A Message for Non-Believers: Stop being so Intolerant
But, that isn't exactly the truth, is it? Religions need to perpetuate their dogmas. For example, one such scheme is the indoctrination of children while the other is evangelism. If these two schemes were not part of a religionists agenda and all they did was to spread peace, love and do charity work, there wouldn't be any problems.
As for your title, intolerance is one of the fundamental principles of most religions, they are intolerant to others beliefs or those who don't share the same beliefs, they are intolerant towards other groups such as homosexuals, they are intolerant to the theories and discoveries of science, the list goes on and on...
Perhaps, this alone should give you some inkling as to why religions are criticized.
That is a logical fallacy. The exact same thing can be said about leprechauns and unicorns.
If you want hard evidence, turn to the creationism vs. evolution and you will see the evidence that shows that part of religions are false, based on your requirements.
Perhaps then, just 99.99% true. If it weren't true, religions would not evangelize and attempt conversions.
And, since there are so many sects within the various religions, that isn't likely to happen anytime soon unless one particular sect managed to wipe us all out.
Yet, we can lay blame to those religions that started a number of wars in the name of their gods. Although you are correct in that there are other reasons for wars to start, they can all be recognized, acknowledged and put to rest, never to rear their ugly heads again.
So, the fact that we now have laws that don't allow such atrocities to occur doesn't mean they wouldn't occur if the laws weren't there.
But, lo and behold, they do in fact still occur. The Rwandan genocide is a most recent atrocity committed in the name of religion. Let's not forget the conflict between the Muslims and the Jews currently afoot in the ME.
No, they have not matured. In fact, they have been forced to change in light of our world. Most certainly, any changes are not the result of internal acknowledgments.
So, you have no problem is someone wanted to join the Nazi party, for example?
When religions stop peddling intolerance, the criticisms will most likely stop, too.
Foolishness of which you seem very dedicated to. So why are you here amongst fools again?
Vec:
Oh I am dedicated to an attempt to bring the enlightenment that knowledge can provide, to the intellectually, lesser evolved of we primitive human creatures who waste their precious lives and time wallowing in the specious abstract concepts of imagined god/s.
I know, I know it's impossible, but hell, a caring man's gotta try!
Thanks for asking Vec...
Qwark
And, religious folk should know that their actions create conflict, yet fail to recognize the truth of the matter. You would be no different.
The conflict arises from the words believers use and how they use them.
You're right EK, it's not restricted to just Christians. It happens to come from all religious people.
The generalization is the only way to explain it. There are plenty of religious people who know and understand their place in the world. Therefore, they've no need to speak about what they believe with regards to their religion. But, those who are the one who cause the conflict.
Believers use words they themselves fail to understand, but then utter those words in world based on reality, which creates the conflict, for which, proves they don't understand. At the same time, fail to see that they don't understand, but claim to. Do you understand? Or do I need to elaborate more?
Untrue. And, it's unkind to claim that people who are not you, will not go looking for answers.
I know, I'm a perfect example who was religious at one point in my life, until I searched and researched answers. What do you know, religion is a hoax to come to find out. Therefore, conclusion- "god" is the hoax played on people and has been in place for thousands of years.Not believing that your god from your personal religious beliefs has the entire truth is a myth?
You are only one god away from being an atheist unless you believe in everyone else's god.
I do not recall seeing you use logic once out of all your posts.
Not believing in any myth is NOT a religion or even a belief system, it is simply not being gullible or indoctrinated in my view.
Yes, I certainly am feeling the love of your god in your post.
Funny though, believers don't need to search for answers as they have one single book on which to refer that provides them all the answers they will ever need, while the rest of us work tirelessly day after day, year after year searching for answers to the universe and the world around us, experimenting and discovering new ones every day.
- Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years ago
0Suffer? Your in a religious thread. Please explain why your here if it brings you such discomfort?
I think that is contradictory, as no one brought you here. Yet you feel so motivated to tell us about your stereotypical ideas of Christians.
I am not better than you, and certainly don't belong to many of the descriptions of which you have posted. It doesn't do any good to degrade me because of what other people have done.Thanks for the grammar lesson. I'm well aware of the two.
I haven't confused anything.
I do apologise for saying you were in a religious thread. I should have checked before posting.
