After the 10 commandments were handed down. One question remains unanswered. Just when, did "GOD" go in for MURDER?
Noticed your "?" It's a valid question. Since religion was first started, more people have been murdered (correct term) for the sake of forcing their religion on other people. Actually through a world war, these religious values were forced without success. Today, we have radicals of a certain religion that want everyone to believe as they do and will murder to enforce that belief.
I think you're reading something into my "?" and dismissed the meaning of "rolleyes".
I was question the foundation which you were making for a claim about "murder". Murder is a human concept and if you attempt to apply it to a G/god via what is based on in the bible, then you've already done yourself a disservice because this issue has been addressed many times about what is in the OT and NT.
I don't need to be told how many different people have died with regards to religious related wars or because people are ignorant so much so that they feel the need to enforce their pathetic belief on others.
I have a question ... Had it not been for these alleged Murders; how many of these people would be alive today?
OK I admitt it! vague indeed.
Strickly from Gods perspective (if there is one) We can not get out of this world alive. We are all going to die some day one way or another.
If there is a life after death; does it really matter how or when we enter into the afterlife?
What makes you think you are suppose to get out of this world dead? Just because it's constantly happened over thousands of years, doesn't mean anything. It only shows how limited people's thinking is actually.
And, you're going based on previous experience and knowledge gained which would you to believe this statement. My experience and knowledge gain would incline to conclude that that would be untrue.
IF being the opportune word and no it wouldn't matter how or when a person would enter. But, knowing what I know, understanding what I have experienced, there's absolutely no reason for an afterlife to exist to begin with.
The only reason immortality isn't viable at this stage of human evolution is because as a collective we've not learned how to properly work with nature for the benefit of all. Otherwise, our knowledge about the world around us and of ourselves, could actually provide immorality for the human species at a later date, due to knowledge still to learn.
All of that is possible. But if we stop dieing, unless we stop procreating, we are going to need a bigger house.
True enough, sooner or later more people would take too much space and buildings can only be so tall. Not to mention, digging in the ground, you can only dig so far. Thus, space exploration and inhabiting other location will be a requirement, but with the advancements to our health, we would come up with a solution for that too.
Could you please explain what it is you are trying to ask?
Hey Dave, if you need an explanation? I would say you have bigger problems.
The question is appropriate. Since when did "GOD" go in for, or support, or approve of MURDER? of anyone or any group of people in "GOD's" name or in the name of religion?
I am not sure God is into murder, nor was it about Her when the mandate "thou shalt not commit murder" was written.
God knew human beings were slaughtering each other since Cain and Abel. The idea behind the Commandments was to provide humans a set of laws to live by.
Of course being human, laws are broken as easily as they are kept.
God understands human nature, probably better than we do. Hence the need to set up some guidelines in which to live.
That does not mean we do not still have free will. As a human each of us has the right to choice.
Does this help?
Great question. Thank you.
I've often wondered if Christ went to the Cross to say something akin to this:
"All things have I created, and all things that have been and will be, I knew would come to pass in my foreknowledge, and for that am I here in the cross. But as I do this upon this cross, I do so to demonstrate that I am aware of the recklessness of my actions to create mankind, angels that turned from light to darkness, and all of the catastrophe that has come to pass. In spite of knowing that all of this would occur before I ever said "let there be light," I made it any way. So here upon this cross, I am saying I am sorry to you all. I, too, have free will to do this or that, and I chose to make a place for mortals. Believe me when I say this, that I did it in love, but also, I was always alone, without anyone to share my power with. And what is it to have anything, if not everything, if you cannot share it. SO, I acted on my own volition, made the universe and everything in it, and even man in all of his suffering. If you can forgive me for making all of this, knowing that so much suffering has occurred on account of my creative will, then please do so, and believe me when I say to you, that if you believe in me, and my sorrow, that this has all caused me great suffering, too - then I will take you when you die and place you in a dimension that you cannot fathom with your human minds. But if you hate me, then I will have to turn away from you. I know this too, because everyone that is alone wants someone for them to share their self with, and all that they have to offer. I have seen into the heart of man what he does when he is alone, and because of that I can see that if man were God as I am God, he, too, would have created something to share all he is with. So, I have come to earth to die by your own hands, because I knew that you would do that, too! But it makes sense, because people have forever slandered and hated that which loves most joyfully. You will kill me, and I will forgive that act, but please accept my actions, as they have contributed to to so much murder. I consider myself an accomplice, even thought I have given you all a will to be Logical."
Any way.... Yeah... I see the point in asking... but I really love God, because I would have done all this, too. I am alone now, and I hate it. I would damn near do anything for love... someone with whom I feel understands me. I have had that thought before... that God was lonely, so he made something that could perceive him so that he could be -- "esse est percipi" to be, is to be perceived. SO, was God at all, before something could consider him? '
wow,... did you write/concieve this yourself?
well said,... i'm speachless,.. and a new follower of brandon tart (not in the creapy cult way, i'm just going to follow you on HB. ha!)
