Do people choose to be gay?

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brimancandyposted 13 years ago
All the big words, and mumbo jumbo in some of the posts in this thread are more confusing than the bible. makes me wonder if some people get out the dictionary so they can use big words to make themselves sound intelligent.

Here's another answer to this question.

NO!
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Troy C.posted 13 years ago
There's a choice in every action taken by anyone, we all face temptations and desires on a daily basis; the question is do we succom to them or not
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hello Troy, Welcome back
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  Susana Sposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  There is a choice in the action, but not in the feeling.
  
  You can't choose not to feel attracted to someone, you can only choose what you do about it.
  
  When there is mutual attraction between adults, it's no one else's business what they do.
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theherbivorehippiposted 13 years ago
hmmm....I was going to come comment on this one but I see it's turned into a religious forum. I shall sneak back out quietly.
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Who but certain types of religious people would answer the OP's question in the affirmative?
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  R.S. Hutchinsonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  @ theherbivorehippi... I know right! I really wasn't expecting that.. cest la vie.
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  theherbivorehippiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  lol...I've been on a "time out" for three days. I must stay out of heated conversations. This has become a "no-no" thread...me and religion don't play very well together.
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Woman Of Courageposted 13 years ago
Yes people choose to be gay. They were not born that way.
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  recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  This goes against all scientific understanding of the issue and is deeply insulting to gay people - are you saying you know more than people far more clever than yourself ? if so perhaps you can explain how this works through hormones and gender assignment in the womb versus the idea of hiccups in the nurture of an individual ?
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  janikonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Okay, prove this statement - if you're going to sit there, assuredly typing this comment out, I would like proof beyond a reasonable doubt I chose to be gay; that ten years old, I woke up one morning and thought, "hmmm, today I think I'll try something different"
  
  So, instead of quoting scripture or rightest propaganda or simply taking your word it, I would like some proof and I don't count something Exodus International put in their pamphlet or something Johnny-Use-To-Be gay told you at the church picnic - I want hardcore, concrete, facts.
  
  And, personally, I think I, and every other homosexual/lesbian taking part in this forum, deserve it, especially if you're going to make such a brazen, self-assured, statement.
  
  Oh and, just so we all clear this is coming from a happy place, I'll end my comment with this - you know, to keep things light.
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  1. She thinks gays and lesbians are doing the devil's work by being gay.
  2. She doesn't think G-d would create evil beings.
  3. So, she thinks people chose to be evil by being gay. They're just under the spell of Satan and can return to goodness (heterosexuality) by praying hard enough.
  4. Incidentally, she believes people are gay because they were molested or raped. Seriously.
  
  Just so you know what you're up against...
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  livelonger, "she thinks" she thinks" How can you possibly know what I'm thinking. I find it very impolite of how you twisted my words. You did not post exactly what I have stated in your last sentence #4). Your entire post is completely false concerning me. I have politely reported you to hubpages for making false accusations against my character. I am not here to argue. Hopefully, you're calm down soon.
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Please, correct me if I'm wrong, then.
  
  Is homosexuality an evil "act"?
  Did G-d create gay people gay, or are they turning away from G-d by being gay?
  Do you believe gay people can become heterosexual by praying to G-d?
  
  As for the rape/molestation matter, we've been through this. You've said most gay people were raped/molested.
  
  I'm not talking about your character. I'm talking about the beliefs you have that have no foundation in either science or in what Jesus said.
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  Job Helpposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You absolutely can be freed from homosexuality by praying to God.
  
  Jesus said in John 14:13: You can ask for anything in my name, and I will do it, so that the Son can bring glory
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks, Marcus!
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Amen Job. There are people who have shared with me how God set them free from homosexuality. I love the scripture you posted.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Homosexuality isn't a disease of some sort. One doesn't free themselves of it.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I agree with you. It isn't a disease, and one doesn't free themselves of it. God does, but only if an individual allows him to set them free.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  BS.
  
  Goes to show you how little you think of people or have any clue about humans themselves. Go get educated would you?
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  WOC: What did Jesus mean in Matthew 19:12 when he said:
  
  "For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb"
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Stump Parrishposted 13 years ago
janikon, I have been asking for this for awhile. It amazes me how so many people who have never knowingly met a homosexual, who have no experience in scientific study, medicine or psycology feel they know more about homosexuality than all these people and the homosexuals themselves. Here in the bible belt the smartest people around are the ones who didn't make it past the 8th grade. Nothing makes some people more of an expert on any subject that never even seeing a book about the subject. It also amazes me how many of these people assume I'm gay simply because I stand up for the rights of homosexuals. These people take this aproach to gaining knowlwdge, it's a lot easier to read one book that a whole bunch of hard ones.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I) Not all Science is correct ,in fact Religion isnt all correct about everything either ,so to say Science has proven ...what?..Science has identified dna which suggests they can tell who may be predisposed to alcoholism too ,but does that mean Alcoholics are doomed?....No of course not.
  
  (What about all the other billion other things our DNA has stored in those precious cells- lets raise them up their on stage too.)
  
  2} I have a niece who is gay,I love her to bits!
  
  3} I believe God when he said
  
  Homosexuality is an illicit lust forbidden by God. He said to His people Israel, "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind.
  
  Do I quit loving my niece because she chose Homosexuality, of course not!
  
