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The facts about islam and its hatred for Israel.

  1. TMMason profile image74
    TMMasonposted 5 years ago

    http://s1.hubimg.com/u/5519672_f248.jpg

    Okay all you great historians and know it alls... who is this sitting with ole Adolf? And all you muslims can take a guess also... he is one of your great heros after all.

    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/israeli … ral-video/

    Long live Israel... The vote in the United Nations will be coming up. I hope America stands up and screams at that joke of a president we have, to back Israel and tell the UN to screw itself.

    As long as Islam is allowed to exist... Israel and the non-Muslim world will be a target.

    You can find the answer for the above question here...

    http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/amin_en.html



    The Left and Islam have long been silent partners in the slaughter of Jews. The NAZIs, Islam and George Soros... what a bunch... it is like all the greatest mass murderers crowded into one lovable group... the Leant Left.

    If allowed the world will screw Israel... the UN must be stopped and the so called palistinians ned to be told to piss off and find a new place to live.

    1. 0
      Holmes221bposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      You believe that a picture of Hitler with a Muslim provides evidence that the political left are bedfellows with Islam.  Well, there is no way that Hitler and the Nazis can be described as being "Lefties."   They were far-right by anyone's definition.

      1. TMMason profile image74
        TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Islam and Hitler were indeed silent partners. That is a historic fact... and Hitler was a leftist, (Socialist), bro.

        Read Mises, read Mein kampf, Hitler was a Socialist... regardless of the Frankfurt re-write of history and the leftist BS.

        The European Left and Islam have been bound by the tie of anti-Semitism for centuries.

        http://mises.org/daily/1937

        http://mises.org/freemarket_detail.aspx?control=507

        1. John Holden profile image59
          John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          But Islam isn't of the left!

          They have far more in common with the American right wing than the left.

          And it doesn't matter how many times you repeat it, Hitler was of the far right, not a lefty, not a socialist and the European left is not anti Semitic.

          You would do well to seek out slightly less right wing sources, ones to view things with an open mind rather than a desire to fit the facts to their biased outlook.

          1. Paul Wingert profile image78
            Paul Wingertposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            There's photo's of Hitler and England's Prime Minister Chamberlain. Who knows what was going on behind closed doors. Does TMMason lay awake at night coming up with these insane conclusions or does it come to himin visions?

            1. TMMason profile image74
              TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Actually I am just reminding people of the reasons why Islam and the left cannot be trusted in this time where they seek to create another terrorist state.... this time inside the borders of Israel.

              Screw the UN, Islam, and the EU. and American Left... long live israel.

              1. John Holden profile image59
                John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                So a meeting of two right wingers is evidence of why the left can't be trusted!

                Dear dear!

            2. John Holden profile image59
              John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I suspect that there are photographs of Hitler with most of the worlds prominent figures!
              He was, amongst other things, a bit of a megalomaniac.

              1. TMMason profile image74
                TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Again... how many of those leaders went around creating Islamic SS units throughout the Balkans and Middle East?


                How many?...

                And SNeville Chamberlains people are the reason Hitler was allowed to grow as he did... so all you englishman should be ashamed to speak of Hitler and the NAZIs.

                1. John Holden profile image59
                  John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  I should think very few went around creating Islamic SS units. After all, the Catholics wouldn't have set up SS units would they?

                  And yet another example of why we should fear the right.

                  1. TMMason profile image74
                    TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Catholics are fairly liberal.

                    Esp. the church.

          2. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
            Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Oh how wrong you are John. Left is socialistic. It is nothing but communism. Hitler was national socialist. Soviet were Bolshevist socialists. Both fight about supremacy. Today formal soviet today Russian communists are friend with Muslim terrorists. How things are changing. They have common with terrorist only common goal. Nothing else.

            1. John Holden profile image59
              John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Left is socialist isn't in dispute! However socialism and communism are two separate beasts.

              Hitler called himself a national socialist but his policies and actions were very much of the right. Never were workers in control of production, never was internationalism a creed of the Nazi party.
              National Socialist was a misnomer, just as the German Democratic Republic was neither democratic nor a republic!
              Hitler and the soviets were state capitalists plain and simple, far closer to the American right.

              1. TMMason profile image74
                TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                No they were not... his actions were very much of the Left.

                The lie won't fly anymore john.

                Hitler was a Socialist... doesn't matter how many times you all deny it... facts are facts.

                http://constitutionalistnc.tripod.com/hitler-leftist/

                http://jonjayray.tripod.com/hitler.html

                1. John Holden profile image59
                  John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Then let's have some facts instead of prejudice and blinkered vision.

                  I tell you what, if Hitler was a socialist then I'm a right wing conservative.I must be because I say so. Such a sudden transformation requires no change in my beliefs, after all, every conservative must want worker control and a government that serves the people, rather than a government that controls the people.

                  You really can't approach the world with such blinkered vision, Hitler was no more a socialist than he was a Jew!

                  1. TMMason profile image74
                    TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    I have already... in many threads... over and over... and you are still in denial.

                    It is the way of your kind... denial is not just a river you know?

                    Like the myth of Hitler destroying Unions... huh! what a laugh.

                    Yes, - Hitler destroyed independent labor unions — by nominally turning them into government unions! Without collective bargaining of course. And, at least ideologically, the idea of creating the DAF (German Labor Front) was to give labor a “seat at the table,” as it were, inside the government.

                    All the leftist' lies are a crumbling, Jonny boy.

                    And here are the Leftist Socialist scum who have literally created the BS histories, and immorral unatural shit-mess of a Society we live in in this day.

                    These are the criminals, who with the American leftist/Progressive scum, have destroyed our nation through under-mining all our Social Institutions, and through the force of Govt and Left-wing/Progressive politicians have forced their agenda down the throats of Americans for the last 80 years. These are the scum who have perverted our childrens minds and morals, who have destroyed this nations strength in faith.

                    http://www.schillerinstitute.org/fid_91 … kfurt.html

                    http://www.catholicinsight.com/online/f … _882.shtml

                    And all American should watch the poison of ideologies these scum spew even today into society through the schools and the Institutions of higher learning, indoctrinating all they can into their Marxist Secualr Humanist Atheistic BS.

              2. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
                Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                John, dictatorship always starts with socialism. Look what Karl Marx said: democracy is road to socialism. What Vladimir said: Socialism is door to communism. All dictators pave the road of so called socialistic ideas. This is how they fool masses. John, you do not have to tell me anything I lived under Hitler and  later socialistic communism in my former country and was educated by them. I have state board of Marxism-Leninism, Dialectic and Historic Materialism and Political Economy on postgraduate level. By the way I read Soviet communistic books in original Russian language.

                1. John Holden profile image59
                  John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  You fall under that common spell, if a thing is called something then it must be that thing.

                  1. TMMason profile image74
                    TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    You simply cannot accept the truth John.

                    Sad sad sad.

          3. Ralph Deeds profile image70
            Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Fundamentalists of all nearly flavors have several things in common--intolerance, suppression of women, preoccupation with sexual purity, willingness to resort to violence against those whom they perceive to be enemies, censorship of literature and art, and so forth. They don't qualify as socialists, liberals or progressives.

        2. Evan G Rogers profile image83
          Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          "Islam and Hitler"

          ... I'm trying to figure out how a human can be a partner with an ideology...

          1. TMMason profile image74
            TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            I refer to hitler specifically because he is being spoken of, as to the islams that sided with him, Amin the grand mufti was simply the face of the crowd in his day.

            Islam still adores their NAZI partners and hitler's attempts to settle the "Jewish question". Egypt has a brand new NAZI party as we speak in its political forces.

            Birds of a feather.

            How you doing, Evan?

      2. Greek One profile image82
        Greek Oneposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Excellent, TM... and here is some more important 'proof'...

        Reagan WAS indeed a Russian communist..

        http://www.foxnews.com/images/518809/3_61_reagangorbachev04_320.jpg

        1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
          Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          lol +1

        2. Ralph Deeds profile image70
          Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Wow! That's a bombshell.

        3. TMMason profile image74
          TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Please, Grk.

          Islam's role in WWII, thier founding of the Bosnian and mioddle eastern SS sqads, and their silent partnership with hitler to sieze and slaughter Jews, is well documented and cannot be denied.

          I would have thought you would know that bit of history.?..

          And for someone who claims Greek status, you sure are forgiving of the Devshirme... you know the Jannassarrie corp?... remember that lil tax upon the greek people by the Ottoman Empire and Islam? All those greek children stolen, perverted and destroyed... lil children, used up and spit out by that barbaric religion.

          Probrably not.

          It is sell-outs like this, whimpering apologizers like Obama, who will sell out Israel.

          http://www.theblaze.com/stories/illinoi … s-country/

    2. recommend1 profile image71
      recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      There are similar pictures of Hitler with the Pope and the leaders of most other countries - but then we know the Pope was in bed with Hitler from the shameful historical record.

      Then you say Hitler was not right wing  big_smile   you need to start wearing the tinfoil hat before you get abducted big_smile

    3. Wesman Todd Shaw profile image95
      Wesman Todd Shawposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I can assume from your pathetic rhetoric that you are just a paid politico propaganda pusher.  If that's not the case - then you are merely stupid as fuck.

    4. Shinkicker profile image91
      Shinkickerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Israel must abide by the rule of law. The military occupation of Palestine land is illegal as are the settlements, the wall and the state terrorism against the Palestinians.

      The decisions of the United Nations, the International Court of Justice, and the Geneva Convention must be enforced against Israel. The Community of Nations state that Israel is breaking international law. Almost every country in the whole world at UN votes agrees that the occupation must end. Anyone who disagrees is supporting criminality.

      No peace without justice, no justice without dialogue.

    5. Ralph Deeds profile image70
      Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Israel under Netanyahu has been screwing itself without any help from its friends.

      1. Shinkicker profile image91
        Shinkickerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Then inevitably it is ordinary Israelis who will suffer more for the illegal actions of its government. The draconian laws against the Nakba and the BDS Campaign are signs of the growing totalitarianism of the Israeli government domestically.  Israeli citizens need to start questioning their government on the unjust treatment of the Palestinians. The decisions of international law must prevail.

      2. ReuVera profile image84
        ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Netanyahu is the best leader Israel can have. Hetanyahu stands for Israel, he voices the truth and he doesn't give a damn what the world can think.  He stands for his people, and he does not lick rear ends of mass media. When Olmert happen to be in the lead for a short time, I was the first to say that his place is in jail. But Netanyahu is the real one for Israel!


        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAlJ6erL-HY

        http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44651801/ns … anscripts/


        This is the real head of the country!
        P.S. During his first term there was no suicide bombing in Israel, the same goes now. Arabs know better not to funk with him

        1. lovemychris profile image80
          lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          That's right...children will get bombarded with illegal white phosphorous.

        2. livelonger profile image89
          livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I think Netanyahu is a coward, and his bravado and indifference to world opinion might make some Israelis feel good (esp since criticism of Israel outside the US really is lopsidedly unfair) but it does nothing to advance the steps the country will have to make in order to be a relatively secure, Jewish-majority country.

          I don't know if allowing the growth of settlements is part of an eventual negotiation gambit, or he's just too afraid to confront his coalition partners to stop them, but the more the settlements grow into Palestinian territory, the more difficult it will be to root them out, and it might very soon come to a point where the Palestinians stop fighting for their own country and just peacefully ask to be fully-enfranchised citizens of Israel. So many Jews will be living in their territory that they might have a point. What will happen then?

