Is Revelation Coming?

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Michele Travisposted 12 years ago
Is the goverment getting more control? Floods, famine, earthquakes. Now they always know where you are because soon they are going to put a chip in your cell phone. You can buy things with it. This was on CBS. You can also google it.

What else is going on?
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  Jeramiposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Just my opinion .. But I truly believe that those things described in the book of Revelation have been unfolding continusosly from the beginning.
  
  John was told to write those things of which he HAS seen, IS seeing and of things not yet seen.
  
  Whether we are talking about what we read in history books, romance novels, or describing how a football game went, ... understanding the correct time frame of events is most crutial.
  
  Even more so when discussing prophesy of scripture.
  But ... In todays religion ???? This doesn't seem to be of importance.
  
  Gotta go lay down a while... later.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I agree with Jerami.
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Emile Rposted 12 years ago
So, are you saying Verizon is the anti Christ? The beast? I’m not quite following you. What does a proposed chip in your cell phone have to do with the title to this thread?
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Jonathan Jancoposted 12 years ago
I think this is what Michele is referring to:

Revelation 13
[15] And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
[16] And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
[17] And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
[18] Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

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For a while, the bar code was a popular target for the number of the beast. Now with all the new technology and the experiments by our lovely National Security Agency as well as private businesses who have dabbled in this sort of thing, the phone chip is becoming a major target of Apocolypticists. Personally, I dont think any gov no matter how strongarmed would ever have the guts to make us do it, so they do it with some sort of consumer appeal and alot of people will eat that right up.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I know. I was just being silly. In response to what appears to be a silly question.
  
  Two thousand years. You'd think someone might have figured by now that the book might not mean what they think it means. How many times are we going to have to hear the same questions?
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  What about the RFID Chip? It is now being put into people. To identify them. For medical problems. So people can go to night clubs without purses ( they can pay to get in and then they can dance and the purse will not get stolen)
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  thebrucebeatposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus told us that noone knows the time of the end except the Father, but people have been convinced that it was imminent since the time of Christ himself. There has always been ample evidence that the end times were upon us, which leads one to wonder if we can expect them at all.
  Why do you think now is any different than it has ever been? The evil nature of man has always been on display, and always will be.
  Google "Revelation as Apocalyptic Literature" and see what you learn. The currently popular interpretation of Revelation was an invention of John Nelson Darby in the nineteenth century. Before that, apocalyptic literature was well understood. The current interpretation is as much an American invention as Mormonism.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  What you have writen is true . We do not know when it will come. Jesus has told us that. But in ST. Matthew Chapter 24 Verse 44 it says " Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not , the Son of man cometh. Newer bibles say the same thing but in different phrases. like " Therefore be on alert, for you do not know which day your Lord is coming" Both of these verses are the same one.
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I've often heard arguments in the justification of Genesis of which the proponent argues that one day of creation time could have been millions/billions of years.
  
  Maybe the same thing can be said about Revelations. Scientists says the sun's fusion process can't sustain itself and it will grow into a red giant enveloping the earth rendering it a cinder.
  
  That will be billions of years from now, and maybe that's what Revelations is all about.
  
  So, why worry about it?
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Because of problems like war, famine, pestilence, death, Only if you believe the bible and that things like this are going to happen to us soon, We should be on alert. Yes they are happening, and have been happening for a long time. But now, it is easier for the government to control more people. They have the technology.
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  MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Michele,
  
  I don't think God would want you to live in constant fear and I'm worried about some statements that you are making. If you start believing that the government is trying to microchip everyone to control them hon, then the world becomes a very scary place. Do you have someone you talk to about this kind of stuff? I mean besides a message board?
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Being on alert and living in fear are not the same things. It is sort of like locking your door at night, instead of keeping it wide open.
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  MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  *nods* Okay, I'll accept that. Just don't get so alert that you start jumping at shadows. That's no way to live.
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  thebrucebeatposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You are my favorite Christian on these boards, and since Brenda won't apologize for her presumptuous post, let me apologize for her. She read something into your post that simply wasn't there, and if she knew you at all would have never jumped to that conclusion.
  Keep spreading the peace, in anyone's name you choose!
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  MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  LOL, I don't think I've ever been anyone's favorite Christian before.
  