  It is not my place to judge, but I accept Gods authority on the matter, in the end.
  
  Further more ,sin is something that the Christian is concerned about, and not the Non-Believer,for he doesn't believe he has sinned
  
  Food for thought.
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  Evolution Guyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Food for thought?
  
  Are you as condescending with your niece as you are here? Bet she loves you to bits when you tell her God said she is a sinner, but you still love her because God will judge her and burn her in hell for all eternity?
  
  Food for thought. '
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I dont tell her any such thing!
  
  I just enjoy and love her.
  
  What she believes ,or disbelieve is her choice.
  
  We are adults. Why do I need to tell her anything that she can read for herself.
  
  I dont agree with her lifestyle-so what?
  
  Im not asking her to go to church and shes not asking me to lie down with another woman.
  
  Boy Religion sure did a number on you Mark,for you to be so bitter and spew your regular dose of venom.
  
  Quit acting like a victim and sounding so bitter.
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  Evolution Guyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  There was nothing venomous there. You are condescending. You do claim that god thinks she is a sinner and will burn her for all eternity. Now you say you do not tell her that. I am not bitter. I just despise religious hypocrites.
  
  You OK with your God burning her for not doing wot u sed the bible sed god sed?
  
  Becaus I would have a tough time worshipping this god you claim to worship.
  
  Oddly - you are the one religion has done a number on. You just don't know it.
  
  You don't agree with her lifestyle and at the same time claim to not be judging her?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I dont agree with Communism ,but I have Chinese friends...
  
  So what, are you saying that I shouldnt.
  
  Its you Mark that must be so rigid and judgemental
  
  Ha ,and you have the audacity to mock me.
  
  Seriouly ,thats very sad.
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I never understand why Christians choose to believe in some parts of the Bible, but not in others. Surely believers should either believe in all of it or none of it. It seems today the only point on which all Christians agree is that gay people are evil, everything else is up for debate. Some biblical laws are totally ignored. For instance, the Bible states that it is illegal for a man to cut his beard, it is illegal for bastards to enter God's assembly, it is illegal for people with disabilities to enter God's assembly, it is illegal for a man with incomplete testicles to enter God's assembly, anyone doing any work on the Sabbath is to be killed, a menstruating woman is unclean and anything she touches is unclean. Only by a priest killing two pigeons can she be made clean again. Stubborn children should be stoned by their own parents.
  
  On-the-other-hand, things which are legal according to God's laws include, slavery, it was even recommended that a father could sell his daughters into slavery to raise funds. Incest also seems fine, even Abraham was married to his own sister, and Lot knocked-up a couple of his own daughters. Genocide is also fine, as God gave the Israelites orders to kill seven nations, with a population of 17.5 million. When the Midianites were slaughtered, Moses was so angry that only the men had been killed, he sent the Israelites back to finish the job, killing all of the women and children. God's love of genocide even extended to giving orders to dashing out the brains of the babies upon the rocks. Compared to this level of genocide, even Hitler seems like a friendly old uncle.
  
  Polygamy was also fine, as Abraham, Jacob, Isaac, David and many more had many wives, as well as having concubines and sleeping with prostitutes or their own daughters.
  
  It makes me so angry, when I read of the immoral laws of God, which good Christians either do not know about or choose to ignore. Yet, that one law against homosexuals is the only one which they choose to believe in. Hypocrisy of the highest order.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Christians are commanded to love!
  
  That is the law right there.
  
  Does it mean God condones homosexuality -
  
  No it does not.
  
  Do we stop loving our own children if they become say ,criminals? or disobey the law ,even within the family context?
  
  No ,we do not.
  
  But that doesnt mean as parents we condone our kids actions.
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No, I didn't think you would be able to answer my question. Maybe another Christian will be able to. I am not criticising all Christians, I really would be interested to know why some biblical laws are followed, but others not. If a Christian woman does not visit her priest during her monthly cycle and ask him to kill two pigeons, she really cannot be said to be following biblical law. Some Christians say it is because Jesus came to replace the Law, and that Christians are therefore not required to follow the Mosaic Law, except for the bit about homosexuality. It must be very confusing. Either the Mosaic Law was replaced or it wasn't.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No you are talking about laws that were in existance 400 years before Jesus was born!
  
  (We dont even follow old laws like that in our courts today)
  
  Jesus came to explain and fulfil All the laws.
  
  By the way did I pick up a note of sarcasm in your last post? lol
  
  The Mosaic laws were superceded!, by the laws of Christ..(and not previous prophets or Kings)
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Actually the Mosaic Laws were still in existence at the time of Jesus, and are still for many Jews today.
  
  I'm glad you agree that we shouldn't follow laws today in court which are hundreds of years old. That would be silly wouldn't it?
  
  So all of the laws were superceded, except for the one about homosexuality. What about the Ten Commandments, were they superceded?
  
  And yes, you should have picked up a note of sarcasm in my last post. Us old queens are expert in the art of sarcasm.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  
  I like people with a healthy sense of humour too.
  
  Superceding in my opinion means to go above and beyond ,not necessarily replace however.
  
  Divorce for example in the O.T was chauvanistic and harsh,because of the hardness of mans hearts.
  When Jesus arrived he was tested by the Pharisees regarding Divorce( they were hoping to trip him up for treason) and Jesus said He was here to fulfil and explain the Law in all of its fullness,so God was still against Divorce.The administeration ,hiearchy had now changed ,if you will.
  
