HP Management What is the current "share" percentage for Authors on HP

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  1. Solaras profile image81
    Solarasposted 2 years ago

    I have tried, unsuccessfully to find the current terms of service for HP or TAG.

    That last forum post, written by Robin E. 2 years ago, generously provided 3 links to the Terms of Service and Rules, but those links have now been redirected to The Arena Group, "Where The Action Is" landing page.  No where can I find a link to our agreement.

    So, what is our percentage of the Ad revenue? Is that after "expenses?"  If it is after expenses, what percentage of total revenue do these expenses amount to?

    The Terms of Use say all content belongs to TAG.  Does that include our content?  Do we still own our work? What about the images editors have replaced our original images with?

    Thank you in advance for answering these very basic and essential questions.

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    1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
      Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

      All these questions are fundamental and functional to writers at hubpages.                                       Thanks for putting them up.

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    2. Thelma Alberts profile image83
      Thelma Albertsposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      I hope we will get answers from your questions. I want clarification, too.

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  2. Jodah profile image85
    Jodahposted 2 years ago

    Very interested to see if this query receives a response.

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    1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
      Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

      It must receive a response.                                        Matt, or other hubpages staff must chirp in.

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  3. Ben716 profile image79
    Ben716posted 2 years ago

    10 years ago the ratio was 60:40. I'm not sure whether the ratio still holds to date. Back then revenue-sharing sites offered an author-publisher ratio based on Google placed Ads on one's articles.

    The articles aren't exclusively owned by Arena. If it was the case, majority of writers wouldn't write for Hubpages, and the payment would have to be higher than the one earned through a revenue-sharing site. Unless the table has changed...

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    1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
      Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

      Very curious indeed, and wondering.

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  4. eugbug profile image67
    eugbugposted 2 years ago

    Impressions are again way down for Thursday compared to views. Either this is a stats anomaly which sometimes shows impressions half of what they are until they update after a day or two or there's a continued drop in the impressions/stats ratio. There's no asterisk beside the revenue figure, so it seems the value for earnings is final. Again I'm wondering is there a reversion to the previous setup where our ads are shown a percentage of the time and Hubpages are shown the rest of the time? However it's more like a 50% of the time ratio now, instead of 60%.

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    1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
      Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

      Who knows?

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  5. Solaras profile image81
    Solarasposted 2 years ago

    This is a fundamental question that should be easily and immediately answerable.

    It is disturbing not have been given a link to the current terms of service.

    Please post a link to whatever it is new authors sign when joining the hubpages community as a new author.

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    1. janshares profile image86
      jansharesposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      I agree, Solaras. So strange that it's been more than a day since your post without a reply. \_O_/ It's also strange that it's not written anywhere that's easy to access. The best I could find was an HP article from 2020 which states it's still 60/40. The Learning Center was like trying to find a needle in a haystack. It shouldn't have been that hard to research or to just get a straight answer.

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    2. AliciaC profile image94
      AliciaCposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      I agree, Solaras and Jan. It’s a strange way to run a business. They say they’ll pay us for our writing, but they won’t say how they calculate the payment. That may be okay for new writers, but not for many who started writing here under the old agreement.

      The site needs to clearly state how we earn from our work with specific details. Yes, if the information that's shared is bad news it may stop some people from writing here or cause them to delete their account, but it’s the ethical thing to do.

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  6. eugbug profile image67
    eugbugposted 2 years ago

    I presume the reason the 60/40 clause was removed was so that the share we get can be varied to pay the bills to run the site.

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    1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
      Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

      That's not realistic. Hubpages should specific the rate of making the payouts.

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  7. alexadry profile image93
    alexadryposted 2 years ago

    The lack of clarity on this subject is very concerning. I always assumed things remained the same as the original agreement.

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    1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
      Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

      Not with marven, hubpages' husband.

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      1. Misbah786 profile image76
        Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

        "Not with marven, hubpages' husband."
        Can you please elaborate mad I am also interested in knowing about "marven" roll cool

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        1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
          Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Deleted

          1. Misbah786 profile image76
            Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

            "You this moslem lady from Pakistan, how dare you!"

