More Condemning Emails - Will The Real Joe Biden Please Stand Up

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   Sharlee01posted 7 months ago

   
   
   "Then-Vice President Biden apparently used a pseudonym to discuss a future White House hire with his son, Hunter Biden, according to 2014 emails from Hunter’s laptop.
   
   In an email on June 23, 2014, Hunter emailed "Robin Ware" from his company email at Rosemont Seneca Partners.
   
   "Before you fill position pls talk to me----- J. McGrail very much wants to serve as detail fr treasury," Hunter wrote.
   
   RESPONSE -    A response just minutes later from the email account robinware456@gmail.com reads: "Re Johnny call me right away Dad."
   
   Robin Ware is one of several pseudonyms Biden used during his vice presidency to discuss government matters with his son, according to House Republicans investigating the Biden family.
   
   John McGrail was serving as senior counsel at the U.S. Treasury at the time of the emails. He joined the White House as Biden’s deputy counsel two months later, according to his LinkedIn profile.
   
   Today, McGrail is back at Treasury as counselor to the undersecretary for domestic finance.
   
   The revelations in the email come after the news broke this week that the Southeastern Legal Foundation (SLF) had sued the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA), demanding all Biden vice presidential records and communications related to three email accounts: robinware456@gmail.com, JRBWare@gmail.com and Robert.L.Peters@pci.gov.
   
   The SLF said it filed a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request in June 2022 for the records but has not seen a single document.
   
   NARA appeared to confirm the existence of more than 5,000 potentially responsive documents to the foundation’s FOIA request in a June 2022 email that was revealed as part of the lawsuit.
   
   "We have performed a search of our collection for Vice Presidential records related to your request and have identified approximately 5,138 email messages, 25 electronic files and 200 pages of potentially responsive records that must be processed in order to respond to your request," reads the email on June 24, 2022.
   
   "Please keep in mind that these totals are an estimate and that all material processed may not be applicable to your specific topic," it continued. "The staff of the Archival Operations Division is currently processing and reviewing FOIA requests that precede your request. To treat everyone equitably, we have placed your request in our Complex queue by the date it was received in our office."
   
   House Oversight Committee Chairman Rep. James Comer also sent a letter to NARA this month to request unredacted email communications between Biden and his son related to Ukraine, Burisma and all documents related to the pseudonyms.
   
   "Joe Biden has stated there was ‘an absolute wall’ between his family’s foreign business schemes and his duties as vice president, but evidence reveals that access was wide open for his family’s influence peddling," Comer said.
   
   "We already have evidence of then-Vice President Biden speaking, dining, and having coffee with his son’s foreign business associates," he said. "We also know that Hunter Biden and his associates were informed of then-Vice President Biden’s official government duties in countries where they had a financial interest. The National Archives must provide these unredacted records to further our investigation into the Biden family’s corruption."
   
   https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden- … mail-shows
   
   National Archives reveals it has 5,400 Biden emails in which the president potentially used FAKE NAMES to forward government information and discuss business with son Hunter.
   
   NARA has acknowledged holding around 5,400 emails, electronic records, and documents suggesting President Biden used pseudonyms while Obama's VP
   
   The existence of the emails came to light in response to a Freedom of Information Act request submitted in June 2022
   
   Emails are connected to the aliases Robin Ware, Robert L. Peters, and JRB Ware — all pseudonyms the 80-year-old president was known to utilize while serving
   
   To see documents source
   https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl … -them.html
   
   My view  --   It's become imperative to initiate the impeachment process against Joe Biden. The mounting evidence cannot be disregarded any longer. At this juncture, it is Congress's responsibility to present all this evidence to the public. A trial would grant the committee the authority to summon witnesses and request documents from NARA. Urgency is paramount, as the general public deserves access to the information that has come to light concerning Joe Biden and his family.

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      Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

      My first reaction? The freedom caucus has to come up with some sort of a distraction for Trump's many indictments. I think they are trying to throw everything they can at the wall in an attempt to stir up enough votes for an impeachment inquiry.
      