  Yes I understand the Jews do follow those laws ,and they are also STILL waiting for their Messiah to appear as well;)
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I have a feeling we are going round and round in ever decreasing circles here.
  
  On the one hand you do not believe Christians should follow old laws which are outdated, and that Christ came to supercede these laws. Great, then that means that homosexuality is no longer a sin, because the Mosaic Law no longer applies. I felt we were getting somewhere there.
  
  But no, apparently supercede doesn't mean replace. So therefore the Mosaic Law is still a requirement for Christians. Therefore all of the other silly laws apply, including not allowing a man with a testicle missing to enter a church building or the need for the killing of two pigeons to clean a woman of her monthly cycle.
  
  However, I am quite sure there is no Christian woman who will follow that one, you included. I have to admit to being even more confused than ever. When Christians have decided whether Mosaic Law is still to be followed, and after two thousand years, they should have made their minds up by now, then and only then will their arguments make more sense.
  
  Why do I get the feeling though that the Mosaic Law only applies to gays. To divorced Christians or menstruating women, there is no need to follow these ancient laws. It is however for divorced Christians and menstruating women to point the finger at gay people, becasue we are the only ones who need to follow the Law of Moses.
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  Job Helpposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Some things included in the Old Testament were only relevant to a certain time period. However there are several verses in both the Old and New testament that clearly speak out against homosexuality.
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  thebrucebeatposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Who gets to decide which are which? You?
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Not really. I'd say there is only one, that verse by Paul in the NT.
  
  The Torah (OT) and verses quoting Jesus are considerably more ambiguous, and there are many who have delved into the original language(s) (not King James' English) and come up with a different prohibition entirely (it was a prohibition against male temple prostitution).
  
  Not that these interpretations will mean anything to you, if you've decided you want G-d to hate homosexuality, but I'm just putting it out there.
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I asked WOC the same question, but I thought I'd ask you for your thoughts, as well, since you're pretty well convinced that G-d detests homosexuality.
  
  What did Jesus mean in Matthew 19:12 when he said:
  
  "For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb"
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus mentions Sodom a lot of times but did he ever mention homosexuality of being wrong? I don’t think Jesus was anti-gay or he would have said so. Religious People just cherry pick their own hated of other groups of people they do not understand
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  Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  indeed, cherry picking and other acts of premarital sex are also forbidden
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  People hear want they want to hear and see what they want to see. Being forbibben make them break the laws even more, l
  
  For example, per capita Christian is the largest group of any other group in prison and in war
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  good one!
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, and the traditional Jewish view (Jesus was a Jew) was that the sin of Sodom was lack of hospitality and violence. Christians chose to interpret that it was all about homosexuality.
  
  That Biblical quote seems to suggest that Jesus understood that gays were born that way, something that flies in the face of evangelical doctrine.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Kiwi, I hit the reply button and landed way down here I enjoyed your excellent food of thought above. There are several on this forum who assume I have never met a homosexual. I have a cousin who is a homosexual. He is a very polite person and I love him. I don't condemn him for the lifestyle he chooses to live nor judge him or any homosexuals.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  W.O.C
  
  You know what is in your heart.
  God knows you better than anyone here.
  I know you are a good,courteous and loving person.
  
  Sometimes when people dont want to change they look for ways to make their way seem right. Part of that process is discouraging other who are likely to disagree with them.
  
  I love ya
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks Kiwi Exactly. Some are experts at justifying their ways to make it right in their perspective. Love ya
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Stump Parrishposted 13 years ago
Oh and BTW, my comments aren't coming from a happy place, I'm in the bible belt and it's filled with the most hateful people I have ever had the displeasure of meeting.
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  janikonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I agree and, BTW, my happy face was sarcasm - I was so sick of everyone saying such hateful things and ending it with a happy face or winking face. It is SO frustrating.
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Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago
You don't get it because you judge me according to your own concepts.

Simple as that.

God judges all sin ,period ,Not me.

The commandmant I read says : Love all.

God is my authority.

My niece doesnt see Him as hers .although she does have her own belief system regarding spirituality.
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  Evolution Guyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Dear me. Do you even realize what nonsense you are talking? Talk about religion doing a job on you.
  
  You have no authority.
  
  None.
  
  Yes - I make a valued judgment about you. I am not all condescending and claiming to be speaking from some make believe authority. It is just me. I am not speaking for some omnipotent Super Being. This is why your religion has done a number on you.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I never said I have authority
  
  I said God is my authority. Pay attention
  
  Im done responding to you too.
  
  You make no sense!
  
  Sure you speak for yourself ,represent yourself. You are well versed with 'Self'
  
  Have you really heard how you sound?
  
  Loving ,kind, respectful,joyful, ring any bells?
  
  Didnt think so
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  Evolution Guyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  God is your authority yet you have no authority?
  
  Loving ,kind, respectful,joyful? This is you? Handing out god's judgments?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thats correct.
  
  I am NOT the suthority on anything !
  
  Cool you finally got it.
  
  So now its looking like
  
  Gods authority versus Marks authority
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  Evolution Guyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No. God does not exist. Please stop claiming to be speaking for it. This is why your religion causes so many fights. You and people like you.
  
