Atheism vs. God

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   Over The Hillposted 13 years ago

   It`s sad to see so many apparently intellegent people who do not believe in God. With all order maintained in the universe for thousands of years , they say it`s the natural progression of things.
     What rediculous logic.Even our earth order displays and proves a God.

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      Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      There is order in the Universe ?
      
      It's also been around a few more years than a Thousand... Plus it seems it is to be working pretty much as expected for something born of an enormous explosion.... EG expanding outwards in every direction from the centre...!
      
      And I'm fairly sure that physicists have proved that there is no need to have God in any equation when describing the creation of the universe.   
      
      
      PS It`s also sad to see so many apparently intellegent people who do believe in God !!

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         Over The Hillposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Yes Merlin, there is order in the universe.
         How do you explain the cosmos making a 360 degree radius in one year and come back in the exact place after traveling billions of miles? Doesn`t happen out of mere chance year after year.
            Without some influence, the planets would sling out into infinity by the rotating force. Very simple deduction.

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            Pcunixposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Orbital motion has been quite well understand for some time now.. No gods required.

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            wildernessposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Presumably you are speaking of the orbit of the earth around the sun.
            
            The radius of that orbit is about 93 million miles, not 360 degrees.  The circumference (distance traveled) is about 300 million miles, not billions.  It happens because of the influence of gravity - a well known phenomenon.  Without gravity the planets would "sling out into infinity" due to linear, straight line motion (conservation of momentum) not some imagined rotating force.  Nor does the earth come back to the "exact place" each year - the orbital motion of the entire solar system around the galactic center prevents this, as does the motion of the galaxy as a whole.
            
            It is sad to see so many apparently intelligent people that use a belief in God as an excuse for almost total ignorance of otherwise commonly accepted knowledge.

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               just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Wow. That's truly amazing. I'd never heard that before. Kind of blows any chaos theory out of the water.

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            Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Sorry to be the bearer of Bad News, it may be a simple deduction for you to see the hand of devine intervension however I think you will find that that organising force is Gravity !

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      Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      They would rather believe in little green men or some man in the moon...

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      Shay Kochbaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      I think reasonable minds can differ . . . and I can't imagine that G-d would be upset with someone who came to the reasoned conclusion that they are not able to believe in a deity so long as they lived a good life.

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      Jeff Berndtposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      "What rediculous logic."
      
      Faith has little, if anything, to do with logic. I don't believe in God because it makes logical sense to do so. I believe in God because I believe in God. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am. I have no evidence to support my belief in God. That's why it's called faith.

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         Druid Dudeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         So where in that scenario does a Nazirite Gnostic fall? Unfamiliar with that term? You'll have to google them separately.

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         Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         However I find there is a logic to your honesty which is indeed refreshing around here !

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      getitriteposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      
      
      You obviously are completely unaware of reality. It apparently requires LESS intelligence to believe in God than to not believe in God.
      
      BTW, your reasoning is subjective nonsense.

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      paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      The Atheists don't have a system for their life; so they don't see any system in the Universe; their view point is a reflection of their chaotic and confused self.

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         Jeff Berndtposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         "The Atheists don't have a system for their life"
         
         You use the phrase "The Atheists" as if they're a cohesive group. They're not, any more than "The Christians" or "The Muslims" are.
         
         Many Atheists do have a system for their life. The use many different schools of philosophy and ethics to figure out their systems.
         
         Atheist does not mean nihilist.

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         Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Since when were Atheists a group ?  Are there meetings they attend ?  An Atheist Newspaper, Magazine or are they super modern and have a Web Site ?
         
           What do they discuss ?  Let me see,  Here's the proposed Agenda for an Atheist discussion group.
         
           Chair: Item 1.  Why are we Here ?  Any suggestions from the floor ?
         
           "To discuss if there is a God."
         
           Chair : "No!  Any more questions......?"  I declare the meeting closed.
         
           Can't see it catching on... Can You ?

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            paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            That is why I say the Atheists have no system of life; they neither get support from the science nor the religion; they are simply confused and bewildered, in my opinion.