            Please excuse me! You have no right to bring up my religion or nationality in this matter. By the way to be honest I think it isn't a typo. You do this with everyone's name.

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            1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
              Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

              To be specific, no, a firm no. It's not even intentional.                                      Let me recall with your name, right?                                Mizbah? D'you think I intentional did that sometime last year? And you of course, like it. And last month. Misbah? Ah! And, I though the 's' was a ...oh how does it come I began to think again until I realize my mistake.                                               'You this moslem lady from Pakistan'. Mizbah,(don't you like it again?) Are you not proud of your faith and country? It was descrptive statement, not hate speech.                                   In the part of my country that I come from, the though is that you're a strong woman for putting me into a chakenge(challenge). I'm afraid of you. But forgive  me.

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              1. Misbah786 profile image76
                Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                I am very proud of both my religion and my country.... but I believe there was no need to bring faith and nationality into this discussion. You have nothing to be afraid of, Miebakagh. Just be careful next time... !!
                Peace!!

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      2. Kenna McHugh profile image82
        Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        I agree!

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      3. Solaras profile image81
        Solarasposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        Yes, as is the fact that someone went to the trouble of redirecting the links from Robin E.'s 2020 Forum post, telling us where to find the new TOS, to the splash page for TAG Partners.

        Why not redirect to the new TOS? Why not tell us what our percentage is and what expenses are being paid before the split is made.

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        1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
          Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

          That would have solve the problem easily.

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        2. Miebakagh57 profile image84
          Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Good thoughs and talk.

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    2. Misbah786 profile image76
      Misbah786posted 2 years ago

      Very interesting. I'm hoping for a quick response to this query. It's strange that no one from HP has responded to this thread yet. smile

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      1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
        Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

        Soon, soon, Matt, will. I think he's doing some studies under the situation...when Hubpages came under maven and TAG                                                     Critically, HubPages is not the same when she came under these two business ventures. Matt is will have a hard time.

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        1. AliciaC profile image94
          AliciaCposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Sorry, Miebakagh, I disagree. We have no idea whether anyone is working on the situation, since we're not being told anything. The management team may think that the current situation is fine and that there is no problem to solve.

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      2. Solaras profile image81
        Solarasposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        Don't hold your breath.

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        1. Misbah786 profile image76
          Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Let's hope for the best smile

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    3. Solaras profile image81
      Solarasposted 2 years ago

      Here is a little exercise.  Feel free to tell me where my numbers are off.

      If I assume 25% of my pageviews are the number of readers who make it to 3/4 of the way through my article:

      The percentage of US Internet users using ad blocker software is 27% (mostly readers from the 16-24 year old age group so this percentage may vary by topic.  Geriatric topics would have a lower percentage, youth related topics would be higher).

      And I assume they have seen 7 ads on their way to the 3/4 point in the article, then the following formula should represent total impressions.

      Pageviews X .25 (those who get 3/4 of the way through the article) X 7 (number of impressions they saw) X .63 (those without ad blocker software) (X=multiply).

      Take that number and multiply it by .60 (60 percent which should be your share of impressions).

      What does that figure look like to you? Mine looks more like I am receiving 40% of the impressions using a very conservative formula.

      What if 30% of readers make it 3/4 of the way through the article? Then my final number of reported impressions is closer to the 34% mentioned in their proud press release.

      I am very interested to see if anyone else has similar results.

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    4. Kenna McHugh profile image82
      Kenna McHughposted 2 years ago

      I agree! We can check it out via legal representation. I'd hate to that happen because nobody wins. I hope HP chimes in!!!!

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    5. Solaras profile image81
      Solarasposted 2 years ago

      It seems we are not deserving of an answer.  Such a simple question, how are we to be paid. What is the formula?  What is our current agreement? 

      Not answering this simple question is sending new articles to other platforms. Those who comment are a small portion of those who  lurk on the forums.

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      1. Misbah786 profile image76
        Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

        There are too many forum posts created daily under different topics. Maybe someone can send an email to the team to bring this query to their attention. There's a chance that the HP Management team hasn't noticed it yet. smile

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    6. psycheskinner profile image67
      psycheskinnerposted 2 years ago

      We used to see 1 or 2 Hubstaff on here keeping track of things.  Not so much for the last few years.