My main concern was you saying "ALL" Christians consider themselves "holier than thou." This is NOT true. I don't see myself as such and don't wish to be classified that way either. I am just like every other person on this planet. Not better.Worry about your own perceived soul. What makes you think YOU should be allowed to interfere in the beliefs, of lack thereof, of others?
Bible belt? North Carolina?At least you admit your irrational belief system does not make you a better person. Nor does it encourage you in any way shape or form to be a better person. I agree.
This is why your religion is of completely no value. In fact - quite the opposite.
Not to be too blunt about it, but I will stop challenging religion when it's proponents stop telling me that THEIR god runs MY life.
And the odd thing there is, you come into a religious forum to declare this. Sounds to me as if you made an effort to hunt them down to do it.
There is nothing odd about it.
I will say my piece, and someones opinion as to my entitlement to do so doesn't interest me.
What is sounds like to you is apparently dependent on your belief in an invisible friend.
Are you saying I wont stand up for myself in the real world?
Yet you see your statement that I responded to as fair?
So we can expect you to expire still in rebellion!
- just_curiousposted 13 years ago0
Not at all, the contradictions posed by the author of the OP were resolved. Not by him, of course.
Hey vector. That would be impossible. I've known plenty of times where beelzedad had nothing of value to say, but he was steadily posting. I don't know that he does speechless.
C'mon JC give beezle a break!
He has posted a lot of good stuff here and is funny as hell!Of course you consider nothing I have to say is of value as very little of it supports your belief system and only serves to point out just how utterly irrational, illogical and violent it is. The religiously indoctrinated rarely if ever find value in reality.
Hey beelzedad. I'm basically out of here, but when I saw the email I figured I'd at least respond to your post here. That was a joke. You've had a lot of good things to say. I've got my pebble, christianity can go to the hell it created. And I don't care what you say, there's something more.
- ryankettposted 13 years ago0
That needs to go in the 'suggest a feature' sub-forum, or whatever it's called
Most non-believers, just like most who do believe, don't say a word nor argue at all.
As always it's only a few from both sides that get loud and make it seem like "they" are hostile, pushy, narrow minded, whatever.
Most people have a life they are busy living and don't get into arguments about it. Believe whatever you want, more power to you. Your right,,, whatever you believe,,, gotta go now.- just_curiousposted 13 years ago0
- jomineposted 13 years ago0
Yes, yes! These non-believers are very intolerant. These are the very people who killed Giordano Bruno and flown planes into buildings and put bombs in crowded places.
These non believers and there arrogance! How dare they show us our god is imaginary, just a concept? How dare they show us we are immature and childish in our beliefs?
And the popes and priests, how good they are in spreading peace by molesting children or protecting/justifying those who does!
No religious leaders ever wanted to take over the world. See Pope Alexander VI only wanted to help his son Cesare Borgia to carve a little territory for him and nothing else!
And how all our stories are true! Why can't there be flying horses? Why can't god die to save us, The Great Humans? You silly non-believers, you will never understand how important we are! - Very good.
Excellent
You aren't stereotyping are you? I hope not.
That would be wrong. And there are plenty of atheist's who claim the title of ego-maniac world take-over. Relevant stuff would be useful.
There are bad apples in every bunch. Stereotyping doesn't make you look smart. Or the little stereotype encouraging ones either..
When people stop thinking they are wiser than their fellow man, they might realize it's best to take care of your own life, and leave other people's business to themselves.
This sadly, will probably never happen since we all think we are smarter than everyone else.
As is so evident in my post. Sorry. Did not mean to butt into your life. Please continue."Basically, if you think about it, most people become religious is several ways.
a) they are brainwashed since childhood.
b) they go through a really hard time and want to make sense of the world.
c) they did terrible things and need forgiveness"
I'm sorry. I find that very wrong to make such assumptions. There isn't a single good thing in your list. Which proves the opinion to be biased.
And if you resort back to b)... most people (unfortunately) rebel against God when things go wrong. So that assumption is wrong. At the least, all we can say is that it's irrelevant completely because people go both ways on that statement.@ vector 7. I was a member of the born again movement for a decade. I heard thousands of people witness and give their testimonies during that time. I know the religion inside out and upside down. Every single body who witnessed spoke about trials in their live and how they had 'come to the Lord'.
No, I'm not wrong.
The human brain is socialized through the things that it hears from babyhood through childhood and it believes things that it hears consistently over and over again. That's why people who grow up with different cultures believe different things.
