Who tempted Satan?

1. 79

   fresh2def05posted 14 years ago

   Satan was tempted by "jealousy", which is one of the seven deadly sins, I  believe.

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      Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Perhaps, but then, so was god!

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2. 67

   ceciliabeltranposted 14 years ago

   

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      Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Get on the band wagon
      
      Wasn’t god named Jealous, for he is a jealous God?

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3. 0

   luabuposted 14 years ago

   I'm back with more petrol
   Castlepaloma's loss brings up a serious point
   imagine a parent who looses a child and through listening to crap about lucifer and belzebub and armani/is he one/maybe not
   well anyway these people in their grief do not need images of eternal damnation
   i think that hebrew lady asked me to go away /i think i was giving her a migrane
   i'm like a virus for intelligent people/actually more like an allergy
   whats this randy line
   it ends when i say it ends
   is this a line from the king and i or something
   randy it ends when it ends or else it doesn't end
   i hope you are not getting a migrane as well
   if you can't stand the heat stay out of the kitchen
   
   satan was framed and i know who did it

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4. 0

   luabuposted 14 years ago

   quick lads
   a bit of girl on girl action going on just above my head
   east meets west type thing
   now we're cooking
   hottest hub around this

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   1. 60

      Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Yes, Eve vs Eve!  No Satan required!  Women are darkness-men are light!

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         mom101posted 14 years agoin reply to this

         nay sayer

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            Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Once had a horse!  He said this often!

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   luabuposted 14 years ago

   help me out someone with the ould guy
   he's starting to freak me out
   the heat is not good for him
   someone ring beelze and get him to collect his da
   i'm busy here in the bottomless pit working on a brew
   Lets see now,
   cat hair/no prob/plenty around here
   an entire cow clap/up to me neck with that and
   a toe-nail of senility /oh dear,i've just sent old belly fella home
   not to worry  /i'll make up the recipe as i go along
   
   Double, double toil and trouble;
   Fire burn and cauldron bubble
   
   this should be ready in about twenty minutes

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6. 0

   Twenty One Daysposted 14 years ago

   well, all these things being said, here at page 19, Happy Hanukkah!
   
   Mon le fin du fin:
   
   Kline wouldn't be the only one to say something relatively similar to that idea. Many --myself included-- from this "episteme" would consider any variation of the word/term 'Sons of' to mean human, not angelic. And yes, the Judaic use of ba`al formatting for 'N/names of' and 'S/sons' of is identical...

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      luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      twenty one days
      that's how long it's going to take to get me irish stew made with all ye carol singers ringing the bell/i hope you're not looking for money cause your wasting your time
      this place is the pits
      a drop in creche for wackos
      and then they say february is the shortest month
      Bye

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   2. 67

      ceciliabeltranposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Happy Hanukkah James! How are you? As you can see, it's same-o, same -o around here.
      Just watched Harry Potter and I thought Beatrice LeStrange had a familiar personality. Then I came back and then I realized who.

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         Twenty One Daysposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         
         
         ps, I have to see this epic ending of Potter & Voldemort -iMAX!

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7. 0

   Deborah Sextonposted 14 years ago

   In Hebrew, Baal, Bet, Ayin, Lamed  was a word used for husband, master, owner. It was used as Lord when speaking of God.
   When it was used by others to describe their false gods, the Hebrews stopped using it.
   
   Jews never used Baal for names of or sons of.
   
   Sons is בני Bet, Nun, Yod (Bn'y)
   Any place in Hebrew scripture where it mentions the Bn'y Elohyim, it is referring to angels, not people.
   
   Maybe in Martian language, but not in Hebrew.
   
   The Bn'y Elohyim is the choir of angels under the Archangel Michael
   dealing with the 8th Sefira, Hod on the Tree of Life.
   
   I love how people pretend to be fluent in Hebrew and don't know the least thing about it.
   Have Mercy

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      Twenty One Daysposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      So the S/sons of Elephants are considered the S/sons of G-d???
      ( In India, maybe... ). Same ba`al, different channel.
      
      Indeed, have mercy!
      Why would Creator title angelic messengers as sons who are not made in his image or likeness?
      
      And if an elephant saw a crowd of women, would it say: "Daughters of Elephants!???

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         Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         _________
         If it said Bn'y Pyl (Sons of Elephant)  it would be sons of elephant, but it says Bn'y Elohyim, Sons of God.
         
         Angels are more like God than us. Man was made only a little lower.
         
         Your arguments mean nothing, your last comment shows how ridiculous they are. I am beginning to think you and C are the same person.

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            Twenty One Daysposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            So you are saying angels are greater than man and if you saw one you would worship it as well? That is what the Hebrews did before, yes? How many times did the angels tell them not to kneel before them or bow to them for they were the messengers of Creator and servants to Testimony of Grace?
            
            As I said, the influence of baal is riddled throughout Judaism and its history, carried on now by the post Y`shua "believers" which includes a non existent entity called Lucifer and Satan.
            
            edit: my comment was meant to be ridiculous in response to extensive name calling or evoking names that have no power, no purpose accept to hinder people.
            
            Creator never once scribed a  single name to himself. Yet, even in the face of Moses, the Hebrews did, not once but twice. They fashioned mental and physical idols they injected from various cults of baal...
            
            The D/daughters of Elephant are equal to the S/sons of G-d...

