This is the question the rest of the world is asking.
Interesting thread on Reddit if you'd like to read some of it.
http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/commen … omney_has/
It's an interesting question.
It seems the more time that passes and the more these candidates talk the better Romney's numbers get.
Why is that?
Great article, When George W. Bush was running for President, he bumbled words and mispoke so often I was not even worried, then he won...twice...what worries me is that I fear this means Romney will also. It follows the pattern...
Many many voters do not research the candidates. They vote on a single issue or a sound bite they heard on a political ad. Romney has taken a stand on just about every side of most issues. He also has a terible record concerning his treatment of the majority of Americans but if you just look at one or two sound bites, you can be fooled.
Here's a good one from that thread...
"I think the answer lies with the tremendous right wing propaganda machine that gets away with constant misinformation and the spreading of its agenda. You pair that with a scientifically illiterate populace and you've got a gigantic group of people ready to feel however a small group of people want them to."
I can go with that one! Trouble Man. I guess it troubles me as a woman as well.
Ah....so in other words we are going to get the whole flyover state thing again.....
The left wing of the Democrat party will never understand you can't spend all your time offending people and think they will agree with your viewpoint.
Do you understand that?
Chams, as explained in my previous response, I come from a country and a culture where one makes the right decision, regardless of whether one is offended or not. It's not about ego. it's about what is right.
Apparently people do not always believe the liberal solution is right.
That does not make them stupid. The message may not be articulated right and that goes back to my original comments.
Maybe not anywhere else but it's a pretty valid argument that if Conservatism is articulated correctly people gravitate toward it. That is why you had eight years of Reagan. Specifically.
George Bush was not really Conservative but was elected because of the low quality of the other choices.
This is not a good year for choices either but Barack Obama has spent four years running still against George Bush. People have paid attention to that.
As I said before concerning the "liar" supposition. they are politicians...they all lie...every day...
Then, you would never support any of them, yes?
Just as much probably if you would.
Everyone on this planet lies. You know that. If you think they are any different I wonder where you get the idea.
I don't think Obama is a liar. However, I think he's a statesman - not a politician. I may be mistaken about that. I put him in the same category as I do Mandela.
This is not about what I think. It's about what the people on Reddit think.
You're missing the point. The question was why people believe Romney when he was clearly a liar and that everybody in the rest of the world saw it quite clearly but half of Americans didn't.
The response to that has been that people believed him because they were stupid. This is not about Romney's policies but about why some believe Romney because it is clear that he is lying.
And yet you were given a video showing the same thing from the opposite side.
What's the difference Sophia? Are Barack's lies more acceptable?
Are we supposed to be willing to be lied to by one person yet not the other?
Do you honestly believe Barack has NOT lied?
It should trouble you as a woman and as a person. He is not in favor of equal pay for equal work. Must be the mormon side of him.
I believe the mainstream media would be offended that you think the right wing media is bigger than them.
I think the quote was to imply that a "small group of people" were the driving force behind a "tremendous right wing propaganda machine" that was influencing a "gigantic group of people" consisting primarily of a "scientifically illiterate populace".
I received so much propaganda on Facebook that was negative towards Obama and pro Romney that I couldn't stand it anymore. I also had my phone ring once a day for Romney and no Obama calls. The Republicans are driving me nuts this election.
I wonder too how anyone could believe any of this and if they really have listened to Romney. He changes his mind so many times.
Could it be that the rest of the world is finally finding out it's the other side that's been doing the lying and not the missionary. That would mean many of the undecideds have finally chosen to trust a man with a spotless record as opposed to one that just can't seem to keep his 'act' cleaned up...
Sophia I went through some of that thread and stopped part way because there is one thing I can never understand.
If you wish me to come over to your point of view....calling me stupid, racist and so forth ain't gonna get it done.
Obviously despite the media intervention there is something they trust more about Mitt Romney than they do Barack Obama.
I wonder what that might be?
I have asked this before....if Barack Obama loses are we going to have another rendition of hateful talk about "flyover states"? Do you actually think these folks in these states are stupid? If that is your opinion you need to understand that this attitude comes out in most communications from the media to blogs to forums and somehow you expect people to warm up to the democrat party when they spend all this time berating the intelligence, regional situations, and so forth of those not voting Democrat this time?
Find a way to explain the need to vote for Barack Obama in terms other than the other guy is a liar. they are all liars. it comes with the territory.
It would help if he had not been so woefully deified four years ago.
JSChams, you raise a very valid point here, and it's about ego. Personally, in my earlier life, when and where I was raised, we were taught that we were to subjugate the ego, and 'if the cap fits, to wear it.'
If you say that people won't convince people by saying that they are stupid, perhaps that is true. However, let me use an analogy here.
