Another Hub of the Day rant... but this time, I'll spell it out:

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   Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

   First, apologies to Tori since it will SEEM like I'm picking on her HotD - I'm not. These featured hubs need to be touched by an editor if Hubpages is ever going to be taken seriously as a 'real' writing site.
   
   1. The Title is Wordy
   2. Restain should be re-stain
   3. FIRST sentence, misspelled word: desparately should be desperately
   4. First introductory paragraph is too wordy: townhouse apartment - pick one; 'burnt orange' shouldn't be repeated and too much is said about 'liking' the color.
   5. The entire opening paragraphs are too wordy with a few run-on sentences.
   
   It's obvious why they chose this hub for the honor - once you get to the tutorial, it looks good. By how many people will find this article, see it and leave before getting to the good stuff because it has a rough-around-the-edges beginning that COULD have been helped along by some input from an average editor making a few good suggestions - so Tori could improve it - BEFORE it became the focus of the site for the day?
   
   And more importantly... WHY doesn't the Hubpages crew take this issue ALOT more seriously? Don't they care what we ALL look like?!!

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      ChristinSposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      You are picking apart her hub. Did she ask for your public critique? You probably wouldn't want someone doing that to you unsolicited.  Perhaps you should email staff with your suggestions and continued concerns about other people's writing.

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      calculus-geometryposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Pointing this out publicly in the forums in this manner is only making you look bad. And it opens your writing up to scrutiny as well, which you probably don't want. As Christin said, it's better to email staff.

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      peachpurpleposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Sounds like to are annoyed with that hub, tey informing hp team

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      Cardisaposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      ALOT should be "a lot" Just a suggestion. Alot isn't really a word.

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      theraggededgeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      You are unspeakably rude to pull apart someone's Hub in public. Can you not see why people are angry with you? It's not about the 'point' you are making - we all get that - it's the way you made it.

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      ahorsebackposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      How childish ! To actually target a hub by someone else to what , Become the vocabulary police ! Shame on this whole thread ,  Hubpages ,unlike all other places to write  is most usually NOT a place  to play word cop ! Perhaps face book is more your place to write  !

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   FatFreddysCatposted 8 years ago

   "ALOT more seriously?"
   
   ...don't you mean "'a lot' (two words) more seriously?"

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   snakeslaneposted 8 years ago

   Ouch!

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   Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

   It wasn't meant to be an 'ouch', really... Just a heads-up. I've been thinking about it. I know that alot of writers don't like the idea of having their writing critiqued. But, if Hubpages staff would at least give writers who are going to be featured a heads-up - they could at least get excited and ask for feedback - even here in the forums - IF they wanted it. There are so many ways this could be resolved. It's really a shame that they don't. Btw, I know that none of *my* articles would even come close, ha! I'm not looking to be up there. I just think we could collectively look better and have a much better reputation with very little effort.

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      snakeslaneposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      If I wanted to help a writer fix something on a Hub I would do it privately via personal email. We have the technology, (go to profile page and find email link on the Fan Mail page). It's your call.

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   Sychophantasticposted 8 years ago

   Reading your criticism, I thought I was going to agree with you, but I don't. I agree that all writing can be better, but this particular article represents more of the good than the bad. It's main attribute is that it explains a process for a beginner's point of view and is very valuable. If I was refinishing a table, I wouldn't care much about the one misspelled word. I'd be hooked by the fact I am in the same boat as the person who wrote the article and it would appeal to me that they've taken the time to guide me through the process.

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   Erin Mellorposted 8 years ago

   A lot, not "alot". If you want to criticise how another person writes then please make sure you do so with real words. If you think people should take criticism constructively then show some leadership and learn from the criticism you receive.

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   Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

   Thanks ALOT, Erin & Sychophantastic... I NEVER said that *I* should be THE PERSON to edit this stuff. This was an EXAMPLE that I used in the forums for EVERYONE since Hubpages staff refuses to take this issue seriously. I was TRYING to show amateur writers (which most of us ARE) how the HotD SHOULD be improved. If you are having problems with this; then frankly - you're too damn sensitive to EVER to a decent writer! It's a crying SHAME that so many of you are so silly about his issue.

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      ChristinSposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      And yet, here you are yelling about someone correcting you, unsolicited, on the net.  Oh the irony.  The correct way to do critique is to only do it if it is asked for, or privately.  It is not right to just pick something at random and plug away at it in a public forum.  Look how snarky you got from two people correcting your use of one word.  See how bad that feels to be judged over something so petty?  Genuine critique and editing does have a place; I agree.  I also agree that critiques can help writers improve.  I volunteered for a lot of critique in my college classes for example.  That was not what this was.  This was shaming someone to make a point for your own agenda and that is why people are reacting negatively to it, not because we are big babies who can't handle criticism.

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   Colin Quartermainposted 8 years ago

   I don't think people have a problem with you saying improvements should be made to HotD choices, but you have highlighted one individual's work.
   
   That was person has not asked for public feedback about their hub.
   