  Do you even know what you are saying?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yep thats the real crux of the matter it seems.
  
  I believe in a God that you want silenced.
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  Evolution Guyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  But god does not say anything. You are the one claiming to be speaking for god. I do wish you would not tell so many lies about me. This is why your religion causes so many conflicts.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  lol
  
  The Bible is Gods word and it says plenty.
  
  It has stood the test of time and it will be here when you and I leave this Earth.
  
  By the way dont be afraid of me.
  
  I do not have any power ,that would hurt you, or cause conflict.
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  Evolution Guyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  LOLOL Yes - it says women are not to preach or get divorced. You conveniently ignore though. This is why you cause so many conflicts.
  
  I am afraid of you. I am always afraid of crazy people who spout nonsense at me and refuse to listen to reason. Who knows what you might do? History is littered with religionists like yourself doing insane things.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I concede you may know about insanity than I will ever know
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  Evolution Guyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hmmm. Passive-aggressive attacks like a real Kristian. Did god tell you to behave like this?
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Greek Oneposted 13 years ago
I know for a FACT that women do NOT choose to be lesbian.

Many of my past girlfriends became lesbians and told me that they had no choice but to go the other way after having dated me
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Greek One
  
  They just did not climax with you like they did with other women. That’s all.
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EmpressFelicityposted 13 years ago
This week's top Amazon recommendation

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Hotplateposted 13 years ago
If you don't ask, they won't tell!
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Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago
Good question livelonger

Truthfully I am not sure (but Im reading a couple of interesting sites)...

This so far I have gleaned from the Geneva Bible Study

which I found on this site
http://bible.cc/matthew/19-12.htm

For there are some {l} eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have {m} made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

(l) A man can become a eunuch in one of two ways: the first is by castration or emasculation, and the other by natural causes, such as a rupture.

(m) Who abstain from marriage, and live as celibates through the gift of God.

I think I also read that some believe some may have been born disabled in some way?...

Now if I may ask you this question:

What do think this scripture means?
1 Corinthians 6:9–10
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I think that means Paul didn't like gay people. He was like plenty of other Christians; projecting his personal dislikes and obsessions as the word of G-d/Jesus.
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janikonposted 13 years ago
@woman of courage i'm still waiting for those cold hard facts concerning your statement 'yes, people choose to be gay. they are not born that way' // I don't assume you haven't met a homosexual but I would like to understand how you have the authority - you and eaglekiwi - to make such brazen and assured statements
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I never claim to have any authority about anything
  
  But someone(I think livelonger) asked me a question.
  
  I researched and came up with variou scenerios.
  
  God does not condone homosexuality.
  
  So it is written.
  
  I think your being very stubborn not to accept that.
  
  But hey its your choice ,it has always been that way.
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Have you read this?
  
  http://www.otkenyer.hu/halsall/lgbh-cortim.html
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Just read it, um from a Catholic handbook.
  
  Seems like splitting hairs to me.
  
  On one hand they are saying it is how the two Greek word are translated
  or could be translated.
  
  I am happy that God knows exactly what he meant,and since my role is to love unconditionally ,then Im not the one who says who will make it into heaven or not.
  
  Honestly its my responsibilty to make sure I do
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I believe your words were "God does not condone homosexuality.
  
  So it is written.
  
  I think your being very stubborn not to accept that."
  
  Is the catholic view different to the "christian" one?
  
  It seems no matter what denomination of christianity someone will say they are not real christians,
  I did not notice the source on the page until you mentioned it.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I do not say who are Christians ,or who are not,but most Religions tend to have a leaning toward scripture that supports that particular denominational ethos.
  
  Objectively you will find amongst any group that there will a few who have a different perspective.
  
  Im thinking for a moment of a court jury-they all receive the same evidence,hear the same information ,yet as we know ,many times do not all come to the same conclusion.
  
  For me, I have never had any issues understanding what God meant when he said ,
  
  "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind:....
  
  Basically it comes down to ,what a person believes.
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  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  janikon, No one were born a liar or thief. If one lie or steal, they chose to do it. The same applies to homosexuality. God loves you and he can set you free if you allow him. Take care.
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  janikonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Okay -
  
  - with that last insulting and condescending remark, I'm out and want nothing more to do with this forum. Please, don't waste your breath praying for me because I want nothing to do with the God you believe in.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hey Janikon,
  
  Don't let the religious fundamentalists and their ignorance, keep you from the forums.
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Woman Of Courage
  
  I think you want to report Sherlock for assuming you are anti gay. If you’re comparing Liar or thieves to homosexuals don’t you think it's clear you are.
  
  Janikon
  
  This is generally a well balance forum compare to a few other forum I have check out, please stick around it will are lease thicken your skin.
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Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago
Just when your ready livelonger

Now if I may ask you this question:

What do think this scripture means?
1 Corinthians 6:9–10
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  livelongerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I thought I answered that above?
  
