A Discourse on President Trump

1. 83

   gmwilliamsposted 7 years ago

   
   Has President Trump's sociopolitical policies & stance united or divided the United States among racial, gender, & socioeconomic lies?  Has President Trump create a rise of overt racism in the United States regarding his immigration policies?   What image is President Trump presenting to the world?  Has the rest of world gained or lost respect for the United States as a result of President Trump?  What type of legacy will President Trump leave for America?

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      Live to Learnposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      I don't think Trump has divided our nation. I think we were already divided. I think the Obama administration went too far, too fast, with many things. The transgender bathroom thing being one of them. I think people are generally good and want to be accepting. I think conversation and gradual change would have been better. I think Obamacare was a slap in the face to struggling Americans. It made sure all side were taken care of, but them.
      
      Trump does shoot himself in the foot with his Twitter vomits. But, I agree with wilderness that those who are color blind can see that many of his policies have nothing to do with racism. Racism appears, to me, to be an expletive thrown out in order to stifle fair and open exchange.
      
      When the left learns that conversation and open dialogue is what we need and the right learns the same, maybe we'll get somewhere. We'll get a lot further, faster, when we get it through their thick heads that neither far end is representative of anywhere near the majority of Americans.
      
      I don't care what the rest of the world has to say. We are America and we need to find an American solution to our current problems.

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         Paul Winngertposted 7 years agoin reply to this

         Step one: Get rid of the orange POS (who now endorses pedophiles) and his freakshow cabinet.

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            wildernessposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            Was that intended as "conversation and open dialogue" as LTL says?  Because if it was it has to be one of the major failures of the century.  Name calling and unproven claims is not conducive to either.
            
            Or was it just another rant to relieve internal pressure from excessive hatred and anger?

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               PrettyPantherposted 7 years agoin reply to this

               While I applaud your efforts to maintain open dialogue by calling out such a response, I can't help but notice that you have not done so wiih one particular very prolific poster whose posts are rarely on topic and are laden with insults, name calling, and bashing of entire groups of people.
               
               Just wondering how you evaluate which posts are conducive to open dialogue and which are not? Because from what I see, we have a regular who consistently inhibits quality conversation. Paul pops in on occasion with some caustic observations which can easily be ignored if you find them unhelpful. It's much harder to wade through the 50-some rants per week that litter the forums.

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                  wildernessposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                  Not positive which prolific poster(s) you're pointing at (but a good idea ) but, frankly, there are a few that I almost ignore anymore as not worth the time to click and read.  Never anything but unsubstantiated claims and wild rants along party lines.  Once in a great while I will respond to one of their posts on the rare occasions when something of value is produced, but on the whole it isn't worth the effort.  It's not going to change anything.
                  
                  But Paul...if we could but persuade him to actually join a dialogue with truth and facts rather than simple, childish name calling we might have something worth reading.  Could be wrong, but I seem to recall in the past where thoughtful, reasoned, factual statements were being made.

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                     PrettyPantherposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                     Makes sense.

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            ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            Let me ask just where you attained such an in depth of knowledge of what a real leaders hair color should look like , Paul ,  I find your incredible wealth of delivered facts and truths almost as brilliant as say , that of  most eighteen years old's today !
            What ; Are you a D.C. beautician ?
            
            I'm impressed .

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         3. 88

            Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            Don't you mean the GOP--Grand Old Pedophiles?

