Would making these trans use their born gender bathroom cause problems?

1. 87

   Annsaloposted 9 years ago

   Would making these trans use their born gender bathroom cause problems?
   
   With all the issues right now around allowing trans to use the bathroom they identify, many people are fussing saying they should have to use the bathroom that identifies with what they were born as. However when they look like this photo, doesn't that pose a whole new set of issues? I mean these men (even if they were born as women) LOOK like men. They are men! How would you feel (ladies against trans using the bathroom they identify with) with these trans  being in the bathroom with your kids or yourself? Wouldn't it be best if they went to the men's bathroom?
   
   

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2. 74

   Aime Fposted 9 years ago

   First of all, Balian Buschbaum is SO super hot.  Love him.
   
   Secondly, yes, it's going to cause problems.  For women and for them.  Women are going to be shocked that there's a man using their bathroom and these men are basically forced into telling a bunch of complete strangers that they're transgendered.  If there was a law passed that required me to tell total strangers something very personal about myself repeatedly I would be livid and I think so would everyone else, but for some reason they just don't care when it comes to trans people.
   
   I don't doubt that I've shared a bathroom with a transgendered person before and I could not care less, it doesn't even crack my top 5000000 list of worries and concerns.  I don't understand what the fuss is about.

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      gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Just old dinosaurs ranting.  Have you read the book, Dinosaur Brain by  Albert J. Bernstein.  There are people who you CAN'T get across to.  They live in the Middle Ages sad to say.

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   2. 87

      Annsaloposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Totally agree with everything you said including your first sentence!

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3. 51

   bradmasterOCcalposted 9 years ago

   Until the public restrooms and the laws pertaining to male and female separate facilities are changed to conform to these minorities, the minorities need to work within the current rules.
   
   The only solution is to have one public restroom for everyone to use. What is the problem with that?

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   1. 87

      Annsaloposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      While I don't have a problem using the bathroom with anyone in there. Why should someone who looks like these photos need to use a separate public bathroom. Why shouldn't they be able to go the mens room? After all they have become men physically.

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   2. 69

      dashingscorpioposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      In the U.S. we're programmed to believe men & women can't share bathrooms without the risk of increasing sexual attacks.
      I'm told in parts of Europe unisex bathrooms exist. If it's all stalls that takes care of privacy; but one's fear.

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   3. 51

      bradmasterOCcalposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Dashingscorpio
      You really think the US is as simple as Europe? We have the most criminals of any country. Also, who is going to pay for all stalls? In parts of Europe, they call a hole in the floor the toilet. lol

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   4. 87

      RJ Schwartzposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Have they had the surgery to change their genitals ?

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      fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Not wanting 2 share a bathroom w/ a total stranger of the opposite sex, 4me. has ZERO to do w/ fear of being attacked! It's much simpler & clearer than that. I don't share a bathroom w/ the oppo sex IN MY OWN HOME!! Privacy, modesty,courtesy!!

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4. 81

   ptosisposted 9 years ago

   
   
   Sgt. Shane Ortega Puts a Face to the Transgender Military Ban  : Lets become more inclusive and say humans instead of dividing and pigeon-holing people.
   
   The Six Most Common Karyotypes
   X – Roughly 1 in 2,000 to 1 in 5,000 people (Turner’s )
   XX – Most common form of female
   XXY – Roughly 1 in 500 to 1 in 1,000 people (Klinefelter)
   XY – Most common form of male
   XYY – Roughly 1 out of 1,000 people
   XXXY – Roughly 1 in 18,000 to 1 in 50,000 births

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   1. 83

      gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      THANK YOU, PTOSIS, THIS IS THE 21ST CENTURY, NOT THE MIDDLE AGES!  WE ALL ARE ONE!

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   2. 84

      tamarawilhiteposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      The one in a thousand biological error does not invalidate the male/female binary for the human species.

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   3. 81

      ptosisposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Darwin may have been wrong about sex. Or at least too narrow minded.