  And you don't have to apologize for Brenda... She and I have differing opinions on some aspects of Christianity. I'm afraid that has led to a mutual distaste.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Oh, no not jumping at shadows.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I agree.
  And there are also those who try to control people by telling them what they should be discussing and where to discuss it! Like being told they're "worried about" some of the statements you're making.
  Ignore those who're trying to take away your freedom of speech!
  Not only does your hub rock, but your belief in the Bible rocks! Keep up the good work and the Faith. I'm pleased to become your first follower here on Hubpages. And I've learned things I didn't know about epilepsy. I've seen some of the devastating effects of the disease in people's lives; but I didn't even know there's possible surgery for it! I'm glad yours was successful!
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  MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You know Brenda, everyone that shows concern for another human being is not necessarily pushing an agenda.
  
  But the idea that that was what I was doing is more a reflection on your personality than mine. After all, to accuse someone of doing something it has to enter the accusers mind as a possibility first. So what does that say about you?
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  Brenda Durhamposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You know, Melissa, I'm not interested in what you think anything or anyone says of me. Your words are your accuser. Now it would be nice if you'd stop trying to distract and detract from a compliment to a newbie hubber. Everything isn't about you nor me.
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  MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Then don't quote part of my post and get surprised when I respond. You aren't the only one allowed to say things. And if you don't recognize true human compassion then I have pity for you.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Michele, I'm happy you started a well meaningful thread. I'm in full agreement. The bible does not lie, and the prophecies have been gradually coming to pass. God bless you!
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  Brenda Durhamposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I Amen and I second that.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Thank both of you. I do need to learn more. That is why I started it. I knew people who knew more then I did would be able to post information here that would help me learn what God wants me to know. I know a bit, but there is so much more to learn. Thank you for helping me.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You are very welcome Michele. We are all still learning. No need for us to fear the bible prophecies unfolding right before our eyes. We just all need to be alert to what's happening around us.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Went back and read small list of things mentioned in the bible that came true.
  The Rosetta Stone, discovered in 1799 in Egypt by Napoleon's scientists, was written in three languages: hieroglyphics, demotic, and Greek. It unlocked the mystery of the hieroglyphics which have helped confirm the authenticity of the Bible.
  
  The Moabite Stone discovered in 1868 at Dibon, Jordan, confirmed Moabite attacks on Israel as recorded in 2 Kings 1 and 3.
  
  The Lachish Letters, discovered in 1932-1938, 24 miles north of Beersheba, described the attack of Nebuchadnezzar on Jerusalem in 586 BC.
  
  Archeological Excavations
  The Bible's authenticity is also evidenced by archeological excavations that prove the existence of names of people and cities found in the Bible. The discovery of the city of Petra, for example, helped confirm the authenticity of the Bible's record.
  
  Also, in Judges Chapter 18 verse 29 the city of Dan is mentioned. It was discovered recently by an archaeololgist fro Hebrew Union College. That was important to me, because my father's name was Dan.
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, those things have been happening a long time.
  
  Government conspiracy theories don't help your argument at all, they just show paranoia.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Please forgive me for offending you. That is not what I meant to do.
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You didn't offend me at all.
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  Jeramiposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks or your post.
  
  Time lines and time rames are o great importance when attempting to understand ANY THING.
  
  Prophesy which were given 2500 years ago ,,, It would seen ; have no validity in todays religions establishments.
  
  Why is that ? AND how can that BE?
  
  Nothing which was prophesied has come to pass????
  Everything is going to happen all within a 3 1/2 year period ????
  
