I feel outsourcing work from US to countries like India are going to make not so rich people jobless and poorer
It's true one way some people are losing jobs due to outsourcing,yet overall US is making more net profit and also can make their product more cost effective and competitive in the world market,it's the best solution for US to compete against low price china products and services.
Well that alone won't make people poorer. What will is the rising cost of government, and our ridiculous monetary policy. Today it was reported that a number of countries are moving to remove the dollar as the basic currency of international trade for oil! This will have disastrous effects on the US economy especially sine we've expanded the money supply, actually doubling it in order to fight the economic crisis. This economic weakness is what's making these countries move against us and we are likely to see inflation that we haven't seen sine Jimmy Carter was president eroding what remains of the wealth we have that's already been decimated in the economic meltdown!
The fact that countries are moving away from the dollar is not a surprise, but it didn't stop Obama from diluting the value of our money. Look for astonishment and outrage from Washington; they will play dumb.
They can play dumb if they like but many of us are paying attention and I predict the dems are going to get swept from office en masse come 2010!
Oh baby! I hope so.
500 more people were laid off today by the company that makes our Space Shuttle booster rockets.
Here's the change we voted for.
We're going to get poorer because our money is becoming more worthless by the day.
Unless we find a substitute for fiat currency...
And we'll have less and less of it. Did you know that Obama signed an executive order, which was just released at 3am, in the middle of the night, in which he ammended the Energy Policy of 2005? This is just another underhanded way of implementing the new Cap & Trade bill soon to surface, as just another cut in American jobs.
Most things made in Asia are made there because of the large availablity of cheap labor. This is the most expensive part of any manufacturing cost and one that truly determines the viability of a products selling point. Unfortunately the jobs that were once a part of Americas backbone to the economy are moving very quickly to the far east as a race to the bottom. Many companies employ children and have indentured labor doing the sewing and assembling that American labor cannot equal wage wise.
If we are to compete with Asia to get our manufacturing base back it will take lowering our standard of living and watching the rich get richer. A good thing if you are rich.
You are wrong then aren't you, because that defies basic economics. If Americans outsource work then they are importing, the less money they have the less money they spend on imports. If India relies on providing services to America, thus America is India's customer, then please explain how outsourcing will make America poorer. Please explain how manufacturing Nike trainers in the third world has made America 'poorer' and please define 'poor' as quality of life is the greatest indicator. If Americans are purchasing goods and services at a lower price, then they are in fact getting more for their money.
Please do not make me explain this again, but we live in a globalised society. If Nike pay Indians a low wage to manufacture trainers, and sells them to Europe, this is actually generating money for America. Cue less America sweatshops, better working conditions for Americans (white collar jobs, counting cash basically).
Yes, some lower paid jobs in America will be lost in the short run, but show me a country that does not import and I will give you every penny in my Adsense account. India purchased two nuclear submarines from Russia for billions of dollars, did this take jobs away from India? No, because nobody in India was making Nuclear submarines in the first place.
Read about Balance of payments, trade deficits. America is trading at a deficit, but I can assure you that this has little to do with India and a lot more to do with the Military operations. And I say that as somebody that is not American.
Ryan, I understand the pure logic of what you're saying here, but what about the jobs lost in call centres etc? These people often end up on benefits, thus making the country poorer.
The call centre one is a bad one admittedly, and a good example. I myself come from a place where a few thousand jobs were lost to India. In fact I am not afraid to admit that I always immediately ask to talk to an English person when they call, no shame in that.
But I am afraid that this doesn't neccessarily make the country poorer. Those businesses are public limited companies, floated on western stock markets, profit margins increase and thus so do stock dividends. I am going to sound very right wing here, whilst in fact I consider myself to be liberal, but we all have the option of taking our money and investing it into stock markets. In fact, that is where my adsense money goes. And that is where your pension contributions go. I am currently unemployed, but I have more of an issue with immigration than outsourcing. We have let more than 3 million people into our country in the past 20 years, and there are currently just under 3 million people unemployed.... go figure
People in our county have accrued stupid amounts of debt to live beyond thier means, and then moan about the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer whilst they spend hundreds of pounds a month on interest payments. The only neccessary debt in the UK is a mortgage.
We live in a globalised society, I own shares in Indian companies, I own shares in UK companies. If outsourcing work to India makes UK companies stronger, and Indian people stronger, then it is up to people to work out how that can make them richer. Ask yourself whether people need to buy designer clothes, expensive drinks, fast cars..... if it is at the expense of share investments and pension pots.
Sorry for the long essay, but the UK's primary export is financial services. 75% of financial services jobs in the UK cannot be lost, actually cannot be taken out of the country, and outsourcing so called lower end jobs does protect that. Our financial services sector exports at a huge surplus, call centre jobs go hand in hand with that.
To put this into perspective, I currently make about 7% annual dividends on my share portfolio - give or take 1% in these volatile times. I wont tell you how many I have. My best friend is 25 years old, and for the past 7 years has paid about £125 per month in interest on a loan for a sporty car and a year travelling. He also spends about £150 on getting pissed. If he had bought a cheaper standard car, not gone travelling, and spent £100 a month going out instead.... then thats £225 a month (ignoring inflation) that he could have invested.
With constant zero growth he would have £18900 in shares, thats £1323 a year in dividends. If his investments had grown as much as mine over that time, then they effectively would have doubled in value. So thats £2646 a year in dividends. Carry that on for his lifetime, and remember that he can invest in Indian companies if he wishes, and he will end up earning more money in dividends from developing economies then he could ever make working for £6 an hour in a call centre.
We lost manufacturing, and turned into a service based economy, India is effectively doing so now. Economies change with technology, and the key to that is education. People always moan about the rich becoming richer, but my best friend the kids tennis coach could be getting richer too. How many shares in UK companies do Indians hold? Not many at the moment. How many shares do the British hold in Indian companies? A bloody lot, and if you want to be part of that it will only cost you a £2.50 stransaction fee to buy them.
Sorry, but thats my take.
Your words> People in our county have accrued stupid amounts of debt to live beyond thier means, and then moan about the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer whilst they spend hundreds of pounds a month on interest payments. The only neccessary debt in the UK is a mortgage.
We live in a globalised society, I own shares in Indian companies, I own shares in UK companies. If outsourcing work to India makes UK companies stronger, and Indian people stronger, then it is up to people to work out how that can make them richer. Ask yourself whether people need to buy designer clothes, expensive drinks, fast cars..... if it is at the expense of share investments and pension pots.