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               Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               So sad that you have no respect for others who do not believe as you do.
               
               No wonder your religion causes so many wars and killings.

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      Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Not to worry, there are millions if not billions of unintelligent people who do believe in gods. You are not alone.

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         Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I would reword that to- there many brainwashed people in the world.

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         just_curiousposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         That's not very nice.  The shoulders our scientists stand on today are those of people of religious belief. Atheism is a very young. It needs a creed. Something simple. Maybe something like, lets be tolerant of people with different mind sets

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            Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            I'm not sure Atheism is that young, it's just so much easier to say I do not believe in God when you know you are not going to get dragged off and stoned to death or set on fire.
            
            Oh I forgot some stoneage religious cultures still do that don't they....
            
            God is Love.... Yeah Right !  Has there ever been one instance of a fanatical group of Atheists stoning someone to death for believing in a God ?
            
            What's wrong with the creed "Live and Let Live..." Works for me and has done for a long time and I don't need to follow a God or need a Holy Joe telling me to do what should come naturally.

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            Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Often, reality paints a picture of itself not unlike itself.
            
            
            
            Why? What's wrong with standing on the floor?
            
            
            
            That's a very good creed to embrace. I understand no religions embrace it so it must be free to use, then.

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            Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Most of the professional scientist in the world are either atheist or agnostic. I think many of them would make better Politian’s, but, mainly they are not allow to do so by the religious right
            
            People like Bush or Hitler were once considered very nice people; Was it very nice creating Wars, and tell people they will go to Hell if they don't along with only one exclusive God plan of Yahweh.
            
            I prefer the word, kindness or love behavior of God like. If everyone in the world were God. The people would be more then tolerant, they would not be victimized so greatly and they would be kinder,

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      Titen-Sxullposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      How does the existence of order imply an intelligent creator? That's an argument from ignorance and a god of the gaps fallacy.
      
      "I can't see a way for there to be order in the Universe without a deity therefore a deity must exist to explain what I can't understand"
      
      There is no scientific evidence to suggest that god(s) exist, thus the most intelligent stance, in my opinion, is one of uncertainty -> agnostic-atheism.

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      Mercrediposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      In 2 Kings 2:23-24 The Lord sends bears to tear apart 42 kids for making fun of a prophet's baldness. I don't think enough people meditate on these versus. It's always important to remember that God does not like people who make fun of male pattern baldnerss.

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   pennyofheavenposted 13 years ago

   People can believe what they want to believe. Makes no difference to God. It makes more difference to man what an atheist believes, than it does God

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      Over The Hillposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      No penny of heaven, it does matter what you believe.
         I`m sorry for your soul .May God open your eyes.
        Without Him, you are blind.

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         pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         You demonstrate my point well. It is only man that it makes a difference to, what a person believes.
         
         I do agree when one does not know God one is blind.

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            Pcunixposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            And we all agree that having imaginary friends isn't necessarily a sign of psychosis, although it can be in extreme cases.

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               pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Yes.

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               SEO Ibizaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               my imaginary friend is better than your imaginary friend, and he says i am to smite down all who disagree with him.
               
               or say his name. or draw cartoons.
               
               and dont you even be thinking about drinking or fornication.
               
               especially homofornication. (except if you're asked to by a priest obviously)
               
               lest ye get smited.

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               Mercrediposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Having five different Hubpages that argue with each other on the forums is an early indicator. Especially when the arguments carry on while sitting around in a coffee shop.

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                  Pcunixposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  I would have to agree
                  
                  i stopped arguing with myself when my wife pointed out that I was wrong and so was the I was arguing with.

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            Over The Hillposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Do you know the Lord,Penny of Heaven? If so , who is he or she?

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               pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Yes. perhaps not in the same way you know God. Does that mean I think your way of perceiving God is wrong. No. God is neither he nor she for me but is that which we are in and of. We who perceive God are subject to our realization of the God process if you like, that is limited by our perception. God is infinite.

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                  Ruben Riveraposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  I second this response, don't know why some think it's she or he

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                     Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Perhaps because some sort of ancient scribblings by nomadic goat herders said that you lot are created in God's image.
                     