      Several of Trump's Georgia gang have invoked their right to a speedy trial. We are looking at October trials and Georgia law allows for cameras and live streaming.  Now that's what I call must watch TV.
      
      But back to these emails.. are Republicans asking me to believe that  Biden used his gmail account to do bribe stuff, and then CC’d the National Archives to ensure that there would be a record of it?  Call me a cynic but it just doesn't seem likely.

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         Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

         It is very apparent they are digging deep, and coming up with lots of smoke. Congress needs to put up or shut up.
         
         I agree we are in for some interesting TV watching.
         
         I feel the email is somewhat damming. It shows Hunter was consulting with his dad, in regard to a person wanting to be appointed to a position.
         
         ". "Before you fill position pls talk to me----- J. McGrail very much wants to serve as detail fr treasury," Hunter wrote.
         
         RESPONSE -    A response just minutes later from the email account robinware456@gmail.com reads: "Re Johnny call me right away Dad."

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            Credence2posted 7 months agoin reply to this

            But, it is like you say when it comes to allegations against Trump, innocent until proven guilty......

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               Valeantposted 7 months agoin reply to this

               And even if someone went to Hunter to have him put in a good word with Dad about a job, that's not really much of a crime.  Because that's about all the e-mail notes.  If that's what the right is considering 'smoke,' then their idea of what constitutes smoke is about as accurate was what constitutes massive election fraud.

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                  Credence2posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                  "If that's what the right is considering 'smoke,' then their idea of what constitutes smoke is about as accurate was what constitutes massive election fraud."
                  
                  Valeant, it is more about "blowin smoke"....

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               Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

               Please note, by no means did I imply Biden is guilty of any crime in my comment.
               
               I share a similar perspective when it comes to the allegations surrounding Biden and his family. I firmly believe in the principle of "innocent until proven guilty." However, I believe it's time for Congress to make a decisive move regarding the ongoing investigations. The continuous cloud of suspicion is becoming burdensome, and it's essential to either proceed with impeachment or put an end to the investigation. Much like the numerous investigations involving Trump, we need a thorough examination of the facts to uncover the truth. I firmly believe that no one, including Biden, should be exempt from the law or treated differently under its jurisdiction. Holding this belief, I must avoid being a hypocrite in this matter.

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                  Credence2posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                  "Please note, by no means did I imply Biden is guilty of any crime in my comment."
                  -------
                  Of course you didn't.
                  
                  I am not advocating that anyone is to be exempt from the application of the law. I am just waiting for the substantive evidence before I consider President Biden complicit in any wrong doing,

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                     savvydatingposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                     No sound person believes you are “waiting” for evidence. The laptop from hell contains more than sufficient evidence. Furthermore, if you knew what else is contained in that laptop…
                     You would vomit if you had a shred of decency for the plight of …
                     
                     Observe the racist hero of unknowing Democrats and all Progressives.
                     
                     https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ifjzQxY-Jag

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                        abwilliamsposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                        Knowing, not caring.
                        Knowing, ignoring.

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                        Credence2posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                        Then bring on the indictments and subsequent charges, I am waiting....too many of you   "are" what you accuse Biden of being, the differences come down to just a matter of degree and extent.

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                           Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                           "matter of degree and extent."   So this indicates you put a weight on breaking our laws.  Am I wrong?

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                              Credence2posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                              No, Sharlee, I was speaking about the accusation made by Savvy of Biden being a racist.....

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                                 Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                                 Got it.

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                           savvydatingposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                           False. No Republican on this site has ever made a racist statement, nor are we pathological liars or criminals. Nor are Republicans, in general. Nor is racism a part of our history. We were and we remain the Party of Lincoln.
                           
                           However, you have used terms like “whitey righty” and “missy Ann.” Not okay.
                           
                           As for indictments against Biden, the Democratic power machine is long, deep and corrupt, and it has been throughout its history. They will protect Biden as long as he remains loyal to their agenda. So, of course they will not bring indictments against him. That would be like exposing their own corruption.
                           
