Here's the twist... How can you prove that God doesn't exist?

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Bovine Currencyposted 15 years ago
Whoever loves discipline loves knowledge, but he who hates correction is stupid.
Proverbs 12:1
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  aka-djposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That's good.I like that.
  How can you bring correction to one that rejects the truth?
  If I say "such and such is wrong", does that bring correction?
  To some yes, but not in these forums. It brings condemnation like "who do you think you are shoving your beliefs on us", or "who gave you the right to judge others". Then there are the less venomous ones like "how condescending is that?". Or "holier than thou attitudes"
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  Bovine Currencyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  When you point the finger there are three pointing back at you. Think about that one dj.
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topgunjagerposted 15 years ago
just curious, i see a lot of people here talking about truth, how do you define what's true anyway? what's the basis of the truth you speak of? i'd like to read opinions from both sides=)
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  cheaptrickposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Truth is one of those elusive things people use to validate themselves.Usually people who talk about"I'm telling the Truth"are lying for sure!Kinda like the pimps in Mexico who say"you can buy my mother,shes a Virgin".IMO,absolutes are circumstantial...
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  Paragliderposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Truth, and particularly 'The Truth' is actually little more than a buzzword for proselytizers. The only way we can advance is through 'objective knowledge' which is the body of results and derivations from theories which have been stated in falsifiable form and which have not yet been falsified.
  Such knowledge might be true, but has not been proven.
  The above deterministic model can be (must be) softened, or rendered slightly more 'fuzzy' allowing for statistical analysis in non-deterministic fields like biology, psychology etc. Nevertheless the basic criterion of falsifiability still applies, and we can say meaningful things about the probability of error in our theories.
  Personal revelation, mysticism, ancient scripture, prophesy, etc may be interesting and may sometimes contain truth, but as they are unfalsifiable in their formulation, they belong strictly in the class of non-science, on the far side of a bridge of faith.
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  marinealways24posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I have a theory of how to find truth, but I don't know if it's correct. I think a formula shoud be logical thought, faith in that logical thought, then the thoughts debated with others to find a logical truth.
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  marinealways24posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Then again, all of the words you and I use along with everyone else could simply be an illusion to make use think we know what we are talking about.
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seasoningposted 15 years ago
how long is this thread going to drag on
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yoshi97posted 15 years ago
How interesting ... we skip past that we have no answer for to reply to something we already admit is muddled in uncertainty.
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
Okay I'm jumping in. My theory is this. If God as people say want peace and goodness for all mankind, understanding there will be tragedy, why does he leave everyone in doubt. Prime example this forum. He could, will all his said to have powers ease everyones mind with one gesture. Then no one would have doubt. Surely he would want this, then people could unite with truth not fiction.

Yet he does nothing of the sort. Come have a Starbucks, talk over the clouds. People may argue but he speaks every day in the form of miracles. He also speaks everyday through the form of tragedy.

So show up or I'm not buying. To carry a bible under my arm, and call a man named Jesus Christ is a little far fetched. I am not without spirituality, however I am with doubt about a God that could easily clear things up if he existed and release the chase of faith.
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hmmmm.....very interesting, my friend.
  
  How are you today kim?
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
Without God seems to be
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Isn't everyone?
  
  Seriously, isn't everyone living without God?
  
  It's not like they each really need his help. They live their life, with their own thoughts and by their own actions. So where does God play a factor?
  
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  in loneliness and fear
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Loneliness? Don't they have themselves or family?
  
  Fear? What are they afraid of? Their own life, I don't get how you can be afraid of life. Unless you're fear is death. And, in that case, they are not really afraid of life, but afraid of death and what they leave behind.
  
  Just a thought.
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  well my feeling is far too many are.
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, by far...too many people fear death. And, therefore they don't really understand their life.
  
  Just another thought.
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  unfortunately too many live in the destination and miss the journey
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Isn't blissful ignorance wonderful.
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  XTASISposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What a Hell of a trip they're missing !
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Agreed.
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Alright, Cags, stop thinking now
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Bite me.
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Wow!! Wasn't expecting THAT from you.... too funny....
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The one putting those thoughts into your head.God is orchestrating this entire cosmos not only we humans on this planet.
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  Bovine Currencyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  God orchestrates this entire cosmos? Well let me play the fiddle as I sing, 'the wheels on the little yellow bus go round and round, round and round... lololol god inserts thoughts now... WOAH! HAHALOLOL!!!
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So have you created these planets and stars and now move them around with such precision.Have you created yourself? So how can you say they are only your thoughts when you haven't made yourself.
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  Bovine Currencyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Nothing was created, it has just always been. If there was no beginning there was no creator.
  