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   2. 85

      Sharlee01posted 7 years agoin reply to this

      1.Has President Trump's sociopolitical policies & stance united or divided the United States among racial, gender, & socioeconomic lies?   The country is clearly divided., and has been for over 8 years.... It has become worse with the new president. In my opinion this is due to media bias. They constantly point out the division with nasty rhetoric.  (Just my opinion)) 2..Has President Trump create a rise of overt racism in the United States regarding his immigration policies? " The truth is he i making an attempt to respect and follow the immigration laws that were set long before he stepped into the WH.   3. What image is President Trump presenting to the world? That is yet to be seen?  So far he has made it a point to meet with many world leaders. I might add ,  rolled out the "red carpet" to welcome the new first couple. In regards to the UN, he has many countries paying their fair share. Where in the past they have not.  This is promising. Shows a true sign to other nations that we now have a president with strength. 4. Has the rest of world gained or lost respect for the United States as a result of President Trump?  It is clear that he has left an impression on the world, and it is yet to be determined if he will gain respect. Respect is earned, and not over night.  5..What type of legacy will President Trump leave for America? How would anyone know that as of yet?  One could take a view that he will fail, without any evidence or reason to do so. However, one could look at the short time he has been in office, and look at the accrual accomplishments he has brought about.   It seems in the end, we will just have to wait and see.

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   ahorsebackposted 7 years ago

   One , It's historical that "the rest of the world " only respects a strong and  independent American president , one who won't  soft shoe through foreign diplomacy like Obama did
   
   Two , No president in American history divided races ,hyper- fueled  such  racial divide and then inflamed those whom he divided as Pres. Obama did . That was wholly intentional and actually  Alinsky-ism at it's finest . Once historians get off their ideological a$$es , they will determine that that will be his legacy . The reinflammation of racism from it's once ,  almost  healed wounds . The overt racism ; was all Obama's.
   
   Three, Trump's legacy may grow beyond even Reagan's leadership  ,    Reagan couldn't drain the swamp ,    his tax reform , his border changes , his shaking up  of the two party useless quagmire of congress and senate ,   Trump will outgrow the left's childish direct  obstructionism and return America to higher standing all around.
   Trump has the ability to at least imagine term limits .
   
   And Trump single handedly saved this country from one more Clinton disaster ,  That alone will put him in the history books as a political hero .

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      Wesman Todd Shawposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      Bravo!
      Don't forget he's trying to save us from all the Islamic terrorism we see in Europe. And today the Supreme Court upheld the latest travel ban. I'm so thankful we're not being held hostage by some liberal judge in Hawaii with an agenda.
      
      The tax cuts are going to get done. The economy is going to heat up. There will probably be a hiccup at some point, but it's looking good.
      
      Then we've got Neil Gorsuch, and the Trump administration is filling so many lower level judicial seats with conservatives. It's absolutely wonderful.
      
      North Korea is our big problem, and why? Because none of the last many presidents did a damned thing about it. Trump will do whatever he can, he only has to.

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         ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

         Absolutely correct ,  I just love it that the obstructionist media is truly and completely melting down , while liberals have screamed "protect my free speech "  and  saluted  the  total blasphemy and biased hatred of the "news media" ,  the success' of Trumps first year are filling up the Christmas stockings .
         
         Next ------Term Limits !

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      jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      +1000%

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3. 91

   wildernessposted 7 years ago

   If Trump's immigration policies (closed borders, evict those here illegally) are considered racist, it is only by racists.  Color blind people find no problem with color blind policies.

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4. 84

   Marisa Wrightposted 7 years ago

   Ahorseback, you may like to think the rest of the world admires Trump - but I can tell you that in Australia (where I live) and in Britain (where most of my family lives), Trump is a laughing stock.  We still find it hard to believe that a civilised nation like America could elect such a person as their leader.  I have friends in some European countries who say the feeling is the same where they live.
   
   Of course the right-wing news sources you read, and the Russian propaganda channels, will say otherwise, so I know you'll simply choose to ignore what I say.
   
   If by "respect" you really mean "fear" - then you may be right, we do fear him, but not because we admire him.  We think he's a madman and we fear him because he's liable to do something really stupid on a whim.

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      ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      Marisa , You are correct , I don't care that the rest of the world dislikes Trump  .   I don't care that the people of the rest of the world don't like him ,  and I really don't care that the leaders of these same countries don't like  him . First , What is important is what the American people think  of him as their elected leader .  He was elected by us , the popular vote as you know doesn't elect our president .
      
