Jesus did not believe in magic, ghosts, demons, zodiac signs, and succubus. Did he?
Moses, Buddha, Zoroaster, Socrates, Krishna and Muhammad, the great religious leaders of the world did not believe in them also.
Newton and Einstein and other renowned scientists did not believe in them also.
It is neither from Science nor in Word of Revelation.
It is simply superstitions to believe in such things. Do you agree with me?
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
Old testament says that a temple priest and Moses both changed their wands into snakes.
I am a believing Christian
Hi friend thirdmillenium
Moses was not a magician. Do you think he was a magician? I don't think so.
Jesus was also not a magician.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
You seem to like answering your own question, and only wish to read from those agreeing with you. WRONG!
>>>Moses was not a magician.<<<
Did Moses not get water from the rock? Did he not change his staff into a serpent? Moses was a greater magician than all the magicians of Pharoah's court. His own magicians tried to tell him so and advised him to listen to what Moses had to say. Pharoah refused. How do you explain the famous 10 plagues of Egypt if Moses was not a magician? I know, God did it. But he did it when and where Moses requested it, and if that's not magick what is? What is the real difference between magick and miracle? Both bring about things believed to be impossible. How do we tell the difference?
Personally, I would call the parting of the sea one of the greatest feats of magick ever manifested. It sure impressed Pharoah and his army--impressed them to death as I recall.
Then there was the incident of Elijah calling fire down from heaven to burn the wood, the sacrifice, the water in the trench and even the stones of the altar. Pretty impressive magick, I think. And the times that he called fire from heaven to burn the troops that came to arrest him. Two or three times if I recall correctly. The only difference is that Moses is in the Bible and you aren't. So the belief that only Moses can talk to God and only in those ages of old can "miracles" take place blinds man to the wonder and the magick that fills all our lives, only we're too blind to see it.
How many people did Jesus heal--instantly? Or raise from the dead? How many? That's powerful magick if you ask me. The rest is just a disagreement over definitions. And if you don't believe miracles happen even today, then you'll never see one. Pity. They're all around you.
With love under will,
The Wizzard of Jacksonville
Elijah's pyro-technic 'miracle' can be replicated using materials: the properties of which were known and understood at the time, such as naptha, suiphur and ascetic acid. I have seen this demonstrated - it is a chemical reaction - nothing more. These guys were all sleight-of-hand, snake oil salesmen. The real 'miracle' is that the con tricks these guys perpetrated all those years ago are still working their 'magic' today.
Did you stand in an election?
Moses did not; he was a Messenger Prophet of the Creator- God Allah YHWH.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
moses and their wands turned to snakes because there is a power out there. Its not satan because satan doesn't exist for one reason and if he did, he is an angel and opposite to most beliefs god empowers angels to do a specific job but normally angels do not create or shapeshift themselves or items. The power that is out there is all yahweh and he dispenses works of power whereever he will, and for whatever reason he will. The solitices have no power, the sun has no power other than to warm us. There are no magicians to this day that have actually walked on water. The disappearance of a 747 by david copperfield is impressive but a trick. Tricks show themselves in all sorts of ways. The turning of water to blood or red color could have been a reddish additive. Some things we don't know exactly, God may have helped the egyptian magicians to harden pharoahs heart and that would be my answer.
Jesus believing in demons etc... i agree, no he did not. As i state in my hubs there is no specific pattern for casting them out, it was never communicated to us as a doctrine - inspite of its seeming importance, So much is healing. Demonology is not of god it is of false religions and this is why the church is so powerless today as they have a blended religion of christianity, paganism and little jewish OT faith in the one true god of which there is no other like him in all the earth. Isaiah 46
oh brother....can you tell me what Jesus cast out of the leper
Jesus used to cure sick persons with prayer and medicine; and that is all to it.
Hogwash! Jesus performed miracles! He was the son of God!
What medicine makes the blind see?
What medicine cures the leperd?
What medicine raises the dead?
What medcine turns water to wine?
What medicine makes Jesus walk on water?
What medicine raised Jesus from the grave?
I believe the Medicine is God! Through his only son, Jesus!
it's said in testament hence it's true kinda thing entertains me here on forums.
Hi friend thirdmillenium
The magicians do tricks only; and what Moses did was that he exposed their tricks as advised to him by YHWH.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
Why are you so on Jesus, Paas... you do know that your Isa, is not our Yashua, correct? I mean. I know your a smart man and all.
Is it that you think you can sucker in those Christians who do not know better?
Is that what your about now?
The prophets prophecies - they do believe in magic.
"Either you can see the magic,
Or your life i indeed tragic." Ponder Awhile
Jesus and other saints performed miracles-magic.