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               Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               __________________________
               Everything you have said is incorrect, either from reading the English scripture or from the inability to understand.
               Those who are not of God can't see the truth.
               
               Bye Cecilia/James

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                  Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Spoken like a true christian. lol!

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                     Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     ______
                     Don't compare me.
                     If someone said something incorrect about your way of life and the language you use, you would correct them too.
                     
                     I am not telling anyone how to believe or that they have to believe like me, but I am and will tell them when they accuse my people and me falsely.
                     
                     Now run along and let people have power over you and tempt you

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                        Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                        Run along?  How cruel!  Telling a creature with no legs to run along.  And from the thread I started too!  I am depressed!
                        
                        
                        The steed you are riding appears tall!

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                           Druid Dudeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                           Don't worry lil snake man. Druids likes snakeses. Symbolic of a Secret path they is. People should look for more snakes. Where there is one snake, there are usually more. Go ask Adam.

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                              Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                              Don't bring the size of my snake into this discussion please!  I though it wasn't supposed to make a difference anyway!

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                           Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                           Randy
                           
                           God took away the snake's arms and legs and to force him to travel on his belly, for the rest of his life.
                           
                           It could have been worst.
                           God could have turned someone into a jelly fish take away their brain and back bone and force him to live immortal for 650 million years.
                           
                           Kind of reminds of some

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                              Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                              I think it was actually Mrs. God's idea! In ancient times the newly captured prisoners were often turned over to the females for torture.  They were much crueler than the men in some cases.
                              
                              
                              An how do you know the jellyfish isn't content with his long life?

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                                 Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                 The bible has disrespect for the jellyfish too

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                                    Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                    I would wager the feeling is mutual!

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                  Twenty One Daysposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Дочери слонов!

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                     Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     ____________
                     ha-James

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   luabuposted 14 years ago

   I love how people pretend to be fluent in Hebrew and don't know the least thing about it.
   Have Mercy
   
   what the hells going on in this literary revelation?
   
   Who's turn is it to fill the coal bucket now !

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      Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      ________________________
      Who are you?
      
      Why?

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         luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Who? Thomas Mc Donald
         
         Why? If your remark was a chinese meal it would be sweet and sour. It has love,pride,ridicule and mercy all in the one dish
         Which one are you?

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            Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            _______________
            Every post you've made is ridicule.
            
            I, like everyone, am many people in one.
            
            Your problem with that?

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               luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               not really deborah/reads a little scary/hell's a scary place
               do you know where you are
               the thread is called who tempted satan
               the clue is in the title
               it's like which came first the chicken or the egg
               it's not a serious conversation especially when people don't listen to each other
               let me guess /no one told you to come casual
               Oops!

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                  Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  __________
                  I was replying to something someone else said, if it is ok with you.
                  I haven't seen you on topic
                  Mind what YOU are doing
                  Goodbye

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9. 0

   luabuposted 14 years ago

   anyone for a bowl of irish stew
   jesus,i'm sweating here
   is it safe to come out yet

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10. 66

    Mishaposted 14 years ago

    To answer the original question - Randy did

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Yours is the closest answer yet, Misha!

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    paarsurreyposted 14 years ago

    Satan or Devil was never a good person; it is an evil conceptual being who disobeys the Creator-God and alway incites man to do bad things.

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       Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       that's nice

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          paarsurreyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Thanks for your appreciation.

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             Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             You are so serious

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                Druid Dudeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                Perception is everything. Consider the possibility here that no one of the satan supporters understands the outside the box possibility that Satan merely plays bad cop to Jesus's good cop. Both are actually working to the same end. Jesus fishes from one end, while Satan works the net at the other end. Then one might have to consider what is meant by me when I say "fishes" and what I might mean by the word "net". www

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                1. 76

                   Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                   God must of had a hell of a sense of humor, when he made Satan

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12. 85

    insearchof truthposted 14 years ago

    It was me.  I did it.  I tempted Satan..... LOL

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Keep searching!

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    luabuposted 14 years ago

    An eerie silence has descended on the cavernous depths of the bottomless pit this morning.
    In truth it is more like a cesspit of ambiguity than a raging inferno.
    Dante would get pneumonia here /there's a draught coming from somewhere
    It wouldn't be a voyage downwards without a quacking duck to lead which brings me to my next undertaking
    Breakfast

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14. 0

    luabuposted 14 years ago

    Today i'm doing a very special dish  Bunny Boiler Hotpot
    i cannot overempathise how important it is not to try this at home
    it takes years of studing the law of old cook books to make this exactly right and it is not for mere mortals
    
    
    just listen to me talking ok
    
    its made with a rabbit and the exact/carefully guarded /exact amount of schiophrenia /an ancient plant /usually found in dried form in quack shops
    
    speaking of quacks/i did did'nt i/ im going to use the quacking duck and some harry potter mandrake
    
    its a kind of modern version of the origional
    
    ready in 26 mins and 42 seconds
    
    but then again how are you supposed to know that

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       luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       this looks done
       want some /it's an aquired taste you know
       not for everyone this stuff

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15. 51

    paarsurreyposted 14 years ago

    Satan or Devil was never a good person; it is an evil conceptual being who disobeys the Creator-God and alway incites man to do bad things.Nobody tempted Satan; it is his nature.

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       Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       God turned Satan into belly crawling taking snake, Then to a  flying red dragon then beyond to man with two horns, and a tail. Satan is loved by God beast into alway something better. Once we all pray for Satan, he can turn into a handsome prince. Then we can see the light, darkness becomes the light. Save Satan.