      But by God these countries will respect if even learned out  of fear , Do you know why?   Because for too long they have run roughshod over our immigration policies , our economic strengths ,  our military contributions , our diplomatic  costs of blood and treasure ,  our corporate research and development rights , our military and space tech patents  ..........somebody stop me !
      
      Admire , respect ? Probably not , Fear , maybe that would be better  BUT they will all learn to step back and not constantly exploit America  for her always being the savior to every good cause  or humanitarian  act that the rest of Europe or the world usually ignores  .
      
      Those who elected him actually know the characteristics of a true leader ,  most obstructionist's do not !

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   2. 88

      Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      I couldn't have said it better myself! He has been uninvited to Britain, our greatest ally. "Fear" and "Respect" are different things. You earn respect. He is feared because he came into office with no knowledge of the American political system. And he makes no effort to learn.
      
      Insiders say all he does is watch himself on TV and tweet. Sadly, the country was very divided before he took office, but he sure knows how to add fuel to the fire.

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         ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

         The fact that the left doesn't even" get it " that your origins of "free speech "  , the media , are now the working medium of the insider establishment D.C. opposition to Trump  and change , tells me so much more about an ideology that  I  gave up on decades ago ,  That the left inside  and outside  of America , is totally spaced out on the surrealism of selfish entitlement and blind to any idea real progressiveness .
         
         God , I'm glad I evolved politically from everything the left represents today .

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         1. 88

            Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            The working poor and middle class will get very little of tax cuts. The rich are getting all the tax cuts, and we can't even deduct our mortgage interest anymore, the only thing I have left to deduct (besides the personal or family deduction). It's proven that when rich get more money, they do not hire more people or try to get that money into the economy. The sock it away in foreign accounts and lie on their income tax returns.
            
            A middle class or poor family will spend it right away, because they need things so badly. Boots and winter coats, supplies for school, tools to fix broken things because they can't afford handymen or professionals to come in. So THAT money does stimulate the economy. Oh, and they need food and medical care too. My neighbor has serious heart issues, and thanks to Obamacare, he is getting the tests and heart surgery he needs. This man works like a dog, sheet rocking and painting, very physical work, and was having episodes where he couldn't breathe. I've known him since HS, and he always worked, so don't even reply that those on Obamacare never worked.
            
            It's been shown in various studies that in 10 years the poor and middle class will be poorer. Also, for all the R's who pretend that other Presidents run up the National Debt, they are putting us in debt for another TRILLION dollars. This is an estimate, some say a half Trillion, some worse. George W. also ran up the debt, but you all still want to blame Obama.
            
            Get your heads out of you know where.

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               ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

               Jean , read through it again ,  if you as I are of the lower income brackets we will benefit from these cuts .  So we lose a couple of other deductions   Our overall tax deduction is higher . We win .    S.S.  retirement just announced a raise .   
               
               Why does the left call a tax cut , as somehow 'costing" us all more ?  Especially if  they profess to not be about wealth redistribution ?
               
               Isn't that just some code for ,   You no long are able to get more of what's mine ?

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               1. 88

                  Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                  No. I just think super rich people don't need tax cuts the way needy, poorer ones do.
                  
                  Also, thanks for reminding me about the SS benefit. I am on SS disability. However, I have a lot of health issues, and although I am getting $50.00 more monthly from SS, my medical Part B that I have to pay more for has gone up $100.00, or will beginning in January. So that makes me $50.00 poorer each month. I do receive about $1450.00 monthly from SS, but an unscrupulous insurance agent scammed me when my husband died, and I've been in costly lawsuits with both the insurance company, which I recently won, and now the IRS. The IRS taxed me 25% on what was life insurance money from my husband, and now I have to hire a forensic accountant to untangle the whole mess. They never should have taxed that money and it has stressed me out so much.
                  
                  So I have been living afraid to spend a penny that isn't necessary, this fight has been going on for almost 4 years now.
                  
                  I worked all my life too, until chronic, serious back pain kept me from doing so. And I worked P/T then.
                  
