I've been wondering about this. A friend of mine who is married to a psychiatrist believes that some people are depressed because that is what they choose to believe.
I'm rather startled by this remark seeing as my fiance suffers from Bipolar disorder and it is nearly impossible to maintain a good mood if the anti-deppressants are not taken.
I also have a friend who goes on and off the pills according to her mood. So this leaves me confused....
Is it really an illness or is it a wrong state of mind
And going on and off pills can lead to some serious problems.
I believe there are many kinds of depression and yes, there are people who are depressed for no other reason than that is what they choose to be. These are generally people who are lacking a form of hope for their future, or who see everything in a negative light. If you ask me, I think ALL people have suffered this sort of depression at one point in their lives. I know I have. But being that it was a state of mind depression, it was easy to snap out of it and start seeing the light again.
Having said that however, there are also many types of depression that are chemical, hormonal, environmental, hereditary, etc. There is no way to generalize depression.
Yes, she's right, we can't generalize depression because there are lots of causes, and certainly we can't classify the causes/forms into only two. Love, commitment, family support and faith will be needed by someone in a relationship with bipolar depression.
It is overwhelming...it can not be categorized...but it is very serious. Like all ailments and each person's own existence...Their "Depression" experience is unique to them.
Careful with it...it is no game...it is very real. If the person chooses to believe a certain way and can not find a way out of it...what difference does it make "how" it is categorized?
It can still be an ailment to them...a very sick and debilitating one, too. (Especially...Over a long period of time).
Just last week...I heard over the radio a statistic of how many people are actually healed by anti-depressants...the figure is very low...if indeed people inflicted with depression are even healed by meds. I would doubt that anyone is healed through medication alone...period. (Some of those meds have been determined to be worse for the problem...than the problem...addiction to the med, suicidal thoughts, and hallucinations...have all been attributed to anti-depressants!)
However...to some degree...certain types of "Depression" can be cured with an overhaul of your mindset...but the person needs help or a boost to get to that level of being able to beat the depression...and then they need to be actually free of it completely... because the symptoms/mood will return most assuredly...as snow returns every winter to the mountains! They can not beat this thing on their own...otherwise they would have done it already. Bear in mind...they could have a chemical imbalance, something making their body sick...and I personally believe heredity plays a big role in "Depression".
You could be a reassuring voice to her and even may help aid her through bouts of depression with a "positive" upbeat approach to your world (although she does not need to depend on your "positive approach to your world"" to soak into her to feel better)...but you should read up on depression and the Bipolar Disorder to be aware of what it can do and all the symptoms. Make sure that you yourself don't go down this long and slippery slope...in the course of trying to help your fiance'. There's nothing worse than two depressed people together!
Trust me...Depression is nothing to take lightly...the good news is a person can overcome it with the "right" forms of treatment...which I personally believe must be tailored to them uniquely. For some it might be counseling...some it might be experiencing grief that they have bottled up...some it might be a more advanced condition...that needs highly specialized care...some might snap out of it with the proper train of thought that is re-trained into their thinking...some might be coupled with anxiety...Maybe a wrong was committed against them that brought it on...or they did something they can't forgive themselves for. Do some of these sound like weak excuses for depression? I highly doubt they do...to someone feeling the signs of depression...and they can't figure out why.
But Surely...I believe all signs of lengthy depression must be treated somehow...before someone goes down an even longer road of depression...and ultimately decides that later on...they would be better off being relieved of the burden...or in other words..."Dead"! Sorry to ramble on like this...but I had a few minutes to write...and I believe "Depression" is very bad...and underestimated as to its affect...obviously, from my own experience with it.
Don't worry about me turning this into a Hub...for anyone that reads it...I am copying it down to do just that...someday...
well some love misery, want other to be in it with them?
guess her observation may have merrit for some, not all.
My wife is bipolar (with many other challenges as well) and often depressed. In her case, some of it may be "wrong thinking", as she's managed now and then to fight through it without chemical help. However, there's no question that without prescription medication she has a chemical imbalance. Whether that's possible to correct completely through "right thinking" is an open question. One thing I do know is that when she's "on her meds", her attitude is day compared to being "night" when she's off of them.
And before someone jumps on this aspect of it: It's not addiction. I've seen her "off" medication for extended periods, here and there several months at a time...and when she does have her "magic pills", she's more likely to forget to take them than not. I'm satisfied that there's something going on inside that redhead's head that goes beyond bad attitude and imaginary friends.
However, it's quite possible that in the cases you describe, both things are true. Why would it have to be "just one cause"? Most likely, some folks can control depression through thinking, while for others the chemical imbalance is far too powerful to handle without help. We see it with heavy drinkers of alcohol--one individual can walk away and never look back, while another struggles for years and swears by 12 step programs, etc. Why should polarity (bi-or-not) be any different?
I do believe in my own opinion that it is a product of wrong mindset.When you have alot negative stuffs loaded in your mind,there is every tendency that it will result to depression or even high blood plessure.
So there is need for a person to watch the kind of words that he/she allows into his mind.Aviod doing businesses that are not legal,never plan evil again anybody,do not invest in any business that you are not sure of.
Finally,study you Bibles and always pray to God for help.if you can take note of these,you are sure to be free from depression.
So sorry, but your advice is crazy,
1. Bibles have zero to do with depression
2. I have actually got low blood pressure not high.
3. Everything I do is legal.
What you are saying is based on lack of experience, and not true, plus only your own opinion. Sorry, but I am being respectful here, and not abusive as many tend to be on forums. Simply facts.
I believe any logical mind is depressed to an extent. You can't live in the world we are in with happiness unless you blind yourself to our realities with faith. Only faith will let someone be happy in a logically fked up world.