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    luabuposted 14 years ago

    Satan was framed, and I know who did it.

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       Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       who?

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          luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          castlepaloma
          thanks for turning your attention to me
          i'm a bit like randy/waiting for the endgame
          why not try some of my hotpot

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             Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             I think it was the Romans.

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17. 74

    arbposted 14 years ago

    It is interesting that many begin with the presupposition that God does or does not exist, therefore, not surprising that conclusions always seem to support the original premise. Philosophically speaking, we are created with the potential to do good or to not do good. Creating potential does not create the consequence of potential.
    It isn't that God created evil, it is that God created good as well as the potential to (not do good) and that is refered to as evil. The opposite of good is not evil, the opposite of good is "non good" and we refer to it as evil. The creation of free will inherently, pre supposes that opposites exist and that we are therefore created with the "potential" to exercise good or to not exercise good. To not exercise good is to exercise the opposite. If opposites exist (mandatory for free will to exist) then Satan existed with the potential to choose good or to not choose good. Eliminate free will and concurently you eliminate temptation, therefore, temptation is simply part and parcel of free will. It isn't a thing created, it is the natural residue of a thing created. Evil does not exist in the perpetual exercise of good. It can only exist in the absence of good. What does exist is the free will potential to choose (not to do good). Evil does not exist apart from the free exercise of man to choose it. It is born of man for only man has the capacity to choose non good.   
    If good was created and free will was extended then inherent in that creation is the (potential) to not do good (evil). The creation of one and the choice (to do or not to do) is not the creation of the other. The existance of evil is born in the refusal to do good. God does not refuse to do good, therefore does not create evil.
    
    By the way, The opposite of God (logic 101) is "Non God" To not believe in God is to believe in Non God. The object of our faith is then God or Non God. Ironicaly, we all live by faith, it is only the object of our faith that seperates us.We have more in common than we think! Perhaps a good reason to promote a mutual respect in these discusions

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       Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       _________________________
       In Hebrew, the word translated as "good" is tov and should have been translated "functional". The word translated as "evil" is "ra" which means dysfunctional.
       
       So you aren't far off, things were functional but had the ability to become dysfunctional. The price that comes with free will.

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18. 61

    Freelance5posted 14 years ago

    I've grown up in a Christian home all my life and I think the best answer is that we don't know. Truly, we can only speak from which comes from the word of God.

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Your first sentence reveals how you came to the biased opinion in the second.

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       Beelzedadposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Sorry to hear that. Religious indoctrination certainly does influence ones worldview and limits their ability to synthesize information not inherently encapsulated within the indoctrination.

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       luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       now we're talking
       i love the innocence of this statement but agree with randy that it is a total cop out
       if i could find a book to live by literally i would
       if you were living from the good within you without words i could go with it
       the general tone of this hub has improved
       talking and listening keep it going
       castlepaloma /the romans is a long shot/how many guesses is that

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19. 74

    arbposted 14 years ago

    Every opinion is biased otherwise it would not be (opinion). The question isn't whether I am biased but whether my bias cause the conclusion or did the conclusion cause the bias? To merely state that my opinion is biased neither supports or rejects the hypothesis and it seems to me, nullifies the intent of your original post (to seek opinion). To seek opinion is to engaged the biases which accompany those opinions, originating with your opinion and your original bias. We can all presume that each post is biased, but what validates the bias is the question of interest, is it not?

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       luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       arb /you attempt to make sense which is commendable
       why assume bias in a question/just answer the question/who tempted Satan
       if you have bias to bring to the quetion then thats a problem for you to deal with/i take your point that we all have bias/we are here to learn and improve/all of us
       its unlikely but possible that the question is unbiased
       i like what arb and deborah are looking at/making me think
       no cooking at the bottom of the pit today
       i love belzee's dad god bless him
       he shouldn't be let out by himself
       thomas

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20. 67

    ceciliabeltranposted 14 years ago

    *shakes head* Somebody give this woman some recognition please, she reads Hebrew hurray!

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21. 74

    arbposted 14 years ago

    I did not presume bias from the question, but from Randy's comments following the question. I could also presume bias in his challenge to all believers to answer the question and the reccomendation that we preface the attempt with prayer. As for answering the question,( I did ) in the origional post. It was met with the observation that I was bias. I have agreed and simply pointed out that all opinion is biased.

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       luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       i like u arb/ u attempt to communicate to others
       i can't find your first post where randy responded /can you go into the vault and kick it back up please
       that hebrew row upstairs is doing my head in
       is it a sophisticated form of spam
       i watched a programme where the gulf stream stopped moving and the sea became clogged with algae
       maybe its just a good old fashioned healthy cat fight
       go up and take a look
       and pray first
       thomas

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Sure, we all have biases which may reflect on our own particular viewpoints.  My challenge, as you presume it to be, is to use either one's preferred biblical scriptures, ancient texts of other religions, or any other means you may be able to offer to support your opinion of the answer to my question.
       
       Naturally, those indoctrinated into a particular religion or cult will be biased more than those of an open mind to all of the other possible answers. 
       
       Despite your assumption, I did not recommend prayer for those who are believers, only that divine guidance may be necessary for some to reach an acceptable (in their minds) answer.

