Should Marijuana be legalized?
Gosh did you join just to ask that dumb question?
I guess if you do not understand how much tobacco you need to grow to be able to make your own cigarettes, compared to how many marijuana plants you need to make your own joints....
Let me know when you are growing enough tobacco on a windowsill in Manhattan.
Should we all sign a petition? And prepare for a jail time?
I wrote an essay on this years ago, but I can't find it for the life of me, haha.
Basically if we wanted to tax and regulate it, the pharmaceutical companies that would be responsible for making the product would have to produce a safer, higher quality, and more direct-approach than what people on the street would, and/or offer it for cheaper.
If we're talking about legalization like alcohol is legal, then that's a whole other ballgame, though I think, just as with booze, it could be sold and taxed. I mean, plenty of people make their own hooch, and if they know what they're doing, it's better than what's mass produced and available on the market, but most people don't care enough about that to bother. Why go through all the trouble of raising the plant and doing... whatever it is that needs to be done to get it to produce a high-quality product when you could just go down to the store and get what you need pre-packaged and prepared for a fraction of the cost. People are lazy, and therein lies the opening for taxation.
I mean seriously, tomatoes are plants. If they put a tax on tomatoes tomorrow, do you think everyone would just grow their own?Good point, considering the US is reliant on consumer debt to produce it's main source of revenue, maybe getting into full-on marijuana products will get the US out of trouble. Finally a good reason to produce hemp products. Geez, it just may be environmentally friendly too.
This one's a hot potato, always has been. I'm all for hemp products - it makes lots of sense considering cotton production is a law unto itself.
But smoking the stuff - sorry can't go for it. Not that I've not had a go, I have. But I've seen the long term effects - not pretty
- Poppa Bluesposted 15 years ago
0 - sandra rinckposted 15 years ago0
legalizing it takes half the fun out of it. lol
no but seriously, of course legalize it already! That's strange, because I haven't said anything yet, on this thread. But I suppose I should, now, so you can agree with me prophetically
It should be legalised, but for me, I still prefer beer!
I have no anything against marihuana. But its distribution should be in any case under the control, i mean not strict control
but some kind of control must exist any way.
Btw we can sign petition here
_http://www.petitiononline.com/Legalize/petition.htmlJewel, not that I am a big expert in marijuana, but based of what I learned recently, from the people I tend to believe, it is NOT addictive biologically. Neither is LSD, btw. Or mushrooms, for that matter
If it were legal everyone would be high and nothing would get accomplished as there are many who cannot control alcohol or prescribed narcotics for that matter , I have seen to much when I was working in the ER at the beginning of my career, so I am going to have to say no.
- pgrundyposted 15 years ago0
We'll have to get together sometime.
Haha. just kidding. No, I'm not.
As for the legalization of drugs....this is such a tricky topic. Our media is filled with bad representations of drug users, and the good ones get drowned out or bashed and run away with their tails between their legs. (Like Michael Phelps.)
In the end, its not a good idea to tell people what they can and cannot put in their bodies. But its a good idea to tell them what to expect if they abuse it.
I find it funny that (from what I know, anyway) alcohol is treated with such respect in many countries (UK, Mexico, etc.) and its become ingrained in their cultures often for the better.
I'd love to legalize every drug, but I'm not stupid. However, pot has proven to be effective for many things and not only is it valuable for medicinal use, it also leaves less affect on the body than cigarettes or alcohol.
Ever heard of a stoner getting into a car wreck? Oh, I'm sure they have at some time. But generally speaking you'll never hear "the driver was high on cannabis..." its always "the driver was drinking and high on [other drug]"
This again, proves a very well to learn point--us Americans, and people in general, just don't know how to moderate our consumption.
Sincerely,
G|MHi Generique - the UK has some serious problems with drinking now, and the drinking culture is out of control.
The Mediterranean countries and France are better, though - everybody drinks, but few take it to excess - apart from exiled Englishmen
For many creative people, much of our best work is done under the influence of weed.
