It isnt the firetrucks that is a problem.. it is their water supply. Is there lots of water in hell? I thought it was all fire and brimstone. (what is brimstone anyway? I would like to know... good to have an informed choice) x
Learn it. You asked for proof. The word proof has a standard definition, to ask for proof it would be a reasonable assumption it is proof you are looking for, no?
Well, according to what proof is and you asking for it and god being a thing only in fantasy, not reality, you asked a question that is impossible to answer. All that god is to most people is a shared delusion.
I thought as much, when you are able to see intelligence in this universe we shall talk.Meditate and you will understand me, god and enlightenment and see incredible intelligence at work all around you. It will blow your mind.
Do I have all the answers? To what questions? Are you suggesting a creator god is an answer to all questions? I do not believe in god but I understand for those who do, what you are suggesting is one of the driving motivations for such a belief. It is easier to explain everything away to a creator god, easier if you do not require proof. I choose otherwise.
I dont understand this new age mumbo jumbo either. There are not any "facts" in your comment either.
However I am tickled when reading "Things that are unknown to us as a race, are not knowable, therefore presently don't exist."
Examples would include everything recently discovered. Because remember they dont "presently" exist until discovered. Before 1847, the gorilla never existed, only when it was discovered in '47 did it pop into existence.
I have a question. This is just one take on it too. If this is supposed to be about faith, and the strength of ones ability to hold fast to our beliefs despite popular opinion or lack of evidence, then why would any real believer want to prove God's existence one way or the other? All of you keep talking about how, or what the evidence you have says or what you read or what you wrote. Have you even stopped to ask why we should prove it, or even if we should?
If everyone had proof God existed, where would faith be? Chances are those that denied him would rebel anyway on the principle of freedom. Then if you proved he didn't exist the other half would still deny the evidence because the only evidence faith has is personal interpretation. The faith is in you. I respect a man more for saying, I don't know, and I can't prove it, but My faith tells me so. This whole thing about trying to prove anything says only one thing if we're going to be honest. Asking science to prove religion right smacks of weak faith. Trying to prove your faith right to Atheists by using science smells like little faith at all. I see alot of believers in this thread who's faith is hanging by a thread and they struggle to shore it up with facts and links and articles. If you believe then do so, show me your faith with your belief not your ability to quote.
I got deep into trouble at my Catholic school when I was about 13. I said that faith has to allow for the existence of doubt and uncertainty.
I believe something because I have been convinced by hard facts and evidence. My belief may be incorrect. However, if someone can show me better facts and evidence that contradict what I believe, then I will change my belief.
Faith involves a leap of the imagination. If, in the absence of hard facts or evidence, I say, "nevertheless I will accept that xxx is the case", that is faith. Faith can apply to all sorts of things, not just God etc. Entering into a relationship with someone is a leap of faith. I have no way of knowing that this person is really right for me.
As for God, there are so many definitions of what that word means. It is senseless for two people to argue between themselves whether God exists if they are using different definitions.
However, as Lao Tzu said: "The Tao that can be described in words is not the real Tao". My take on that is that once "God" is defined, He, She or It is being confined in the box of our limited imagination and therefore is no longer God.
Lao Tzu also said: "Those who know, do not speak. Those who speak, do not know".
God what ever the discription, higher power, All that is etc. he can make diffrent covenants with diffrent peoples, tongs and nations. My relation ship with him can be diffrent that the relationship with you. H tells me that I should quit doing this and he tells my neighbor that he should quit doing that.
My son calls me DAD, my sister calles me brother, etc. God is much more than I. Why can he not have diffrent names as well ?? As long as he has the same essence.
True god is a personal relationship he can be ones Mother, Father or best friend. Different names is simply because of geography and language.Man fights foolishly over gods name but we have so many different names or words for lets say Mother or Ma and no one fights over which is the correct name.
I am glad you have sold so many, and also that you have the IT job for income. I am retired these days, except for the fact that my grandchildren need me around, I just write these days.My kids and grand kids are my love in life! I have been known to cry with joy far too often when I am talking to them. Children today at 3 4 or 5 are smarter than we ever were. I adore them! I know, I an getting old and silly!
I was Navigating Officer In the Merchant Navy worked for Mosvold a Norwegian company. Was in charge of the Fire fighting , lifesaving and then Navigating department, I understand international quality something many Indians do not, we are 50 to 100 years behind the west. It is challenging and the money keeps me alive so I can keep working on my book, which is my baby , my life.