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          Druid Dudeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Satan was tempted by all those who refused what God is saying. But, again, the evidence is there that his real purpose has been hidden from us. Good cop, Bad cop. Both are out to get you, and taking opposite tactics to acheive that end. They both want to get you, and put you in the same situation. Two roads which lead to Rome. Resistance is futile. You will be Assimilated!

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             Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             Evidence? Did god dunnit then?

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                Druid Dudeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                There you go again. So obsessed w/ God. You're going to make people wonder about you. Academically,  you must have been a real jewel to your teachers back in school.  You don't hang around china shoppes do you? Must get pretty expensive. Have you discussed this fixation you have with ethereal beings with your analyst? It really stops the honest exchange of ideas when you let your ignorance rear it's ugly head. Sometimes it is much better to hold your tongue and have just a wee bit o' open mindedness. Otherwise, people are liable to think you might be one of them that Sky Fairy worshippers you seem to disdain.

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                   Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                   Yeah - it was all me. You never sed it

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                      Druid Dudeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                      Mark...spelling man. That's SAID, not sed. Semi literate WB

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                         Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                         Deary me. Sorry you do not understand the point I am making. God seddit just works ya no?
                         
                         If'n we sez god then it is sed.

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             yolanda yvetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Who  are  all  those who refused what God is saying that  tempted  Satan?  I just got  thru  reading  the  bible  and  the  bible said  in  Matthew 4:1-3 that Satan is  the Tempter.

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                Woman Of Courageposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                Exactly

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             luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             druid man
             this is very profound but bonkers sorry
             i like the bit
             satan was tempted by people
             the idea of a preordained cosmos leading to an inevitable end
             are you a fatalist/a literalist/or what
             it all seems like smoke and mirrors to me
             you commend pennyofheaven on a statement which stressed basic human abilities of being good and bad
             whats the story
             are you off your trolley or not

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    yolanda yvetteposted 14 years ago

    Good ouestions  my friend. The  answer  to  those questions  is  as  you  can  see  in  the  world  today  evil is  present.  Evil  has  been in  existence  since  the fall  of  mankind  before  the  the  fall evil was  not  present on earth  until  man  disobeyed God and  ate  or the  forbidden tree  that  God told them  not  to  eat of , but adam  and  eve  made  the choice to  disobey  God and because of  that sin  was  passed  down on all mankind. Satan had lied  to  Eve  and  said they would be just  like  gods knowing good  and evil.  Before  they ate of  the  fruit  they  had  no  knowledge  of evil.

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       So what is your answer?  Did God create evil or not?

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          Druid Dudeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Thought I covered that. Let's review. Man conceived of evil. Which does not speak to the reality of the concept. Since evil was part of that quantum leap that happened in the proverbial garden, then evil was the negative to the positive. -knowledge vs +positive knowledge. It is also very clearly written. "God is the author of all things, good or evil. All inspiration comes from God." Get it? Got it? Good!

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             Beelzedadposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             And, religion was born.

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             Woman Of Courageposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             Druid, Yes, you have previously covered that. Some delight in repeating the same exact question for fun and mockery. It's a game to keep the thread going.

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                Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                Ah WOC!  Still, the non-judgmental follower of JC gives her totally unbiased opinion.  LOL!

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          yolanda yvetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          I  answered that question my friend.

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             Druid Dudeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             not trying to steal your thunder. Been bantering with these guys awhile. They're hard cases. Read words that aren't there, make baseless comments and statements. Firing arrows from a leaf floating on quicksand.

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                Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                I'm sorry you feel that way Dude!  I honestly fail to understand how a god can create everything but not evil.  If he did not create evil he did not create everything.  But perhaps you understand this answer and would care to clarify.

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                yolanda yvetteposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                You're so right.

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                   Woman Of Courageposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                   Druid, Agreed

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                Beelzedadposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                Yes, it must be terribly difficult to understand reality when fantasy rules your world.

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                   Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                   ___________
                   Don't you think I look lovely today?

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                      Beelzedadposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                      Hmmm... did you change your hairstyle? I can't quite put my finger on it, but I'm sure it'll come to me.

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                         Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                         _________
                         LOL, no it's not my hair. But do you like my new look?

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                            Beelzedadposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                            Of course, how silly of me not to have noticed. You changed the color of your lipstick.
                            
                            Looks great!

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                               Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                               It looks like, you can change your color anytime you want

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             Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             "God created everything, but He did not create evil."
             
             
             I still fail to understand your logic!

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                Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                That is becoz u don't have faith. This seeming contradiction of god creating everything - except one thing- goes away with faith.

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                Druid Dudeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                What part of AUTHOR do all you AUTHORS fail to grasp. I can't believe that you can't seem to read what is written. It's in the flippin' book. Instead of pretending to have read it, why don't guys just break down and read it. Then you may understand how many simply stupid questions you ask, and how many truly assinine statements y'all make. Total waste of good knowledge.

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                   Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                   I quoted Yolanda's response in my post!  I was addressing her statement concerning god creating everything but not evil.
                   
                   Now, unless you and Yolanda are the same poster, you are confusing things by answering for other posters when I respond to them.  Please point out to me where Yolanda used the word "AUTHORS" to explain her response. 
                   
                   I saw no reference to which FLIPPIN book you are referring to!

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                      Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                      Who created the name and concept of Satan?
                      