I think the brain is hugely complex, and that no man is likely to understand it completely, ever!
There may well be cases that fall into both the categories you suggest, and I doubt most, if not all, psychiatrists can do brain surgery, nor are they any better than their original training, (possibly why I gave up on them long ago as a depression sufferer myself, I got fed up of them drawing incorrect conclusions and not believing me when I tried to explain why they were wrong).
Anyone on here who dismisses depression as merely a state of mind, is seriously operating a blanket judgemental system, that is unfair, and based on no personal medical qualifications, only opinions, (unless any brain surgeons or well respected Psychiatrists plan on posting here with their views).
I went to therapy every two weeks for 23 yrs. I also belonged to a group therapy where we learned to help each other.
I believe that clinical depression has to do with a chemical disorder that causes you to be that way. I also think, and this was contrary to my dr. thoughts, that sometimes people have a good reason to be depressed, and should be allowed to be sad if there is a reason for it. anti depressants in this instant would simply be covering up the symptoms.
Thirdly, I think there are people that like to be noticed or get attention by having various problems, that seem to come and go, depending on the effects. Some depression occasionally is normal I think.
I myself, say there are two types of Depression, personally from experience, the first is externaly based and is triggered by bad cicumstances around each person, such as losing a relative, burglary, accidents. when these happen to you one after the other in a short period, your mind gets low and cannot seem to remember anything good.It seems we tend to hang more too bad memories then good during those times. However this external Depression can be easily curable as circumstances eventually pick themselves up.
The second type, is something quite different and is not so easy too recover from, this is called "Clinical Depression" this is not as mind related as people believe, your body generally says I have had enough?
There is also said to be a chemical imbalance within clinical depression which means a person cannot seem to pick themselves up even in the best of circumstances.
I myself suffer from "Clinical Depression", believe me when I say its a horrid and debilitating illness.
If you would like more info about Depression or any help or advice, the best people to contact is the charity called "MIND"
Google this and you may be suprised at th symptoms behind theid illness..
Anyway, hope all this info isn't too Depressing!!!!
Take Care Alllll!
I think you are exactly right. There is situational depression and endogenous depression, with different treatments. The first keeps therapists in business and the second keeps psychiatrists and neurologists in business! (and hopefully any we utilize are helpful for their purposes!) Look at your family tree and if there are mental disorders/suicide/dysfunction that might now be recognized as depression or some other mental illness, I suggest you give that quite a bit of weight in evaluating your own situation...
The psychiatrists and psychologists do (for the most part) believe depression is a state of mind--something we choose to believe. They are wrong, as many types of brain scans, blood tests, and necropsies have proven.
There's the type of "depression" a person feels when something really bad happens, like someone dies or they're in an accident or something--that's like a really bad case of the blues that'll go away on its own over time.
It's not the same type of monster as "real" severe, treatment-resistant clinical depression that's caused by chemical and/or physical changes in the brain that the sufferer has no control over whatsoever.
When you think about it, if psychiatrists and psychologists believed the problem was physical they'd mostly be out of work--the neurologists (or whomever) would take over and fix the real physical problem(s). Nobody's too eager to prove themselves wrong.
And the drug companies are having a darn good time ensuring the depressed stay depressed. Medical practitioners don't have time because it's not financially viable to treat people with depression. Where as it takes 6 minutes to ask a few questions and write a prescription.
When you think about it, psychologists are perhaps the enemy of the drug companies as they at least attempt to get at the core of the chemical imbalance. Brain imbalances are created by many factors: bad diet, environment, stress and a dysfunctional mind caused by a dysfunctional society who are encouraged to remain dysfunctional because they know no different and too darn lazy to think outside the box. It has become normal to take a pill! God help this world quickly filling up with medicated zombies.
Possibly. Depending on the person. Their situation,. It is definately a mind and body disease. When the mind hurts the body will start. Lack of nutrition, execrise,. Takes a horrible toll.
I would probably defer to Dr's opinion, but I would venture to say that depression can be both a state of mind and an illness.
It's a Chemical Imbalance within the brain.
This is why certain medications can "create" depression. It's stops the production of the brain chemicals
Jon, it is much more complicate. Giving a name to something doesn't explain anything. A human being is not a chemical or a mechanical system, that's pretty clear, but the medical health system treats humans like this and gives a name to a misfunction and then tries to balance it with chemicals.Taking pills doesn't change the cause. Depressions are the result of accumulated disappointment and frustration and these are the reactions coming from the conditioned personality who doesn't find enough confirmation for ones self image in daily reality and so is hiding and suppressing ones expressions, mostly those of anger.
To heal the emotional imbalance it needs self responsibility and the urge and readiness to go beyond ones limited and trapped personality. It is necessary to relate and respond to ones daily life situations in a creative way and this can be possible when one sees happenings and conditions as a *challenge* and not feels as a victim.
There is much more to say about this and I might make a new hub out of answering your question, but meanwhile you can read my hubs that are already there, these will give you more information and show a way out of this stuck and miserable condition of a depression.
PS: My Web site deals mostly with my experience and way to deal in a creative way with difficult situations, not to fall into depression...
Clinical depression is a Chemical imbalance.
We are, as a matter of fact, made up of Chemicals. The Chemicals cause communication between different parts of the brain, etc. Reduced serotonin levels caused by stress, lack of sleep, exercise, and poor nutrition cause depression.
It is my belief from experience, that depression is a state of the soul that is not fully recognized and dealt with. we are spiritual beings and our soul is that part of us that is connected with all other aspects of our being.
