Guess the Roll out has started

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IzzyMposted 13 years ago
Big traffic drop from international Googles, especially .co uk. Anyone else?
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  Tomygunposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  My traffic has dropped significantly. Plus, all the hubs that were in the first Google page are "gone by the Google wind" and lost in the "never to be found" pages. This Google slap is even harder than the first one. Guess, some serious wipe-out is happening.
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  tdarbyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  My traffic is down over 50 percent. Not sure why but it is horrid
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dingdondingdonposted 13 years ago
Yes, I'm seeing a huge drop from google.co.uk, which is usually one of my main sources of traffic.
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IzzyMposted 13 years ago
It's official http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot. … -goes.html
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Mark Ewbieposted 13 years ago
I find this interesting...

"In some high-confidence situations, we are beginning to incorporate data about the sites that users block into our algorithms"

... so another pointer towards the importance, and I guess, urgency, in raising the quality of the site.

Fingers crossed.
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  Will Apseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  The piece about hitting long tail searches in the US is depressing too.
  
  The overall strategy is clear, though. Google wants to push more money into high reputation sites. Those sites will be able spend more money on content and boost output. They might even pay good writers decent money.
  
  In other words, Google wants to make professionally produced content pay, so it can offer better results to searchers.
  
  User generated content will find it harder to get an audience.
  
  Can Hubpages compete? It can certainly try.
  
  Get that garbage out quicker!
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  recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I am not so sure that is the Google strategy, the same kind of thing but with a different thrust maybe, they are promoting sites that can pull good traffic to their advertising.
  
  Can Hubpages compete - no they can't. There is very little 'professional' content on here, quite a bit of semi- and pseudo- professional mixed together and tons of good hubs about nothing much really.
  
  The current manner of 'hitting' hubbers with vague explanations, hitting people twice for different things at different times, banning people who are trying to help their fellow hubbers, poorly thought out information to guide those who have problems and scant appearance in the forums to provide guidance - even in threads that are miles long with questions and queries. The ultimate unfortunate decision was to 'unpublish' hubs rather than any other method of warning and enforcement. It seems that the number of well written hubs has dwindled as the good writers have been upset and insulted.
  
  Ok - rant over, back to work, nothing to see here folks, move on now . . . .
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  Mrvoodooposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I do think that if they're not careful, the name HubPages could pick up a Kontera-esq stink about it. The internet is wild fire. And as seen with Kontera, it can be almost impossible to fix a damaged reputation.
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  Mikeydoesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I think everyone needs to get that sour face at Google and stop using it. It is stupid to let them dominate, every time we search Google it is like a vote for it. We can hit them where it hurts and stop using them.
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  Mrvoodooposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  To be honest, I personally think that the algorithm change was a good move. Obviously not for HP, but overall. Not perfect, but moving in the right direction.
  
  A few months ago I could write a 300 word article on HP, in twenty minutes, and instantly outrank a niche site that somebody had spent years working hard on. Good for me. But fair?
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  Mikeydoesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Most of my hubs were made in 20 mins, some were really good, some weren't. But the fact that I'm letting my life lay in the balance of Google is just ludicrous.
  
  Either way I am not completely against what their algo change has done, but it is clear that I am not using Google anymore.
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  Aya Katzposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, it is fair, if your article was better. The fact that somebody spent years working on something doesn't mean that it's any good.
  
  The major New York publishers spent years building up their presses, but they didn't publish what people wanted to read. Borders spent decades building up its name, but Amazon came along and broke them, because it offered more for less.
  
  Does it makes sense for Martindale to appear before Hubpages with information that is twenty years out of date, because they spent years establishing themselves?
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  Mrvoodooposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Articles on HP weren't ranking because they were better. In many cases, they were ranking simply because they were on HP. Despite what many people would rather choose to believe.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yup. A lot of people do not seem to understand why they were ranking so well.
  
  Game changer this. For this site and any site that got it's authority from links from hubpages.
  
  Got a few of those myself and "hoping," is not going to change it.
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  Aya Katzposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That's true. Articles weren't ranking because they were better. They were ranking because they had the link juice necessary to get noticed at all. And now that the algo has changed, articles are not tanking because they are worse. They just don't rank because HP links have been devalued.
  
  So it was never fair, overall, and it still isn't.
  
  But for those of us who happened to write well on important subjects, it seemed fair that HP gave us a chance, when no one else would. Now, we stand no chance, unless we generate our own link juice. But let's face it: link juice was never about fairness.
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  Mikeydoesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I agree with this, but the thing was. If my sites were better, they stayed up. If they weren't they went down.
  
  Now most sites are way worse than mine. Not that my sites are the best, but it looked pretty accurate. A lot of the times I'll see yahoo answers above me, with terrible answers.
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  Will Apseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  This is pretty much what Google is trying to do at the moment. They want to reward the hard working pros by ditching the twenty minute article brigade who just happen to have the leverage of publishing on massive sites with overdeveloped SEO muscle.
  
  Of course, there are hard working pros on Hubpages too and that is what this site has to prove.
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  bgamallposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You know, I have a problem with Google here. What is authority? I write for Business Insider. There are professional people here. Ehow is not that great. Authority sites copy each others articles continually. It is all about advertising and how much you pay. Perhaps Hubpages should pay to advertize the front page aggressively.
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  Aya Katzposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah! I think you might be right.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  
  This may be the funniest thing you have said so far. Ehow and wikipedia (both user generated) are doing just fine thanks.
  
  What if the "garbage" is "sleep apnea treatments" written by people with no qualifications or authority?
  
  Because that is what I think the problem is.
  