I like your thoughts here, if you get lemons, turn them to lemon aid and sell it!
It is about free enterprise and trade, and I must say, although I hate to see out-sourced jobs for anyone, that it makes sense to take hold of your own way.
Jon in Nashville
I'll just answer one point you make. "We have let more than 3 million people into our country in the past 20 years, and there are currently just under 3 million people unemployed.... go figure.
Are you speaking legally or illegally? With over 20 million illegal aliens, you might be talking this year alone.
There is a listing on Craigslist almost every other day for more telemarketers in America around here LOL.
Same here, is one of the jobs that nobody wants to do in the UK. Is the last resort for me, well after McDonalds.
Ryan, If you impress so many on this site; why are you unemployed? What did you do? Your job went to India, it must have been low level. But too many you are an expert on economics; how is this possible?
Harvey Stelman, one Indian man claims that I am an expert in economics. To the contrary, my economics modules at uni were my weakest. I am not self-proclaiming anything, so dont need to answer your other questions. I am sure that if I told you that my degree was in Property, you can figure this out for yourself. The UK property market collapsed in tandem with the USA, there are many property professionals out of a job. As to whether or not I need a job desperately enough to work in a call centre, my financial situation is none of your concern. I can choose unemployment without guilt, as long as I am sustaining myself and not reliant on state handouts. Any further questions in relation to my personal life or credentials? Would you like to know my waist size? Or my telephone number?
No, they go out and find new jobs. The Liberal mindset is to pay them to sit home.
My dad lost his job. He was making a great living at a company that just couldn't afford to keep him. He also had another job he worked on the weekends (mostly for fun). Unemployment pays $275/ week and he works his other job more now to try and make some extra $$. He is not being paid to sit at home.
Unemployment pays you to sit at home. If he's doing other things, I respect him for that.
Unemployment eases a little bit of the burden of not having a steady paycheck. $275/week for a family of five is hardly paying someone to stay home.
What she means maybe is that the payment given to sit at home is not enough to make a decent living !
The more rich one is the more is the benefit of Globalization!
Hmmmm, you pay into the system through tax so whats the problem with getting some of your money back?
The tax shouldn't be levied in the first place. The federal government shouldn't be in the business of subsidizing unemployment.
Well the tax is levied and the government gives some people their money back, for a short while. Then they tax it again, I don't begrudge anyone for getting back what is rightfully theirs!
So you are in favor of capping the payout to what was paid in?
Unfortunately that would leave an almighty hole in the budget, lets call it 'war'.
Sure, if that was the only tax levied. But we are taxed at every turn so the 12 or so weeks that unemployment is received is fine with me!
I thought you were a conservative. I had no idea you favored distribution of wealth to that extent.
I am so sad today...
Getting ones money back is conservative! I have never received a dimes worth of unemployment because I have never been unemployed! If you think that is a redistribution of wealth thats fine, I consider it getting some of my money back.
How would you suggest we help those that through no fault or their own become unemployed in a time such as we have now?
I think it is you that lacks true understanding. What happened when we lost industries to overseas producers? The workers that were working in good enviornments were out of wor; what happened to them? They were trained to work in another industry, such as computers. Factory workers did not do well enough in these jobs, so we bring in immigrants to work or we outsource. What happens to these workers now?Either their unions protect them or they have to be re-trained.
You seem to be very far to the left with your thinking. The pendulum has swung left for too long, so the public wants it to swing in the other direction. I think you may be in for a shock when the next election comes.
Actually outsourcing is a side effect of capitalism. Protectionism and distribution of wealth is a socialist ideal, so maybe you need to look in the mirror. Industries evolve, the UK was one the worlds leading hub for manufacturing, the last big boom was service-led. Now that service jobs are departing to India, something else will take its place. The UK is leading the world in energy efficiency and renewable energy technologies, which looks like the next big thing.
You are a self proclaimed capitalist, and yet you can come on here and accuse me of being 'left wing' for pointing out that the West has made a lot of money from outsourcing? American Corps are probably the worlds largest outsourcers. Is it nationalism that you want? The only way to protect domestic jobs is to introduce trade bariffs, quotas, and nationalise industries. The very things that you habitually preach against. So much for your free market ideals hey? Now your crying for the government to protect jobs? Guess what Harvey, they require your tax money to do so. Restrict imports, and the rest of the world will surely follow. To do so you need to be confident of self sufficiency. Stop importing then you stop exporting, so you can wave goodbye to Nike and Co.
Its you that is swinging further to the left Harvey, welcome to liberal thinking. You might enjoy it. We will go to Mardi Gras together next year yeah?
Ryan I might have differed from you in the beginning, but now it looks like we agree on some things.....
India was more socialistic until recent times..... That time they (Indian Govt.) let US Majors MNCs come in and buy 1000s of Indian Companies or push them to bankruptcy.... They even preached capitalism...
Now when US is facing the same heat..... people are talking of protectionism and socialism....
If what you say is true then we should be making more money and able to spend more on products and services.
The sad fact of the matter is that while america is showing growing savings and sales of goods from overseas the middle class income has been stagnated for the last 10 years.
Then who is making these profits I speak of, the top 10% of America. They control 95% of the income in this country. So if capatalism works so well it is not so well for the middle class.
Instead of drawing political identities to people maybe we should try and see what is working for us in the trenches and not keep bailing out the exhalted 1% that have been and are now capitalizing on so many peoples misfortune.
"Hate the rich". Have you ever asked a poor person for a job?
Capitalism works beautifully for the middle class. Poor people become middle class people all the time. We live in a free country. People are free to improve themselves.
Like you just did?
The top 1% also pay FORTY PERCENT of the income taxes. Perhaps we should be grateful. They provide jobs when they buy luxury cars and big homes. They employ people. They take risks that the middle class aren't willing to take.
Continue your culture war and vilify the rich; we will have fewer jobs, fewer entrepreneurs, fewer employers, fewer tax dollars.
What planet are you from? Do the math you just quoted. If the rich are paying 40% of the income taxes owning 95% of the wealth then I guess it is by far fairer that we the working class should pay the remaining 60% of the taxes with 1% of the wealth. Wake up and smell the coffee. You have been fed this load for so long you take it as gospel.
I guess your idea is to appreciate the paltry amount of our money that the rich allow us to have.