  I don't understand!
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Some things do come true. In The Book of Judges the city of Dan is mentioned, in chapter 18, verse 29. That was written a very long time ago.
  Recently the city of Dan was discovered by an archaeologist from the Hebrew Union College. I know this mostly because my father's name was Dan, so it was a big thing for us.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  There are more things that have been discovered also like
  The Rosetta Stone, discovered in 1799 in Egypt by Napoleon's scientists, was written in three languages: hieroglyphics, demotic, and Greek. It unlocked the mystery of the hieroglyphics which have helped confirm the authenticity of the Bible.
  
  The Moabite Stone discovered in 1868 at Dibon, Jordan, confirmed Moabite attacks on Israel as recorded in 2 Kings 1 and 3.
  
  The Lachish Letters, discovered in 1932-1938, 24 miles north of Beersheba, described the attack of Nebuchadnezzar on Jerusalem in 586 BC.
  
  Archeological Excavations
  The Bible's authenticity is also evidenced by archeological excavations that prove the existence of names of people and cities found in the Bible. The discovery of the city of Petra, for example, helped confirm the authenticity of the Bible's record.
  
  These are things I find incredible!
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I don't know that anyone would argue whether or not the Israelites existed. Or that there is some historical accuracy to the names of cities, or some rulers.
  
  But, you have to admit that its claims of supernatural intervention have never been proven, with corroborating archeological evidence.
  
  We are finding that other tales we once believed to be total myth are based on some fact. Of course, we don't then assume demigods walked the earth; or that other ancient gods were real.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Like the parting of the Red Sea. A reef runs from Egypt to the north side of the Red Sea. The reef used to be much closer to the surface during Biblical times at approximately 1500 B.C.
  
  Depending on the weather and tidal movements, the reef could have been exposed for hours at a time. At least that is what scientists are telling us.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Good point.
  Does that make the parting of the Sea any less of a miracle?
  Not to me. And probably not to you either!?
  God gave Moses in several instances the power to perform feats that looked like "magic" tricks (only more powerful than the magicians!) and, in the case of the parting of the Sea, the foreknowledge of what was going to happen, plus the power to perform the miracle. He obeyed and acted at just the right time to fulfill the Lord's intent.
  
  I think of God as the original "scientist" anyway. He, having created all, knows all, sees all, and can do all things, directly or by causing His followers to do them. Hallelujah!
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Sure. That makes a lot of sense.
  
  That works for the little kids in Sunday school, I'm sure.
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  Jeramiposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  A skeptical mind will never see that which they are looking at,
  In the manner in which it needs to be seen.
  How many times in our lives have we seen something to be the way in which we preceived it? to be Totally true! ,,,, only to later discover that there was another side to the issue which changed our perseption of that which we saw to be something else?
  
  I think everyone has done this!
  
  To ALL Theist & Atheist alike; !! .. Nothing is as we preceive it to be!
  
  SOooo we hold onto our perseptions as tightly as we can for as long as we can..
  YEP! I'm talking about YOU ......... and me.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I don't know that I can wholeheartedly agree with that. Were there a shred of evidence to support any claims of miracles I would be more than willing to give some benefit of the doubt. Unfortunately, there is not.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I see it as confirmation of God's word.
  Emile's response about the little children is refuted in the Bible. Jesus says we should come to Him like a little child. Pure unadulterated Faith/trust, even a revelation concept! Awesome miracle that is!
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  Jeramiposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, I was looking at a little six year old girl and her father today; and was thinking; how beautiul this was. Unadulterated, purity of Love and trust, unaware of the hypocracy and shame of the world into which she will some day enter.
  
  When we look into the eyes of such a child, we can see heaven; if we are willing to see.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Amen.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  It is not refuted. The concept was in reference to purity, not level of intellect; I'm sure. If Jesus wanted to be followed by simpletons, he would have stated that clearly.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  He wants to be followed by everyone. He Loves everyone, from the simple-minded or immature to those who are wise by the world's definition. Even those who just think they're wise. He doesn't play favorites when it comes to salvation.
  