  I have already given my vote for the witch hunt to be quack medical advice.
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  bgamallposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  If a person experiences a problem and writes about the medical improvement from a personal perspective, that could really be helpful.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Anecdotal. Helpful perhaps, but - how do the search engines determine what is "helpful"? Obviously - they cannot because that is completely subjective. So instead - they will favor "authority" sites instead of sites filled with personal anecdotes.
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  Aya Katzposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  There is one way to tell what is helpful: to see what the searchers prefer. Google has been losing customers, because people aren't finding what they want under the new algo.
  
  Read this:
  
  http://www.pcworld.com/article/224931/b … _lead.html
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  bgamallposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah, people aren't finding the sites they were used to on Google. What a bunch of bozos! Too smart for their own fricken good.
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  Aya Katzposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, and here is something to consider: Yahoo is now powered by Bing. So even though the Bing traffic you get on Hubpages is very modest, if you add the Yahoo traffic to the Bing traffic, you should see that Bing is second only to Google right now, and Google is losing ground!
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  lrohnerposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I spent a couple of hours last night reading hubs, most written from personal experience, on a particular disease. What a bloody lot of bullcr*p there is out there. I must have flagged several dozen for putting out inaccurate, misleading and just bad and potentially deadly information. I didn't care whether it's against TOS or not. They got flagged and voted down.
  
  You wouldn't believe how many "cures" there are out there for incurable diseases, just because the "big pharma" companies don't want us to know. Keep it quiet. Shhhhhhhhhhhhh....
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IzzyMposted 13 years ago
Well, my best hub that was #1 pre-Panda and #2 afterwards is now #5.
I'm beginning to think this has just been a giant waste of time and should aim all future efforts on sites of my own. This is never going to pay me a full time living. It's just a part-time income and always will be.
Depressing but there it is.
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  snakebabyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  IzzyM, I honestly expected this reaction from you after all, believe it or not. I hate to say this, but I'm absolutely on my own sites now. I believe putting all your effort to couple of your own sites with unique content would bring in a lot more. When you have to promote, you promote merely couple of your sites instead of every single hub, and you have the full control, plus all rev is yours. Few of my sites gained traffic in various degrees these few days.
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  Mutiny92posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That has been a blessing in disguise for me. I started a website about 40 days ago and have already had four amazon sales from it for almost $20. I will count that as a success!
  
  I think the Panda vs. HP story is still evolving, but it certainly seems smart to spend a bit of time diversifying the income streams.
  
  ***crosses my fingers that my websites continue to grow!***
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Snakebaby, I've got my sites. I just haven't developed or published them. Tell me to get off the forums and go do it! It's another huge learning curve and I guess I'm scared because Wordpress is so new to me. Last time I wrote a website it was in Frontpage, and I was only playing. I have almost talked myself into looking at it and going cross-eyed again for while...just need that extra shove.
  This roll-out and watching my traffic sink again should be enough.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Get off the damn forum and go get your sites working! Drop me a PM if you need any help.
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  CMHypnoposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Get thee to thy site Izzy, before you end up in the padded cell with Kirstenblog and me!
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ohhhh Izzy would make lovely company in this hear warm padded room with us, bet she will need to join us after doing some work on her site
  
  I will keep a little cup of pills ready just in case
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm pulling my hair out and am ready to scream and scream.
  That is two whole bloody hours I've been working on that site and I've got NOTHING to show for it!!
  
  I can't figure it out.
  
  I keep writing posts. Then I learn I should have been writing pages.
  
  So I copy/paste the posts into pages and delete the posts. Then it kicks back to Hello World!
  
  And my pages stay buried.
  
  So I change Hello World into one of my posts, and click save, and then it defaults back.
  
  And who are those strangers who have been adding comments to the comments section. How do I delete the whole bloody lot? They all want to sell me something anyway.
  
  I would go for a walk if my back wasn't so sore.
  
  I'm going to walk away now and come back later when I have calmed down!
  
  Oh and in between all that, someone hacked my gmail account and I had to let google text me a pin number to get back in!
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  snakebabyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  IzzyM, I've never used wordpress, I've heard that they have more features and design can be more professional than blogspot. But I also know for sure having a blogspot blog should not go wrong, since it is owned by google. They can get google traffic quickly if you keep updating them at the initial stages. I believe with unique content, blogspot is a way to go. Setting up a blogspot blog is very easy.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I've got blogs with blogspot - they were easy to do and easy to maintain, but not aimed at making money.
  I've also got a Wordpress blog but stopped adding to it when I learn it couldn't be monetized.
  Now I have real sites with my own urls and paid hosting, using Wordpress.org which is supposed to be simple and straightforward.
  
  It probably is. For others.
  
  All I want to do is put a main page up - a home page - with a menu of links down the side each one which openes to more pages and further information.
  
  When I've got that set up, even without a lot of content, then I will hit the publish button.
  
  Or have I got to hit publish first in order for them to work?
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  CMHypnoposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Izzy, I have been flailing around WordPress like you, and Mark very kindly helped me yesterday. I also had an issue with posts, but apparently you need to have more than one page if you want to show posts. (probably described this very badly!)
  
  Drop him a pm as he has offered to help, and see what he says?
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks God there are more in the same boat as me! lol Thanks I have now emailed Mark. I've got the site up and published but it looks awful.
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  EmpressFelicityposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Eeek!
  
  I eliminated comment spam on my blog by adding a Captcha plugin - the one I use is called SI CAPTCHA Anti-Spam and it works well.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Plug-ins are far too complicated for me just now when I can't even set the site up in the first place lol
  
  Obviously it's going to make me no money whatsoever (getting used to that here) without plugins, but once I have a handle on everything I'll look at those things.
  