   If it was me I wouldn't want my mistakes highlighted on this public platform, I get embarrassed enough when fellow writers take the time to do it in private, but private feedback is definitely the way to go

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   Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

   I'm not yelling about anyone correcting ME... I'm mad at you all for 'not getting it' and for altering the course of this subject toward the ERRONEOUS conclusion that I was picking on Tori when that OBVIOUSLY was NOT the case. I didn't SHAME anyone. If that is how YOU are taking it; then again, you're too damn sensitive and it's no wonder WHY this sit is KNOWN for it's BAD writing.

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      ChristinSposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Then you obviously need to calm down and take some of your own advice.  If you don't like being told why something you are doing is rubbing others the wrong way; chances are you aren't going to like being critiqued publicly either.  You are the one who is being sensitive here and we are all entitled to our opinions.  I "get it" - I don't happen to agree with your tactics.

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      Millionaire Tipsposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      

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         Huntgoddessposted 8 years agoin reply to this

         Yes. I love this!

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    Millionaire Tipsposted 8 years ago

    When we write and publish a hub, we have no idea that it will be singled out as Hub of the Day.  Yours might be one of them too one day, and I'm sure you wouldn't want a public critique of it..  We are all amateur writers, and we all make mistakes.  The HOTD doesn't highlight perfect hubs; it highlights the good ones. While spelling and grammar is important, the focus should be on the content.
    
    While I agree that Hubbers should get a heads up when their hub is about to be highlighted, and editors should be available to help polish it up, I think this public shaming is unwarranted.  This Hubber didn't get any advance notice and didn't have an editor's help.

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    Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

    The reason WHY I used Tori's HotD was to DEMONSTRATE what I have tried to explain before and OTHER Hubbers HAVE agreed with me that the HotD need improvements. It just seemed like a demonstration was needed to get the point across. Perhaps if you had seen my other posts about this, you wouldn't be so silly about it.

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    Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

    Stop telling me to calm down after YOU all keep acting like I'm being SO mean. I actually WELCOME critique on my writing. Have you ever heard anyone say this? "If I see a Hubpages article in a search, I don't even click on it unless it is the only article that comes up - and even then, I'm usually disappointed." If you can't see that I am trying to HELP IMPROVE things for us ALL - then yeah I'm angry and screw you.

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       ChristinSposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       I get that you can't deal with people who disagree with you.  I agree the HOTD quality is often not the best.  I even agree that HOTD notifications in advance would be an excellent idea and that if the author of the hub would like the services of an editor - that would be peachy. 
       
       However,  where we part ways is in publicly choosing one person's writing, presumably without her permission, then picking it apart on the public forum. 
       
       You can email staff, you can email writers here personally and make suggestions, you can hub hop - all manners of things to help improve the site.  I write for a living.  I understand and value critique when it is done appropriately.  I would be very angry at anyone who decided to just pick apart a piece of my writing publicly without my permission.  It's very rude - but obviously you don't have a problem being rude to people.  "screw you" is your response? Seriously? Yeah you're real mature and a prime example of how professional writer's should act... whatever.  I'm done with this ridiculous conversation.  Have a lovely day.

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          Misfit Chickposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          Oh shut UP... if you believe that this is the ONLY way or TIME I've ever complained about this topic, you're mistaken. It is the REASON WHY I brought it out so plainly and openly into the forums. And YEAH, I'm REALLY GLAD that YOU are done with this conversation. Overly-sensitive people like you probably should even TRY to be a writer, LoL! Oh, I'm sorry... was that too MEAN? Have a LOVELY day, too.

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             Misfit Chickposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Woops... allow me to correct my own bad writing... that word should be 'shouldn't' as opposed to 'should'.

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    Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

    @Millionaire Tips Yes, that was one of the suggestions in a previous comment of mine that we ALL really liked... Hubpages staff should ALERT Hubbers when their article is going to be highlighted so that they WILL give it one more look over to improve it. Hubpages could send out a form letter with a few generic improvement suggestions that could/would apply to any article. It doesn't have to be NOR was this article MEANT to be a bad thing.

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       neosurkposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       @Misfit Chick
       I applaud your move to post this discussion in the forums because it REALLY is all about HubPages' staff not being careful in EDITING and REVIEWING the HotD hubs. The best thing anyone can do is stop accusing you of publicly criticizing a hub because you are NOT. You are publicly criticizing HubPages' review policy and I am surprised that people are not "getting" the main picture.
       
       To anyone who does not get it, here is how I understood the original post: HubPages editors did not review the hub properly. Tori could have updated the mistakes if HP had given her the heads up. Even if Tori hadn't approved HubPro, HP staffs could have simply edited the typos.
       
       All MisfitChick has said is that there's mistake on the side of HP editors, she did not accuse Tori of making mistakes because she clearly understands that we can make mistakes. I have yet to see any statement by Mis Chick that belittles Tori's hub.
       
       See the whole picture! It's not MisChick who spotlighted a hub, it's HP who did it.

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    Mark Ewbieposted 8 years ago

    The biter bit.  Most people who get a HOTD are not expecting it and there is a sense of panic to make it half-decent now that everybody can see it.
    
    That is why I make sure I keep my quality level just below that of any stellar business.  It's safer that way.

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       Misfit Chickposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Good advice, always.