The first evidence of Jesus existence s a bowl he is inscribed on it as the magician.
Some Sikh saints forbid their children from using magic-creating miracles.
Albert Einstein "There are two ways to live your life - one is as though nothing is a miracle, the other is as though everything is a miracle."
The miracles do not happen because of magic; they happen naturally but are beyond the level of present understanding of the man.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
It would be ridiculous to expect a scientist to believe anything that can't be logically accounted for.
And no, I don't agree with you. Just because you don't understand something is no reason not to believe in it.
Good point, but I'd change this wording a little to say, We can't expect scientists to believe anything that's not NATURALLY accounted for. Logic is another thing altogether. Logic brings some to question the things of God, while it brings others to question current theories and search for the greater truths not accounted for by naturalism. Logic is useful here on earth, but gets us only so far.
did you know jesus, personally?
if so...i have so many questions for a being of such great age and wisdom!
what information do you base your assumptions on?
Hi friend double_frick
I know Jesus from Quran, wich has given a vivid accout of Jesus and his mothers life and also his teachings. There are whole chapters of Quran on Mary and Jesus; like:
The Holy Quran : Chapter 19: Maryam مَریَم
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/sh … .php?ch=19
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/sh … r.php?ch=5
The Holy Quran : Chapter 3: Aal-e-`Imran آل عِمرَان
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/sh … r.php?ch=3
One could just click the links above , read them and enjoy.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
If it is not of God, if it cannot be substantiated backed up in The Holy Bible, it does not exist.
In answer to what did Jesus believe in, he most definately believed in demons, considering he cast them out. ghosts, no. Magic- well, not like we think of it. the others. nope.
I also, am a christian
did he cast them out? Indeed one needs to look closely at the approach jesus used to "cast out" these demons. Also it might be beneficial to discover more about these demons, which are angels that are fallen probably stripped of their powers if indeed angels have their own powers at all. If you can answer yes to this next statement then, well, here's, the statement: Can you imagine any angel wanting to be away from god and outside of the glory and wonder and amazement of heaven, even for a moment?
There are no fallen angles; it is the seemingly anglelike good person who sometimes falter and get fallen. Angels do only good deeds and they obey whatever the are commanded to do by the Creator-God Allah YHWH.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
Brotheryochanan, no I cannot imagine an angel actually wanting to leave the glory of God. But Lucifer became prideful and desired to be more holy than his Creator. He began a rebellions, in which he lead many angels into who believed that he had more power and stature than God. Fallen Angels and Satan have limited power to use only as far allowed, but it was the angels choice on whether to rebel or not. Same as it is humans choice on whether or not to love and have a relationship with Jesus Christ, the Lord.
It is wront concept of the scribes that an angel fall down and became devil. By definition angel cannot fall down and cannot do evil; similarly devil can only do evil and cannot be pious. It is a man who could do good and also could do evil; by choice and by will, and that is why man would be rewarded for doing good and punished for doing evil.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
Jesus never confirmed that there was any demon; it is the people who say that he cast demons out. Jesus never believed in any demons; he cured people who had some diseases with his prayers to the Creator-God Allah YHWH and/or using some medicines. When he was injred on the Cross; he was treated by his friends in the tomb; when he got cured enough to walk, they helped him go out.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
I am sorry, paarsurrey, but the Bible says that Jesus Christ indeed cast demons out. He spoke to them, and told his disciples how to handle them. The Bible also says that Jesus Christ died on the Cross and by the power of God, rose again on the third day! He came to give us salvation, and He will forgive you of your sins if you believe in Him as the Son of God and Savior of the world. Paar, read the Bible to find out these things for yourself. Read the four gospels in the New Testement, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. I think you will find these most enlightening. peace*
Hi friend UniqueBeauty
These are all mistakes and misunderstandings of the deserting and unbelieving scribes.They did not believe what Jesus believed in and that is why the deserted him.
Jesus is not responsible for the mistakes and misunderstandigs of such errant people.
Jesus always prayed to YHWH and that is why he was saved a cursed death on the Cross.
I don't understand as to why our Christian friends prefer the errant scribes over Jesus their Master.
Jesus did not believe in demons ; nor he cast them out.