  Thanks for those offers of help, especially from Mark Knowles.
  
  It's got to be something simple I am overlooking. Others have said pointing the url from godaddy to the host was the hard thing but that was nothing.
  
  Off to find more youtube videos.
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  sunforgedposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Why should you have been writing "pages"?
  
  The only real distinction between post and page is that a post appears in the "loop" - depending on the theme, it means it will appear on your home page and also be shown on tag, category and archive pages.
  
  Most themes, plugins and tweaks you will make along the line will involve the use of "posts"
  
  Traditionally, you would be writing posts and use "pages" for "about""privacy" etc.
  
  Some do choose to use pages and use wordpress to create a static site but if your making a static site ..there is less reason to use wordpress as that makes the whole database rather pointless and the site would be faster w/o being a wordpress site.
  
  The comments are comment spam, get used to them.
  
  Akismet is really the only anti-comment spam plugin worth using.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I used this youtube video for help and he used pages.
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vt7BleX … grec_index
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  sunforgedposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hes making a tiny static website for a race.
  
  If you are making a tiny little micro niche site than its an ok model to follow. About Page, Privacy page - 5-10 articles and a store page or two and then you leave it alone.
  
  Otherwise, its really not a very good example of how to best use wordpress. If you are planning on building and updating for a long time then find a new video
  
  pages dont appear in your rss either - so no options for rss submissions, autotweets, autofacebook or old fashioned notification to your readers,etc.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm learning. Thanks.
  Actually I think the one I am writing on is a micro niche static site - I didn't actually know that before.
  However, I have others to work on once I figure out how to get Wordpress on them (I take it they are subdomains in Hostgator?)and while most of them are as you say micro niche static sites - probably - at least one will take a lot more ongoing work.
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  sunforgedposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It sounds like your learning is going well
  
  I always try to stress the importance of planning out your site when working with people on wordpress.
  
  Is this a site will be updating, or is it "set and forget"?
  
  Could I possibly have thousands of pages/post at sometime?
  
  How will I monetize?
  
  Little things like permalink structure and theme settings can make a difference depending on how you answer.
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  lakeerieartistsposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Izzy, you might find this helpful. http://writing-online.org/ There is a series right now about how to set up a wordpress site.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thanks
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  snakebabyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I always publish first and then work on finishing the site. It takes time for a self-built site to get traffic, could be 6 months to a year. So publish it asap is recommended. No one would find your site anyway no matter how ugly or empty it currently is.
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  EmpressFelicityposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Tell me about it - I confronted the Wordpress white screen of death for the first time yesterday
  
  (If it ever happens to you, it might be because your theme doesn't like a plugin that you've recently downloaded/updated. Try deactivating it.)
  
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Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years ago
Well, there goes Aussie, co.uk, and whatever else... Now, where were we?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I would hazard a guess you will now lose another 30-50% of whatever traffic you had pre-slap. I am also guessing this will only affect your adsense income because I think Amazon/Ebay was already damaged as badly as it was going to be.
  
  Guess making everyone run around deleting Amazon products didn't do a lot of good.
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  Bill Manningposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Some of my best, page one website pages are nothing but Amazon product links with some good text thrown in. I never did understand why people were getting rid of those.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Because they were told that they would be deleted if they did not comply.
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  Bill Manningposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I thought they just had to have 50 words per Amazon product? In which case they should have just added more text. However if you had 50 products showing I can see why you'd want to cut some.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You have any idea how many hubs some of us have/had?
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  Bill Manningposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  True, I forget that some have many. I only have 33 so it was not a big deal.
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  Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Mark, at this point, I'm dead in the water...
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Aya Katzposted 13 years ago
Yes, I've lost my uk following, too. And the other Googles have dropped.

The good news, though, is that yahoo is steadily rising. It's right up there behind Hubpages. I think part of this is attributable to the loss of the international Googles, but part is because searchers are realizing that at the moment, if they're looking for content rather than a place to buy something from an established retailer, then yahoo is a better place to search.

The Google algo change was not geared to help searchers who are doing research. It was primarily geared to help big name advertisers and their market find each other. As a result, a lot of old news is privileged, no matter how stale.

At the top of the Google search for my name comes a Martindale.com listing of me as a lawyer with my address in Grand Prairie, Texas. It's been over twenty years since that listing was current.
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Eve Fossposted 13 years ago
I guess that explains why my traffic is down again. Yeah--depressing.
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Mutiny92posted 13 years ago
The work-reward ratio has definitely changed. I haven't seen any positive changes resulting from the HP spring-cleaning work - no increased SERPs or the like. Hopefully, there are significant improvements for others...but I don't think there are any in my world.

At some point, the workload to create new content here is not worth the rewards (potential income).
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optimus grimlockposted 13 years ago
my traffic sucks i'm not even at 10000 veiws
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Mutiny92posted 13 years ago
If there is a silver lining, it may be in this article http://www.travolution.co.uk/articles/2 … oogle.html

If yahoo and bing continue to gain on google, it hopefully will reduce the reliance on the google search and the recent panda update.

http://www.geekwire.com/2011/data-micro … ain-google --- another good summary
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  prettydarkhorseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  hmm..
  I read this article that Bing could overtake Google sooner by 2012? just a probability but more likely
  http://mashable.com/2011/04/11/bing-search-growth/
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frogdroppingposted 13 years ago
Same for me. Not even scraping the traffic I was a year ago. Nice one

As for great content the algo can't read. Google doesn't give a monkeys about raising the stakes for writers, end of. I almost fell about alughing at the thought of that ever happening.

