicting qualities and i saw what havoc others had acquired through the use of it. My best friend bill lost most of his hair and teeth before the age of 22. Common sense is always something I figured i have had. To this day i have no police record. I am and never was some drugged out bum with a sordid past that drew me to drink. Drinking never occured to me as a past time, bars i have visited few in my life and the last beer i had was maybe, 1975.
Why i spout off about god is really out of love and concern. If you want my honest opinion, its a tough walk, denying worldly things, being the best person you can be, overlooking those who persecute you and harboring all the frustrations of ranter and ravers who repeat the same ignoble statements all the time like a broken record player. In my lifetime i never slammed god for anything. I used to think, I didn't ask to be born, i didnt ask for this life, which is really a silly thing to think because i grew up into me, I didn't create me, so when i think of me it is a formed me not a dropped into a slot me; everybody thinks me. Why did this happen to me? Me is what resulted from the birth of a person and that person will always think me, but its nothing personal lol.
I always showed people courtesy and respect, i said hi to everyone just in passing on the street, i would always help someone in trouble, kind to animals, lover of nature. I always enjoyed making people smile and adding to their happiness. In short why do i spout off things about god, because god chose me because i was the sort of person who would listen and listen i did.
It cuts across the grain of your common sense but millions of christ believing people actually do believe in all this stuff.
The purpose of christ on the cross was not something he did because he knew he would rise again, he did it because the blood was needed to be shed. He could have floated off that cross landed in front of all those people and astonished many onlookers and sure they would have followed him, but why, because of what they saw not because they believed in is ways. The entire old testament is full of signs and wonders but that did that do the job? no. The need for a different way was needed, so as the blood of animals acted as a covering for sin, christs blood was the final sacrifice of that system a one time for the rest of time sacrifice. God doesn't want prisoners or actors he wants believers. Faith is how we navigate through the unseen, we think its walking around and buying stuff and being good to only those people who are our friends, etc. But theres a whole different way to navigate around this world and its completely opposite to our 5 senses.
The pure and simple truth is that a creation can never understand its creator.
If you ate a twelve ounce steak you could have fed a dozen children with the grain that it took to feed that cow enough for you to eat that one steak. And Beer, how much grain does it take to make a beer that could have feed hungry children.
You and I are feeding ourselves instead of them. Is that Gods fault that we chose to do what we do?
Don't get me wrong I eat a lot of beef. I'll keep earing beef til they quit raising it. Yea I'm also guilty of misappropriating grain
You asked God why He allowed men to create things with chemicals and elements of the earth thast cause children to die.
We are so concerned with saving fuel and eliminating greenhouse gases that we are allwoing children to starve.
One tiny grain of corn grows many thousands of grains of corn. God allows us to grow corn and makes sure that we can grow it by giving us everyhting we need to do it. We abuse it and expect God to just make things better while we build biugger barns and silos to hold our fortunes.
Next time you think of asking God this question, ask yourself first.
There's more to that. We have gone well beyond hoarding. I'm not sure of every detail as agriculture is not my interest, but there was a huge thing here about the modified seeds from businesses. The seeds are not allowed to be used naturally. The farmers must purchase new seeds from the company each year.
Some of the seeds can not reproduce at all, as they have been engineered that way.
That is all a part of it. Science has engineered the seeds and changed them from what they were intended and look at what has happened. So many believe science to be the Messiah, but it is actually not. It is science that is pushing mankind back to the "caveman days."
How do you figure we are headed back for caveman times? I think caveman times would be not evolving your mind and reading the same book of belief over and over. No disrespect.
Nuclear warheads, engineered food which causes duisease, flouride in water. There are many other things I am sure but these are the ones most prevalent.
We are told what to eat and how to eat it. We are told what we can feed our livestock. We are told what oils we can use to cook with. We are turning into robots. It will not be long before it all comes down around us.
If you don lik what theh science man has maid then quit usin theh science mans internet, and theh science mans medicines, and theh science mans world. Go live in a cave to die of your gods parasites and diseases.
If it werent for theh science mans engineering of crops, then wheat would still be inedible grass and bananas would still be 2 inches long and full of seeds.
Get off ray comforts back, stop drinking his farts, and try to think for yourself.