                           The Democrats are trying to destroy Trump and they have been since he announced his presidency the first time. Yet he remains standing. Ironically, Trump is the only president who kept all of his promises and he has done more for Blacks than any president, except Lincoln.
                           
                           As an aside, I will only add that I am no longer concerned about the delicate sensibilities of never-Trumper’s and Rhino’s who will never vote for Trump because they hate his manners.
                           They are useless and my Party doesn’t need them. Minorities will carry the day and defeat the Democrats in the next election, ironic as that may sound to some.
                           Minorities are waking up. They no longer want to be labeled as victims who supposedly need to be taken care of by Daddy Democrat, an entity that has never served them well, but who has used them for cheap votes.
                           
                           Just because your Party willing believes Trump is an evil person due to the false narrative created by powerful Democrats and the media that is beholden to them, that in no way makes their narrative true.
                           
                           Rather, it is simple proof that propaganda is a powerful tool, that many are easily swayed, sometimes because of their own propensities, other times because they are weak.

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                              Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                              So well said

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                              Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                              "Trump is the only president who kept all of his promises and he has done more for Blacks than any president, except Lincoln."
                              
                              He certainly did not keep all of his promises but which promises that he kept do you find were most beneficial for all americans?
                              
                              In terms of what he has done for blacks, can you be more specific? Specific policy or legislation.
                              
                              As far as  Trump being an evil person, I believe it's more so that many believe his character, lack of integrity and continued lying are qualities beneath the office of president. .  He is a wannabe autocrat who mainly appeals to far right white nationalists. Not to mention that during his one term he showed shocking ignorance of basic political terms and of the mechanisms of government.  On any level, the man has never been presidential material.

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                                 Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                                 Unemployment rates for Blacks hovered for months at or near historic lows. Workers with less than a high school diploma and criminal records left the sidelines of the workforce.
                                 
                                 Before the coronavirus, the labor force participation rates of Blacks, prime-age workers 25 to 54, and women ticked up from Obama-era lows. Even years into the Obama economic recovery, these workers were still leaving the labor force.
                                 
                                 The Census Bureau just released stunning statistics about the economic well-being of Americans in 2019. Minority groups benefited greatly from the remarkable labor market that preceded the coronavirus epidemic. 
                                 
                                 President Donald Trump on Oct. 17, 2020, in Norton Shores, Michigan.
                                 Unemployment rates for Blacks hovered for months at or near historic lows. Workers with less than a high school diploma and criminal records left the sidelines of the workforce.
                                 
                                 Before the coronavirus, the labor force participation rates of Blacks, prime-age workers 25 to 54, and women ticked up from Obama-era lows. Even years into the Obama economic recovery, these workers were still leaving the labor force.
                                 
                                 High employment under Trump led to minorities experiencing the largest income gains. Real median income grew by 7.9% for Blacks in 2019. That outpaced 2018’s income growth of 2.6% and 2017’s income decline of -2.4%. Notably, Black median income growth last year surpassed income growth rates under the Obama administration. There’s still more work to do though. Although Black median income hit a new high, Blacks earned the lowest income level of all groups (just over $45,000 a year).
                                 
                                 Income gains for Blacks translated into real economic mobility. Not only did the poverty rate for Blacks fall to an all time record low in 2019, but it also dipped below 20% for the first time. At the other end of the economic scale, more Black households earned six-figure incomes than the year before. 
                                 
                                 What did Trump do for education?
                                 President Trump has led a national conversation on expanding school choice and introduced the most transformative education funding proposal ever, Education Freedom Scholarships. President Trump has twice signed legislation re-authorizing the D.C. Opportunity Scholarship program.Dec 28, 2020
                                 
                                 Promise made and kept  --
                                 
                                 "President Donald Trump on Thursday signed a bipartisan bill that will PERMANENTLY  provide more than $250 million a year to the nation’s historically black colleges and universities, along with dozens of other institutions that serve large shares of minority students. (Yes I know Obama also provided funds to Black colleges, but nothing permanent)
                                 
                                 In signing the bill, Trump said historically black schools have “never had better champions in the White House.”
                                 