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   4. 87

      RJ Schwartzposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Seriously almost everyone with Klienfelters doesn't even know they have it?  How about the true facts of trans people - high suicide, bullying, etc. - just because a couple of them make it doesn't justify the process

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5. 0

   LoliHeyposted 9 years ago

   So you're saying that the people in your picture are men? 
   
   The issue for me is safety.  A heterosexual man who is a sexual predator can easily pose as a transgender woman to get into the woman's bathroom.  Not only are women in there, but little girls as well.  So now mothers will not feel safe when their daughters go to the bathroom.  Yes, that could have happened before, but now the "doors are wide open."

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   1. 87

      Annsaloposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      The pictures were BORN female, and are now male. Would you prefer the people pictured come into the ladies room since they were born female? This is what a transgender looks like. Would you want someone who looks like a man in your ladies room?

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      Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Except there's nothing preventing a sexual predator man from dressing up as a woman now and doing the naughty stuffs.
      
      Hell, there's nothing preventing him from just walking into the bathroom and waiting. Your point gets an F.

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   3. 81

      ptosisposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Maybe we should have a separate bathroom for narrow minded meaness. And what could've happened before is reptilians disguised as humans changed the words from Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness to "life, liberty, and property" :0

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   4. 74

      Aime Fposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Having a law that states trans ppl can use whatever bathroom they identify with does not make me fear for my daughter's safety. Someone with bad intentions could be nearby every time we leave the house. I'd rather teach her acceptance than be fearful

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   5. 97

      Kylyssaposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      If transgender people who look like the men in the photos are forced to use the toilet intended for the sex of their birth, male perverts won't even have to dress up as women to sneak into ladies rooms, they can just say they are transgender!

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6. 65

   WordCrafter09posted 9 years ago

   First of all, I don't think any adults should be in any rest room with my young children/grandchildren (have neither right now) without my being there.  Second, I don't want people who look like those people in the picture standing next to me if I'm in the ladies' room, touching up make-up, fixing a hem, changing into new nylons if I got a run, etc. etc.  BUT, just as I have whatever reserve I have about my uses for a ladies' room; in fairness to guys who use the men's room, I have to respect any "reserve" some of them may have about someone who - let's be honest - has not completed a transition from one sex to the other.
   
   I have the deepest and sincerest concern and compassion for someone who has an "issue" with his/her own gender; but - I'm sorry, and in fairness (as far as I'm concerned) - I just think more single-user restrooms should make everyone happy, serve the purpose during the transition process, let those of us for whom our own gender is not an issue not have to make someone else's issue/concern our own.
   
   I walk in a suburb where the walking is exhausting and weird, and I've  been working on a getting a couple of injuries back to strength.  The traffic is irregular and varying, depending on the time of day/night.  So, the cross-walks are in the worst place they could be because after a long demanding walk to the main road I'm frazzled and aware of needing to rest a little (a couple of minutes) and get my head together so I don't do anything careless when I cross.  The curbs and other "accommodations" they have for people with physical issues aren't right for where my injuries were until recently.  So, I need to not-use the crosswalks and lights and walk yet a little farther to where I can rest a little, and cross where I'm less at risk of being hit by a car.
   
   The town accommodates people with "standard" disabilities and provides crosswalks and lights as well.  The fact that the standard accommodations don't work for me is my problem (a temporary one, but one nonetheless, for years).
   
   I don't ask for new crosswalks/lights where I'd prefer them, or for new/different curbs.  I just go with it, adjust to it,  and figure it's MY problem and not everyone else's.  The good thing is I've found ways to live my issue/problem without making it every else's.
   
   Point is, trans-gendered people (and I, as well) are not the only ones with kind of unique-ish issues that require a little adjusting and thinking out.

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   1. 84

      tamarawilhiteposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      The solution is counseling to rectify their minds with biological reality, not endorse their delusion that is in denial with biological reality.

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      fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Tamara...While I see your point & perhaps agree~~for the vast number existing, it would be a bit "too late" for what you suggest.