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    Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

    @Millionaire Tips Your image applies to houses and people's own personal baggage - not writing.

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       Millionaire Tipsposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Actually, it is a quote that was used in a similar forum post about writing. It's a metaphor. It means you should work on your own mistakes before criticizing others. 
       
       By the way, since you said you welcome feedback, you used "it's" incorrectly. It is not a possessive - it is a contraction.  I learned recently that I was making this mistake and have since fixed it in my new writing.

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    johndwilliamsposted 8 years ago

    I'm just going to grab my bag of Pop-Corn this is going to be fun

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    LuisEGonzalezposted 8 years ago

    I think that every time we post a hub, we open ourselves to criticism, whether it is designated as a HOTD or not.
    
    If someone finds faults with it and tells me privately or publicly it does not matter to me since I should have done a better job of catching the "errors" before I published it.
    
    I see posts as this one as someone trying to point some things out to me and in a way helping me out.  I rather have a Hubber catch them before an outside visitor does and comes away with a bad impression of the site.
    
    So in my humble opinion the faster the errors are fixed no matter how I became aware of them the better.

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       PegCole17posted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Luis, I think it's great that you have a strong sense of self esteem. Not many people can stand up to criticism however nicely worded it is. When we receive back a school paper excessively filled with red marks, long winded notes and notations of errors along with a big red F across the top, it doesn't inspire most to do more. Sure, it points out our errors, but at the cost of our ego.
       I would much prefer a quiet and polite email from a concerned person who has found a mistake on my work rather than have it posted for all to see in the forums. I admit to bringing errors found in the LC to the attention of staff and I firmly regret doing so for my lack of courtesy.
       To each his/her own. You're right about catching these mistakes before outside eyes view them.

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       Millionaire Tipsposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       I think the issue here is that the Hubber in question may not even see this criticism, and definitely sees it AFTER all other people are aware of her errors. Also, we don't know what else she is going through right now.  Piling more on top of that is plain mean.  A private email to give her a chance to correct the issues, when she has time, would definitely have been more appropriate.

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          LuisEGonzalezposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          True that would have been a better method but I think the post is directed more at the failings of HP in catching these than at the author.

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    t aaron brownposted 8 years ago

    I like the idea of an editor/team providing some finish work before showcasing an article. It's mutually beneficial. Maybe they can only afford to do this for one article a day.  At another site I contribute to, we do recieve editorial oversight and some minor work for every article. We also get syndicated more often too. It's nice to see your headline all over the net.
    
    I am new here. I can immediately identify that the writer is left a bit more to self promotion and lone rangering it.

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    t aaron brownposted 8 years ago

    I also prefer my mark-ups transmitted privately, rather than by forum. My worst experience was a "professional" editor trying to solicit and showcase their ability. They put edits in my comment section instead of emailing me. I will not use them for my future book needs.

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    John Dyhouseposted 8 years ago

    Shouldn't "ALOT" be written "A LOT". The former is not a word in my dictionary.

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    Valeantposted 8 years ago

    Grammar police, everyone has a badge.

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    LindaSmith1posted 8 years ago

    Personally, I didn't like the hub because it was just too long.  But, I bet this forum post sure increased the traffic for it.

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       Marcy Goodfleischposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       If anyone has a link to the hub, please forward it to me privately - I will gladly read her HOTD and congratulate her on it. 
       
       This thread saddens me - I agree that constructive criticism should be given privately.  If someone has an issue with how the site chooses the HOTD, that should also be offered privately, or pointed out in general terms rather than using a specific example.

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          Writer Foxposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          I agree with your post, Marcy, but I usually do agree with you!  Here's the link:
          http://hubpages.com/hub/Home-DIY-The-Co … a-Beginner
          
          It's really an excellent Hub and that's why I posted the link here.

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             Marcy Goodfleischposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Thanks, Writer Fox!  I read the hub, and I agree - it's outstanding & very useful.  I posted a reply & then thought the reply hadn't been entered right, so I posted again (oh well!). 
             
             Meanwhile - I shared her hub on Facebook, which I rarely do. It's so useful and so well written. Very deserving of the HOTD!

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                LuisEGonzalezposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                Marcy, this still doesn't take away from the fact that HP should do a better job in and how HOTD's are chosen.

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                   Marcy Goodfleischposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                   Perhaps so, Luis, but this hub and this writer did not deserve to be the platform for that criticism. There are more issues and errors in various posts on this thread than in the HOTD that was singled out in the OP.
                   
                   My post was meant to compliment the HOTD, not to discuss how they're chosen.

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                      LuisEGonzalezposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                      Agreed. But put yourself in the place of a new visitor who sees the Hub (any Hub for that matter) and finds about 23 spelling and grammar errors and specially on an HOTD which are supposed to be "best" samples on the site, the visitor may leave HP thinking that the quality of the work here is nothing to brag about and may or may not return.
                      
                      I think the original post was intended specifically to address HP's lackluster effort to prevent these kinds of mistakes (by using a real sample HOTD) rather that picking on a particular hubber in the first place (although it does).
                      
                      I would have "shown" the errors without naming anyone or better yet, would have sent an email to that author first.