One can not ever say that a particular illness is only about one thing...we are whole individuals of spirit, mental, emotional and physical being-ness that is directly correlated with our soul.
pharmaceutical drugs are suppose be intended to help, in any situation, in the transition from illness to wellness, not as the panacea, cure all to become dependent upon for the long term.
it is important for any one to recognize that the soul can get "sick" and that creates the other levels of illness that humans experience. address the soul and all other levels of existence and see where that takes you.
For instance, what is it about the soul that your girlfriend needs or wants to know...her soul will tell her if she asks her soul what she needs....
and while she gets to know her soul's needs, she can keep taking her anti-depressants or other alternative more natural things, see/ask her soul what changes in her diet, exercise, environment and relationships could be helpful...see the wholeness in addressing the issue
can you "go" with considering the soul in this way...do you understand? let me know... SJ
I am of the understanding that depression is many things. It is a chemical mixture. It is a hormonal imbalance. And, it gives people mood swings, possibly suicidial thoughts.
However, if you look at the underlying cause for depression, it actually has to do with one thing- peace of mind. I didn't state of mind. A state of mind, is being in and staying in a particular mind-set. Peace of mind, is security/safety for one's own being and that of any family member(immediate). The being "peace of mind", is a blanket of protection that tells them things are going to be alright. Things always have a way of working themselves out.
Should you believe that your life is falling apart, it might be that you are right, and that view is horrible, to say the least. But, how does stop the downward movement of their life, so as to stop the roller coaster ride they have been on most of their life. Many wonder how they could have a life like theirs and cannot find a reason for it happening?
Many have questions about their life, they are simply too scared to talk about, because they refuse to accept themselves. Each person dictates the path their moves, through effort and will.
Just a thought.
Well, you can forget that thought.
The underlying cause of clinical depression is a chemical imbalance.
What you might be thinking of is situational depression. Not the same thing at all.
Situational depression is a reaction to the circumstances around you. Loss of job. Marital problems. Death of a loved one.
Clinical depression isn't caused by your surroundings. It's a physical problem with your brain chemistry.
i think mild, infrequent depression is a reaction to stress or unhappy events in your life. severe chronic depression sounds like an illness.
Depression is a mental disorder clearly defined by the American Psychiatric Association in the DSM-IV.
Depression can be a serious illness with well-known precursors including genetic, social, chemical, and behavioral with devastating outcomes.
I haven't read all the posts here, but I am concerned about your question. Clinical depression is a disorder, not something that someone makes a decision to be in to or out of.
I hope others who posted to this thread have conveyed the same information to you.
Yes, Misha. But is it necessarily a bad thing?
economic depression as Karl Marx would say hehehe...It is not the consciuosness which determines the being, it is the being which determines the consciuosness.....
lol And the copious meds are helping to prop it up.
Both. You can definitely increase the severity of depression by irrational thinking. Some people who are depressed are almost catatonic, and I don't think this is simply due to bad thought patterns. The brain is a physical structure with electrical and chemical functions.
Depression is the leading cause of human suffering in the world. Just thought I'd throw that in.
That is because we have so much to be depressed about, I would say!
To answer the question asked though, I would say depression can be definitely caused by things like alcohol - that's a physical substance effecting us mentally. It is a known depressant. Unfortunately depressed people often drink a lot of it seeking to escape their depression but in fact making it worse.
I also believe that depressives tend to focus on bad stuff in their thought patterns and this leads to more of the same because they are not looking for the good things in life. In other words negative thinking has negative results and tends to create more to be depressed about.
Thanx for the rensponse guys!
Now i feel less confused about this.
I have another question though.
Is it true that a pregnant woman isnt allowed to take anti-depressants?
Its true that it is not studied enough to know what kind of effect they could have on the baby. but that is like all drugs of any types. ethically, no woman would ever want to be experimented on while pregnant, so there is a real lack of evidence of what meds can do to unborn babies.
Having said that, a doctor will have to weigh the implications of taking or not taking the medication. It is commonly referred to as 'the lesser of two evils'. Since "mothers" safety is first and foremost, the doctor will make a decision based on what he thinks themother needs to be safe and healthy. hope this helps.
There are a few antidepressants that are considered ok during pregnancy, but it also depends how serious the depression is and what trimester the pregnancy is in. I think the main one prescribed in pregnancy is amitriptyline.
http://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/mentalhealthin … sants.aspx
This is true. There is an element though, of maintaining the health of the mother to protect the baby. It is a thorny issue.
Since you can't conduct clinical trials on a developing fetus, there can't be any definitive studies regarding the risks of the drugs.
Medications fall into various classes and risks for taking during pregnancy and during breast feeding. Medications now come with the information printed out when the medication is dispensed from the pharmacy. Some medications fo fall into the category that they shouldn't be taken during pregnancy, but you need to check with your doctor/pharmacist about the specific medication. There are a lot of risks to patients going off medications for depression and bipolar disorders, those risks are often higher than the risk of taking the medications. Again check with your doctor and/pharmacist
My wife was diagnosed as Bi-Polar years ago, she does not take any pills and never seems to be any different to me, So I don't know.
Until you've lived in it, you'll never truly understand it. You can over come it but you need to be very motivated and many who suffer don't have that motivation. Its hard work everyday. Some days are hard, getting out of bed, showering, etc. Somedays are easier. My main focus is never to allow myself to go backward. I know the signs when I'm starting to slip & take action before the depression gets bad.
Depression is an illness like any other and should be treated as such. There's no 'snapping out of it'. Once the mind/brain is deprived of serotonin levels for so long due to problems, emotions, loss, or other things, it affects the whole body. It's like the brain uses it all up. Then it can't reproduce the serotonin fast enough so the result is depression. That's when anti-depressants like Prozac, Cymbalta, and Zoloft can benefit. It keeps the levels of serotonin to a more normal level. It's fascinating.....