                  I just care too much about poor and working class people who haven't had decent raises in years, ahorseback. And I still feel the rich don't bother to put those tax cuts back into the economy. And why is the national debt going to grow so much? I took micro and macro economics at the college level, but it's really boring stuff . I wonder if anybody really understands it. And plus, it's a 500 page bill. I read fast, but I know none of those or few of them who will vote have bothered to read it.
                  
                  Thanks for your input though. I don't want to argue. We need to be able to have different views and not be mean spirited. I am a kind person and hate to see people suffering the way they are. I'm working on not being confrontational, but it's hard the way things are now. We have to change that.

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               Randy Godwinposted 7 years agoin reply to this

               Jean, I couldn't have said it better. It infuriates me when those on the right claim everyone else is wanting to take hard earned money from the rich. that shows they have no clue as to how the real world works. Big companies and corporations collude on the products they purchase for production, as well as, the prices charged for the finished product. It's a way to get around the monopoly laws.
               
               They manipulate the prices with similar companies although it's technically illegal. Ill gotten gains at any rate. Yep, We're trying to take THEIR money!

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                  Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                  Randy,
                  I see it that way too.
                  
                  But I don't want to waste anymore time on this forum, too many participants are never going to change the way they think. It's sad, the only thing in life that is inevitable is change. It seems certain people want to take the country back to the Civil War era. Even the Civil Rights laws of 1964 and Voting Rights laws of 1965 are not yet being honored. And don't get me started on Women's health! Take care.

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                     Randy Godwinposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                     Jean, don't give up. Just talk with reasonable folks and ignore the others as I've learned to do lately.

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               wildernessposted 7 years agoin reply to this

               "The rich are getting all the tax cuts, and we can't even deduct our mortgage interest anymore, the only thing I have left to deduct"
               
               Was your mortgage deduction more than the standard deduction?  The one that has doubled?  Mine never was, which means that my deductions would have gone UP, not down, with the increase in the standard deduction.
               
               "Also, for all the R's who pretend that other Presidents run up the National Debt, they are putting us in debt for another TRILLION dollars."
               
               From what I read, you're right.  The debt will increase some Trillion dollars.  Of course, what isn't being mentioned is that it will take 10 years to do that, and that that's the slowest pace (100B per year) that we've seen in a long, long time.  Don't forget, Obama did the same thing (increase the debt by a trillion $$) in just one year.
               
               "It's proven that when rich get more money <...> The(y) sock it away in foreign accounts and lie on their income tax returns."
               
               And they go to jail for it, too.  So why isn't anyone you consider "rich" already in jail?

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            4. 83

               GA Andersonposted 7 years agoin reply to this

               Hi Jean, I am wondering if your compassion for the poor, (and financially insecure), although admirable, might be clouding your perspective on these tax cuts being discussed.
               
               A quick Google search finds that at least half of all income tax filers, (surely your poor folks, and probably most of the lower middle class folks fall in that half), pay no Federal income taxes. How do you justify the complaint that these folks don't get a tax cut - when they are not paying Federal income  taxes to begin with?
               
               I am not defending Pres. Trump's tax plan - I haven't even checked it out, I am just questioning this public, (not just yours), complaint that the poor and lower middle class aren't getting their share of the tax cuts in his plan.
               
               GA

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                  Randy Godwinposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                  Hi GA, does the plan still net the Walden family 50 billion in tax cuts and the Koch Brothers 40? And does the majority of the tax cuts--was estimated at 80%--go to the top few percent? I haven't read the final version if there is one.

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                     wildernessposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                     Is it your stance that those paying the least amount of taxes get the bulk of tax cuts, further widening the unprincipled, unjustifiable and immoral inequality in the tax code in the name of wealth redistribution?

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                        Randy Godwinposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                        I made no such assertion, Dan. I simply stated the rich manipulate the middle class and the poor in unethical ways to increase their profits. Do we need to increase their profits even more? The middleclass would spend the cuts on local businesses as the rich pocket theirs. The cuts given to the middle and lower classes would be put back in the economy with the taxes from the cuts increasing many times over.
                        