          BTW that barenakedislam link is really frightening. I'm not talking about the post's images, but the site itself, which has a prominent button saying "Bring back the Crusades." It's basically an anti-Islam hate site.

          1. ReuVera profile image84
            ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            about the site- I really posted only for the sake of pictures and later gave a link to the original site. So, I apologize if I posted a link to a hatred site.
            But at least the info regarding the topic was truthful.

            I don't agree that Netanyahu is driven by a bravado. He is a bold politician, not a hypocrite and not an opportunist.  Settlements are built not on illegal territory, but on a disputed territory, this is a big difference. Though I myself is not a supporter of settlement movement, but there's nothing illegal in it. There's no settlements being built in Gaza stripe. When in 2005 Israel moved out of Gaza, IDF forcibly evacuated all Jewish families from settlements, leaving behind pretty houses, green-houses and fields, for Arabs.  What did Arabs do with all this ready to use civilization? They bulldozered everything.

            Here, some facts about Gaza:
            http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jso … ments.html

            http://www.tomgrossmedia.com/ExodusFromGaza.html

            1. lovemychris profile image80
              lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              The Arabs didn't bulldoze it, the IDF did!

              And then the settlers just moved to the West Bank, so it was null an void anyway.

              And I find it well, what's the word?

              Supporting a foreign president over your own?
              How many people do that, is what I'd like to know.

              And how many members of OUR gvt do the same?

              1. ReuVera profile image84
                ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                gosh, you are not informed. And confused. IDF DID NOT bulldozer anything, all green houses, homes and fields were left in great shape. After Israel left Gaza, Arabs burnt green houses,  demolished homes and synagogues.  Look at the pictures.

                Secondly, I am standing up for MY Prime Minister (Netanyahu is not a president, hehe, he is a Prime Minister) because I am an Israeli and proud of it. Do you call Mr. Obama MY President? Alas, unfortunately, technically he is as well, as I am also American.
                I wish here, in America we had such a President as Netanyahu. He would stand for HIS people and wouldn't go world tour apologizing.

                1. livelonger profile image89
                  livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Agreed on the destruction of the infrastructure in Gaza. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face...

                  Sorry to completely disagree with you on Netanyahu (and Obama). Netanyahu is a coward; "preaching to the choir" doesn't require much courage at all. Doing the tough work of statesmanship is something he's clearly not up to the task for, and Israel will end up paying for that. You might also notice that the largest protests in the history of Israel have taken place recently, so the idea that he enjoys unrivaled support there is absurd, too. He's yet another right-wing politician who strikes populist tones to get the votes, but then gives everything to the rich. Israel is becoming another rich people's playground.

                  Obama has done nothing wrong and both supported Israel and tried to push the peace process forward. He never apologized in the way the right-wing spin machine is fabricating. He is more pro-Israel than Bush was, and his only "crime" is having a Muslim grandfather. People who making something of that should be ashamed of themselves, and Jews should remember that populism built on a mountain of disprovable lies has always ended up biting Jews in the butt in the end. Didn't you grow up in the Soviet Union? You should be more familiar with this pattern than anyone.

                  1. Ralph Deeds profile image70
                    Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    +++

                  2. ReuVera profile image84
                    ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    You are right, I grew up in Soviet Union, so I know this side of life first hand as well. Basically, it was a welfare country. Soviet Union was tremendously rich, but its people all (except those in power, government shots) were welfare recipients, no less no more. There was no rich and poor there, all were equally poor. Government was in control in every aspect of life. Yes, we had free healthcare (read my hub about "free" healthcare in USSR!), free education (read my hub about growing in socialistic society!), almost free hosing (I didn't write about it yet, but imagine three generations living in the same 1 or 2 bedroom tiny apartment.). Doctors, teachers, engineers, line workers, cleaners, drivers were getting almost the same salary, which was rather an allowance. I don't say anything about choice of goods in the stores or about choices in life. The most funny part of it- we were happy!We didn't know else (Iron Curtain, you know.... Government in charge of our lives)

                    Because of my background I see more clear all the points of what is happening now in Israel and in America.

                    I know better than you that people are going to manifestations against Netanyahu in Israel. But not because of his foreign policy, most of Israelis are supporting him here. They protest about housing situation and about cost of education, and about welfare handouts. They want more of free stuff. Israel already has almost free (government subsidized) healthcare for those who qualify, educations grants and housing financial aid for those who qualify. Actually, the same as here, in USA. Believe me, this help is enough, it is not much, you have to work as well to get this, but it is a REAL help. Again, I know it first hand, as I was a minority when I lived in Israel, I was a single mother.   That's why when single mothers go on riots about that government should give them more help, I say, "Bull$$t"!  I had enough help from government. I worked too. I didn't have to pay taxes, not income taxes, nor property taxes. To qualify for most of this help I had to work, though, and it is just fare! I bought an apartment with subsidized loans, my son was in best schools because he was a good student and I was getting financial help to buy his books.
                    All riots against Israeli government are about getting more free help. Sorry, I am against turning Israel into a welfare country, the same as I am against turning America into a welfare country.         
                    For a country to prosper we need a free market. I don't hate rich. We may despise those who get their wealth by speculations or who live like royalty on a tax payers money (think government). But there is nothing wrong in being rich. Hating the rich is a sign of socialistic society.

                    You know what confuses me in you, LL? On one hand, you have a tremendously deep understanding of history of Israel, you know the REAL things and you are able to answer the most tricky questions (I remember reading your explanations about Hagana and Palmach). But you don't see this deep in nowadays situation.

                2. lovemychris profile image80
                  lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  THIS is what I was talking about...I do not go onto your anti-Muslim sites. I have the Tea-Party for that!

                  "while many Israelis claim that the moving of 5,000 settlers from the Gaza Strip caused a huge rift in Israeli society, the move was necessary for compliance with the law. Many settlers who had colonized the Gaza Strip were then moved into new settlements in the West Bank, thereby nullifying any compliance that may have been achieved by moving out of Gaza.

                  Israeli forces then bombed and demolished all of the buildings of the Gaza settlements, rendering them as toxic dumps where the residents of Gaza are afraid to go due to the potential health risks of exposure to asbestos and other chemicals.

                  Although both the international community and the United Nations have condemned Israel for its settlement of civilians on occupied territories, no international body has attempted to enforce the rulings."


                  Netanyahu is a horrible man. One-sided and evil. Meanwhile, our decent, kind president is bashed by peope who hold loyalty to another country.
                  Sickening, IMO.

          2. ReuVera profile image84
            ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            do you mean, it's a Christian site??????? I'll take a closer look when my time permits. But on the first glance, it would be more kind of anti-political-lie thing, not anti-Islam as a religion.

            1. livelonger profile image89
              livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I would assume so - only Christians would cheer on another Crusades (as you probably know, Jews didn't fare too well with the last set of them...).

    6. harrist profile image60
      harristposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Interesting topic smile I am Muslims! but I never hate !  jews smile why american hate islam! wink hmmm. not so sure why! ? give me one good reason why american should hate islam! smile

      1. Repairguy47 profile image61
        Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        America doesn't hate Islam, we are a tolerant people who embrace the diversity that Islam is. We hate terrorists, the majority of which happens to be Muslims.

        1. John Holden profile image59
          John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          You may not hate Islam there are plenty on here who do!

          And as for the fanny about the majority of Terrorists being Muslim, open your eyes and look around you!

          1. Repairguy47 profile image61
            Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

            My eyes are open, and I don't see any other terrorists other than Muslims.

            1. Shinkicker profile image91
              Shinkickerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              What creates terrorists? That is the important question.

            2. Hollie Thomas profile image61
              Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              That's because you don't want to.

      2. Ralph Deeds profile image70
        Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Most Americans don't "hate Islam." However, the September 11 attack on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon by fundamentalist extremist Muslims wasn't good public relations for the Muslim faith. The same goes for anti-Israel propaganda and rocket attacks.

      3. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
        Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        harrist, Americans do not hate Islam, because they live in free country. What we all hate is evil.
        My birth country is Slovakia. The Turks (their religion is Islam)  invaded Slovakia killed the men and took to Turkey woman and children. Boys became soldiers and they by brainwashing invaded their own country. Islam is spreading by sword, we preach Word. We Christian love Muslim in spite of it. But not all in USA are true Christians and reacting according to Muslim behavior. What do you expect?

    7. GNelson profile image83
      GNelsonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I hope you are writing the junk just to rile people up.  At least that would have a purpose.

      1. TMMason profile image74
        TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        The pupose is the up-coming vote to give Palistine state-hood.

        A very very good reason to point out why Islam should not be given another terrorist state, and that the suppossed Palistinians should be absorbed by the Islams, as it was Islam who created the refugees.

  2. TMMason profile image74
    TMMasonposted 5 years ago

    Oh the lie has been shattered... embrace your fellow Leftists and be proud.

    You all would have been had he won.

    The American Left was fine with Hitler untill he betrayed Stalin, that betrayal was mutual but the American left didn't like it none the less.

    And the European left and American Left is as anti-Semetic as it gets.

    And yes similar pics of the pope etc... but the pope didn't go around and crate SS units for the NAZIs as Amin did. The Bosnian Muslim SS slaightered tens of thousands of Jews and others and their role was wiped from history, as was turkeys and Irans and Palistines... all wiped clean.

    Anti-Semetism has been the tie that binds the European Left and Islam for centuries John.

    Good company you all keep.

    And I will take the word of the Austrian school of Economics and their theorists over you all any day.

    And look here is some of those American Muslims who love this country so much...

    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/gird-yo … e-at-home/

    Palistine is not now and never should be recognized as a state.

    1. John Holden profile image59
      John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Ah well, they must be lying -

      http://www.european-left.org/nc/english … -groups-1/

      Well somebody must.

      1. TMMason profile image74
        TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Yes they are... I have been telling you that.

        The Left tolerates all those who believe as they.

        And screw the rest of us.

        Glad you finally caught up.

        1. John Holden profile image59
          John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Unlike the right which tolerates all those who believe as they do, and screw the rest of us.

          1. TMMason profile image74
            TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            I tolerate all people... Left to Right.

            Talk to a Leftists about Israel... and watch the love flow. It is no different then talking to a muslim about Israel.

            The tie that binds.

            1. John Holden profile image59
              John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              A leftist maybe, but not all or even many.

              As for the idea that you tolerate all people, that doesn't wash. You are actually pretty intolerant like most on the right.

            2. Mighty Mom profile image91
              Mighty Momposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              And yet, the party of American Jews would be ....?
              Certainly not TEA.

              1. TMMason profile image74
                TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                ?... What are talking about?

                Are there Secular Left Jews... yes.

                Just like there were Jews in Germany who sold their own to the ovens... George Soros comne to mind... but there were many indeed.

                You would be surpriswed the people in a race or community that would willingly walk to their own graves in the name of many a BS excuse or reasoning.

    2. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
      Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      wow, how many people are misinformed.

  3. Mighty Mom profile image91
    Mighty Momposted 5 years ago

    As long as Islam is allowed to exist?