I have depression. I thought I was going crazy and I was making everybody around me crazy. It affected me mentally and physically and I was really to stuborn to listen. It wasn't me! Well it was and once I got treatment I've felt and acted alot better. I was amazed how two pills aday could change my whole out look. I still get mad just not as bad or as long. I still have good days and not so good days but it's just not as overwhelming.
i have been diagnosed with major depression. i've also been diagnosed with bile reflux, and the two, i think are connected. unfortunately the bile reflux is worsening my depression because it has no cure. if i'm able to overcome my depression, will the bile reflux stop? somebody please help me
In 2005, my gallbladder was removed and from that moment forward my life became a nightmare. I was in permanent dyspepsia. I had a bile reflux and chronic gastritis. Finally, at the end of last year I found something that is truly helping me very much and I want to share with all of you –– should you be one who is having a similar problem.
TRIPHALA is the name of these wonderful vegetarian capsules. You Google this name and get information about it. I tried for years everything that my doctors told me to do from prescription drugs to anti-acids and many other medicines. Nothing worked for me until now. Hopefully you will benefit from Triphala and it will help you as much it is helping me.
My snap, standard answer is that depression is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain. Think about it. Why else would anti-depressants work? They correct the imbalances of some neurotransmitters.
However, I also know some people who have become depressed and were diagnosed with clinical depression due to a bad experience, such as a death. My depressions were never triggered by an event, but I've been told that my depression is largely chemical and it does run in my family. Apparently, some people can develop clinical depression after something bad happens like a death in the family or so forth, but I am not sure how that progresses from normal grief or feeling "depressed" to clinical depression which has physical and cognitive symptoms. Anyone know how that happens?
Hi Sheila, when something traumatic happens in one's life, generally they develop 'situational' depression. Clinical depression is really not related to events, it is indeed chemically based, and I don't believe situational can evolve into clinical. I've suffered from both, and there is a distinct difference which, of course, I can't really describe.
In my case it was stress. I think things in our world move so fast it's easy too feel overwhelmed and if you throw in kids and finaces look out! The main thing is to watch your friends and family and if you notice changes talk to them and really listen to what they say or don't say.
I also believe that it depends on the person and situation. I was diagnosed Bi-polar almost 3 years ago. Due to my history, when I got pregnant last year, my doctor and I decided that it was best for me to stay on my meds. However when my son was born we decided it would be best for me to stop taking them while nursing. My son is now 5 months old and I have not had any problems with being off my meds. But one big thing that helped me was reducing my stress level. Hope that helps with both questions!
I suffered from depression, anxiety and migraine headaches. The doctor after a long struggle convinced me to take paxil. It did for my anxiety what aspirin does for a headache. The paxil helped restore a normal balance of chemicals in my brain. I learned with this drug to find calm places and deal with stress in a more positive way.
After two years, I stopped taking paxil. I no longer had migraine headaches and I could control the depression and anxiety.
In some cases, it could be a chemical imbalance in the brain. This is why many antidepressants work. For others it could be more emotional rather than chemical as in, they struggle to deal with the day to day issues of life. Many people are helped by drugs alone, many are helped with therapy alone, some require both. But there is no, unfortunately, black and white answer for depression. Different triggers and severity of symptoms are found in different patients.
so in answer to your question, I would say both...and neither
Hi, Many people now-a-days are getting depressed due to mental tensions,family issues,financial problems. They are thinking about different aspects deeply. So one should over come of it by doing regular exercises. Exercises helps a lot in keeping the body and mind active & energetic.
Morning exercises impact a lot in our daily-routines. Spend with children they smiles gives you millions of dollars. I think you can understand better when you doing these things.
Come out of Depression
I have sufffered from severe depression and uncontrolled mood swings for years. Severe highs and severe lows both. While yes a bad experience can trigger some types of depression severe depression is a CLINICAL disorder that can be treated with,
1. Medication 2. Group and/or Individual therapy or a combination of both of those factors. Depression is not simply a 'woe is me' attitude. Some, such as myself, choose not to go the medication route, while others do and it helps the imblanaced feelings. I don't do medication because I have seen the effects it has on others and I have no desire to increase the severity of my symptoms. I, therefore, have to deal with out of control mood swings and sometimes uncontrollable episodes.
Depression is a state of mind.
If you can't control your mind, then you will succumb to depression.
If you can control your mind, your outlook never gets bleak enough to let depression to set in.
It's mind over matter.
As far as other diagnosis such as bi-polar and other various ailments, is just doctors over-inflating their importance and allowing the to push off more drug manufacturers prescriptions.
The dishonesty in America is deeply rooted and up-ended society.
The FEAR in America, generated by those who want to keep citizens separated is working overtime and ruining life.
It is ridiculous all the different diseases and mental illness have arrived in the last decade. I don't think anyone has even realize that no one has to be self-responsible for any action, because now it can be explained in some or other mental disorder.
I've been bi-polar for more than a decade
The issue I have here, is that there is an element of truth to what you say. In terms of the pharmaceuticals. But if you put it this broadly, you are lumping a lot of undeserving people into one big bad category.
In terms of being self responsible, that is a problem across all segments, not just us crazy folk. You will never hear me say that my disorder is the cause of anything I do or say. Period.
There is a big difference between "explanation" and "excuse". Again, this is true for any person regardless of mental health status.
How have you been, Ray?
your joking right? state of mind assuming it's based on all these other elements than chemicals in the brain? I'm damn well out of here.
Cagsil, the last decade? Have you ever heard of Edgar Allen Poe or Mary Todd Lincoln? Mental illness is not something new... look it up.
I am aware of how long mental illness has been around. The fact that I was pointing out is how many NEW illnesses(defined illnesses) have arisen in the last decade.