The large corporations pay zero taxes and get subsidies from us to help them.
The problem is that you can find no middle ground and vilify through name calling all those with a different point of view.
This country is falling behind and just as the wealthy have done in the past with their greedy ways they suck the economy dry with their misdirection and politics. You are soooooooo naive.
I guess the Planet of Common Sense. Perhaps that's why you and I are so far apart.
Last I checked we don't pay taxes on what we control, just what we earn. You'd better double-check your 1040.
I'm just trying to feed you some common sense. Eat up.
I am allowed to have as much as I can earn. You are welcome to blame a Nasty Rich person for your shortcomings, but I'll pass.
Every corporation should pay zero taxes. The employees and the shareholders pay them anyway. I thought you were pro middle class?
I haven't vilified you. I called you nothing but a Liberal. Does that offend you? I am careful not to resort to name calling in my posts. We can disagree without becoming disagreeable.
I agree that our politicians are greedy and misdirected. It's not because they are rich, however.
We were only talking about income taxes. Your argument has become a moving target. If you think property tax should be progressive, you are beyond my ken.
We do agree on the politicians, however. I trust that you loathe the rich Kennedys and Obamas as much as the rich Bushs. yes?
"allow us to have"?! The 'rich' aren't the ones that "allow" you to have YOUR money or not, the government is. Keep that in mind when voting.
I conclude that his built-in excuse for his social and financial status is that Rich People kept him down. I can't imagine any other reason for such bitterness toward a class of people.
I can't imagine complaining about being allowed to keep one's money and then encouraging a government bent on taking more of it.
I don't know that he said that, but generally most people who are anti-rich are pro big government.
It's almost funny; a poor person might be anti-middle class because from the poor perspective no one 'above' them pays enough taxes. I wonder how a Liberal would react to seeing the middle class vilified by the poor.
Then why do I get left holding the bill as a taxpayer?
The rich are taxpayers also. I quoted you the stat: the top 1% of filers pay 40% of the taxes. That's too much.
Oh really who bailed them out this past winter. Oh I get it they paid into the taxes fund with their taxes and and lost their shirts and then we bailed them out so they get paid twice when we bailed them out. Once when they got paid their commissions and once when they got replentished for the poor investment.
Mabye because you keep voting for people who hand you that bill (at the point of a gun).
I agree.... wherever it is ..... Rich gets richer... be it any country.... call it whatever..... Capitalism or Socialism.... all is just to fool the ordinary class..... Whatever is followed in any country.... it is only on paper and words.... no it action........ the rich is powerful..... they get to manipulate facts....
I am really not so great in Economics so can you explain to me...
In India a person may be ready to do an office job for $1 per hour where as an American is ready to do that may be for $5 (say). Now if 1 lakh such jobs are transferred to India which could have been done in US (unlike Russian submarines bought by India which were not being made in India). What will those US 1 lakh people do?
If they remain jobless, even Wal-mart is not going to provide them grocery assuming US economy will revive and they will get a job and then they will pay!
Will the Rich Multinational Companies Offer No Interest Loans? Will Multinational Economists pay a part of their salary considering that ultimately it is benefiting everyone !
So until the economy comes to normal... what about the jobloss due to outsourcing ?
Look, lets put this in simple terms. If the Nike Corporation produced trainers in Mumbai, but wages in Mumbai became more expensive, say $1 an hour, and they could pay people 50 cents an hour in Bangledesh. They would shift production to Bangledesh. Lets say that the entire cost of production of each pair of trainers is $4 in Mumbai. These cost $3 in Bangledesh.
They produce 10000 pairs of trainers a day, these cost $40000 in Mumbai but $30000 in Bangledesh. Nike then exports these trainers directly to Japan, lets say transportation costs Nike $2 a pair. Thats $20000 in physical transportation costs, so that would cost $5 in Bangledesh or $6 in Mumbai.
Nike then sells these trainers to their license holders/distributors/wholesalers in Japan for $30 per pair. That is $300,000. They take this money in revenue. Nike have cut their costs by $10,000. This is $10,000 extra on the bottom line.
What you really need to determine is who gets this $10,000 in extra cash? Ultimately it is the share holders. These can be everyday people like me. At the moment they are very unlikely to be everyday people like you. Only when Indian's are buying equity stakes in western businesses will the West be losing money as a result of outsourcing. As it happens I do not and will not buy shares in Nike, I cannot stand that business, but I hope that gives you at least a little insight.
Free4india, another brief example.
I own £269 of shares (sell price) in an Indian business, thats roughly $450. I could probably buy $160 of shares in Indian businesses every month, if I was working 40 hours per week on the British Minimum wage. I actually paid £200 for those shares 4 months ago.
I have just been paid a £54 dividend, a share of the profits of that business. If the employees of that business are making $1.50 per hour for a 40 hour week and have done for the past 16 weeks, then they have been paid $960.
If I sold my shares right now, and added profit to my dividend, I would have made $196.80 from that business without lifting a finger. And that is why the growth of Indian business can benefit me. If I had invested £1500 into that company, which most British people could probably afford, I would have made more money from India in 4 monhts than the employees had been paid.
So India's growth, to western investors, is a purely positive thing.
Your ideas seem to be a little bit over the head though some of them are making sense for me.....
Sorry nothing personal, but I am not so deep into economics regardless of whether this is too much of economics for others.
My perspective is Layman's not Lehman's
Ryan you seem to know a lot about this topic, which I think might make an interesting hub. Don't you think?
Lol, no probably not..... it would be one of those where 'anonymous' leaves me a comment every 5 seconds disagreeing with my points.... I prefer to write about simple things, like facebook
Ryan I was talking to an English born Indian the other day and he was talking about shares he has bought in Indian companies. I have been thinking about this for a long time but years ago my dad was stung bad in the last recession. Do you think things are stable enough to think about going down this road as I have income that would benefit investment in a more positive way than I am getting at the moment. What is the best way to go about buying shares? Any good websites I could look at? I know there are risks, but it sounds like if I could get some advice it may well be worth my while.
Thats a hard one. I started out blind and did ok, but certainly dont feel that I am in any position to offer share advice. I would stick with shares listed on the main markets such as the FTSE 100 or FTSE 250 if you want to go lower risk. Smaller markets such as the AIM can offer some fantastic returns, but those businesses are always going to be more susceptible to changes in the market.
