If God didn't promise you Heaven

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   Rabgixposted 12 years ago

   Or anything at all, would you still be Christian?

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      Dave Mathewsposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Yes I would still be a Christian because I would still lookforward to a time or day when I could be face to face with God who created my life and my universe.

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         Rabgixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         But once you die you're dead in this situation.

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            Dave Mathewsposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Only physically, my body will die, cease to be, but my spirit, that which gives life to the body will live on and will return back to my creator God.

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               Rabgixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               You missed the point of the entire question.
               
               Not suprised

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      tlmcgaa70posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      going back to the beginning, to before GOD offered a plan for salvation, HE had followers. Even if GOD never offered us salvation, if CHRIST never died and rose again, thus people who would follow HIS example calling themselves CHRISTians (though today they do not follow HIS example), even if all this never happened...i would still follow my GOD. HE is THE Creator. my life is incomplete without HIM.

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      pstraubie48posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      absolutely......it isn't about what He will do for me later...it is the fact that He has carried me through some of my toughest times....He didn't promise this walk would be easy...only that He would be here for me..and He has fulfilled that many times over in my life.

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         earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         God works in mysterious ways.
         
         
         

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      paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I am a Muslim

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         paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         I will still remain a Muslim- submitter to the truth.

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   MelissaBarrettposted 12 years ago

   I'm not sure I believe there is a heaven or anything at all after this.  So yes, I would still be a Christian regardless.  The lessons of Christ are pretty awesome and inspiring even without all the supernatural stuff. (think Jefferson bible)

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      tlmcgaa70posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      i am a bit confused here...how can one believe in the lessons of CHRIST and not believe in heaven? to me this is a perfect example of worshiping a self made image of GOD...you take Words of GOD and twist them around somehow until they make you comfortable, that becomes the god you worship.  a true CHRISTian is one who follows the example CHRIST set, which is living a life of complete obedience to GOD.

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         Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         By understanding that Jesus' teaching were never meant to be in any religion, but are the only location to find them.
         
         Secondly, Jesus' original message is about love, compassion(mercy) for everyone. It's the understanding that loving yourself and your fellow humans is the most compassionate thing one can do. No god required to have peace in that thought and living within that makes life worth all the things you have to go through.

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         RookerySpoonerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         I believe in the teachings of Christ, without all the supernatural stuff that Christians believe in.  Christ's teachings were not unique to him, but are common to many spiritual leaders throughout history.  Some of the words recorded as having been said by Christ are almost identical to those of the Buddha for instance.  The fact that such teachings are universal would suggest that people in different parts of the world at different times have shared the same ideas of morality.

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            RookerySpoonerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Jesus:
            Why do you see the speck in your neighbor’s eye, but do not notice the log in your own eye? Or how can you say to your neighbor, “Friend, let me take the speck out of your eye,” when you yourself do not see the log in your own eye? You, hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your neighbor’s eye.
            
            Buddha:
            The faults of others are easier to see than one’s own; the faults of others are easily seen, for they are sifted like chaff, but one’s own faults are hard to see. This is like the cheat who hides his dice and shows the dice of his opponent, calling attention to the other’s shortcomings, continually thinking of accusing him.

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         MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Thank you for that rather limited view of Christianity.  I respect your right to have an opinion.  However if you would research the history of Christianity and learn the different beliefs that encompass the religion, you will find that a rather large percent of Christians do not believe Christ is the living son of God or had any more authority to speak for him than you and I.  In short, he was a prophet... and a rather good one btw.
         
         That view of Christianity actually predated the trinity "Father, Son, Holy Ghost" sect by quite a few years.  So while I may or not be right (as you may or not be) My faith certainly didn't twist the word any more than any other form of Christianity.
         
         So maybe it isn't I that isn't the true Christian.  I mean if someone has got to be a heretic and a twister of words... tell me again why it isn't you?

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            DoubleScorpionposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            A thought that you might find useful...
            
            Jesus taught to not search or seek for the kingdom of heaven, because you would not find it, as it was within and all around you.
            