If it wasn't for science, there would be no cancer, there would be plenty of food, there would be no smallpox, no chickenpox, no fetal alcohol syndrome, no atomic bombs, no nuclear disasters, etc. . .
How much evilness does it take before it is considered bad for mankind?
Wow, I mean wow! So life was a perfect paradise right up until we started to peruse science then right?
Adam and Eve (assuming they weren't cave people) got kicked out of the garden of eden and the world was just as trouble free as the garden had been then. Adam and Eve n Co didn't have to worry about disease or finding good food. Their decedents musta been right idiots for perusing science in that case. And we are all made in gods image
You can ignore it, dishcarge it, disbelieve it, make fun of it, take it serous or whatever you want. It makes absolutely no difference whether it is true or not.
Again, I ask you. If you dont like what theh science man makes, then why the fuck are you sitting there using it, using it to complain about it.
That is being hypocritical.
If you were genuine then you would stop using science and all its products.
Science has not brought anything bad, its bad people who use science wrongly. A knife is not bad, the person who sticks it into another neck is!
"there would be no cancer, there would be plenty of food, there would be no smallpox, no chickenpox, no fetal alcohol syndrome" - Dent How did science make cancer? Egyptian mummys were found with cancer, smallpox and chicken pox have been around for thousands of years, and FAS is the result of drinking alcahol. I fail to see how theh science man did this to you. Sounds like you just want a scapegoat for your own unhappyness.
Denial is the first sign of addiction.
Do you have any idea what is put in our food and water supplies? Do you have any idea what is put in the air that we breathe? There is so much that goes on that we have no clue about.
Why do you suppose cancer is at an alltime high? Why is death in children more prevalent now than before? Why are more children born with diseases than before?
Calling me a hypocrite helps nothing at all. It is just a part of the denial process.
"Why do you suppose cancer is at an alltime high? Why is death in children more prevalent now than before? Why are more children born with diseases than before?"
This is just not true, we are actually healthier and living longer than ever before. As PROOF, just look at life expectancy, it has risen steadily since the beggining of this age of science.
Since I have PROVEN you wrong, through actual physical evidence, admit that you are wrong.
If I claimed that I hated cheese, and yet sat around eating it all day long, wouldnt that be hypocritical?
If you hate science and its products, why are you using them to reply to me?
I have never said I hate science. I haven't even implied it. So where does this leave us?
How much money was spent on the Hadrian collider?
How much money is spent on space exploration?
How much money was spent developing the nuclear bomb so that we could blow up the world?
Why develop seeds which cannot grow?
Why add so much garbage to the food and water supply?
Not all science is good and not all science is necessary.
I think you are not understanding what you are stating here. Without the use of science many of the conveniences you take for granted would disappear.
Man went from using the ground, to using the outhouse, to using an indoor toilet, because of science. And from walking, to horseback, to automobiles, to aircraft, because of science.
How on earth can you just see the bad that science is causing?
I think also sometime ago, not too long ago the agriculture industry produced a strain of, I think wheat, that would grow with little water in Africa.
Anyways, as it turned out, the strain also became a virus and even the so called 'organic' fruits and vegetables are not actually organic but come from seeds that have been genetically altered.
I think it is something like 89% of all the foods we eat have been altered. And everyday we hear about something that we were told was good for us that is actually causing cancer.
The latest being multi-vitamins.
It's not our place to question God or his methods or motives. They are beyond our understanding. If God lets a child die, perhaps it is that child's time to take it's place in Heaven.
Would you be so open minded about this if it where your sinless child suffering?
I have no wish to debate my openmindedness or the suffering of "sinless" children. We are all born with original sin. And I have no wish do debate that either.
Qwark's question was addressed to God and the reasons he sits back and watches innocent children die. I simply answered the question as I was taught. If my answer is in any way offensive, take your arguement to the Catholic church.
I have no argument with you. I merely asked a question based on my experiences that even the best Christians in the world tend to forget the face of God when one of their own are suffering.
I truly hope that you have never had to and never will have to find out how you would react in this situation.
Um, so if we feed those children, are we going against God's methods and motives? Are we taking away that child's place in Heaven by doing so?