Yes adventurous and responsible, navigating some passages like the English Channel is difficult .Now I have a lot more responsibility though, too many fanatics on this planet, creating peace between religions will be a life long job.
it's funny, everytime I make a point you attack me, and it's funny how you keep on talking about science and logic, you believe in god, you using logic is like elton john getting married to a woman, it doesn't mix, here I go again with my stupidity, sorry=)
no matter what points and sense i make it wouldn't matter to you because you believe, if you believe in something, no matter what evidence is thrown in your face, you'll still fight for what you believe, so please, try not to make people look stupid with your words, it keeps on bouncing back to you. by the way, your son is cute, i bet you "believe" he's the cutest baby in the world no matter what anyone says right? oopss, stupid point once again=)
I have an idea, which keep me open to possibilities=) I'm not completely shutting my brain down because i don't want to be stupid. I'm not gonna claim I know things, all I can do is prove points and make sense, a concept which religionists fail to grasp=)
of course you don't, you can't back any of your words up, and by the way, good job trying to bash me and putting me down because we don;t have the same belief, just as jesus would want you to do right?
Bingo! You just defeated the nonsensical quality known as "omnipotence". Good work cath, you have just proven that this "god" thing is NOT all powerful as claimed by the all enthusiastic in here. All we have now is a "god" concept that is crippled and can't do anything.
(Prove his non-existence first then go up to the next ladder rung...)
LOL The whole point flew 30 miles over your head there general. cath proved that the property of "all powerful" is impossible. Omnipotence is impossible. You can take this fact and do what you want with it.
Don't worry though: your "god concept" is still alive and kicking in your mind. It will always be safe and sound. The point is: do you want to define any "new" attributes for your concept now, because as you know, it's crippled.
Also, you haven't even defined or reified your god concept into reality. So you have quite the biblical task ahead of you, especially after now discovering it will come out crippled.
Gonna have to agree with the cow here, general. Not to mention, logic excludes the need to prove a negative. The burden of proof is ALWAYS on the person making the assertion. It's up to ME to prove to you that purple unicorns exist, not on you to prove they don't. You can never prove a negative, and frankly, it's not necessary.
It is impossible to prove a negative. That is a scientific reality. God is about faith,not proof. He does prove his existence to me in so many ways every day. Scientists sometimes forget that the knowledge that we all have comes from God. Yes, we sometimes think that we have discovered the universe and all of it's secrets, but we are a prideful bunch. It doesn't matter what you may call Him, He is the Great I Am, but I call Him, Father.
For those of us who live in reality- GOD doesn't exist. For those of you who want to live in a mystical based world, then sure GOD exists, but only in your imaginary thoughts, by which have NOTHING to do with reality, because thoughts, desires, will or wishes, have nothing to do with reality. Reality is all knowable, which isn't to say that we know everything there is to know, but means that we know everything there is in reality, at the time we are talking about it.
Reality exists, like the Universe exists and Life on Earth exists. It just does. Nothing cause the Universe to happen, The Universe cause Earth to come to be, and Earth evolved so as to support Human Existence.
Please, whatever you do- DO NOT say that God exists, because the topic 'god' itself is imaginary. It is YOU that make a difference in your life, by using your consciousness, conscience and subconsciousness, in the manner in which you are suppose to in the first place.
There is NO god looking out for Us or anyone for that matter.
I think logic has its limits though (though I think I would need to be a pure mathematician to show this, which I am not...).
Logic is a pretty safe bet on balance though. Nevertheless, without having read the rest of the thread, it seems right that a person cannot prove God's non-existence.
I think you can, however, prove certain supposed *characteristics* of God are not possible.
For example, God cannot be: a) all powerful b) completely compassionate and merciful if 27 000 children are dying every single day of preventable diseases (which they are).
I mean, even if we accept the idea that God gave us free will, and that to intervene would be to disrespect the freedom of our spirits, as granted to us, by him, don't things get so bad at some point that he has to step in and say: OK, this is really too much, I'm going to stop some of this misery. I'd do it -- am I more merciful than God?
Can you prove the Flying Spaghetti Monster doesn't exist?I know this question sounds like I'm trolling but I assure you I'm trying to ask it legitimately. I see questions all the time on HubPages like "Do you believe in god?" and "If god doesn't exist, prove it." I would say...
Atheist say that they can't prove that God do not exist,so.......that make them just as ignorant about the matter as those that they say can't prove that He does.That is a clear view of the Pot calling the kettle black.Do you agree.There is more proof that He does exist than He doesn't.They don't...
That's the typical Sam Harris argument. How does suffering negate God's existence? Maybe He's just watching. It doesn't mean He doesn't exist and for anyone to bring up suffering as proof of no God is indication of a logical fallacy.
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