  I think that means Paul didn't like gay people. He was like plenty of other Christians; projecting his personal dislikes and obsessions as the word of G-d/Jesus.
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  For some reason I can’t imagine being a gay male, but if I were lesbian I would give some of these women a good tonque lashing and I don’t mean in wonderful aweee kind of way. On the other hand, gays have built up a much stronger tolerance on a daily base towards attacks against their character than I have. Why would any person would choose to be gay and suffer social torture, in which has been handed down to them for thousands of years as if they were not homosexual naturally plus a great sin.
  Gay bashing are just words on this thread yet in the physical world it is on the raise again on up to 80 countries in recent studies as a criminal offence in heavily religious countries
  
  Gays are too kind to go into prayer then go into the killing field with you. Gay rather meets you in the street as their gay parade. Gay parades are out attending that old coke up Santa’s Clause Parade, as fairytale are a changin also.
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Job Helpposted 13 years ago
No one is born gay. And no one chooses to be gay. They are gay due to things such as abuse or not having a positive father figure in their lives (there are many other factors). Its understandable that they feel they were "born this way" but that is just due to not realizing what turned them gay.

The Bible calls homosexuality an abomination and speaks against it in several verses. God would not create anyone gay, however the evils in this world do turn people gay. Gays need to realize homosexuality is a sin and they must repent.
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  K9keystrokesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I could not disagree more...
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wheelinalloverposted 13 years ago
While doing a research paper for college I came in contact with many people who were same sex oriented. My thesis was "Single sex oriented people are this way when they are born".

During my three months of interviewing and from the person who took my place and used "other methods" we learned that every one of the people we interviewed all had traumatic experiences as a child usually around age four but for some up to age twelve which set their sexual orientation for life.

This was so out of sync with "common knowledge" that the person who took over the study asked one thousand of the people interviewed to take a lie detector test and another thousand to be questioned again after truth serum had been administered.

Of these two thousand over half (1204) had been sexually abused as a child but that was not the deciding factor in their preference. How the parents and or guardians handled the aftermath was. Not a single one felt they "chose" to be single sex oriented.

My thesis was disproved and the one who took my place was told not to publish their findings. The reason given was no one wanted to know it's quite often the parents, close friends or relatives who orient children to their sexual preference as adults.
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well, may I be your first case study to disagree with your findings? My childhood was gloriously happy, I was not abused in any way, but had loving parents. I look back upon my childhood as the happiest part of my life, and wish I could turn the clock back and live it all over again. It was a childhood of picnics, of gardens, of weekend visits to see loving grandparents, of loved family pets. Yet, I turned out to be gay, as have two of my cousins. The one cousin, I know also had a loving family environment in which she grew up. The other I don't know about, because he lives in America and I have never met him. Frankly, I doubt your findings
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  thebrucebeatposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  What was this "truth serum", 007?
  
  No professor worth his degree would allow you to go into an experimental process with a predetermined thesis.
  
  Your story is BS, and not even artfully so.
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  BS is the word for it. I doubt every word of it. The problem is, there will be some who will read that and take it at face value, not even thinking to question the veracity of it, because it agrees with their narrow views.
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  K9keystrokesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You make a perfect point. It is things being said in haste and ill conducted (if at all) experiments that keep people questioning this issue. Being gay is definitely an inborn trait, not unlike being left handed or having brown eyes. I think these would be quite difficult to "revise" under any conditions-- abuse or otherwise. I stand in support of your point of view Sherlock.
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  wheelinallover of these two thousand over half (1204) had been sexually abused as a child but that was not the deciding factor in their preference. How the parents and or guardians handled the aftermath was. Not a single one felt they "chose" to be single sex oriented.
  Guite often the parents, close friends or relatives who orient children to their sexual preference as adults.
  
  Being an artist and knowing lots of gays personally, I have this abillity to open up people and expose them for any can of worms they maybe hiding. I find most gays backgrounds are not much different than any of ours, Yes about 25% of all people have been molested at some point in their lives yet you saying about half of gays have been sexual abuse between 4 and age 12, is untrue and unfounded. If it were true than your would have a cases where gays have some form of a mental disorder, yet the other half of gays, would have no mental disorder.
  
  This is the kind of attitude brainwashing makes homosexual acts against the law in 80 counties. In which I find to be the true mental disorder is med evil thinking people in which make false accusations against gay character in judgment and how they sleep at night I may never know.
  
  Furthermore, the American Psychological Association has carried out a systematic review,
  The American Psychological Association (APA), the world's largest association of psychologists has stated that: which not only concludes that psychological interventions are not effective at changing sexual orientation, but they can also cause significant harm.Homosexuality is not a mental disorder and the APA opposes all portrayals of lesbian, gay and bisexual people as mentally ill and no need of treatment due to their sexual orientation.
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncd7oaaY … re=related
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  qeylerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  The study you performed and which was denied publication is just another example of what you are seeing on this MB. today everyone and their dog In America and other Western Nations has decided that homosexuality is just peachy. People inother nations who do not believe this are, of course to be bombed into submission.
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Lisa4posted 13 years ago
This argument was by far the most.... Ridiculous and the saddest yet!
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  How so?
  
  Please don't run off with your fingers in your ears like so many Cowardly Lions do.
  
  Do you approve the death penalty to homosexual in 9 countries?
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wheelinalloverposted 13 years ago
To those who misinterpreted my post. If you know anything about America you would know the national average for sexually abused children not too long ago was above 60%. This seems to have no bearing at all on if they become single sex involved at all. The people in the test were a pretty accurate group when you take the national average into account.

The main reason seems to be how the parents, guardians, and relatives handle the sexuality of their children. This is what the lie detector and truth serum showed.