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      1. Solaras profile image81
        Solarasposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        Matt Wells responded to the "No Ads" thread on Monday. So they are aware of the forum posts.

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    7. Solaras profile image81
      Solarasposted 2 years ago

      So I had a mini-viral moment where pageviews were up total 66% but sadly earnings only increased by 11%.  Seems peculiar.

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      1. DrMark1961 profile image99
        DrMark1961posted 2 years agoin reply to this

        I asked a question of Rupert the other day (he had increased views from a news article) and he stated that his earnings were improved. My earnings from the news articles does not match the improvement in page views, so I think it is like social media views, which are brief and maybe the ads dont even load. Not sure, but disappointing as the earnings do not match the views.
        I do not have the exact numbers like you but have noticed a trend.

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        1. PaulGoodman67 profile image69
          PaulGoodman67posted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Yeah, often I get a surge but the earnings don't go up much. I think that it depends on numerous factors, the value of the keywords to advertisers, and where the article's being viewed from, being two of them.

          It's kind of annoying.I'm not as excited by surges as some (I'd rather have something more long-term, even if more modest), but it would be nice to get a few extra bucks now and then.

          There are exceptions, where I seem to have made some money from a surge, but that's not typical.

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    8. AdeleCosgroveBray profile image93
      AdeleCosgroveBrayposted 2 years ago

      I, too, would like to see a reply from staff in order to address the issues around low income from this site. For me, the last two months here have been very low, to the point where I'm only just scraping the pay-out threshold. My income hasn't been this low since I first began publishing here 12 years ago! This site used to be a worthwhile source in income which I had recommended to others for that reason, but I would not recommend it as things stand.

      The articles now look like clickbait, plastered in irrelevant adverts. So many writers here have pointed this out already, yet we've been ignored.

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      1. Kenna McHugh profile image82
        Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        I hear you!

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    9. eugbug profile image67
      eugbugposted 2 years ago

      Hubpages possibly aren't at liberty to discuss it with us because TAG won't allow them.

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      1. AdeleCosgroveBray profile image93
        AdeleCosgroveBrayposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        Where did you find this information?

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        1. eugbug profile image67
          eugbugposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          It's not facts, just speculation. If we don't know the answers, it's natural that we think all sorts of things.

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    10. Miebakagh57 profile image84
      Miebakagh57posted 2 years ago

      That hubpages has still not respond to the question seems odd.

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    11. Sue Adams profile image68
      Sue Adamsposted 2 years ago

      I found this: HubPages Network Terms of User
      https://hubpages.com/help/user-agreement-2019-10-02

      Read section 9
      9. EARNING MONEY THROUGH HUBPAGES...with specific reference to
      HubPages Ad Program:

      "Your Earning Page View share will be selected based on a 60% chance of generating earnings for the author. Your earnings will be based on a formula selected by HubPages, in its sole discretion, which formula HubPages may change at any time for Your account."

      The question is:
      Do writers get a share of the income from the numerous "sponsored ads", the so-called "advertorials" below our articles?

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      1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
        Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

        I'm wondering as that beats my mind.

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      2. eugbug profile image67
        eugbugposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        The last update to that was 2019 though (Before the TAG takeover?) and the question is whether it's still applies. The TOS webpage linked to at the end of every Hubpages page doesn't mention anything about 60%.

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      3. Solaras profile image81
        Solarasposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        I'd like to know that as well as what is the current "formula selected by Hubpages"

        Why can no one answer this simple question?

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        1. eugbug profile image67
          eugbugposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Maybe because there aren't Hubpages staff anymore and everything is centralised and my Marie Celeste theory is correct. So Matt just works in the engine room, keeping the site ticking over. TAG don't answer any questions, at least not on social media and have told us to send our queries to Hubpages.

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        2. Miebakagh57 profile image84
          Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

          D' you the mean any author here or staff of team.hubpages.com/? Wondering.

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    12. Sue Adams profile image68
      Sue Adamsposted 2 years ago

      Old Agreement
      https://hubpages.com/help/user-agreement-2019-10-02

      HubPages Ad Program.
      "Your Earning Page View share will be selected based on a 60% chance of generating earnings for the author."