I am no expert on the subject Helen, and normally just read the main financial sites such as FT to see what the markets are saying. I use a broker which is well suited to novices such as me, share.com, which can charge as little as £2.50 to purchase a holding. They have quite a strong 'tipping' system, which draws on the advice of primary brokers. They are more likely to be right than me. For example, most of the media has been saying that Vodafone are likely to be a good longer term investment..... and there will be a good reason behind that.
Perhaps the best option if you are risk adverse is to invest in funds, some of my best returns have come from those. A fund will typically do nothing expect from invest in a particular market, so you could buy £100 of shares in a fund, and that fund is actually just a holding of shares in 200 different businesses of varied risk. Thats the way that I have been going recently, its not very often that a large fund goes bust.
I read through your theories and I don't agree. When you lose jobs due to a compamies lowering its' costs you lose jobs or lower your income. As your income dives so do your opportunities to buy products produced through lowering costs. It's a race to the bottom with the few who rise above through this chain of events become rich and are above the much poorer. If your theory is correct then why is it 1% of the population hold 95% of the wealth? The last ten years have seen the greatest transfer of wealth in the history of mankind. The erosion of the middle class has come about due to this downward race.
"The last ten years have seen the greatest transfer of wealth in the history of mankind."
This is an absolutely ridiculous statement, in the short history of America maybe. It is more possible than ever for normal everyday people to become millionaires. I dont buy into your own theory either.
If you want to counter me with facts then I will counter you with mine. 80% of Americans with a net wealth of $5m or more grew up in middle or lower class families.
Maybe there is a greater rich-poor divide amongst developed nations, although a select few distort this figure significantly. But you clearly have no understanding of the way that the world worked as little as 50 years ago. Where you had to be rich to attend university, rich to get a good job.
Elitism has gone, the class system exists only for those that believe that they are oppressed or those void of ambition. A survey from the BBC found that 60% of UK millionaires were from lower or lower middle class upbringings. Only 2 of the richest self made millionaires in the UK went to university.
99% of self made millionaires make their money from selling a service or a product, and investing their income into financial products. The other 1% do something like write a bestseller or are sportsmen.
America has a short history of course, so you wouldnt understand the principles of land ownership in England in the middle ages. And how each county in England is in fact a large piece of land owned by one person, who would be able to charge as much rent as they wish to the millions of paupers.
This society is less elitist than ever. I will concentrate on investing my spare cash, and you can claim that this will not make me richer. I suppose what you really believe in is socialism? Unfortunately that wont give you a more enjoyable life, you either join the rat race of you dont. And if you dont, then you will stay grounded.
Another tip, a self made millionaire works for an average of 60 hours per week. So get cracking
Nicely Stated, and Correct in my humble opinion. The vast middle class was and is the true strength of the U.S., that we are destroying it, is destroying us.
If you're concerned that, in response to economy/job loss in the US, American companies will start pulling all their outsourced jobs back to the US (leaving India with fewer available jobs), here's a link that would suggest otherwise:
http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/ATT- … -US-100570
Based on that article, the claim is that many outsourced jobs would not have gone to Americans anyway. The claim is that there aren't enough trained Americans for some of those jobs.
As for whether, in the long run, outsourced jobs will lead to Americans being poorer overall, I don't think so. Americans will just do different types of work.
Larger economic picture aside, a US company that outsources jobs like call-center jobs saves money. That's why they do it. In the US people are paid, I believe, around $10 or $12 an hour for that kind of job. I don't know what people in India are paid, but I know that a US writer will often get (at minimum) $15 or $20 for a web article, while job-match sites with writers from India often post jobs for $3.
In the US, when jobs have been outsourced, very often people are moved to other positions in a company or referred to programs that train them for other work. Jobs that pay $10 or $12 an hour are "one rung up" from the lowest paying jobs, which pay in the area of $8 dollars an hour (whatever minimum wage is these days, which I think is $7 and hour plus change; although $8 or $9 are common hourly rates for low-wage jobs).
Jobs are harder to find these days, but many people do just trade one $12/hour job for another. Some live on unemployment compensation longer until they find another job. Regardless of income, many people supplement their income by doing things like writing online or offering products/services from a website.
There is an overall shift in the way people earn their money these days, but the US is known for its resources and opportunities (even in a bad economy). Americans do have the advantage of having English as their first language; and, respectfully, for everyone who will only pay $3 for a basic web article (often written in English that isn't as skilled as it is when English is someone's first language), there are still American and British companies that are willing to pay more for something like an article, in order to have it written by someone for whom English is their first language.
There's no doubt that outsourcing means those jobs are no longer available to Americans (although there could also be the situation where a company had, for example, x number of customer service people and could not hire more because of what they'd have to pay; which could mean that there never would have been those particular jobs available to Americans anyway). At the same time, the company that goes out of business because it has to pay call-center people American wages, or else because it can't offer service to massive numbers of customers and loses a good percentage of them because of it, will not be offering jobs to any Americans at all.
The American job market continues to evolve. There was a time when Americans were usually the ones to have cleaning jobs. These days a good number don't want those jobs. The same is true for call-center type jobs. Some people Americans may still be willing to do them, but one can't live very well on a $12 or $15 an hour job in the US. It's all just part of the ever-shifting picture of the American (and World) job market. There's no doubt that outsourcing has had its impact on the American job market, but as the nature of available opportunities shifts Americans have learned that they either need to have the training/education for far higher paying work or else find other $12/hour jobs. In the long run, outsourcing will not, overall, cause Americans to be poorer.
Your reference to web writing and white collar jobs makes some sense. But the jobs that are for the masses such as plumbers electricians and carpenters have been hit terribly hard by the influx of immigrant labor with no qualifications.
Competing for jobs against the employers who hire these people in essence take the food out of the trained professionals and pocket the leftovers. Just think when the licensed and experienced jobs are replaced by lesser paid and untrained workers, the effect it will have on our health and safety. Not all Americans are capable of getting the type of jobs you mention so what about them? Let them live in squalor or on welfare. The big business in our country have lobbied for this lie and now are in the position to loot us for what we have left. Wait till the inflation takes place and see the dollar buy less than the higher paid employee can even afford.
We did it to ourselves. What if you made it so cheap no one could afford to buy it. It is a race to the bottom my friend.