  All you can achieve by opening this sort of discussion is nothing. You believe in a creator god. others might argue the big bang. Me, I dont buy either so you are picking the wrong guy.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Have you been around always or were you created a few years back?
  Will you all ways be around or will you be destroyed in a few years time?
  There is a creator and I have come across the Light like many others have.Because you haven't doesn't mean god doesn't exist.
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  Bovine Currencyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  My mum and dad created me, not god LOL!! you are a funny dude
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Do you believe all to its was sex, isn't it far more complex than that.You can have sex and have babies, are you really solely responsible for creating.
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  Bovine Currencyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What are you asking me?
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  Bovine Currencyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Lets just skip to the meat of it. Why don't you tell me who created god.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That is why this super entity is called god, all comes from him , nothing creates god.
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  Bovine Currencyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Nothing creates god. Sounds plausible LOL!!!! So who created nothing?
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  God is the basic fabric of this cosmos, a very fine Light love tissue pervading everything , is timeless, has no beginning and no end,super intelligent and man has connected with this super entity, or his real or inner self since ages,I did recently.
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  Bovine Currencyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No beginning and no end. Thats what I said. Why argue then. Only difference is that you fail to see that the 'very fine Light love tissue pervading everything' is nothing compared to the very thick all consuming layers of evil maintaining the status quo.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  On this planet, ying yang or opposites is a fact of life.
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  Bovine Currencyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Now its ying yang?
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Always has been not just now.Whats your point?
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GeneralHowitzerposted 15 years ago
1) Define exist CONSISTENTLY. Science doesn't deal in loose terms like god does with loose women. Science is a study that is objective and rational. Please define 'exist' in a RATIONAL manner so that it applies to ALL those items above which YOU say exist!

2) Be prepared to be slapped with a straight-jacket and shipped to an insane asylum.

If you don't want to go down the path of science, then you have 3 other choices:

1) Define 'exist' in logic. Then use a logic argument to show how the above items exist.
2) Define 'exist' philosophically. Then use a philosophical argument to show how the above items exist.
3) Define 'exist' religiously. Then use a religious argument to show how the above items exist.

The Rationale Fatfist and Mohi Here in this Thread is proving the non-existence of Supreme Entity who is God I wonder why you two have Gotten Here at the existence...

@ Fatfist how will you prove the non-existence of God... I am keeping my eye on your reply... Lets get into the meat of the thread not the other way around...
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Stimpposted 15 years ago
Ok...I'm gonna answer a question with a question. How do you prove something does NOT exist? Is that even possible? If a person doesn't know what a donut is, how can I convince them it's not sitting on my counter, when in fact it's not? I don't know just askin.
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  GeneralHowitzerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  How sure it doesn't exist you have no proofs of the non-existence?
  
  The Burden of Proof lies to the Atheists, show Proof of God's non-existence... The Theists are awaiting your witty, smart, sizzling and crisp answers...
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  AS in MINE, personally? Cuz they'll be waitin' a long time. I've got none this a.m. Too tired.
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Excuse you sir. The BURDEN of PROOF is on the believer. They are the ONES trying to bring into reality, something that has already been defined as NOT real or doesn't exist in reality.
  
  You want proof that God doesn't exist....READ the post I left for Stimp.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Many answers have been provided for you, some from a scientific perspective, all of which you've hastily and without any forethought dismissed.
  
  Cult indoctrination is a powerful tool that has been honed over the centuries to decimate any hint of critical thinking, reason and rationale in a child growing up in such an environment.
  
  This is the burden of proof all too evident in your posts.
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Stimp- I keep trying to tell people, but they simply won't listen.
  
  How do you prove something does NOT exist? By living in reality.
  
  That simple. Reality exists. It exists free of independent thoughts, desires, will, or wishes. Reality is all knowable.
  
  By 'all knowable', it means that we can define, measure or grasp, everything we have learned or created. Whenever mankind makes a new discovery, then reality anews from a new point and we move forward. It's called "objective" reality.
  
  In case people want proof of what reality is- you are it. Your human consciousness grants you the ability to determine what is real and what isn't. Your conscience re-affirms whether or not something is real or not.
  