    Source: Wikipedia:

    Islam is the world's second largest religion after Christianity. According to a 2009 demographic study, Islam has 1.57 billion adherents, making up 23% of the world population.[1][2]

    Islam is the predominant religion in the Middle East, in northern Africa,[3][4] and in some parts of Asia.[5] Large communities of Muslims are also found in China, the Balkans, and Russia.[6] Other parts of the world host large Muslim immigrant communities; in Western Europe, for instance, Islam is the second largest religion after Christianity, though it represents less than 5% of the total population.[7]

    Around 62% of the world's Muslims live in Asia.
    About 20% of Muslims live in Arab countries.[10]

    A demographic study conducted by the Pew Research Center in October 2009[1][2] found that there are 1.57 billion Muslims around the world, accounting for roughly 1 in 4 people. The study found more Muslims in Germany than in Lebanon and more in China than in Syria.[11]


    And all these non-Palestinian Muslims are a threat to Israel and thus should not be allowed to "exist" because....????

    1. TMMason profile image74
      TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      It is hate speech and should be outlawed world wide as such. smile

      1. Mighty Mom profile image91
        Mighty Momposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Well that is a surprisingly anti-American viewpoint, TMMason smile
        The First Amendment doesn't apply to that particular religion?
        And as to the practicalities of your idea of ridding the world of all Muslims,who would accomplish such abolishment?
        Certainly not a government (read: OUR government)???

        I think you're pulling my berka here so I'll hand you the win and go to work now:). Cheers, sir.
        MM

        1. TMMason profile image74
          TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          What would make you think that is un-American?

          Hasn't the Left pushed their hate speech laws to the point of censorship already?

          Why not add Islam?

          And I have not said Muslims, nor People, should not be allowed to exist. I said Islam, the suppossed religion. Without Islam to cling to there would naturally be less Muslims.

  4. 0
    Holmes221bposted 5 years ago

    It is known that there were many in the Roman Catholic Church, who did a lot to secretly help the Jews, including the nuns and monks who hid them and helped them to escape Germany.  However, the Pope was known to say daily prayers for Hitler and gave the Nazi salute.   And Hitler's own Roman Catholicism was the cause for his anti-Semitism, as this was an official doctrine of that church until the 1960s. 

    I used to work in a Roman Catholic seminary, and whilst there heard of its history in World War II, when it sent lights into the sky from its observatory during air raids, as a signal to the German bombers.  There seemed to have been a  schizophrenic attitude within the church between those who approved of Hitler's Final Solution and those who did everything they could to protect the Jews. And it is a past the Church still has to admit to.

    1. Mighty Mom profile image91
      Mighty Momposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Not holding our breath on that one, are we?
      The Church has a long list of schizo actions to answer for -- before and after WWII.

  5. livelonger profile image89
    livelongerposted 5 years ago

    Islam has nothing to do with Israel.

    It's a pan-Arabist movement that seeks to wipe Israel off the map. Naturally, they're trying to make it a Muslim thing in order to get support from Iranians, Pakistanis, Turks, and other non-Arab Muslims who really shouldn't care about an Arab territorial dispute.

    The fact that many non-Arab Muslims bear the same resentments towards the West as Arabs makes it quite a bit easier.

    1. 0
      Holmes221bposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      There is one Jewish homeland in the world, which is officially secular, yet many Muslim nations.  And as Muslims make up 1 in 4 of the world's population, I would have hoped they might be charitable enough to allow this one small nation to exist, especially considering it was their land originally, even though this was hundreds of years ago.  Yes, there have been many violations by the Israelis into occupied territory, but this must be seen in the light of thousands of years of persecution of the Jews, who have just as much right to exist as anyone else.

      1. livelonger profile image89
        livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Try to convince the pan-Arabists (and the Islamists, who now have a new cause celebre) of that.

        They don't really care that the history of Jews is full of genocide and persecution; they usually say it's at the hand of Christians (which is mostly true although not completely true).

        1. lovemychris profile image80
          lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          So, now that the Jews are doing the genocide and persecution, will it then be Ok?

          1. livelonger profile image89
            livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            No, of course it's not OK. But they're not committing genocide, no matter how much you want to believe that.

            1. Ralph Deeds profile image70
              Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Israel has been more than a bit heavy handed, building more settlements and in the extent of its retaliation for Palestinian rocket attacks. As a result many of it's friends have become critics.

              1. livelonger profile image89
                livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                That's true, but it still hasn't committed genocide. If that were its goal, it could have done so rather easily.

                I doubt very much LMC was ever a friend of Israel, but as for others, that is true.

                1. lovemychris profile image80
                  lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  I wouldn't have been a friend of the Nazi's either, whereas they had plenty of people who made excuses for them.
                  Just as you people are doing now for the Zionists, IMO.

                  I would have been just as sickened by the Nazi regime as I am of the Zionist one.

                  And I am sorry to inform you, but I can gather quotes of many Israeli Prime Ministers and high-leve people who have said that they want to wipe out the Palestinians.

                  Maybe they figure a slow, torturous death is better?

                  1. livelonger profile image89
                    livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Please, gather those quotes. And, for good measure, find quotes from Israeli Prime Ministers and high-level people saying that Palestinians are looking for the same thing as Israelis and that they (Israelis) want peace (since you won't find Nazis saying that about Jews).

                    What was the relative death toll: at the hand of the Nazis vs the Israelis?

                    Telling that Israel and Nazi Germany sicken you in equal measure.

              2. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
                Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Ralph, one day Muslims will tell you: you cannot build house in this territory. It is our territory.

  6. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    "Slaughtering Jews and burning Israel.

    It is you alls favorite pastime."

    Yeah, I see it's the Jews who are being slaghtered here in 2011...snark.

    Get with the times.

    1940's=Israeli's are victims
    2011=Israelis are persecutors

    Oh, and btw...first I have to get to the blacks and the lesbians...remember: I am a racist homohpobic anti-semite....according to you.

    ......who accuses the Left of using labels and racism.

    1. TMMason profile image74
      TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      You are what you are acording to your words Chris.

      Nothing to do with me. I did not make the racist homophoblic jokes, I did not speak about how I was an anti-Semite who hated Jews for simply being Israeli... those were all your words.

      And the Jews have suffered with islam for 1400+ years Chris. Along with all non-Muslims intheir vacinity.

      See... there is were you are so lost. You seem to think this conflict began in the 20th century.

      Way off.

      1. lovemychris profile image80
        lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        You are a mis-leading creep. report all you want.

        I have tried to keep it plain and simple. I have a problem with Zionists and neo-cons, and the Israeli gvt. But you always have to smear it into hating all Jews.

        My grandson is half black....yes, I hate him.

        My best friend is a lesbian...yes, I hate her.

        "The Palestinians in the West Bank, 3.5 million today, will not live without civil rights for another 42 years. We might as well get used to the fact that the world won't stand for it. Can Netanyahu or Shimon Peres explain why the Palestinians do not deserve their own state? Do they have even the slightest of arguments? Nothing. And why not now? We have already seen, especially of late, that time only reduces the possible alternatives in the region. So even that weak excuse is dead.

        Yesterday, a coalition of Israeli peace organizations published a list of 50 reasons for Israel to support a Palestinian state. Assuming that you only accept five of them, isn't that enough? What exactly is the alternative, now that the heavens are closing in around us? Can anyone, can Peres or Netanyahu, seriously contend that the regional hostility toward us would not have lessened had the occupation already ended and a Palestinian state been established?

        The truths are so basic, so banal, that it hurts even to repeat them. But, unfortunately, they're the only ones we have. And so, a simple question to whoever will be representing us at the UN next week: Why not, for heaven's sake? Why "no" once again? And to what will we say "yes"?

        * Gideon Levy is a Haaretz columnist and a member of the newspaper's editorial board

        1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
          Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Chris you are confused. Never read the truth. There were Jews all the time for 3000 years and Christians 2000 years. Do Christian ask for the state?  Muslim religion started in 600 ad. All so called Palestinians are Arabs came from Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and so on. Why they want Promised Land and other countries?  Why they do not like to go back to Arabia? Expansion of Islam is their goal. They kill for it. And you say it is OK? I see how misinformed you are.  Turks invaded my old country Slovakia, took many as slaves to their homeland. Many were killed.

          1. lovemychris profile image80
            lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            "In VaYoel Moshe [Satmar Hasidim founder] Teitelbaum explicitly declared that, from the time of the very inception of the Zionist movement in the 1890s, the Zionists violated the three oaths, and thereby caused the Holocaust, as well as all wars, terrorism, and violence in modern Israel, and most anti-Semitism around the world since that time, as a result:

            “…it has been these Zionist groups that have attracted the Jewish people and have violated the Oath against establishing a Jewish entity before the arrival of the Messiah. It is because of the Zionists that six million Jews were killed.”
            In keeping with the three oaths, Satmar Hasidim were strongly opposed to the creation of modern Israel through violence and antagonism against gentile nations such as the Ottomans and Britain. In the years following the Holocaust, Rabbi Teitelbaum undertook to maintain and strengthen this position, as did many other Torah Jews and communities. Rabbi Teitelbaum declared that the State of Israel was a violation of Jewish teachings."

            *****

            He confused too?

            1. livelonger profile image89
              livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              The ultra-Orthodox are almost all against Israel, but for religious reasons. They believe Israel can not exist as a secular state; it must be restored by a personal messiah. This doesn't stop many of them from moving to Israel, though - they live off the government there, and are free to practice their religion without harassment by non-Jews.

              Israel was founded by mostly secular Jews seeking to escape the horrors of violent anti-Semitism, which existed everywhere Jews were a minority.

              1. ReuVera profile image84
                ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Absolutely!

                To lovemychicks: lady, you should listen to livelonger, he gives you so much for your thoughts, if only you could use it without rejection. If you still want to follow the crappy anti-Semitic sites, at least read a book by James Michener, "The Source". It is a great historic, archaeological, psychological, etc account of the land of Israel. Please, make an effort and read it.

                1. lovemychris profile image80
                  lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Arrugula: Thanks for the smug advice...but I can pick my own books, thanks.

                  And I do not listen to anyone who calls me a Jew-Hater.
                  Nor will I ever.

      2. Hollie Thomas profile image61
        Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        And that's really interesting, and probably rather insulting to many Jews, that you think they are there in Israel, because it's bought and paid for. So, they allow the Arabs to stay. I actually can't believe that you said that.  I've never heard you make a homophobic joke TM, but I have heard you in other forums talk about how homosexuality is unnatural. You use the same tone when you talk about gay men and women as you do when you talk about Islam. TM, newsflash, people are different but EQUAL. Difference is good, equality is essential.

        1. TMMason profile image74
          TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Israel was bought and paid for and that is historic fact.

          And as the owners of that land they have allowed Muslims to live there, whether explicitly or implicitly.

          What would be insulting about sayiong that.

          And no I do not believe homosexuality to be natural, or genetic, that doesn't make me a homophobe, just realistic.

          I really do not get your issue Hollie?

          http://www.danielpipes.org/9931/palesti … purchasing

          Where did the refugees come from...

          "According to official records of the League of Nations and Arab census figure 539,000 Arabs left Israel at the urging of 7 converging Arab armies so that they would not be in the way of their attack. They promised the fleeing Arabs they would return and move into the Jews' houses after the anticipated successful annihilation of the Jews.

          "We know that 850,000 Jews were ejected from the Arab countries where they had lived for hundreds of years. This included successful people whose property and assets, including community assets were immediately confiscated. 750,000 penniless Jews from Arab countries fled to Israel.

          "This was a virtual exchange of population. The Jewish refugees were immediately accepted by the new State of Israel. They were provided with shelter (albeit temporary tents) food and clothing.