                                 “When I took office, I promised to fight for HBCUs, and my administration continues to deliver,” Trump said. “A few months ago, funding for HBCUs was in jeopardy. But the White House and Congress came together and reached a historic agreement.”
                                 
                                 I am not here to compare. I am stating many of the positive things Trump did for Black Citizens. No need for anyone to inform me of what any other president has done ---  I think most of our presidents have had accomplishments. This should not take away Trump's accomplishments. The compare game is getting very old Here.

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                                    Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                                    I'm not sure if it's fair to call it an accomplishment if you are simply riding  the wave of the guy before you and have had no legislation to point to in terms of taking credit for advances in anything. 
                                    
                                    If I'm a newly hired employee in a random office, is it fair to credit me with the lower cost of office supplies due to the employee who left before me who chose new vendors? 
                                    
                                    At any rate, what really irks me and it has not been mentioned anywhere in these forums is Trump's defamation of Georgia election workers Shay Moss and Ruby Freeman. 
                                    I'm very happy that Rudy Giuliani is being held accountable and hope that they choose to seek a civil suit on Trump also.  What kind of person does this? These women experienced and still experience death threats and racist attacks.  The man has zero integrity or morality.
                                    I am deeply offended by this behavior and I am disturbed at the seeming indifference displayed by so many of my fellow citizens.  Is this okay for some of you? You can skip to 5:50 in the video .  She called Shaye Moss hustler.  This is just reprehensible.
                                    
                                    https://youtu.be/zy_UbpC7S-0?si=LFOuYEVmU56hGVKr

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                              Credence2posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                              This is one of those opportunities to sharpen my pen over a comment.
                              
                              Party of Lincoln? Honest Abe has to be spinning in his grave over that one.
                              
                              This big wave of minorities voting for a party that would denigrate their interests is just more Fox News propaganda.
                              -------
                              "Rather, it is simple proof that propaganda is a powerful tool, that many are easily swayed, sometimes because of their own propensities, other times because they are weak."
                              
                              Ask yourself, how much of that "propaganda" comes from your side of the divide?
                              
                              
                              https://www.c-span.org/presidentsurvey2 … ge=overall
                              
                              Funny how that turns out, you say that he was the greatest President for Blacks since Lincoln, how are you qualified to know that? I don't say that and I AM black, and neither did the 85 to 90 percent of blacks that voted for Biden say it.  But  I forgot, outside of your credentials as a PHd climatologist, you also have a Doctorate in the Game of Life. So the question is, do I believe all these renown historians from the country's most esteemed colleges and universities or do I believe Savvy? Am I in a bit of quandary here? As for the greatest President, the debate is between Washington and Lincoln, and I prefer Lincoln. When it comes to Trump, the only real debate is whether he is on the bottom or immediately above it. William Henry Harrison, President for one month dying of pneumonia, scored better.
                              
                              Trump is an evil person because of the behavior and actions Trump took, not because anyone is out to get him. He makes his own deliberate mistakes and he will be held to account for them.
                              
                              
                              
                              "However, you have used terms like “whitey righty” and “missy Ann.” Not okay."
                              
                              You still regurgitating this stuff? I going to call a spade a spade (no pun intended) whenever I deem it appropriate.
                              
                              "As for indictments against Biden, the Democratic power machine is long, deep and corrupt, and it has been throughout its history. They will protect Biden as long as he remains loyal to their agenda. So, of course they will not bring indictments against him. That would be like exposing their own corruption."
                              
                              Excuses, excuses, and pretty pi$$ poor ones at that. Bring on the proof!

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                                 savvydatingposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                                 Well, a progressive someone seems to have got her panties in a bunch.
                                 
                                 You might want to sharpen your pen a little better next time. This tirade didn’t cut it. Maybe next time, dear.
                                 
                                 Oh, and as you like to say, “nothing personal.”