                     Now I could extrapolate that to mean that umpteen thousand years ago as women were considered to be property, measured in how many goats or sheep they were worth, that the writer was a man and they would hardly consider for a second that this God would be a woman.
                     
                     For proof of the theory above you need look no further than the present day Middle Eastern source of all this Biblical nonsense where the lot of women has not improved much since man used an imaginary superior being to consolidate his power over women in the first place.
                     
                     Of course if I'm wrong and everybody on Earth is made in the image of this Supreme Being can you imagine what it must look like ?   Is it half man half woman.... and what colour is it ?
                     
                     Personally I could go with the theory that God isn’t a man,  based upon the logic of bodily design, I cannot imagine that a male God would have put testicles on the outside !!!

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                        pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        Perhaps it isn't bodily design that was meant when it said "in Gods image". God is spirit according to the bible.

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                           Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                           Where does it say that ? Or is that a modern interpretation of what someone thing they meant to say ?
                           
                           Not exactly my interpretation of the let us create man in our image... does a spirit have a shape ?
                           
                           This is the bit I cannot grasp.... The intelligence and educational level of those who told these stories way back then for whatever purpose it served within their cultural group.
                           
                           That and the way modern day mankind think that it has any remote relevance to us !
                           
                           Watch this space as next year approaches we will see every form of religious Nut Job coming out of the woodwork at us with "The End of the World" predictions scaring the Bejeesus out of the sad and gullible all in the name of some obscure sect.
                           
                           Think of all the young and innocent children who will have only just be born and have committed no sin (Your Rules not mine) must they be destroyed as well ?       
                           
                           When the World reaches 2013 safe and intact, besides feeling like a sad bunch of moronic has-beens will they finally admit that they are wrong and that they have been had all these years ?

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                              pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                              The bible does yes, its been there as long as I can remember. But then I'm not 2000 years old so I don't know if its been changed or not.
                              
                              Depends on ones perception of spirit. It might have shape might not. All depends.

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                                 Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                 No shape whatsoever....!
                                 
                                   Even Whisky, strong spirit that it is requires a glass or a bottle to give it shape...

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                                    pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                    Like I says depends on an infinite amount of conditions. If it is manifested it has shape. Not manifested it has no shape like thoughts. Vibrations that can give shape for sure.

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                  Pcunixposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  If your god is everything, then in fact it is nothing.

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                     pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Yes if you want to put it that way.

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               Druid Dudeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Should I tell her? No, I'll let you. Just wanna see if we have the same test answers. Bet ya my answer is different.

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         Mikeydoesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I'm sorry you waste so much time of your life on this.
         
         Not that there is anything wrong with religion, but you are spending all your short time living worrying about us.
         
         The difference between you and me is our brain. Your brain needs God, mine does not.

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            Druid Dudeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Where did you get the mistaken idea that I, for one, am in the least concerned about you? Those who choose blindness and cling to it, deserve everything they aren't seeing. Good riddance.

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   Home Girlposted 13 years ago

   Well, if you have a lot of imaginary friends, you don't have to talk to yourself or to write on hubpages, your void is filled up to the brims!

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      Druid Dudeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Some people can't see. Should we chastise them for their blindness? And you, Homie, are going to end up with imaginary friends that won't go home.

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         Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I thought it was, without science your blind and without God your lame

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   simeonvisserposted 13 years ago

   C'mon folks, the opening post is not even worth arguing about. We're just repeating the endless cycle of religious talk. Over The Hill makes no effort to present arguments for his/her case but just posts something to evoke responses - otherwise known as trolling. Please, let us not feed the trolls. Or install Edweirdo's plugin

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   pisean282311posted 13 years ago

   order is perfectly balanced by natural forces...yes it does tend to curious view about who might have done this...that has to be god...as long as one has such questions it is perfectly normal...but imagining that god to be interested in humans , loving , punishing etc etc can frown any person who views nature at large...can't blame atheist for it...
   
   P.S..it is not thousand years...it is billions of years..4 billion ...