"...someone with whom I feel understands me..."
it seems you had that...
God never supported any murder. When you think about it the true( this is just my opinion no offence to any one) gods true followers, the Anabaptists and the Baptists never killed anyone, but the Catholics, Protistants, Lutherins, ect. killed for their religion.
@ts it never says I(God) shall not murder ,it says thou shall not murder...on serious notes mass murder,jealousy,arrogance,hate are attributes of LOVING GOD which abrahamic faiths promote..
I find no reference in the old and new Testament that indicates "GOD" ever murdered anyone. I do, however, find reference of "loving, careing, devoted" to all his "children" aka us. I personally believe that "GOD" does not promote or support murder in any form. Yet! more people have been ruthlessly murdered in his name, as well as for his name. More people have been murdered for their belief in a particular religion, than for any other reason. I think this form of hyprocracy and other types is why I have no specific desire to follow or subscribe to any form of organized religion. My opinion, and I'm entitled to it, Is Mankind reads the "Bible" then distorts it's wording to suit specific ideals to satisfy his prejudices.
@lawrence read again..u wuld find noah's flood in which god mass murdered not just humans but animals too...then read about egypt plague again god involved in mass murder..
@pisean282311, but can it be called "murder?" What is the definition of "murder." One human killing another human.
God is not human.
In fact, Genesis 1:26 says that God created "man" in His own image. That would mean that we are inherently non-physical, spiritual, and immortal sources of creation. Being immortal (albeit sleeping in our Homo sapiens shells), God cannot kill us with a Flood. He can only destroy Homo sapiens bodies. His children remain unharmed by it.
So, even if you "changed" the definition to, someone killing their own kind, God still didn't kill His own kind, because they are immortal (dead in the sense of asleep, spiritually, but untouched by physical harm).
@Lawrence Da-vid, you make some good points, but it's really pretty simple.
We are "flesh of God's flesh" which essentially is no physical flesh at all. Genesis 1:26, we were created in His image and likeness -- non-physical, spiritual and immortal sources of creation -- essentially baby gods. So, Jesus was our beloved brother in a very true sense of the word.
This has all been a rescue mission, and some simply do not want to be rescued. They've forgotten who they really are. They think that they are their bodies and their egos.
Ego was created by "eating" the "fruit" (product) of the tree of good and evil. But in the simplest terms, ego was the turning away from God toward physical dichotomies and physical continuity -- a dependence on reality rather than on the Father. Faith in physical things is what traps us.
Humility, on the other hand, is the subduing of ego, and turning back toward the Father and depending upon Him.
When people interpret the Bible (and everyone who knows about it, does), they can remain humble and seek truth, or they can hold onto their own interpretation as truth. The former is full of humility; the latter is full of ego.
When someone holds their own ideas as "important," they are following ego. And I have done that on far too many occasions. But when the ideas are left as unimportant, then finding truth becomes possible.
Those who pervert truth are holding too tightly to their own interpretation. That's ego. That's being "right" for the sake of self.
There are two kinds of being "right." There is the physical reality type which is part of the dichotomy -- right-wrong (and one of the many vectors of ego), and there is the pure kind of "right" which does not have another side to it. In fact, it remains entirely untainted by "wrong." This is the viewpoint of God and of Jesus. This is the Christ consciousness for which we all seek. This is Buddhahood or Nirvana -- everlasting life.
When Peter the fisherman stepped out of his storm-tossed boat onto the unsettled sea of Galilee, he left all "reason" behind. For a few precious moments he was held in bliss and touched perfect "confidence" untarnished by "doubt."
In that moment, he was not perceiving truth (effect), but creating truth (cause), because he had -- in that moment -- returned to the Father. That was prayer in action with no importance considered at all.
WHEN God acted to destroy mankind he always ALWAYS did three things 1) warned mankind through prophets 2) gave them opportunity to be saved 3) was selective in who was destroyed. God is primarily love, but He is also Justice, Power, and Wisdom.
Humans have free will and thus can decide whether they prefer life independent of God and all His Love, Justice, Wisdom and Power which leads to death because incidentally God is also the source of light; or they can choose life acknowledging God's sovereignty which leads to peace, love, joy, goodness, mildness, faith, long suffering, self control and kindness. (I'm pretty sure i have those out of order)
People can be such bullies when they have issues with authority. It feels awful from a human perspective to have to destroy what you have made or to have a child turn out rotten and useless because of it's own choices in life. How awful it must be for God to have to protect his good children by ridding the world of the sorry ones.
SN: I think it's interesting that religion and God are used interchangeably in these types of discussions. Doing what God says is not a religion. It's a life.
by pisean282311 12 years ago
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