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                           abwilliamsposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                           Shameful; you know we aren't the people you attempt to portray us to be. Yet, you do it with every opportunity.

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                              Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                              Deleted
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                                 Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                                 Research has extensively documented that Trump's voters are predominantly white, non-educated, evangelical and middle-class, and that it was primarily the question of identity, especially related to race, religion and gender, more than the economy, that was the driving force behind Trump's election in 2016.
                                 
                                 https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads … education/

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                              savvydatingposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                              This is true, which is why I take the time to call out the egregious and irresponsible propaganda that has been placed upon an entire population.
                              
                              Especially given the Biden family’s compromised stance with the CCP.

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                              Credence2posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                              Well, AB, at one time I though that the "other side" were sincere people with differing opinions as to how to proceed forward. But from What I have seen over the last 5 years, I don't know or have anything in common with the "other side" short of sharing the same geographical space.
                              
                              I copied this from Willow which is honestly what I believe the "secret sauce" is that gets Trump all of his supporters. And not just for 2016, but for 2020 and upcoming 2024.
                              
                              "Research has extensively documented that Trump's voters are predominantly white, non-educated, evangelical and middle-class, and that it was primarily the question of identity, especially related to race, religion and gender, more than the economy, that was the driving force behind Trump's election in 2016."
                              
                              How can I find that to be anything that I can embrace?

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                     Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                     Have you had the opportunity to stay updated on the latest developments from Congress? There seems to be a significant volume of bank records, documentation, and firsthand accounts from whistleblowers, along with information sourced from Hunter's laptop. Additionally, White House records indicate meetings between VP Biden and Hunter's business associates. To maintain accuracy and fairness in our discussions, I believe it would be appropriate to provide supporting documentation for these claims, as I value the importance of evidence when addressing such matters.
                     
                     JOE BIDEN MET WITH HUNTER'S BUSINESS ASSOCIATES 16 TIMES
                     https://gop.com/rapid-response/joe-bide … -16-times/
                     
                     I could go into a lengthy presentation of what information the Congress has dug up. I am not interested in persuading anyone of anything.
                     
                     I did not accuse Biden of anything. I have presented information on a newly found email chain between Hunter and his dad. I see lots of smoke, but that is a personal view.  I have followed and researched the information that has come into the public eye.  I hold the same sentiment in regard to Biden as Trump --- innocent until found guilty due to evidence presented in a trial.
                     
                     Congress needs to do its job at this point...

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                        Credence2posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                        I have no doubt that you have researched the topic to exhaustive detail, but much of the evidence you present to implicate Biden has been presented to condemn Trump. Yet, you found that information regarding Trump as inconclusive?
                        
                        I say let the investigators loose and they are obligated to follow all the crumbs to their source. I will pay much more attention when indictments and charges are brought forth.

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                           Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

                           All I've provided is information, and as of now, there's a lot of speculation. However, we continue to see leaks nearly every day, some of which are quite damning, although they aren't directly tied to Joe receiving money.
                           
                           I haven't found the information on either individual to be definitively conclusive or inconclusive. As a nation, we're poised to witness Trump defending himself, all stemming from several ongoing investigations.
                           
                           I won't be content until there's a thorough investigation into Biden and his son Hunter. Given the circumstances, it's only fair to expect all these allegations to be subject to rigorous scrutiny.

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         DrMark1961posted 7 months agoin reply to this

         My impression is that the Trump indictments are an attempt to divert atttention away from the Biden corruption.I think the TDSers are trying to throw whatever they can at the guy to distract away from the real issue.

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      Miebakagh57posted 7 months agoin reply to this

      I'll watch on the side line.

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   Valeantposted 7 months ago

   Now if this Congress could just find a high crime or misdemeanor that Biden committed during this term of office.  Impeaching someone for something done during a previous term, while holding a different position is just ridiculousness.  Even if they prove he did what they think, this impeachment is seven years too late.