  Should you try to bring something from outside of reality, into reality, then you're consciousness and your conscience will not be fooled, because those two things can't be fooled by the mind.
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  XTASISposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So clear!
  Why Believers can't see the truth in this statement ?
  Well, we know the answer, don't we ?
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The reason the can't see the truth in that statement is because it challenges their faith and they see it as a lie, so that they can justify to themselves that they believe.
  
  However, with that said- the consciousness, conscience and subconscious can never be completely fooled or forced to convert, something that isn't real, to be real. And, this is basic biology of human nature, which can't be broken.
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  This whole thing reminds me of a conversation I had with my mother. One year around my birthday, she called all upset. Okay "what's up, ma?" "Did you get my eCard for your birthday?" "no, I didn't". As the tears flow from her eyes and the voice quivers she says "Well, why didn't you tell me." WT#? I DIDN'T KNOW IT WAS COMING. How could I tell her I didn't get it when I didn't know of it's existence. I tried to explain that but you know mothers. She was so upset by that point, there was no reasoning.
  
  and for those who have decided to make inappropriate judgements or decisions about who I am or what I believe in....I am not an atheist. I have my own belief system, but it certain doesn't mean I am an atheist. Sorry, to disappoint you (not you Cags...just "you" in general).
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No problem, I just said the same thing, because I'm not part of any form of religion. Just simply because I KNOW what they are.
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GeneralHowitzerposted 15 years ago
The Atheists will laugh at every answers the Theists might answer if they are asked about the existence of God... Because Atheists will use every trick in the book to discredit God...

But the Theists will rejoice when Atheists are asked of the non-existence of God...

Even the greatest Atheist Scientists cannot claim of the non-existence of a very Powerful Entity...

And so far this thread haven't induced any substantial answers of the Atheists to the thread's question, that is... How can you prove that God Doesn't Exist...

Conclusion: "GOD DOES EXISTS NO DOUBT ABOUT IT"

This thread was few days old already and no breakthroughs is whipped out by the Atheists...

I'm no longer posting in this thread in the days ahead as much as possible...

Because this thread already served its purpose...
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Excuse me sir- I AM NOT an atheist or of any religion.
  
  So, please refrain from labeling ALL non-believers into the category of atheism. It's absurd and it's an insult.
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you....
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  GeneralHowitzerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah You are right... I already modify it Buddy, BTW, Have a nice day to the two of you... Stimp and Cags
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Well you have a good day too....and I mean that!!
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  yoshi97posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I already offered proof that 'the biblical God' as we know it can not exist, but was ignored. Now, I do believe in God as a force of nature, so I won't discount that ... but with the argument I gave earlier ... either the biblical God doesn't exist, or he he is more human than we are - given to perform acts that are contrary to his own existence and purpose.
  
  But that's okay ... refute the easy ones because they take far less energy. After all, it's real easy to say science isn't proof, but let's here religion say the Bible isn't true! the Bible creates a paradox that no religionist will touch, because they already know it's contradictory in their mind - so they call that part imagery ... but heck ... all the rest is true, right?
  
  You're not looking for discussion or debate ... your looking for proof that God must exist, and when given strong evidence to the contrary you people go on debating with the ones basing their arguments on science (as you requested) which puts them in a no-win situation.
  
  You can't absolutely disprove anything, but you CAN prove an unresolvable paradox exists, which debunks what is commonly believed.
  
  So, keep debating with the scientists ... it's an easy win.
  
  Which brings me to the point ... why would a believer (such as myself) basically state that God doesn't exist? I'm only saying God doesn't exist as people perceive God should. God is nature ... and in that sense God definitely exists. However, God is not this voyuer watching our every action and passing judgment upon us. If he was doing as many believed then his responses wouldn't be so mixed in the Bible.
  
  The funniest thing is ... my God is stronger than your God, as no one can disprove nature. Now, the God in the Bible ... too many paradoxes to consider it all true.
  
  Ah well, continue on and keep ignoring me ... ignorance is bliss.
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  From the descriptive measure you use to provide proof of GOD, which is your perspective and I will not argue, because You can label Nature however you please. Mankind call Nature, Nature.
  
  I will not contest Nature's existence, because if it wasn't for Nature's existence, human life couldn't exist, as it does.
  
  I bow to you Master Yoshi.
  