Almost.
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tritrainposted 13 years ago
You know when you're logged into Google and do searches there's a little + (plus) sign to the right of the search?

If and when you find a good HubPages Hub you may want to click the + sign.

It's probably our only hope right now.

*Interesting that certain other HubPages competitors are not even discussing a Google slap...
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Mikeydoesposted 13 years ago
I would really like to hear from Hubpages staff on this forum topec.. And more importantly this(my topic about the videos that are supposed to be coming here).

http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/72340

I would say all of my low quality hubs are gone, meaning most hubbers bad hubs have to be gone by now. Things were supposed to improve here and it has gotten twice as bad, what are the plans?

Also it is clear Google, much like the gov't must want all the money to go to the rich. We can make Google squirm, all we have to do is stop using it. Spreading the word would also be great. I don't think switching to just Bing will do it. Having just 1 popular search engine is dangerous obviously, especially if the website doesn't care about the average person.
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CMHypnoposted 13 years ago
Traffic well down, and just have had the first couple of clickless days on Adsense in ages.

Have to say that the HP ad programme is not making up all the difference and Amazon is on the floor

I am trying to stay optimistic, but it is getting harder by the day!!!

And to top it all, am having technical difficulties with my WordPress site today!!!!!!
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Bill Manningposted 13 years ago
Hmmm, I was wondering why my traffic suddenly went down on my sites yesterday. Yeah I am seeing a drop, including drop in ranking in normal USA Google searches.

Guess we just got to slog through it and wait until it goes back up,,,, and it will go back up. Time to tweak my sites and do grunt work on them while I wait for traffic to return.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Why will it go back up?
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  Bill Manningposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Because after every Google dance, all 500 or so times they have done that, good sites with good content always gets put back on top.
  
  Which is the way it is suppose to work and almost always does. So until I see differently I will assume my good work will once again get back up there. In a month or two.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Good luck with that.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe not always
  
  "What is interesting is that there have been zero signs of anyone really coming out of this update. So if you were impacted by the Farmer/Panda update back one and a half months ago, very few have claimed to have regained all of their traffic from Google since."
  
  Quoted from site I posted above
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  Bill Manningposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well I seem to have been the exception then. My tourist site was smacked pretty good, even though it's nothing like a content farm.
  
  But about 3 weeks ago all my pages came back even better than before. Only yesterday did they seem to go back down a little, and now I know why.
  
  So I am pretty sure it will raise again. My other websites have not been affected at all.
  
  In the end what will happen will happen, right? Do your best and do what you think you should do.
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  snakebabyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Your own separate sites are different stories than hubpages. Wish you the best of luck with your hubs
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ngurecoposted 13 years ago
The worst part of it is the low paying ads they are now sending here. It’s now normal to get 20 clicks for a combined total of less than a dollar.
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TerryGlposted 13 years ago
Actually I am quite enjoying all of this.

I had two good keywords where a hubpage was beating my Wordpress site. Well today my two keywords went to number one and I am getting traffic in the thousands for both keywords. Its only been 7 hours since the start of my new stats.

Whatever Hubpages are doing, I for one, hope they keep doing it.

I feel this venue is at is past use-by date personally.
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  tritrainposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That's just great.
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BobbiRantposted 13 years ago
This place has been all but buried as far as outside traffic coming in. Google doesn't like HP one bit. So now HP has to rely on the 'other' advertisers, but those too will wane if no outside traffic comes in. They keep 'featuring' junk no one wants to find in searches, so there will be no traffic.
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  recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I have a low visitor rate on all my hubs, ok for me as money is not the object and I haven't done any backlinking etc. Interestingly the poetry hubs that have always had some traffic have seen a steady rise through all of this, they are now about twice as high hit rate as before.
  
  They are still Hubpages, maybe being HP is not everything in this shake-up.
  
  I personally cannot think how product oriented hubs with some packed-in keywords in yet another well researched but same as all the other thousands of same product articles would be seen as 'good' by Google. Or is it just me ?
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  bgamallposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Keep publishing poetry hubs, then make them into an ebook at smashwords. I think people should try to take their hubpage writing and turn them into ebooks. Ebook growth is soaring. It may produce some income and make you an authority.
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IzzyMposted 13 years ago
This is an interesting post http://www.seroundtable.com/google-pand … 13259.html
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Mark Ewbieposted 13 years ago
Bit of anecdotal - I am completely bummed (if that's the right term). If it's not, ignore it, I'm English.

My favourite hub and two words for watching had slowy risen back up in Google.com to page 1 - above the totally crappy Yahoo answer waste of time moronic few words of utter shite.

Sorry - bit annoyed.

That was yesterday.

Today in Google.com I'm in the middle of page 7!!!!

I am really quite disappointed. If that Google van comes up my road I am going throw a brick through its windscreen.

edit: Oh another hub I check - was page one - now page five. It's obviously five times as utter crap as they thought it was yesterday.

Quality content - my ass.
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  bgamallposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It isn't about quality content. It is about how much a website is willing to pay. Business Insider has some great content, and plenty that is not so great. And contributors have been booted some compared to paid staff. Like Google knows that is better? How do they know that?
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  kirstenblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Mmmm, quality ass
  A man with a nice ass sure does have some quality content ya know
  
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nasus loopsposted 13 years ago
I really thought that the decrease in traffic was just down to me and my hubs.