I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
That is why God started right away in making a plan to save man. By the time God established a formal law system with a system in place that would be able to save all who came to him, he chose Moses. Moses was given power by God to perform all the things in Egypt. The magicians in old times were being influenced by the now demons because God never took the power from them and allowed them to remain in supernatural form which is parellel to our own dimension. These 2 dimesions exist simultaniously which is how we are able to communicate with God and the Angels. This is how Satan gave the magicians and sooth sayers their power and knowledge to perform the things that they did. It wasn't magic in them it is the demonic or God given power an dthose assigned to fulfill what task has been commanded of them. The difference is when demonic forces are allowed to work with humans they come in and use our creativity and imagination to ultimately destroy that person and anyone else they can. Which is a direct copy of God except God never forces humans to do anything nor does he take over who you are. You are always in control of your mind and spirit unless you open it up for him. You are a willing servant. Yes, it is the same today as it was then. People can perform mighty things both for good and evil, but you will reap the blessings or horrible consequences depending on whose side your on and whom you serve. If you don't serve God than you sevre Satan but ultimately it is always your choice. As for Jesus, he agreed to come to Earth because just as Adam was pure and without blemish when he allowed Satan to influence him and what he did was sell himself, the Earth, and all following generations to Satan. Satan had a right to rule, not fully because God was and is still supreme ruler, but he was able to rule wherever God's hand was not. Jesus came to be a perfect man without blemish to reclaim God's plan to restore man as ruler of Earth. A perfect man sold it so a perfect man had to take it back. Jesus was well aware of demonic presences and their influences and power. We see him as God intended all men to be and the power within, to never have war, diseases, criminals, hardships, death, etc.. We see it in not only the example he lead as a person, but in the miracles he performed and the way in which he dealt with the demonic forces. As for ghosts, the Bible says 6to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. Which means their is a place where we go an dit is almost instantainously from the time we take our last breath. So your ancestors are not left here on Earth. However, the Bible does speak of innocent blood that cries to God from the Earth. We see it in Gensis when Cain killed Able, God cam e to Cain and asked, where is your brother Able, his innocent blood cries to me from the ground. It is true that when a traumatic event happens, such as murder, war, or any other atrosotiy occurs, that it leaves a mark on that place. Then the demonic forces called familiar spirits are assigned to take over that place and either reenact the event like a time loop that can be accesed fairly easliy or to look like a person who has passed. They will mimic everything even down to simple hand gestures or experssions so that it is an exact replica of that person as they were on Earth. They can also attach to people, places, or things. They can cause people to be disfigured, deform, or shapeshift. They can appear in different forms and yes, if you are not protected by God, they can hurt or kill you, because if you don't serve God then you are open to any and everything Satan wishes to do to you. You will reap the will of your master. See Jesus is the only way to God and to salvation. As for Einstein, he believed in God. He said very plainly that God had given him the revelation of E=MC squared. Many other scientist have made remarkable discoveries cncerning the God an d the Bible. Even people who don't believe in God or follow him in any way say that the Bible is the most accurate document of historical accounts in the world. Now if something is proven to be that historically accurate then to me at least it is worth believing. If it is true, worth believing, than believeing in the contents of it, isn't such a stretch of imangination. Also, the Bible speaks often of the supernatural world, and you don't have to believe in God to believe in thre supernatural, but if combined together, what a revelation to the meaning of life, complete with instruction manual and new discoveries that will take not only a lifetime to explore but fulfillment while exploring it. That is why I am a Christian, even though I often fall far short of perfect or of being an excellent example, which is why I am thankful that God gives me grace. So when I do fall in my walk with him, I can pick myself back up, try until I succeed in not doing it again, and move on closer to him and the supernatural that we all will one day experience.
Why would Jesus be "saved" from that which he came into the world to do? And without his redeeming work on the cross, none of us would be saved!
Yes, Jesus did believe in angels, demons, majic, and so on. He himself is from the alternate plane we call the supernatural. He is God in himself. He is also the Word, which many people refer to the Bible.
See when God created the Heavens, Earth, and the Universe as we see today (which Scientists have discovered is still expanding because God never told it to stop); Jesus was with Him already. I do not believe that was his name before God sent him to Earth, so he was made flesh, and became the Savior of the World. He came to fulfill the Levitical Law that was given to Moses for him to establish, by God, the Law at that time in history. As for Satan and the Angels, yes, they were made by God to serve. They were not given free will nor the same creative minds as we as humans were. However, God is not a tyranical ruler and the Angels have the choice whether or not to serve. When God made Lucifer or Satan, he not only made him an Angel, but he was made in such a spectacular manner that not even Hollywood could come close to even trying to replicate his splendor. As with most Angels who are given personalities and each one different, he made Satan an Archangel which is one of the highest ranking Angels. Satan was also given a creative intelligence because he was the musical leader and had Angels at his disposal to carry out what God had designed him to. As the old saying goes, pride comes before a fall, Satan began to look at the power God gave him (because God is true to his word, so when he gives you something, he never takes it back), and his own majesty, position, authority, he became prideful to the point that he viewed hiself as God's equal and therefore could become ruler of all Heaven and then all the inhabitants of Heaven would worship his as they do God. It would be like a teenager looking at you and saying, "Ok, now that I know everything you have taught me and everything else I have learned myself, I know it all, and now you have to obey me." Absurd, right. That was Satan's attitude to God a being that we can spend the rest of infinety getting to know and will never unstand nor know all the knowledge that is in Him.