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                         Marcy Goodfleischposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                         Luis, you are correct that there are two separate issues here.  I'm sure the writer (if she sees this thread) might check for some needed edits.  The tone of the thread at the start reminds me of a great line from the play Greater Tuna - "Glass houses!"

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                         Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                         Also, there is the jab at the writing style - "too wordy" that I object to.  Sending a polite email - "Heads up; you have a couple of grammatical errors," is one thing. Announcing to the world that someone has a poor writing style is unkind at best. 
                         
                         This is not the first time the OP has openly criticized someone's style.  Last time it was "boring writing." I would be mortified for my writing style to be autopsied in public in this manner.

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    colorfuloneposted 8 years ago

    I would have missed that excellent HOTD, if it wasn't for this thread highlighting it. Tori did a great job on the hub, I voted it up and shared it on Twitter. I could smell the smells, hear the sounds, and feel the delight the writer had when her beautiful table was finished.
    
    I have been writing online for about 7 years.
    I have a proof reader for everything I publish.
    Do I make mistakes? Yes.
    Does my proof reader make mistakes? Yes. <3

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       Marcy Goodfleischposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Nicely stated, Colorfulone!  I agree - no matter how much I proofread something, I can miss typos or other errors. 
       
       Glad you shared that hub on Twitter!  I need to see if I can still get into my Pinterest account - the hub is perfect for that site!

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          sallybeaposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          I agree, good job on the hub, shared on Twitter and on Pinterest.
          Lets make a point of being nice to one another in the year 2015 - hell no, lets be nice to one another until the end of  year 2014 as well.

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             LuisEGonzalezposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             The only time you should spell “let’s” with an apostrophe is when it means “let us”: “Let’s go to the mall.”
             
             If the word you want means “allows” or “permits,” no apostrophe should be used: “My mom lets me use her car if I fill the tank.”................LOL.......Just having fun with you sallybea since I often make horrendous mistakes myself!

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                sallybeaposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                Thanks Luis my sincerest apologies, slip of the old fingers there. Hope you have a great Christmas.

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                   LuisEGonzalezposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                   

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                      sallybeaposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                      Thanks Luis, that was sweet.

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          colorfuloneposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          One of my titles for a coloring book once read "Unicorn Cook Book" for at least a year. I did feel silly when I noticed that.

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             Writer Foxposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Unicorns are Kosher.

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    jeffryvposted 8 years ago

    A classic run-on sentence (Wordy )
    
    "It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness, it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity, it was the season of Light, it was the season of Darkness, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair..." from A Tale of Two Cities
    
    The two time Pulitzer prize winning author William Faulkner had terrible grammar.
    http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/1986-0 … ote-novels

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       Marcy Goodfleischposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Great point, Jeffry - there are other examples of award winning writing that violates standard usage, but you've made the point better than I could.
       
       The HOTD has some terrific information in it, and the writer covered a ton of details and helpful tips.

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       Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       A Tale of Two Cities was Charles Dickens - am I missing something?

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          Writer Foxposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          I think he was using Dickens as an example of being 'too wordy' and Faulkner as an example of grammar/spelling.

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             Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Okay - I did miss that lol. Not a big Faulkner fan.

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    LuisEGonzalezposted 8 years ago

    BTW...................................
    

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    Marcy Goodfleischposted 8 years ago

    That's a sweet sentiment, Luis!  I didn't repost it -  (it's huge!), but I agree - best wishes to all Hubbers and all Staff!

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    Len Cannonposted 8 years ago

    I hope I never get awarded a HOTD so I don't have to have a forum thread devoted to every typo  or non-standard word usage in the article.

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       Writer Foxposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Sadness.

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    Dressage Husbandposted 8 years ago

    Winston Churchill when told prepositions could not go at the end of a sentence said.
    
    "That is a statement up with which I will not put!"
    
    It all goes to show that grammar rules in English are merely guidelines and that often times something can be stated more effectively by changing things up a bit.

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       colorfuloneposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Winston Churchill, and so many others had a nice way of putting things, that flew into the faces of the self elected moral majorities of one. Did they get it?

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    CassandraCaeposted 8 years ago

    Ha ya know you really should not throw stones at glass houses.  One quick look at your hubs from just your profile page --- most of your titles are really long and wordy,   I found 2 misspelled words, and you ask questions often without a question mark....so yeah that's just in the little blurbs on your profile. I am sure your hubs are full issues and you should tidy your own yard if you are so worried about the quality of the site.

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    LongTimeMotherposted 8 years ago

    Hello Misfit Chick.
    
    A couple of years ago I received an email from a very helpful HP staff member (Simone) who told me one of my hubs had been nominated as HOTD. She requested some changes. As I recall, I was asked to move a list from the bottom to a higher position plus I think she suggested I split a lengthy section into two separate capsules.
    
    Since Simone's departure from HP, I've not received any advance warning of HOTD. Suddenly it just appears on the feed page. On one occasion I didn't visit HP at all on the day and remained unaware until I saw the comments later - with congratulations. Sadly, that hub included a typo. Nobody commented on it, but I had noticed it and intended to make the change ... of course, I'd have fixed the hub more promptly if I'd known it was going to be HOTD.
    