      "If HubPages changes any significant terms of the Affiliate IDs program and/or HubPages Earnings Program, HubPages will notify You by email, if reasonably practicable, at least two weeks before any such change occurs."

      Did anyone receive such an email?

      New Agreement
      https://thearenagroup.net/author-submis … -addendum/

      "6. Payments to Authors
           4.Your Earned Balance shall be calculated and based on records generated and/or maintained by TAG (The Arena Group)."

      You are correct Eugene
      It doesn't say anywhere what percentage of ad revenue is the author's share.

      One way to find out when our 60% share went out the window is to examine our Balance History. In my case, I stopped reaching the required monthly $50 balance in July 2019.

      What about other folks?

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      1. chef-de-jour profile image76
        chef-de-jourposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        The bottom line as far as I'm concerned is the lack of communication when changes to revenue sharing occur. We as writers need to be informed. It's unethical to leave us in the dark. Fair enough if belts have to be tightened, just let us know!!

        I can understand any normal business having to cut costs when times are hard. All businesses have to evolve to survive. But HP is special because it works through mutual cooperation between writers and staff -  longevity is proof that most of the time this has been a positive arrangement.
        What's clear is that TAG have altered the small print regarding revenue sharing and somehow deemed it necessary to stop this essential communication from HP staff to the writers. Come on, we're all grown up, tell us when radical change occurs!

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      2. Isivwe Muobo profile image79
        Isivwe Muoboposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        I agree.

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    13. profile image0
      Beth Eaglescliffeposted 2 years ago

      Sue, thanks for posting the link to the new agreement-addendum.  https://thearenagroup.net/author-submis … -addendum/ I found it very informative; albeit in a negative way!

      Deep in the small print it contains the answer to the question about what percentage we authors are paid.

      Under EARNINGS PROGRAM it says " The formulas used to determine participants’ earnings may not be the same across all Earnings Accounts that participate in the Ad Program."
      i.e there is no longer a set rate for all writers. TAG varies the rate depending upon how valuable they feel an individual's contribution is.

      Under MODIFYING THIS ADDENDUM it says "We may make changes to this Addendum from time to time. If we make material changes, we will provide you with notice of such changes, such as by sending an email, providing a notice through our Platform or updating the date at the top of this Addendum."
      i.e They don't need to send an email to inform us of changes, posting the Addendum on TAG's website is sufficient.

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      1. Solaras profile image81
        Solarasposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        I would not call that "the answer to what percentage we authors are paid," instead it is a further wrinkle to the question. However, that is the answer to why no one will ever answer the question.  Some animals are more equal than others.

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      2. chef-de-jour profile image76
        chef-de-jourposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        Annoying to think they can change things and not inform writers upfront and plain. It's like we're not even an afterthought.

        Still, underneath all this is the idea that the awful ads placement issue is costing them and us earnings! I just don't get it.

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    14. daydreams profile image74
      daydreamsposted 2 years ago

      I agree with this. The lack of transparency is unethical.

      This puts me off publishing anything further via Hubpages. I'm happy to collect my current earnings but investing more time here seems risky.

      How can Hubpages expect people to want to contribute good quality content if they are effectively saying we can change what we give you at any time?

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    15. Sue Adams profile image68
      Sue Adamsposted 2 years ago

      Hello all,

      In answer to the 2 questions:

      a) Do we still get 60% of ad revenue?
      b) Do writers get a share of the income from the numerous "sponsored ads", the so-called "advertorials" below our articles?

      I just received this email from Matt:
      Hello,

      We cannot share any more details than are supplied in the Terms of Use and the FAQ.
      Writers do earn a share of sponsored ads below articles.

      https://thearenagroup.net/terms-of-use/
      https://hubpages.com/faq/#royalties

      Periodically we receive inquiries from the author community regarding the specifics of our HubPages revenue share formulas. While the company does make public filings with certain summary partner revenue data across all of its lines of business in aggregate, the company does not publish specific data for HubPages.

      Thanks,
      Matt
      Team HubPages

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      1. Solaras profile image81
        Solarasposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        Just - WOW.