          "The Arab refugees who had migrated to various Arab nations were not similarly well received. They were regarded not as Arab brothers but as unwelcome migrants who were not to be trusted. Squalid refugee camps were set up as showpieces to induce the West's sympathy and kept that way. The UN through UNRWA (UN Relief Agency) provided assistance to the camps when the host country could not or would not. These camps became a training ground for terrorist youth to be targeted at Israel. The host country, like Syria, would provide training, weapons and explosives, but refused to absorb the Arab refugees as equal citizens. Keeping them in misery made them valuable and irreplaceable as angry front line terrorists attacking Israel as proxies for the Arab armies who lost to the Jews on the field of battle in declared wars. The Twin Pillars supporting Arab Muslim society are "Pride and Shame". Losing to the Jews on the battlefield time and again in 6 wars shattered the self perception of the Macho Man.

          - Emanuel A. Winston, Middle East analyst and commentator


          " The existence of these refugees is a direct result of the Arab States' opposition to the partition plan and the reconstitution of the State of Israel. The Arab states adopted this policy unanimously, and the responsibility of its results, therefore is theirs.

          "Since 1948 we have been demanding the return of the refugees to their homes. But we ourselves are the ones who encouraged them to leave. Only a few months separated our call to them to leave and our appeal to the United Nations to resolve on their return."

          - Haled al Azm, the Syrian Prime Minister in 1948-49, The Memoirs of Haled al Azm, (Beirut, 1973), Part 1, pp. 386-387

          "Since 1948 it is we who demanded the return of refugees... while it is we who made them to leave... We brought disaster upon... Arab refugees, by inviting them and bringing pressure to bear upon them to leave... We have rendered them dispossessed... We have accustomed them to begging... We have participated in lowering their moral and social level... Then we exploited them in executing crimes of murder, arson, and throwing bombs upon... men, women and children - all this in service of political purposes..."

          - Khaled al Azm, Syria's Prime Minister after the 1948 war


          http://www.science.co.il/Arab-Israeli-c … sp#Whathap


          Islam sent and left their own people there and have refused to reintergrate those refugees.

          Islam is at fault for the plight of the palistinians... not Israel.

          And it is hysterically funny that you would state I am insulting jews, when Chris has called them genocidal opressors among many other things, and not a peep from you.

          Funny.

          1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
            Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Firstly, LMC has not slurred Jews, or the Jewish faith, or any other faith for that matter. LMC has made her feelings clear regarding  Zionists. There's a difference. SHE IS NOT BEING ANTI SEMATIC. That's why there was no word from me. Not a joke. I understand what LMC is trying to convey.

            Many Jews, even though I do not belong to any religion, despite my parentage, are very sensitive and understandably so, when their faith or peoples are critisized. However, when we see injustice, no matter who the perps are, we have to challenge it. It was not challenged sufficiently, or indeed at all, when it should have been pre WW11. We know the consequences!

            Greed and intolerance transcends religion, race, gender and sexuality. Therefore, to say that one religion, race or gender is immune to this 'disease' is unrealistic, false and definitely not conducive to world peace or complete equality.

            In your own words, you talk about the 'plight' of the Palistinians. So you agree that they have suffered? Yet your original post, tells them to 'piss off and go find somewhere else to live' That's what I mean, when I say you do  not have a very christian attitude towards your fellow man.

            After WW11. The Jewish peoples acquired,in part, their holy land. For them, this was spiritual, not fiscal. Hence, 'bought and paid for' is entirely inappropriate.

            And, I'm afraid that unlike you, I do not find anything funny about the situation in the Middle East. On the contrary, I find it very sad that so many have suffered.

      3. Hollie Thomas profile image61
        Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        She is what she is according to your words TMM, not LMC's.

        1. TMMason profile image74
          TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I am not the one who made racist homophobic jokes, Hollie.

          If I had you and all the rest would be calling me on it and beating me over the head with it.

          If I told racist homophobic jokes you all would definitely call me a racist homophobe... matter of facgt I have been called it without making racist and homophobic jokes or comments.

          So to call a Leftoist on it is a no no... but to call a conservative racist or homophobe is okay even if they do not say anything racist or homophobic... good to know where you stand on that hollie.

          1. lovemychris profile image80
            lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            What is the racist homophobic joke?
            please...word for word.

            1. TMMason profile image74
              TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Your black lesbian rice and beans joke... I do not have to repeat it you know damn well you said it and where.

              it shows your shame and knowledge of your act in that you would act like it wasn't said and no one knows where to find it.

              Unless you deleted it last nite so as to cover yourself.

              Which thread was it in Chris?... fess up to it...

              Or you can act like you never said it and that would be so very deceptive it isn't funny.

              If a consevative ever made a joke involving black lesbians or gays and rice and beans or chicken and watermelon all you leftists would hit the roof.

              The selective ignorance is amazing...

              1. lovemychris profile image80
                lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                It's in MM's "did you hear about condi and sarah" thread....

                please...word for word. And show how it's racist and homophobic.

                1. TMMason profile image74
                  TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Why should I write any of it out... go to the thread an read it... God knows you turned the whole thread to that joke.

                  Denial... that is all I hear from leftists every time they spew hate and racism. Which is quite often I might add.

                  And do not worry Chris, like most racists, I do not expect you to admit or even recognize your racism.

                  I learned that from the Leftists... that most racists do not accept nor recognize their own racism.

                  Seems the Leftists may be on to sometthing there.

                  1. lovemychris profile image80
                    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Can't do it, can you?

                    So stop putting your hatred of me onto my person.

              2. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Which thread was it in Chris?... fess up to it...
                OMG now you actually sound like Mcarthy.

                1. TMMason profile image74
                  TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Yes... I am giving her the opurtunitty to step forward and do the right thing. To admit the joke was in bad taste and racist in its speaking. Pretty simply. 

                  If you think a joke about 2 black lesbians and rice and beans is not racially charged and dripping with racial over-tones, then you are in denial along with Chris. What about rice and beans is funny? You wouldn't have laughed had it been two white women... you know why you thought the rice and beans was funny, racism.

                  And that is sad.... I would have expected better of you.

                  Racism is racism regardless of who is practicing it.

                  Now back on topic please.

                  @Chris... why would I report you Chris... that is not my style... say whatever you want.

                  1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                    Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Actually, didn't read the post so cannot say whether i would have found it funny or not. What is funny though, is your comment about racism, regardless of whose practicing it. What a joke. You're so funny TMM big_smile

          2. Hollie Thomas profile image61
            Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Sorry, can't remember when I called you a racist homophobe.  I merely talked about your tone when talking about groups to which you don't belong, nor agree with. Now, if  I wanted to infer that you were a racist homophobe, I would simply resort to copying and pasting your comments from precious forums. It really wouldn't be that difficult.

            1. TMMason profile image74
              TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Yeah I pointed out earlier how you leftists call conservatives racist homophobes for no reason, then defend the racist in your ranks with fiegned ignorance.

              It is amazing how you try to turn her racist/homophobic joke on to me being a racist/homophobe for calling her on it.

              As I said earlier, you all exeplify every word I say about the Leant Leftists with your every action.

              Continue on...

              1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Why not, unless I've missed it, 'she' being LMC, I believe asked you to point out where, exactly, she had been a racist homophobe. Funny, I have no recollection of racist homophobic terminology that LMC has used. Except of course, where she was being sarcastic. On the other hand, TMM, there have been multiple occasions where you have slated other religions and sexualitys. Frequently, attributed every wrong in the world to one political view, religious ideology and sexuality other than yours. Take a good long look in the mirror. I know it's painful. Good night!

                1. paradigmsearch profile image90
                  paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Am I here?

                2. TMMason profile image74
                  TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Yes... I state that homosexuality is not natural, nor is it genetic, and that is the truth, you can call it what you want, but in the end it is the truth.

                  I also state the facts as regards Islam plainly. Like this myth of Spain going on. Read some of the Islamic scholars of the time and they will recite the bloody atrocities and slaughters for you involved in that era with glee. They are damn proud of them.

                  And I attribute the problems in this country to the Liberal Socialist Democrats and their treasonous Marxist useful idiot folowers, along with the Progressives who range throughout all parties.

                  And I blame the Conservatives who have made it into the system and then bowed down and compromised the lil left, away to the Leftists and Progressives.

                  Your issue is with the facts... not me.

                  Oh and I do not cede my mind to PC, I speak it the way it is.

                  1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                    Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    My issue is, with what you believe to be facts. Not with you.

      4. Ralph Deeds profile image70
        Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        The Jews, Muslims and Christians lived peacefully together in Spain for three hundred years.

        1. TMMason profile image74
          TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Bullshit.

          Islam conquered Spain and imposed Dhimmitude on non-Muslims, not to mention the mass slaughters they undertook in thier time their. That is just the Liberal 'golden age" BS... never happened.

          Matter of fact if it wasn't for the Jews and Christians secretly compiling the knowledge of centries, then all the knowledge of those nations would have gone the way of the Library of Alexadria under the Muslims.

          1. livelonger profile image89
            livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            You are a poor student of history. Jews had it relatively good under the Muslims, when Islam wasn't riddled with the insecurities that it unfortunately has now.

            When the Christians took over, we got the Inquisition...and millions of murdered and displaced Jews and Muslims.

            1. TMMason profile image74
              TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              "Jews had it "relatively" good"

              Uh-hum!...

              Okay.

              And my History is just fine, just not liberaled down to placate certain political groups and protected peoples.

            2. Hollie Thomas profile image61
              Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              You know Livelonger, how ever difficult and heated these debates get, you go away for a while, really think, delve into all your learning and come back with something balanced. I really respect you for that. Good night to you all, I'm tired smile

            3. Hollie Thomas profile image61
              Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Livelonger, had to reply here. Don't know if it's a glitch or I'm just not very good at following a thread, probably the latter smile That's what I meant by framework for peace talks, at place at which they can begin, but not nessercerily the eventual outcome. Bush also I believe suggested the same re: 67 borders? That's why I just don't get it when people accuse Obama of anti semitism re the framework for peace talks.

              1. lovemychris profile image80
                lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                That is something I find very confusing as well....people here say that Obama is just carrying on Bush. So that means they think Bush and Obama are pretty much the same.
                But I never heard ANYONE call Bush a socialist,or a communist--use that to smear him.
                Never heard Bush called an anti-semite--use that to smear him.

                Why Obama?

                1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                  Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Who knows! I think one of the problems that people have with Obama is that although he faces many constraints within office, he's not been quite as controlable as some may have hoped. Just watching the news now, it's looking likely that 2/3 rds of the UN assembly will vote in favour of Palestines enhanced status at the UN. IMF and the world bank have also confirmed that Palestine is strong enough, I assume they mean economically, to become an independent state.

                2. TMMason profile image74
                  TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  I have constantly told you bush is a Progressive... just like 2/3rds of the idiots in the Republican race right now.

                  Putting anyone of them into the Presidency will have the same effect in the end as leaving Obama in... the Progressives are simply slower and more patient than the Liberal/Socialist/Democrat Marxist Commie loving slime of the Left.

              2. livelonger profile image89
                livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Yes, it's been understood for a long time that the '67 borders are the starting point of peace talks.

                Obama's statement was deliberately misread by the far-right and far-left to mean a return to the 1967 borders.

                1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                  Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Well, just heard it on the news that Abbas has agreed to meet with Israeli reps before the vote at the UN.  Lets keep our fingers crossed and hope some progress is made this time.

                  1. livelonger profile image89
                    livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Fingers crossed!

  7. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    Wonder what the word would be if sis or seven million Arabs were immigrated into New York

  8. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    "there are 124 official Israeli settlements and 100 informal outposts, and 12 Jerusalem settlements on Palestinian land." All paid for I'm sure. It's not theft if it is already yours.