                        Can you guarantee the rich will do the same with their billions in cuts? The rich already have enough money to create more jobs but they chose not to and instead give it to the greedy stockholders. How does this help everyone?

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                           wildernessposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                           "And does the majority of the tax cuts--was estimated at 80%--go to the top few percent?"
                           
                           Sorry - I took this as disapproval of the way the cuts were distributed.  And the latest post bears this out - you believe that those paying a tiny portion what the rich do should get the tax cuts. 
                           
                           I'd be interested in how you can justify increasing the inequality in the tax code, from a moral standpoint.  What reasoning (logical and moral) leads you to the conclusion that if a person has more money than you think they should that it means it actually belongs to someone else?  Hint: claiming that it was illegally gained won't work...unless you can provide proof of the claim.  And claiming that the rich are greedy - as the poor demand that they be given that money without effort on their part - as a reason won't work either as we're ALL greedy for more.

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                  2. 83

                     GA Andersonposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                     I don't know the details either Randy, so let's just go with the concepts.
                     
                     Your view is that the tax cuts "net" someone a windfall of money, my view is that a tax cut "let's them keep" more of their own money. I see that as a big difference in perspectives.
                     
                     How else can your view be seen, if not as a concept that it's not really their money?
                     
                     To your last point about who gets the cuts - I answered that in my response to Jean. I expect you might have seen that, so asking me again just means you disagree.
                     
                     How would you answer the question about why folks not paying Federal income taxes aren't getting Federal income tax cuts differently?
                     
                     GA

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                        Randy Godwinposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                        I didn't comment on those not paying taxes because I still don't know the details, GA. I do know the rich manipulate prices on many things. Should they be rewarded by a huge tax cut as well?
                        
                        And are you saying many of the ultra rich only got what they earned legally and ethically? Do you also believe monopolies aid our economy for everyone, or merely the rich? It seems that way to me.

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                        1. 83

                           GA Andersonposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                           Randy, it is no wonder we can't agree, we are talking about different topics. I was talking about the tax cuts, and you are talking about the greedy and evil Rich Folks.
                           
                           Monopolies, price manipulation, and how they earned their wealth aren't part of the topic I addressed. Your questions to me about them are your own creation - not a reasonable inference from my statements.
                           
                           GA

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                              Randy Godwinposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                              You're correct in that I was speaking of the conservatives giving huge tax cuts to the greedy rich with their ill gotten gains. I thought I made that plain. Who do you wish the majority of the tax cuts go to? And do you think "trickle down economics" will ever work?

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                              1. 83

                                 GA Andersonposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                 Well, your questions are a different conversation aren't they Randy?
                                 
                                 But I will give you one brief answer relevant to the topic. I think all the tax cuts should go to the people that actually pay Federal income taxes. The proportioning of that distribution is a matter of the details of the plan - something I am not familiar with.
                                 
                                 But... conceptually speaking, I do think that the majority of the cuts should go to the folks that pay the majority of the actual tax monies. And that would be those greedy and evil Rich Folks that you are condemning.
                                 
                                 Our friend Google can provide you with support of my contention, ("The top 1 percent paid a greater share of individual income taxes (39.5 percent) than the bottom 90 percent combined (29.1 percent)"  Summary of the Latest Federal Income Tax Data, 2016 Update), so how can you support your contention that those that pay the least should get the most?
                                 
                                 As for your "trickle down" question... start a thread. I would be happy to participate.
                                 
                                 GA

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               2. 88

                  Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                  GA,
                  
                  I say this in sincerity, and have not read the bill either. But I've heard a lot about it.
                  