  Your perspective is proper, as long as, you don't think Nature itself is a guiding source to be listened to.
  
  Such, as a higher authority, who commands humans to obey.
  
  Otherwise, I'm good with your position.
  
  But, one question- How do you see Nature? Does just exist or did something or someone create it?
  
  I'm just curious about your perspective on that, if you don't mind. I'm always a sucker for good conversation Yoshi. But, it's someone of these other people who are completely out of whack and really don't understand life or their own beliefs.
  
  Thank you for a well thought out post.
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  yoshi97posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I see nature as a set of cosmic laws we are only just beginning to understand. Do I see nature as a being ... no. Do I see nature as creation ... yes. Do I see nature as something we need to understand better ... absolutely!
  
  We can't create stars, black holes, or planets ... but nature can ... for that we should be in awe and reverence. As it is, we do enough damage to our planet out of our ignorance of how nature works. By learning more, we could fix up what we messed up and go on to make many great discoveries!
  
  Nature is a force that will always dwarf any of our accomplishments, which is why I see it worthy of being considered as the God of creation ... though in this presence of form it's not the kind of God that answers prayers.
  
  For the God we all seek, we need only look within. For internally we are capable of good or evil and we are free to chose at any moment which path we shall follow. To think there is a heavenly force ready to punish us for any misguided step is crucial for many to perceive the need for everyone to get along, but there are quite a few of us capable of moderating our behaviors on our won.
  
  The only means by which to resolve the God paradox is to see God as a belief and realize that those who believe in God give him substance, thus making him real (to them).
  
  Nature is the most powerful force in the universe ... as God is proclaimed to be an all powerful force, then does not nature fit the definition?
  
  As for what created nature ... I don't see nature as having a creator. Nature is a series of laws that interact to create everything around us. As such, while nature is constantly changing and in motion, these changes are brought upon by the laws of nature and are not able to be changed or modified without the use of another law.
  
  As an example ... gravity ... A rock dropped from your hand will always strike the ground, unless another force counteracts the fall. Example ... if you drop the rock on a spring, the spring could shoot it back into the air.
  
  I hope that helps to explain my thoughts a bit.
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  GeneralHowitzerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Now this kind of post make sense...
  
  Laws of Nature also encompasses all other Laws in Science... Being a rationalist I see your view as God as the Nature itself...
  
  God created the universe and everything on it with this Laws, in contrast to some beliefs that God is nothing but to worship him with faith is half truth half lies, God worked in wonderful ways and through the wonders of Nature you'll see his existence... I hope I'm right though...
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  fatfistposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That is a very crucial point, yoshi.
  
  How can somebody say that this "God" concept (an idea in people's minds) is directly mapped to a supernatural object that is supposedly part of reality as described in the OT, NT, and Koran?
  
  They can't! If they say it's true, then they belong in the insane asylum along with the idiots who claim that gravity is some type of a being. Nobody knows what any of these basic imponderable effects of our reality are: gravity, electricity, magnetism, light, matter, energy, space. And we experience their "effects" every single day. How the hell can anyone say there is some supernatural effect called "God", and they know "Him", he has a "son", and he has given them some type of truth they call absolute?
  
  If any such supernatural "thing" is possible, it certainly isn't called: God, Jesus, Allah, Yahweh, Buddha, etc. Nor does it have any "truth" to give you. It couldn't care less about you or whether you were naughty or nice. It probably couldn't even think.
  
  The herding mentality of humans has always made them pursue imaginary beings into oblivion. That's their faith, and that's fine. But that's where the party ends. Once they say this imaginary being is "real", then they shouldn't complain when other people respond to them.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, I would agree. It demonstrates clearly that the mind of an immature child can remain intact well after childhood.
  
  It also demonstrates that those same minds will believe anything they want to believe despite facts to the contrary.
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I am new to this but would you give the FACTS to the contrary that proves that God does not exist?
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  TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  All religions are created so they can't be disproved because they are based on faith. YOU need to ask why YOUR religion is the right one and YOUR god is the right one.
  
  Organized religion was created about 2,500 years ago with Buddhism. Juddiasm and Christianity came about around 2,000 to 1,500 years ago then Islam, Mormons and the rest.
  
  But humans have been around for a good 15,000 years. So why wasn't religion part of those people's lives?
  
  Simple. Religion is man-made.
  