At least now I know that I must pay more attention to putting my work else where. Anyone got any suggestions as to where I could go, not looking to make a full blown living, but some would be nice!!
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  mistyhorizon2003posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ryankett here on Hubpages has started his own site called Excerptz.com and they are going to give 80% of Adsense revenue to their writers and you retain ownership of all your content. I signed up yesterday as I looked at the site and the info on it and was very impressed. Ryan is a very experienced web marketer etc, so I have faith he could very well make this new site a great success.
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  nasus loopsposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That sounds really good misty. Me thinks me head over there and have a look. I have read some of Ryanketts work on here and know he will do the best for the writer (being one himself). Thanks for the heads up.
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  mistyhorizon2003posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You are very welcome
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  Mikeydoesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  ThisIsOli has a site too. http://www.thisisfreelance.com/
  
  I like both of those guys a lot
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  Mrvoodooposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  While I wish RyanKett's new site well. Investing time in another revenue sharing content farm, when even the most established sites of that type have been hit hard. Seems like a questionable course of action to me.
  
  It could be good for a few backlinks though.
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  Daniel Carterposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That was my thought. It's a nice idea to support a friend and great writer, but the jury is out as to how this will rank, and I suspect that google is going to go into hyper mode in making adjustments, based on their steady losses and Bing/Yahoo's gains. I think this going to be a bumpy ride for a while.
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  CASE1WORKERposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  latest e mail from his site is that they have not been affected.
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  snakebabyposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Either create your own website or a blogspot blog for your content, it will pay off in 6 months to a year.
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Will Apseposted 13 years ago
It is important to get a grasp of what these changes are all about if you write online for a living. That means not getting upset but looking at the reality of what Google is trying to do.

A good starting point is reading what Google has to say for itself.

Anything you read on a blog or (on Hubpages forums for that matter) is second best.
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  frogdroppingposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yep. And then I'll start believing that there really is a tooth fairy. And maybe ... just maybe ... it's time I started believing all the crap than continuously spews from the mouths of plotticians.
  
  Ohhhhh lol ... and hell's freezing over.
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  tritrainposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well said.
  
  We would be rewarded for our writing efforts more if HubPages was better recognized for quality content. Starting over with your own website isn't often an easy process.
  
  We really need to get a handle on the short, spun Hubs and obviously promotional, linkbuilding ones. Probably 80% of them are one or both of the two mentioned.
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Tenerife Islanderposted 13 years ago
I have plenty of high-ranking hubs that are still high in searches for their keywords but my earnings have dropped way down which is worrying as I had been counting on them to help pay bills here!
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logic,commonsenseposted 13 years ago
Just ask yourself, WWJD!
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  canadawest99posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I was on pace to make about $15/day, then the panda attack happened which knocked me back to about $4/per day. I spend the last few weeks fighting back by writing more anf got close to $10/day, but then something happened again last week and knocked me back to a few bucks per day.
  
  I don't know if this is a viable business model anymore.
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sofsposted 13 years ago
Traffic is down by almost 50%.. I really hope it will bounce back and normalize in the course of time.
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Ritsosposted 13 years ago
mmm thought I was down today ... I think my 50th hub may have to wait .. mayb I will give Excerptz a try and maybe set my own site up too
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Definitely get some of your own sites going.
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  Ritsosposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  yep .. need to think my strategy through and get my proverbial in gear
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  Kidgasposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I had almost as many AdSense impressions with my new site (started right after Google slap) as with HubPages yesterday. HP is dying a slow and painful death. On a side note, my eHow income hit a record in March.
  
  PS--I hope Bing eats Google's lunch.
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  paradigmsearchposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I’ve decided to take up worm farming and Texas holdem.
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Daniel Carterposted 13 years ago
I'm beginning to conclude that since I'm definitely not an SEO expert, and this is really a very active hobby for me, I really need to team up with some SEO person, start a few of my own sites and kick butt in that direction and slowly let HP take it's natural course. I'm losing interest very fast in trying to make up the difference on any other writing sites, since google is now threatened by Bing and Yahoo, and will obviously be playing god much quicker, messing up traffic and searches for a while to try to regain their lost ground.

We are the proverbial lab rats, nervous about when the next injection will take place. I tend to observe and watch and not jump too quickly in these situations. But we'll see...
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Ritsosposted 13 years ago
Ok ... that's got my 'own site' domain name registered anyway .... it's a start :-)
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Mark Ewbieposted 13 years ago
I'm less sure about the starting your own site thing.

If I type in a search term that is on a few of my hubpages and also on my site then HP still comes up above my site.

Now that may just mean my site is even less liked by Google than Hubpages, or something else.
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Susana Sposted 13 years ago
I have a nice afternoon out and come back to this - oh joy

Well we knew it would happen but it doesn't make it any easier to bear....grrr....I hate Google

My most cynical theory is that the panda update will force webmasters into buying more adwords.
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IzzyMposted 13 years ago
I honestly don't think writing on yet another content farm is the solution.
I still don't understand how ehow and squidoo are still doing well. I just checked the SERPS to see how my hubs on growing catnip are faring these days and found a squidoo result near the top that was only written last month, and is the worst piece of writing I have the displeasure of reading in a long time.
Honestly the sentence structure, the word use, everything is terrible, and the info isn't that great either.
Yet Google have ranked them highly on the front page?
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  bgamallposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That is because Google is really not able to sort the wheat from the chaff. They think they can but they can't.
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  White Teethposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  The growing catnip lens has over a 1000 backlinks.
  
  It seems like in general that non-backlinked hubs are doing better than non-backlinked lenses (based upon the small sample that I have looked at).
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Most of them come from 512kbps.com and digitaldevildb.com, so they are artificial self-created backlinks that have nothing to do with growing plants at all.
  I thought Google was against this? Or is it OK for some?
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  CMHypnoposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  The whole situation from Feb onwards seems to have punished some folks for some actions, but not others. We at HP seem to have copped the lot!
  