        Thanks for sharing this response.

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      2. Kenna McHugh profile image82
        Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        For some reason, this makes me feel sad. Is it because HP is not transparent, or am I not getting it. Am I just lost in the mumbo-jumbo of legalese?

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        1. thooghun profile image97
          thooghunposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Obligatory "I'm not a lawyer", but the Terms seem to indicate that all submitted content, from our artwork to our text, is owned in its entirety by TAG.

          I distinctly seem to recall the Hubpages FAQ stating that we owned the rights to our work. It was the primary reason I settled here back in the day.

          I'm probably not getting it either.

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          1. Kenna McHugh profile image82
            Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

            What you read is correct. Based on your comment, I suspect the FAQ discounts the TAG. I am probably not getting it right either. That's why it's sad.

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          2. Sue Adams profile image68
            Sue Adamsposted 2 years agoin reply to this

            Regarding copyright, the 2 documents supplied by Matt seem to contradict each other.

            HubPages FAQ
            "21. Who owns the content that I post on HubPages?
            The content is entirely yours. We simply provide the technology to support it."

            TAG (The Arena Group) Terms of Use
            "6. OWNERSHIP
            The Platform, including all content contained therein, including Partner Content and Submitted Content, text, graphics, images, photographs, audio, videos, illustrations, themes, objects, stories, concepts, artwork, and other content contained therein, are owned by TAG or our licensors and are protected under both United States and foreign laws. Except as explicitly stated in these Terms, all rights in and to the Platform are reserved by us or our licensors."

            So are HubPages authors "licensors"?

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            1. Solaras profile image81
              Solarasposted 2 years agoin reply to this

              I think the "licensors" are those that own the rights to entities such as Sports Illustrated, and give them the right to publish under their name. They have licensed the name to TAG under a lease.

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            2. chef-de-jour profile image76
              chef-de-jourposted 2 years agoin reply to this

              Thank you. Yes, it's all got a bit murky with TAG takeover. You'd need a lawyer to properly interpret the details of the Terms of Use but I take it the fundamental copyright still remains with the original author, the creator, and that cannot be taken away unless that author signs and agrees a transfer of work?

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              1. eugbug profile image67
                eugbugposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                It reminds me of "V". We'll just have to watch out for the skin splitting.

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                1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                  Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  That makes much sense. But a High Court Judges' interpretation can settle the challenge much better.                                       Nevertheless,, copyright of any original content belongs to authors. When plagiarists stole our articles, who file the  DMCA? The authors. Not TAG and Hubpages. Not even the laters on behave of the writters.                                        Critically, its seens that the owner of contents under the 2 terms provide by Matt are clearly in conflict, and not in tandem. So, we writers own our contents: text, photos, images, and videos.

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                  1. Kenna McHugh profile image82
                    Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    Yes!

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                    1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                      Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      Kenna, you're welcome.

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              2. theraggededge profile image76
                theraggededgeposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                I can see that the two aren't mutually exclusive. We do own the rights to our work. We can remove it whenever we want to.

                However, while the text, photos, etc are 'living' on the TAG platform, it's all theirs. It's not copyright, but ownership of the digital material.

                At least, that's how it appears to me.

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                1. janshares profile image86
                  jansharesposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  +1

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                2. Kenna McHugh profile image82
                  Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  Bev,
                  I reviewed the TAG and FAQ. I agree with your take on it.

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                3. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                  Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  Bev, so when we remove the 'live' materia from they websites, it become entirely ours? While its still live we own the copyright. Don't you think so? Thanks.

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                  1. theraggededge profile image76
                    theraggededgeposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    It's always entirely yours. You always own the copyright.

                    HubPages owns the displayed content, but they can't prevent you from removing it.

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                    1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                      Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      Now, very clear to me. Thanks.

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                    2. thooghun profile image97
                      thooghunposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      Thanks for the clarification.

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                4. profile image0
                  TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  GDPR Deleted

                  1. hclpd profile image83
                    hclpdposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    I've never understood the allure of a site like Quora. Why invest time in witting for free when you can get paid for it?