But this debate is not about immigration, that is another topic. Why did you disagree with all of my theories, if I effectively already said twice in this thread that immigration poses a bigger problem than outsourcing? Seems like you need to make up your mind. Outsourcing is a completely different subject to immigration, two completely different things. Has it occured to you that you could be making a lot of money through outsourcing yourself? With very little start up? Im not going to tell you how, as you so obviously hold little regards to my opinion, and I wouldnt want to burst your little negativity bubble.
I am sorry for bringing the other topic of immigration into your argument so I will address it more directly.
I currently have a business that is outsourced to China. I have no other choice but to outsource it to them because of the race to the bottom the retailers demand.
One thing is that the retailers will not buy a product that they feel is too much to bring a bigger return to them. The production of the product I sell costs almost 93% more in tooling to make it here and 75% more per part to produce. I hold the patent and the retailers want the tool in their stores but I cannot demand the higher price that manufacturing here in the US would require.
Why is it that you feel we have to sell our souls to the almighty WalMart and Home Depots to provide them with product they mark up by hundreds of percentages to make their profit. We the producers are squezzed into this model so the almighty giants of retail can make incredible profits. Multi million dollar profits are made on the backs of hard working individuals from overseas. We didn't end slavery for this country, we shipped it overseas.
Well it is you that sells to those corporations, and you that is outsourcing. So you tell me. Why do you sell to those corporations? And why do you Outsource? I am not outsourcing, and I am not selling anything to major corporations. So you are effectively arguing against yourself. So why do YOU feel that YOU have to sell YOUR soul to the almighty WalMart and Home Depots? If I ever saw a hypocrite, you are it. If you really wanted to produce and market an American made product, which you chose to sell independently, you could. But you know that you would make less money. Im not selling me soul to any corporations right now. I dont own shares in either of those companies mentioned. Why dont YOU answer your own question?
This "owning the means of production" argument is the biggest load of cow flop since Ryan's last hub.
People want to work at Wal Mart. They want a job that doesn't challenge them, that they can do with as little stress as possible, and that coddles them. If they wanted more, they'd be in school or out digging a ditch in the cold and rain. They'd be hanging from the side of a building welding steel or they'd be starting a business. Wal Mart fills a much-needed niche in the employment continuum. And everyone gets to take their soul home with them at 5PM.
Oh really? When you vote for the slimbag of your choice or do not choose to vote you sell your soul to the almighties. Who do you think run this country?
Do you buy from any of the big box stores? Guess what! You support them and the system. Do you buy brand name items from an American factory? Guess what! You support China. Have you tried to buy your christmas presents from an American made company? Right again you are the same as me.
Guess what when you buy any product made in China you support human rights transgressors, support child labor, and help to enslave poor people in squalor. Remember when you point your finger at someone, three more are pointing back at you.
So if I am a hypocrite you are one at the other end. You obviously do not understand retailing in this country with statements that "If you really wanted to produce and market an American made product, which you chose to sell independently, you could". Where do you market and produce your inventory? I bet if you did it here you either will soon be going out of business or you will sell it of as a hypocrite to the very companies you are bashing too.
Your pie in the sky suppositions are way to naive to have any merit and your grasp on the subgect is very loose.
I try my hardest not to buy from American made company, as this would do very little to support my own local economy. That would effectively be the same as buying from China. Of course I buy products from China, thanks to people like you. I could quite easily find entirely British made products even in this day and age. I still buy much of my food produce from local butchers and bakers, who source food locally. I drink in pubs that sell locally brewed real ale. Remember that I was supporting outsourcing? and you were disagreeing with me? and yet your are an outsourcer? and you are now trying to turn this around?
I try to when I can..... there is actually a lot of money to be made selling local products. If you had 5 restaurants on a street, and one boasted of using locally made ingredients, it will be the last one standing
Buy british if ya can get it ...........
I wanna buy locally also. However, your 5 restaurants would have to have the nearly the same quality and pricing for your scenario to prove out.
"Of course I buy products from China, thanks to people like you."
Remember that people like me are people like you. Hey I did not make up the game or the rules but when you are totally outnumbered and given a choice after investing tens of thousands of dollars in something like patents and inventory, how can you take the moral high ground and go bankrupt? Or stay poor and right? If you have a formula I am more than willing to hear it but I have spent the last four years trying to get around this paradigm.
Its an easy choice. Rich or Poor. You have chosen Rich, and I would have chosen the same. Perhaps what you have failed to acknowledge is that I am not against outsourcing, you perhaps need to remind yourself of my initial statements. The ones which you took it upon yourself to disagree with. I said that western investors can benefit from outsourcing. You disagreed with me. And now you are saying that you chose outsourcing as an alternative to bankruptcy. You are still the hypocrite here, Outsourcing is making you wealthier? So you are in effect agreeing with me. Maybe you should read my first posts, and tell me exactly what it is that you are disagreeing with; because you have confused me somewhat.
You also stated almost exactly the same point as me with regards to immigration. If you can tell me exactly what it is that you are disagreeing with, then I will do my best to respond. Is this whole approach from you supposed to have some sort of political agenda? Are you assuming that I have some sort of ideology that you disagree with?
All I have said is that western investors can profit from outsourcing, and that you can become richer through investment into stocks and shares. I thought that those two simple points were pretty standard logic. I actually have two cousins that make a living exporting British goods to China, have you considered the possibility that China are also great importers as well as exporters?
They export a nice curry to me twice a week !
I cant say that I have ever eaten a Chinese Curry, neither do I wish to.
why would you when there are so many indian people living in England making lovely curry,
I just thought that Curry was an Indian cuisine, apologies if I caused offence. I just associate my Tikka and Korma with another geographical region.
chinese curry is quite nice actually for a change, but in the north of england you cannot beat an indian curry yummy
Might give it a whirl, be a change from sweet and sour chicken balls
I recently had an Indian curry in a hotel with a cockroach in it.... Maybe that is how they first found out "Chinese Curry !"
Note: The cockroach actually committed suicide without the permission of the cook.
You don't have to damn well say sorry about your takeaway, I have chinese, indian or damn well arabian if I want, if anyone is offended by my choice of takeaway go chew on my walking stick.
You know maybe I did mistake some of your statements with some one elses. Sometimes it gets confusing the way the replys are laid out in a row on the page.
I do believe that outsourcing is the ONLY way to produce products for the US market and that immigrant labor is killing our standard of living.