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   Sharlee01posted 7 months ago

   Consider this hypothetical situation: If a Vice President of the United States were to be found in a situation where he, along with his son and potentially other family members, were allegedly involved in the sale of political favors from the White House to foreign countries, it would be concerning. This family could be suspected of establishing multiple LLCs that provide no discernible services and have raised 150 red flags in bank alerts. Moreover, if the Vice President were documented to have met with his son's business associates 16 times at the White House while claiming not to have discussed his son's business affairs, and if bank records indicate financial transactions with China despite denials, it would be crucial to request sources and supporting documentation, including witness transcripts, to validate these claims.
   https://oversight.house.gov/landing/bid … stigation/
   
   The son left a laptop carelessly in a repair shop, and became the property
   of the FBI --- and then before the 2020 election we have more than 50 former senior intelligence officials signed on to a letter outlining their belief that the recent disclosure of emails allegedly belonging to Joe Biden’s son “has all the classic earmarks of a Russian information operation.”
   https://www.politico.com/news/2020/10/1 … nfo-430276
   
   A video of that VP holding one billion dollars over the heads of the Ukraine president to fire an AG investigating the Gas company his son is receiving millions from.  Then learning the  White House was actually pleased with the job the Ukrainian AG was doing.   https://nypost.com/2023/08/23/team-obam … him-fired/
   
   Emails trickle out between the VP and his son from the son's confiscated laptop, which shows the son is clearly discussing businesses.
   
   "Then-Vice President Biden apparently used a pseudonym to discuss a future White House hire with his son, Hunter Biden, according to 2014 emails from Hunter’s laptop.
   
   In an email on June 23, 2014, Hunter emailed "Robin Ware" from his company email at Rosemont Seneca Partners.
   
   "Before you fill position pls talk to me----- J. McGrail very much wants to serve as detail fr treasury," Hunter wrote.
   
   RESPONSE -    A response just minutes later from the email account robinware456@gmail.com reads: "Re Johnny call me right away Dad."
   
   Robin Ware is one of several pseudonyms Biden used during his vice presidency to discuss government matters with his son, according to House Republicans investigating the Biden family.
   
   John McGrail was serving as senior counsel at the U.S. Treasury at the time of the emails. He joined the White House as Biden’s deputy counsel two months later, according to his LinkedIn profile.
   
   "I am sitting here with my father and we would like to understand why the commitment made has not been fulfilled," Hunter Biden allegedly wrote. "Tell the director that I would like to resolve this now before it gets out of hand, and now means tonight."
   
   "And, Z, if I get a call or text from anyone involved in this other than you, Zhang, or the chairman, I will make certain that between the man sitting next to me and every person he knows and my ability to forever hold a grudge that you will regret not following my direction," the message continued. "I am sitting here waiting for the call with my father." https://abcnews.go.com/US/hunter-biden- … =100338044
   
   Thoughts -- Does what I presented consist of a hell of a lot of smoke?  It would seem some think just because it may have happened when this now president was the VP, this should be ignored, forgotten, water under the bridge...
   
   Do you think this kind of possible corruption needs to be investigated, or just forget about all the information that has been presented by Congress?
   
   With all the smoke that surrounds this  VP be someone you want as The president of The United States? 
   
   Would you want him sitting in the White House without an investigation?
   
   Are you willing to ignore the information that has been uncovered? Hey, it happened years ago... 
   
   I must admit while putting this together, it sickened me. What the hell has happened to common sense?

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      Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

      "if the Vice President were documented to have met with his son's business associates 16 times at the White House while claiming not to have discussed his son's business affairs, "
      
      Question, is it possible that father and son could meet without discussing business? 
      Republicans right now are asking me to buy into a complete narrative of unsubstantiated allegations. Time to put up definitive proof. 
      
      From a Fox news interview:
      
      "Republican Representative Nick Langworthy tried to defend the GOP investigation into Joe Biden’s alleged corruption—only to end up admitting that they still don’t have any proof."
      
      Langworthy fumbled that point big time on Thursday during an interview with Fox News. Fox correspondent Gillian Turner pointed out that Republicans have yet to produce “a smoking gun: clear-cut, undeniable proof of the president’s involvement.”
      