            

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               MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               LOL, I know DS. I don't bring that one up very often because it makes evangelical Christians froth at the mouth. I'm already a heretic and a heathen, I don't want to cross the line into being called the Antichrist.

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                  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  Yep, lets not go taking over other peoples roles. The Anti-Christ job has been taken.

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                     MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                     Is it you, EG, or Obama this week?

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                        earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        I think it's Barry's turn this week.

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                           MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                           Do let me know when it's my week.  When I start casting down stars I am AIMING those big boys.

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                              earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                              It's a busy roster, but I'm pretty sure your turn is next.

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                                 MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                                 Good to know... I would advise anyone that might be living in the vicinity of my Ex-Husband to relocate.  He's about to get an asteroid up his arse.

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                                    earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                                    Holy mackerel! I guess that will stop him from giving the world the *hits permanently.

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                  DoubleScorpionposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  Personally, I think the UU, probably has the best version of christianity. But that is just my humble opinion.

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                     MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                     There is neither a best or a worst, there is just a different.  Each person must follow their heart and find their own path.
                     
                     A girl does like being agreed with though

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                        DoubleScorpionposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        I agree that there is truly no better or worse.
                        
                        It is just my opinion that the UU is the more tolerate, understanding and accepting version, I guess would be a good way to phrase it.

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               Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Hey DS, I've told some that and I was told that Jesus never said that.
               
               
               Edit: Just like "heaven" the metaphor and "hell" metaphor. They didn't like my knowledge about those two things either.

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                  DoubleScorpionposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  Yeah, I get that too. It is found in Luke 17:21 though.

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         A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         While I too would agree with you in that Melissa is not your typical Christian in the sense that she doesn't follow the Bible to a tee, but for you to criticize her perception of Christianity is so hypocritical, it defies all reason and logic because you too have used your perception of Christianity to make you feel comfortable.
         
         Let's find some proof of this hypocrisy in your next post.

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            MelissaBarrettposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            LMAO, did you just DEFEND me?  Did it hurt?
            
            (((hugs))) It gets easier, I promise. 
            
            (the above post was extremely tongue in cheek)

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               A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               In a way, I did, and it wasn't painful. Of course, I'll defend you or any other believer in light of contradiction and hypocrisy, even though both may be present on their side and yours.

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            sammygirl82posted 12 years agoin reply to this

            I give you kudos Troubled Man!! There is way too much hating going on in the Christian sector which is one reason I feel that Christians have a bad rep.

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         jacharlessposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Humans can 'believe' just about anything, because any thought in their brain can produce a string of similar thoughts, resulting in a desired conclusion. So, the lesson is not to be learned, it is to be applied/transofrm a person into understanding.
         
         If any who follow the lessons of the ANOINTING/Christ/Ruach, they understand Heaven is not a place, like the 'heaven above/beyond earth/firmament', but heaven is the STASIS of Rest/Ruach (the perfect place of being encapsulated and experiencing the power which made all things and is all things). [ for ref see Day 7/The Seventh Reality of creation in Genesis. ]
         
         Creator NEVER required obedience, worship nor praise, even before the Mosaic System. The Agreement was breached and set in place a time of Covenant. Under Covenant there were promises (blessings)/forbiddances (curses). Even after with the addition of Commands, "have no gods; make no image". From Adam to Moshe the text clearly says, it was ridiculous to think otherwise. Wrapped in Grace, there was no division and no necessity to obey, worship or praise. The Obedience was Walking With == Walk in the spirit. The worship was the sharing of true Love, the praise was rejoicing together, at all of creation.
         
         Those who claim to be of Israel are not Israel, they are Jews.
         Those who claim to be of Christ are not of Christ, they are Christians.
         
         Those who live and dwell in the Law to keep it -that is to be good in the eyes of their Maker, themselves or other men, shall be blessed because the covenant, until death. Because the Law of Obedience demands blood for sin; is accursed because of sin; is the Judge of all sin and is sin itself. If you ARE Israel; if you ARE Christ, there is no law, no choice; there is only Rest/Ruach. If you are not experiencing 100% rest/ruach, you are not IN the Spirit, you are between the Pinnacle and The Temple.
         