The process is called 'soft brainwashing' and it's why advertising works.
things go wrong all the time in my life. I don't turn against God because I don't think there is a God.Yes. You heard thousands of people witness. I wonder what Church all the people that went the other direction from the trials they suffered witnessed? I didn't know their was an Atheist Church to compare results against those who went to, and those who turned from the "idea" of God seeing as I have to be technical to keep things straight.
Yes. "You're" very wrong. You have not one account of who decided God couldn't be real because the world is so bad.
It's aggravating to hear such incorrect information being told to everyone. You going to Church does not give you all the accurate information for the entire world.
God bless..
If you think some one has insulted you - perhaps you might try looking inside and see why it is that you feel so insulted. Your insecurity and quickness to anger may be the issue here. Just because some one does not believe in Majikal Super Beings and chooses instead to think for themselves - this is no reason to attack them. Nor is it an insult to your god.
How odd that you demand tolerance of this behavior. I for one will stand up again this sort of behavior any day. Sooner or later you religionists will realize we need to have some standards of behavior and moral codes in order to stop the fighting.Hi mark..I thought I had gotten rid of you for good. Go figure.
I'm not insulted, by any means. I've had an epiphany.
Anyway, the point I was making (that you missed) is that both ends are incredibly rude and arrogant. These are emotional arguments, that will do little more than insult one another.
I understand that the emotional atheist poster is responding to years of being preached to. I don't see it as mature, but it is understood.
I don't like to see people attacked unfairly. No matter who they are..I'd stand up for you too, if I thought it fair to do so.
Anyhoo, that being said, trust me, this is no longer the droid you're looking for. Your argument means nothing to me anymore. Like I told Bailey bear, I really don't have a dog in this fight.Trollin trollin trollin.
Dear me, you religionists are dishonest.
Pity you seem incapable (don't care) of understanding that this is what causes all the fights.
Not that I have a position either way - I am just an impartial observer.
Bye bye. Glad you will not be partaking any more.- impartial observer? I always imagined you in a shroud with a sickle. But I have an overactive imagination.
You're unfair on your assessment of your adversary, but you were always good for a few laughs.
We'll never cease being adversaries, because I will never be like you, but most of all because you leave yourself wide open for attack with these humorous posts.
But, you can never honestly call me a religionist again. I won't bore you with the details.
Unfortunately for you, I still find amusement here; so I'll still comment if I run across a comment you make that is blatantly in error, or warrants an obnoxious response; because I can recognize what I'm not but I can't deny what I am. Which is (as you've noticed) someone that speaks their mind.How funny. LOLOLO
Religionists like you will always cause fights. How funny that you think repeating religious nonsense is "speaking your mind."
IDK - Perhps if you did not hide behind an anonymous persona? I thought you were done with this? No?
At least you admit you consider yourself an adversary. Because I don't believe in an invisible super being. Oh well. This is why your religion causes so many wars.
He said
She said
Beam me up Scotty :LOl;
The problem with Atheists is they think they have the answer for everything-they dont, Next he or she plumps up the feathers and up on their self made podiums they create begin pointing fingers at God ,Christians, Mickey Mouse and anyone who wants listen to them.
Degrading another humans belief system ,makes them feel important. Bullies do that too.
They are also well versed in dishing out insults, and inuendo's.
Wow did they learn that at private schools I wonder? dreadful waste of mummy and daddys money for sure.
Attack the problem ,not the person.
Number one rule in debating
Great points, but don't diss private schools too badly. I'm a product of one and I think these guys are twits sometimes too.
"Probably more than 50% of atheists grew up in religious homes."
Is this just a random guess then, or do you have a source?
"As for the 'getting rich', it's Christians who started the prosperity movement - out of complete step with the bible which teaches a sort of communism. Go read your bible."
Again no evidence. Basic personal opinion.
This is another stereotype, which I've noticed a lot of people using against Christians lately. Need we go over statistics against all Atheists and Agnostics?
And I do read my Bible. I wonder why your telling me I should if you don't believe it. And also how you would know whether I do.
"The Christian injunction that Christians must go forth and witness and bring people to the 'Lord' is 100% responsible for the backlash that is now taking place."
We don't bring people to the Lord, we tell them of Him. He does anything beyond that.And what makes you come to religious threads? To share the good word? Are you speaking for Jesus when you admonish others?
Did you inherit your religion or did you simply choose it from all the rest?