Satan was also an eloquent speaker and had a natural charisma to him similar to some world leaders today. When he spoke, they listened and his reasoning made sense to them, even though they knew the first rule, which is God is God and anything or anyone else, will never come close. I don't think they underst6ood fully their actions, but God had established rulers in Heaven as well, and when they broke them, they had to walk out the consequenses. Make no mistake, Satan does exist. When they chose to defy God and all inhabitants in Heaven and brought war in the Heavenly places, they were transformed and he hated loosing to God. God could not allow such treason and abomination to exist in Heaven, but he was merciful to them still by casting them out of Heaven instead of totally wiping out their entire existance. Because Satan was prideful and had changed not only his own self but those Angels were transformed as well. Then God made man and gave man authority over Angels in Heaven and over all the Earth because we are made in God's image. Both male and female, which represent God's true nature, judegment and mercy, creativness and sensiblity. Satan hated what he became, he blames and hates God. he also hates the fact that man has ultimate authority given by God over him and all angels. He discovered that man had a creativness like God and could be influenced, so inorder to gain power an dcontrol over what God loves and cherishes he knew that war against man and God would not do so if he were to persued man to sin as he did, then he could gain control over man and man's only way out of bondage to his control would be to live without sin or make severe attonment for sin and to walk with God, but everyone else is fair game
As for the zodiac symbols. In history, which you will be hard pressed to find information on, the zodiac was a chistian symbol. It is fasinating how you can look up you "sign" and the personality traits are astounding. Agian it is a counterfit of the original which included the cross, and two other signs that now excape me. It was later changed by certain pagan religions and distorted. As a very wise man that I respect said to me when I brought up the subject. Takethe information that is solid an dleave the spiritual out. Because no matter what your sign is, when you allow God to change your heart you naturally become a better person. You can't stop the process and if God puts a Leo and an Aquarius together as a couple than if both of them serve the Lord, then nothing will ever be too strong to over take them.
As for certain scientist and religious leaders who did not or do not believe in God, my opinion is this. God placed an truth inside everyone of us. That is why you don't need to be taught that it is wrong to kill, steal, eat other people, or any number of things that people around the world and of all religions do or don't do. Wright and wrong if you will. You don't have to be of any specific belief to be a good person or to find wisdom where it is. To be an excellent leader and to make a good example that people choose to follow doesn't take a specific religion. However, the Bible plainly says the only way to Heaven is through God, and the only way to God is to believe on Him and in His Word, which is Jesus. That was one of His names before he became our Savior. I respect people and their free choice to believe any way they want to. I was not put here to judge, be critical, or to hate someone who doesn't share what I personally believe. However, if you want to know the Bible or what God has reveled to me and will to anyone who seeks him. Then send me a message. Have a great day and keep seeking truth and you will find it.
Exodis 22:18 "Suffer not a Witch to Live" If you read the whloe of Exodis all of 22:18, not just this passage, but all of it. The whole thing
You will find that he was quite clear in his meaning, of his laws and ways. No Ghosts, Nothing supernatural. No spiritual plane-like a Talisman beliefe. There was Nothing like what you and other people here are incinuating at all. Please read it first, then Quote him.
If you insist on talking about him, (piegon-hloe-ing him; so to seak) re-defining him. At least learn his thoughts first. It would really improve your whitness.
with concern for you my friend
Jon in Nashville
The original Hebrew does not say "Witch" that is a mis-transliteration and a mis-translation
52. And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
53. And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.
When it says bodies, it means the astral body.
Many say these were resurrections, but this isn't true. Even those martyrs who died horrible deaths aren't resurrected yet.
Rev. 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
The only one who has already being resurrected is Yahshua.
1. And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,
2. And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
3. And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.
But Yeshua instructed them to tell no one until he was risen from the dead. He knew no one would believe them.
6. And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid.
7. And Jesus came and touched them, and said, Arise, and be not afraid.
8. And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man, save Jesus only.
9. And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.
The original translation most deff. says witch...I have seen the translation Deb, it really does, it was what stopped me cold, and made me re-consider my Priesthood in WICCA, it does indeed say this.