Sadly, a joint = automatic jail time in this part of Greece, so I do not take the risk.
Don't want to do a bunch of quoting..but I'll reply to some stuff in a paragraphic format.
Its sad that DARE and other things like it tell our kids outright lies. If you don't believe it, you've never been in the program. They'll propagate these lies until it becomes like a new version of "Sex Madness" or what not have you.
Marijuana is not addictive, and like I've previously stated, when used in moderation its a safe and relatively (and if you've cancer or tumors, actually good for you!) harmless psychoactive.
The problem is, as someone mentioned about the UK drinking (I thought you guys were better than us! ) is again..moderation. America's the fattest nation on the planet. Because of....lack of moderation.
No wonder our government wants to be our parents.
Sincerely,
G|MSigh...you always have clear, and great points.
I personally don't eat much, but I've a bit of a pudgy belly. I reckon I'll do situps religously, like I used to, but...eh?
Diets, especially "fad diets" are generally bad for you. I remember my parents were drinking this powdery thing for like two meals a day..I forget what it was called, but they were all into it for years!
Apparently, though I've never tried to substantiate it, the guy who invented this method of dieting died....from complications of said diet.
Our society today is waaaaay too concious about how it looks. While this can always be good, its generally, again, used for the bad. I remember reading this Time Life book or some other just FILLED with old newspapers from the 1800s. The perfect woman then would be someone considered a "plus" size now. Pssha.
Sincerely,
G|MI suppose you're right on all accounts!
Though, if we legalize MJ, we'll have to watch out for the munchie monster.
G|M
Bob, I've seen that things aren't always that simple. I was a kid who would skip my homework just enough, but knew to how to draw the line on myself when it came to my grades. A lot of other homework skippers either didn't know where to draw the line, or thought they did but were wrong. My argument is not that smoking pot "is that bad", by itself. I think it does have a higher tendency (just like alcohol does) to have a higher number of "peripheral" issues that can turn it into a bigger problem, regardless of how "sound" or "mature" many people are. It's not a simple risk like, say, jumping out of airplanes is. To me, that's what makes it a trickier thing to judge.
I don't think it's safe to say that because the majority of users don't get into problems that those who do had some other "issue" going on (or at least going on at the time they began smoking). Situations change (and the younger people are, the more fluid their situations sometimes are). Maybe if that same kid I mentioned had not started smoking as young as he did, and instead got himself to high school graduation, there wouldn't have been the fights with his parents over the grades; and there wouldn't have been the dropping out of school. Maybe, too, if he and others like him couldn't have gotten pot so easily he would have been forced to find something else to entertain himself with.
It has nothing to do with drugs, but I, myself, have found myself in situations where I think, "How on Earth did I find myself here, when I've always been someone who makes all the right choices, and aims to do what is right?" I've actually discovered that some of those right choices have actually not worked out very well, even though anyone who considered them would have agreed that the choices were the right one.
Before cigarette smoking became the "major, unpopular" thing it has become today, I think a lot of people would have told you that it was because they were "acceptable" and legal (years ago) that they felt free to smoke. Today, people are discouraged from smoking - and for good reason. I have a friend who has been through some terrible things. She's a smoker and can't quit, because she says if she doesn't smoke all the thoughts she can't bear to think come flooding into her head. She began smoking decades ago, so her choice didn't seem that bad back then. Today, she's dealing with choosing between smoking and dealing with thoughts of the son she lost (among other things). When she decided to start smoking she probably planned to quit, the way a lot of other young people planned to. Life got in the way to the point where she knows its her responsibility that she smokes (and yet, someone who understands psychological/physiological issues may know that she's more at the mercy of the cigarettes than even she thinks). Someone used to social drinking may start to drink more if horrible things go on his life. Again, it can be a matter of "bad choice" or "feeling like he wants to kill himself because it's all so unbearable".
The person who isn't already a smoker or social drinker isn't all that likely to turn to these things when/if life gets unbearable (although they may, if they get desperate enough). People who already do them may be naturally inclined to let things get out of hand.