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   Home Girlposted 13 years ago

   I don't think I need god's crutches to live my life without fear. You can live your life without god, but without science? No! No way. Otherwise you have to dig a hole in the ground to live and have some dry animal skins to cover yourself from cold. They say in my old country, "Call me a pot, just don't put me into the oven". So call me atheist if you like, just don't imagine that I am stupid, wicked, lame or have horns and a tail.

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      paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      One is perfectly alright in having knowledge of science and technololgy a common fruit of human being's efforts of both Theists and the Athiests; the other things you wrote are not connected with it, I think.

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      aka-djposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      "So call me atheist if you like, just don't imagine that I am stupid, wicked, lame or have horns and a tail."
      
      If the profile picture is actually you (and I assume it is). You are absolutely right!

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         Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I can find often enough hard core atheists some what lame. Going by my personal experiences and by the history books.

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   Twenty One Daysposted 13 years ago

   Let me remind the masses on both sides of the Ism, that neither refutes g/God --although they dispute-- merely the application of the g/God concepts.
   A husband without a wife is a lonely, desperate man-whore and a wife without a husband, a virgin, a widow or a femme whore.
   
   Science, without the hunt (observe/report) or the thrill of it, is useless without application. And a wife, (sensation) with no kill to prepare a glorious feast, is equally useless.
   
   An atheist is merely one who has convinced themselves of the foolishness of sensation but has not accepted fully the hunters role. Kind of like a teenager in puberty, uncertain but damned determined to prove something --still wanting to satisfy a longing, but not certain as to how.
   
   James.

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      A.Villarasaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Interesting analogy... one that securely place atheist into the corner of juvenile delinquents.

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         frogdroppingposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Generalization. Try harder.

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            A.Villarasaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Funny that atheist are such  experts on generalization when applying their  contortionist  rationalization on why  theists are stupid fools for following a belief system formulated by "ignorant goat herders" ;  belief systems that has caused wars and famine and pestilence and rape and murder; etc.. etc. then, when they themselves think that generalizatrions are being applied to them unfairly, they howl bloody murder.
            
            Is it because of their juvenile preoccupation? or is it because of their narcisitic predisposition?

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         Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Don't worry about it,
         
         If it’s any consolation this delinquent not only knows for sure that Man create God... I can more or less tell you which man and when.  Not that anybody will listen.

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            A.Villarasaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            I'll listen... and I'm sure we would have a very lively debate.

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         Twenty One Daysposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         You know, that never occurred to me.
         But, in many respects, it would seem so. Atheism --again a product or derivative of theism-- is as much a rebellious teenager as any actual teenager. The freedom/independence from a codependent lifestyle/mentality is what is being expressed --sometimes violently, sometimes artistically/poetically, as they try to sort out for themselves the course that best suits them. It is still as much humanism as their estranged parents (equation/sensation). Oddly --and no offense to any atheist-- at some point they will assimilate or be assimilated in order to sustain that necessity (cause/effect; purpose; solution) of humanism, else dismiss the nature completely and start fresh with no injection of information/social condition, but simply by the rules of the universe and its directive...
         
         James.

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            Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Aww. Is zat wot Daddy sed? Least they do not  claim superior esoteric ness innit? Wot Soz u dun geddit coz u thgunk u cleber innit.
            
            Tjhen wen baby sez innit we no it int true wot peeps b 800 years old innjit?
            
            Right?
            
            No offense to religionists such as yourself. But good for you thinking how superior you are - I am sure if you consider the number "7" you will understand - or not. Perhaps you sill resort to sensationalism instead and perhaps rationalism and normal ism to approbate the reprehensible normalcy
            
            Only I do not need to waste 17 days - I can do it in just 5.
            
            C my book "internal evolution in just 5 days"
            
            'Course it dint occur 2 yer - yer is thinking wot Jews sed god sed innit?
            
            Dear me.
            
            You religionists get more desperate with every statement. Does it bother you that much that some people can think for themselves?
            
            I guess so....................
            
            Marcus

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               Twenty One Daysposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Religionist is not an official word. BTW, we had this discussion numerous times: I am as far from being a sensationalist as possible --maybe even further than you, Marcus. Still, it doesn't mean I don't appreciate you and your opinion.
               