I stood there stunned when it was proven to me. But..... the point I was making was not :18 specificly, but all of Exodis
read the entire thing, not just 22:18...all of it; they keep re-making Jesus, re-defining what he believed in, and in truth he laid it out in plain language for everyone. Thats what I really am saying, read it for yourself, not because I said something or anyone else for that mater, just read it. Thats it!....I'm done...lol
I speak, read and write Hebrew (Also Greek), my Husband is Hebrew. No it doesn't
When did you read the Hebrew Bible?
Got your info off the internet. You can't believe everything you read on the WWW because any ignorant person can create a site
>>>The original translation most deff. says witch.<<<
Sorry, Dutchman, but it does NOT say "witch". It says "kashaph" in Hebrew letters, of course, Kaph, Shin, Peh. But the word is now obsolete and has been for hundreds of years. Today, no one really knows what it used to mean. The King James translators made it say, "witch" to flatter King James, who considered himself an expert on witchcraft. Why even the Greek word translated as "witchcraft" really means "medicine". It's "pharmakeia", the word from which we get pharmacy. Please go and tell Walgreen's and CVS that they're practicing witchcraft and see how far you get. The majority of scholars these days believe that a "kashaph" was a poisoner, but no one really knows for certain.
And BTW, how do you explain the woman of Endor who raised the spirit of Samuel to prohesy for Saul? I note that she is referred to simply as "the woman of Endor", nowhere is she called a witch. And I notice that even though Saul was an enemy who had outlawed her kind, she took pity on him and comforted him when his doom was foretold. Was the spirit of Samuel a lying spirit? His prophecy came true did it not? And in comforting a man who was her declared enemy, did not the woman of Endor show more Christian compassion than Saul ever showed anyone at all?
Get the text right and your priorities straight if you want to convert the world.
With love under will,
The Wizzard of Jacksonville
I will have to take your word that none of these historical figures believed in magic, ghosts, ect.
I agree that it is just another superstition to believe in these presently unproveable forces or beings.
Mankind's reliance on superstitions logically predates the written recording of history.
I am curious as to where this one is going and will see you in the comments.
Peace comes only to those who seek it and desire it.
I am a peaceful American atheist.
I may discuss the matter of agreeing, or disagreeing with your point of view, after, you restructure the question properly ...
Because, the Arch-secular, Socrates,
The Aryan's native nemesis, Krishna.
Zoroaster the King of Persia.
The Scientist Newton
And the Theoretician, Einstein ...
cannot be placed in the category of God's Prophets, or at par, with Prophet Muhammad, Peace and Blessings of Allah be upon Muhammad.
In my Correct Islamic Belief ...
I believe in all the Prophets of Allah ...
I Believe in Jesus; The Christ, Son of mary ... The savior, returning in Person, to save human kind before the onset of the Day. Peace be Upon him.
I believe in Prophet David, Peace be Upon him,
I believe in Prophet Moses, Peace be Upon him
And I believe in the Last Prophet of Allah, Muhammad, Peace and Blessings of Allah be Upon him.
Jesus knew there were demons. He did not believe in the other stuff, tho.
I am a God-fearing devout Christian,
How about the Slave Girl who stalked Paul on his way to Phillipi, she was said to possessed by a demon which Paul exorcised..this made her owners angry because they lost money and arrested him and Silas
When the Son Of God was walking among us, the answer was here. Although, Jesus said that I must go away, and I shall send you a comfortable.
Is this comfortable made of cotton or wool? NO. It's a ghost.
Jesus said I have over come the world. The second heaven is where spiritual warfare takes place. Did Jesus defeat Hitler? No, He defeated the spirit of Hitler, a demonic spirit.
Jesus said O' generation...when a sign is given you recognized not...
Although I believe in miracles and magic, and have seen both manifest in my life...
that’s not what that scripture says
But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:
Yahshua (Jesus) didn’t defeat the spirit of Hitler. How do you figure this ?
people often use the words implying magic and miracles are the same, but there is a difference
Miracles are energy manifestations of Pure Light use...untainted by the human consciousness of imperfection. i.e. superstition
Magic is the use of the Pure Light energy into imperfect manifestations, through the use of the imperfect human consciousness...they can produce what appear to be miracles, but are not and are usually temporary; or may solve one problem yet produce another
it is all in why and how the flow of Pure Light energy is used
or I guess more simply one could say, magic is created through the imperfect human consciousness (tainted faith) and miracles are allowed through pure faith
I find it fascinating that people have certainty without a speck of evidence.
I find it amazing that religionists pray, when not one prayer or miracle has been proven in the entire history of man simply because a few old sexist goat herders thought they would control the masses by rewriting old stories dating back to the sun god.