                    On top of that, Quora continues to invite and welcome drivel with each passing day. Yes, there is the promise of exposure, brand-building, and what have you, but you can accomplish all that and get paid for your work at the same time.

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                    1. DrMark1961 profile image99
                      DrMark1961posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      I used to write on Quora, mainly providing short answers to people that had pets in need of help. I stopped many years ago though because they instituted a program to pay people to ask questions and the site become filled with fake questions. (They did not pay the writers, only the people that made up the fake questions.)
                      It lost its allure after that.

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                  2. Misbah786 profile image76
                    Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    It's funny that you were promoting Quora only a few months ago.

                    https://hubpages.com/community/forum/35 … ay-writers

                    Did you pay the $50 annual fee to Quora? You mentioned that they wanted to use your work without paying you, but you were still interested to pay the annual fee at that time but now you don’t like it anymore. I am wondering …. Why?

                    https://hubpages.com/forum/post/4198434

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                    1. Kenna McHugh profile image82
                      Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      Misbah, Thanks for taking the time to check and ask.

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                      1. Misbah786 profile image76
                        Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                        You are welcome, Kenna smile

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                    2. profile image0
                      TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      GDPR Deleted

                      1. Misbah786 profile image76
                        Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                        Tess, I wish you the best of luck. I trust you are a good writer, and one must go with the flow  smile

                        I've read your story on medium.

                        But my question was (if you don't mind me asking again):

                        Did you pay the $50 annual fee to Quora? You mentioned that they wanted to use your work without paying you, but you were still interested to pay the annual fee at that time but now you don’t like it anymore. I am wondering …. Why?

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            3. profile image0
              TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

              GDPR Deleted

              1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                Heavens forbidden that I land on a site as Quora.

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                1. profile image0
                  TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  GDPR Deleted

                  1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                    Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    Tessa? So you're saying or rather affirming that the owners of Hubpages are also the owners of Quora? I need a clear clarification. Thanks.

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                    1. profile image0
                      TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      GDPR Deleted

                      1. Ben716 profile image79
                        Ben716posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                        I am remember the Associated Content before it was bought by Yahoo, and became limited to U.S. writers only. Used to be before the limitation was put in place.
                        It's interesting to note the owner of TAG was once a CEO of Yahoo which explains well your point.

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                      2. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                        Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                        Tessa, I got it now. Many thanks.

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        2. Isivwe Muobo profile image79
          Isivwe Muoboposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          This is sad. This means Hubpages could decide to pay writers 20% if they desire and you would have to accept that.

          Knowing what you stand to earn from views is always a motivation. It's like publishing books on Amazon KDP, knowing you get 70% every time your book sells.

          That kind of transparency is what motivates you to do more.

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          1. AliciaC profile image94
            AliciaCposted 2 years agoin reply to this

            The point that you’ve raised in your second sentence worries me as well. The situation is certainly sad.

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          2. Miebakagh57 profile image84
            Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

            Sure!

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      3. Sue Adams profile image68
        Sue Adamsposted 2 years ago

        Thanks, Bev, that makes (some) sense to me. So maybe we don't need to worry about TAG "ownership" and copyright.

        The bigger, and the most disappointing issue is the enormous decline in earnings due to the disappearance of our previously secure 60% share of the revenue. Plus the fact that we were never informed of such a major change.

        https://hubstatic.com/16045329.png

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        1. theraggededge profile image76
          theraggededgeposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Yep. It's demoralizing in the extreme. At least there are other places smile

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          1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
            Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

            'At least there are other places.'                                      You're infering websites like Medium? And blogs/blogspot?

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        2. Miebakagh57 profile image84
          Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

          The damages done to our intelligence and emotions, sub rosa are enormous.                                        It's an online world. Hubpages' knows well that it can get away easily with it. That's how  I see it.                                                  Any person left, right, and center is weicome to correct me. Thanks.

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      4. Jodah profile image85
        Jodahposted 2 years ago

        Now that we have, at last, received feedback from HubPages staff (Matt) on this issue, why do I feel even more ill at ease than before?

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        1. Kenna McHugh profile image82
          Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Why?