    I just took at a look at the HOTD you mentioned. (Thanks, Writer Fox, for the link.) I have to say it is a remarkably good hub. All those helpful lists and tips, plus heaps of original, helpful photos. It must have taken a long time to compile the hub ... but it is an evergreen topic and will undoubtedly attract traffic and be useful for readers for many years - so I'm sure her effort will be rewarded.
    
    Sure, there's a few improvements that could be made - but compared to many other hubs, that one's a real winner. I don't understand why you chose that hub for your example. If all Tori's hubs are as strong and original as the one we've been discussing, she'll be a very successful hubber.
    
    It would be great if HP assigned someone to email potential HOTD authors with suggestions the way Simone did (or at least so the hubber could do their own last-minute edit). Tori obviously didn't make any last-minute changes. The hub was last updated in March, her last comment was 5 months ago, and there's no indication of any recent activity on her account.
    
    She is probably unaware that her hub was made Hub of the Day.
    
    So then I went and took a look at one of your hubs, Misfit Chick. It was a helpful hub about mattresses. There's a few improvements that could be made on it, but the impression I'm left with from that single hub is that you, too, could be a very successful hubber.
    
    Anyway, here's my tip for you, Misfit Chick, (and every other hubber.) Quickly take a really close look at all your hubs ... just in case they appear unannounced on our feed pages!
    
    

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       a beautiful messposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       The Hubber (Tori) is my sister, and she does know that she had HOTD. However, she doesn't do much browsing on the boards. I've been debating telling her about this thread, since it seems to be revolving around her awesome hub. The support for her is great, but I doubt she'd appreciate the original post and the negativity that spurred from it.

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          rebekahELLEposted 8 years agoin reply to this

            I see no reason to point out the thread to her.  Threads like this that attempt to 'help' the site hurt real people.  I didn't read this whole thing, but hopefully her HOTD has received a lot of views and helped those interested in her topic.  I imagine that most people who even find the HOTD are hubbers and not someone randomly visiting the site.

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          Barbara Kayposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          Please don't tell her about this forum post. It will hurt her feelings and ruin her confidence in her writing.

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    Marcy Goodfleischposted 8 years ago

    Just a quick invitation to everyone - if you haven't done so already, and you're reading this, be sure to read the HOTD in question! I hope Tori gets a ton of views from this thread.  Writer Fox posted a link to it on one of the earlier pages (thanks, WF - I enjoyed reading the hub and have posted it on  FB!).
    
    Meanwhile - as LongTimeMother said, we used to have more interaction with staff.  I think they do the best they can now to keep up with a changing landscape on the Web, though, and I appreciate their help.
    
    Maybe they can consider your point about contacting a writer ahead of time in case he/she would like to review a hub just before it's posted as the HOTD.  Sometimes information can be updated, and of course there are always the stray typos we didn't catch the first dozen times we worked on it!

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    daisydayzposted 8 years ago

    'BE a decent writer' surely?

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    Dressage Husbandposted 8 years ago

    I think that the best way of commenting on a Hub with issues is to privately E Mail the author. That way they can either take it on board or not as the case may be. They will also not have to suffer the public scrutiny and discussion like the one on this thread.
    
    Some of the comments here are too personal to have been brought out in public and the writers should have used more discretion. However I am sure we all sometimes over react to things and over time will learn to leave the trivial alone.

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    Dale Hydeposted 8 years ago

    I can not believe I just read all of this!  Must be due to the rain and cold weather on this Sunday.
    
    Private messages are the way to go.

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       Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       haha. Yeah. Handling something in private instead of ripping them apart in public is always the way to go Dale. Good thinking.

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          Writer Foxposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          

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             rebekahELLEposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Yeah, that was a good one.   
             
             @those referring to HP as a content farm - according to definition, it isn't.  HP needs to continue to tighten the reins and it needs to start at sign-up.

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          Dale Hydeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          Your continued attack of me in various posts is being noted.  As to your reference, I have messaged people prior to posting the famous thread you have alluded to in one of your other posts.

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             Cardisaposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Dale, in all honesty the remark was one of sarcasm rather than an attack. I can't speak for other posts, but this one didn't seem like an attack to me.

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             Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Oh.

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    Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

    I agree, but again... most people COMPLETELY missed the point about this original post. That's why it got so dumb and long.
    
    Private messages ARE the way to go... Which is WHY I suggested a couple of times, including MONTHS ago; that Hubpages add a way for VALID critical feedback from probably pre-approved 'peer-editors' who have proven themselves to be capable... To be able to add more specific details for writers in helping them to improve their Hubs SHORTLY after they are written and WHILE going through the QA process.
    
    Yeah, thanks to all who chose to pick on the most ridiculous thing and make SUCH a big STUPID deal out of it. I hope to GOD this is the last comment on this post.

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    Nick DeGeorgeposted 8 years ago

    Misfit chick
    
    hubpages is an article farm not a writing site so as long as a piece has ads where they make money they are happy . This is not a creative writing site so the next great authors will not be found here. There is no need to critique anyone as the hub scoring and hubber score are for that purpose although they do not work well.
    