I personally don't know how a 4 to 8 year old child can make a life long decision about anything. Their brains don't function like adults and won't until they are at least eighteen.

If you bothered to read the whole post you would see that my thesis was "Single sex oriented people are this way when they are born". I didn't set out to disprove it, my intentions were to prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt.
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  89wheelinallover
  
  Timoth J. Dailey, PhD, Senior Research Fellow at the Center for Marriage and Family Studies of the Family Research In fact, gays and lesbians may be less likely than heterosexuals to sexually abuse children. Two studies that examined the sexual orientation of child molesters found that less than one percent, in one study, and zero percent in the other, were lesbian or gay...
  
  CONCLUSION:
  Social science research does not support the claim that gay men and lesbians are more likely, or even as likely, than straight men or women to sexually abuse children. Child sexual abuse has little to do with sexual orientation."
  
  Oprah Winfrey was sexual abused as a child and look on how she turned out. Some assessments say she is the most influential woman in the world.
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  thebrucebeatposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  No one suggested that you were trying to prove gays weren't born that way. I suggested that no serious experiment would begin with a thesis to prove. That is bad, tainted science. Entering into an experiment with an agenda is bad science 101, and I find it impossible to believe that your professor would have allowed such a procedural error.
  Still haven't heard what this mysterious "truth serum" was. Very interested to hear that.
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  wheelinalloverposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Why do you think my research was passed on to someone else? The professor realized my mistake and passed my information on to someone who was doing research in the same area and could use it.
  The data I had collected used this way kept me from flunking so it was ok with me.
  
  As for what type of truth serum was used I personally have no idea. Knowing what kind was used was of no value to me then or now. My guess is it was something most people believe was effective or the results wouldn't have been considered valid. I personally would have never used any, none of the people I interviewed were tested this way although a few were asked if they were willing to be.
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  thebrucebeatposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic … ruth-serum
  
  Here is an article about "truth serum". There is no such reliable substance. It is a fantasy, something that can be a useful suggestion to a subject but not a dependable way to find the truth in a subject.
  You are trying to create a scenario that you can't prove and has so many holes in it one has to laugh at the inept attempt at passing it on as truth.
  Your credibility is lagging with each new post.
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MelissaBarrettposted 13 years ago
"Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind"

Strict definition of that would seem to say that lesbianism is okay, but male gayness is not.

Actually, as a bi-sexual, I could take that to mean that I should give up men all together.

Is god telling me to be a lesbian?
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Your right, it seem society is much easier on lesbian than gay men maybe because religion men like to watch too. I might have to take back my lesbian tongue lashing comment toward Christian women.
  
  Or was the word –lie: can be translated to Men BSing and women gossiping
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well, female homosexuality was never illegal in the UK, and I suspect that is the case with other countries. Male homosexuality was illegal in England and Wales until 1967 and until 1980 in Scotland. Apparently in the 19th century there was an attempt to make female homosexuality a crime, but Queen Victoria wouldn't give royal assent to such a law, because she refused to believe that such a thing existed in the first place.
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  qeylerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  the reason why female homosexuality was never illegal in England is because the Queen, Victoria, claimed women did not do that and would not sign the Bill into law. Hence the provisions were removed. In all nations which were once part of the British empire, the Offenses against the Person Act which mades Buggery illegal remains unless specifically changed.
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earnestshubposted 13 years ago
I don't believe a persons sexuality has much to do with anyone who isn't having sex with them personally.
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  K9keystrokesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I would go even further and say please dont tell me
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  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I usually don't get told, I discover if I get to know them, or meet their partners. I find most people don't have an interest in bringing their sexuality in to normal conversations.
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  The only people who seem to want to bring sexuality into conversations are straight people who are obsessed with what gay people get up to. Gay people on-the-other-hand have no interest in what goes on in the bedrooms of straight people. I mean straight people are entitled to a private life, just as gay people are.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Not me ,I dont care what people do in their bedrooms ,so long as they dont take to the streets and shout about it ,lol.
  
  I could be wrong ,but I dont know of hetrosexuals having parades to celebrate their straightness
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Eaglekiwi
  
  I would bet if all of a sudden they outlawed Christianity in 80 countries giving out death penalties in 9 of them, you would hit the street too.
  
  Christianity is only outlawed in North Korea, and they are considering the greatest threat to mankind by Americans now.
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  thebrucebeatposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  They don't need to. What subjugation of their rights would they be marching to overturn?
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  They are so a custom to blowing things off ot consider on how the other shoe fits, their sensitive and numbness is so advanced on earth, that their future regrets is more likely most of them will end up in hell anyways.
  
  Since 90% of worries do not materialize, what do I care?
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  thebrucebeatposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  This was indecipherable.
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  thebrucebeat... not so hard to figure out
  
  Take Christian's huge long list of the groups and people they hate or are against in this world. Then consider most Christian believe most people will be going to hell. Then check the Christian records per capita of being in prisons and wars. USA has military bases in 200 countries and a few creating hell on earth.
  
  Being aware, takes most of the worries away, luckily most of the earth population are not aware of Christian ways, even a more of a peaceful thought.
  