  And He says He has chosen the "foolish" things of the world to confound the "wise". And He refers to His people as a "peculiar" people. I have no beef with that. Do you?
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Well, just so you know; peculiar is not a good definition for your posts. And, foolish and intractable are not one in the same.
  
  I have no problems with the words from the gospels. I do recognize and respect a good Christian when I run across one.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  What does your personal opinion of me have to do with the subject at hand?
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Why do the religious always attempt to make these conversations personal?
  
  You made a statement concerning christians being like children. I made a statement in reply.
  
  You posted something you say Jesus said about appearing peculiar. I said your posts wouldn't be considered peculiar. That is not personal. It's an observation from reading your posts.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  So, if scientists are saying that it could have been naturally exposed for hours at a time......where's the miracle? Assuming that that particular story is true. If it was, wouldn't it seem logical to assume there would be something written in Egyptian history about the incident? There was a lot more to the story than just walking across a dry sea bed.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Ok, I have said it twice, I did copy it from another site. So, I am going to shut up now.
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  justcuriouserposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Perhaps incredible, but none of these are fulfilled prophecy. There is a difference.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You are correct. Maybe they are just helping us learn. I really don't know enough. I am still trying to learn.
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  thebrucebeatposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  This is simply an admonition to live your life "as if" the end was near. I have no problem with that.
  
  The ridiculousness comes when people think they have the goods and know that now is so evil it is obvious that the end is near.
  
  I find these people silly.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry, not trying to be silly. But there is some truth to that. There has always been evil in the world. It is just easier to send it from place to place now. Like planes with bombs, and viruse we can't control. They are getting worse because our antibiotics don't change as fast as the bacteria does. Things like that.
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MelissaBarrettposted 12 years ago
Anyone who doubts my "Each Christian gets from the bible what they are searching for" argument needs look no further.

Its not the book, it's the reader.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Well, I wouldn't cut it off at Christians. It's a cool book. It has that effect on anyone that reads it. Haven't you heard the psychotic argument? Where that interpretation comes from is a mystery.
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I thought you guys would have read the bible and be familiar with it's psychotic ramblings, but then I also assumed people could recognise what psychosis is and the meaning of the word psychotic.
  
  My bad.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Actually Ernest, I can see a lot. The book is no more psychotic than you, or I. I don't feel the need to hate a book.
  
  Out of curiosity. You said you used to be Christian. Might I ask what sect?
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Christian sect. Born again.
  Or did you want to know which sub-set? That would just get me giggling about baptist jokes.
  
  Tell me what authorising mass murder, demanding obedience under threat of death, justifying torture and murder, wiping out whole nations on a whim sound for starters. No red flags?
  Have you ever read it would be my next question.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I have read it. I've also read history books. Bloody species. Man.
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  It's the hate of god that gets my attention in the bible.
  
  A psychotic god? A god with a human mental condition which is the worst we know of?
  That makes sense to you?
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  Jonathan Jancoposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Well, earnest, I've mentioned this before but I think it makes some sense if you abandon the theory that its a 'god'. Maybe just a nonhuman creature they thought was god. And that creature was a total control freak.
  Maybe Yahweh was an Ayeleid
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Or, the more likely scenario, a bunch of guys that wanted the guys across the desert to think their god was bigger and badder than the one the other guys were praying to.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  If you believe in God, and you follow the Mosaic laws? Sure. You'd scare the beejeebies out of me. I think most Christians probably view themselves as gentiles. The God of the Old testament was the God of the Israelites. It's the history of another people. The only God they know is the God of the New Testament. They were accepted through Love, so that's what they get out of it. That was my take on it.
  
  Just because I don't buy into things, I don't have anything against it. Unless the religious use it to pass judgment. Then I do.
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  “For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” (Matthew 5:18-19 RSV)
  
  It seems clear that the Old Testament is to be abided by until the end of human existence itself.
  
  None other then Jesus said so.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  All was accomplished. That was the whole point of the gospels. But, that was what I got out of it. You were probably seriously into the whole religious thing? You obviously saw it different.
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Yes I see it differently, and being earnest by name and nature I got deeply involved in scripture initially.
  