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        2. Misbah786 profile image76
          Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

          "You can be in the storm, but don’t let the storm get in you.” – Joel Osteen smile

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          1. Kenna McHugh profile image82
            Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

            1+

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        3. Brenda Arledge profile image81
          Brenda Arledgeposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          Me too

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      5. eugbug profile image67
        eugbugposted 2 years ago

        One of the goals was to "help elevate your earnings potential"

        Was that achieved? Without stats, can't differentiate between any increase in earnings and reduction in revenue due to other factors.

        https://hubpages.com/community/forum/34 … rms-of-use

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      6. Sue Adams profile image68
        Sue Adamsposted 2 years ago

        Here is an interesting observation.

        TAG Homepage on 3rd January 2022 via Wayback Machine
        https://hubstatic.com/16048293.png

        TAG Homepage today 25th June 2022
        https://hubstatic.com/16048294.png

        https://thearenagroup.net/

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        1. SerenityHalo profile image84
          SerenityHaloposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          I wish someone who actually wanted HubPages to succeed would buy it.

          replyreport
          1. eugbug profile image67
            eugbugposted 2 years agoin reply to this

            If it's unprofitable, they may be reluctant, but maybe that could be changed by someone with insight. However that could involve rationalisation and cutting our earnings further.

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            1. SerenityHalo profile image84
              SerenityHaloposted 2 years agoin reply to this

              I'll hope for someone that actually cares for the writers. Whether TAG finally starts to switch gears (seems unlikely at this point) or a new owner who straightens things out.

              Media companies do change ownership often, which sometimes can be favorable and sometimes worse.

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              1. profile image0
                TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                GDPR Deleted

                1. SerenityHalo profile image84
                  SerenityHaloposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  On the one hand, you're right. You do have to be a little crazy to want to go into writing as a career.

                  On the other hand, let's not pigeonhole writing as a whole. Albeit going into freelance writing or something like this will likely not turn into decent income for most people (as in a full-time salary, not millions) there are a lot of writing jobs that do pay well and are stable.

                  I take it most people that are on HP are looking for passive income to back up their day job.

                  One of the best writing tracks for stability and income is technical writing. Businesses will always be hiring for this, and you can make $70,000+ a year. It's not the hardest thing to switch to career-wise either. You can get a technical writing certificate, or if you have a decent portfolio, you might be able to land yourself one of these jobs. For those of you who love working from home, structure, and getting into fine details... technical writing could be the right fit.

                  Is technical writing pretty dry? Yes! It's essentially the equivalent of accounting in writing form.

                  There is also teaching, editing, journalism, television and filmmaking, and law. Writing is a great skill to have in your pocket to open doors. It can make going through higher education a lot easier. You have to write and read a lot for grad and doctorate programs, so if you already are an ace at writing... things will work more in your favor.

                  You might not necessarily land a great publishing deal, but if you apply yourself right you can definitely earn a living.

                  The worst thing a good writer can do is pigeonhole themselves. There are a lot of opportunities out there, and sometimes... you have to invent your own opportunities.

                  Honestly, what separates the bad writers from the ones who can actually make a living through writing is simply effort. If you want to earn money, keep writing, learning, and applying yourself. If it's not the right fit for you, follow a passion where things seem to work in your favor.

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                  1. Kenna McHugh profile image82
                    Kenna McHughposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    Very true!!

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                  2. Misbah786 profile image76
                    Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    +1

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                  3. profile image0
                    TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    GDPR Deleted

                    1. SerenityHalo profile image84
                      SerenityHaloposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      I'm not sure where we're getting 84% of people want to be writers, or what that means in relation to what kind of writers they want to be. The only thing that comes up when I Google that is your own work. I doubt 84% of people want to be the next Stephen King and actually believe they will be. I assume they also want to win the lottery and don't expect it will actually happen. (Sure, some people do, and they buy lottery tickets daily.)

                      I don't think everyone is meant to be a writer nor will get very far if they pursue it as a profession. If you're not putting effort into it, then you're not going to see any results or any development. I think the wisest course is to follow and develop your top talents and nurture that into a career.

