How thin is the line between conceit and confidence in women?

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   tHErEDpILLposted 12 years ago

   In a world dominated by sex women have become more powerful than ever.  In my opinion this has resulted in many young and older women confusing confidence with conceit.  Many are only concerned with doing whatever makes them happy and making sure that everyone else knows they are pretty enough to get away with it.  Trust me men will let a women get away with murder if she's hot and its legally possible.  No wonder men are wearing tight pants and carrying purses.  Women are rising to power, but they must understand that; "with great power comes great responsibility."  Here's to the future!

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      klarawieckposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I'm not conceited, and I don't have anything to brag about, but as I've grown older I've become more confident and I've learned to appreciate my womanhood. Sadly, most women who flaunt their sexual confidence are in fact very insecure and have a need to be noticed in order to feel like they exist. I much more prefer the type of confidence of Marian, the Librarian.

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      Shadesbreathposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Hot women founder when they hit forty-five.
      
      Money and power lasts lifetimes. Don't kid yourself into believing there is any hot-chick conspiracy.
      
      Hot chicks are, and always have been, and always will be, the prize of the powerful man.
      
      Women who want real power will get it by educating themselves, learning how the system works and, rather than burning a bra or making a sign, will simply use the system for her own ends. Many have done it. They have shown others how it works. Despite how much idiot women will complain about porn, prostitution or the biological imperatives that will always animate men, power (which is what "confidence" is about) comes from where you try to set your base.
      
      Women who set their power base in hotness, assuming they have the right genes, workout regiment, genetic make up, will do great financially. For X-number of  years anyway. Then they will be old, and, well, their power base that is based on male approval will die. Hopefully they got enough money or security from that and did something un-hot-chick-like with it.
      
      It doesn't make them evil. It simply makes them not women who want to compete on an intellectual level.
      
      Women who can compete on both levels will win. I just don't think that woman will ever exist. Men who work on the level of "I need global dominance" don't care how hot a chick is. They have a bucket of hot chicks sent to their rooms every time they call room service.  So, the woman who wants to win the universe has to not care about being hot and just care about screwing everyone over like her male counterparts do.
      
      I'm not sure there's too many women biologically programmed for that. Our culture doesn't encourage it either. It could happen, but it's kind of a matter of reality, biology and ongoing cultural momentum.

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         tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         So the women who concentrate on "hotness" only are inferior to the women who are hot, but also have other things going for them?  If this is what you are saying I would agree.

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         couturepopcafeposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         This global dominance/hotness factor power is off the mark, IMO. The premise on which it relies is that men are the determinant for assessing hotness in women who might wield that hotness into some kind of power, that power being over men. The scenario does exist and, having been on both sides of the hotness table, I can tell you it's ludicrous. Intelligent women (I can't speak for men) who also had the good fortune to be born beautiful find no satisfaction in the type of power born of the weakness of male lust. In essence, it gets old really fast and can often become a crutch as well as a hindrance. The beautiful woman needs to try harder to prove she's more than a pretty face. She has to focus on not relying on that beauty to open doors, though I must admit, it works to a great degree but can cause one to rely on it instead of growing one's intellect and skill. 
         
         The confidence/conceit argument has more to do with inner power. So here's the big secret. When the voice and the vision on the inside become more clear and loud and profound than the opinions on the outside, you've mastered your life.

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            Shadesbreathposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            You make my point better than I did. So, while you may think you disagree with me, perhaps not, you've actually, in my mind, entirely clarified my intent (see bold text).

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      Shinkickerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Confidence springs from security and self-assurance whereas conceit has its roots in the opposite

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         tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Well said.

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   Lisa HWposted 12 years ago

   The women who are "rising to power" (at least any kind that's real power) aren't usually the ones who see the only form of power they have as the fact that they look good in tight pants and/or mini-skirts.  Also, women who achieve any degree of "the kind of power that matters" don't usually do it because men "let them".  They often do it in spite of a lot of men, and a lot of other women, trying to stop them (or at least not doing anything to support their rise to power).
   
   I'd agree with klarawieck about women who flaunt their sexual confidence (and who often actually "build their identity" on whether or not they're known for looking sexy).
   
   There's not really a fine line between confidence and conceit.  There's a big difference between the two.  One problem, however, is that confidence in women is often interpreted as "conceit" by both men and other women, while confidence in men is often what is taken for granted as "how men are supposed to be".
   
   Having said that, though, I think one thing that does separate the two different things is whether or not someone feels "superior as an overall person" to others or whether she has a healthy confidence while still knowing she's not the only one in the world who has the attribute/skill she has; and/or whether she's aware that the "measure of person" isn't on isolated and superficial traits/attributes/skills and is, instead, on the the value of a "good heart"  and integrity.