  But since all religions are based on faith (great way to build a company, btw) you can't prove or disprove it. Funny how that works, huh?
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  TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Actually, it looks like Buddhism and Judaism was created around 3,000 years ago. Again, if a god existed and was always there, why didn't he show himself/herself/itself 15,000 or 20,000 years earlier to the humans living around that time?
  
  There is no way around those facts. Religions we know today were created WAY after humans existed.
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Religion is as old as mankind and there is no such thing that life as we know it has been around 15,000 or even earlier than that. That is a myth that no history can account for.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Actually there is a good argument that we became self aware around 30,000 years ago.
  
  We are talking archaeology, anthropology and geology though - not history.
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  How could you dissociate those disciplines from History? How would you use the "data" you gather from them? What do you do use the archaelogy data for? Not to ascertain History?
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  fatfistposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Once you define this "God" using positive predication and reify it into reality, it is extremely EASY to prove that it is impossible for such a "thing" or whatever, to exist. This is why all theists and theologians refuse to provide such unambiguous definitions. It is this failure to define the terms that make or break one’s argument that allows people to get away with murder.
  
  If you don't define it, OR, "attempt" to define it using a sleight of hand we call NEGATIVE predication, then it only remains as a concept in your mind. Then you must concede that it is only part of your faith. It's that simple!
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I don't quite get you but you are missing the point that the God, the God of the Jews, that we say created the Universe can not be defined and I don't deny the fact that I know He exists only by faith. This God of the Jews I am talking about, no human or creature can stand in from of Him. it is just that complicated!
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  fatfistposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  (can not be defined and I don't deny the fact that I know He exists only by faith.)
  
  Now we're getting somewhere. Everybody has faith in some type of proposition. You admit you can't unambiguously define this concept in order to reify it into reality. So you have "faith" it somehow exists, without even defining the word "exists". And that's ok. You have faith. I don't have any issue with that. Thanks for the response.
  
  The point is: we can't disprove something that cannot be defined!
  
  We can't disprove that "skhgyejblah" is not some type of supernatural whatchamacallit.
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If you can not disprove it, then it exists! And if you disagree with that what is your argument?
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  fatfistposted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Don not ask for definition. We are not babies here. I don't see how I have been cornered at all. A proven truth???????? That does not sound right. There is too much air in that phraseology. An enraged Pilate asks Jesus once: What is truth? after He told him He came to earth to testify to the truth. Perhaps, even if all "truths" could be proven they would have nevertheless be discarded because they just will not fit some brain harness.
  Can you prove true love scientifically?
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  fatfistposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  There is some confusion here. Since you made 2 posts, I didn't realize you were talking about disproving the existence of "skhgyejblah". I already answered that question. There is nothing to prove or disprove either way when dealing with concepts.
  
  (Can you prove true love scientifically)
  Science is not in the business of proving anything. Science only explains. Love and relationships and fatal attraction is an issue for psychology. Ask them for proof.
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Actually, "skhgyejblah" exists because you've just created "it". We are not just sure about its attributes.
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  fatfistposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes! It exists as a concept in MY mind. The fact that you referred to it, also proves that it now exists as a concept in YOUR mind.
  If I write a bible about it and herd a bunch of people together to believe in it, then it will exist in more people's minds.
  
  The point is: It is not defined. The word supernatural is not defined either and cannot be defined. So there is NOTHING to prove or disprove. Get it now?
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I am sorry to say I still do not get it. How could it still be a concept in your mind [not mine] when you are looking at it in front of your eyes on your monitor? If you can create something it is no longer a concept. Have you ever read the Bible, though? I am just curious. Because if you did you would not have posted that anology.
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  fatfistposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  (Have you ever read the Bible, though?)
  
  Yes, this is the problem. I read the whole bible.
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Maybe you just read the pages and the letters with no understanding.
  
  The Bible is a point a view of the universe from a Jewish perspective. You are free to disagree with it but it is a compelling story if you can get it. You may choose to believe that everything around you came from a Big Bang or any other theory. That is fine. But if you were to make a critical choice based on what makes sense not what is logical logical among all other "explanations" to account for our world, which one will you pick?
  
  Have you ever read Genesis 1 and try to make sense of it? It is very illogical and nonsensical because it is beyond our understanding. It makes sense to my brain because it is the most sensical alternative to the disorderly Big Bang theory. But I still csn not grasp it though.
  