  9. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    I thought I covered this. Apparently not. Let it die.

    1. paradigmsearch profile image90
      paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Still under a 100.

    2. paradigmsearch profile image90
      paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Yet another thread... (really ...)

  10. 60
    Arcjahadposted 5 years ago

    Stop all this whining over Israel they created the modern form of terrorism back in 1947, they continue to expand their land when the majority of Jews live outside of Israel also the continue to spy on their good friend the USA in reality I never really understood why we feel sorry for Israel yes 6 million were killed during  WW2 but so were 20 million russians . But to be fair the Arab nations of the world don't really care about Palestine they just use it for something to fuel anger in their countries to take the anger away from their own corrupt regimes

    1. lovemychris profile image80
      lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Very succinct.

  11. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    Think what most people don't recognize consciously
    is class.

  12. TMMason profile image74
    TMMasonposted 5 years ago

    The Palestinians/Islam are not interested in peace but have clearly chosen terrorism and the anihilation of the State of Israel as their ultimate goal.

    Let all keep in mind that after being offered 95% of the West Bank and Gaza, half of Jerusalem and an independent state of their own, Arafat and the Palestinians refused and didn't even present a counter offer.

    After Deborah Sontag from the NY Times published a revisionist article blaming Israel and the US for the failed Camp David peace talks, here's what President Clinton told Barak:

    "What the hell is this? Why is she turning the mistakes we made into the essence? The true story of Camp David was that for the first time in the history of the conflict the American president put on the table a proposal, based on UN Security Council resolutions 242 and 338, very close to the Palestinian demands, and Arafat refused even to accept it as a basis for negotiations, walked out of the room, and deliberately turned to terrorism. That's the real story, all the rest is gossip."

    Here are a few more excerpts:

    Arafat said "No." Clinton, enraged, banged on the table and said: "You are leading your people and the region to a catastrophe." A formal Palestinian rejection of the proposals reached the Americans the next day. The summit sputtered on for a few days more but to all intents and purposes it was over.

    What they [Arafat and his colleagues] want is a Palestinian state in all of Palestine. What we see as self-evident, [the need for] two states for two peoples, they reject. Israel is too strong at the moment to defeat, so they formally recognize it.

    Repeatedly during our prolonged interview, conducted in his office in a Tel Aviv skyscraper, Barak shook his head in bewilderment and sadness at what he regards as Palestinian, and especially Arafat's, mendacity:

    "They are products of a culture in which to tell a lie...creates no dissonance. They don't suffer from the problem of telling lies that exists in Judeo-Christian culture. Truth is seen as an irrelevant category. There is only that which serves your purpose and that which doesn't. They see themselves as emissaries of a national movement for whom everything is permissible. There is no such thing as "the truth."


    You might also want to read an interview with Shlomo Ben-Ami who was Israel's Foreign Minister at the time.


    http://www.factsofisrael.com/blog/archives/000069.html

    The Palistinians wanted the destruction of Israel over peace, war and death over compromise, even when that comprommise gave them all.

    Screw Palistine and screw Islam... they can get out of Israel!

  13. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    to...

  14. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    This not done yet?

    1. paradigmsearch profile image90
      paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      ?

      1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
        Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Not yet.

        1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
          Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Screw Palistine and screw Islam... they can get out of Israel

          Such a diplomatic fellow smile

          1. Paul Wingert profile image78
            Paul Wingertposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Palistine was it's own independent nation up until the end of WW2. England was the leader in pushing the Palistinians out to make room for the displaced Jews and Holicost survivors, basically giving back their land that they held 2000 years ago. People wonger why the Palistinians are pissed. By the way, screw Christianity - caused more problems than all the religions combined..

            1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
              Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Yep, supposedly under British protection. Britain failed miserably and handled the whole situation very badly. First to admit it. I don't wonder why the Palistinians are pissed off. I can well imagine.

              1. lovemychris profile image80
                lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                The British though, were subject to terrorist attacks by the Irgun!

                1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                  Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Yeah, they still took the easy way out though LMC. The world could've been a very different place, if better decisions were made  back then.

                  1. lovemychris profile image80
                    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Well, there's no time like the present!

  15. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    Tired of this subject being shoved in my face?

  16. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    I should not have done that re whatever prev post

  17. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    Sorry about that.

  18. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    Just passing by...

  19. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    Would you like to chat?

  20. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    "Dang...I wonder if Beans knows?

    You know, Condi's "other" woman...they share a house together. The mortgage says Rice and Beans."


    That the big racist homophobic joke? In which you threw in the anti-semite slander?

  21. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    I am nonplussed and therefore concede. smile

  22. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    "Torah-true Jews wish to live in peace and harmony with their neighbors in every country among the community of nations, including in historic Palestine.  They deplore acts and policies of violence carried out by those who, misusing the name of Israel our forefather, have substituted the ideal of chauvinist nationalism for the eternal values of the Torah, the eternal divinely bestowed inheritance of the Jewish people.

    It has been the age-old intention of Zionism to intentionally stir up anti-Semitism anywhere possible, and even more commonly, to take advantage of any Jewish suffering anywhere in order to enhance its cause Indeed, hatred of Jews and Jewish suffering is the oxygen of the Zionist movement, and from the very beginning has been to deliberately incite hatred of the Jew and then, in feigned horror, use it to justify the existence of the Zionist state – this is, of course, Machiavellianism raised to the highest degree. Thus, the Zionists thrive on hatred and suffering of Jews, and seek to benefit thereby through keeping Jews in perpetual fear, causing them to ignore the true nature of Zionism, and instead to consider the Zionist state is their salvation."

  23. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    "Jews Against Zionism is a group for Jews and others opposed to the Zionist movement and ideology, and to its impact on both Palestinians and Jews. This is not a religious group, not a racist hate group, and not a conspiracy-theory group. JAZ is a political group, committed to coexistence between Palestinians and Israeli Jews.

    We believe that the conflict in Palestine cannot be resolved without a return of Palestinian refugees and dismantlement of the Zionist structure of the state of Israel - and that this is impossible in the context of two states and a re-partition of Palestine. We advocate the only approach which can lead to peace with justice in the region: we call for a unitary, secular and democratic Palestine, the return of Palestinian refugees, and full and equal rights for Palestinians, Israeli Jews, and all other people living in the whole of Palestine."

    ****

    So--do all these people hate Jews too, or is it just me?

  24. TMMason profile image74
    TMMasonposted 5 years ago

    Palistine was givin back to the jews as recompense for Islams participation with the NAZIs in slaughtering jews.

    You people think you can ignore all the evil that religion has caused and done in the name of momo and allah, and just blame everyone else... what a joke.

    Radical Islamic Jihad and pan-Arabism in its violent form find a common root in Amin Al Husseini, the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem. He is the vector of European fascism into the modern Islamic world, both religious and secular.

    And his actions and those islams with him sealed the fate of Cannan to be givin back to the jews... who puchased the land from the Muslumps anyways just to be right in the deal.

    1914-1917, Amin Al-Husseini swears allegiance to the Ottoman Empire  during the Armenian genocide [i] . [ii] He is an officer stationed in Smyrna and participates first-hand in the Armenian genocide. One and a half million Christians are slaughtered under the sword of Islamic Jihad by the Ottoman Army.  Allegiance to Ottoman Empire and Islamic world take-over will be echoed by Osama Bin Laden in his post-September 11th declaration

    1920, The Violence Begins, Riots. Amin Al-Husseini becomes lead figure in organizing riots against locals.  Amin Al-Husseini begins life-long campaign of inciting hate between Jews and Muslims under British Mandate of Palestine. He begins rule of terror over local Muslim leaders, who denounce him as an ignorant thug.


    1921, Grand Mufti Against The Will of The People,
    The British, against the local Muslim vote, appoint Amin Al-Husseini as Grand Mufti of Jerusalem.  Amin Al-Husseini came in a poor fourth place in the vote [v] .  The Muslim community rejected his candidacy because he had not received any credible  Islamic education.  He was neither a Sheikh (religiously accredited leader) nor an Alim (Islamic scholar).   He becomes the pre-eminent Arab power in Palestine.  His brutality becomes notorious and is rejected by local Muslim leadership.

    If they had only known what would come of that appoinment.


    1922, Head of Supreme Muslim Council, Amin Al-Husseini is appointed Head of Supreme Muslim Council (1922-1937) [vi] .  He is hugely disappointed by the end of the Ottoman Empire under Ataturk. Husseini becomes fanaticized by the idea that he must restore the lost Islamic Empire. He vows to fight all Muslim seculars.

    1922, Jerusalem Capital, Amin Al-Husseini implements restoration of Dome of the Rock and Al Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem [vii] .  He has the Dome gold-plated for the first time.  Thereafter, Jerusalem takes on more importance as Holy Muslim site in the eyes of the Arab World.


    1928, Husseini Joins Muslim Brotherhood, Muslim Brotherhood established in Egypt by Hassan El Banna [viii] in 1928.  Amin Al-Husseini becomes a central member and ideological inspiration [ix] for the Muslim Brotherhood. Mother organization for today’s Egyptian Islamic Jihad and Hamas [x] .  The Muslim Brotherhood preaches Wahhabi Islam [xi] , which justifies violent means to rid the ‘Muslim world’ of its non-Islamic element.  It envisions a Pan-Islamic Empire, where strict Islamic law rules over all.


    1929, Hebron Massacre, Amin Al-Husseini organizes more riots in Palestine.   He spreads false rumors to further turn the local Muslims against the Jews.   Random murdering of Hebron Jews begins. Hebron Jewish community was over 2,000 years old.

    1931, Founder of World Islamic Congress, Amin Al-Husseini starts to build his own political base.  He preaches Islamic unity and creates the World Islamic Congress in 1931 [xii] .


    1933, Hitler Finds Arab Support. Arab Nazi political groups [xiv] spring up throughout Middle East: Young Egypt.  Led by Muslim Brotherhood member Abdul Gamal Nasser (future Egyptian President). Young Egypt’s political slogan “One Folk, One Party, One Leader” is a direct translation from German of Nazi slogan. Social Nationalist Party in Syria.  Led by Anton Saada (known as the Syrian Fuhrer)


    1936, Husseini Meets Hitler’s banker, Francois Genoud, later known as the Swiss Banker of the Hitler’s Third Reich, travels to Palestine to meet Amin Al-Husseini for the first time.  Their relationship will continue well into the 1960’s. 

    1936, Palestine Riots Weapon of Choice Suicide Squads Muslim Leaders assassinated. Amin Al-Husseini is main organizer of riots. He organizes suicide squads against the local authorities.  Applies Nazi methodology of “systematic extermination” of any Arab suspected of less than total loyalty to Pan-Islamic vision of Muslim Brotherhood. 

    Any “non-Islamic” element is a threat to his Pan-Islamic vision.

    Many Muslim and Christian Palestinian intellectual leaders and clerics assassinated for protesting Husseini’s Islamic terror.

    1936-1938. Murdered by Husseini’s men: Sheikh Daoud Ansari ( Imam of Al Aqsa Mosque),  Sheikh Ali Nur el Khattib (Al Aqsa Mosque), Sheikh Nusbi Abdal Rahim (Council of Muslim Religious Court), Sheikh Abdul el Badoui (Acre, Palestine), Sheikh El Namouri (Hebron), Nasr El Din Nassr  (Mayor of Hebron).  Between Feb. 1937 and Nov 1938, Eleven (11) Mukhtars (community leaders) and their entire families slain by Amin al Husseini’s men.