I have no idea, why don't you ask God, I certainly can't speak for him. I can only offer what a dozen years of Catholic education have taught me and that is that God, has his own purpose and plan for us and we can try to figure it out but all we have is human understanding so we bring everything down to a human level. We can never understand God, for God is God, and his actions are beyond simple human understanding. So we will never know what God's big picture is because it just isn't our place to know it. You either accept this based on your faith or not.
It's that simple. You don't have to discuss it, debate it or argue about it. You can't prove or disprove the existance of God. You believe or you don't.
If we feed the hungry, we are surely doing God's work, but if he chooses to call his children to him and it is their time to take their rightful place in heaven, that is God's will and we must accept that, unquestionly and unconditionally, if we believe.
When I was 11 my mother died of congestive heart failure. She left me alone and I went into the care of the state. I was told by my parish priest that it was God's will. For years I ranted, raved, and rebelled against God and his will. Now, I have to go look after my grandson and make sure that God's will doesn't happen to him out on the swing set.
"Its not our place to question God or his methods or motives. They are beyond our understanding."
This is how I feel too.
Joseph Campbell said it like this: "I don't need faith, I have experience."
All I know is...Knock and the door will be opened to you. Seek and ye shall find.
it's true. and be humble like a child.
You mean to say, only children don't deserve to die? How about my dying anytime, without my control?
Is there anything in creation that can last far ever?
Is your personality built cent percent on goodness only?
Why are there 4 seasons? Why not we enjoy spring all through the year?
Why do we have day and night? Why not have all days? Why should we fall asleep? Why not we remain awake all through the day?
Why not we all lead sickness-free lives all through for ever?
Okay. One last thing.
Assuming that you are married, assuming that you love your wife, assuming that she has a very serious ailment that if she becomes pregnant and carry advanced pregnancy, it will seriously affect her health unless she aborts, assuming that she becames pregnant, will you allow the baby to grow in her?
What ya'll have to understand is that we ask these questions to inspire passion and thought in responses.
I chuckle when reading some responses that are so passionately expressed that it's obvious that the questioner has hit a very sensitive spot...which is exactly what his/her intent was, in asking the question.
A "forum" is just a "medium" for open discussion.
If it gets too hot in the kitchen leave! Relax, take a deep breath, complete a chore or 2...then come on back with an understanding of what the purpose of the forum is.
Remember: "sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me."
I will respond honestly, candidly and impassionately.
How you handle that, you control.
I never respond to those whom I think respond emotionally and irrationally instead of calmly and rationally.
Insult? How can one be insulted if one does not allow himself to be?
Love me or hate me...means nothing to me. I'm here for the pure entertainment the forum provides.
I take nothing personally.
Why do you?...:-)
understood, except, you ask the questions to inspire passion and then refuse to reply to it? that part I dont understand.
I don't know whether your above reply is directed to me.
If so, hope you will understand that the "you"s appearing in my queries need not really be taken as a personal offense against you, but to kindle honest replies to the queries I have posted which I suppose are not illogical.
"Joy and woe are wowen fine
A clothing for the soul divine"
We turn to religion and try to understand the concept of God only when we start inquiring ourselves rather than presuming that God is to be blamed or God is to be negated by sighting the quirk goings-on in this world.
A couple of ideas...
1) Turn all the golf courses of the nation into homeless shelters
2) What if every person in the country sent one penny to one individual whose name came up on a list that day that had we ALL signed..... one person every day would become a billionaire, and the rest of us wouldnt go broke (and plus we'd all become millionares too when our name came up) .
So why would he give man free-will? Being omniscience, he already knew what the outcome would be.
Hi friend getitrite
Do you want compulsion and no free will?
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
A wise man told me once. 'Don't interfere with something that ain't botherin' you none.' It's none of my business so it don't bother me and who's is doing this counting thing anyway?
Qwark: If an ant asked you why you allowed certain things that the ant did'nt like, and you knew that any explanation you gave,(no matter how reasonable it was), would not be understood by the ant, would you waste your time trying to give the ant an answer? Just a question. Consider, when we try to compare our reasoning ability with God, we are less than ants.
I sometimes have thoughts so terrible that they would make Jesus drink gin straight out of the catdish.
So god makes man, makes sin, man does what god makes him to do, then god punishes his own creation for being imperfect. mmmm
so earnest builds a car and it doesn't work quit right so he dismantles it. Did you ever think that man is not quit so important that obtaining a few people out of the masses is all quit acceptable to god because if you think about it, the few that god gets are quit admirable people, doing admirable things, perhaps even still, a little unadmirably.