  Go Back in time to Babylon under Nebuchadnezzar,for example, and tell people you could land on the moon or fly from Iraq to Jerusalem? How would that generation receive your presentation? You would have to prove it to them but you know for yourself you're not crazy. Because you have witnessed it. And others have also. Now it is up to them to accept or reject your testimony. However they may feel about it will not change your assurance that you do know the certainty of the things you have spoken to them.
  
  It is pretty cynical for example to say that Moses did not feel the power of that God that lead the Jewish people out of Egypt from slavery. It makes no sense that in order for you to believe it they would have to go back to Egypt for another 400 years and somehow get another Moses to be born and lead them again out of Egypt. Imagine repeating these events again and again whenever someone like you chose to put himself in denial mode!
  
  Then by faith I accept the story and every other thing in it because I choose to and because the Jewish people live among us to prove and history talks about it.
  
  But again you need that missing piece that will make it click to unlock your understanding. To find that key you have to read the bible again as you would let yourself taken into the story.
  
  Imagine you go see the Matrix or the Dark Night and you dispute every single scene of the movie. What is your point? If you don't get it you probaly eould have to go back again and rewatch the movie by paying more attention to details...
  
  People of old who met with the presence of the Jewish God say it is a dreaful experience thet brings death. if you would want to relive their experience you would not be able to anyway because you would be dead.
  
  Faith is to believe and accept the heritage of the experience of the Jewish people, which happens to make sense to me instead of the point of view of Buddha or the Greek mythology or else.
  
  My choice and your choice will not annul the truth. It will remain truth. As presented by the Jews. That their ancestor witnessed the power Of God who therefore must exist unless you also want to deny History.
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  fatfistposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I think you may be right. Reading the whole Bible from front to back is definitely NOT a good idea.
  
  I wish somebody had directed me to read from a set of cherry-picked versus so it could have made more sense to me. I am willing to have another stab at it.
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  shazwellynposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Well, the bible is only one volume... the other parts got lost in the great fire at Alexandria, Egypt
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Cagsilposted 15 years ago
You're welcome Stimp.
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Stimpposted 15 years ago
alright...Cags...I can prove there is a God, in two ways
1. I fell off my horse and broke my damn rib last week....if Adam hadn't given a rib of his own for women, I'd have one less and therefore, probably wouldn't have broken that very one

-- AND --

2. My bro-in-law had perkoset at thanksgiving and slipped me a few so I could get through it all. And I said, "thank you, there IS a god."

I'm not sure how much more you need
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It's nice to see that you give credit for what others do to God.
  
  How very moral of you. Interesting thought tho.....
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  GeneralHowitzerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I need proofs Buddy not discussion that is the goal of this thread...
  You are perfect to your opinion and thank you for saying I'm a very moral person at least other people done that for me hehehehe even in thoughts...
  
  No Proofs Still...
  
  I thought the atheists here are highly logical but I am seeing otherwise, I hope they are not like rats as they escape when cornered...
  I hope they're not...
  
  Your funny reactions will prove nothing...
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What do you need proof of? Just curious.
  
  I've been here all day and already posted my thoughts. If you're not willing to read through the entire thread, that's not my fault.
  
  I don't necessarily need to repeat myself, that's for sure. You missed the party.
  
  Party is over. Have a nice day now.
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  GeneralHowitzerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Darn, I missed it wakikik...
  
  No Proofs still... Though...
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You must not read well. Hmmm....that's sad.
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  And, just curious....so I have to ask.....What makes you think ADAM was a real person?
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Cags...have you met me....I'm funnin' with ya (well actually with others THROUGH the use of you!).
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Stimpposted 15 years ago
And, Adam was here for breakfast...he brought donuts
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So, how is after 2000+ years?
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Ya know they were a little stale...but you pop those babies in the microwave with a dish of hot water for 30 seconds or so and you got yourself a meal, my friend.....
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drej2522posted 15 years ago
some mother's children...i tell ya
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Cagsilposted 15 years ago
Religion teaches- 'MIME, conscience and subconscious'

What does that boil down to? Control.

They want you to be mimic(obey and follow without question), use your conscience and listen to your subconscious.

However, what NO ONE does not realize is that to do the first "MIME" is completely against one's nature of life.