    1937, On Hitler’s Payroll, Amin Al-Husseini visits Jerusalem German Consul. He meets SS Hauptschanfuehrer A.Eichman and SS Oberscherfuehrer H. Hagen to discuss “the Jewish question”.  [xviii] Amin Al-Husseini subsequently receives financial and military aid from Nazi Germany. [xix] [xx]


    1941, Mufti Joins Hitler In Jihad against Britain, Amin Al-Husseini arrives in Rome, where he meets fascist leader Benito Mussolini, the genocidal butcher of Ethiopians in Africa. Mussolini vows to help the Palestinian cause against the Jews. From Rome, Husseini declares Fatwa-Jihad [xxi] against Britain. He preaches the notion of Pan-Islamism, with vision of Muslim unity to further his cause.

    1941, Husseini-Tulfah, Iraqi Pro-nazi coup. Amin Al-Husseini instigates a pro-nazi coup in Baghdad, Iraq.  Kharaillah Tulfah is his right-hand man. Tulfah is Saddam Hussein’s mentor and uncle. Germany sends weapons and aircrafts to Husseini.  Coup fails.

    1941, European Jews Must Not Make It To Palestine. Amin Al-Husseini in Berlin meets [xxiii] with Adolf Hitler [xxiv] and is active in the decision to exterminate all Jews through the infamous Final Solution. Hitler was reportedly content with deporting the Jews out of Europe to Palestine.  Husseini perceived this as a threat to his stronghold in Palestine and pushed successfully for the extermination of the European Jews.   

    1941, Christian Serbian Genocide, Husseini’s Personal Project 300,000 Non-Muslim Deaths.

    April 25th. Amin Al-Husseini is made chief architect [xxvii] of Nazi offensive in Bosnia:  Serbian-Cyrillic alphabet outlawed. Orthodox Serbs forced to wear Blue armband.  Jewish Serbs forced to wear Yellow armband.

    While in Bosnia, Amin Al-Husseini takes the title “Protector of Islam”.  One hundred thousand (100,000) Bosnian Muslims join the Nazi ranks. They seek Nazi approval to establish autonomous Nazi protectorate for Bosnian Muslims.

    Amin Al-Husseini approves the Pejani Plan, calling for the extermination of the Serbian population. Nazi Germany refuses to implement the Pejani plan. 

    Bosnian ethnic cleansing under Amin al Husseini:

    . Orthodox Christian Serbs:  200,000 killed

    . Jewish Bosnians: 22,000 killed

    . Gypsies:    over 40,000 killed

    Husseini’s legacy of hatred is a major factor in today’s Bosnia/Herzegovina conflict against the Serbs and their leader Milosevic.


    1942, 10,000 Children Die, Amin Al-Husseini intervenes personally with Nazi High Command to block Red Cross offer of exchanging 10,000 Jewish children for Nazi prisoners of war.  They will die in Hitler’s gas chambers. [xxviii]

    You all really need to learn about Islam and the NAZIs... put down the liberalized BS History books you are reading and go to the sources, Islamic, Jewish and German, untill then you all know just about nothing as to the real facts of this part of world history.


    Arafat Speaks On Amin Al-Husseini

    “I was one of his troops.”

    Yasser Arafat was interviewed by Al Sharq Al Awsat (London Arabic Daily) and reprinted in Palestinian daily Al Quds on August 2, 2002:

    “We are not Afghanistan… We are the mighty people.  Were they able to replace our hero Hajj Amin Al-Husseini?… There were a number of attempts to get rid of Hajj Amin, when they considered him an ally of the Nazis. But even so, he lived in Cairo, and participated in the 1948 War and I was one of his troops.”

    (Translation found on Palestinian Media Watch web site.)

    http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/ … tml#_edn22

    Now you all can continue on in your lil la la liberal land fantasy world.

  25. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    Thought Hitler for one tried murder as negotiation. But it still seems to be the supreme peace process.

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      You may remember that Hitler and Germany lost the war. They lost because America and the allies relentlessly bombed them and killed it citizens. Funny how that works, if its murder then too bad, don't start none and there wont be none.

  26. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    Guess that's why Muslims have military bases in every state of the union and prosecuting wars in five of them. Oh I forget. We have to fight them over there so we don't have to fight them over here.
    "So prepare, say a pray'r,
    Send the word, send the word to beware.
    We'll be over, we're coming over,
    And we won't come back till it's over
    Over there."

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      It would be over a lot quicker if the military wasn't hamstrung by the compassionate left. War is about killing the enemy not reasoning with them.

  27. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    Why don't you just nuke everybody and get it over with. You should be quite happy with yourself.

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Why would anyone have to be nuked? I know, you ran out of anyway else to prove the point you thought you were making.

  28. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    Try war industries, your favorite.

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Building the autobahn was another, but thanks for proving that Hitler did use socialist ideas. History is a bitch.

      1. John Holden profile image59
        John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        He's not alone in using socialist ideas, still doesn't make him one does it?

        1. Repairguy47 profile image61
          Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

          You said that there was nothing that Hitler did that was socialist, you don't seem to recall the things you say. I never said Hitler was a socialist I just pointed out that you were wrong.

      2. John Holden profile image59
        John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Actually, having time to give that statement a bit more thought. Are you saying that the Roman Empire were socialists then?
        After all they built some great roads in Europe, roads that lasted far longer than the Roman Empire did.
        They built them for military, not social reasons, pretty much as Hitler built the Autobahns, well he didn't actually build them, they were well under-way before he came to power. He just saw the value of them.

        1. Repairguy47 profile image61
          Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I understand, it takes a while to log in and out of accounts.

          1. John Holden profile image59
            John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            What are you implying?

            I was actually watching the TV.

            1. Repairguy47 profile image61
              Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

              What are you implying that I'm implying?

              1. John Holden profile image59
                John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Your comment about taking time to log in and out of accounts.

                1. Repairguy47 profile image61
                  Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Sloooooooooooooooooooooooooow

  29. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    Fascism is corporations that exploit socialist government for their own private profits. Take Obamacare for instance.

  30. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    You ever hear of drone warfare. Right up your alley.

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      It would be nice if you would reply to a message so others could be sure who you are talking to. And yes, I have heard of drone warfare and would love to see more of it. In case you don't understand my point let me make it perfectly clear. I want to kill the enemy and any who harbor them.

  31. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    If you don't know who I am talking to can't help you. So I can assume you want to kill me.

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I don't want to kill you, and all that is needed to help me would be to reply to a post. Can't be that hard, just hit reply.

  32. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    Sorry I don't engage in private conversations, us and them and all that.

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      What are you talking about? This is all on a public site so hitting reply wouldn't be anymore private than what we are doing.

  33. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    I don't talk to one I talk to all. At any rate are you sure you should be talking to the enemy.
    There is no negotiation.

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I see, are you my enemy? If so then you are correct I will not negotiate.

  34. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    My theory is the problem with right wing Floridians is too much fluoride in the water.

  35. Hollie Thomas profile image61
    Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago

    TM, I can't find a place to reply to your comment. When I said last night that something weird happened when I tried to reply, I meant in terms of a glitch. The system wouldn't let me. It just said flag, less, report etc. I haven't reported you, or flagged you. I was talking about a glitch in the system. In terms of where I stand on the Israel issue, it's where I've always stood. I believe both sides have the right to exist and the right to live in peace, with territory of their own.

    1. TMMason profile image74
      TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Okay, Hollie.

      Sorry. I thought you were reporting me for something and was curious as to what is all.

      1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
        Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        No, not at all, we might disagree fundamentally but it doesn't mean I want to report or flag you. These forums are a place to air our views. Last night I had to reply to you in another thread, because of the glitch. That's what I meant by had to 'reply to you here.' Had to do it again tonight when I said 'can't find a place to reply to your comment.

        1. TMMason profile image74
          TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Well that sucks... I rather enjoy the banter.

          I will try to keep up if we switch threads for answers.

          I knew I felt a lil confused last nite...

          1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
            Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Cheeky smile I did too, but I put that down to that extra glass of red, for medicinal purposes of course.

  36. knolyourself profile image60
    knolyourselfposted 5 years ago

    And the media is all socialist.

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Only NPR, the rest are for profit.

  37. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    "Palistine was givin back to the jews as recompense for Islams participation with the NAZIs in slaughtering jews."

    Palestine is the home of the worlds oldest living Christians.....how does that compute?

    And that is BS anyway.
    Ole Herzel was given a map, and they said "Pick a spot". He chose Palestine, and that was the end of life for the people living there.
    Had nothing to do with recompense...because if that was the case, you would owe the Iroqouis Indians your home!

    1. TMMason profile image74
      TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      you just fly all over the map don't you.

      I wouldn't even bring up American Indians if I were you... you want to see you American Socialism in action... just take a look at the reservation... that is what all your Govt asst. does for a people.

      1. lovemychris profile image80
        lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        It's not "gvt assistance", it's apartheid!
        Just as the Likud gvt is doing to the Palestinians.
        Just as certain Muslims in Africa do to African Christians.
        Just as White South Africans did to the Native Africans.

        You can dress it up all you like,excuse it by past injustice, whatever you do.....it is still wrong and unjustifiable and Man's inhumanity to man.

        1. TMMason profile image74
          TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Excuse me?

          Indians are free to go where-ever they choose and do what-ever they want...

          You are lost.

          The only thing keeping them on the reservation these days is the entitlement enslavement mentallity that the American Left has drummed into them. They have been stripped of all pride and dignity, and enslaved through the chains of economic slavery.

          It is sad actually.

          1. lovemychris profile image80
            lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            What's sad is how some people really understand nothing.

            Nothing of history, nothing of loss, nothing of desperation.

            How nice to have all the answers sown up, and all the comforts of life to spout them in.

            The wild beauty that was America has become a genetically engineered/chemically altered warm bath.

    2. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
      Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      lovemychris, you sound like juvenile...

      1. lovemychris profile image80
        lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        "Shall we choose Palestine or Argentine? We shall take what is given us, and what is selected by Jewish public opinion. The Society will determine both these points."

        The Jewish State
        By Theodor Herzl
        (1896)


        http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jso … rzl2b.html

  38. Ralph Deeds profile image70
    Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago

    Here's Tom Friedman's take today on the Israel-Palestine-US situation

    Israel: Adrift at Sea Alone
    By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN
    Published: September 17, 2011

       
    I’VE never been more worried about Israel’s future. The crumbling of key pillars of Israel’s security — the peace with Egypt, the stability of Syria and the friendship of Turkey and Jordan — coupled with the most diplomatically inept and strategically incompetent government in Israel’s history have put Israel in a very dangerous situation.
        Palestinians See U.N. Bid as Their Most Viable Option (September 18, 2011)
       
    This has also left the U.S. government fed up with Israel’s leadership but a hostage to its ineptitude, because the powerful pro-Israel lobby in an election season can force the administration to defend Israel at the U.N., even when it knows Israel is pursuing policies not in its own interest or America’s.

    More here:


    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/18/opini … amp;st=cse

    1. TMMason profile image74
      TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Friedman is an idiot.

      1. lovemychris profile image80
        lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Here's what else Friedman said years ago:

        "...Mr. Sharon has the Palestinian leader Yasir Arafat under house arrest in his office in Ramallah, and he's had George Bush under house arrest in the Oval Office. Mr. Sharon has Mr. Arafat surrounded by tanks, and Mr. Bush surrounded by Jewish and Christian pro-Israel lobbyists, by a vice president, Dick Cheney, who's ready to do whatever Mr. Sharon dictates."