                      I used to teach college-level writing courses, and for the most part, people who would come to class, do the work, and put in the effort would grow their skills and become better at writing. There were generally 1-2 students per semester who were lost causes... they simply wouldn't put in the effort, not turn in assignments, wouldn't show up to class, and if they did turn something in it would have no paragraphs or punctuation. Wild stuff, but those students were outliers. By in large, I found writing was suffering because students had bad teachers growing up. Once they were placed in a room with proper instruction, they'd grow.

                      Technical writing isn't for everyone. Some people need creativity and absurdity. The thing is, there will always be technical writing jobs just as there will always be accounting jobs. If you know you have a good writing background, did well in writing in school, and the likes, then you can more than likely get the right materials together to apply for something like this. It's not the hardest thing in the world to get a technical writing certificate. You may need to apply to 100 places to finally get a job, but that's the reality for any job worth your time anymore. There are companies everywhere with technical writing jobs, and they come with benefits. New jobs are posted daily. Yes, you'll have better odds with a college degree.

                      It may be a competitive industry where you have to apply against a large pool of people, but more than likely if you've been getting the right training, taking the right classes, and building a portfolio you will stand out from the crowd. Because yeah, a lot of people aren't putting in that kind of effort and are pipe-dreaming. Tess, you're right that people are pipe-dreaming, absolutely right... but some people here in the forums are making writing their career, or they're about to make that switch.

                      ***You can take advantage of free library resources to learn how to become a better writer. Don't limit yourself to expensive college classes. And do look out for scammy master classes online.

                      I'm writing all this to say that freelance writing, submitting to magazines, working on publications like HP aren't the only methods to use to make an income with writing. I think what you're writing about is more about online writing, which I know you know is only one avenue. I think people here on HP need to know there are other options. There are a lot of people here who are strong writers and aren't at the bottom of the barrel.

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                      1. profile image0
                        TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                        GDPR Deleted

                    2. SerenityHalo profile image84
                      SerenityHaloposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      Also, I enjoy your comments and contributions. There are many valid and wonderful things you have to offer here. I have a tendency to overwrite.

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                    3. tsmog profile image83
                      tsmogposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      Thanks for the contribution. As an old guy living in these times writing definitely provides opportunity such as the tehnical avenue. I may fit that bill and will look into it! I seek only supplemental income, working fom home, my hours, honest work, and fair pay.

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                    4. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                      Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                      Sound advice that makes much sense. You're welcome.

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              2. profile image0
                TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                GDPR Deleted

                1. janshares profile image86
                  jansharesposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  Thanks for the useful info, Tess. I appreciate the reality check about writing not being a lucrative career for most writers.

                  replyreport
          2. Jodah profile image85
            Jodahposted 2 years ago

            Good points, Misbah. I'd like to know also.

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            1. Misbah786 profile image76
              Misbah786posted 2 years agoin reply to this

              Thank you, John smile

              replyreport
          3. Miebakagh57 profile image84
            Miebakagh57posted 2 years ago

            What is Matt? What did he said? Where? In this ever trending forum? Did you talk with him on the phone, or email him?                                           Seriously and critically, I've to scroll twice 7 of 7 pages to get to what Matt said, and I found none. It seems to me that he is yet to make his presence felt here. Good day everyone.

            replyreport
            1. profile image0
              TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

              GDPR Deleted

              1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                Tessa? Thanks. I know  Matt, is a staff on hubpages. But if I could not see and read what he post, I've got to ask, right? Thanks again for the input.

                replyreport
          4. Solaras profile image81
            Solarasposted 2 years ago

            My HP payment via Paypal informs me that I have received funds from The Arena Platform, Inc. Is that new? Have they done away with TAG and now it's TAP?

            replyreport
            1. eugbug profile image67
              eugbugposted 2 years agoin reply to this

              I noticed that too. It's been the Arena Platform since the end of February payment (which was delayed to the start of March)

              replyreport
            2. profile image0
              TessSchlesingerposted 2 years agoin reply to this

              GDPR Deleted

              1. Miebakagh57 profile image84
                Miebakagh57posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                Thank you, Tessa. Thank you.

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          5. Miebakagh57 profile image84
            Miebakagh57posted 2 years ago

            We're being put into a much confused state then ever.

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