It seem like there are TOO many illnesses and not enough people for these illnesses.
Almost every person on the planet would be suffering from something or another.
Look around - open your eyes(other than your daily routine)- and you'll see what I mean.
depression is what you choose to believe. definetly not a disorder
I can agree with this statement from personal experience, but it depends on the circumstances that create an atmosphere of depression. Positive thinking is definitely beneficial, but the strength to use it comes from within. Some people don't have the necessary inner strength to control depression. It is much easier to say than do and if one has never experienced depression, extreme mood swings, or bouts of utter sadness and a sense of uselessness then they should not be commenting on the subject.
I also know that depression can occur from light deficiency. I become more melancholy/depressed when the sun doesn't shine as do many people.
I also have seen/known people who allow themselves to be swallowed up, so to speak, by negative thoughts. I don't think anyone truly knows the causes or cures and doctors do their best [or sometimes worst] to deal with patients often ending with prescribing drugs because they have no explantion.
One thing I do know for certain is that if someone you know starts to talk about taking their own life you shouldn't shrug it off as nonsense. This is often the first cry for help, even if they deny it.
Just read this thread as a person who has been signed off any kind of work by my GP for over two years. I know what I feel, I know it isn't right, and I know I didn't feel like this in my past, so why would anyone say it isn't real???
Signs of depression include inability to sleep! Guess what, it is after 06.42 am here and I haven't been to bed.
Needing excessive amounts of sleep when you do sleep, (I need at least 10 hours).
Getting emotional at things you never used to, e.g. documentaries etc.
Actually, to cut a very long saga short, these are the exact notes I gave my G.P.
"1) Whenever I close my eyes to go to sleep or have a nap, or I have no other distractions, I find my mind obsessively turning over and over all the bad experiences I have been through in my life, e.g. bereavements, violent partners, bullying, as well as current pressures, (such as having so much trouble getting pregnant, financial worries etc). Many of these memories go back to my schooldays and all the years that have followed. No matter how hard I try I cannot switch them off, and it is causing me to have trouble getting to sleep or relax. When I do finally sleep I have nightmares and very disturbing dreams and wake up feeling exhausted, stressed and depressed. As soon as I begin to wake up even slightly, my mind begins turning over and over the same traumatic events from my past, current worries and concerns, and before I know it I can't get back to sleep even though I still need more.
2) I find I need far more sleep than is normal, and unless I have at least 10-11 hours sleep I cannot function normally and feel exhausted and lethargic.
3) I am more emotional than I have ever been, and find myself in tears over the smallest things, such as a News article, a documentary, or reliving my own past memories or current worries.
4) In recent weeks I have found myself having what I can only describe as panic attacks, where I get the feeling of "a huge cold pit of stress or really bad butterflies" in my stomach, even when half asleep. I try changing positions in the bed, but it won't go away and makes me feel physically sick, (to the degree I have actually been sick on several occasions). I find the most comfortable way to deal with this is to tuck my knees up towards my stomach whilst lying on my back in the bed, but it is still there. This feeling has stayed with me when I have got dressed and gone downstairs, and I find my hands shaking and an overwhelming sense of dread at the thought of going out of the house to go to work or to be around people.
5) I am not interested in socialising unless it involves visiting my Mother and Step Father at their home, and will tend to avoid going out or make excuses. Even they are unaware of what I am going through and how I am feeling, and I would not want to worry them by telling them, especially as my Mother has enough health problems of her own right now, and tends to be a compulsive worrier by nature.
6) On the surface I appear to most people to be my normal cheerful self, but this seems to be out of my control, as if I need to be this way for them to like me, and only in private do my real feelings come to the surface. Even when I went for counseling in the past for depression, I found myself behaving very much like I was in a job interview, and unable to show much of my true feelings, or even be consciously aware of most of them whilst I was in that environment.
7) I am concerned that if I am diagnosed as suffering from depression it could affect the fertility specialist's willingness to treat me, be it with "Clomid" or any other treatment. I fear this would make things so much worse, as I really feel a deep seated "need" to have a baby, and am convinced this will change my life for the better and give me a sense of purpose, as well as fulfillment, even though I am under no illusions as to how much work is involved in bringing up a child. I am not sure how I will cope if ever it becomes apparent that I cannot get pregnant again having already been pregnant once after years of infertility, and then having chosen to terminate the pregnancy.
8) I was due to begin a new full time job on Monday, but feel unable to face this with the way I am feeling. I am certain I would not cope and that I would sink further into depression and exhaustion if trying to hold such a position whilst struggling with my emotions. It has become apparent that my best course of action is probably to withdraw my acceptance of the job offer and concentrate my efforts on sorting out my depression, and hopefully the fertility specialist can help me to get pregnant which would be a cause for great joy and would give me a far more positive outlook on life. I would like to be in a position to seek a suitable part-time job in the next month or two, but in the meantime I sincerely feel I would be more able to concentrate on getting my depression under control if I were to be signed off work and given the medical support I need to feel able to return to regular employment.
9) I do now feel a course of anti-depressants may now be the best option for me, and have only been reluctant to take them because of the risk of it affecting my fertility treatment, the willingness of the fertility specialist to treat me and the risk of my becoming too dependant on them, however I am willing to give them a try if you can, as my GP, reassure me about these concerns.
Guess what, When my most recent episode hit me, it was the first for a couple of years. It came without much warning, and suddenly I experienced a whole load of symptoms I had not ever really noticed on previous occasions. In fact, there were so many I typed them up to take into my doctors with me,.... see above for exact list... so I wouldn't forget any of them. I was inclined to think I might be lapsing into depression again, and was therefore quite relieved when my Doctor read my list, and straight away he said I was a 'textbook case'. "
Anyone who says this doesn't exist has never been through it! Simple as that!