      Oh my and it goes on..
      
      "Well, we’ve never claimed that we have direct money going to the president, but many members of his family have received money from foreign governments,” Langworthy said.
      
      Turner interrupted to correct him: “That is precisely the claim that the chairman of your committee, James Comer, and also Jim Jordan have made many times,” she said, referring to House Judiciary Chair Jim Jordan, who alongside Comer has spearheaded the charge against Biden.
      
      At this point, the committee is not looking very competent.  It looks like they're hoping Americans will buy the smoke show.  Unfortunately for them that isn't going to do it for most of us out here.

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         Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

         I'm not seeking anyone's belief here, including yours or anyone else's. Instead, I've shared information supported by credible sources. I've followed up with inquiries and shared one profound personal reflection: "I must confess, as I compiled this, it deeply troubled me. How did we lose our grasp on common sense?"
         
         My intentions behind the scenario I presented were driven by the best motives. I was attempting to gain insights or validate something about of the human psyche.
         
         You did not address the questions.  You ignored the "smoke" entirely.  You just went after those that are blowing the smoke... What about all the information that has been collected?  The bank records, the emails, the information form people that have been interviewed?   Do you find it all very innocent?

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            Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

            "What about all the information that has been collected?  The bank records, the emails, the information form people that have been interviewed?   Do you find it all very innocent?"
            
            At this point, I find it all one-sided.  I find it to be information that Republicans are pushing forward and asking me to believe but I need the whole picture. Any point of information they are presenting at this point could have a multitude of explanations.  I need the whole story and at this point it is half a story.  I'm not inclined to believe a one-sided push to believe their interpretation of emails, their interpretation of bank records.  As far as smoke goes,  it can be created at will, on anyone. 
            The average American's IQ is 98 and the average American reads at a 7th to 8th grade level. Politicians know this.   The facts are, the average American doesn't have the ability to figure a lot of this out beyond what they are fed in their news bubble.  We aren't a nation of critical thinkers for the most part. Facts are facts.

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      Valeantposted 7 months agoin reply to this

      This hypothetical, like so many other we see at this site, omits many key data points to arrive at its flawed conclusion.
      
      The first being that Shokin was not corrupt.
      https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl … 47001.html
      
      Add this fact:  In July 2015, shortly after his appointment, reformist minority member Yehor Soboliev advanced a motion to dismiss Shokin for corruption, gaining 127 of the required 150 signatures including several members of the ruling parties.  Representatives of the EU and the United States pressed Poroshenko for his removal, as did the World Bank and International Monetary Fund.  The feelings that the international community felt Shokin being corrupt were prior to July of 2015 then.  And how exactly did Joe Biden orchestrate a vote of the EU?
      
      Or this article from December 2015:  https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2015 … corruption
      
      As to the bank accounts, there is zero evidence that any of the them tie back to Joe Biden.  This hypothetical conspicuously omits Devon Archer's testimony that Joe Biden was not in on his son's plan to sell the appearance of access to his father.  So when Hunter says he's sitting with his father, and he's clearly not, that shadiness is about Hunter.  Which we've all known about Hunter's shadiness long before now.
      
      And the usage of private e-mails for personal correspondence with his son is not really much.  Neither is Hunter wanting to give a reference to a friend, someone the elder Biden referred to by his first name (Johnny) - meaning that person was likely a close acquaintance already.  Pretty normal in today's society to use people you know to try and get better jobs.  Where's the crime there?
      
      As usual, so many posts have key omissions of facts that undermine the conclusions trying to be reached.  This one is the latest in a long line of them.

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         Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

         Very interesting. I believe we will have more details as to when the impeachment inquiry begins. Hopefully, if there was wrongdoing, and the Bidens, Hutner, and Joe each accepted 5 million for getting Shokin fired justice will come to the Biden's. Or they will be exonerated. It's been reported  ---- "WASHINGTON — The FBI source who reported President Biden's alleged role in a bribery scheme said that a Ukrainian businessman claimed to keep as “insurance” 15 audio recordings of first son Hunter Biden and two of Joe Biden, a Republican senator revealed Monday."
         