               James.
               
               (ps, I could not understand most of the gibberish verbiage in your reply. And it is 9 not 7 . In finality, it is not about superiority as you often inject against your counterpart. At least to me it is not. It is about NOT justifying equation or sensation and engaging the universal principles by the universes rules/standards --something neither side seems to give a tiny rats a@@ about, yet wouldn't be here without. Ironic, isn't it.)

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            A.Villarasaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Dang... you posted an  excellent  analysis of what makes the mind of an atheist tick. I sure hope  a lot of the atheist hubbers read it and not  consider what you just wrote a frontal attack on their non-belief system.

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   SpanStarposted 13 years ago

   Matthew 19:17
   New Living Translation (©2007)
   "Why ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only One who is good. But to answer your question--if you want to receive eternal life, keep the commandments."
   
   John 7:7
   New Living Translation (©2007)
   The world can't hate you, but it does hate me because I accuse it of doing evil.
   
   It would appear that God is hated because he tells the world that we are not doers of of good but of evil.

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      Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      And this is relevant to our Forum discussion  HOW ?

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      Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      His followers have had that pounded into their heads for so long, they believe it.
      
      Funny how you would believe anyone would want to love a god like that.

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         Druid Dudeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         So, I take it, that besides God, none of you support that nonsense about alien civilizations out there being more advanced than we are? How much more advanced would you say they have to be? Or, do you suppose the universe still revolves around us? Maybe we, instead, revolve around the universe. Now, there's a concept.

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            Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Hopefully, advanced enough to understand the different between myth and reality.

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            Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            You want us to revolve around Yahweh Universe, funny, I know some megalomaniac people like that

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            A.Villarasaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Hey Dude:
            
            Don't waste your valuable time convincing these folks about your belief system..... for obvious reasons---they do not believe in any ideas, ideals, ideologies that do not enhance  or  further advance their  exagerated sense of  intellectual/moral superiority.

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               Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Yes, it is a very hard line, to pull on.
               
               Yet, Inch by inch, making a little way towards a middle grounds.

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   lucieanneposted 13 years ago

   The world could have been created from the 'big bang' who knows? None of us were around to witness it. But if that were the case, who lit the fuse? There will always be people who argue for and against the 'God' theory, and none of us will be any the wiser, unless of course, God does exist, then the ones who always believed in Him will be proved right, but there will be no-one there for them to say 'I told you so' to, because they will all have perished.
   Then of course, there are the ones who do believe He exists but are too fond of their lifestyles, ie; getting drunk, smoking pot, sleeping with someone elses husband (or wife) Sleeping with someone of the same sex, or even sleeping with anyone they're not actually married to (because fornication is a deadly sin)and a whole load of other stuff that is on the 'no-no' list.
   Lets face it, for a lot of us religion is soo uncool. It's a thing of the past. We're in the 21st Century now and science is overtaking religion. Or is it?
   Where do I sit in the midst of all this? I honestly don't know.
   I believe there has to be some divine entity (who I call God) who has designed the universe and everything in it. We are merely humans. We will never know all the secrets and I doubt we'd ever understand them if we were to be shown. the trouble with us is we're too damn curious, and although I don't believe in the holy scriptures, there's quite a bit to be said for some of it. The human race is getting too big for its boots. we are wanting to become 'like God' which will be our downfall.
   The world is becoming over-populated because of the advances in medicine, ie; fertility treatment, stem cell technology, etc.
   We are destroying the environment, cutting off our air supply by destroying the rain forests, polluting the oceans, killing off the coral reefs.... the list is endless. We are NOT LISTENING to God!!
   Whatever anyone believes,whether we be Christian, muslim sheikkh, Jew, Hindu Bhuddist, or whatever, we should all be pulling in the same direction, and the only way to do that is through a common belief in a creator. If all you atheists want to go on destroying the planet, then you have no right to share it with people who want to live in peace and harmony. If the Muslim extremists want to strap bombs to themselves and take out a jumbo jet, then they should all be blown off the planet!
   