Ridiculous and infantile.
Oh yes! The "My god is gonna send you to hell for not believing in him" always gets a chuckle.
Oh! Earnestshub, those are the ones that make me cringe! lol I do very much enjoy Jesus narratives tho'... I always wonder why so many people don't value "the story/stories" at least but instead end up arguing about "true/false" or "historically correct/history revision" issues...
I don't think I'll ever prove that certain personalities from ancient times lived or did not live but heck... that's some cool narrative goin' on when staff turn to snakes, waters part, man, someone should make a movie out of something like that lol
I agree that there are a lot of "My god is gonna send you to hell for various reasons oh and by the way, sacrifice your child on that rock over there" statements all over in scriptures.
Thanks, MB, I spent many years studying religion and decided it was a crock.... all of it.
Lots of hate and revenge from the psychotic imaginary fairy in the bible and quoran.
That people believe this rubbish in 2010 is gobsmakingly crazy!
I'm not saying I believe, "literally," the Scriptures... but I think they're really interesting. I always have at least two versions of Bible out in the open (shocking my friends since I am Metis and also very interested in the Stoics and, if nobody guessed - gothic fiction, mythology, etc).
I actually DO believe that Jesus or the culture surrounding Jesus (even if they were attempting to follow the principles of their "one-god") DID believe very much in magic, ghosts and many things related to astrology/zodiac.
I am guilty, too, of shortening narratives down, adding a spin to call the "one-god" angry, harmful, full of vengeance, killer even... but people who discuss narratives with me find the same things in Native tales, Greek mythology, Egyptian and other mythology sets fron every corner of the globe...
I'm not sure why Christianity deems God "ultimately benevolent and right" when - CLEARLY - there are times when the one-god behaves and speaks in a way that none of us are s'posed to!
I like this.
This universe is totally magic, everything in it is magical.
I agree *waving my wand.........zap* frog or prince, mohitmisra, which would you want to be in this magical world?
Are you sure that Socrates didn't possibly believe in some of the magical things you mentioned? I think he certainly believed that the stars and planets might have some influence on the world, human behavior...
I might be mixing that up with another philosopher, so correct me if I am mistaken.
Hi friend mythbuster
I don't think there are any such writings by Socrates himsilf that he believed in magical things.
The Sun, Moon, and stars do effect the weather and our life with physical characters; but that are altogether different from what are blieved mythically by astrologers.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
Demon gods demanded child sacrifices, which the Lord was appalled at. Child sacrifice was one of the big things that turned God against a nation.
The one place you are misusing in Scriptures is the instruction for Abraham to "sacrifice" Isaiah. The Lord would supply the sacrifice, which Abraham said confidently, and the Lord did just that - first by providing the lamb for that immediate sacrifice and then by providing the ultimate sacrifice for all humankind - Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior. The request for Abraham to give up Isaiah was both a test of Abraham's love and faithfulness to God, who would make him the father of all the faithful, and also a foreshadowing of God's / Jesus' sacrifice at the cross.
We are not merely listening to stories, but our own Spirit led prayers and miracles are proven to us all the time. How then would we not believe?
According to the "word" the jesus loony beat up on a tree cos it didn't give fruit out of season fer gords sake!
I don't believe Jesus ever did that; it is the mistake of the sucribe to mention a thing which might have never happened. Jesus was a rational person; why should he do such a thing. Jesus did not write the incident himself or dictate it to anybody.
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim
Mark 11:13 And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet.
Mark 11:14 And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.
Mark 11:20 And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
Mark 11:21 And Peter calling to remembrance saith unto him, Master, behold, the fig tree which thou cursedst is withered away.
Mark 11:22 And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
Mark 11:23 For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
Mark 11:24 Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.
Mark 11:25 And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.
Mark 11:26 But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.
All this from one fig tree.. well done jesus. I wonder if a better tree sprung up in place of this one.
As to the lemmings.. jewish tradition, taken from persian tradition was to put a bowl of water somewhere around the person to be exorcised and command the possessing spirit to knock the bowl of water over when it had left the body (as a sign to those around that the demon had left) The same with the "food of the invading romans", pigs, which by nature are good swimmers, drowned... Now we have to actually wonder if the demons couldn't control the pigs or the demons wanted the pigs to drown (either way, with pigs alive or dead the demons from legion could leave at any time they chose, the demons didnt have to kill the pigs for freedom) or if jesus just killed the pigs for a sign to the possessed man and audience and to injure the food supply to the romans who were using jewish slaves as guards.
