I have twice as much traffic as I did a year ago, yet half the revenue

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   davidlivermoreposted 10 years ago

   A bit of background first...
   
   I joined HP almost two years ago, did a bit of writing and then stopped for a long time.  Then went back and got into the apprenticeship program.  My hits, on average per day, were a total of 100.  I know how much I'd earn from HP per day from that to hit a certain monthly goal.
   
   Now, I am almost on the cusp of 200 total hits per day.  Yet, I noticed the money coming in is being cut in half.  I still write hubs because I enjoy it, but also because the extra cash is nice.  I earn money per hub I write, but after that is gone (or I take a break), I don't see why I should keep writing for pennies per day.
   
   I love to write, but my goal was to write consistently under the apprenticeship program and then move on to novel writing.  I now realize I earn more money in working 30 minutes of overtime at work than I can in a month on HP.
   
   Unsure if it's the whole "related searches" fiasco, or HP not giving as much money, or whatever.  But it's been an issue the last couple of weeks.
   
   Thoughts?  I don't want flamers or anything who wishes to be mean.  Meaningful, construction responses are preferred.  I've avoided the community since I haven't met too many nice people except those in my own apprenticeship group.  So it's why I'm not too active on the forums either.

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      Dale Hydeposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I have been here under two years, but I do notice the difference that you mention over last year at this time.  Not sure the reasoning, but I am sure that there will be some who know more.  I just wanted to let you know that you are not the only one that is seeing such a decline in earnings with an increase in views over a period of time.

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   2. 87

      Marisa Wrightposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I saw a discussion on a webmasters' forum about this just today.
      
      It's partly because so many people are now browsing on mobiles, tablets etc. Google charges advertisers less for mobile/tablet ads - plus the smaller screen may not show the ads to advantage.

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      1. 80

         Dale Hydeposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         I had was not aware of this, however it does make sense when you think about it.  Thanks.

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      2. 82

         Bobski606posted 10 years agoin reply to this

         I hadn't really though about this either but as technology gets smaller and smaller it really does make sense for people to be using those portable devices. It'll be interesting to see how HP takes the site given the increase in mobile and tablet usage.

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      3. 59

         helpavisitorposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         This answer just fit perfectly well. This is one of the problem and it may get worse. People spend more of their leasure time sending whattsapp vidoes and spend less time browsing the net.

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   3. 59

      wowtgpposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      As a newbie who has just embarked on the HubPages journey, these kind of threads freaks me out and I start wondering, is it  even worth it?

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      1. 82

         CMHypnoposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         If you want to make money writing online you need a long term attitude and be able to accept that there will be a lot of ups and downs.  This is not a place to make fast bucks

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         1. 59

            wowtgpposted 10 years agoin reply to this

            There is no place where you can make some money without putting some time and effort. I am all for it.

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            1. 84

               psycheskinnerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

               It is equally important to use the most efficient platforms, and know when to cut your losses and transfer to another platform.

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2. 84

   psycheskinnerposted 10 years ago

   CPM was down way before the related search issue began

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   1. 84

      TIMETRAVELER2posted 10 years agoin reply to this

      CPM has dropped significantly in the past two months or so for me.  I believe part of the problem is HP's drop in the rankings.  Advertisers are not going to pay more to put ads on articles that belong to a site that has been downgraded.  I believe this will change with time and do think HP is making a slow recovery.  The other issue, as mentioned above, is the fact that people are using smaller devices to search for info, etc.  This is a BIG problem for HP since they insist we need to write long hubs.  Long hubs will not work on small devices, for the same reasons ads do not work.  Hang on for a rough ride, folks!

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3. 87

   Marisa Wrightposted 10 years ago

   This thread is relevant (thanks paradigmsearch)
   http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/114962

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4. 79

   LeanManposted 10 years ago

   You seem to have two issues;
   
   Firstly as the posters above have already told you the amount paid by advertisers is reducing so the amount you get will reduce also, either due to market conditions or due to different medium being used hence the reduction in earnings that we are all seeing. This is not HP reducing what they are paying you and being more greedy! HP are suffering also and the only winners here really are Google!!
   
   The second issue seems to be that you are questioning the worth of writing online at all and comparing it to doing half an hour of overtime. you seem to forget that you will only get paid that half hours overtime the once, while your online earnings have the potential to be paid out month after month. However to be worthwhile you need to target areas (Titles and subjects) that are getting large numbers of searches and have little competition so that you can get traffic.
   Writing in subjects that are not searched or using obscure titles will not result in masses of traffic, you cannot force people to search for your hubs; your hubs need to answer a question that is being searched for if you want traffic. But they also have to be in an area in which competition is minimal or the likelihood is that established pages and dedicated sites will get the bulk of the traffic.
   