        Not only have the Zionists occupied Palestine, they have occupied the USA.
        Bout time for this crappola to end.

        Jews, Arabs, Americans....we can all get together to throw those Zionists bums out! From wherever they hold sway.

        1. TMMason profile image74
          TMMasonposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Arafat could have ended this a decade ago... and that is the FACT that cannot be over-come by you Leftists.

          Arafat and the Islams choose terrorism over peace, remember he walked away from all they wanted when israel offered it, and the new president of Palistine is Abbas, who is the former advisor to Arafat who urged Arafat to walk away from the deal.

          Even Clinton knows this is a fact... everyone but you Leftists see the truth of Islam wanting to annihilate Israel.

          So again I repeat... Friedman is an idiot.

  39. Greek One profile image82
    Greek Oneposted 5 years ago

    TM wrote:

    "Islam's role in WWII, thier founding of the Bosnian and mioddle eastern SS sqads, and their silent partnership with hitler to sieze and slaughter Jews, is well documented and cannot be denied."

    My reply:

    As a Christian, I live in a very big glass house, and would not wish to condemned 1 billion people for the crimes and atrocities of those relatively few who committed crimes because their religion, in part, inspired them to do so.


    TM wrote

    "I would have thought you would know that bit of history.?..

    And for someone who claims Greek status, you sure are forgiving of the Devshirme... you know the Jannassarrie corp?... remember that lil tax upon the greek people by the Ottoman Empire and Islam? All those greek children stolen, perverted and destroyed... lil children, used up and spit out by that barbaric religion.

    Probrably not."


    My reply:

    Alas, TM, if only I was familiar with such atrocities through the 4 years I studied history at university.  Unfortunately, as a person of Greek decent, I have a more intimate knowledge of such events.  My Grandparents on my mother's side where born in Asia Minor, in what is modern day Turkey.  During the beginning of the last century, the Turks were purging the large Greek communities and rounded up all the males in my Grandmother's village, including her brothers. 

    Her younger brother, just a few years old, saw his older siblings being taken away, and naturally wanted to be go off to play with them and not be left behind.  He came out of hiding to join them... and was also taken.  He, like his brothers, were never to be seen again.

    My grandparents were naturally reluctant to talk about these events, but i remember them cautioning me about hating all Turks for these crimes.  If I was to do so, if i was to paint every single Turk (then or now), or every single Muslim I have met or have not met (then or now) with such a wide brush..  not only would I have to ignore my grandparent's wise counsel, not only would i have to hypocritically ignore atrocities committed by followers of all religions throughout history (including mine); not only would I have to throw away the wisdom offered, and the love demanded, by my Christian faith, but I would put my own self in peril....

    for such xenophobia, such wide and all encompassing paranoia and hate, could leave me like that old US Senator from Wisconsin I read about in school... tired, broken, drunk, discredited, and left to wonder why the world have evolved but he hadn't.

    1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
      Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      +1, +1, +1. Profound.

      1. livelonger profile image89
        livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Agreed - great stuff.

  40. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    "Bethleem) is a city Palestinians in the West Bank and is a center of Palestinian cultural and tourism industry. Population of 29,019 inhabitants (2005). The city has an important meaning for Christians because it is believed to be the birthplace of Jesus of Nazareth. Rachel’s tomb which is important in the Jewish religion is situated on the outskirts of this city. Bethlehem is also home to the largest Palestinian Christian communities in the Middle East."

    http://www.evtv1.com/player.aspx?itemnum=8012

    The IDF bombed the oldest Christian church/cave during Operation Cast Lead.

  41. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago
  42. Kangaroo_Jase profile image80
    Kangaroo_Jaseposted 5 years ago

    Misleading title to context of OP

  43. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    Gordon Duff agrees with Arthur Koestler, author of The 13th Tribe!

    "There is, however, a historical record of a people from Russia called the Khazars who converted to Judaism and created a great empire nearly as large as the United States.  The “Jewish areas” of Russia and Europe were the eastern portion of Khazaria.

    One could assume that all Jews in Russia or Poland, just as Helen Thomas said, were from there and had never been from Judea.  We can prove Jews lived there as Khazars.  We cannot prove Jews moved there from Judea."

    http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/09/22 … -whatever/

  44. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    Bibiguns is from Lithuania, for gods sakes....just like my grandpa Julius was!
    So--how's he lay claim to Palestine?

    1. livelonger profile image89
      livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      The UN has made a decision on how human rights are secured in the world: through national self-determination. Jews were not safe in Europe; Europeans did not consider them really European.

      1. lovemychris profile image80
        lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Yes, and even WE turned them away!

        My only  problem is, they are now doing onto others just what was done onto them.(which is why I believe the Zionists are, in fact, Nazi's)

        And as in EVERY counry...it' the LEADERS who are the problem! BUT, the people vote them in. *allegedly*...who knows what shenanigans go on behind the scenes.
        ****

        "Ami Ayalon, former Israeli Shin Bet (its internal security service) head backs Palestinian Statehood, saying:

        “After voting for the Palestinian state, Israel should start negotiations over borders….We should realize that the Palestinian move came due to the lack of other options.”

        He added that Israel has itself to blame for its growing isolation and believes it’s essential to formulate a new policy.

        Enlightened millions globally agree, including growing numbers of Jews in Israel and elsewhere.

        In fact, “most Israelis actually want the Palestinian initiative to go ahead and to succeed.”

        They believe achieving it is the best way to “save the ‘Jews only State’ from a demographic meltdown” because Palestinian numbers are growing faster than Jewish ones.

        Polls show Israelis clearly favor Palestinian statehood. Not only that, “they actually love” the idea.

        Opposing it are Netanyahu, Avigdor Lieberman, other political hard-liners, extremist settlers, diaspora Zionists, and the powerful Israeli Lobby."
        ****

        "Opposing it are Netanyahu, Avigdor Lieberman, other political hard-liners, extremist settlers, diaspora Zionists, and the powerful Israeli Lobby."
        --and apparently, the US gvt. Geeeeee, wonder why? Ooo, gotta sneeze... *AIPAC*

        1. livelonger profile image89
          livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Who are "the Zionists" to you? (What is your definition of them)

          Are Zionists exterminating millions of Palestinians?

          You have a pattern of making false equivalencies, almost always equating Jews with people who have committed far worse crimes.

          1. lovemychris profile image80
            lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            You make a lot of equivalencies yourself...as if what Isreal is doing is not so bad...IT IS.

            I want the here and now horror on Palestinians to stop. Just as the horror against Jews was stopped.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lX18zUp6WPY

            1. livelonger profile image89
              livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Were Palestinians herded up in concentration camps and killed by the millions?

              Are there efforts to round up Arab citizens of Israel and kill them all?

              Is Israel marching into neighboring countries in an effort to kill off all the Palestinians living there?

              You make the pro-Palestinian side look terribly foolish and racist when you make false equivalencies like this (just like TMMason does for the pro-Israeli side). Peace efforts are stymied by one-sided perspectives promulgated by people like the two of you.

              1. lovemychris profile image80
                lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Fine, then don't listen to me, or ask me any more questions.

                I'm sick of having to apologize for calling Israel out!

                They are brutally mistreating another ethnicity. I think it's BAD, no matter what was done to them in the past.

                Period, end of story!

                1. livelonger profile image89
                  livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Evasions of your outlandish claims and your black-and-white thinking. I'm come to expect no less, but still (probably futilely) hope for something different.

                  1. lovemychris profile image80
                    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    I will say the same for you.
                    There is such a thing as right and wrong.

                    And you cannot keep playing the victim card forever. It is not the reality of 2011.

  45. Ralph Deeds profile image70
    Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago

    The CIA abruptly yanked all of its advertisements this month from metro Detroit's largest Arab-American newspaper because it ran an Associated Press report that said the intelligence agency was helping spy on Muslim Americans.

    But on Thursday, after inquiries from the Free Press, the CIA said it was resubmitting the ads to the Arab American News and regretted "any misunderstandings."

    The decision to remove the ads concerned some local Arab Americans, who said the agency was trying to squash criticism through its money.

    "When a government agency that uses tax dollars tries to muzzle people, stifle debate or control the press, I have a problem with it," said Osama Siblani, the paper's publisher.

    After the Free Press contacted the CIA and Gravity Media, the company it works with to place recruiting ads in the newspaper, the agency said Thursday it wanted to place ads again.

    "The CIA has a long history of advertising with the Arab American News, and we regret any misunderstandings in this instance," CIA spokesman Preston Golson said Thursday. "Freedom of the press is one of the many American values that CIA officers work to defend every day."

    On Sept. 8, Gravity Media contacted the Arab American News and said it must immediately pull all the online CIA ads, Siblani said.

    On Sept. 12, Gravity Media told the Arab American News it was "ordered by the CIA to pull the ads because of the AP story we ran on the CIA cooperating with the New York Police Department to spy on Muslims," Siblani said.

    "They thought ... we can be intimidated," he said.

    Siblani said he was especially disturbed considering that he played a key role in helping the CIA make inroads into metro Detroit's Arab-American communities. As part of its recruiting efforts, the agency now helps fund 13 Arab-American groups in metro Detroit and sponsored an Arab-American dinner in Dearborn in 2009 with then-CIA Director Leon Panetta.

    "For them to do this after all we have done to introduce them to the community is beyond imagination," Siblani said.

    Siblani said he's now mulling whether to accept the CIA's resubmission of the ads.




    http://www.freep.com/article/20110923/N … -newspaper

  46. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    And peace is stymied by Bibiguns and the rotten mean selfish settlers, who are recruited and PAID to steal land from Palestinians and some-how claim it as their own. They are the racists. IMO

    http://www.disclose.tv/action/viewvideo … nists_1_4/

    1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
      Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      lovemychris, your statement is crazy.

  47. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    The Day the Zionist Settlers Paid Us a Visit

    http://avoicefrompalestine.wordpress.co … s-a-visit/

    "All Israeli settlements on Palestinian land are illegal under international law, and while many Israelis claim that the moving of 5,000 settlers from the Gaza Strip caused a huge rift in Israeli society, the move was necessary for compliance with the law. Many settlers who had colonized the Gaza Strip were then moved into new settlements in the West Bank, thereby nullifying any compliance that may have been achieved by moving out of Gaza.

    Israeli forces then bombed and demolished all of the buildings of the Gaza settlements, rendering them as toxic dumps where the residents of Gaza are afraid to go due to the potential health risks of exposure to asbestos and other chemicals.

    Although both the international community and the United Nations have condemned Israel for its settlement of civilians on occupied territories, no international body has attempted to enforce the rulings."

    Now THAT is crazy. Why is the whole world afraid of Israel?

    1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
      Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Promiss Land is Israeli's for 3000 years. Arabs came there recently for work (most of them). Religion invaded the land  by Turks and destroyed everything, left wasted land. They use the trees for producing coal. Since when this territory is Arabs?  Do you know what is wrong with siding lies?  Either misinformed students or old communists. Have you ever been in Israel?  Every thief now want Israel since Israeli developed it beyond the measure.

      1. lovemychris profile image80
        lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        "Promiss Land is Israeli's for 3000 years"


        Promised by who?