  Eaglekiwi
  
  What is the Christmas parade about?
  Santa! Or course they throw in the Easter bunny parade too
  Is it really about Jesus checking on you? to see if you’re naughty or very nice?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Christmas parades are all about Commercialism...you have to look really hard to find Santa anymore. Not that St Nick from Europe has everything to do with Christman either.
  
  Celebrations do take place but mostly within the Churches there are many praise -filled Christ like celebrations,and many more celebrate Christ by giving food and gifts to the poor.
  
  (Unlike the major box stores)
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Gays are slowly replacing your fairy tales
  
  I do like the thought of giving food to the poor; Jesus cared more for the poor. Except most the junk food is made by the rich and toxic food is killing them with obesity faster than starvation and that’s happening throughout the world
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  There is a reason gay parades are called Pride, and it is for the same reason that heterosexuals don't have their Pride parades. It is because gay people have always been forced by society to think of themselves as abnormal. For most of history, being homosexual was punishable with the death penalty. This was the case in the UK until the 19th century. Oscar Wilde was lucky to be living at the end of that century, because earlier he would have been hung.
  
  For all of this time gay men have been taught how evil they are, and how when they die, they will have the fires of hell waiting for them. Straight people have never been made to feel this way, because they are the normal ones. Being made to feel dirty, sinful, immoral or even wicked doesn't allow much room for gay people to have much pride in themselves.
  
  The long struggle for gay rights, often at times when fighting for such rights could lead to inprisonment, has not been easy. Every step has been painful and slow. Even today, in much of the world, homosexuality is still illegal, and in some is still punishable by death. In the countries where we now have legal equality, but still experience discrimination, gay people have begun to refuse to be told how evil they are, and to come out and say, 'we are proud of who we are, and no one will make us feel otherwise.' It is for this reason that Pride has its name, and why gay people feel the need to express their pride in themselves, because previously we have never been allowed to think this way.
  
  As long as discrimination continues against gay people, then some will feel the need to make it known to those who would deny them rights, that they are who they are, and aren't going anywhere.
  
  However, if you feel the need to have a heterosexual Pride parade, there is nothing to stop you. Get some of your straight friends together and organise one. It probably won't be as colourful as the gay parade, and with less feathers and glitter, but you could always give it a go.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I prefer to save the celebration for the bedroom
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Have you ever held the hand of your boyfriend in public?
  Have you ever kissed him in public?
  
  Just curious....because if you have, then so much for keeping it in the bedroom.
  
  Just a thought.
  
  People have a right to be who they want to be, either in public or in private and that is the point. It isn't for other people to tell them to keep it strictly in the bedroom.
  
  Heterosexuals kiss in public and hold hands with their mates, so gays/lesbians want that exact same right, regardless of what other people think.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I thought we were discussing parades?
  
  Besides Ive seen many gay/straight couples doing exactly what you descibe.
  
  Is it an offence to do so ?
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It isn't to me, but apparently it is to others.
  
  As for parades....it's about rights, which is why the parades happen. If they already had the rights, which they wanted, then the parades wouldn't happen.
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  TMMasonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  They have the right to do all that.
  
  What kind of red herring is that?
  
  They can do all that already... and people around them can choose to accept or like that behaviour... or not. I have seen many a hetero couple get shut down by those around them for improper time and place for certain activities.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I too have seen it Mason, and I have injected my voice at the time I have seen it done, and gone as far as to tell other people to mind their own damn business.
  
  I don't care whether gay/lesbian or heterosexual...if someone wants to pay affection to their partner, then it's their right to do it at any time they choose to do so.
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  thebrucebeatposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  But the question is, if you don't accept or condone such behavior, do you have the right to make their lives uncomfortable by voicing your preference to them or those around them? If there is a black/white mixed couple and a bigot chooses to make his disgust known, is that acceptable in a civilized society?
  You are free to feel any way you want to about gayness, but not to inflict those feelings on those who exhibit those behaviors. Go pray for them if you want. Let go and let God. Whatever. But realize that supporting their rights is a way of supporting your own.
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I don't know any gay couples who would hold hands or kiss in public. Whilst there is no legal reason now why they should not do so, there is still a lot of discrimination. And any open display could still lead to danger. The 62 year old gay man who was beaten and kicked to death by a group of girls in Trafalgar Square was with his friend, who the girls took to be his partner, and this was the reason for his murder. So, although things have moved forward a long way, the time for gay couples behaving as couples in public is not quite here, and probably will be a long time in coming, if at all.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Actually, I have seen them do it.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Depends alot on location and culture I believe.
  
  Few years back New Zealand changed (after much red tape) introduced a Civil Rights Law ,which basically was a huge breakthrough for homosexuals, marriage ,property /tax rights etc.
  
  I see a few states do the same here too.
  
  N.Y just had a mass gay wedding ceromoney event this week-end.Hundreds of couples etc.
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I have lived in a gay communality and was the only straight person who swam in a master gay swim team for two years; I bet cha I could be straight in a prison if I was framed, too.
  