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I ask if there's a fine line because one can slip into the other at some point.  You don't agree?  Can a confident women not fall victim to human nature and one day have their confidence subconsciously morphed into conceit whith out them realizing?

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         Lisa HWposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         After I saw this yesterday I decided to turn my long answer into a Hub.  It's finished but not posted yet.  Anyway, the short answer (and probably only one you'd be interested in anyway): 
         
         I don't necessarily agree.  I think there aretwo things that can look like confidence, but only one of them is "the right kind of confidence" (with things in perspective and valuing the right things) The other kind is the more shallow kind, which often focuses only on isolated traits/attributes (as opposed to seeing them within perspective and the right context).
         
         I think the two kinds of confidence are like apples and oranges.  An apple won't morph into an orange, but an orange disguised as an apple is eventually going to appear to be what it really is when the disguise wears away.  I think what looks like confidence morphing can really be that second kind of confidence (that orange disguised as an apple) getting so "bad" it becomes obvious that it's conceit.  Maybe it's a matter of "conceit light" and "out-and-out, obvious, conceit" when that happens.
         
         I think someone with healthier confidence doesn't morph, because all the things that go into healthier confidence are there, and conceit can't grow from those healthier components..
         
         Just my own thoughts on it, though (of course).   

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   CMHypnoposted 12 years ago

   I don't think that women are idiots for complaining about porn and prostitution Shades, as a lot of what goes on in the sex industry is pretty abusive and degrading to both the women and men who get involved, although it is probably naive to think that they will ever stop. As with everything the line between a bit of harmless, adult fun and something altogether darker is easy to cross.
   
   If a woman promotes herself purely on her hotness, she turns herself into a commodity with a finite self life, which is fine as long as the woman has the smarts to realise that and make plans for what she is going to do with her life when physical attributes are no longer enough.  There is nothing sadder than seeing women who repeatedly go under the surgeon's knife or starve themselves to make themselves look younger. Women's beauty changes as they get older, but like fine wine, maturity brings out the best.

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Yes, most of these women who go under the knife are the ones who unfortunately based there whole lives on how they look.

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         klarawieckposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Yes, but . . . Oh, man! Every time I stand next to those gorgeous swedish looking girls, 5'10" with big blue eyes, high heels, and hot bodies . . . I want to disappear by some kind of magic act. I have to work up the courage even to walk pass them without getting ran over!

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            tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            That is a real response,  from a real women, expressing real personal feelings.  At the end of the day you are more beautiful than those walking dumpsters with the blonde hair, because you are not fake.

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   klarawieckposted 12 years ago

   You should also take into consideration that there are social groups were looks are regarded as a top priority. If you're a model and your social circle consists of models, fashion designers, photographers, etc; you might want to pay more attention to your diet and your hair products than understanding the facts that lead to the war in the middle east. I'm not saying that models are dumb, but we don't have 32 hours days. Most of their time will be employed in taking care of their physical appearance, and there is nothing wrong with that. We need gorgeous people to inspire writers, musicians, film makers - those of us that spend less time brushing our hair and more time creating artistic beauty.

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      MarleneBposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      You make a good point here, klarawieck. In the beauty industry, it is ALL about beauty, and you will only succeed if you spend a good amount of time being consumed with knowledge about the industry. If you are the beauty upon which people are looking (a model, for instance), then you had better put your best face or body forward. That is not being conceited; it is being wise.  It is no different than me being a real estate broker and spending all the time I can spare learning about the industry so I can be of the best assistance to my client.
      
      Conceit is when the person internalizes their beauty, believing they are God's gift to the world.

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   curtisnh005posted 12 years ago

   As women do get older and wiser, doesn't the attraction to men become about who they are as a person they are?  I know for me, an air of confidence is very appealing and that confidence is not about their looks or about needing to lower the values of those around them.  The confidence seems to glow in how they interact with you as an equal.  If find that many many women who cross out of their 30's and into their 40's seem to carry this naturally. It must be the wisdom collected over time.  I am in my early 50's and date regularly and pretty much eliminated going out with 30 somethings for this reason. I find that many times but not always, the age of the 30's is about trying to find the final footing in their own confidence and sometimes that can come across in putting others down to achieve their own self worth. I don't think many times it is intentional, but it shows they still have a lack of confidence in themselves. I would say this would appear as conceit to others. In the 40's for some reason I find this to not be the case as often.  Maybe it is just been my experience and what I perceive is not true, but just wanted to share what I see. Great post and interesting responses.  Cheers

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