As it happens, if I bolt a car together it goes just fine.
yet you want others to believe an omnipotent omniscient god makes a neurotic mess like mankind and then tortures them as punishment???
I guess he only allows the miraculously smarter christians out of the rubble eh?
He didn't make a neurotic mess of mankind. Mankind did that. I am not neurotic i know a lot of people who aren't mentally disabled. I see mostly people who rant as those who are mentally neurotic. The unsaved state of mind is far more neurotic than the saved state of mind. I have a peace that surpasses your understanding. I am able to show kindness to people that others would go out of their way to walk around. I don't feed on the corrupt things of this world and as the saying goes you are what you eat.
God offers a way out of everything that mankind gets itself into. You have this backwards too.
Hehe just trying to hit the ball in your park so you would draw a familiar comparison, i am sure you are quite good at car stuff. Y'know the gasoline engine didn't surprise god, eh. He knew about it, saw it coming and can fix engines too, so you have something in common already :0)
I use to have similiar thoughts, then I just concluded that God must have his own sense of humor.
Someone had a sense of humour!
Who would follow a nutter this sick?
As for you, son of man, prophesy: Thus says the Lord GOD against the Ammonites and their insults: A sword, a sword is drawn for slaughter, burnished to consume and to flash lightning, because you planned with false visions and lying divinations to lay it on the necks of depraved and wicked men whose day has come when their crimes are at an end. Return it to its sheath! In the place where you were created, in the land of your origin, I will judge you. I will pour out my indignation upon you, breathing my fiery wrath upon you, I will hand you over to ravaging men, artisans of destruction. You shall be fuel for the fire, your blood shall flow throughout the land. You shall not be remembered, for I, the LORD, have spoken. (Ezekiel 21:33-37 NAB)
Ah the good book, full of god's luv!
So a man goes into a home and steals everything and then he rapes the daughter and wife of the husband, breaks his legs and leaves. Well in a sense aren't those who do bad things hurting god and why can't god pour out his wrath upon those bad doers? All god is doing is making a more peaceful and secure life for those who do good.
We have a judicial system here on earth. And when a rapist goes free many people get up in arms over it and protest, or a murderer, the family is often upset that his tenure is over. God feels the same way when his children, his creations do things that harm others and ruin other lives including their own.
In biblical times, the sense of singleness was not prevalent. People did things as a whole, together, in mass, hence tribes for example. Countries all followed their own ways and worship of gods that required baby sacrifice, cutting their flesh, allowing murder and conquest of others properties for gain, etc. And they ran around doing just that. Other than the promised land that joshua led Israel into, the jews were always attacked and provoked into war, notice WW2 for example. God, because of necessity, had to purify the land or the warring tribes and countries would just continually come back because there was nothing in their moral creed to prevent the greed that drove them.
So when you see god killing remember he is making a safe habitat for his people from greedy, plundering, murdering peoples all around, or the unsaved if you want to quote a phrase.
Other examples, earnest, like the one you repeat over and over again does indeed show gods love. As i mentioned previously, god is making safe the place where his people dwell. Sometimes god had to purge his people or sin (the ability to do evil would run amok) In your example false prophets are running amok to persuade the people to do things contrary to what god wants to do, so he has them killed and thus he gets his people back on track. God is showing love to his people, not the unsaved, his people by purifying the camp so the peaceful and productive ways of god can resume again.
Its not just god killing people, its god making safe his people.
You've heard the expression, "A little leaven, leavens the whole lump". Well corruptness is very much like that. One person is doing it then 2 then 3 and soon its a normal way of life for everyone. Sin is the same way, Next door neighbour is banging the wife of ted and the papers of hollywood say all are adulterous and pretty soon adultery is just another life style.
When christ came, god promised to back off with the killing, now judgment is held off till the end of persons life. Could you imagine living in a world where one man sins and 13,000 fall by the sword? You should be thanking god not yelling at him. lol.
As you consider me "unsaved" seeing as I do not believe the garbage you believe - I could take this as an insult.
But - then I remember you are a self-professed Christian and - as such - are just looking to cause ill will and hatred. Good job.