Yup. If the condition did not share it's name with a common emotion, there would not be such a stigma I think. People who have not felt clinical depression associate it with the moody feeling that everybody gets. Two different things tho.
Regarding your sleep issue:
We (dr. & me) have been addressing my sleep issue as a primary condition and bi-polar as secondary. With a treatment for narcolepsy believe it or not, I have been nearly symptom free for almost a year now. Without it, I will generally sleep 10 - 14 hours, then feel sick from sleeping too much.
Don't let yourself forget that you are not doing this to yourself, and you will find better days. It's tricky to know when you should fight hard, or give yourself a little bit of a break.
I agree with Ghost about your GP, and give yourself credit as well for recognizing your symptoms. That was the hardest part for me.
Take good care.
Thanks wyanjen, your words are a great comfort, and make so much sense. Time for bed now..... at last. (07.30)
Sometimes you survive, other times you can only endure.
Go get yourself some sleep
Give me a holler if you ever need to talk.
Me too misty, I experience the same thing when trying to sleep as you do. To better days ahead!
Sorry to hear it, Misty. The best thing (silver lining?) in your post is that it sounds like you have a GP who is willing to listen. We (Pam and I) have had great trouble finding one of those for her, especially since no physician in our county has been willing to take her on as a patient since we moved to southeastern Arizona last April.
Her symptoms echo yours quite closely. As to the insomnia aspect (from not being able to shut her mind off), we are extremely fortunate that a former GP from when we lived in Montana, circa 2003, got her to try a medication that actually combats the insomnia with considerable effectiveness. Not every night, but she does get some relatively decent rest about two nights out of three now, on average.
Hang in there.
they want you to believe that it's a disorder so you'd keep buying their anti depression drugs. depression is a choice and it becomes worse because you let it happen. you can change that mindset if you choose to=)
So if you believe this, quote evidence, prove the case, and your beliefs!
BTW, as a sufferer, really not that easy, so so wish it was, have you ever suffered this? No, I thought not !
PS. not actually taking the tablets right now, but no real improvement noticed
No offense, but do you think people are actually choosing to be depressed?
I won't argue that mental illness is over-diagnosed, but that does not mean there aren't legitimate disorders. People who have an illness should not be made to justify their condition.
You are confusing the emotion depression with the clinical condition depression.
Why aren't you sleeping
I'm teasing of course, it is 3 AM and here I sit writing about Pink Floyd.
I will be regretting this tomorrow.
I'm logging out. Take it easy misty, it is nice to meet you
Talking of which, it was God that gave King Saul a 'spirit of depression' and if that was fact then, it's fact now.
1 Samuel 16: 14-15
But the Spirit of the LORD departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the LORD troubled him.
And Saul's servants said unto him, Behold now, an evil spirit from God troubleth thee.
So to stop depression.... ask God to reveal why you have it.
On a practical vein, you can also take Vitamin C (it has a 'feel good' factor) Passion flower and a few other herbs and minerals that are probably short in your system, but first ask God to free you, because unless He does, no herb or potion will work for long!
PS. topgunjager, you are presumably aware that your profile pic is showing you to probably be demon possessed?
yeah you told me that before, presumably, you are not also aware that that little hand gesture "never" influenced anyone to commit crimes and go on a killing spree, it would be nice if people like you could focus on things that "actually matters" instead of judging my profile pic, oh yeah god teaches you to judge people because he's the epitome of good right, sorry for not using my brain, i offer my humblest apologies to you sir=)
you can choose to give in to the feeling, it's like when you feel like crying, you can always hold it, same with depression, when you get sad, you can choose to do and think of other things instead of letting it get to you=)
I agree, with topgunjager. It is a choice, perhaps sometimes not a conscious choice, but a choice none the less, just as happiness is a choice.
Have to strongly disagree, but then no problem if you disagree with me either. I guess it all comes down to your own life experiences and the effects they had on you. If you haven't been there, you can't "get" it. No worries, gotta go bed now, after 08.00am now, (another symptom of depression, staying up late as not tired ,but needing 10 hours plus of sleep once in bed).
maybe you should focus on doing things that actually make a difference in the lives of people today, ever thought of getting off your butt and help out someone in need or maybe feeding the hungry? i'm sure the hungry children of the world would appreciate it if you can help feed them instead of talking about god all the time then you would have truly made a difference in the lives of others instead of annoying people about the word of god, this is not the thread for that. push your beliefs on people who wants to hear it, you're not going to make fans by saying what you're saying. "you can't make people believe by your annoying words, but you can make people believe by the actions you make" i'm sure you;re "old enough" to understand that=)god bless you
For the record, we do feed 35-50 homeless people every week and have done for some years, and will do with more each year needing food, clothing and love.
My objective is not to make fans, though I seem to have them joining of their own accord, maybe they approve of what I say in forums, but just can't be bothered to deal with the criticism that you and your kind hand out, but cannot take.
And funnily enough, I just wrote a hub about why we are charged to carry on "annoying people about the word of god" - It's for the benefit of those who may be saved.
Now I appreciate that may not apply to yourself, but hey, there are some out there who obviously lack your insight and wisdom.
I am quite old actually, been on this here planet long enough to know I know less than I thought I did when I was your age.
Careful my friend, be very careful, your way out of line, and you know it. Is this your forum? Then take control of it and help direct it or are you here with the purpose to tell people all the wonderful things you don't know, yet pretend too.
This is fine but then start a sarcasm forum, not one that effects people on an emotional level. I am sure your 13 fans would be glad to converse and bicker with you.
My God, what's next? Close this forum someone please
Depression is a disorder acquired though a mindset that did quite accomplished its goal. At least that's what I think.