If one repeatedly explains math to someone over and over again for decades, and they still don't get math, people are human, and they will, undoubtedly begin to call the person who doesn't understand math 'stupid.'
I truly do not have an answer for you. I have no interest in persuading you to 'come over to my way of thinking.' Regardless of who wins, it does absolutely nothing for me personally. However, in terms of what is right for the world, for the greater human equation, for the common good, it is my opinion that Obama is the right choice. Do I need to persuade you or anyone else? Absolutely no! What happens, happens. In many ways, I'm a fatalist. I don't believe I have any power to change outcomes, so I just accept them.
Now let's get back to ego. It's an extremely emotionally immature attitude not to vote for someone because one's ego is hurt.
It's not just that.
There is a pattern.
Four years of Carter...eight years of Reagan.
eight years of Clinton.....eight years of Bush.
Now we have had four years of Obama and looks very likely a Romney term.
Back and forth. Why do you suppose if the liberal policies do so much good people go away from them?
JS, Completely agree with your pattern theory, however, as much as Conservatives want to believe that Romney is a Reagan, it just is not so. After 8 yrs of Clinton the economy was in good shape, and we had a surplus, I will concede the point before hand that he had the help of the tech boom and that was also creating a bubble, however, when W came in and did what R's do....it took us down not to the floor, but through the floor. Obama stopped the bleeding, did he accomplish his idealistic ideas, no, but he did turn it around...recovery is a slow process...How fast can you spend $5000.00 on Christmas, how long does it take to pay back? Romney is another Bush, a puppet being led by the puppet masters, this is why he has taken both sides of every position...as to the reason R's keep being elected.....? I will never understand
I don't think anybody believes Romney is Reagan.
Obama stopped NO bleeding Tammy.
Gee is it's what R's do and it's all that bad and wrong why are there R's? Hmmm?
You would think someone like the UN would step in and rid the world of R's because R's are the cause of all our problems right?
Think about that.
We can only hope
Anyway, as for your contention that Romney is going to win, the only polls suggesting a Romney win are known for being biased toward Republicans. The Gallup poll merely takes the results from four sections of the country and then averages them. It's easy to be up 6 points when you have a 22 point lead in one part of the country and are losing by 2-6 in the rest.
Check out fivethirtyeight.com. I just hope it isn't too much science and facts and logic for you
How Does (Insert either presidential candidate here)Win When the Whole World Knows He is a Liar?
65 Outrageous Lies by President Obama
Let's understand something. This election is has and will be Barack Obama's to lose.
He has had an adoring press who believed in him and people who believed in him. I f you look on HP you will find hubs from former supporters who feel let down. Now......is that because they are scientifically illiterate or are Fox News viewers? Highly doubtful. All of them supported him four years ago but now can't get themselves to do so.
What do we think is the reason for this?
I posted a thread from Reddit about a completely different topic. i really, really am not deviating from that. Why do you need to deviate from that? Why don't YOU answer the question that was asked on Reddit? That is the quesiton.
What I am trying to do is get you to understand WHY people would vote for Romney.
Why do you not understand that? Your OP was why would people vote for him and I am working with that.
How can you make people understand that when you stated earlier all politicians are liars?
Are Romney's lies more acceptable?
Nope....but obviously that isn't going to keep people from voting for him now is it?
Everyone that votes will be voting for a liar. Sorry....reality.
Fair enough, since we'll agree that all things will remain equal in that everyone will be voting for a liar, we can therefore eliminate this clause and begin looking at the validity, consistency and value their lies have provided in the form of results.
And that reply had to do with a reply you thought was great from another forum poster.
You didn't have any problem with it then.
Please give examples of lies Romney has told? Then be fair and give examples the president has told.
Something to ponder:
Obama Benefited Financially from the Auto Bailout
Earlier today, the Obama campaign pushed around a story that they claimed proved Mitt Romney "was against the auto bailout...but personally [benefited] from it."
"Today, [deputy campaign manger Stephanie] Cutter and the Obama campaign were pushing an article in The Nation saying that Romney - who opposed bailing out the auto industry as carried out by Obama - actually made $15.3 million from the bailout through a $1 million investment with a hedge fund firm that put cash into GM supplier Delphi,"
Obama, from his time as an Illinois state senator, is invested in the Illinois pension fund. Obama has between $50,000-$100,000 invested in the Illinois General Assembly Defined Pension Benefit Plan, according to financial disclosure forms.
And that pension fund is invested in the Delphi Corporation:
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/oba … 55001.html
Another instance of projecting one's own infractions upon your opponent!
"And that's to be expected, because if you don't have any fresh ideas, then you use stale tactics to scare voters.