It's not an meant to be an insult, but a fact is a fact and i like the truth, it doesn't bother me at all. If you are unsaved that is entirely your doing. Good luck with it.
And you do not see how calling me "greedy, plundering, murdering peoples all around, or the unsaved" could be considered insulting?
You do not like the truth. I do not need saving, and I am certainly none of the things you accuse me of.
No morals. None.
There's many attributes to unsaved, i only mentioned a few in relevance to my post. I like to think you do not murder and i may well be correct in saying that, so how you perceive this insult i don't think hubpages will back you up so i won't worry to much about it. And God well, he just chuckled along with me. You may be mistaking the insult for a bit of conviction. Either way good luck with it.
we are vessels of knowledge, when that light passes on to the next vessel, is that death? the human experience is not the same as the cosmic experience.
chaos only looks like chaos from our perspective and the course of our lifetimes. but chaos organizes in the coarse of many lifetimes.
it is we who must prevent the death of a child. we are the vessel of that knowledge.
‘When christ came, god promised to back off with the killing, now judgment is held off till the end of persons life. Could you imagine living in a world where one man sins and 13,000 fall by the sword? You should be thanking god not yelling at him. lol.’
Judging from your words above god realized he had screwed up with his mass murdering schemes and plots and decided to try another format by killing his own son to try and curb his uncontrollable subjects.
Sounds like an imperfect god at best. What are your facts on that?
'The pure and simple truth is that a creation can never understand its creator'
"pure and simple truth" is a mighty strong assertion in the absence of any proof. If that statement is based on personal faith its not worth diddly squat and is useless in the quest for any truth.
The ‘real truth’ is…I’m reluctant to reply to any of your posts…since I was mysteriously banned the last two attempts. I reckon you carry too big of a stick for little old ignorant me.
I don't know what you are talking about.
If you got banned it had nothing to do with me.
If I was to make a complaint, You would have been the first to know .. beforehand.
I do get irritated with people that argue about anything and nothing like you did earlier.
A creation knows nothing of its creator ???
And you argue with this? why ?
What does a painting know about the artist?
What does a pot know of the potter?
There was a thread a week or two back stating that a scientist has created life in the lab.
What did that life know about that creator?
Please don't be arguing just to be arguing.
If you have a opinion explain the whys and how’s, the way we are supposed to do. Make a discussion out of it.
Don't just say stuff like "That’s stupid" and leave it at that.
Tell me in an intelligent way; Why it is stupid.
I wasn't referring to creation or creator...I was commenting on his presumption that he knew what pure and simply truth was as he addressed creation and creator.
Please don't tell me what 'I need to do'...sounds too much like another case of over presumptiveness.
The idea of God sacrificing himself to himself
in order to prevent himself sending us all to hell
for committing sins because of the way he made us,
and which he knew we were going to do anyway,
is a little hard to swallow
Religion is to reason what rigor mortis is to dancing.
Sir William Robinson, Dublin
How about Star Wars. Now there's a movie. We all end up in blocks of Carbonite, until JC is done with the coffee break, or whatever and comes back to save our worthless butts cause we can't get along long enough to save our own worthless butts!
It’s an incredible con job when you think about it, to believe something now in exchange for something after death. Even corporations with their reward systems don’t try to make it posthumous. — Gloria Steinem
Earnest…I believe you and I march to a similar beat when it comes to senseless religious myths.
Cain't figure how a seemingly educated person can actually believe such rubish...I suppose they have to be brain washed from birth.
however...more and more of them are beginning to think.
It is an incredible con job...excellant analogy.
You are right about indoctrination. Whenever I go to some "scientific proof" about religion, I am met by a website written by a religionist. The scientists they quote are always from a religiously indoctrinated background, parents, school, teachers will all be religious, or you will find a period when they became indoctrinated somewhere in their lives.
I live in a secular society yet our Government recites "The lord's prayer at every sitting!
That may change if we keep our new Prime Minister after the elections.
She is not religious at all. Very refreshing, very smart and gutsy enough to state her case.
When a politician goes on about his religion I feel he is not smart enough to get past that, so he is not going to be useful as a politician either.
What a load of old repeated fairy droppings!
We will all be called to God's kingdom and age is not the reason. Some are called as infants and who are we to question God.
by qwark 10 years ago
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