With all do respect, this is the worst forum I have ever entered. Ignorance and sassy jokes. It's not funny and try educating yourself before strongly declaring the 'right' answer. Thank god for the few of you who get it or this forum would transform into a mental illness joke-a-thon.
good luck and definitely goodbye.
I'm still in shock.
Theres a lot more into depression than just that, and it is not all due to abuse of substance etc. prolonged exposure to abuse etc and social interactions and some problems cause people to be depressed, eevrybody expereince this once in their life....at the first symptoms we should seek help and avoid being alone, talking to others and sharing, going out is another thing...
Depression can be a physiological problem caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain. I believe it has to do with a lack of serotonin, or an inability to properly use the serotonin that we do have.
That's my two cents.
This is still theory.
Serotonin is a neurotransmitter (there are many neurotransmiiters). Regulation of serotonin within the brain is thought to improve mood in depressed people. This is a simplification. Doctors/psychiatrists still don't know the exact action antidepressants take to improve mood.
While antidepressants do work (or appear to work)... other factors such as placebo response and spontaneous remission need to be discounted first to discover just how effective antidepressants really are.
it could be either, depends on the person and if they have any other mental or medical problems behind it..or it could just be mindset from a streak of bad luck????
Depression is a real medical condition. Period.
(But thanks for giving me an idea for a quick hub. )
There are all kinds of depression, not just one, and all kinds of opinions on what to do about it. When Big Pharma developed SSRIs they started to aggressively market them. Recently it has been shown that SSRIs don't work as well as previously thought.
Depression is real. But drugging it isn't always a good idea.
It's self-serving to say people cause their own depression. That's just a not very delicate way of saying, "Hey, not my problem." Which it isn't. But that doesn't mean depression isn't real.
I'm not trying to be rude, but would there be a forum about whether people believe kidney disease is real?
This is a BS forum.
Depression is a disorder. It's not the wrong mindset. If you don't like the concept, that's your choice but stop implying that people who have a disorder should be able to cure themselves by thinking happy thoughts.
I know two people who won't get help for depression because they hear things like some of the posts in this forum, and it makes them feel like it is their own fault for being depressed in the first place.
Sadly, some people WOULD suggest that kidney disease can be cured by thinking happy thoughts.
Mental health issues still carry a stigma and sadly you'll never have to look far to find someone to dump shame on people who struggle with these things.
Before I was diagnosed BP, I had a depression diagnosis.
Frankly, I find fewer people give me a hard time when I say I'm bi-polar than when I used to say I have Depression.
Go figure. But it's true.
I do believe the issue is the name of the disorder. Like I said earlier, people confuse the disorder with the emotion.
Thus, we get a forum like this one here. And, we get people who don't seek help because they think they should be able to control it themselves.
There should be another name for it.
I can see how people would see BP as more significant and believable than depression, even though this isn't fair. I guess BP just gets more publicity from the media.
No, it's absolutely not fair. I think the reason is that BP symptoms can be so extreme that people can't readily relate to them, as with "depression".
In any case, I rarely discuss BP. It can be a trigger for me, even to talk about it LOL
And there is a big stigma with it.. Another reason I don't talk about it, especially in the forums, is that I worry that somebody in my family or from my work may stumble in, and see me admitting I have it
However, some of the posts in this one got me riled up so I had to speak up.
Pleased you did, and well done for doing so. Many famous and successful people have suffered (and still do) from BP. Stephen Fry springs to mind off the top of my head, yet he is also a highly intelligent person, (borderline genius). If you don't know who Stephen Fry is, well he used to be the comedy partner of Hugh Laurie (who now stars in "House" the medical drama). There are many others of course, but for some reason Stephen Fry springs to my mind first.
It is nothing to be ashamed of, so don't feel bad about talking about it, or commenting here.
Thanks, and back at you as well.
We all take care of each other, as everybody has good days and bad ones.
Like people who you thought were your friends, true friends, until you get hit with an episode so bad they run fast, and they run far & they don't return. I've become open about my depression & agoraphobia, it helps me cope to say what it is. Its also helped me loose every person who I thought was a friend. During a period of time when I was so frightened to be alone or leave my home, they were not there, they did not come back either. They were not really friends after all, retrospect is good.
Wow! Misty, Lyricsingray & others - I understand where you are all coming from. Living with depression since 8th grade - its real.
Misty, have you tried meditation or a relaxation cd before bed? I find it helps with the brain chatter - which can seem endless.
I suffer from severe panic attacks, clinical depression, anxiety & agoraphobia and now have a great regimen of both medications, meditation, relaxation, breathing techniques and a new word in my vocabulary "confidence" - I'll sing the words "I have confidence in me" over and over to get me through a short drive by myself...which I finally did after 1.5 years this past week. I know what has contributed to the anxiety & it hurts like hell to admit what it is, and I won't on this forum.
The cd series I use, was the series that the hospital outpatient program I went to used...they are very very good. Her name is Bellaruth Naparstek, she also has a series of guided imagery which works surprisingly well.
I wish this was a sort of support forum, I think there are a few of us who would benefit, like the addicts forum
Hi Jane, Thanks so much for the suggestions, but I have to say I have tried meditation 100's of times over many years, but my mind simply won't focus and is too inclined to wander. I even went to a meditation group with my late Husband for weeks, same problem. Meditation music not an option as current hubby would be disturbed, and I can get to sleep okay anyway, it is when I wake up, even briefly, I have trouble returning to sleep because my brain kicks into activity mode. Hard to explain, but very frustrating BTW, I am diagnosed as suffering from anxiety and depression, and know all about panic attacks, so do understand your symptoms well too.