I feel very helpless in this moral dilema because of the effect outsourcing of jobs creates for American workers. The fact that people with a much lower standard of living are taking domestic jobs and the rich keep getting richer. Maybe if I was rich I would have a different take on the subject but I hope I never do get that way if I do gain great wealth. That is not to say I think your opinion is governed by your wealth or lack there of.
I feel American entrepenaurship is in a downward spiral and that we are in a race to the most common denominator and that is a collapse of our system.
no thanks i would rathere starve... let's have a coffee break
i am talking about steak seasoning recipes, i was just thinking about your recipe when i saw your avatar....
Because the cost and risk of creating products and business is becomming more and more difficult.
yoou think you lead the world you are fooling yourselves
There are millions of people in India who cannot even afford for one time meal..... for them does it matter saying that India is Nuclear.... India is doing globalization... India is G20 !
Same way..... it just sounds good to hear that your country is at the top of the world when things are fine... but when the country is screwing you....... or for those who are getting screwed.... lets say unemployment or other foreign policy.... or health insurance issues...... it really does NOT matter !
Our politicians are doing us dirty, but we are still the greatest country in the world. Our level of freedom, economic opportunity, and our health care are unmatched anywhere. You may quibble with our health care delivery system, but our people and technology are nonpareil.
Bush let us all down and the backlash was to elect an unqualified community organizer as our president. Conservatives will take back the Congress next year and the White House in 2012.
Nope, but that's irrelevant to the discussion. I've never been to the moon but I know it's cold and airless.
I really like visiting the world of nicomp. It's almost like Disneyland.
Ad hominem attacks, the hallmark of a Liberal. I am done responding to you. Take your shots and have fun.
Is all your predjudice this transparent? I do not feel the need to defend myself or your take on my views. But what I find interesting is the way you summarily dismiss an opinion raised with out taking the time to visit the point.
The self worship that comes from making a statement that the US is the greatest country in the world is hedonist at best and dilusional at worst. Sometimes you have to listen to the question before you come up with an answer.
And with that I am done with you as well. Thank you for your input.
That is a lot of knowledge!
I actually did not know much about US people being compensated when they did not have a job.... how much do they get compensated...
Meanwhile you were asking for Indian Call Center payment.... per hour they start from $1 to $3 for may be 75%... the rest 20% may be having the double of that... may be the cream 5% may be getting anywhere close to American Pay!
Thanks Ryan I think I will look into it a little more. I do have a customer who has a son in this industry and she says he is a bit of a whizz kid. I am guessing if I start of with a small investment that I can afford to lose it will give me a little experience as this is a form of gambling and I am a gambler. hope you do well with yours and hit the jackpot. Were you talking about Cadbury's earlier or another industry where we have lost jobs in this area?
I dont really see stocks and shares as gambling, it has risks associated, but you are effectively buying a stake in a business.
If you went and bought a 50% share in your local pub, you would do so in the belief that you will make your money back plus profit. Exactly the same principle, just that you will be buying something like 0.000000000001% of a business instead.
I understand why there is so much focus on jobs right now, but I think the real problem in the U.S. is the cost of living. Wages have stayed stagnant for at least 10 years, if not longer, but the cost of living has risen rapidly.
There is a phenomenon here called R2I. It stands for 'Return to India'. Lots of the Indians who came here and got MBAs or MD degrees, or engineering, or what have you, who stayed here and worked here while the economy was booming are now going back to India. This is especially true of second generation Indians who find that they can live like kings in India on the skills that in America give them a barely middle class existence.
Everything is very expensive here and rapidly becoming more so. Now jobs are disappearing--or at least good jobs--and so families that needed two or three jobs in household to make ends meet are forced back onto one job, and often that is experiencing wage, hour, and benefit cuts.
I've seen freelance work get tougher to get and lower-paid over the past year too. There's a glut of unemployed Americans competing for low-pay projects with people in India.
Where was your TV manufactured? Your computer, cell phone, wardrobe? I suspect you reap the benefits of shipping those jobs overseas.
Sure, as long as people can buy them, we reap the benefits.
Let's see what the next year brings. Hard to buy a nice foreign-made flat screen TV on $8 ot $9 an hour. Or no $ an hour.
We don't have the authority to decree a stop to outsourcing now that you and I have all our cheap stuff. The free market will even it out.
I think more US people will come to India to buy TV !
I absolutely agree.... well-educated people especially software guys who returned to India live like a King even though they might not even get half the salary that they earned in US. Though the cost of living in India is not cheap compared to Indian salary standards... compared to US standards it is damn damn cheap.....
Many believe it is better to be King of a small kingdom that to be soldier of a large Kingdom !
I'm a little confused Nicomp, allowing the government to keep my money and spend it on welfare/medicare/medicaid instead of it coming back to me is conservative how?
You said you were comfortable with receiving more than you paid in. That's not conservative. Actually, supporting the unemployment tax in any form is not conservative. We could all do better by purchasing our own unemployment insurance if we felt the need to do so.
Do you think throughout your working life that you have paid into the system just what you might possibly receive in unemployment benefits? Lets not forget the tax on gas,sales,beer,cigarettes,registration on your car and on and on. So if you are unemployed and are able to get this money you wouldn't take it? I doubt it.
Taxes on gas, beer, and cigs are not unemployment taxes.
If you are happy to receive the precise amount you paid in, you are still participating in the redistribution of wealth that I used to think you opposed. Assuming the feds are 80 % efficient, which is more than fair, you should expect an 80% return on your unemployment taxes. Accept any more and you are dipping into tax money confiscated from someone else.
Someone please explain. If I paid lets say $9,000 into the unemployment fund, I get laid off, I get paid $225.00 per week for 9 months, less 10% taxes, and this is somehow redistribution of wealth? I don't understand who's tax money would I be dipping into?
It seems you would be dipping into funds taxed from employers. Do you personally pay unemployment taxes?
He didn't say that. He said that he would happily take 12 weeks of unemployment payouts. I am sure that he has paid a hell of a lot more tax than that.
So let me get this right Nicomp. You are anti-taxation, in that you dont believe people should be taxed? Yet you would not take your tax back? Thats not conservative, thats stupid.
You called me stupid, but I will consider the source. Your premise is strawman anyway.
Britain had its highest ever tax rates under a so called 'conservative' government. Well, at least the poor did. The rich had some of the lowest. Great logic that.
And now they have an entire social class that feels entitled to sit home and wait for a check. Doesn't matter which party subsidized it.