  So much for adding UK Amazon links!!!!
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  White Teethposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hubpages seems to be against this...everybody else...not so much...
  
  Many of the links may be low value, but low value is better than no value...especially when you have a 1000...
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  2 of those links were PR 2, about 20 were PR 1 and the rest PR0 and of course they count. How else could an article that bad get so high!
  Looks like our next course of action will be to slow down on the writing and get on with the backlinking.
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  White Teethposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Just remember that at Hubpages a lot of low quality backlinks could potentially get you banned if some moderator decides that it looks too spammy.
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  Will Apseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Ehow doesn't have the huge baggage of terrible pages that Hubpages carries around with it. Squidoo seems to control its content better too.
  
  Hubpages is fixable. It just needs to finish the process it has already started.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Doesn't it? I've read some pretty terrible ehow pages too, and the worst ones from HP get buried anyway so unlikely to find them in a search, unless they are backlinked to the hilt, which some are.
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Ritsosposted 13 years ago
five hubs now shifted to Exerptz so I'll monitor that a while and see how they fare while I'm planning and setting up my own site
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  mistyhorizon2003posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Would you mind keeping us posted on how it works out Ritsos please. I am interested to hear your results too.
  
  By the way, I just got an email from Excerptz admin saying:
  
  "In fact, our traffic is reaching record figures. Yesterday our 500ish posts took 3000ish unique visitors, 65% of which were US visitors. For more information, check out this latest blog post: http://excerptz.com/2011/excerptz-unaff … -roll-out/ "
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  thisisoliposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  For the record This is Freelance is doing increasingly well post update as well
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  mistyhorizon2003posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That is great Oli, perhaps these newer sites are the way to go in the future.
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Simone Smithposted 13 years ago
Interesting discussion, guys. Everyone knew that the Panda update was going to roll out to additional countries eventually, so this doesn't come as much of a surprise, right? We've been making a lot of positive changes on the site and it may take a while for the impact of those changes to really take effect.

HubPages has always been a site where patience pays. Hubbers don't typically see significant earnings until 6 months or a year after they join and get started. HubScore grows slowly. Followers grow slowly. And recoveries may take place over a more extended amount of time, too.

We're still implementing site improvements to help HP out- they take a lot of work behind the scenes

Just wanted to throw in my two cents and let you all know the whole HP team is working really make HubPages as good a place to write and be found online as it has ever been- and to make it even better, too
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  Ritsosposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yay :-) .. Seriously .. the exerptz is largely an experiment with low ranking hubs to see what happens. Of course, as they grow, they could get panda'd too !!
  
  I wonder if seperating the poetry/creative writing to another domain would maybe help too. Every time I hop hubs they take up about 80% of them.
  
  I hope HP does get back a good chunk of the lost traffic as it is a well constructed and easy to use site.
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  rmrposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I hope so too! I've never gotten huge traffic. Before Panda, I usually got 400-500 views a day. After Panda US it dropped to around 275. With this latest roll out, my 24 hour views are stuck at 185. That's about what I was doing 2and a half years ago, with 10 or 15 hubs.
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  Simone Smithposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  We're working on a bunch of improvements- stay posted! And lol @ panda'd.
  
  It's like... "Hah! You just got PANDA'D" I feel like a wee YouTube miniseries could be made on that. Though perhaps only online writers could get the joke.
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  Mikeydoesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Mind sharing some of the improvements? It usually gives people incentive to stick around. I've been asking what is going on with the video section?
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  canadawest99posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Simone, isn't google just across the street there in SF? Maybe having someone walk over there and ask whats the deal might help. Paul and Sergei can arm wrestle or something. Otherwise I sense an exodus from writing sites. People are already doing the math and thinking having their own site is a better deal.
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  Simone Smithposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  We have already:
  
  -Discouraged duplicate content (e.g. made it against site policy)
  -Changed our policy with Amazon and eBay capsules
  -Changed our policy with links capsules, news capsules, and Amazon capsules being the first full-width capsules
  -Gone on a moderating marathon (and when I say marathon, I mean MARATHON) to mod out Hubs that aren't compliant with our site TOS (in this case, Hubber flagging really helps, and notes are particularly helpful)
  
  We're working with Google to get things moving. Here's the latest Google guest blog posts with their tips on improving Hubs in the meantime: http://blog.hubpages.com/2011/04/optimi … d-adsense/
  
  We're also forging ahead with site improvements of our own
  Those are going to be announced by the higher ups. I ain't gonna steal their thunder no way no how. But you'll hear from them soon enough
  
  Once things settle down, good Hubs will rise again in the rankings.
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  canadawest99posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Simone, the duplicate content penalty is just a total myth. Even the major news agencies spread their articles over multiple syndicated sites and nothing bad happens.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe they have a special dispensation or something, but I for one, am glad that duplicate content has been banned.
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  bgamallposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  It isn't fair though, Izzy. It is wrong to hold us to a different set of rules than they hold each other too. It is rigged and it is fixed. And Google is the bookie.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Look at news items though - they hit the top quickly but sink even quicker. We want our hubs to stay up there.
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  bgamallposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I agree with that but the sites are not penalized. Yes, articles are less important than the site itself, but they have no penalty for dup content.
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  mistyhorizon2003posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Izzy, I am confused on this part though, as Simone says 'discouraged' in the first part of her post, but then says it is 'against site policy', neither of which seem to really state it is 'banned'. I wish it was, but not sure what would happen if someone tried to post duplicated or stolen content here now, that would be any different to what happened beforehand!
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I'm sure I read somewhere that you can't even publish a hub if it's full of duplicated content, yet I am still finding the odd one in the hopper.
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  mistyhorizon2003posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I suspected as much, therefore nothing in their rules on this has changed. It is an empty statement for them to say 'it is discouraged' or 'against site policy', it is like telling a child not to pick their nose, i.e. discourage it and say it is against your policy.... hard to enforce though, and the children still do it anyway and ignore their parents!
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  tritrainposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Could we get some improved HubHopping tools and reports?
  