The conscience will tell a person that they are not right, by following others commands about how to live. The conscience knows 'god' isn't real and it knows it's not right.
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adauphinposted 15 years ago
If anyone could prove the existence of God,then God has not existed.The majesty that this notion of God conveys proves to be too much for our finite mind to grasp. We can't even grasp His Science and our science can not capture Him and even duplicate the Deeds we attribute to Him. One is being the Designer of our unreachable and vast Universe that our science is unable to explain and map and contain and even explore because our lifespan is too short... Which one of our sciences can duplicate the making of a man with all his intricates from dust?
God asks us to just start by believing He exists in order to prove His existence. Spiritually. I think that is what is called faith. And once He accepts you and you act as He tells you to then you will want to meet Him because God does not make sense to anybody. You will never be able to grasp His wisdom and power. God wants you at a local level to love your enenmy and cater to your enemy and pray for your enemy! Does that make any sense? That enemy can be anything you can think of like someone who robs you of your spouse or child or one that is dear to you...
Why would I ever want to love my enemy? He dares to tell me I am not better than my enemy! And if I think I am better than my enemy that I am a liar and that He seeks the humble to translate His care to the others. Or I can be content with myself and forfeit the chance to ever get to meet Him and therefore have the fate of a tree or an animal or any creature that is deemed to be erased from the universe forever.
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  TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I mean it's cool if you want to talk to and believe in something you'll never see, touch or feel. But there is much greater things in life for me than chasing ghosts and mythical beings.
  
  "Ennemy" is spelled "enemy" btw.
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hey, Mr Webster, "enemy" ifs french for "ennemi"].
  
  Then you don't believe in love.
  
  If you say you believe in love because you can feel love, people can feel God too. But not anyone can feel God specially if you shut yourself up. A God that you can see and touch at this time can never or would never be a God. This kind of God would have ceased to exist if you could ever handle it.
  
  Perhaps, your idea of God is different from the God I am talking about. I am not talking about an idol-like god like an image of Buddha or virgin Mary or an animal or a sculpture made by one of us. Those things are ghosts and mythical beings.
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  TimTurnerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Either way, you spelled enemy wrong lol And this is an English speaking forum.
  
  I don't have an idea of a "god." I don't believe in anything of the sort.
  
  It seems you are "feeling" your "god" as mother earth. You are feeling the powers of the Universe, not some magical being in the sky.
  
  The spiritual powers of the Universe are far greater than any "spirit" or "god" structure that humans create.
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You meant to say an English Grammar forum because the spoken English is different from the written English. Ain't that right?
  And while you don't want to chase ghosts and mythical beings you're talking about "The spiritual powers of the Universe are far greater than any "spirit" or "god" structure that humans create". What's up with that? I am not quite following your thought process! It seems a little bit contradictory to me.
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awareposted 15 years ago
proof is in the pudding
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  exactly, you can't
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Can you post me some then? i am kind of hungry!
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awareposted 15 years ago
if proof had a flavor . using 4 words, describe it
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awareposted 15 years ago
dry bitter sourlike lemons
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awareposted 15 years ago
i think proof would taste like sht
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
you can't
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drej2522posted 15 years ago
wait...wait...what's Spaghetti?
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  adauphinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It is a rare pearl from the Italian Milky Way.
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
You're such a joy, Cagsil
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I know. Ain't I.
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I'm waiting for the Snartstorm....
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Wait....it's coming soon.
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I'm grabbing some popcorn, want any?
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drej2522posted 15 years ago
I'll get the goobers!
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hey Drej,
  
  You have fan mail. I just fanned you.
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
The suspense is killing me....
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Cagsilposted 15 years ago
Hey you guys, don't forget to get drinks.
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
Keg of Pumpkinhead Ale. Check.
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Good Job.
  report
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I love the stuff. Yummy.
  report
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
and the straws
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Cagsilposted 15 years ago
Now that everyone is ready, no one wants to come out and play?

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Denno66posted 15 years ago
Hey Cagsil, start something new....
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Cagsilposted 15 years ago
And, btw- the thread itself is a joke.

Proof already exists that god doesn't exist. But, it's the people who refuse to see it.

Either way, now isn't a good time to talk about it, because like I said, I've already given my comment.

But, thanks for playing. I'm outta here. Enjoy.
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
Shane....come back...come back....Shane!
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
Oh, these kids.......
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shazwellynposted 15 years ago
Nope.... I dont think anyone can possibly prove that god doesnt exist. Good investigation and well thought out. x
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I can prove he doesn't exist. But, no one wants to believe me.
  