         "Audacity is Joe Biden’s magic power.
         
         When the walls are closing in, he laughs in your face and dares you to come after him.
         
         He did it last week when he laughed at a question about “damning evidence in an FBI file” that he allegedly took a $5 million bribe from a Ukrainian energy company in return for a policy decision when he was vice president.
         
         “Where’s the money?” he quipped, before calling the allegation “a bunch of malarkey.”
         
         Forgive us if we don’t take the president at his word, because he has lied before about his involvement in the international “pay to play” scheme run by his son Hunter and brother Jim during his vice presidency.
         
         But his cockiness in the face of mounting evidence before the House Oversight Committee of shady foreign millions flowing into Biden family bank accounts needs to be understood, not only in terms of his personality, but in the context of whistleblower claims about an FBI cover-up.
         
         If you were frustrated that the Delaware investigation into the president’s wayward 53-year-old son has failed to reach a conclusion after five long years, you won’t be surprised to hear about efforts to derail the case.
         
         I would think if this is true Congress will need cooperation from the FBI in regard to clarification if these tapes exist.
         https://nypost.com/2023/06/11/biden-lau … er-mounts/
         
         If the Bidens are guilty of pay for play --- it would seem they would be caught out of sheer sloppiness.

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   Valeantposted 7 months ago

   If they are guilty...
   There may be tapes...
   I believe we will have more details...when the impeachment inquiry begins...
   
   And when Biden notes that he's in no way tied to the money, as the GOP readily admits, you fall back onto an unverified tip by an oligarch tied to Russia's interests.  Might as well just put a Russian flag outside the house at this point for all the efforts that are put in to spread their misinformation.
   
   It's all speculation, and yet the far-right is sold.  It'd be more believable if the GOP didn't already shred their credibility by getting no charges against key figures in the Benghazi and Hillary's e-mails investigations.

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      Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

      Joe Biden's credibility has come into question, as he has made statements that contradict verifiable facts, particularly regarding his son's business dealings. For example, he claimed, "My son has not made money in terms of this thing about, what are you talking about, China," a statement rated as "Four Pinocchios" by the Washington Post fact-checker.
      https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics … otherwise/
      
      This raises concerns about the accuracy of Joe's statements, suggesting either a lack of precision in his words or potential memory issues.
      
      In regards to all the ifs --  In today's political landscape, there are numerous uncertainties. For instance, if Trump were to be found guilty or acquitted...
      It's worth noting that past investigations involving Hillary Clinton appeared to result in her not being charged with anything.  Many feel she has been guilty of many wrongdoings, but let off the hook. I have no thoughts on Hillary and her many scandals.
      Regardless, the forthcoming impeachment inquiry is likely to receive extensive media coverage, offering Americans insight into Congress's findings regarding Biden and his family. This exposure may influence some independent voters to lean towards the Republican party, a development that could potentially benefit them.

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         Valeantposted 7 months agoin reply to this

         I'll take the DOJ's 91.4% conviction rate from 2022 on where I'll put my faith, as opposed to the GOP's record in bringing their allegations that end up in convictions.

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            Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

            It seems this DOJ let many off the hook... LOL
            
            In fiscal year 2022, only 290 of 71,954 defendants in federal criminal cases – about 0.4% – went to trial and were acquitted, according to a Pew Research Center analysis
            
            Guess they pick carefully cases they feel they can win. How sad for the justice system.

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               Valeantposted 7 months agoin reply to this

               Man, your omission of the facts is getting even brazen.
               
               Here are the parts you left out from your same source:
               
               Another 1,379 went to trial and were found guilty (1.9%). The overwhelming majority of defendants in federal criminal cases that year did not go to trial at all. About nine-in-ten (89.5%) pleaded guilty, while another 8.2% had their case dismissed at some point in the judicial process, according to the data from the Administrative Office of the U.S. Courts.

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