                  People making at or less than $10,000.00 per year are getting a tax INCREASE (not yet, but a few years down the road). It may not be much, but if you make below minimum wage for 40 hours a week, you can't afford much. In the area where I live, you can't get into an apartment with rent less than $1,000.00 a month. This could be a 2 BR apt. and let's say a husband and wife trying to swing this have 2 kids. Plus, in NJ, you need 1 1/2 months security to get into that overpriced apartment to begin with. So it costs $2500.00 to get a roof over your head. That includes no utilities, and often the apt. doesn't have a refrigerator. Of course, nobody cares about homelessness anymore, we just accept it.
                  
                  Now, I could argue that maybe such a poor couple shouldn't have had 2 kids. But Trump and the religious right want to make it almost impossible to get access to free or cheap birth control by closing  Planned Parenthood, who would assist in these matters, or letting religious fanatic employers decide who they allow to get health care. Recall, this is a secular country. At least Obamacare helped poor families HAVE families, and supported women. Does Trump have to worry about how many kids his multiple wives pump out? Of course not, he doesn't give a damn. According to Ivana, he ignores them until they get to college age.
                  
                  Also, is the corner office so important for the CEO who is going to give himself a 10 million dollar raise for doing nothing except stare out the window while he transfers his money all day? And this will give him a heart attack because he is so sedentary. But he can afford the best medical care available, like our Congress who does nothing reasonable. So there is an unfair burden on the couple who both work for minimum wage and have to worry if they have children that they have no quality of life to give them.
                  
                  Also, often tax credits don't help people who have to FRONT the money first. They already had to do without whatever health or educational needs they had, because they don't have that money to put out. When Obama was POTUS, my son was in college. We got pretty generous tax help on education. But my husband and I had to "borrow" our own 401k money FIRST before we got the refund. We both worked hard when young and could afford it, and our son went to a state college, as he had an internship going near home that led to his career anyway. Getting a Grinch like credit after the fact doesn't help people who need help at the time they need it. Tax credits just don't work for anyone who isn't upper middle class.
                  
                  Let's be honest. Congress rushed this tax bill through because they wanted it to look like the Trump administration actually did something in his first year (something that didn't rob from the poor to give to the rich, or just cause controversy, his main goal). None or few of them read it.

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                     GA Andersonposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                     I understand your perspective Jean, and think there are valid observations in the points you make. I just don't think they are relevant to the tax cut discussion - relative to who gets them. And that was the point I addressed.
                     
                     GA

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                     wildernessposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                     The standard deduction for a couple filing jointly is $12,700.  It doubles under the new plan, to 24,400.  Suddenly that couple making $10,000 isn't going to pay any more taxes than they did under the old plan; i.e. zero.  Even if it were a single person with no children they would have a standard deduction of $12,700 and pay nothing (unlike under the current plan).  Don't know where you're getting your information, but it isn't accurate.

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                        Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                        Wilderness,
                        
                        The IRS has enough of the life insurance money from my husband's death that I am suing them to get back. They owe me over $100,000.00. We worked hard for that, and I was a widow taxed in a 25% range for something untaxable. It was an unscrupulous insurance agent (though we had him for over 30 years and he seemed trustworthy) who took advantage of me when I was grief stricken and tried to put my finances in order too soon. Because of this illegal taxing of life insurance money left to me, my SS went down, and I've been living at a much lower level than at any time in my life.
                        
                        And I know that it will take years to get it back, although they would seize my home in an instant if I owed them that much. So I thought I would be able to maintain my lifestyle, which was modest to begin with. Now it's a big deal if I can order a pizza once a week. I thought I could have a decent, if lonely, life without him, but now I can't even afford to get out of the house much.
                        
                        Taxes still hurt poor people, or people like me, whose only error was sorrow and shock.
                        
                        Ahorseback, the word hate isn't even part of my vocabulary. But I can spot a person who is not astute or politically aware enough of the country and others in the world to be running it, without hating him/her. And people I know around the world think Trump is a dangerous idiot.