If you don't have a record to run on, then you paint your opponent as someone people should run from. You make a big election about small things.
And you know what? It's worked before, because it feeds into the cynicism we all have about government. When Washington doesn't work, all its promises seem empty. If your hopes have been dashed again and again, then it's best to stop hoping and settle for what you already know. "
Oh there has been a dutifully ignored video of Obama lies posted in this thread already.
because usa needs liar in current scenario!!!!!!!!!!!....obama sold dreams ,though didnt lie because he was inexperienced and actually believed in those dreams...now liar would be better than fantasy man... at least liar knows what he is selling
Tell me, if nobody in the USA cares that a majority in the rest of the world regards their choices as stupid, why is the USA so keen to be seen as a leader of the world and a place of 'exceptionalism?"
I don't get that either.
Here we are - again - arguing over the merits of Obama vs Romney whereas what I find interesting is a comment on Reddit that someone from another country wants to know why people believe Romney - not why people believe Obama...
They believe him for the same reasons you believe Obama. Do you understand?
I mean I am so stupid that you probably can't even read this because I can't type well
Western Europe et al need to get over themselves.
If " the rest of the world" believes we are so stupid then why be concerned who we choose amongst ourselves as a leader? It should be no concern as we are so insignificant.
You didn't read the Reddit?
Because if a sociopath becomes the president of the most militarized country in the world, he will start wars that will destroy the rest of us. That's why they care....
He isn't a sociopath.
I am very sorry that it appears he will be President. It's no ones fault but the democrats.
However Mitt Romney is not going to destroy the world. Remember, you said the same thing about Ronald Reagan .....right?
The rest of the world traditionally looks to that militarized power when something goes wrong.
Do you want Mitt or Barack if Putin gets an itch?
I don't want Mitt interacting with any foreign heads of state.
He totall botched his summer tour. It's not easy to insult Britain, but he managed.
His foreign policy team of 24 includes 17 neocons from the Bush years.
http://www.policymic.com/articles/11219 … sh-neocons
Even the conservatives are pointing to Romney as Bush 2.0:
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/ … -bush-2-0/
Here's another criticism from The American Conservative:
"Romney has no foreign policy experience, and tonight everyone clearly saw that. He is superficially conversant with foreign policy issues, but hasn’t taken the time to learn enough about them to speak about them effectively or persuasively. Romney’s bad judgment and his lack of preparation on this front were on display, and it has probably become clear to a much wider audience that Romney lacks important qualifications for the Presidency.
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/ … gn-policy/
Romney can talk a good game on financial issues. "I ran companies for 25 years! Of course I can balance a budget!" (perhaps, but you wouldn't actually be the "boss" in Congress).
But on foreign policy, he seems to be about a half step ahead of Sarah "North Korea is our ally" Palin.
Between that and his temper, NOT someone I want with is finger on the button!
Americans, by and large, are extremely insular. They (we) have limited knowledge of the rest of the world or the politics or economics of individual nations or regions/zones.
They get all they need to know about other cultures from their usual news sources (which is to say, very limited and biased).
As a result, the typical American voting for Romney (and this is not to say that those who participate here are "typical") believes that Obama has been on an "apology tour" and has somehow weakened America's position in the world.
Americans have a very short attention span. We apparently have a short memory, too.
In 2008 Bush's policies were widely rejected. Eight years was more than enough.
We were weary of war -- two wars. Which we, as a nation, were not invested in or asked to sacrifice for (unless you had a son, daughter, mother, father, husband, wife, sister, brother, etc. in the military).
It was "over there" and we didn't see it.
We dutifully believed what our government told us about 9/11 and invading Iraq. If we didn't "Support Our Troops" with bumperstickers, we were accused of being unpatriotic.
Then, the economy crashed. It crashed big and hard.
None of us will ever know how bad it could have been, but from what I read, it would have been WORSE than the Great Depression.
Remember, Obama charmed his way in with a message of HOPE in 2008.
Somehow, I suspect he selected that campaign theme BEFORE the economy tanked. He made promises he never should have (5% unemployment? Really?).
Coming in, he had no idea how brutal things would get.
He severely underestimated the power of McConnell et al in Congress in blocking him.
But of course he can't run for a second term on "It could have been worse" and/or "It would have been better if Congress weren't buttheads."
Romney et al are right. Obama has NOT laid out an explicit plan of what he will do in his second term. I think he's learned that there are way too many things outside of his control (including the rest of the world).
I see it over and over. People honestly cannot name one positive thing Obama has done in 4 years. Whatever he has done has been minimized, or vilified as taking the country in the "wrong direction."
His administration has been singularly AWFUL at self-promotion or communication. It pains me as a marketer to see, but there it is.