  Also, make the link more obvious. The newer folks may not know where to find it.
  
  Maybe that could be part of the "approval process" for new Hubbers. They could learn the TOS and then HubHop.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Oh dear.
  
  The girl who wrote to me "challenging" me to be a "better" online writer with spelling mistakes and poor grammar in the first paragraph says they are "rolling out improvements".
  
  Good oh.
  
  Can I expect to be banned by tomorrow?
  
  I assume you took an 80% pay cut huh?
  
  Patience pays? Sure. How many years do I Have to wait?
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  Simone Smithposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I ain't no good at der grammer.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I know.
  
  Just got fired?
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IzzyMposted 13 years ago
I'd like to hear an encouraging word or two as well. OK we knew it was coming, but the delay honestly had me thinking that Google knew they had their algo wrong. They've made some other change do their US algo too, not sure what but hubs are slipping in the US SERPS too.
It's disheartening, just as many of us had got to writing hubs again too.
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  Simone Smithposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Oh, I know- it's totally frustrating. But it's also something we expected to happen. We're in the midst of our fixing-up, so it's just going to take some time.
  Hubs written today are still investments for the future, no? At least that's my approach! Muwahahahaaaa!
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  Mutiny92posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I am with you Izzy! I was hoping they found flaws in the algo. My logic being that most of my backlinks are ranking higher than the hubs....that made me think that there were problems...
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Mark Ewbieposted 13 years ago
P."Simone. I want you to get out on the forums and stop that misery talk"
S."OK, Paul"
P."We can't have all the Hubbers upset"
S."What shall I tell them?"
P."Anything you like, just keep it upbeat"
S."On it sir"
P."And watch out for that Ewbie character - he's a bit of a sour puss. If he gives you any trouble - then just slap a ban on his ass. He doesn't make us any money anyway".
S."He needs an HP slap to go with the Google one?"
P."You got it babe".
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  You're just hoping for a slap, you masochist you!
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  Mark Ewbieposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Lol. I'm just warming up a theme, might get another hub out of it.
  
  I'll tell you Izzy, I am so hacked off today - bad traffic AND copied.
  
  Hardly seems worth the 20 cents I made.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  There you go you are doing fantastic - way better than me! I've made 25 eurocents with 4 times as many hubs!
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  Simone Smithposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  EWBIE GET YOUR SPY RECORDING EQUIPMENT OUT OF OUR OFFICE THIS MOMENT!
  
  It makes that annoying interference sound every time I leave my cell around.
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  mistyhorizon2003posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  LOL, that is kind of what I reckon many on here are thinking, although we hope we are wrong!!!
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nell79posted 13 years ago
I'm happy to hear that HP is being proactive about this. I wasn't getting a lot of traffic to begin with, but it's beyond dismal now. Before PANDA it was steadily increasing, after it cut in half, then in the last week or so it's cut in half again
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  Simone Smithposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Don't worry. We're working on it. I mean... it's just a panda, for goodness sake.
  
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  nell79posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah....wait til it gets bigger, hungry and cranky
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  ngurecoposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That's a good one.
  
  Hopefully, panda will not change goal posts again.
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  bgamallposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Take away his bamboo and you will see a more humble Panda.
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paradigmsearchposted 13 years ago
I just did an image search for dead pandas. But I have decided to defer…
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  nell79posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I can imagine....yikes
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Greek Oneposted 13 years ago
Just sitting by the dock of the bay... waiting for the invite to come my waaaaay...

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frogdroppingposted 13 years ago
Look at you Greek, sat between a purse and the deep gold jar.
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ngurecoposted 13 years ago
Don’t worry Greek, for the God who gives is the same God who takes away.
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  nell79posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Geek? Typo or intentional?
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  ngurecoposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you, Nell79. I intended to mean Greek One.
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David 470posted 13 years ago
This is very disheartening...I still believe this site can get back on track like it used to, but I am going farther and farther away from optimism.

Google has dealt bad cards to hubpages. If we don't get a royal flush soon, it won't be good...

I have not been checking my traffic lately, but my earnings were a bit lower than they were usually with HP ad program.
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  shoganposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  "If we don't get a royal flush soon, it won't be good..."
  
  Well, in a manner of speaking, isn't that sort of what we got?! (sorry, I couldn't help myself)
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  David 470posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  A royal flush is a good hand.
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  shoganposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah, I know, David. It was more the "flush" part I was focusing on.
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Will Apseposted 13 years ago
I have come across very little copied content while hub hopping over the last few weeks. I reckon they have got that side of things pretty much under control.

Over fifty per cent of the sites I looked at yesterday were over promotional though- two links to the same site. Surely, a software fix could be found to that problem.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Today there seemed to be a huge amount of spun content in the hopper. Leastways I think it's spun. Sentences that don't quite make sense in articles that were otherwise professional looking.
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  Will Apseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Spun content is probably the hardest thing for a robot to detect.
  
  Also, it could be ESL content. I did flag one page yesterday for just being so brutally cruel to the English language.
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  recommend1posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Two links to the same site is what is allowed in the TOS.
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  Will Apseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  If you go and check the hub hopper flagging tool, it gives you this as a reason for flagging as overly promotional-
  
  2 or more links to a single site, purely promotional, or teasers that require you to follow a link to read the full story.
  