    Writing a 1000 hubs does not make anyone a peer editor. The editorial process is a career job where you need experience in that profession. Writing articles about building boxes does not make you either a writer or qualified as an editor.
    
    Thus leave it alone for this site is about making money not about writing.

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       fpherj48posted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Nick...I couldn't disagree with you more.  It is both outrageous and insulting to refer to Hp as an "article farm!"   Hubpages is most certainly a writing site for any number of extremely talented and quite successful writers.  Authors a-plenty are found here...unless you are simply not paying attention!   
       To highlight just a handful of the many:  Mike Friedman, Maria Jordan, Vincent Moore, William Holland, Gail Sobotkin, Sunnie Day, Alastar Packer, Vicki Warner, Shauna Bolling....the list goes on and on. 
       Whether or not there is a NEED for critiques, the vast majority of us do give feedback to one another, encouragement and support.
       The issue with this particular hub is that many feel it was done in possibly the wrong way.
       Just what is it that makes you presume that several of our  fellow hubbers are not experienced in the editorial profession and have not most surely been through the process of developing this career,  Professional qualifications abound on this site and it is disingenuous of you to assume otherwise.   many have been journalists, literary experts, creative writing Professors and writers of magazine articles and newspaper reporters.
       Finally, I question as to whether many will agree with your statement that "this site is about making money..not about writing"  !!   this site is by it's very nature about WRITING and so very much more than "making money.'
       Nick, your comment is not only a mere uninformed opinion, it is assuming, insulting and rude.   
       An apology from you is in order, but somehow I doubt you possess the ego-control to offer one.......In honor of the coming New Year, you may want to consider getting over yourself.    Resolution time, Nick.

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    Pawpawwritesposted 8 years ago

    Wow! After reading all off this, I suddenly want to unpublish my hubs and throw away my keyboard.

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    LindaSmith1posted 8 years ago

    HP is a content farm, article farm, however you want to put it according to Google.

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       fpherj48posted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Linda, Thank you so much for your comment.  It may prove helpful and/or accurate to some.... I choose not to accept nor foster that description....whether it comes from Google, the Bible, encyclopedia, Wall Street or Obama.  Google is not the God they think they are.
       I'm an independent thinker and most definitely intelligent and free enough to form my own translations.    Have a Great New Year....

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    LindaSmith1posted 8 years ago

    Fine, but HP is a content farm.  Even if Pulitzer Prize winners were here, it would still be a content farm.

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       Cardisaposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Hubpages is not a Content Farm. A content farm refers to websites that "employs" freelancers/people to write for them OR a website that aggregates large amount of low quality content specifically for back-linking and page rank purposes. HP does neither of those practices.

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          Barbara Kayposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          I agree. That is the definition.

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          makingamarkposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          That's not Google's definition. It's never provided one. What follows really ought to be a debate in a separate thread - but given the misinformation.......
          
          The first Panda update of the Google algorithm - that's the one which took out HubPages in 2011 - was very clearly aimed at sites with shallow and/or low quality content.  At the time these were characterised as "content farms" by many people.
          
          In the context of "employing" writers, you might want to think about whether a site pays its writers or not rather than whether or not it pays them a fee for an article - and read this article http://allthingsd.com/20110301/amid-con … ters-more/ (BTW - that is clearly now dated - but before remonstrating about what HubPages is and is not, try looking at it from another party's perspective. It's always educational.)
          
          Bottom line WHO produces the content is neither here nor there.
          
          All Google is interested in is
          * whether or not a domain has quality content or
          * whether there is too much content that doesn't make the grade.
          
          The fact that a domain might also have decent writers does nothing to mitigate Google's unhappiness when it wants to tweak its algorithm.

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    Nick DeGeorgeposted 8 years ago

    Thank you Linda it seems Google agrees with me on the status of hubpages. I resent that you feel Miss FPHERJ48 that you are the only one entitled to an opinion last I saw this country still allowed diverse opinions.
    
    I will prove my point...
    The  best authors in the world would rate poorly here why..
    No pictures, videos or maps.. Books such as Hunger games, Game of Thrones etc the authors would have been frustrated and left.
    
    Why is it I have a hub of 3500 words and it rates a 75 but when I split it into two parts they now rate an 85 simply more article real estate.
    
    I look at the top five hubs they are all how to, recipes, history of this or that. All already well documented. How many pumpkin pie recipes do we need. Or how to buy the best ski equipment this is writing to you? Then you should read some more.
    
    I have not seen one piece of creative writing ever make hub of the day why? because people cant search new fiction writing so it has no value to hubpages. Read all the articles on how to make money on hubpages its all about picking a niche, checking adwords and keywords this is not writing it is advertising.   
    
    I see forum discussion over and over about how much money hubs made not one on creative stories, life events and break through new books. How can you post a fiction work when you need photos and videos?
    
    Further to prove my point  I took hubs off my main account where hubpages rates me as an 84 hubber score and reopened a new account just applying the words How To in front of the titles instantly hubs that were 69 are now 85 and that score in four days went to 89!
    