As a result, the Limbaughs of the world are defining his administration for him.
Their modus operandi is to whip people up with fear and loathing.
Don't forget, too, that America functions best with a big, bad, scary nemesis.
Since we don't have a Cold War or a declared War on Terror to rally around, here's a novel idea! How about we rally against the nigger Muslim communist president?
Don't kid yourself that that's not reality.
But back to the economy:
Now, Americans are suffering. Things have not turned around fast enough or well enough. They don't understand -- nor do they care to understand -- the complex and interwoven factors that have kept our economy from rebounding. They believe what they're told. That gas prices were $1.89 under Bush (they actually went over $4 per gallon) and that today's high gas prices are ALL OBAMA'S FAULT. His stimulus FAILED. His regulations are killing jobs. He has tripled the deficit in 4 years.
Obamacare is a government takeover of healthcare AND it robs seniors of $716 billion in Medicare benefits.
(Not for anything, but it makes no sense for a president whose goal is to get as many Americans as possible covered with health insurance to take it away from Americans who already have it (seniors) to give to other Americans!!)
The government doesn't create jobs, the private sector creates jobs.
Or, the government isn't doing enough to create jobs.
Any way you look at it Obama's wrong.
And that's just on the domestic side. Forget any comprehension of how a global economy works or America's role/contribution to same.
So here's where Americans are now:
They want relief.
They want a scapegoat, and that's Obama.
They want a new, shiny messiah who will magically wave his wand and make things better. Not unlike (but they will never admit this) they just did in 2008 WITH Obama!
Americans are attracted to Romney BECAUSE he is a gazillionaire. He is the American Dream personified. And he LOOKS presidential (the non-racists here will jump on me for this, I know).
I truly believe that on some subconsious -- or even conscious -- level, Americans believe that with Romney in office, they will somehow share in his riches. He's rich so they will be, too.
They believe that because he knows how to turn around companies (they don't pay attention to the tactics used by Bain) he knows how to create jobs and he WILL create jobs.
Romney will return us to the mythical days of Reagan.
On the foreign policy front, someone (and I won't get into my conspiracy theories on this) has conveniently created a giant distraction with the Libya thing.
Rs tried to make a similar distraction with the AZ/Mexico border, but it didn't take.
Regardless, they now have Libya and that is the one and only foreign policy issue on most Americans' radar screens this week!
Well, except for Iran's nuclear capabilities and whether we are BFF with Israel or whether we see strategic value in maintaining relations with Palestine, too.
The Israel FIrsters and the anti-Muslim crazies (Michele Bachmann et al) are keeping quiet for now.
The Arab Spring is ancient history. The extreme volatility across the Middle East and Northern Africa -- way too complicated for Joe the Plumber and his ilk.
I've even heard some say that things were better with the likes of Quadhaffi in control. Now we don't know if we should support the new goverments or the rebels.
Yeah. It's messy, complicated, and a moving target.
Americans can't handle that.
You're either with us or against us. Your cowboy hat is either white or black.
Foreign policy comes down to which candidate represents a STRONGER America.
They still believe right is might.
More military, more saber rattling will put our "enemies" in their place, by God!
They want to believe that.
They don't want to know the details of what Obama's really done around the world, the delicate negotiations (including with China).
Obama is the G4 and they want the G5.
What they don't seem to get is that Romney is G2. Things have moved way beyond his outdated (Bushian) model that didn't work the first time.
They see the curtain, but they choose not to pull it back to reveal that the great and powerful Oz is a scammer. WHen you take off the smirking Romney mask, it's Bush underneath.
But it's been 4 years already. Come on.Obama has CLEARLY failed!
At the same time, it's only been 2 years since the tea party steamrolled into Congress.
But already they're out of favor, too.
I worry that as a nation we can no longer delay gratification for more than 2 seconds.
We cannot distinguish between politics and entertainment.
Is this the presidential election? Or American Idol?
I'm not sure if the Reddit folks will accept "Because we think we're voting on American Idol, that's why!" as an answer.
But you're welcome to try!
MM, This is why you are my new hero! Get on that soap box girl, and tell it like it IS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"But . . . but Paul Ryan has really, really gorgeous blue eyes and . . . and when he looks at me through that TV screen, I just know in my heart of hearts that he's telling me the truth . . . and, and Romney looks like a movie star and has a beautiful family so I just know he must be an honorable man!"
If only these people had a clue! Seriously . . . nice to see someone gets it! You go!
I guess the answer is simple? People look at a candidate like Romney, like a lottery ticket. Maybe they'll win, even though they have no idea what the ticket holds. Or in this case even though they have no idea what Romney's plans entail?
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