                      The concept of an evil force in the universe separate from God is foreign to the Jewish religion. It is clearly expressed in the Torah as well as in First Samuel that there is only God, He does good as well bad acts. So where did the concept and the name Satan first appear and in what books?
                      
                      This is how it came about:
                      
                      Piso saw himself as a new lawgiver and philosopher after all he thought he was the greatest writer in the world. He just created the beginnings of his new religion, Christianity, which he hoped to would give new moral laws to the Roman Empire.  Satan motivate fear stronger than love in power over the people. Satan Roman concept motivate fear stronger than love, in power over the people
                      
                      God would want us to choose love, other prefer hate, Satan needs to be loved to death as love concurs all.I say power to the people and God and save Satan. People want to hate snakes, troll, rats, bats and stump on any bug. I think everyone and everything is beautiful in its own way. Satan is part of nature, the Universe is part of nature, so love all, or separate things and hate creature and things for the rest of your life
                      
                      See randy the snake is not so bad; he and all of us are beautiful in our own way.

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                         Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                         You are much closer to the truth than most!

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                   Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                   Druid Dude
                   
                   I’d be careful about the word stupid, the only people I may consider as stupid, are the ones who don't ask enough questions. Out of the 1000s of other good books these people could be asking question about, they have considered yours.
                   
                   Beside’s there are 2000 disagreeable version of the Bible anyway. Funny how many people major in minor things?

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                      Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                      And there will undoubtedly be many more with adherents just as convinced in their veracity as those we have now. Too bad they all can't agree on which book is correct.

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                      Druid Dudeposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                      My book? Which book are you referring to? Are you mistaking me for other than someone who has not been confined to one discipline, one philosophy, one way of looking at things? I follow no book. No longer holds sway for me, one way or the other. Not Christian either, but people can, and are stupid. Not those who continue to seek, but those who believe what passes for them as a philosophy, when all it is, is the same old crap wrapped up with a different bow, trying to pass itself off as somehow Blessed with Secular Wisdom. They make me puke!

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                         Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                         Er..weren't you the one telling me to read the FLIPPIN book?

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                         Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                         Druid Dude
                         
                         Do you have any degrees in Philosophy and do you know what the first rule in Philosophy is?

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                            Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                            I doubt it seriously!  He seems to want to answer questions asked to others but ignores those asked of him!

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                               luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                               randy
                               frankly i'm disappointed
                               i go out for a few pints for the christmas party at work
                               i come home and hell is in a right mess
                               i've heard of kissing a frog and making a prince
                               but kissing deborah and making a frog
                               i'm going to have to take the pledge as we say in ireland
                               i'm quite inebriated but i think the druid guy is off his trolley
                               just tell him the truth
                               your off your trolley
                               i love beelze's dad /god help him /he's harmless
                               he still thinks logic will get him home
                               all in all  you made a pigs ear of minding hell while i was out on the raz
                               i'll try to pick up the pieces tommorrow
                               deborah if i kiss you will you turn back into the lassie who was talking sense to arb 11 hrs ago
                               what happened to arb /he was food for thought
                               the question is   who tempted satan
                               satan was framed and i absolutely know who did it
                               sweet dreams hubbers/randy what are ya like/i told you not to feed the fish

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                                  Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                  Sorry the place is in such a mess, luabu.  Noah himself had a full time job cleaning up dinosaur poo on the ark, so I don't feel too bad about about the small amount of gum on my shoe!

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    fettyposted 14 years ago

    Satan was envious of God. He felt God was keeping the good stuff for Himself,alone. Satan believed he was as good as God and tried to bring other subjects to his way of thinking up in heaven. Some religions believe he was God's son. There are supposed to be books hidden in the Vatican on this very subject.

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Thank you! And your answer to the original question is?

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24. 66

    fettyposted 14 years ago

    God gives all of his creations "free will". Satan, the fallen angel chose to be jealous of God and worked at bringing others to his side. He was thrown out of heaven along with his other followers. GOD CREATED this angel but this angel came up with his OWN Thoughts. This is not new and of course has to be believed with faith because ultimately, man was not present to witness this event.

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       The bible says Satan was created perfect.  Perfection implies he was immune to temptation, no?

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          Castlepalomaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          nahh
          
          They are always contradicting each other, God and Satan

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    luabuposted 14 years ago

    hubber with a hangover
    we've had 25 pages to warm up here
    lets stop jogging on the spot and show people what we've got
    
    who tempted Satan
    
    it's a great question
    castlepaloma said satan is a conceptul being
    i think i agrre with him on that
    pennyof heaven said /accentuate bad it gets badder /accentuate good it gets gooder
    last night we made a daisy chain on the dance floor
    everyone loved it/great for bonding/team moral /all good
    
    why not pick something some one else said on this subject and put it in the chain
    i'll start
    which of thes two?
    castlepaloma ----satan is a conceptual being
    don't agree or disagree with this
    juat add to the chain with someone elses opinion
    thanks/
    
