Apostle Paul got it all wrong.
92- IntimatEvolution
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I think that the Christian religion would have been entirely different, if Apostle Paul hadn't screwed things up. It is my firm belief that if Christians really want to be Christ-like, they need to have a dual faith based, religious, belief system. As it is, how can any of us Christians expect to get to heaven, when we don't follow God's laws except for 10. It seems to me, that Christians should closely mimic the ancient practices and traditions, such as our Jewish and Muslim brother and sisters do. Why don't we? Why are so many Christians so against a Judeo-Christian foundation? Christ was a Jew. Early Christians were all Jewish. Why didn't Paul take on Christ's faith, when Paul supposedly embraced Jesus as his Saviour? I think he seriously screw things up and got it all wrong.
What's your thoughts and views?
Thanks
87- Born Again 05
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No one can keep the ten commandments. Paul didn't have it all wrong. He had it all right! Everyone lives in sin. We were born that way...it's our default setting. Christ, sinless, came to pay the price for our sin atonement. You can not earn your way into Heaven by any good works or practicing religion. Only by repenting of your sin and placing your faith in Christ alone can you be assured of eternity with Him. 1John5:11,12 tells us, " And this is the testimony. God gives us eternal life and the life is in His son. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life." Accept the Son and be assured of spending an eternity with him!
Amen, May God bless you and make your postings a a real eye-opener for people living under the bondage of sin.
Thank you.
Abraham- Godsweirdson
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IntimatEvolution wrote:
I think that the Christian religion would have been entirely different, if Apostle Paul hadn't screwed things up. It is my firm belief that if Christians really want to be Christ-like, they need to have a dual faith based, religious, belief system. As it is, how can any of us Christians expect to get to heaven, when we don't follow God's laws except for 10. It seems to me, that Christians should closely mimic the ancient practices and traditions, such as our Jewish and Muslim brother and sisters do. Why don't we? Why are so many Christians so against a Judeo-Christian foundation? Christ was a Jew. Early Christians were all Jewish. Why didn't Paul take on Christ's faith, when Paul supposedly embraced Jesus as his Saviour? I think he seriously screw things up and got it all wrong.
What's your thoughts and views?
Thanks- Godsweirdson
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I don't think Paul got it wrong, the church has gotten it wrong. We CHOOSE to look at the Old Covenant and the New Covenant and totally over look the Dispensation of the Mystery as recorded by Paul in Ephesians and Colossians.
We choose to confuse ourselves by trying to combine the Kingdom of Heaven and the Kingdom of God. And further add to the confusion by trying to say that believers are both the Bride of Christ AND the Body of Christ. You can't be both!
Its just like with the four Gospels. The first three pertain to Israel and the offering of God to give them their earthly Kingdom. But the Gospel of John is our Gospel for today. Its NOT a Jewish book. If it was, he wouldn't have to define Jewish terms 17 times.
If you would like to discuss this further e mail me at godsweirdson@yahoo.com and I would love to continue the discussion.Thankfully we dont get to heaven following rules. The rules actually demonstrate our inability to get to heaven, and show us our desperate need for a saviour. Jesus said he did not come to abolish the law but to fulfill it.
- Jerami
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Godswierdson wrote And further add to the confusion by trying to say that believers are both the Bride of Christ AND the Body of Christ. You can't be both!
And the Church can not be the mother of Christ; which many Churchs interpretes Rev. twelve to represent.
Is this right. The church gave birth to; was then the body of; going to be the bride of ??? I cain't believe that.Paul was a master architect of the mind. He understood what people wanted and wrapped it up in philosophy that went viral.
He also saw that the national and nationally exclusive religions of his age could be supplanted by a transnational, inclusive religion that appealed across all borders and all times.
It's a shame he couldn't have dumped the Old Testament with its nationalism and all those absurd prejudices but then the New Testament is a bit thin on its own.
If Paul was around today, he would be head of promotions and advertising at Coca-Cola. After the success of his religious strategy how could they refuse him?- Jerami
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I don't think that Paul could have left out the old testament and had a story to tell.
Scripture says that God chose the Hebrews to introduce himself to the world.
To begin with almost nothing and build a mighty nation.