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               jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

               That is a lie. The rich, people earning above $250k will have their taxes increased instead of decrease.
               The average income people will get a tax cut proportional to how much they pay in taxes.
               Some at the low income end will have their taxes elliminated with even some tax credits.
               The biggest change is to corp. income tax which will be reduced to around 20% comparable to most other nations...
               
               The net effect, should be to stimulate the economy, increase the GDP and help bring manufacturing jobs back to the US...
               
               In fact, just the gains of 20% of the DOW this year will add to the wealth of most Americans who either own stocks or have 401K plans or invest in mutual funds, that is more than 60% of the population.

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                  ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                  Jack for Jean Bakula's  benefit , I won't call all of that a lie BUT I will say that she like so many are so embedded  in a wash of fear mongering , political hatred and  media bias that truth seems of little use to them .     Why would  essentially the richest guy in the US ,  a US. President  who takes no salary , who has more money than God , who employ's  essentially more people than Disney , would invoke a plan that would  TAKE more  money  from us little people than give us ?   
                  
                  One more senseless interpretation .

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                     jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                     I agree...
                     Sometimes the simplest explanatoon is the best, occam’s razor.
                     
                     Instead of looking for some evil motives of Trump...
                     Just take him at his word.
                     The reason he ran for president of the US is he wants to save America for his grand kids...
                     He found among the 16 other GOP candidates lacking in the will to win against the Clinton machine.
                     As it turned out, he was right...as much as I liked Carson and Cruz... they could not survive the Clinton attacks...
                     Trump won and the rest is history...

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                        ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                        You nailed it ! By the way Jack , I read your  profile ,did you work for IBM in  Plattsburg NY. or Burlington Vt?

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                           jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                           I worked in Fishkill, NY, then Kingston, NY and finally at the Watson Lab. In Yorktown Heights, NY, all in the beautiful Hudson Valley of NY State.

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                           1. 78

                              jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                              By the way, you can read about my career at IBM in my autobiography published here on Hubpages... it is a bit long and took me six months to complete.

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                  2. 88

                     Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                     Trump changed his mind and does actually take the salary now. And he benefits from his Trump Hotel in DC, which is against the law. A President is not supposed to use his Presidency to make money, and he does it every time someone stays there. He never gave up interests in his own main business either. Do you honestly believe he gets together with the family and they don't get advice or speak about the real estate biz? Come on.
                     
                     But Hillary gets insulted and everyone insinuates the Clinton Foundation is a money laundering scheme. Get over her, it's so last year. When Trump was running for the office, I read in Time that a group of people called every charity they could think of, and he never contributed to ANY of them in his life.
                     
                     And now he's going to save the country for his kids by coal mining in western National Parks, a dying way of life and reversal of Teddy Roosevelt's visionary act of putting aside our most beautiful lands for National Parks? Really Jacklee, this is beyond the pale even for you. Thank God I drove through the whole country twice when I was in my 20's, before it was destroyed. Back when I had that Datsun that got 40 MPG on gas.
                     
                     I don't think anybody has read this tax bill (including me). We are all depending on different sources. But who to trust?

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                        ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                        Jean , Jean , Jean ....Trump donates his salary quarterly ,   every president who actually owned a business at least know what one is and the importance of ALL their  success' , Neither Obama or Clinton's ever owned anything but a taxpayer funded pay check , how does that qualify them to run a capitalist country?
                        
                        The coal industry;  you should get out of the city and see how much coal is an integral part of U.S. life. Maybe it's time to actually -read the REAL tax bill Jean . Just try it , .........we might all learn it's benefit's together .  Do you really think Trumps still needs to "..........use his presidency to make money........ "  If all Trump made for money was the same salary Obama did , where is the fault there ?  He needs nor want's either , a salary or  to have  Putin rent a hotel room from him .
                        
                        Stop listening to all the media bias Jean ,it  just makes you angry.

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                           Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                           Coal is filthy and too many people have died of black lung and cave ins. I live near PA and have driven across most of this country twice, as I said in an earlier post. Why aren't we still looking for alternate ways of energy? Other parts of our country are, and other countries are way ahead of us in this.
                           