I once did a special feature on teen suicide; and one of the experts I interviewed talked about how sometimes it's one drug or another than lowers a person's inhibitions (that would otherwise stop him from making a drastic move).
Another point about "being ok" is that when I was kid my friends enjoyed smoking pot. I didn't. I honestly don't think I was any more "ok" than they were. ("Stuffier", maybe - but not more ok )
It's sometimes easier to believe that everyone else's problem are "their own stupid fault" or their own weakness. When we believe that we can feel immune to the problems that stare us in the face. We don't get to feel self-righteous either.
While I'm not sure that the degree of my concerns about pot is right, I know they're based on enough reality that they are at least valid. One thing I am sure of, though, is that so many problems have several factors at their roots; that it isn't always easy to sort out, or prevent, that "perfect storm" that can happen to any one person, at any given time. My father used to say, "The only way you can be 100% sure you'll never be an alcoholic is not to drink at all."
When any of the "peripheral" problems start showing up around use of either alcohol or smoking pot, they aren't usually confined to the person who uses the substance. It's all just so messy, I can't come around to feeling comfortable with the idea of legalizing pot.
Bob, decriminalizing is different from "making legal". This is something that only occurred with the most recent election; so even if I had access to statistics or other pertinent information, I think it's too soon to tell whether there is any negative impact from decriminalizing. I don't have a strong feelings about decriminalizing.
LadyG, I can't speak for others who share my views; but I do know I don't care who does what; and, again, it has nothing to do with trying to control anyone. I, personally, have no trouble with self-control; so if I were to "project" - you can guess what I'd be projecting. It's just about the simple belief, again, that I don't think the advantages of legalizing pot outweigh the potential disadvantages.
This is one of those topics on which there is so often not point-by-point debate; but which, instead, invites attacks on people who have the opposing views. Imagining some psychological "flaw" in the people with the opposing view is not debating, valid point by valid point. I believe that's because I presented valid points and a reasoned argument; but that people on "the other side" are not willing to even consider the possibility that the opposite views may actually be reasonable.
I usually (up until recently) stay away from controversial topics, but over time it has become clear that there is always one side that tends to "attack" (even if politely, and I'm not saying everyone on this thread has done that, at all); and another side that holds an unpopular view and is sometimes afraid to just state it.
I don't see discussion/debate as people being being pitted against one another. I just see it as communication and - yes - debate. Here's what I compare the pot question to:
Suppose the medical profession comes out and states that someone smoking three cigarettes a week for, say, a year doesn't have a very high risk of developing the problems that life-long, pack-a-day smokers do. Even with that, a lot of people just don't want to be around cigarette smoke. Suppose there's a giant office building with 4000 employees, most of whom work in cubicles. Suppose the law then changes to allow allow those employees, who "feel like" having their three cigarettes a week to, smoke in their cubicles. Imagine that, say, 3500 of them (a majority) "feel like" smoking, even if the the rest of the people see that 3500 x 3 cigarettes a week is one load of second-hand smoke (even if it's distributed over the course of the week). At this point, other people are, in fact, at risk if such a thing were to occur (even if the three cigarettes aren't going to pose that high a risk.
There is, as far as I can see, no difference in this imaginary situation than with the real situation of some people wanting pot legal (across the whole society) so that they can feel free to smoke it once in a while. Can you measure the exact hazards to the 500 people who have to live with having all that smoking introduced into their work day? Not necessarily. Would it be healthier if the smoking didn't take place in that shared workplace? No doubt about it.
I, personally, am not a big fan of the government telling people what to do in their personal lives; but I also wouldn't be a fan of all those 3500 fellow employees who decide to disregard what I see as healthiest for me, and smoke their three cigarettes a week (at any given time during any given 8-hour workday). Do they have a right to attempt to control the quality of my workplace, just because they're the majority? Some would say they don't, and that's why the government steps in and tells people they can't smoke cigarettes in some places. What's so special about pot that a similar policy (in the interest of even a slightly increased risk of negative fallout in society) is all that unreasonable?