  I see straight people doing far more of their physical bonding in public than gays do. Bonding dose not bother me, harming dose.
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  Sherlock221bposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well, it depends where you live, but certainly, I have never seen two men holding hands or kissing in public in my hometown of Birmingham, except for on Gay Pride Day and only then in Birmingham's gay village. I can assure you, living on the council estate where I live, it would be more than their lives are worth for a gay couple, particularly if they are men to behave so openly. Even as a single man, wlaking about my neighbourhood, I am used to being called queer, and sometimes the anger can be quite frightening.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Mostly thats true, except for in here
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  recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  This works all ways, I would prefer that people did not tell me that they were slightly deranged and based their lives on an imaginary super-being. I am happy for them to believe this in the privacy of their own homes but I don't want them openly inflicting it on others, especially children.
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  Evolution Guyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It is their right. But they prefer others not to exercise the same rights. How odd this one argues that it prefers not to hear other people's preferences, yet at the same time insists on it's own right to share it's irrational beliefs with all and sundry.
  
  Christianity. Probably the most Hypocritical Religion in the World.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Are you implying that I am deranged?
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earnestshubposted 13 years ago
I just had to find this succinct little fellow.
Thanks.
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  K9keystrokesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Nice!
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theirishobserver.posted 13 years ago
Homosexuality has many facates as does hetrosexuality: Being paranoid does not mean that people are not talking about you. Folks, there is nothing Homophobic about using the term Homophile, it is the clinical definition of men who sexually molest under-age boys, or women who sexually molest under-age girls, enough with the paranoia, 95% of confirmed child rapes at the hands of 'Religious' were committed by men on boys, hence, Homophile. Hetrophile is when a man sexually molests an under age girl or woman molests under age boy, paedophile is an adult who is sexually attracted to either sex, maybe your reading different academic books than I am. The point is that 95% of Religious child rapists are Homophiles, when one does not use the correct terms one is simply facilitating child abuse as it creates the illusion that there are a single group of raincoat clad deviants hiding in the bushes, when in fact they are right there in your own home or in your neighbours home.
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Gillmeposted 13 years ago
Did u hear about the chase case? If not...well they just made a decission last month. u probably wondering how that relates to this topic, huh? Well...chase said " Be ashamed people.Being gay's against the bible.) My question... IS IT? But isn't that discriminating? And I'm sure God would HELP THE GAYS NOT discriminate them!
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qeylerposted 13 years ago
Straight people don't think about homosexuality unless it is in their face. The gay who is circumspect isn't notice, the one whose making it all gay all the time so that everything is about him is going to get a reaction.

It is like chain smoking.
The character who is doing this is going to annoy a lot of people. The person who smokes and you don't even know it gets none.

If a person smokes at home or away from others s/he gets no attention as non-smokers don't think about smokers until they see them.

The general point here, is that if you annoy a person with your lifestyle you are going to get a reaction. If you can keep your private business to yourself, you get none.
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  Uninvited Writerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Then maybe we should ban all public weddings gay or straight, not allow public hugging etc.
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  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Better still
  
  Force Religious will on all people to wear blind folds and have them run around in the dark, for God lives in the dark, it could bring us all closer toward his image.
  
  Relating Smoking to fags, I find fags much healthier because smoking kills more people than all the drugs in the world combined. If we must, force, everybody to get your doctor to certified that all fags are a danger to your health and ban all fags from public places
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TMMasonposted 13 years ago
You all are still up in here?

Obsessive much?...

I told you all... you can repeat it as many times as you want... doesn't make the BS any truer.

No genetic, nor any other link, nor scientific evidence to support any finding of anything, other than a choice.

Of course you all are welcome to continue speaking in terms of FAITH that there is some genetic link... add that to your FAITH in human evolution and origin... your all just one big happy bunch of faith blinded folks.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  And, all YOUR BS about it being immoral or deviant, or anything else, is just that..BS.
  
  But, go ahead and feel free to express yourself, just like everyone else has a right to express themselves.
  
  However, it would be nice if you did keep out of other people's life. Which apparently, it is something you cannot seem to stop yourself from doing.
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  TMMasonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Actualy, my stance that it is immoral, un-natural and deviant, is correct by definition.
  
  You all are the ones lacking evidence. The natural, moral and correct is all around us. The deviant, immoral and unnatural stand out for just that reason... they are not normal.
  
  Pretty simple.
  
  And at least you conceded the obvious and true by not disputing the lack/absence of said scientific evidence. You are not as closed minded as I thought, Cags... I am glad for that.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Again, homosexuality itself cannot be as you describe it, because it's been around, just as long as heterosexuality. So, stick it.
  Ridiculous statement, considering you don't take evidence when offered. All you do is twist it with some warped sense of supposed values.
  So, is ignorance, but you seem to be enlightened so much so, that you forget you're human.
  It stands out because idiots and jacka$$e$ continue to stick their damn nose into other people's life. Learn to know your place.
  Only for the gullible.
  I cannot ever be closed minded. Too bad you're narrow-minded.
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  TMMasonposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Tsk... tsk... the truth hurts, eh.
  
  Too bad... get over it already, Cags.
  
  Your right to do something, doesn't magically make that something good, moral, correct, or natural, etc... it just makes it something you choose to do.
  
  Simple.
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  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You know, that's the problem I have with you TMMason. You speak truth only when it suits you.
  Nothing to get over. But, you're too blind to understand that.
  As I have said in the past and apparently your comprehension problem is a real huge factor.
  
  Rights are choices. Choices are tied to actions. Actions are deemed either good, bad or amoral(emotional).
  
  Homosexuality isn't either good or bad. It's strictly based on emotion.
  
  So much for you being right about anything with regards to rights.
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Do people choose to be gay?

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