    
    castlepaloma ----satan is a conceptual being

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    arbposted 14 years ago

    Hey Randy, been away but wanted to respond to a couple of comments.
    1)In your original post "Now is the time for all you enlightened believers to show you know what you are talking about! You might have to pray about this one!" The comment seems to support my assertation that my assumption was correct-not incorrect. I have no problem with the statement, only the observation that it too revealed a bias! As previously stated, I have no problem with biases, but, foreknowledge of bias does illuminate the context of our opinion.
    2)perfection implies immunity from temptation? Inherent in the statement "Satan was created perfect" does not imply immunity from future imperfection. You assume that because something is created perfect it must stay perfect. This discounts the possibility of free will, which inherently houses the possibility of choosing to act imperfectly.
    3)Your invitation to use ones prefered biblical scripture seems an exercise in futility if you have already dismissed it as an unreliable source of evidence. If you don't believe in its authenticity then my reference to any part of it is dismissed prior to my reference! That is as it should be given that it is not an agreed upon source of evidence. I am left, therefore to argue from a purely philosophical point of view.
    4)This brings us back to the original question! Who tempted satan? The question begs the assumption that satan was tempted by someone and that premise remains unestablished. There is no evidence that satan was tempted by anyone other than himself. I believe your assumption that he must have been tempted by someone else is dirivitive of your privious assumption that "perfection implies perpetual immunity from imperfection".
    It does not imply such conclusion. As far as both good and evil being created, I think this too is based in an invalid assumption. Because it exist does not imply that it was created by God. If He created good and we choose to not do good, then we ourselves give birth to evil. We possess the ability to not murder, but if I choose to murder, the act was not created by God. It was created in my refusal to act as God created me to act, thus I, myself am capable of creating out of what God has created.
    5)In conclusion. I am not an expert in biblical translation or authenticity anymore than I am an expert in astro physics. I am, therefore left with the remedy of reading the works of those who are and consequently can only rely to some degree upon thier expertise. Having said that, my understanding of scripture (some 38 years) is the by product of scholars who have answered my questions adequately over the course of my years and have done so with greater clarity and precision than alternative theorist. My point being, is that the knowledge I lack far exceeds the knowledge I possess. I must conclude in light of this reality, that because we fail the answer, does not mean that it does not exist, it sometimes means we do not yet see it and if we do not see it, perhaps another does. That reality commands we respect the attempts to answer such questions. Perhaps someone has answered the question and we just can't (as yet) see it. I am encouraged by so many who have taken the time to think and the courage to post where everyone can see. Thanks for the stimulation.

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       luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       arb - someone who engages in arbitrage (who purchases securities in one market for immediate resale in another in the hope of profiting from the price differential)
       
       i work in this area
       arbs are universally despised in bookmaking
       i like arbs /they are very important
       
       they keep people attentive and vigilant
       every hub should have an arb
       your thoughts are a challenge to all
       I'll break it down if you want or maybe let randy do it?

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Your thoughts on the question are welcome, whether i agree with them or not.  But we seems to disagree with the meaning of the word "perfection."
       
       I take the words meaning as "without flaws" or, lacking the ability to be wrong.  Unless you are suggesting perfection is not truly descriptive of the act of being perfect, this only creates more confusion.
       
       No problem with you using the bible to support its own statements.  It is the only thing supporting its own veracity.
       
       
       Whether I believe it is true or not plays no part in the question for this thread.

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          arbposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Randy! I don't think we disagree with the meaning of the word perfection, however, I do think we disagree with how the word is used in your premise. If I purchase something that is originally perfect (without flaw) why would I assumne that it would remain perfect? If it does not have the capability of becomming imperfect how could I define it as perfect to begin with. Perfection only exist because imperfection exist. The definition of Cold only exist because hot exist. We can not define cold apart from its relative proximity to hot.  Satan may have been created perfect, but only if imperfection co existed. If imperfection co existed then the possibility of choosing imperfection was his without any third party intervention. A new born child may be without moral flaw, but, given time and his own device he most assuredly will morally transgress.

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             Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             But your god was the one who said Satan was perfect!  Not my words, simply the words written in your book.  You can say god doesn't really mean what he says if you like, but then, this causes even more confusion if the rest of god's words may be taken with a grain of salt, or that we are not to take his words literally.  You cannot have it both ways!
             
             Comparing a child with an angel does not work.  Satan was not a child, and neither was god.

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                arbposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                I never refuted that God made such a comment. Whether He did or not ,isn't the question. Satan being created perfect has no bearing on whether He then had access to imperfection. Can not have access to one without the other.  Why would I say God doesn't mean what He says. Your assumption is (Satan was created perfect, therefore he could not fall from that state) an invalid premise. Again, though created perfect, he was not imprisoned by  perfection. Had he been imprisoned by perfection his state of perfection would cease to be perfect. He had both the freedom and the right to choose otherwise and to then reap the consequences of that choice. All things created are at first flawless-they are not created flawless into perpetuity. Nothing created remains the same. They decay, they age, they change from perfection to imperfection.

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                   seanorjohnposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                   read " the day I swore on the bible" just for a laugh.

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                   Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                   Okay, then it therefore means temptation came from god. Without temptation, Satan retains perfection.  God created good, there is no good unless there is bad to compare it to.  Without bad, there is no temptation to do bad for the perfect angel to succumb to.
                   
                   
                   God knows everything.  He knew the evil he created would influence his perfect creation.  If you do not accept that god knows everything, then you must admit he may be wrong about lots of things. 
                   
                   If perfection is so easily destroyed, then there is no such thing as Satan being perfect.  Perfection means perfect everything, and this includes an ideal defense against evil. Unless of course, evil is stronger than the perfect angels god created.

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    yolanda yvetteposted 14 years ago

    Who tempted satan? 
    