  I was surprised by the two links thing myself. If the above is wrong and 2 links are allowed in TOS the tool needs changing.
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  thisisoliposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Two links is the limit, not overly promotional.
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WriteAngledposted 13 years ago
When I last hopped yesterday, I found quite a lot of duplicates. I test snippets from any texts that seem too polished, unless the hub has been produced by someone I know to be a good writer. My suspicions tend to be confirmed at least 90% of the time.
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  Will Apseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  I do the same. The Chrome browser lets you search for something on Google direct from the page with a right click selection.
  
  Maybe I am just getting careless- or too optimistic about copied content.
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  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  That's a handy feature! I didn't notice that before and found the very first hub in the hopper I looked at was copied or duplicated using that feature. Thanks!
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  Will Apseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Well, its sort of good you found the copied content and sort of bad!
  
  I have truly only found one copied hub out of the last forty or so I checked. I used to find that around twenty per cent were copied.
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IzzyMposted 13 years ago
"During that length soul can get products triple times on fourfold devices as mortal wishing."

Talking about an iphone app or something. Not copied but spun...or something. Maybe the writer was on drugs?
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relacheposted 13 years ago
From Search Engine Watch's blog, dated April 12,

http://blog.searchenginewatch.com/110412-160000

"Google's Panda Update Hits the UK: Early Winners & Losers"

For those who want to cut to the chase, here's the pertinent info from their chart.

Domain = hubpages.com
Visibility(OPI)new = 26099
Visibility (OPI)old = 182704
difference = -156605
loss in percent = -85.72%
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  Will Apseposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Dismal. Then again, my US traffic has been coming back strong lately. Perhaps the horrible losses of yesterday will be reversed as quickly.
  
  I am worried about the long tail search change in the US as much as the rest of the world getting a furry present. I have't seen any impact analysis for that yet.
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  canadawest99posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  Triond, Infobarrel, Bukisa all not hit??
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  sunforgedposted 13 years agoin reply to this
  The 3 above may not had much standing to lose
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DDSposted 13 years ago
I'm not a seasoned veteran of hubpages so I'm not sure if google is actually being punitive, or if everyone was doing something a little loop-hole-ish and are miffed now that it's being closed down.
Either way, I think perseverance and human ingenuity always find a way.
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kiwitomposted 13 years ago
In case anyone was thinking about starting their own site, this might be of interest.

Last week I decided to start my first site, with a custom domain on Blogger and content that was directly derived from one of my hubs. The site went live yesterday and is now ranking #11 for its keyword whereas the hubpage with very, very similar content, some backlinks and 6 months of maturing has today fallen from ranking #5 ranking below the new site at #15.

Not sure what this all means really, but it might be of interest..
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ThomasEposted 13 years ago
Looked on, checked the forum... oh nooos... I've been Pandalized.
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CMHypnoposted 13 years ago
http://www.webpronews.com/ranking-in-go … 11-04#more

More pain all around it seems. The Mahalo comments were interesting about only accepting articles from credentialed writers with seven years or 10,000 hours of experience in their subject, and then they give as an example an article on making profiteroles????

Much as it may be tricky to make good profiteroles, I think that most people could master it in 7 years? Isn't this going a bit from the sublime to the ridiculous?

Yes, I can see that wanting writers to have more impressive credentials for writing on topics like medical matters is probably a good thing, but there are plenty of people out there writing good stuff about food etc, who do not have paper qualifications or work experience in that area.
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1. 87
  mistyhorizon2003posted 13 years agoin reply to this
  ROFLMAO I loved your comment about the profiteroles taking 7 years to master the art of making... brilliant
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Google Custom Search	This is feature allows you to search the site. (Privacy Policy)
Google Maps	Some articles have Google Maps embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Google Charts	This is used to display charts and graphs on articles and the author center. (Privacy Policy)
Google AdSense Host API	This service allows you to sign up for or associate a Google AdSense account with HubPages, so that you can earn money from ads on your articles. No data is shared unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Google YouTube	Some articles have YouTube videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Vimeo	Some articles have Vimeo videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Paypal	This is used for a registered author who enrolls in the HubPages Earnings program and requests to be paid via PayPal. No data is shared with Paypal unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook Login	You can use this to streamline signing up for, or signing in to your Hubpages account. No data is shared with Facebook unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Maven	This supports the Maven widget and search functionality. (Privacy Policy)

Marketing
Google AdSense	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Google DoubleClick	Google provides ad serving technology and runs an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Index Exchange	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Sovrn	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook Ads	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Unified Ad Marketplace	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
AppNexus	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Openx	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Rubicon Project	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
TripleLift	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Say Media	We partner with Say Media to deliver ad campaigns on our sites. (Privacy Policy)
Remarketing Pixels	We may use remarketing pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to advertise the HubPages Service to people that have visited our sites.
Conversion Tracking Pixels	We may use conversion tracking pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to identify when an advertisement has successfully resulted in the desired action, such as signing up for the HubPages Service or publishing an article on the HubPages Service.

Statistics
Author Google Analytics	This is used to provide traffic data and reports to the authors of articles on the HubPages Service. (Privacy Policy)
Comscore	ComScore is a media measurement and analytics company providing marketing data and analytics to enterprises, media and advertising agencies, and publishers. Non-consent will result in ComScore only processing obfuscated personal data. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Tracking Pixel	Some articles display amazon products as part of the Amazon Affiliate program, this pixel provides traffic statistics for those products (Privacy Policy)
Clicksco	This is a data management platform studying reader behavior (Privacy Policy)

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