In either story, be it fig trees or pigs, people are what concerns jesus most of all, not all people however, but whosoever believeth on the son should have eternal life. In my own life i have taken down an sickly tree out of season to plant a new tree for the season. Trees are trees, I wouldn't go around saying god is psychopath for cursing a tree
The DUDE walked on water and you are telling me he didn't believe in Magic?! Yeah right!!!
It is a misstatement of the scribes or he understood wrongly.
Of course you know more than anyone, even Yahshua
He was wrong, you are right.
I don't claim that. Jesus never said that he was a magician or he believed in Zodiac signs or succubus or he believed in ghosts or demons. It was ascribed to him by the scribes who deserted him; they never believed in Jesus.
Didn't you know Deborah. .. Paara is the only source of truth.
Some of his "truth" got 50 people killed today and 100 injured.
The day I see Bill Nye, the Science Guy walk on water, I'll turn into a skeptic. In the meantime... Jesus believed in magic. AND SO DO I!!!! lol
Jesus cast the demon called "Legion" some say it was many demons hence the name, he sent them into a herd of swine that promptly ran into the sea and drowned. (Also a prophecy: Christianity would destroy Rome. (Or save it depending on your perspective) And in my opinion, someone who points out his peacefulness, has something behind his back, like saying "TRUST ME!"
Non believers call miracles, magic. BUT, the powers of light are "White Magicians" the powers of darkness are "Black Magicians". The word Magic comes ffrom the word "MAGI as in 3 wise men from the east"
ONE MORE THING I think, as in i'm not sure, but succubus is the old test. so proof that Jesus did or didn't believe in that is rather fragile. There are NO LEGITIMATE BIBLICAL TEXTS ON THESE MATTERS. Mr Parsurrey, thou art a cad!
Jesus was a Messenger Prophet of the Creator-God Allah YHWH, he had nothing to do with "magic, ghosts, demons, zodiac signs, succubus".
The word "Magic":
1350â€“1400; ME magik ( e ) witchcraft < LL magica, L magicÄ“ < Gk magiká¸—, n. use of fem. of magikÃ³s. See magus , -ic
What if it happens that they find that Jesus in fact did not exist, which is highly likely, what then?
Quantum, welcome to my parlor said the spider to the fly.
The historian Josephus verified in the Roman records, the existence of the man known as Jesus.
Further, proof of God does exist. You prove it, I prove it. By Jesus's own words. Everybody proves it.
our God only made 1 mistake God should have said ..........." paar is the truth the way and the light' as after lisening to paar I now now paar is NEVER WRONG, if you say something that paar dose not like , he say's not true, or you are mistaked, or any other excuse that paar thinks up. paar can insult Jesus as much as paar likes because paar then says I love Jesus in the Quran, paar I can promise you this much Jesus was only put in the Quran as Islam wanted to try and prove that Jesus never died on the cross.
Paar knows all! You should not question his authority Skipper! LOL
LOL Libby I now know paar is the ONLY REASONABLE TRUTHFULL HONEST MAN IN THE WORLD, it was told to my by A FLOCK OF POLAR BEARS FLYING SOUTH. THEY CALLED OUT PAAR PAAR ONLY YOU ARE REASONABLE, ONLY YOU ARE TRUTHFULL, ONLY YOU BELIVE YOU,KEEP BELIVEING THAT PAAR, BECAUSE ONLY FLYING BEARS BELIVE YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
Now over to the 'WORD" according to paar.
God bless Libby
Skipper, you and most of the other posters are missing the point that Paar is a Muslim. In that faith, Jesus is honored as one of the prophets, but Muslims do not believe he was the son of God, much less God incarnate. In fact, if you believe in the Bible, check out John 17:3, which shows clearly that Jesus did not believe in the divinity of Jesus, "And this is life eternal, that they may know Thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent." And the word "sent" is apostello, which means "sent as an apostle" not "sent as a God." The Christianoids have it all wrong, as they have most of their Bible dogma dead wrong. But quoting the Christian bible at a Muslim is a waste of time, since they have a different holy book. And Paar quoting the Quran to a largely Christian/atheist audience is also a waste of time. You guys don't even speak the same myth-language.
Just a friendly note to call for some sanity.
With love under will,
The Wizzard of Jacksonville
G;day Adastra you are entitled to belive what you like, I am free to disagree with you.Also I do not accept that Christians have the Bible 'dead wrong' I think you are also missing the point, Paar goes out of his way to attack and insult Jesus, then states he (paar) loves the Jusus in the Quran.Thank you for your inport. Also as you might be aware Paar is a (Ahmadi Muslim) Banned as a sect by Mainstream Islam, if FACT no Ahmadi Muslin is allowed to go to Mecca , so being a Ahmaid Muslim is a bit like a Clayton;s Muslim the Muslim you have when you are not haveing a Muslim!
