Are our deaths already predetermined? Do we all have a 'time to go'?

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   tHErEDpILLposted 13 years ago

   Early this morning a young Marine died while crossing the street here in New York City. This tragedy got me thinking, "this kid could have died while serving time overseas in a war torn nation, but instead died on American soil while crossing the street." Was it as religious people say, 'his time to go?'

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      Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      If so, by what criteria do religious people use to determine when it is someones "time to go"? God did it?
      
      Was there a hand sent down from god to move the car or bus into the path of the marine? Seems pretty silly.

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         tHErEDpILLposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         True, I agree with Beelzedad. 
         
         Beelzedad Said:
         
         Was there a hand sent down from god to move the car or bus into the path of the marine? Seems pretty silly.
         
         I say:
         
         And does he help them win Grammies and Oscars?  Those people always thank God.

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      Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      The only thing in our life that is predetermined is through foresight with regards to self.
      
      Death comes, makes no matter when, how or why. It happens. Accept it and move on.

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      kessposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      the one who is ignorant of his originn pupose and destination, will continue to operate in ignoraance and therefore all this will be unto him as ramdom chaos....
      Not even recognising that he of his own self has predetermined his own death....and to him it also appear as another random event.
      
      But that has knowledge, knows his origin , purpose and destination, and he sees that all thing are perfectly synchronised unto an expected end and stull at the same time reserve the right to manipulate the order of events unto that same predetermined end.

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      Brenda Durhamposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Yes.  There is a time appointed unto man to die.    Only God knows when.
      And after that the Judgement....

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   knolyourselfposted 13 years ago

   Obviously it was his time to go and he went. Predetermination negates free will
   which then reduces one to a machine. But I would accept the idea that headquarters reassigned him.

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   Disturbiaposted 13 years ago

   No, I don't believe the time of one's death is predetermined and I get very frustrated when I hear people say things like "Oh, it was just his time" when they can't accept or reconcile someone's death.
   
   I don't believe in predetermination of any kind. If everything is predetermined, what's the point of getting out of bed in the morning?  Our death and the path of our lives is determined by random events, our free will, and the choices me make, not by some cosmic predeternimation designed by an unexplained, mystical power.

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      tHErEDpILLposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      True, I agree.

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      earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      That says it all pretty well.

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         dutchman1951posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I vote for that answer as well. Good answer

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   Diane Insideposted 13 years ago

   Disturbia, I agree with you, I think we choose for ourselves, and it is hard to justify a child of 5 years old who dies of drowning or some unfortunate event as their time to go.
   
   I do however wonder if people aren't spared who would have died otherwise from some accidents. You wonder how in the world are they still alive. I've seen quite a few of these kinds of things working in a hospital, it's very puzzling. Is it just dumb luck?
   
   I don't know some things we aren't meant to know I guess.

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   dutchman1951posted 13 years ago

   Do you know the Last word a Red-neck says befoe he dies???
   
   Hey Boys, whatch this!!!!!!
   
   I think we all have no clue when it happens at all, never will, unless we are at deaths door in sickness or trama from an accident and we realise there is no cure, then we are genius about it, other wise, no way.

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   recommend1posted 13 years ago

   Pre-determination is necessary to construct a belief in a god, but that argument is probably way beyond the religious types in these threads who appear amazingly ignorant of their own self professed beliefs.

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      Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      

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         recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Are the 5 laughing faces because you are in agreement and appreciate my acid wit, or because you don't agree with this fundamental reason that religionists try to claim predetermination ?

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            Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            If I disagreed with you, whenever have you not seen post something.
            
            Your statement was so dead on target, I could only laugh.

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               earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               I thought it was spot on as well!

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               recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Phew! that's ok then   I thought I was going to have to dig out one of my old lectures on the subject !  and it is too hot and humid here to do any real work

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                  earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  You do real work?
                  I just pretend to work, much easier on the body ya know!

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                     recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Well now you are famous and about to explode into celebrity status you won't need to work any more I guess.  Us more humble creatures still have to slave to earn a daily crust.
                     
                     I thought I had cracked it here when a Chinese lady fronted me in the street outside the Uni here with a mini outburst that was clearly an accolade in Chinese - but my Chinese missus told me later it was more in the lines of "you are the miserable fat foreign b@st@rd who failed my son in oral English last year!"

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                        earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        I hate it when people translate stuff, and it means different to what I had thought I heard!
                        
                        A guy yelled out in traffic the other day in Korean and I could have sworn he said he was once married to my mother, but apparently that wasn't what he meant.

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                  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Since you find it too much work, I wouldn't want to put you out. So, let's agree for once and move on.

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                     recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     I am marking the auspicious occasion of our agreement with another iced coffee break 

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      tHErEDpILLposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      recommend1
      
      I agree with your statement on predetermination.  I think Religious groups rely on too much blind faith to explain questions that can not be answered.  On a side note it is funny to me how all the nonbelievers in these forums have opposition against religion based on 'no proof'.  My question is:  Does seeing something with your eyes necessarily make it proof?  In the court system no matter how much evidence is against a defendant, they still get to go into trial "innocent, until proven guilty."  This is because our eyes and ears do lie, and sometimes it takes a little introspection to determine the truth.

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         recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         You are mistaken - people, especially me, only argue with religionists who claim they know who and what and when and what god said and what god thinks and that god hates gays.  You know, the out and out morons.
         
         I am more than willing to accept that nobody knows what is unknown, I am also willing to accept that some people believe there is a god out there.
         
         However, the claim that this entity that made and knows everything talks exclusively to embittered old right wing women, racists, warmongers, whoremongers, homophobes and the intellectually challenged is less easy to accept.

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            tHErEDpILLposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            I agree

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            tHErEDpILLposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            and recommend1,
            
            You are mistaken- I am agreeing with you, maybe I was not clear enough.  Too much "Blind faith" implies throwing all logic out the window and following the words of these old right wing women, racists, warmongers, whoremongers, homophobes and the intellectually challenged people.  A charismatic anarchist can lead most of humanity over a ledge into the pits of death, given the mind state of the masses at the time.  Even the smartest people seem to ride the coat tails of people who impress them with their intelligence or present their opinions in a manner that they relate to.  "Band wagon Brainiacs" I call them, and it seems like we have many of them in these forums from what I have observed.

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         Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Pretty much. But, if you're the only one who sees it, then it falls into a questionable category.
         
          
         
         Or, just add more sets of eyes and ears to confirm.

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   lizzieBooposted 13 years ago

   predetermination is a protestant fallacy. It has been one of the single most damaging concepts to the face of Christianity.

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      Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Really? Seems more like the atrocities carried out by its followers in the name of Christianity were the most damaging.

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         lizzieBooposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I mean predestination, not predeterminism. Predestination is a protestant fallacy. Predeterminism is about cause and effect.
         But yes, really. The most enduringly damaging thing done to Christianity has been the contortion of its doctrine. If you look at British history, you will see that the most serious crimes have occured since the reformation.

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