    Nobody

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Any evidence to support your claim?  Use the book you get your info from and point to scripture which backs your opinion up, if you don't mind.

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28. 0

    luabuposted 14 years ago

    randy and arb
    a truly epic tussle
    if this was a words/logic debate the victor would be arb
    in reality randy is the winner
    he has a very intelligent well read person talking about nonsense
    if randy intentionally did this then he is very very wise
    if it happened lets say arbitarily then the process is revealing
    perfection meets imperfection and by contact is blemished
    
    castlepaloma said
    
    satan is a conceptual being
    
    add to the line and stop fighting like the two hebrew women earlier/god i miss their wailing /lads and lassies add to the line or get off the floor

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Even nonsense may be debated.  This has been done for thousands of years, as a matter of fact.  This thread is a perfect example. LOL!

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          luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          hi randy
          we're losing customers/soon hell will be empty
          
          i want you to crawl out from under your rock and add to the line
          pick some sense from the nonsense /what did  a person say that impressed you.
          lets make a sense snake
          this makes sense to me
          
          Castlepaloma said ...Satan is a conceptual being

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             Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             At the very least!

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                luabuposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                is this the engame
                satan wasn't tempted
                he was framed
                framed in the minds of the people who made hell
                they needed someone to mind the house
                
                i've been digging in this hub for more than a week and the few precious stones that i coulde find
                
                were
                
                pennyofheaven-good gets better and evil becomes worse depending on which part we emphasise
                
                and castlepaloma said
                
                satan is a conceptual being
                
                maybe its time to make a new hub around the hub of who made hell
                let's get in there for real
                thank you it's been swell

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29. 0

    luabuposted 14 years ago

    Randy /i think our work is done here
    Hell is now a safe place and Satan is a free man
    Apologies have been sent to the families of the 55,000 innocent defenseless women who were wrongly  burned and tortured as witches.
    The Spanish Inquisition has issued a formal apology and all that remains is for all the gobshites on the hub religion sites to stop taking tripe.
    If their nonsense was harmless I would let it be.
    It is a call to hatred by people who should know better.
    Give me a call on your next expedition.
    Q.E.D.

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       Randy Godwinposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Sorry you have given up, Luabu!  I do not think this has been totally decided yet!  Just a little bit longer.

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30. 61

    OpinionDuckposted 14 years ago

    I thought that it was Santa Claus that knew who was naughty and who was nice.
    
    We have people that dress up to look like Santa.
    
    We don't have people that dress up and look like Jesus and the Apostles.
    
    
    It could be done, especially at Christmas Time.
    
    We cam evem have people to dress like Satan or an Angel,
    
    But how would anyone be able to dress up as God?
    Maybe he is there but we can't see him, along with all the other things that we can't see.

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31. 71

    puregraceposted 14 years ago

    If God is the Creator of all things, then He gets to plan what He wants everything He creates to do. He must have created angels, and ordered that some would rebel against Him.
    We don't have the answers to all the "whys" but we sure do have a lot right there in the Bible. And what's more, He uses His Spirit to help us understand more and more of it.
    Then we come to find out that He "ordained" it all for His glory, and to show all the aspects of His being:
    "God is a spirit, infinite, eternal and unchanging in His being, wisdom, power, holiness, justice, goodness, faithfulness, mercy, and truth."

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32. 0

    just_curiousposted 14 years ago

    Maybe the introduction of man into the world was his temptation, but who knows the nature of the angels. Good question.

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    Daewalkerposted 14 years ago

    All angels have free moral agency or freedom of choice and this
    is necessary for one to develop godly character, the ability
    to distinguish between right and wrong and to always choose the
    right against self temptation and all other influences. Contrary
    to what some believe angels are not robots or automatons. God
    creates time and circumstance and He did this for the angels so
    they could learn,grow and develop holy righteous character. No
    one tempted Lucifer his intellectual vanity seized him and he
    made himself and enemy of God because he wanted to be God. Before mankind was ever created there was a great war in heaven, God's realm and apparently 1/3 of the angels sided with Lucifer and fought against there very maker, God. Those angels lost and were cast to earth and no longer have access to God. The rebellion of the angels cased sin to enter into this world and the character of those rebellious angels permanently changed and they became demons. It is the character of the fallen angels that changed not their appearance as many assume. They actually look the same as when they were created but they can change their appearance when they make themselves visible
    to humans so different people see different forms of the same
    thing! The self is at the root cause of Lucifer's fall!