I deleted my posts for anyone curious and for Sophia to know because:
I allowed myself to be drawn to the personalisation that was made and that is not what I'm suppose to do. Therefore I withdrew my statements as the way I posted was wrong.
I'm sorry if I offended you. I simply feel the information isn't accurate at all. And I do read my Bible, which I'm attempting as of right now to follow.
God bless..vector, Stereotype is used against christians quite often. All christians get slammed in the same boat because of the actions of other people. That's not nice, but we have to love them anyway
Lastly, a, b, or c of Sophia list didn't apply to me. I thought freely on my own when I recieved Jesus. I became a christian because Iove I love God for the wonderful God he is, and wanted to serve God.No one would get slammed if you guys simply kept your religion to yourself. Try it and you'll see it's true. Let folks be happy in their own delusional religions. and keep yours private.
How arrogant Randy,to think you or anyone should tell people to keep their opinions to themselves.
No its is really unbelievable!Do you say the same thing to Atheists I wonder Cags?
Or is it one of those double standard things
So you think it is okay to try and convince others YOU know better than they concerning gods?
You are essentially deciding their fate for them, whether you are right or wrong in the matter. What gives you the right to do so? What makes you think your idea of which god to worship is better than anyone's?
Hi Randy, No, I will not try it, but thanks for the offer. I will continue to discuss my faith, regardless of getting slammed. No one is forcing you to paticipate in the forums where believers are discussing their faith. I will leave you to fight with yourself. I love you.
W.O.C Hugss
What a glorious (pre) Spring day today.
I saw trees with tiny new buds and dafodils peeking bravely out this afternoon!!
God is so amazingEaglekiwi, Yes it was a beautiful spring day.
I love the colorful trees and flowers. God is wonderful. Love and blessings to you.
Of course you won't, WOC! Why don't you simply explain the wonderful things you have accomplished with the help of your god? You know, things a non-believer cannot do here on earth. Surely with an all powerful deity backing you there have to be miraculous deeds done by you. Pray tell us of them,
Science corrects itself on a monthly basis. How accurate is that?
At least Science does correct itself though. Not much can be said for you.
Well I don't hide behind an avatar. This is me. I find it interesting that some who claim religious detractors hide and have no gurbles, are hiding behind a blind profile when they do so!
Hey Earnest, I guess people could look at my avatar as hiding, however, all of my written material actually has my real name on it. I don't think an avatar matter much and shouldn't carry any weight.
But, I guess you could just chalk that up to just my opinion, like everyone else does with my posts.I have notices that you are open about who you are.
I have another profile here that, like yours is not me as a person.
I don't use it to post, as I have no information there about who I am, unlike yours, so I post as me all the time.
Oh so you not only speak for God now but me too
Earnest everyone Im sure has many a story to tell.
I didnt just wake up one day and wonder aimlessly through the doors of the nearest church.
For me ,it was relising my happiness or peace wasnt going to come from anybody or anything.
Sure in my teenage years alcohol was the great escape (from reality) the usual distractions are fun for awhile.
But theres always a morning after guess I got tired of the same ole same ole.
I am from a family of nine ,5 brothers and 4 sisters,
My father was a Mormon elder ,then gave it up, for hard work and hard drinking. My Mum was raised a Presbyterian,she passed on when I was 13...so my Religious indoctrination was balanced by other things believe you me.
In fact my beer drinking, hard working father raised four daughters,after his wife died and never drew a welfare check!
My brothers have respectable careers, 2 have been in prison
Same with my sisters ,though none in prison.
I ,too come from a mixed and colourful background.
I have been to different churches as well. Some good, Some not.You have an interesting background. My mother was very religious.
Can't say fairer than that!
Spot on! :]
G'day Mark. Nice to see you are still around.
I have noticed you absence during the last few months. You are not here as often these days. Good for you! - you should let that sense of humor out more often. That was a good one.
I reckon I am a bit Australian with my humor. It's a cultural thing like religion.
Are you enjoying the banter? Always.
Especially with Mark. I think his sense of humor is bigger than he let's on sometimes. Other times? Not so much.
Of course you have a religion. It is all you talk about. You even argue that the bible should be taught in school because life was better when there was segregation and slavery.
Well, now, aren't we special today?
-
ROFL
I agree with Earnest on that one.
It's 'most always funny, I don' care who ya are!Hello Brenda, I have no idea what time you have, but it is 6 am here. I got up really early this morning. I hope I find you in good spirits?