   A final thought - where was God when a quarter of a million people died in the boxing day tsunami? Where was He when the earthquake hit Haiti, or Vesuvius erupted and wiped out Pompeii or Santorini exploded and wiped out Crete?
   I ask myself why did a three year old little girl have to die of Swine flu?
   I don't know the answers, only God does. And sometimes we need faith, because without it, what's the point to anything?

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      Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      lucieanne
      
      All this righteousness sure is discrimination and may not allow us to move forward fast enough towards a spiritual age.
      
      We are all co creator with God, combining atheist, gays, Muslim, whores, and pot heads. Thet are in no where near the main source of evil and should not be blowen off the planet. They are people like you and me, no better, no worst. I thought your creator taught you, we are all created equal
      
      When you see everyone as God, God wars makes no sense and you see war never did resolved anything, yet did create more wars, for sure.

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         lucieanneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I'm not discriminating - I'm pretty much a 'live and let live' sort of person. Nor am I suggesting that all Muslims or athiests should be exterminated. However, I'm not keen on sharing my world with people who are hell-bent on either destroying it or each other. I don't give a flying fig about who's sleeping with whom or what their sexual orientation is. It's not me they've got to answer to.
         As for extremist bombers being, Quote; 'people like you and me, no better, no worse' I have to disagree. They have no regard for human life, either their own or anyone else's, and I object strongly to some crackpot extremeist sect controlling and destroying my life and the lives of my loved ones.
         I'm not a religious person. I have my own private beliefs which I keep to myself. I do strongly believe that as a resident on this planet I have a right to a vested interest in its wellbeing, which includes not having it destroyed by thoughtless assholes who have no regard for anyone,-not even themselves - or our communal home.
         I'm not keen on any one particular government having the power to destroy my children's and their children's futures either. What gives them that right? So, for my part, I hope that there is a God and I sincerely hope that before too long he kicks some ass and gets rid of all the crap that's destroying it.. Only then can we move forward spiritually.

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            Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            About one million Iraqi have been killed on Iraqi soil (mostly families)
            No proof of an Iraqi killing an American on American soil
            About 14% of the kills have been suicide bombers in Iraq
            
            What would American do, if 1 million American were killed on their soil?
            
            A better question is who is really doing more of the destroying greater than the other?

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               lucieanneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               For the record - I'm English, not American. I did not support the war in Iraq and none of my family serve in the forces. You obviously have an axe to grind about this but I'm really not the person for you to grind it with. I am totally anti-war and anti-violence in any way. Everyone knows that the war was illegal and should never have happened, but I have nothing to apologise for. I won't apologise for being English - I can't help where I was born.
               Anyway, slightly off topic methinks

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                  Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Your right, slightly off topic, yet it is predominate religious countries at war tooled by the greedy.
                  
                  More people have been killed in the name of god and atheist opposes both most often.
                  
                  I love everybody, If I do have an axe to grind, it's would be with the very greedy rich.

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                  paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  You are a good human being.
                  
                  Thanks
                  
                  I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

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                     Castlepalomaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Almost everyone blows off my Iraq war questions. 
                     
                     Paar, We can agree on somethings,

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    Merlin Fraserposted 13 years ago

    Hey Lucieanne,
    I was more or less with you right up to the point when you said,
    
    “If all you atheists want to go on destroying the planet, then you have no right to share it with people who want to live in peace and harmony. If the Muslim extremists want to strap bombs to themselves and take out a jumbo jet, then they should all be blown off the planet!”
    
    Why do you suppose it is only Atheists that are destroying the planet ?  Only Atheists drive gas guzzling vehicles, only Atheist eat food imported from farms that were once rain forests, only Atheists go to War ?  Where do you find one single fact to prove that point ?
    
    What single fact do you have to support your theory that Non Atheists are the ones who are living in peace and harmony.... Not on this planet they’re not that’s for sure !
    
    I loved your point that Muslim extremist suicide bombers should all be blown off the planet... You may want to revise that thought ? 
    