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7. 60

   fpherj48posted 9 years ago

   Ann.....This is more than I care to handle.  I've lived long enough to be existing in a world where these pictures are trans men who were born female? 
   Sorry to address the 800 lb gorilla in the room, but how do we know just how "complete" their surgery has gone?  Pictures are one thing but what is going on from the waist down here.
   These "people" are a far cry from poor Chas Bono!  It's OK. I'll say it~~ Cher has shown love & support for "Chas" which is what a Mom will do I'm sure.  However, behind closed doors, in her most private & authentic moments, how does a mother comes to terms with her once darling, precious little blonde daughter, now standing before her as an overweight, unattractive lonely male in a 3-piece suit?
   I give up.  Like I said in the beginning......I've lived long enough to literally outgrow my capacity to understand.  That's sad.

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   1. 87

      Annsaloposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      The Q was asked due to some saying people should use the bathroom of the gender they were born. Could you imagine the people in these pics just walking into a women's bathroom? I'm sure there are plenty of ladies who would be bothered!

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   2. 60

      fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Of course....My point is~ if they had "complete" trans surgery, why on earth would they use the Women's room?  In their case..NO ONE WOULD EVEN KNOW THEIR ORIGINAL GENDER!!

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      Aime Fposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Some men look like this but still haven't had reassignment surgery.. So the argument from some is that if you still have a vagina, you use the women's room. But of course if these guys walked into the room you'd have no idea they had lady parts.

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   4. 60

      fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      OK ladies, (from the generation B4 URs) Curiosity led me to research "Buck Angel." I am SO-so sorry I did. Alas, he is a "Porn Star" (how special) & photos were graphic. My lesson learned? This TOPIC is 1 I cannot & will not ever again respon

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   5. 60

      fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I am a "big girl" & no prude. I trust I am as open-minded as possible.  But this? This, I confess is a reality I can & will choose to "pretend" does not exist. It's just my own self-protection from what I cannot accept. We R who we are, after

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   6. 74

      Aime Fposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Haha, you perhaps picked the wrong one to Google for curiosity's sake.  Try Balian Buschbaum.  He's very smart, sweet, and lovely. Nothing that will scar you.
      
      (Also, how did you comment twice in a row?!)

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   7. 87

      Annsaloposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Paula to be honest I didn't know who he was either and googled after seeing your comment. Yup That was WAYYYYYYYYYYYYY WAYYYYYYYYYY More than I wanted to see!

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   8. 60

      fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Ann........LOL!!  Seriously!  I trust 9 out of 10 women I know (in any age bracket) would agree.  At least I can always HOPE so!  There are "limits" IMHO.  Enough is enough.....maybe enough is TOO much!!  LOL

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   9. 60

      fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Aime~~LOL  Not "perhaps," honey.....Point blank, I chose the wrong one to google! Commenting twice is "Ancient Chinese Secret"  LOL...just kidding.Send me Ur private email address via HP Gmail message & I'll share with U.

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   10. 87

       RJ Schwartzposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       People are not born with a Gender - they are born with a biological sex - gender is a social construct

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   11. 60

       fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Ralph, Thanks 4 the correction. Regardless, bio sex, gender,social construct~I've come 2 the conclusion I don't wish 2 discuss this topic 2 often w/ 2 many. How relieved that I retired much B4 this issue Bcame unavoidable. Call me a coward.

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   12. 60

       fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Ralph..In analyzing both terms, I have 2 ask U 2 explain how we R clearly required to check M or F in answer to "GENDER?" Has this "new" awareness also changed R verbiage & translation? Oddly, I'm happy 2B beyond the age of "getting" this.

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8. 84

   tamarawilhiteposted 9 years ago

   Yes, because you're having someone of the opposite sex seeing you unclothed and/or in a space where you're in a state of undress without your permission.
   It is insane to say that your right to privacy includes abortion but doesn't include a mentally ill man in a dress in the bathroom stall next to you, a transvestite (man in dress who doesn't think he's a woman) able to hector you on how you look, or a boy choosing to wear a dress to peep on women and getting away with it because saying he's a woman gives him the privilege to invade their privacy.
   In the case of these women who say they are men, they are invading the men's right to privacy by invading men's spaces, just as it is sexual harassment for a naked woman to walk into the men's locker room.