I have been a napper for many years, even as a young man, I would use naps to refresh through the day.
Things are going nicely again, I will soon even have a wardrobe! My old one floated away when I was flooded. I finally fixed my ute yesterday, (flooded too,) so those sorts of things are normalizing. For the rest of it, my life is wonderful thank you for asking.
Good response I reckon. I copped a couple of them the other day as well. I told them they were too late, I WAS already "saved" then closed the door quickly leaving them standing there arguing about if they should try again. They decided not to, and went next door where they will get a reception the whole neighborhood will hear! Serves em right!
Waynet:
Just answer the door naked singing: "jesus loves the little children..."
That does it for me...
...and guess what? they never come back!
It's surefire! lolol:
Qwark
So was I.
Wow, Mark is starting another war. Thank you, but I have always respected them as an individual.
That is wonderful. Good for you. I am glad you now respect them and their choices. Well done> perhaps now the fighting will stop because you no longer think they are going against what god wants?
We can but hope.Ok Mark, I can see you are here to fight, and I don't have time for it. You don't read very well. I never stated "and their choices." I encourage you not put words in my mouth. Please read again to view exactly what is written.
Ah - so you "selectively " respect them. Which is no respect at all. I read just fine - I wanted to clarify that you were not being truthful.
Me? I love and respect you. I just hate and despise your irrational beliefs, and the fact that you are dishonest and cowardly.
That the sort of respect you were taught huh?
Little wonder your religion causes so many wars.
Hey EK, most atheist speak about things based on facts and evidence, which are derived from reality. They're in fact offended by Christians and religion in general. Their actions are just reactions, like someone who cries out from pain.
Sorry I disagree ,my observations have been that you lean(quite a lot) on the other side ,but hey thats your choice. Just thought Id point out the double standards is all.
I see the wanting to silence or control how and when I say it to be very selfish!!
On the other hand I have seen many Christians who love God ,themselves and fellow man ,while sacrificing their time ,money and labour.
That is unselfish. They do not do it for recognition ,in fact many acts go unseen.
You might determine they do it out of fear ,indoctrination, whatever other label.I say ,open your eyes widerI don't lean on either side. My argument isn't the same as the Atheist, so there isn't a double standard. Mine isn't a reaction, but is one of teaching to correctness of life itself.
Then you are short sighted. The goal is peace.
All based on the original belief that is selfish. So all consequent action is selfish. Sorry, cannot avoid it, but you can believe what you want. I'm just pointing it out, as it IS, not as it appears.
Sure they do it for recognition, just not recognition of humans, but of their god. What part do you not understand about selfish behavior.
My eyes are open, as is my mind. Sorry, you cannot see it yourself.Sure they do it for recognition, just not recognition of humans, but of their god. What part do you not understand about selfish behavior
And that is selfish?
Namecalling ,mocking ,critising, etc etc is hardly the hallmark of Peace
- just_curiousposted 13 years ago0
You're cute. Really. I know you don't see the emotional side of your argument, but it is there. Why does it upset you that they threaten hell. It isn't real, and yet it upsets you. Why is that? That is one of the things I find odd about the debates. Of course there's the god is evil argument. If there is no god, how is he evil? Why do you appear to argue this with such vehemence? Everything seems so passionate, when the actual reasons to argue against belief in that type of deity, or god or whatever you want to call it are quite the opposite. For me anyway.
Call me indoctrinated again and again. But it doesn't make it true. If it is true, and you seriously want to prove it, you'll have to change up the argument because I honestly don't see it. And I do try.On the contrary, you imagine an emotional side to my argument.
Yes, I know you find it odd, being on the side that generates the threats. In other words, you're fully at ease when people threaten you.
You seem to be forgetting the followers of religions, those who actually make the threats. Believers are unable to imagine a world without their gods, hence it is up to those who can imagine both worlds to stoop to that level of that intellect for sake of discussion.
No, you don't try and yes, the proof is in your posts. I completely understand why you can't see that.Indoctrination was not your fault, you were simply the victim. There's no need to feel embarrassed or hurt about it, just deal with it and you'll be fine.
Yes, they believed it to be right because they themselves were indoctrinated, and those before them.
It doesn't bother you because you wholeheartedly accepted and embraced the indoctrination.
And, if you don't break the vicious cycle, you will most likely indoctrinate your children, if you haven't done so already.