    This is not writing, I examined someone with a 100 Hubber score all the articles are about Seattle the construction of the space needle etc. I am pretty sure these have been written before as they are articles researched from other sources. I have read hubs which are all regurgitated Wikipedia information with neither insight or commentary yet that author is rated 95.
    
    The next Tolkien is not here. This is about making money from providing research useful to other people not creative writing. I also dislike the forums because of people such as yourself who are quick to attack people for their opinions. If anyone is demeaned it is yourself.

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       Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Very good points. I have many times thought it would be nice to see a creative story make it to HOTD, but assumed for obvious reasons, it will never happen. Maybe someday things will change.

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          Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          You need to republish your superhero/batgirl/hubscore poem. It was brilliant, and all new comers and oldies will enjoy it!
          
          I don't expect my hubs to ever be considered HOTD. That's okay with me.  I think some of my hubs give people ideas - some are very specific to a small niche; I am good with not being HOTD. If others find them useful and I get views, then I am happy. I don't need to win a Pulitzer Prize for my hubs; I just want people to have some fun and enjoy some new ideas.

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             Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Thank you ma'am. You're too kind. I will see if I can find it, but I think it was lost in my hasty exit. lol

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                Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                That would be tragic.

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                   Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                   Tragic like when you run out of toilet paper, but not tragic like famine or flood. lol

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    LindaSmith1posted 8 years ago

    Haven't got time for children.  All of the writing sites like HP, Wizzley, Infobarrel, Ezine articles etc, etc are CONTENT FARMS.

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    Nick DeGeorgeposted 8 years ago

    Agree Linda which is why I rarely participate here.

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    psycheskinnerposted 8 years ago

    While "farm" is a derogatory phrasing Hubpages is very much a content site. That is: multiple contributors, covering all topics, and advertising supported with a relatively low payment amount relative to standard freelancing. Content sites key goal is not backlinking, it is making an aggregate profit for the owners across a large number of contributing writers most of whom only earn modest amounts. I.e. Examiner, info barrel, answers, etc etc

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    Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

    ONE more time... I wasn't playing 'word cop' NOR was I picking on ANYONE' HotD. If you just can't grasp what I WAS trying to do, then it is obviously lost on you. I really can't believe Hubpages didn't delete this entire post since it got so stupid.

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       Uninvited Writerposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       You WERE attacking a HUBBER on a PUBLIC forum. YOU are the one who is DEFENSIVE.

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       jeffryvposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Then please explain YOUR title of this topic.
       
       "Another Hub of the Day rant... but this time, I'll spell it out:"

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    Sed-meposted 8 years ago

    Maybe now that she has heard from nearly every hubber on Hubpages we can take her noose off, eh?

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    Sed-meposted 8 years ago

    Remember when public executions were a form of entertainment?
    Someone would make some kind of mistake and the whole town would gather to watch them hang by the neck for their crimes until dead. Hard to imagine that wasn't that long ago.
    

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       Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       We call them movies now...

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          Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          I just watched Magic in the Moonlight, and as much as I am Not a fan of Woody Allen, it was a really good movie.

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             Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             I haven't seen it, so I believe you are off topic.  You should now watch Love and Death followed by Crimes and Misdemeanors. Throw Manhattan in for good measure as well.  Oh, and Annie Hall has a nice lobster scene in it too.
             
             However, if we are going for mindless murder of and by the masses, forget all of the foregoing and just watch Dr. Strangelove, or How I Learned to Love the Bomb.  That's Entertainment!

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                Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                No, no. I know he's made some good movies... it's the whole marrying his underage daughter thing that I don't like. But Im weird like that. I hope this doesn't cause a controversy within a controversy. I don't think we have enough nooses, do we?

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                   Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                   Yeah - that's why I included Manhattan - that and the accusations by his own daughter of real molestation.  His current wife was Mia Farrow's adoption, and they never lived under the same roof.  In fact I don't think Woody and Mia ever lived in the same household; they lived across the park from each other. Mia has 156M adopted children, so he was bound to marry one of them.

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                      Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                      lol... is that how you see it? It was a neighbor thing more than a relative thing?
                      Well what about the fact that he was a hundred and two and she was like 18?
                      He was her mother's (icky) lover. What happened in her little life that made that seem desirable? That breaks my heart. Surely there was a sweet young boy out there who would have loved her well. Being adopted, she might have had father issues... I guess she had no dad, it makes sense, but what is his excuse? He should have left her alone to be happy and well adjusted. There are not a lot of ppl I don't like, but if anyone is on the list, he is.

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                         Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                         Indeed, Manhattan creeped me out, since he was in his 40's and Mariel Hemmingway was 18, and he jerks her around throughout the movie.  He is always a creepy guy.

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                            Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                            I watched something so interesting the other day. I think it was streaming on Netflix. It was called Running from Crazy, a documentary by Mariel Hemmingway. I knew very little about them, except the basics. It was actually quite interesting and it stayed with me... maybe it was the crazy part. IDK.

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                               Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                               I have seen that documentary too.  Very sad about their  affinity for suicide; as though it was something they ought to do, a family heritage.

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                                  Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                                  You get the feeling, watching it, that she's definitely in for a long distance run, but you feel proud of her for living clean. God willing, it will be a saving grace for her. I hope her daughters learn from her.