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  God's not happy with that response, Atheist
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yo- PUNK! Yeah, YOU!
  
  I'm not an atheist. Calling me an atheist is a direct insult.
  
  I have NO religious belief or religion affiliation. Got it.
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Do your best. I have the God on my side.
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So, in essence, what you're telling me is that what you are really saying is that you are alone.
  
  Hmm....interesting. But, not surprising.
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  shazwellynposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  wow.. he called you a punk.... kewl! It must be something to do with the wool dye. hehehe x
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Your Brit humor is so different from what I hear all the time. Thanks a bunch, Shaz. No offense intended at all.
  report
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  shazwellynposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I am imagining a sheep with dyed wool, spiking up dancing to 'rock the casbah' by the Clash. Wow... how cool is that!? x
  report
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Holy Crap! That has to be the best thing I could be doing right now!
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  shazwellynposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are just a blooming rebel babes! x
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I do believe you are right my Happy Hippy friend(bows)
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  shazwellynposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Oh.. I think there was a reference to a hill earlier? Well the spelling of Capitol was wrong it is CAPITAL and I live near a hill, here in Glastonbury - not a capital btw ... it is the Tor. Monks were chucked off it for being catholic, me thinks? Sad but true. I hope we dont start getting into sheep... lol x
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You had me at hello
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Oh, Lord, I knew that was comin'.....
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  shazwellynposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I dont want to be in the middle of bolts of lightening... happy hippy shaz just believes in looooooooooove! Whether God is behind this, I will await my death to find out. *singing madonnas ... life is a mystery... everyone must stand along... I hear your voice and it feels like........ home!* Prayer by Madonna. x
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I try to draw out the faithful or, um, otherwise with these little comments. Someone's gotta bite
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  report
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  shazwellynposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  aww cagsil... I would love to read another one of your hubs about it .. why waste it in the forum? x
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I already posted my answer to this thread. But, no one wants to believe it. So, I leave to them to figure out.
  
  As for the Hub- I have a 3-part arrangement coming out, each will be linked to the other, because there was too much information to put inside ONE Hub.
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
They try, however.....
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
Sigh.
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  Stimpposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Time to move along and raise CAINE somewhere else.
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
Politics?
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  report
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
Lightening has to strike somewhere?
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
whyare you asking us to, doubts within?
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
It's like asking if you still beat your wife?
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What does that got to do with anything? Explain, for us ignorant people.
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You don't know Multivac? Huh? You...don't...know?
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  meany iam the typo queen and dont forget it or i'll skin you alive
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No to answer your question. I don't know.
  
  I don't claim to know everything.
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  oh, I get it know,thanks
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
how can I prove God doesn't exist when not one person on this planet can prove that he did this thread sucks but I'm game to go at it again if you want to. Still awake, it is after all late, maybe fell asleep reading
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  report
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
I believe if we envision ourselves with long tails......
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
is capitol hill the capitol of the united states? I always wanted to know
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, the Capitol Building is in Washington D.C. which is the capital of the United States.
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  then why do they call it capitol hill?
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Because, the Capitol Building is there, as well as, Congressional House and The President Office- The White House.
  
  These things I think are within a 5 mile range of one another.
  
  I'm not exactly sure.
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe it's up a hill?
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  oh, i get it now, it's on a hill. cool
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  report
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  actually, I think it is.
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  well thats what you said, but why is it called capitol if it isnt the capitol?
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I just told you it is the Capitol of The U.S.
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  oh, but its not you said washington was?
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The Capitol Building is in Washington D.C.
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  ok hmmmmm.
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  thank you
  report
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  lyricsingrayposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  never mind I have to attend to my nails, thanks anyways kiss
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  report
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
304! and 75 posts to go yeh for me
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
yay!
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
hey! think i can make 4000 - im bringing back addicts post
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
You don't know everything? Oh, this undoes a great portion of my sparring material......
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
Her nails, Cags, her nails....
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  shazwellynposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  very importand detail, didn't you know? Of course not... you have hoofs dont you. Waste of time doing your nails babes! x
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
guys can we prove that god spelled backwards is dog?
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes we can.
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Denno66posted 15 years ago
That is reasonable.
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lyricsingrayposted 15 years ago
59 more post, liked it when it was 69
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  Cagsilposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  report
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  Denno66posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  giggity
  report

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Here's the twist... How can you prove that God doesn't exist?

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