P.S. Paar also claims Allah corrected the Bible also
Jesus trumps Muhammad, Know why. Because he wasn't "just a prophet" It is written that he who believeth a lie, shall be sent strong delusion to believe that lie. The more you allow yourself to be deceived, the more deceived you shall surely be. Just exactly who do es anyone think the Christians will be battling in Armageddon? Mickey Mouse? Not really. More bad news...Armageddon is upon us.
Jesus was not a man so he couldn't believe in anything.
Jesus is a state.
The heck he didn't! He would tell demons to "get ye behind me Satan!" lol
Au usual this is to hard for Parr so like always he leaves.
Well, that may or may not be the case.......HOWEVER...if astrology is 'godless' (as someone once told me), then answer me this question:
If God is against astrology, then why did he 'announce' his Son's birth with a major conjunction of 2 very bright planets, and also, at His death, have an eclipse???????
Good post Ben! Why indeed did God announce the arrival of Jesus with a conjunction of planets? And what's so bad about interpreting people by the positions of planets anyway? I don't think there is God, but I believe more in a "Creative Principle" or "Energy" that is all knowing and all seeing. And whether it's God, Allah, Buddah or Joe, it's all the same energy. The energy that made the planets and nature. I am not a Christian, but I have read the whole Bible cover to cover. How many self-proclaimed Christians have done that, and put in the time?
The Bible and many religious texts are written in an exoteric form, one that is easy for the average person to understand. They all have more serious, esoteric meanings, that take more study and contemplation to understand. Jesus was a Master. But he said," You will do things even greater than these." He wanted people to follow his excellent example and expand their minds and knowledge. He didn't want a religion made up of his teachings. Plus he didn't hate women and think the whole Church should exclude them and demonize them. I know Constantine was responsible for merging Christian and Pagan teachings. It was already OK to try to erase women from history and pretend they were all "harlots." Well known Bilblical authors and others in the Gnostic Gospels think Mary Magdalene was married to Jesus, and his bloodline survived. Remember the wedding where Jesus turned the water into wine? The person in charge of the wine at a Jewish wedding is the groom. Period.
Jesus did not believe in magic, ghosts, demons, zodiac signs, succubus
sorry Parr wrong again, you read the Bible to try and prove your point..................... guess to understand Jesus is byond you, and the Quran is no help as Jesus was son of God never a prophet, Allah never saved Jesus from the cross................. and just for your sect Jesus never went to India either.......................yes Jess did belive in demons
This is hilarious that Paar knows what Jesus believed! He knew him personally!
According to his teacihngs... he cast out many demons! Therefore, to cast something out would be an indication that he believed in them!
Go read the Bible again Paar! You missed big portions!
I agree the way Parr talks he must know Jesus personally, I am like you still laughing
I think Parr 'READS' the Holy Blble from a Islamic viewpoint, I must point out to Parr the Holy Bible is not a Islamic book therefore has NOTHING to do with Islam.
Parr might have better understanding of 'The Book of Morman' after all Joseph Smith had 11 whitnesses to him RECIVEING the last word of God. LONG AFTER Mohammed.!!
Jesus did not believe in magic, ghosts, demons, zodiac signs, succubus.
Moses ,David and Muhammad also did not believe in magic, ghosts, demons, zodiac signs, succubus.
I disagree with you, however, the story of creation is not adding up which led people to believe in those low level spirits. If Jesus did not believe in the mysteries why were they created? Mythical beings and stories is as old as the Bible. What was the purpose of including the Magi story in the Bible? Most of Jesus miracles were expelling demons from people, for example, Legion, Mary Magdalene, the boy with seizures, the slave girl who was a seer making her master lots of money. The Bible is very clear about the hierarchy of angels, etc.
Ephesians 6:12 touch on the division of power in the heavenly spheres.
From the OP "Jesus did not believe in magic, ghosts, demons, zodiac signs, and succubus. Did he?"
If we are talking about the Jesus of the New Testament Christian Bible, I think he actually did believe in the demons he exorcised from people.
Yes! Funny that anyone who believes in the Scriptures would say otherwise!
Mark, "anyone who believes in the scriptures..." as the IIMPORTANT point.
(Hi Cat333!!! )
The Jesus of the bible is not the Jesus of anywhere else. No one knew him so well as "the gospels".
Jesus surely did believe in spiritual ghosts. He knew them by name, right?
No, I never heard him holler, "Sagittarius in the house!" so it may be safe to say that the zodiac was not his cup of tea though.
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