Actually it has much lower unemployment than the USA, so straight back at you. Not that the unemployed pay tax, so I really cannot see your logic there.
GB is at about 7%, US is about 10%, and we don't count people who quit looking or went back to school. I don't know if GB counts them or not. We also have a disproportional amount of folks on the government payroll, which is a huge drag on the economy.
You must be talking to me. I am the only man in this discussion.
You look a little hoarse, I could help treat you for that.
don't play mind games with Ryan he will win
No argument there. I blame you for setting me up.
You are a creepy avatar of House. You play an American doctor by cleverly concealing your GB accent, right?
You are the only one having horse play, but it is treatable.
I am talking to you............. you are one sad dude
Did I miss something? Hell froze over? what the hell is going on in here? Ryan defended little ol me? Such a gentleman.
Not as original as a demented doctor, but I tried.
Meaning? I don't recall ever being rude to you (or anyone here for that matter).
<snipped - no personal attacks in the Forums>
you are a rude fellow aren't you.........
I wrote hubs over the summer, now that school is back in session it is more difficult to write a quality hub. I come into the forums to talk here and there between classes and studying. I'm sorry if you find my comments "bitchy".
Well that's your opinion. I hope not everyone feels that way. I'll make sure I steer clear of conversations with you.
we are all grateful for the contribution you make to hub pages, Colebabie
Is there a reason why you don't like me so much? Being here 11 hours and all...
An identity crisis probably, dont take it personally. I like you, if thats any consolation. And Health Tip likes you too..... he really does.
It's because you can write Cole, ok so I lied your hubs were good so stop pissing about on the Forums all the time and write something new. I actually like you more than you know !
Well I have 2 hubs in the works, but concentrating on them and making sure they're good before I publish them is hard with class in session. Like I said, the forums, while it takes some time, is something that I just do for fun in between studying and class. Like right now I'm writing a lab report, so I pull up the forums between thoughts. Sorry if you don't like it
Well the only person on here that knows who you really are, and thats me, wishes that you would be yourself on at least one avatar. Dont worry, Im not going to say anymore, that can be my little secret. But this persona is not the real you and doesnt suit you. Your better than this.
I kinda recall you got killed wheras I kinda got smarter but with people like you it's hardly an effort
Theres a first time for everything, and credit where credit is due.... I was just trying to ensure that you were not misquoted
The UK is full of incapicity scroungers, I could make a fortune treating them.
Careful, \Brenda will start feeling sorry for you.
Move to America, you could make much more money watching them die.
that was funny.... Ryan what does I.Q. MEAN?????
intelligence quotient, or something like that. Its just a number, a score. The higher your score the higher your supposed intelligience. Just another way for society to knock people down. They mean nothing, Frank Lampard has an extremely high one..... thats all the confirmation you need to know that they are crap.
How much does he earn a week compared to you ?
oh thanks, i like down to earth people with a high I.Q they are the best people in the world
Ryan..... I think the question what IQ was is supposed to be joke.... at least that is what I felt when I followed the chat between em....
Says it all really, do you ask Ryan how to do everything, can't you think by yourself ?
no i have no brain.... But i don't usually ask Ryan, it's just whoever is around, you can answer if you can
Let me guess, you are either a student or unemployed as you have no worry about paying good taxes to scroungers. The UK has become the Benefit State but it's bubble will explode in the next 10 years !
I am unemployed. I have just finished university. You dont need to guess, as you are far too obviously an alter-ego and probably know already.
But as it happens, I have not signed on for benefits. So make of that as you wish. I have paid taxes for several years. But they are clearly paying your wages (if you really want me to play this alter-ego game with you, and ignore your real life office job), so you cant argue with that doc
Tell the entire story. You turned down a job. In this economy.
And why does this concern you nicomp? I have already stated that I do not recieve benefits, so please explain the relevance. Quite why I should have to explain something which I have already publicly announced on this forum is beyond me.
Come on then nicomp, out with it, why should I have accepted that job offer? Why is this of concern to you or anybody else?
I SAID it was getting personal but he did not listen
Its all good Brenda, I cant see how he has a leg to stand on. It was an irrelevant statement.
Nicomp, let me explain something to you. The British are not entitled to any unemployment benefits if they possess more than £8000 in capital. This includes stocks and shares, and money in trusts. But excludes pension funds that cannot be taken.
I dont need to justify my personal circumstances, but that may shed a little light.
I just hope when " 13 " joins this site on Wednesday she is made welcome
well it just seems some people like arguing, and we like watcing but if you just change the subject then it wont get boring..... you can still argue
I will say this from experience... I know many Europeans whom came to the US and scrounged megga bonds. Unreasonably, it happens all the time... I even had a gripe over the US folks griping over the Mexicans because per person as far as people I know they where a lessor threat of greed than the illegal Equropeans in the US...Even with a couple of children..
Yet let us all stand clear... when the Mexican population is running back home no matter what mess we are in.....
I love everyone, yet get a grip.. America with stand, as we all will. The UK tends to now follow American trends as well. If you see a slight now... just wait fo the boom.
Point in frank a person is deened 'poor' should they make claim.. We will be ALL gravitating on a different level..
FYI~ If your Bank balance is what defines you...well, see my hubs..lol
I am not racist to any creed, yet as the mexican population is to America the Indian population is to the UK.
I have great respect for the hard work from such, yet we just need people on the tally.
You are the exception Ryan, the British are a nation of scroungers who are dragging the country down !
To be fair to the US they are not.
you know what that is a bit off not all of them are scroungers, but there are a lot i will grant you......
I would support a return to 2 years National Service, and any unemployed have to do voluntary community work for benefits. Sound like a fair deal?
It deff needs sorted and soon or in 10 years from now the UK is going to be in one hell of a state, the worst thing that ever happened to the UK was Incapicity Benefit and giving lazy scum free cars for doing nothing !
Well now that is a brilliant idea for the US and the UK. Could you imagine if everyone in the two sectors on welwqre were giving back what a boust that is!!
While you guys were busy pissing on each other an Interesting development Is happening . China Russia France and Saudi Arabia are entering Into a deal that will stop using the US Dollar for trade In Oil . So In reference to the topic at hand , I thought you might find this Interesting.This Is a sign of things to come , and they aint pretty !!!
nope as i said the whole damn world is a mess
I heard about that, Tony - my friend owns a gas station and, as you can imagine, he will be pretty happy if that happens. Might not be so good for you guys, though
Still a lot of hearsay, and a good dose of political sabre-rattling and bluster, but OPEC, Iran, Russia and Europe have expressed interest.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/busin … 98175.html
Tony, how dare you address the forum topic, how rude!