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   1. 74

      Aime Fposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      You know you're supposed to close the door while you're on the toilet so no one sees your pants down, right?
      
      Someone peeping over stalls won't "get away with it" - trans ppl allowed in the bathroom doesn't give ppl a pass to break the law

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   2. 87

      Annsaloposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      But these pictures are BORN women, even though they look like men now. Exactly which bathroom are they suppose to use in your opinion? The gender they are born or have become?

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      Aime Fposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Something tells me people won't be happy either way. If they look like that they shouldn't have been in the women's bathroom. If they have/had a vagina they shouldn't be in the men's room. I guess they hold it til they're home or go in a bush.

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   4. 87

      Annsaloposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Exactly. All the anti trans ppl say they are suppose to use the one they are born, but they also don't want these men in their bathroom. Pick one! They have to be able to use the bathroom. I think ppl think of Mrs Doubtfire instead of this reality.

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      Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      It's funny to think that all the people who are even making this an issue are the real perverts.
      
      I mean who else would care enough to want to cup check the person next to them in a public bathroom...

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      fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Link...LOL.  But I don't think it's THAT 4 most people. Speaking 4 myself, I simply do not appreciate "sharing" a personal (& what it thought 2B private) activity with total strangers of the opposite sex? Am I just as old Puritanical snob?  O wel

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   7. 84

      tamarawilhiteposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I've been confronted and harassed by a mentally ill man (transgender woman) in the bathroom, accosted because he didn't like how I looked at him when I went in the stall. And HR said it was a fight between two women, no protection for me.

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   8. 87

      Annsaloposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      So you are going to generalize all transgender people because of a few idiots? So you don't associate with anyone right? Since someone in every group has done something wrong.

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      Link10103posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      With your tone about the subject, one has to wonder if you knew beforehand she was transgender.
      
      It would be really easy to imagine why there was an issue if you did...

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   10. 87

       RJ Schwartzposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       So you want to penalize millions and their rights to privacy for a handful of people?  Bathrooms are sex based, not gender based - gender is an entirely man made social construct, nothing more.

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9. 55

   peter565posted 9 years ago

   Hmm...this is very interesting, because trans have the external appearance of the other gender, but the DNA of their original gender, nor do they have the reproduction system of the other gender. So, should we legally define them according to their original gender or their trans gender? Some psychology study have also found, trans demonstrate some gender base, personality, of their trans gender
   
   PS: I had a nightmare last night, I woke up in the morning and turned into a girl...NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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10. 0

    Hxprofposted 9 years ago

    There's no solution that will be 100% satisfying.  We're in a time in which mankind is pushing back boundaries that, IMO, we shouldn't be.

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11. 97

    Kylyssaposted 9 years ago

    Why is it that people against treating transgender people like human beings are so focused on the MTF folks and the possibility that heterosexual cisgender perverts could possibly dress up as women and enter ladies rooms? Is that a fantasy they have? Or are they really just hoping transwomen will be forced to share their bathrooms where they can more easily assault them?
    
    Why don't they realize that cisgender heterosexual male perverts could just walk into ladies rooms dressed as men if laws are made to make it so transgender people must use the bathroom of their birth sex? Those hot transgender dudes in the photos under the question would have to use the ladies room. A cisgender man could just say he's a transgender man and walk into any ladies room.
    
    I think unisex bathrooms are the real answer. Many first world countries use them and it hasn't resulted in anything bad. There's no reason to sexualize waste elimination. It's like sexualizing burping or sneezing.
    
    Meanwhile, why not just let people use the bathroom that is safest for them? Women cis and trans can use the ladies room and men cis and trans can use the men's room until we can grow out of this freakish cultural sexualization of toilets.
    
    And as a person who has cleaned both genders' bathrooms, men and women are exactly tied for who is more disgusting in the restroom. Women clog the toilets more, though.

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