It would be interesting to see the opposite side of this "debate" made without skipping addressing the valid points here, and without jumping to conclusions about the thinking of everyone who has an opposing view.
Well, it's a rainy day here in decriminalized Massachusetts; and I've spent a ton of time "debating", just because I didn't have much else to do today. Obviously, I've pretty much said all there is to say from "this side" of the "debate"; and obviously, a "meeting of the minds" isn't likely to happen on this issue. So, signing off on this issue (much to a lot of people's delight, I'm guessing ).Hi Lisa
That is quite a weak analogy - There is a lot of difference in the two situations. Smokers sitting in office cubicles, exposing others to smoke, is a lot different from somebody sitting in their home with a joint. In terms of the fallout to society, the Dutch have suffered no problems with their liberal policies.
Certainly, the issue is complex, and needs discussing properly. Whilst I disagree with you, I appreciate the fact that you have researched the topic fully and made a reasoned opinion, rather than repeating soundbites.
It is one of those debates where there is no black and white - most of us are in the middle somewhere.Hey, Sulfi points out something I need to say, too. Thanks for your healthy research, Lisa.
Soundbites do suck. I've done probably a grand total of three hours of hardcore research, so I'm not the most informed. But y'all know me and my oppinionation.
G|M
Good get out of here narc! Nah I'm just kidding
It's cool debating with you. Nobody's hating you for having your view.Do you think legalizing marijuana will have a negative effect on America's obesity problem?
I would prefer not. Ever talk to somebody all high on pot?
they have intelligence of a starfish No, no, see...you have several different stoners. Your inexperienced one..yeah, they can be slow and dumb.
Here's a primer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tevg74P3t9w from Half Baked.
- Neon Sign Fanposted 14 years ago0
A day later, and I'm popping back for a quick scan of what's here.
Bob, thanks for the non-hateful words. I'm too much a big, giant, "chicken", to ever be a narc. I guess my main point - in all that posting - is that I was hoping a lot of people would realize that people who (if faced with choosing to vote for, or not vote for, legalizing pot) may just be weighing what they see are the concerns and benefits - and not really caring about what other people do with or without any changes in the law. It's just that simple question, "If you vote, which way will you vote?"
It's kind of like if someone offered (even forced on me) the choice of either a piece of pecan pie or apple pie. I may like both. I may not love either. I may hate both. To whatever degree I like or don't like each type, I'm faced with the simple choice of either apple or pecan. Chances are I'll go with my "gut" at any given time, particularly since both apples and pecan both have their "pro's".
Colebabie, I think it could go either way. People would either start eating to alleviate their stress (more obese people); or else they'd stop a lot of the snacking that's going on now (in which case, fewer obese people).
Neon Sign Fan, most people aren't big fans of a lot of the stuff that alcohol causes in society. We've already got whatever problems that brings. That's why a lot of people don't want to ask for what they think will be yet one more set of similar things by changing the laws.
Alcohol is, and always (apparently) has, played such a "big role" in society; it would be very difficult for most of us to imagine the following, but: Imagine if alcohol and cigarettes had never been "invented/discovered" in the world; and imagine us all being born into that world. If we're honest, we have to admit it would have been a healthier, better, world. We can't put that horse back in the barn at this stage in history (apparently); although people are trying to do just that when it comes to cigarette smoking. The "pot horse" may be out of the barn at this point, too, but because it isn't legal maybe it's sometimes nasty cousins haven't yet made their way out of that barn. (Oops - I can't believe I thought I could keep a "quickie return" post brief. )Meh, I'm with ya there. I'm in Cali..problem solved for me.
Haha..actually, more and more local communities around the country are basically saying "Yeah, we got people that smoke pot, but this dood shooting up dope and smoking crack is a bigger issue." So they've basically have made it a slap on the wrist...however million slaps you get, it don't affect you one bit.
G|M
- Leta Sposted 14 years ago0
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