    In spite of anything and everything you may read here on Hubpages about Atheism and Atheists, they are not evil, well no more so than anyone else. Nor are they organised into Cults of Science, in fact I am not aware of any organised Atheist groups organising anything, to all intents and purposes they are simply people who do not believe in God and happily get on with their lives without a backward glance.
    
    If you bother to read any of my Hubs or forums on the subject of Global Warming you will find I have been arguing to save the World from the greed and stupidity of humanity for years and for the record I don’t believe in god, any of them !  Nor do I believe for a second that all who argue against me are all Atheists.

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       lucieanneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Hey Merlin - Thanks for your comment and I take on board what you say. I was wrong to accuse ALL athiests of not caring for the planet, and I apologise for that. With hindsight, what I should have said was All atheists who DONT care for the planet.
       Religion has been the cause of most of the wars and I don't have any evidence to support anything to the contrary.
       There are extremeists in all religions, but they take it to different levels. I suppose everyone has a right to believe what they want, and they all believe that their own particular 'brand' is the right one, and sometimes they try to 'persuade' us that they are right in their own way - some vocally, and some physically (like the nut-job suicide bombers)
       I have no objection to somebody standing on a soap-box in the town centre shouting out his message of doom if we don't convert, I can walk away and ignore him, but I object to someone blowing up a load of innocent people because the world won't convert to Islam.
       If God does exist, is this what he wants them to do?
       
       I will read your hubs. I'm all for looking after our communal home, and for the population to stop being so greedy and materialistic.
       I'm sure that if God does exist, His plan was for us to look after this beautiful planet they way He intended, not to ravage it and bleed it dry.
       Regards, Lucie

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    Merlin Fraserposted 13 years ago

    Hey Lucieanne,
    
    I am not a Atheist, not in true sense anyway, I do not believe in god or gods by any definition but I do believe there is fine line of balance that mankind has crossed to the detriment of the planet and I also believe in many respects that organised Religion is partly to blame.
    
    My beliefs are Pagan in origin and Pre date any and all Religions when man lived in harmony with Mother Nature.  My thoughts are that when those who wrote the Bible came along saying this God of theirs gave them dominion over all the beasts of the earth, the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky or whatever it’s kind of been downhill ever since.
    
    I abhor ignorance, and I must admit that when arguing that with a World population fast approaching 7 Billion this just might have an adverse effect on the balance of Life as far as sustaining an adequate food and water situation and might have something to do with Global warming.
    
    Of course I am talking about the whole World and all Life forms, not just mankind, and I get shouted down as a Prophet of Doom with no evidence and it is all a natural cycle and therefore we need do nothing at all... How convenient !  True most of them will be dead and gone before the proof they are wrong becomes irreversible.
    
    They may be right, I doubt it, but it gives them the comfort of doing nothing and not having to change their life styles.  This is of course you have a life style you are content with, however I doubt they give a second thought to anybody beyond their line of sight.  The worst part is they proclaim themselves Christians and God will provide, funny enough when I worked in the Middle East the Muslims say the same Allah be praised he will provide. 
    
    Yet they brand me an Atheist...a Non Believer... I am Evil and no one should heed me.
    
    So I write Hubs.... Hey Ho !

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       Jeramiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       I don't see how ??  But someone will argue the points that you have made.
       
         I guess, cause a lot of people like to argue.

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          Merlin Fraserposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          Of course they will Jerami... I stand for Logic, Reason and Common Sense. There are two sides to the argument;
          
          1. Do Nothing and hope it will all blow over. 
          
          2. Cut down on our Greed and Pollution and see if it helps.
          
          If we who are on the No 2 side are wrong then at least we have not been guilty of exacerbating something we believe to be a problem.
          
          However, by the time those who support No1 get the proof they seek it maybe too late for mankind.
          
          Although on the positive side I also believe that without mankind the world will continue and recover, possibly to start all over again.

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    paradigmsearchposted 13 years ago

    Egocentrism failure indicates that there is a higher power.
    
    However, there is no guarantee that the higher power gives a damn or is even aware of us.
    
    Edit: This statement is copyrighted.