It was a progressive plan. He then showed to the world what happens when he is rejected. Paul was then chosen to tell the story to the Gentiles. Following rituals did not work well with the Hebrews; Jesus died on the cross abolishing ritualistic observance of Gods Laws. Paul introduced The NEW COVENANT through the rest of the world. When the disciples preached in the trade centers of the world people heard the message and carried it around the world.IntimatEvolution wrote:
I think that the Christian religion would have been entirely different, if Apostle Paul hadn't screwed things up. It is my firm belief that if Christians really want to be Christ-like, they need to have a dual faith based, religious, belief system. As it is, how can any of us Christians expect to get to heaven, when we don't follow God's laws except for 10. It seems to me, that Christians should closely mimic the ancient practices and traditions, such as our Jewish and Muslim brother and sisters do. Why don't we? Why are so many Christians so against a Judeo-Christian foundation? Christ was a Jew. Early Christians were all Jewish. Why didn't Paul take on Christ's faith, when Paul supposedly embraced Jesus as his Saviour? I think he seriously screw things up and got it all wrong.
What's your thoughts and views?
ThanksYou have to go back to the sacrifices of the old testament. People would sacrifice a lamb to cleanses them of their sins. The prophets foretold of a "lamb" that would end all scarifies--Jesus Christ. If we try to justify ourselves by the Law you will be condemned by it. Why? Because we have broken God’s Law. We’ve either lied, stolen, lusted, coveted and if you break 1 you’ve broken them all, that’s why Jesus came. If we could save ourselves What did Jesus die for? Remember what Jesus told the Peter? If you want to view more on my take I wrote a hub call “You can’t buy Grace”. I hope this helps.
77- Sunny River
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IntimatEvolution wrote:
It seems to me, that Christians should closely mimic the ancient practices and traditions, such as our Jewish and Muslim brother and sisters do. Why don't we? Why are so many Christians so against a Judeo-Christian foundation? Christ was a Jew. Early Christians were all Jewish. Why didn't Paul take on Christ's faith, when Paul supposedly embraced Jesus as his Saviour? I think he seriously screw things up and got it all wrong.
The thing about the ancient practices and traditions is that, as Christians, we DON'T NEED TO FOLLOW THEM ANYMORE. Know why? Because every one of those sacrifices paled in comparison to the perfect sacrifice-- Jesus Christ. Once he had died and risen, there was no longer a need to sacrifice in atonement for what we have done because the ultimate sacrifice had been given to pay for those sins. It's the wonder of forgiveness that we don't have to do those things anymore and the reason the Jews still do is because their faith basis is completely different from that of Christians.
The heart of Christianity is centered on the belief that Jesus Christ was the savior. Jews DO NOT believe this and are still waiting for the savior they think is still to come. Therefore, it is impossible to have a Judeo-Christian faith because at the heart of it the two religions believe two completely different things that are totally incompatible.
As for Paul, he was also a Jew. HOWEVER, the thing many people fail to realize or remember is that it was the JEWS that were promised the savior and they were supposed to spread their faith and bring the Gentiles into it rather than become an exclusive little group of "holier than thou because we were chosen by God and you weren't". That is what the Jews became and so they failed in the mission God had given them to bring others to him and set an example for the world.
When the Jews as a whole failed to see Jesus for what he really was, God turned from the Jews and they were no longer his chosen people, because EVERYONE was chosen now that Jesus had died and risen for THE WHOLE WORLD.
So, no. Paul didn't screw anything up. He had it right and the Jews as a whole couldn't see that, which is why they're still waiting for their savior to this day and we can rejoice in our assurance of eternal life.We don't keep the law on our own but that's the point. With the spirit in us, we now can. That's why we're told to be perfect even as our Father in heaven is perfect. Nobody said that will 'get us to heaven', it's what we do because Jesus paid the price for sin, reconciled us to God. He didn't come keep all the law, fulfill the requirements, die for our not keeping them just so that we don't have to anymore. We're supposed to walk as he walked, do what he did, and live as he lived.
There are two ways to take the word fulfilled too. One is fulfill by completing; the other is to fulfill by...well, fulfilling. Like you fulfill the requirements to be accepted into a college or to be hired for a job.
92- lyricsingray
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who's opposite Paul?
God said he blinded the Jews so they couldn't see and will graft the Gentiles in. I'm not a Jew so guess I'm a graftee.