         James

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   Romans814posted 12 years ago

   There's no 'If Questions'; when it comes to God promise of 'Eternal Life' in Heaven in Christ Jesus.  The promises of God is 'yes' and 'amen'.  As a Christian, our mind-set is on receiving, and acting on His Will (Word); and not questioning HisTruth.

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   Romans814posted 12 years ago

   There's no 'If Questions'; when it comes to God promise of 'Eternal Life' in Heaven in Christ Jesus.  The promises of God is 'yes' and 'amen'.  As a Christian, our mind-set is on receiving, and acting on His Will (Word); and not questioning HisTruth.

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   Romans814posted 12 years ago

   There's no 'If Questions'; when it comes to God promise of 'Eternal Life' in Heaven in Christ Jesus.  The promises of God is 'yes' and 'amen'.  As a Christian, our mind-set is on receiving, and acting on His Will (Word); and not questioning HisTruth.

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      Rabgixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I'll take your answer as a no.

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   RookerySpoonerposted 12 years ago

   I think the whole point of religion is that it offers its faithful the belief in somewhere to go after their bodies have stopped functioning and turned to mush.  A religion without such a hope is pointless.  Fear of death creates the need for religion, and any religion which did not offer an afterlife would not survive for very long.

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      Rabgixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I agree. Fear of death beyond all else.

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      tlmcgaa70posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      what you say may be true, however, i believe in GOD because HE called me to HIM before I knew HIM, before I understood anything even. I died when I was 3 yrs old.  I was dead for 4 minutes. what I experienced during that time influenced who i am today as well as what i believe. i do not fear death or dying. GOD is an active participant in my life, not just a supernatural myth in some story book. I am no member of any religious organization. GOD alone IS my religion.

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         lyndreposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         What did you experiance during those four minutes?
         
         When I was 16 and an apprentice electrician I recieved an electric shock.
         
         I was told my heart had stopped and the first aid instructor had to punch it to start it again.
         
         The only thing I remember was a bruise on my chest and no buttons on my shirt.

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         A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         And, here we have the proof. You now claim you are no member of any religious organization, yet call yourself a Christian, which is a member of the religious organization called Christianity. See how that works?
         
         Not only that, you have provided one of the lamest reasons for believing in religion I've ever read.
         
         If you say you died for 4 minutes when you were 3 years old, that would mean your brain was not getting any oxygen, which means it wasn't working very well and it began firing off synaptic responses, which means you were hallucinating.
         
         To think that at 3 years old, you are going to have cognitive reasoning skills to make the determination that God was calling you is so ridiculous and far fetched it's comical.

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   earnestshubposted 12 years ago

   A god without religion? Now there is a totally new concept.
   Which god?

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      Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Hey Earnest, you know there are some people who believe in a higher power, but give it the name of god, because it's easier than just repeating the same thing over by saying that they believe in a higher power.
      
      Example: Some people define their belief in a god, as being energy being the higher power, but use the word god in their description. No religion required. It also doesn't mean that they make the claim that their god intervenes or interferes in life/living. It's just their way of saying a higher power.
      
      Just a thought.

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         earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Maybe so, Cags, but I don't think they would be on a forum with a heading like this one, flogging their religious beliefs do you?

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            Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            I'm just making a point to not jump the gun on those who use the word "god" and assume they are part and parcel of religion. That's all. And, yes I have seen some who believe in a higher power talk on the forums, using the word "god" as a representative of what they believe.

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   Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years ago

   can we ban faceless posters from the forums already?

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      Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I don't have a face on my account, would you be willing to prevent me from posting? I use a picture I like from a game I like. Your request is absurd and would end all forum participation.