  Long story short, many hundreds of books read since, and many conclusions and concepts changed in the light of further information.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I would say that's for the best. That's a hard way to look at anything. Did you see it that way when you were a Baptist? That must be a real fire and brimstone sect.
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  The Australian Evangelistic Baptists fiery? Hardly! Nothing like some of the American religions.
  I love reading, and can't get enough of learning. The world and what we make of it is fascinating to me, and I have been lucky enough to have time to indulge in studying many things since I was in my early twenties, as when I made money I bought time with a lot of it. It was a good investment in my case, I had a lot to learn and still do.... every day.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Emile R. You do have a good point. I have seen some Christians who do pass judgement on others. Nobody has that right. That is not what God told them to do. It is quite the opposite of what they are supposed to do. so, what you have said about passing judgement is a very good point.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I think it fair to admit that we all pass judgment. Whether it is good, or bad. I simply dislike a bad judgment when someone tries to convince others they are the mouth piece for some supreme deity. It's rather presumptuous, at best.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  We both agree on that one. I would try to put a smile on that, but just started to use this a few days ago. I joined HubPages 3 months ago but just started using it, so don't know what I am doing yet.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Click on formatting beneath your reply window. That tells you how to do the smilies.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks, still trying, hope it works
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  maybe next time
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Jonathan Jancoposted 12 years ago
Yes, Emile, I have definitely heard the psychotic argument. How they come to arrive at their theory that their own interpretation is gospel truth (pun intended) is beyond me. I only have one hub that deals with any sort of religious concept, and I was told by more than one person that the Bible passages noted in the hub were 'off' or 'incorrect'. Thus, forcing me to conclude that the commentator's interpretation was perceived by himself as being the only way to interpret it. Kind of takes the 'interpretaion' part of it right out of the equation, doesnt it? In fact, come to think of it, the Bible passages and the interpretations of them that were noted were from a website that I linked to the hub. they werent even my own interpretations. they were from a website that claimed through their interpretations of scripture that we are about to be reconquered by the alien race that originally created humanity in their image. I was merely trying to point out the many, many, many different ways that people interpret scripture. But of course I couldnt even do that without some psychotic (or two or three) completely foaming at the mouth over it.
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  Emile Rposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  People do get exceptionally emotional over it. Which I think is odd. I would think the whole point of reading any text with a spiritual message would be to see what you got out of it, personally.
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  Barbara Kayposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I've noticed atheist can get really excited over Christian comments too. God is just an emotional issue I guess, even if you don't believe in Him.
  
  I agree with you Emile, that reading anything with a spiritual message would be to see what you personally got out of it.
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Spiritual?
  
  If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT)
  
  Is this spiritual?
  Death for adultery would wipe out most of the religiously inept!
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  Paul Wingertposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That's why I practice safe sex - Be sure there's a clear path to the back door in case the husband comes home early!
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I never thought of safe sex that way, an interesting thought process.
  
  I hear a lot of women complain about how unfaithful men are, I always wondered who they were being unfaithful with.
  
  Apparently there must be just this one woman that all these men are unfaithful with. Amuses the hell outta me!
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  DoubleScorpionposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Death for adultery would wipe out about 95% of the adult population...LOL...
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Geez! and I was trying to understate it a bit. Only 95% eh?
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  DoubleScorpionposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Oh yeah, I forgot to add the +/- 5%. Oops.
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That's OK it can be difficult to get perfect stats when using doctrine.
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  DoubleScorpionposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Ain't that the truth! The input data keeps being changed in an attempt to get favorable numbers.
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I just had a revelation!
  
  How about we just say goddunnit and be done with?
  
  I like to put the blame where it belongs.
  