93- Ken R. Abell
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IntimatEvolution wrote:
I think that the Christian religion would have been entirely different, if Apostle Paul hadn't screwed things up. It is my firm belief that if Christians really want to be Christ-like, they need to have a dual faith based, religious, belief system. As it is, how can any of us Christians expect to get to heaven, when we don't follow God's laws except for 10. It seems to me, that Christians should closely mimic the ancient practices and traditions, such as our Jewish and Muslim brother and sisters do. Why don't we? Why are so many Christians so against a Judeo-Christian foundation? Christ was a Jew. Early Christians were all Jewish. Why didn't Paul take on Christ's faith, when Paul supposedly embraced Jesus as his Saviour? I think he seriously screw things up and got it all wrong.
What's your thoughts and views?
ThanksPaul was also Jewish, a Hebrew of Hebrews is how he referred to himself.
You ask why so many Christians are against a Judeo-Christian foundation. Not sure where you come up with that since the Bible contains Jewish Scripture (Old Testament) & Christian Scripture (New Testament), & Paul is the one who wrote that ALL of it, the whole counsel of Scripture was inspired by God.
Christ centralized the Ten Commandments into what is known as the Great Commandment, which by the way he pulled out of Deuteronomy in the Old Testament: "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind, and love your neighbor as yourself."
Paul picked up on that & wrote to the Romans: "Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for he who loves his fellowman has fulfilled the law."
The Ten Commandments are the foundational cornerstone of western civilization, but since in the context of your post you posit Christianity as a religion, keeping all ten as intended by God & explained by Christ most clearly in the sermon on the mount, is an impossibility.
It is a matter of the heart, as Christ made clear again & again.
Christianity is about relationship; the vertical relationship between humans & God; the horizontal relationship between each other. While we were yet sinners God loved us & gave his only Son that we may come into relationship with him.
God loves us, we are to love one another. Jesus proclaimed that & Paul build upon it precept by precept. And near the end of his life when he was imprisoned in Rome for preaching Christ, Paul wrote to some friends in the city of Philippi & told them that he wanted to know Jesus more & more & more so he was pressing on to do just that; it was his burning passion to be faithful to the risen One who he encountered on the Damascus Road.
All that to say, I do not think Paul got it wrong or seriously screwed anything up.Also, it wasn't just Paul's idea that non-Jewish believers did not need to convert to Judaism.
Ken wrote: Paul is the one who wrote that ALL of it, the whole counsel of Scripture was inspired by God.
But remember, Paul could have only been talking about the old testament, that WAS scripture; he also said anything that didn't agree with it was a lie.- 93
- Ken R. Abell
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TMinut wrote:
Ken wrote: Paul is the one who wrote that ALL of it, the whole counsel of Scripture was inspired by God.
But remember, Paul could have only been talking about the old testament, that WAS scripture; he also said anything that didn't agree with it was a lie.That is a fair issue to raise, though my point was that Paul's words were instrumental not only in the development of the New Testament canon, but also for inclusion of the Old Testament as Scripture for Christians.
For those who want to dismiss the Judeo dimension of Christianity, I'd urge them to read "The Bible Jesus Read" by Phillip Yancey. 
76- Danny R Hand
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IntimatEvolution wrote:
I think that the Christian religion would have been entirely different, if Apostle Paul hadn't screwed things up. It is my firm belief that if Christians really want to be Christ-like, they need to have a dual faith based, religious, belief system. As it is, how can any of us Christians expect to get to heaven, when we don't follow God's laws except for 10. It seems to me, that Christians should closely mimic the ancient practices and traditions, such as our Jewish and Muslim brother and sisters do. Why don't we? Why are so many Christians so against a Judeo-Christian foundation? Christ was a Jew. Early Christians were all Jewish. Why didn't Paul take on Christ's faith, when Paul supposedly embraced Jesus as his Saviour? I think he seriously screw things up and got it all wrong.
What's your thoughts and views?
Read Romans and Corinthians!
ThanksAs I understand it, Christianity has Paul to thank for the spread of the religion because no one did after Jesus died.
He got Romans to start believing in it and when a future Roman Emperor (Constantine) made Christianity the official religion, that is when the religion exploded on the scene.
Without those two individuals, Christianity wouldn't be the #1 religion in the world today.
But Islam is catching up pretty quick....