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13. 0

    Twenty One Daysposted 13 years ago

    Interesting the paradox of Duality between paradigmsearch and Titen-Sxull. The duality is compiled regarding an entity. Perhaps it would be better to consider a totality instead. Even still, by application of sensation or observation(equation) the information would be useless to either, since both would be required to 'forget' their methods of application and the humanism that drives both.
    
    James.

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       paradigmsearchposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       
       
       And agreed.

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          lucieanneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          Twenty One days - would you like to rephrase your paragraph so that dummies like me could possibly understand what you're talking about?

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             Twenty One Daysposted 13 years agoin reply to this

             Luci, I for one, hardly believe you --or anyone-- is a dummie.
             My verbiage sometimes is obscure, so I will elaborate.
             
             It simply means this "entity" created and designed or dismissed by humans does not exist. (ie The man in the sky, flying spaghetti monster, fiery star goat, etc.) The primary entity most speak of is the Hebrew (not Jewish) entity, which was twisted and adopted into pagan ritual --like Zeus, etc --from ba`al practices (the oldest recorded theology on earth)
             
             But, the Creator is everything/everywhere, which throws a proverbial monkey wrench into the well oiled machine of the human mind. Creator is the stars and distance between them, the air, the dirt, the water, the wind. The mystic formations of Creator are seen in part by observation of those stars (equation), else emotions expressed by watching those stars (sensationalism). To understand it, man designed limited items called theories, entities, religions, war, etc (aka humanism) to both make sense of something they once knew and were apart of, as well as claim fact to that something.
             
             (I have been writing a series of articles on this subject and working on a book as well, which outlines the details of how man lost his connectivity and dominion of the Six Realities and has spent x-thousand years trying to recreate those realities --by either sensation or equation.)
             
             James.

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14. 0

    Twenty One Daysposted 13 years ago

    Part Two:
    
    Duality, is the entity of the human mind --meaning humanism.
    It is from humanism that religion AND science have their same root. They are a husband and wife --and in many ways identical because they come from the same place.
    
    The husband -hunter, masculine, powerhouse, observer.
    His quest has been to dominate his surroundings by using the elements of the universe by his own methods/terms of thinking.
    
    The wife -the feminine, the nurturer, emotion, sensationalist has taken those things her husband made and assisted him in securing those elements. She softened them, made them pleasurable to him according to her thinking.
    
    Together they built temples, designed ideas, decorated their treasures in gold, perfumed them with stories, incense and yes, blood. They titled it humanity and humanism.
    
    Still, one thing plagues them both -a gnawing truth neither will face and have spent ages trying to ignore, refute, understand --the thing they lack is not unity but totality. So, to compensate, one designed the idea of g/Gods because her husband turned out not to be the g/god he claimed, while the husband became bitter and jealous and set out to prove even more he was the only g/God.
    
    They found themselves at odds for years, after their separation and what some would call an all out War of the Roses. But in truth they have never divorced and need each other all the more. Without one side, the other has no purpose. Who would show off the male kill, his treasures? Who would enjoy tho sweet smell of the feast if the husband never came to eat?
    
    Recently reunited they formed something called Quality. A quality of life. A blend of both equation and sensation (ie Quantum Yoga). With that have given birth to a new generation of --in my humble opine-- bastardized children, living on the roof of the house of Quality. Dancing like the pagans of old on --as Templin sang it-- a volcano.
    
    Certainly the mystic charms of sensation have faded with age, as most charms fade in the feminine; and the strength of the masculine has faded also. They have come to a paradox where the only solution is to define an entity for belief or disbelief. This is the final fig leaf. There are no more excuses for either, nor the lack of understanding. The Universe will not wait for man to decide he is ready to return to his place of authority and joy --through his methods of thinking (his own humanism). Humanity was rid itself of its humanism --break out of this "hell" of madness they designed for themselves and accept restoration. They must come to the place where Creator's power is restored in them, else face the consequences of that humanism.
    
    Unfortunately, religion places that burden on a series of books and documents they deem as absolute power (ie the Bible, Quran, Torah, Vedic archives) while equation deems absolution by their documents (The Fundamentals of Physics, etc). both identical in nature, highly obscure in application), neither useful.
    
    James.

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