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                                     Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                                     +1

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    Marcy Goodfleischposted 8 years ago

    I'll vote for Silence of the Lambs, if we are referring to content that reflects this thread.
    
    Looking for a picture of a dead horse.  Can't find one.

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       Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Isn't that from the Godfather?

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       Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       I think I am the only person in America who hasn't seen that movie. It looked too dark to me.

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          Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          Godfather 1 is not dark; it is strangely uplifting and optimistic.  GF2 however is very dark.  They rank in my top 5 movies as a single work.  GF3 was garbage.

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             Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Interestingly, we have come full circle - the fellow that gets a horse head in his bed is a child-molesting film producer. lol

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                Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                I guess you have to see Godfather to get that, but it sounds right either way.

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             Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             haha. I was actually talking about Silence of the Lambs, but I haven't seen any of the Godfathers either. I don't like mafia movies. I don't like movies where the bad guys are the stars. I did love The Untouchables though, but that's b/c the good guys win.

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                Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                I have seen Silence of the Lambs probably over 100 times.  I was a bartender in a hotel, and the bar-backs looped the movie from the  hotel room cinebox onto the Oyster Bar Sports TV.  I watched it 3 times a day every shift.  Still a great movie and while dark, (Spoiler Alert) the good guys win.

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                   Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                   They made a 2nd one with a different actress, right?

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                      Solarasposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                      It was written as a trilogy. The first one, Red Dragon, used the Atlanta High Museum as the crazy house lol.  The next one, Silence of the Lambs, was excellent - with Jody Foster and Anthony Hopkins.  The third one was ridiculous, I think they replaced Foster with Julianne Moore - more cannibalism.  Only number 2 was worth looking at.

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                         Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                         Oh yeah... Alec Baldwin, right? Anyway... I don't see a lot of movies like that.

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    Misfit Chickposted 8 years ago

    @Uninvited Writer I WAS NOT!!! Re-read the post from the beginning!! HUBPAGES PLEASE DELETE THIS THREAD, I'M BEGGING YOU!

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       Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Misfit Chick... please don't let this get to you. I don't think you meant this the way many have implied, but even if you had, it is certainly not the worst thing to happen... it has happened several times before and it will probably happen again.
       
       Ppl have a tendency to allow things to snowball. It's not enough for one person to reprimand you, as a matter of fact, it wouldn't satisfy some if 20 ppl reprimanded you. In 6 years someone will revive this thread and it will all start over again. It is meaningless, please don't take it seriously.
       
       Receive any well meaning advice that you find applicable and the rest... flush it. Do the best you can, as often as you can for as long as you can. I'm sure you're a very nice person. This place, like any forum, is a snowball environment... if it wasn't you, it would be someone else. Let it go and they will run out of fuel. Take heart... know that there are a lot more ppl here who didn't add to the negativity than did. Move on... it really will be ok. That which doesn't kill us makes us stronger, right? Hang in there, this will just be an unpleasant memory soon. I promise.

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          LongTimeMotherposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          Might be helpful if you stopped chatting on this thread, Sed-me.
          
          You wrote "Maybe now that she has heard from nearly every hubber on Hubpages we can take her noose off, eh? smile" ... and then you promptly posted a public execution photo that inspired 24 unnecessary (and unrelated) comments - each of which sent a notification to hubbers' feeds and emails, drawing more attention to this thread.
          
          That's not counting the batch of 5 earlier comments including your one that read "Tragic like when you run out of toilet paper, but not tragic like famine or flood. lol"
          
          If you'd like to stop the snowball effect, I suggest with respect that you chat somewhere else.
          
          Misfit Chick should not be feeling like she has to beg for HP to delete this thread. If we all just stop posting on it, it will drop off the radar.

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             Sed-meposted 8 years agoin reply to this

             Shhhh. Be nice.

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       Writer Foxposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       An old story is told about a man who spread vicious gossip about someone with the intent of destroying his good reputation and turning others against him.  In later years he felt remorse for his evil actions and turned to a rabbi seeking a way of redemption and relief for the torment in his own soul.
       
       The rabbi advised him to apologize publicly to the man whose character was assaulted and to ask him for forgiveness. 
       
       "However," said the rabbi, "to repair the damage you have caused, take a feather pillow, cut it open, and scatter the feathers to the winds." The man thought this was a strange request, but it was a simple enough task, and he did it gladly.
       
       When he returned to tell the rabbi that he had done it, the rabbi said, "Now, go and gather the feathers. Because you can no more make amends for the damage your words have done than you can recollect the feathers."

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    Thelma Albertsposted 8 years ago

    Wow! How I wish there is  a dislike and like  in this forum so I only have to click it. I hope the said hubber is not upset now for the public criticism. Now I am scared if one of my hubs will  be HOTD. Happy  New  Year 2015 ahead to  all here at HP!

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    Mark Ewbieposted 8 years ago

    This thread reminds me of a tale about an old rabbit.
    
    When he saw the young rabbit being rude about the farmer and his writing he called him over.
    
    "You *?!* piece of &*£#" he said to the youngster and he told him to get a pillow.  The young one hopped off and returned with a carrot.
    
    I can't remember the conclusion but it was quite apt.

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