   No writer is entitled to earnings just because they have written well and spent a large amount of time on their hubs - if you cannot master the ideas behind SEO then you will never make good money. The better writers on here that understand about basic SEO appear to make in the region of $1 per hub each month, some make much more. This may not seem like a huge amount but if you create just 2 hubs each week for a year that can soon be an income of $100 each month, month after month. Keep doing that for a few years and I am sure you will be much happier..
   
   Like anything, the more you put into online writing the more you get back, even with the many setbacks visited on us by google. Some of us earn our livings solely through what we do online but it is still a full time job and has to be treated as such. The days of being able to easily make millions online are long gone unless you are Google!

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   1. 87

      Marisa Wrightposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      You make a lot of good points here, which would have been 100% correct a couple of years ago.
      
      I'm not so convinced it's accurate now.  I believe that these days, passive income is dead.
      
      I've done well online.  Most of my Hubs (and my main blog) have been live for four or five years, and even the worst have paid me more than if I'd sold them outright.   However, ever since Panda 2011, it hasn't been truly passive income - because there are always actions to be taken for various reasons:
      
      - to make changes to suit new HubPages' rules;
      - to research to keep abreast of Google updates and new requirements;
      - to make changes to address those;
      - to add fresh content (either by revising existing or adding new) to satisfy Google's "freshness' criteria;
      - to fix broken links;
      - to moderate comments;
      - to raise my profile online and promote my Hubs/blogs
      
      and now, to check whether Hubs are still Featured and address the situation if not.  On my blogs, (which are Wordpress), there is also the regular updating of the software, themes and plugins.
      
      A few years ago, you could say, "work hard for two years on your blogs/online writing and you can then cut back to a few hours a week and earn a good living".   Not so now, because the constantly changing online landscape means you can never sit back and relax.   Making a living online is now a full-time job like any other - and the hourly rate is often pathetic.
      
      It's so easy to lose track of time on the internet, it's easy to overlook how much time you're spending on online work.   Try keeping a log and then try translating that into an hourly rate of pay - you may be shocked!
      
      I've gone back to "real world" work for exactly that reason - even now, when my blogs and Hubs are established, I'm not getting a reasonable return for my effort online.  I can make a better hourly rate working as a lowly office clerk - and I only have to do that for a few hours a week, to earn more than I can earn online working every day.  My blogs are now just a hobby.

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         Jennifer Sucheyposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         Okay, that's just depressing. And usually you're my voice of hope and inspiration. Sighhhh ....

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         1. 87

            Marisa Wrightposted 10 years agoin reply to this

            Oops sorry!   I do know people who make a living online.  I'm just sayin', don't ever expect it to be a "lazy" way of earning a living.   There is a big learning curve in the first year or two, so it's like working full-time and going to university at the same time. After you've done the major study, you can sit back a bit - but it's still a full-time job.  The advantage is that you're your own boss, you can set your own hours and you can work from home.  If that is important to you, then it's worth sticking with it.

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               Jennifer Sucheyposted 10 years agoin reply to this

               Okay then. Thanks Marissa.

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      2. 93

         davidlivermoreposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         I've done all of this, quite religiously, and only seen my earnings go down.
         
         I've actually washed my hands of HP.  The small, passive amount of income will be nice.  But I have other things I want to write, which won't be as time consuming and are geared more towards my passion.
         
         Still, good points as that is what is needed to be successful, I think.

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            sabrebIadeposted 10 years agoin reply to this

            I know this is beating a dead horse but EVERY notice I get in Google Scorecard about Recommended ad formats is related to HubPages.
            I know that despite what they think, Adsense is not always right about the best ad sizes because I have been working with Adsense for six years and I know they are wrong a lot of times.
            But when you have a steady CTR of 0.91%, something needs to be addressed.

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   Jennifer Sucheyposted 10 years ago

   I was just wondering how "views" and AdSense worked on mobile devices the other day when I read a hub on my phone avid noted there were no ads at all. So I guess it counts as a view but no impressions in that case.

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6. 90

   Nell Roseposted 10 years ago

   I agree about the mobiles or cell phones being used much more these days, but I do think a lot of lost money is caused by the fact that ever since Hubpages have stopped adding the Adverts straight away we have lost a hell of a lot. The first 'flush' of publishing can bring in a lot of revenue. Especially if we Twitter or Facebook the new Hub. Who wants to read it twice just because we have to wait for Ads? And yes you can say, well, don't twitter or facebook it until you get ads, but I still think a new article is more interesting than one that has been hanging around a couple of days for ads. Just my opinion. If we want to earn more, or at least get back what we used to earn, we need our ads back straight away.

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   1. 72

      Barbara Kayposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I let it hang until the ads are added. I want that to happen fast too, so someone doesn't copy it before it is approved. I agree with you. Let the ads be added right away.

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      1. 71

         galleryofgraceposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         It's best not to respond to posts that are over a year old. It will confuse the squido converts terribly.
         Just a suggestion, thanks

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