      2. Hollie Thomas profile image61
        Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Your comments are ridiculous. Arabs didn't recently arrive in Israel looking for work. The situation is far more complex than that and I really don't see how using trees for coal is relevant, if this is even true. The situation in the Middle East is worrying enough, not only does it affect the citizens of Palestine and Israel but stability throughout the world depends on what happens there. Keep it real.

        1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
          Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          oh, grandma have you been in Israel?
          to lovemychris, by God.

          1. lovemychris profile image80
            lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Given the treatment I get by Israel supporters here, I'm quite sure I would not be welcome.

            errr, bytheway.....which God?

            1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
              Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              God of Elohim.

              1. lovemychris profile image80
                lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                The Annunaki of Nibiru?

                I read all of Zachariah Sitchins Earth Chronicles.....

                The Elohim.... Had babies with Earth women.....the Gods of old.

                So--who you for, Enki or Enlil??

            2. ReuVera profile image84
              ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              You are such a liar again. I myself personally invited you to go to visit Israel. I told you that I'll ask my friends there to give you a tour there, so that you'll see with your own eyes what a beautiful, peaceful and friendly country it is. You are welcome at least to read my hubs about Israel. But, oh no, it is not interesting to you. All you are able to do is to bash Israel, blinded by your hatred and bias.

              1. lovemychris profile image80
                lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Nope..blinded by the harsh, inhumane treatment of the Palestinians going on 60 years now.

                Which I invite YOU to consider, but you won't.


                It's like this: When people say they hate America, I know they don't hate all Americans, they hate what people do in our name.
                Same goes for Israel.
                And until it is acknowledged and CEASED, I will continue to speak on it.

                1. livelonger profile image89
                  livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  When will you ask that the Gazans CEASE their bombing of Israel, and acknowledge its right to exist?

                  It seems that if you were really interested in a peaceful outcome for all parties (not everything they want and currently demand, which are irreconcilable) then you'd be more fair about it.

                  1. lovemychris profile image80
                    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    I'm sorry--but Israel does 50 times the bombing and killing...maybe 100 times. Maybe even 1000.

                    You want the Palestinians to say it's OK that their land was given to other people, and they were thrown off to live in tents?  Would you?

                    Israel needs to stop the settlements number one. That would show a good faith effort. Then the Palestinians must be given their land back! If it's not too late already. They are walled in away from each other...like little pockets of prisons...it's really cruel and Nazi-like.

                    I wonder if the Israeli's even know what's going on?

          2. Hollie Thomas profile image61
            Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            oh, grandma have you been in Israel?
            to lovemychris, by God

            Makes even less sense than you former post. Gobaldygook!

            1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
              Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Uneducated. Coal always come from wood, organic matter one burned with very little oxygen. It was old time process.  In the Turkey they did not have enough technology to take it from the ground.

              1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
                Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                But do you know God loves you?

            2. ReuVera profile image84
              ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Makes perfect sense. She talks about things she has no idea about. she has to go and visit Israel and then maybe, maybe she'll be able to see the reality.

              1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                V Uhri :You make assumptions, I don't bash Israel actually, I want to see both the Israelis and the Palestinians live in peace, with territory of their own (Try reading my previous posts in this thread). Your friend  talks about reality, there is a reality for Israel and a reality for Palestine. Hence, my usage of the word complex.

                I thought it was ridiculous that you bring the situation in the Middle East down to coal and Arabs recently moving there. Decades of strife in that region can't just be attributed to coal and a recent migration to the area. So, yes, I still think your comments are ridiculous. Perhaps you are the uneducated one?

                I'm sure your intentions are good, but I really do not need to be told that God loves me, nor do I need your attempts at salvation. This is yet another comment I find ridiculous because it's completely irrelevant to this discussion.

                Reu Vera; You mention visiting Israel, why don't you try living there day in day out for some real perspective. There are, in fact, Israelis that want a two state solution, they're sick of war and they think there are some perfectly logical reasons for a two state solution. Given your link United with Israel, I think it's unlikely that you have read widely, by widely I mean, try expand your reading matter so you have a better understanding of  ALL the issues and all the perspectives. So, instead of me talking a minute to investigate the information you have posted, why don't you take several weeks to in attempting to gain a more balanced view. I will however, check out your link, so thanks for posting that.

                You also mention hatred, this is interesting because I do not hate Israelis or Palestinians. Can you say the same?  Disagreement does not equate to hatred. Perhaps you should invest in a good dictionary and you will be the on that is better informed. Btw she has a name and it's Hollie.

                1. livelonger profile image89
                  livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  I think she did live there for a while (I'm pretty sure I read that).

                  1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                    Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Ok, fair enough. Then I take that back and apologize for it, but I think you may have guessed what I was trying to get across.

                  2. ReuVera profile image84
                    ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    yep, I lived there for 10 years (1991-2001) and going back again in future.

                2. ReuVera profile image84
                  ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  -Hollie, if you'd taken an effort to check my profile, you'd learn that I am an Israeli, I actually lived there and going back to live there in future. I live in USA because I married an American, but I hold dual citizenship and visit Israel often, I have a family there. So, I know the subject first hand.

                  - I didn't know that Vladimir addressed you, since I did not read every page on this thread. I presumed that he was talking about LMC.

                  1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                    Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    LL, pointed out that you lived there, so I apologized and took that back. I didn't check out your profile because I responded instantly to what you'd said about my hatred for Israel, which is completely untrue. So between me not reading your profile and you thinking you were addressing LMC, well, no wonder it let to confusion.

    2. ReuVera profile image84
      ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      You are SO misinformed!
      Will you have a minute to take from your open hatred and watch this video?
      http://unitedwithisrael.org/the-video-t … ans-crazy/

  48. paradigmsearch profile image90
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    Give it a rest.

    <A FEE IS CHARGED TO ACCESS THIS LEVEL>

    If you wish to proceed, go to <reserved>.

    1. lovemychris profile image80
      lovemychrisposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Who are you talking to?

      1. paradigmsearch profile image90
        paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        You.

    2. Hollie Thomas profile image61
      Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      You have also confused me too Paradigmsearch. I know, that's not difficult!

      1. paradigmsearch profile image90
        paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        big_smile

        1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
          Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          You, cheeky cat you, good job I don't take you too seriously!

  49. lovemychris profile image80
    lovemychrisposted 5 years ago

    Yeah, if you don't want to see something....don't look!

  50. Hollie Thomas profile image61
    Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago

    LMC, I think Para is in the business of winding up. But kind of in a harmless way smile

    1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
      Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Ottoman Empire - See Wikipedia:
      a Turkish empire that lasted from 27 July 1299 to 29 October 1923.
      There is nothing mention in history about Palestinians. The word Palestine was British joking name for Philistine.

      1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
        Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Well, if there's nothing in history about Palestinians they clearly don't exist do they. Except they do exist, so take a moment and get your head around that. Instead of telling me that God lives me, tell the Palestinians or does your god not recognize all people.

        1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
          Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          And by the way, if this is true, and that wouldn't surprise me, then the English have something to be ashamed of.

        2. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
          Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Hollie, wrong. Arabs exist as well as Christians exists and other minority. But not Palestinians. They just want to destroy Israel and want have all things. They shell 1200 Soviet-Rushian Katushas Rockets to Israel, without reason not mentioned suicide bombers, even children. They had massive wedding ceremony with 12 years old girls - pedophilia and you approve to replace Israel?  Where have you been? Don't you do home work ?

          1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
            Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Where have you been? At what point did I say Palestine should replace Israel?I hardly think your helping any cause by suggesting that all Palestinians are pedophiles. Israel want to be recognized by Palestine, and to some degree they have been, albeit not as a Jewish State but that opens up a whole new can of worms with regards to the refugees amongst other things. At some point this situation has got to give, you may not want to recognize the Palestinians but it doesn't change the reality in that they do exist, just as the Israelis do.

            1. livelonger profile image89
              livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I'm with you, Hollie. (Though recognition of Israel hasn't happened yet but presumably would in a peace deal; Hamas is tougher since their charter explicitly calls for the destruction of Israel)

              The thing you quickly realize is that those who solely advocate for one side in the conflict rely on distortions, exaggerations and lies in order to beatify the side they're on and demonize the other. It's those black-and-white distortions that lead significant numbers on each side to believe they're the only ones who deserve any land.

              1. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                I know, and that's what's really sad about it all, because in the meantime we have the Palestinians living in rubble as they do and we still have rockets sent into Israel and old lady's getting blown to bits at bus stops. It just hurts all involved. Even more worrying, is the situation with Israel and its neighbors. It feels like the whole region is about to reach another boiling point, and it's frightening.

              2. ReuVera profile image84
                ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                The funny thing is that Israel is NOT against Palestinian state. Israel IS for two states for two peoples. Did you listen to Netanyahu speech in UN on September 23?
                Why do Arabs have to talk about talking, negotiate about negotiating? Do you remember how Arafat threw the pen and left the room, leaving Clinton and Rabin and the rest with dropped jaws? when Rabin was giving to Arafat more than they asked for in lands. They don't need peace! Why don't you see it?

                Had Israel ever stared any war? Had Israel ever attacked first? Gosh!

                1. livelonger profile image89
                  livelongerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  I agree with you on some things in this post, and disagree with others.

                  I agree most Israelis want a 2-state solution. But the current government coalition really doesn't. As you know, Bill Clinton has a pretty honest read on the Israel-Palestinian situation, and he recently placed the (current) blame on Netanyahu:
                  http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts … ce_process

                  I am fully aware that for decades, the situation was reversed and the Palestinians, especially under Arafat, had no interest in peace. Arafat abandoned Oslo when it was being negotiated under Ehud Barak; that same deal that Barak offered would be accepted today by Abbas, if you believe Clinton (I have no reason not to).

                  About Israel attacking first: the only time I know that's been the case was 1967 (all other times, the Arab countries attacked first). That's probably why the pre-1967 lines are the basis of final negotiations.

                  Believe me, I have little sympathy for Palestinians losing a huge chunk of the territory they would have had in 1948 had they agreed to the land split. I also have little sympathy for the Gazans who chose to vote in a party that would make attacking and eradicating Israel the thrust of its platform over taking care of its constituents. But that doesn't mean it's not Netanyahu that's running interference on a peace deal now.

                  1. ReuVera profile image84
                    ReuVeraposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    The mentioned fact is correct and it was pretty much provoked situation. I won't go into details, read it here:  http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jso … s/mf6.html

                    I know that you mostly support Israel and I respect you for this greatly.

                    many people do not know or don't want to recognize the fact that when Israel was proclaimed as a country, Jews were pleading with Arabs who lived there not to leave, to stay and build a new country together. Only a small number of Arabs stayed. The rest left, because they were ordered to leave by their leaders under the promise that they'll return soon to get everything.

                2. Hollie Thomas profile image61
                  Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  ReuVera, this was not meant as a critisizm of Israel. I actually did listen to Netanyahu and I've also listened to Abbas. My comments are about the suffering of people on both sides in that region. My comments about an old ladie being blown up at a bus stop were relating to an Israeli woman.

                  Israel has started a war in the past yes. But, history is history, we are were we are now. They do need peace and so does Palestine. Peace.

                  1. Vladimir Uhri profile image60
                    Vladimir Uhriposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Hollie, Arabs and others are suffering by Arabs fault. Their religion wants to wipe out Israel. That's all.  Suffering is consequences of sin. I did suffer under Soviets, so I moved out. Arabs should go to Arabia. We built city on desert they can do also. They had option to leave but Arabs like other countries better, since they have no freedom in their own country. Why don't you address that part?

 
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