                           There is no record of Trump ever donating anything to anyone. When he pardoned the Thanksgiving turkey, he still took it as an opportunity to brag about himself, instead of wishing everyone a blessed holiday. His tweet storms show how childish and unstable he is, and whether he needs the money or not, he still is illegally making it from his Presidency. Other Presidents gave their businesses over or at least showed their income tax returns. He's hiding his.
                           
                           Now he is saying his voice was dubbed on the Access Hollywood tape, and saying Obama is Kenyan again. Ahorseback, you are too smart to pretend all this isn't happening. Melania swats his hand away when he tries to touch her, her disgust for him is even clear. She stays feet away from him in public.
                           
                           Both Clinton and Obama were highly educated. They were reasonable. Trump was the Bully in Chief at his business, we see as President that's all he does. He can't make a deal, he makes threats. We have one person negotiating when North Korea is ready to start a nuclear war.
                           
                           I'm fed up with closed minded zombies trying to tell me I am hateful and angry. I am a licensed therapist and work all day either in person or many nights online working with people in our country and others, who need help and have nobody to talk to. People who are my friends and know me think I am pragmatic, spiritual and gentle.
                           
                           I was feeling happy about Christmas and other things when I got on this forum earlier, and found that my mood dropped so far from all this negativity. I am not the angry one. I clearly see a man who is not intelligent, unable to run a Country, and his followers who defend him no matter how crazy or ridiculous he is. Did you ever read The Emperor's New Clothes? It's a children's book which is eerily descriptive of Trump's Presidency. You are mostly the ones who grovel to tell him how great his new clothes are, even though he is naked.
                           
                           I am not subjecting myself to a group of brainwashed people unwilling to look at anything other than one point of view. Maybe see you on a writing forum or something like that. I'm just telling you what I see, and what many others see. Open your eyes. Trump is destroying our country and embarrassing us all over the world.

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                              Randy Godwinposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                              As many of us have discovered, it's useless to argue with a Trump proponent, Jean. It does indeed create animosity for those who debate those who refuse to recognize facts and destroys one's feelings of well being.

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                              ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                              Jean ; That whole tirade  shows nothing but the fact that a lot of people here are grossly uninformed of political and media reality .  You are listening to a media extremely slanted to fantasia .  Give us some fact not fantasy , truth not  tirade !
                              
                              Your blind hatred of the man is so obvious as to be childishly uninformed.

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                                 Jean Bakulaposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                 Thanks Randy,
                                 That wasn't a tirade, it was merely a list of facts any sane person can clearly see about this POTUS. They are proven by his TV appearances, his tweets, and his rampages which WH insiders openly discuss.
                                 
                                 It's impossible to talk with irrational people. What I can't understand is the hatred spewing Trump lovers who are trying to paint me in their ugly colors. I actually read and get most of my information that way. It's sad that they believe what we can see is wrong just by observing. I don't want to discuss anything with closed minded people who are so mean spirited. They have one view of a crazy man and will insist he is doing a great job, when all I am doing here is making observations.
                                 
                                 Life is too short to waste time on them.
                                 
                                 Best Regards, Jean

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                                    ahorsebackposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                    The problem isn't that you're reading , It's actually what you're reading .    As is the case with ALL  Trump opposition . That cannot be denied .   I'm actually  not trying to change anyone's mind  on the left , why I remain  here in HP forums is simply because of the 80 - 90 percent of constant media bias ,  one fact about the political right----- is that they speak less than the left does .
                                    
                                    I speak for them . Those that read and are actually more informed than the left but simply remain almost silent . It's a tough job trying to restore and remain some ideological balance in media , but I must persevere !
                                    
                                    Best regards to you too.
                                    .

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   Jayqueposted 7 years ago

   Common response by those who find reason to complain rather than get involved in the process of positive change and unity.

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6. 100

   Glenis Rixposted 7 years ago

   I couldn’t have put it better. You took the words from my mouth

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