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   sammygirl82posted 12 years ago

   Absolutely! In all truth, God does owe us anything, nor are we deserving of heaven. But by His grace and love, He sent His son to pay the penalty for our sins with his very life. And the sad truth is that most of us mourn Him (myself included) instead of rejoicing in the fact that we have someone who loves us more than anyone could ever possibly fathom beyond all of our faults and mistakes....

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      Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Really?
      And you say this like it's true? How would you know? Are you planning on using the bible to prove this or do you have knowledge outside any/all religious books to provide evidence?
      Really? I can honestly say that I love all of humanity, enough to die for a complete stranger....so can you explain that?

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    BobMongerposted 12 years ago

    Calling it "God's promise" is a little off the mark. It is what it is. If you believe in Him and the message His Son came to give then you get to join the party. If you don't then you don't. In your case you're probably right-once your dead that's it, you're dead; there is no eternity or hear-after for you.

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       Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       WOW!
       
       Nothing like avoiding answering a direct question.

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       Rabgixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       A simple yes or no answer would have sufficed, but kudos on avoiding it altogether.

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    RookerySpoonerposted 12 years ago

    There is already a place for Christians who don't believe in anything, it is called the Church of England.  Religion without belief might look something like the following:
    
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryWVRS4a … re=related

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       Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       WOW! That's so stupid it's funny. Then again, I don't like stupid humor. Oh well.

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    Johnjfernandoposted 12 years ago

    You have to understand that God never made a promise or any guarantees for you in life because you have to earn it the same way you have to earn someone's respect in life. I dodged death about 3 times and I think that science can go so far in the world, then comes the unknown(God). So, to your question, of course I will. If God told me that I'm denied entry to heaven its simply because I was giving too problems and not following him and his ways.

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       sammygirl82posted 12 years agoin reply to this

       John, if one had to "earn" their way to heaven, then that would throw the whole meaning of grace right out the door. And that is not to say that one should sit around and do nothing with the life that God gave to us...

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          Johnjfernandoposted 12 years agoin reply to this

          I'll agree on that..

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    awareposted 12 years ago

    rabg   . ...  i don't care for you that much. man you either. 0 hubs   is a stench .
    ray

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    Smokes Angelposted 12 years ago

    I would absolutely follow my Jesus.  I have a personal relationship with Him and my life would be empty and miserable without Him.  When all others have failed me, Jesus has lifted me up with His grace and love.  I am not a Christian because it's a religion I follow.  Religions usually try to find God by working their way to Him.  Instead, I am a Christian because God came to earth to give me His grace and love.  A Christian is not something I follow but it is who I am as a person. 
    Heaven is just a way to be with God totally and completely in the after life. I also need Him while I am struggling to cope with the world

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    davenmidtownposted 12 years ago

    well said Smokes Angel

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    Romans814posted 12 years ago

    The forum question was addressed.  Let me break it down, again.  There's no questioning God's Truth with 'IF THIS', 'IF THAT'.  Satan attempted to deceive Jesus Christ; with 'IF QUESTION'.  'IF QUESTIONS' are from the devil, and his children of disobedience.

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       Rabgixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       LOL
       
       Religion doesn't like free thinking does it?

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    Romans814posted 12 years ago

    Away with you, For it is written,
    "You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it."

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    Romans814posted 12 years ago

    Jesus is the Word; Jesus is the Truth.  Jesus said,"I am the Way, Truth and the Life.  To deny the Jesus; is to deny the absolute Truth.  All other truth; is from the pit of hell.

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       Disappearingheadposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       But there is no hell, so how could anything come from there? Your statement isn't logical.

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       paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       Jesus is only a part of the truth not the whole truth; absolute truth is the Creator God to whom Jesus used to pray in times of trouble; like Jesus prayed to whom while he was put on the Cross.

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    Romans814posted 12 years ago

    @Disappearinghead, first of all, God don't want mankind to go to hell; that's why Jesus became a sacrifice for all the sins of the world, to include your sins.
    
    I don't know you, but I know God loves you; and he allowed me to speak the 'Truth in Love'.  Don't let Satan deceive you; in thinking there's no hell.
    
    Jesus Christ is the answer; don't reject Him!!!

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