  Silly use of a perfectly good male rib!
  As you can probably tell, I need sleep. Goodnight sinners, winners, and all those dear souls in between, it has been fun.
  Sleep awaits, perchance to dream of real imaginings that serve me when I wake.
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  DoubleScorpionposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Have a good one.
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Jonathan Jancoposted 12 years ago
Or maybe just made up as a control tactic. Either way, I dont think an allknowing creator of everything would be a Jealous God as they say in Exodus. And speaking of the desert, perhaps the heat and lack of water are the reason Mosaic law expends so much of its energy on the gazillion different ways you SHOULD NOT slaughter livestock and then taking their sweet old time to say 'oh and dont marry your siblings or offspring, either.'
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jacharlessposted 12 years ago
Those claims are bogus.
John's Revealing expressly points out the who, what, why:

Note he mentions the "image" of the beast 3 times. The image or idea, concept, thought of is what is being brought to life and cause for worship demand, to the point where this image would speak -or ruach (manifest itself).

I find it interesting its says: free AND bound; rich AND poor. This means every single individual who has lived after the resurrection.
The right hand and forehead are symbolic of righteous action and
righteous thought. Remember the law was bound to the forehead AND the Tefillin wrapped around the right hand & arm. ["Bind them as a sign on your right hand and let them serve as a frontlet between your eyes [forehead]."]
John is talking about remembering Rule #1 versus human rule #1, the law of themselves, yet again.

Man is the beast AND the image of that beast, not a creature called the Devil or Satan or Lucifer, unless of course all are small letter d s l, then you are talking about the adversary of the human being --themselves.

Ever hear the saying, "The only person standing in your way is you?" That sums up everything -the entire law, prophets, salvation, resurrection, pauline fixation, renewal of the mind, etc etc etc. Man is standing in his own way, worshipping none other than his own image and not the image he was created to be.

Revelation, as a letter, was fulfilled at the Resurrection. Again, to note chapter.verse:

rev 20.5-6
Back to back, the verses are explicit: this is the FIRST Resurrection. The 2nd death has no power.

-why would the second death have no power? Because the first death is the body, the second death is the spirit. These first fruits would not face the second death.
Note also, this event is AFTER Death & Hell are destroyed and immediately BEFORE the reopening of the Kingdom of Heaven, once again.

"All thing made new" ring any bells?
Guess who else said that? Bueller, anyone... anyone...

Rejoice and live -and never taste death or worship your fears, thoughts or those of man and die in body -and possibly in spirit also **.
That's what John pretty much summed up.

James.

** you will also note, death of spirit is controlled by the individual also. Yes, I am aware many texts say Creator is able or can destroy both body & spirit -but it never says He actually does...
Think about it.
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manlypoetrymanposted 12 years ago
Is Revelation Coming? People have always said this generation by generation. However...One Truth is undeniable compared to those previous generations: We are much further down the road to "Revelation" happening then they were!
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Jeramiposted 12 years ago
Most prophesy mentioned in the book of revelation come with a time line for which the prophesy is to come, and or a timeframe in which it is to last.
Rev. 6:1 thru 8 (four horsemen) were sent down upon the earth having no time fame in which they were to finish their mission.
They have never stopped roaming the earth.
Chapter 5 gives us a hint as to when these horsemen were sent down unto the earth.
Who is worthy to open the book?
No one in heaven, on or under the earth is found that is worthy to open the book! John is greatly disappointed!
And John wept. John was expecting his Lord and savior to be there in heaven, BUT ? Momentarily the Lamb of God arrives.
Where was he just moments before? Not in heaven or on the earth. He had to have been halfway in between (in transit)

As soon as Jesus gets there, all bloody and looking like a sacrificial Lamb, he immediately takes the book and begins opening the seals.

This tells me that John is saying that these seal judgments came upon the earth about the same time as Jesus was crucified
(around 30AD) and have been roaming the earth ever sense.
The seal judgments were inflicted upon that Hebrew Nation which had rejected Jesus.