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34. 57

    Dee Stoneposted 10 years ago

    hey randy, sorry it took me 4 yrs or however long to come across this hope ur still around or found sum insight to ur search for the truth, i tried to speed read thru everything and a lot of the responses jus seem word for word, taken directly from texts that we truly cannot confirm , have been distorted over the centuries, or people jus dodging the question entirely per lack of understanding or deeper awareness, im gonna go wit the limited knowledge, understanding, enlightenments, brain capacity n personal experience in seeking da truth and dis jus kinda dawned on me spur of the moment cuz i nvr really pondered too much about it, i cant speak for everybody but as humans we jus tend to tk in wut were force fed n influenced by and to accept or grasp the concepts that are easier to swallow or sumwut rationalize....doing my best from the most possible logical standpoint if we were created in the image of god, n the greatest commandment was originally to luv god with all our mind body n soul, or however it goes, u gt the idea, from this we can reason why god is noted as a sumwut jealous god, bare wit me im  trying nt to leave anything out...we all kno exactly how dat feels to long for someones attention, to desire, kno or be as close to someone each n every way possible we frown upon rejection but at the same time we want people to accept us or like us without having to force it upon someone otherwise its nt real or genuine love, care, or affection hence free will...im gettin there i think...alright angels were nt created to have free will idk where everyones gettin dat idea from, they were heavenly beings created for the sole purpose of glorifying or doing gods appointed will, most notably satan or wutever his real name is could be bob who knows...yes supposedly created perfect maybe too perfect, a perfectionist if u will we all kno the type all too well...one of his most important purposes or tasks as head was supervision over da garden...paradise pretty much it had everything any dude could ever ask for, gold, jewels, neverending free food n water, even a hot chick, adam n eve livin it up havin a good ol time, keep in mind dat they had a childlike innocence until sumhow sumway, dat innocence was lost, someone or something opened dat part of their brain or consciousness via the "tree/fruit" n made them feel guilty about the lil pleasures in life that they were created to express n enjoy who doesnt secretly like feelin free n walkin around nude every chance they get kids babies do it all the time, they luv it simple joy no shame...several factors at play here, god saw man was alone, woman created, boom instant happiness n infinite possibilities, immortality, man gets caught up in da blissful moment nothing can go wrong, wrong...this causes a lil tension n again jealousy cuz man is no longer focused on god and completely oblivious to his surroundings happens all da time wen we fall hard or luv sik, all we wanna do is spend time wit dat one person n no one else, ignoring or slacking on all other responsibilities n everyone else including god himself, taken everything dats been given to us for granted pretty much and its only wen we dont kno wut we gt or how good we gt it til its truly gone sad but tru, in da meantime satans jus bustin his azz havin to put in all work no play, n this perfect being knows he was created way more advanced in every which way yet hes pretty much stuk in paradise as a third wheel as wut he most likely feels as a slave to a couple primitive minds, thus satan taking it upon himself to be equal or higher than god, thought he knew gods intentions n since man was supposedly made in gods image hes thinkin wut a bunch of dodo birds running around naked in da woods, its gotta be a joke or mistake, how could he possibly be proud of his creation and favored more than heavenly beings dedicated to serve, satan ridicules n mocks gods taste or choice n pondering all the ways mankind should have been created or be improved, meanwhile satan desires to experience the same free will, (y sum people live vicariously thru others) wuts da purpose if theyre jus taking it all for granted and not acknowledging their creator or truly being appreciative, satan created as a perfectionist to  kno good n evil emotions or intentions, right from wrong...saw this as an insult to his intelligience and prolly thought he deserved better treatment being the highest in command, this was his appointed territory and wanted to control the situation, all the negative emotions we can possibly think of surfaced...mankind made him look weak and irresponsible, and to a certain extent it wasnt his fault they had free will to do wutever they pleased, without satans consent or approval, while he got fustrated cleaning up the mess and taking the heat, almost like a pet, man was considered disgraceful, clumsy creatures that needed sum type of order or correction, their life was meaningless without purpose, and this was his opportunity or moment to practice the power, discipline, influence, knowledge he was rightfully given at dat moment seeing it as no wrong himself with it being his duty and an extension of god himself he considered it easily justifiable and with due cause, he was surely covinced he had authority over sum of the angels to enforce law either out of fear, or to find a way to manipulate free will with persuasion or coercion, material possessions, etc...man was easily reprogrammed to do wutever, for sum fallen angels im sure it was addictive, quite the entertainment and they felt empowered, however nonetheless it was still indirect disobedience, no such command was given from god and henceforth rebellion whether intentional or unintentional, theres forces of corruption at work beyond our understanding, mother nature/weather is a prime example but it is during these most volatile destructive moments where weakness or imperfection becomes perfect, diamonds n gold the most valued materials on earth created from utter chaos, this is the true power of god and his existence, that nothing is impossible, u can turn absolutely nothing into something, darkness and light can essentially balance each other out, and anything negative can have a completely positive outcome if one truly believes, focuses, and works the odds in their favor, this is the same power that has been freely given to us as we still are created in gods image, we have the inert ability to defy laws of physics and gravity but it has been suppressed as a result of our corruption, lack of faith, separation from god, inability to use our brain at full capacity due to our defective dna...our talents and gifts, our ability to create n destroy, adapt, overcome, the human spirit that nvr seems to die or fade, life still goes on...all these things in all actuality set us above a higher standard n even earned us positions as kings in heaven and having authority to govern over and command angels to guide and protect mere mortals, im strongly convinced this notion did not sit well at all with the fallen ones, naturally refused to be submissive and will most likely spend the rest of eternity utterly bewildered in disbelief and ultimately it has been a desperate attempt to modify our own behavior, thinking patterns for self destruction in order to comprehend why god would still favor such an underdog jus like people tend to root for in todays society in the likeness of god...the least truly are considered the greatest, higher in value, substance n self worth, tried n true quality at its rawest form, no pain no gain...sorry gt a lil carried away but this is my honest n most humble opinion, to each their own best wishes on everyones life journey for we all play an important role of sumn greater beyond ourselves and wut we can currently sense, interpret, or process and it def goes wayy beyond any known history, math, science, religion, political viewpoint, philosophy, dream or man made idea period...

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       Kathryn L Hillposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       interesting.
       ...in conclusion satan had a big little ego.

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