Misty, I'm exactly the same, I feel like your my twin. Thank God, mostly to you and wyanjen this forum is becoming useful. Thank you both.
It's true, the name gives a false impression. Lots of people think it just means being in a sad mood too much, which is a total misunderstanding.
I know about fair weather friends too. It's funny how your real friends are not always who you think they are. When things get tough, you find out.
Depression is biochemical, discouragement is based on circumstance and emotions. Both can have the same effect, except the discouragement usually doesn't go biochemical unless it becomes chronic. It's a delicate dance. One can actually trigger the other, because we are, in essence a bag of chemicals and when something goes out of whack it can cause a lot of other domino effects.
So, some people need help with discouragement, others need help with biochemical depression. I've needed help with both. I can pretty much see the difference in myself, but it's taken a lot of years to get to that point. Even so, neither is easier or worse than the other, I believe.
I agree that while both forms yield essentially the same results, the only reason there needs to be an understanding of the difference is that with discouragement understand the cause of it can actually at time reveal the keys in how to help it.
However, overcoming either is a process in healing, and healing always takes time.
I've done a lot of study about this and have even written hubs about the emotional and biochemical aspects of depression, anxiety, etc. And having come off some serious meds, I've also had to come through some very serious protracted withdrawals. Those'll stop yer damned clock in a heart beat if you're not ready. But I made it through.
Life is not easy. It's good for us to band together for support, understanding and help. That's one of the basic reasons why I think this community and these forums are so powerful and why we often bond to people so readily.
Glad you are all here and glad you're all so damned intelligent and insightful. Really.
Aww, thanks Daniel, it is good to have a strong support network of others who understand what each other are going through.
Hi Daniel! I made your chicken soup and it was so good, I've been talking it up in the forums thanks!
I see your hubs on this subject, sitting there, waiting for me to read them...
But I haven't yet because I don't want a trigger.
I'm happy tonight that there are so many of us talking about this.
Good for you! Don't read 'em unless they apply! Don't fix it if ain't broken.
I read that you made the soup! So glad it turned out well! (Boy would I be in hot water if it didn't!!) LOL
Glad you are happy. Let's stay that way. Life is nice this way.
Well, I am interested very much in your hubs. It's inspiring, knowing what you have gone through.
I've been on & off my medication due to money problems lately no fun, the withdrawals and then the... REdrawals?
In any case, what I am taking right now is primarily for sleep disorders. I tend to be against Rx treatments, but, these meds are working.
I hope I can get strong & smart enough eventually to handle it without the pills.
So, I do want to read your writing on the subject, soon enough.
And, life IS nice this way. True words!
Peace and good night everyone
I was diagnosed with bipolar disorder about 12 years ago, but have been free of wild mood swings and episodes for almost 5 years, but it's been a very long road to get where I'm at. At this point depression is still a powerful drawback in my life at times. It's been such a huge factor based on past experiences.
I'm just very glad that whether or not I truly am bipolar, I've been able to improve my mental, emotional and physical health dramatically. For me it's been a long journey that included meds for a period of time, counseling, and really wanting to get better more than anything. The journey seemed so impossible, but I've learned it's possible.
Improvement doesn't necessarily mean reversal, but improvement does make life better. I've enjoy so many of your posts in this thread. Thanks for your insights.
I relate to what you said here about improvement and reversal.
I'm in a much better frame of mind with it since I was able to accept it as a part of me, without letting it be the only thing that defines me.
I'm not too afraid to get emotional, if that makes sense.
I've stopped thinking that every emotion is a symptom.
I'm glad you are feeling good
It's no fun, is it?
Do you believe that Deppression is a disorder or a wrong mindset?
I believe that depression involves having a wrong mindset but is not necessarily a disorder.
I am bipolar and it makes me really angry when people take this viewpoint of a what can often be a chemical imbalance in the brain that they can't help. my oldest son just happens to be one of those that thinks it a "mind over matter" thing and if you have enough self-discipline, you can "snap out of it". My EX-husband also thought so....that's one of the many reasons he is an ex..lol!
My ex reassured me CONSTANTLY that everything was OK, that I was OK, right up to the day before he filed the papers. 14 years of me being told I was OK when I was not.
I'm still trying to get past what that did to me. I didn't realize I was being lied to, so now I over-analyze every GD thing I say and do. He pulled the rug right out from under me. If he had just been honest about it with me...
I am very aware there are some problems with me and I don't accept the idea that everybody else needs to conform to me and my issues. But just tell me if I'm going sideways! Don't say everything is OK and then frickin' leave me by the side of the road.
Well i guess a wrong mindset is a mind that is not in order.
Depression when labeled clinically is definitely a disease. We often use the term loosely for sadness and pensive moods which are states of mind.
But per se Depression indicates a diagnosis and thus it becomes a disease. Depression affects persons health and other daily stuffs that person would normally do.
Grief and sadness per se do not constitute depression though they may be part of depression symptoms.
Depression has a spectrum of severity and is treated on individual basis.
A person who is depressed needs medical as well social support. Most of the persons are able to maintain a normal life with help of medication and family/social support
I think TRUE depression is a combination of mindset, external conditions, and internal imbalances...
Willpower is strong enough to overcome internal imbalanced (IMHO), but if external conditions are horrible, one's willpower will waiver
it is definetly a disorder, a chemical upset in the brain, lack of feel good hormones such as seritonin. But you can also make yourself depressed with bad thoughts and rough outlook on life. I dont think it is something someone can just choose to be. who would choose to be miserable on purpose??
It can be one, or the other, or both. I know from personal experience and working in the field of behavioral health. Yes, some people do choose depression as a ploy to gain attention. But those are few. It is real, it hurts, it damages, it can be treated and controlled.
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