Before that Hebrew Nation was scattered to the four winds (approx 138 AD), the 70 weeks as described in Daniel for them to quit sinning and anoint the Most Holy had surly come to pass or God would not have caused that Hebrew Nation to cease to exist.
THEN a period of time passes once more before the trumpet judgments begin to blow.
These were inflicted upon the Roman Empire.
With the seventh trumpet having not yet been sounded.

And concerning the vial judgments, (C 16) The first angel poured out his vial and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men who worshiped the beast.

Can anyone think of a more grievous sore than that of the black death (Bubonic plague) which killed 1/2 to 2/3 of the population in Europe ?

In my opinion, ALL of the prophesy written in the book of Rev.; except for the seventh trumpet and seventh vial has been fulfilled.

When we consider this concept to be a viable option …….
All of prophesy begins to fall into line, and "THE Mystery" of prophesy begins to fade.

At least; this is the way my pitiful little brain sees it.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, mine also.
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justcuriouserposted 12 years ago
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/201 … ladam.html

Even evangelicals are starting to crack regarding the myth basis of the Bible versus the literalist interpretation.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That is interesting. There are other things I find interesting if you look at the earth from a scientific view. There have been some major global changes which kill off all life, or almost all life on earth. About 500 million years ago, an asteriod hit the earth and killed off about 95% ( I think) of all life. But then scientists find a large number of fossils that just sort of spring up. How can that happen? How can such a large number of animals just come to life? This is no myth, this is science. I believe it is proof God exists.
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  The fact that you have not taken the time to understand how that happens and have instead embraced God as your sole answer only shows that is what you wish to remain ignorant about and what you wish to believe.
  
  It has nothing to do with proof of anything.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Then can you tell me how it happend?
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  If I were to spend hours/days writing explanations for you, yes. But, there are many, many sources available for you that would answer your questions.
  
  If you actually take the time to seek those answers rather than just turn to the Bible, you would begin to understand there is no proof of any god.
  
  You might not like that, either. So, be prepared.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Either way, nobody can ( or should) force anyone to believe or not believe. I hope you have a good day.
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Who said anything about forcing beliefs? You are asking questions, don't you want answers? If the answers make you think and those thoughts are in contradiction with your Bible, who is going to force you to change your beliefs other than yourself? No one. Just you.
  
  So, be prepared.
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  manlypoetrymanposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Ok...I can't resist...and have to interject: " be prepared for what?" You made at least 2 refernces to be prepared...seems interesting for you to say that based on what would appear to be that you refute the Bible...which would then mean that would be "Revelations"...as well.
  
  So that being the case...I'm dying to find out what your definition of being "prepared" for what...is!?
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Be prepared to think.
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  manlypoetrymanposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That was a quick answer! (Faster then I can think... )
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That was even faster.
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  justcuriouserposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I think you mean "Revelation".
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  manlypoetrymanposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  HHHmmm...I'm "just curious" why the non-plural had to be pointed out?
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  justcuriouserposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Thought you would want to represent scripture accurately. Was I wrong?
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  manlypoetrymanposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  A very small point...I must say...not worthy of discussion...and seemingly odd...and slightly petty. But...I have heard many a lecturer and preacher say "Revelations" with out taking anything away from what they say. have a nice day, J. Curiouser!
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  justcuriouserposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You know what they say. The Devil's in the details.
  You have nice day too.
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  American Viewposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  A suspended hubber in hiding
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  justcuriouserposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Being followed by a troll.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Troubled man, yes I am asking questions, and yes I do want answers. But you said
  
  ."If I were to spend hours/days writing explanations for you, yes. But, there are many, many sources available for you that would answer your questions."
  
  "If you actually take the time to seek those answers rather than just turn to the Bible, you would begin to understand there is no proof of any god."
  
  So, I thought you did not want to answer my questions. I was trying to be polite and not bother you.
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Your questions would require a huge amount of explanation. There are many sources for you to get started if you wish to get them answered. No one could possibly answer them here without spending many hours posting them.
  
  You are not bothering me at all.
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  Michele Travisposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks, I appreciate that.
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