Look HealthTip, being rude to go along with a "persona" is pretty lame. Going from calling me "one false little girl who is really up herself" and saying that my hubs are rubbish to saying that you like me and my writing is ridiculous. Good luck with your writing.
I don't need luck with my writing Cole, I can write well with ease, I have known you 6 months !
Well I don't care who you really are being rude is uncalled for. I've never seen the show House, but I hope I don't end up being a PA for a doctor like him.
sad sad sad sad sad sad sad sad sad sad sad sad sad
I feel very sad to say that I agree with you on this one Colebabie....... hopefully HealthTip can stay off of the forum, and be replaced with a nicer ego.
And I have no idea how it got focused on me!
you just came along at the wrong time darlin' we do love you ignore him
Thank you Brenda. I'm not taking it seriously. I don't even know who he is, so why should his opinion matter? I hope this thread turns around.
we are not talking to you now, so you may as well sign out
well i am not talking to you but everyone else i think in a couple of days we will all see an apology from a crying man who does care somehow
Yes mate you do, because you love people like Brenda to bits. And you will feel bad about upsetting a decent person like Colebabie for no reason. But Im sure they will both forgive you when you apologise.
Pushing the people away who care a little bit for you isn't the way to deal with your problems. Sounds like issues with rejection have made it hard for you to understand why people like BadCo. Well your ex-wife is not on the forum.
There you go, if you can give it then you can take it. Night everybody.
I agree with that. And I'm going to join him. Night Brenda, night Colebabie.
BadCo, come back with something new. Sorry mate, but for the first time.... Epic Fail. BadCo should come back, and leave HealthTips to write some keyword hubs.
I think that if I do know you (and so far you are someone who is rude for no reason) I don't like you. I also think if everyone just dealt with their own lives and let people handle theirs there would be less problems. If it is you BC then that's sad. You're better than that. Better than being rude for absolutely no reason other than to conform to a persona you've created. We're here to write, and bounce back ideas, throwing in stupid emotions shouldn't be a part of that. So my suggestion? How about we mind our own business? However someone wants to write for HP, just let them do so.
Sometimes I wonder whether or not there are any more than 3 hubbers...... and I actually spend my days talking to the same two people; and that the whole joke is on me.
You know, with reading this thread, 'scarcely'... Seems odd that most posts are of the UK. The UK is the equivalent of the size of the STATE of Oregon in the US... * Please see globe*.
I do enjoy reading all views and take in those, within reason...
I have to say the WORLD is shifting for sure and how a person holds their personal value will be there own play. I see US at a mass learning to appreciate LIFE at a more simplistic manor..(HOPEFULLY) ...
You know what... at the end of the day if you wage yourself and being at your bank balance... Sod off!
this thread is really turning roung now hooray.............
The FTC will require that writers on the Web clearly disclose any freebies or payments they get from companies for reviewing their products. The commission also said advertisers featuring testimonials that claim dramatic results cannot hide behind disclaimers that the results aren't typical.
The FTC said its commissioners voted 4-0 to approve the final guidelines, which had been expected. The guides are not binding law, but rather interpretations of law that hope to help advertisers comply with regulations. Violating the rules, which take effect Dec. 1, could result in various sanctions including a lawsuit.
he is not the only one, you do let yourself down at times
you know what, Badco...Take it and give a rest... I love you to bits as well, yet the whole continuous monkey dish of emotion and flair is a toss.... ((Especially fuelling yourself with innocent others ...always))) It is continuous and we all care...the numbers only dip due to your slashing of throats in your vagabond days
PlEASE GET OUT WITH THE CRAP.....
The best way Isee Is focus on the new YOU!
I can't help it ok, next week is the anniverary of my break up and what have I done in that year, nothing. Not one thing !
i absolutely disagree...... you have ,made so many friends, so many everyone is willing you to get better and better and you are doing......... my mum died one year ago, and we both joined hubpages together, both M. City fans probably the only two.... you have come sooooooo far, please keep trying.........
the new you is a brilliant writer, well probably the old you was too but you are getting better all the time
I only brought House in because people are bored with BadCo and PirateGirl, we have upset too many people.
So you start off with being rude and calling names to someone who has never done anything to warrant it? That doesn't make any sense.
If you're attempting a fresh start maybe you should try.
Its not that easy Cole I am still living in the same house, she still rings me, the kids, its complicated.
I understand. But you have to use your resources and work towards a something new.
Everyone deserves to be happy, at any age. And if that means starting fresh, it is still possible.
YOU HAVE SOOOOOO GROWN OUT OF BADCO AND PIRATEGIRL, OK???
See, this is the type of braising comment that could cut someone, eh? Yet, I will remind you that after ou completely slashed me with my name on the hubs...Still your friend and fan...I guess just fan since you don't write much other than forums...still have all of the footagage where you completely desparaged my name n the internet.... my not being a newbie and not needing your crazy rapture of comments if someone googled me .... Ya just...yet.
why don't you go get some professional help bad co, i mean it you really need it
Sorry..don't understand.. I think we are equal with alter-ego's. Yet, have I ever written, said, or done anything to you to CUT THROAT??? Noooooooooooooo....and so not have MANY 'ego's' whom either do or had adored you....
Please do not call a dummy upon yourself. Badco!
It is mostly used to the slight ones as 'goodbye' in Italian...
Yet it's origon is to mean 'Hello' and 'Goodbye'...
And feck off from my Poems in future as well !
I don't take offense to what you said because I know that you don't mean it. I think BadCo that you should just write (because you are great at it!) and participate in friendly conversation. Emotions don't need to get involved at all. If you were trying to be funny that was a pretty lame attempt. Understand that there is no need for rude behavior. Really there isn't. We can all write and get our points across without it. There are other ways to deal with pain.
I am sorry Cole, you know I have loved you from day one, I am just taking my hurt out on you. x
*bowing to Cole, at the same time trying to look up the skirt*
Hundreds of thousands of people ran out of unemployment benefits in September, and more than 1 million could have their benefits expire by the end of the year if Congress doesn't act.
House members say they've done their part: On Sept. 22, the House voted 331-83 to grant an extra 13 weeks of benefits to states with the highest unemployment rates.
But the bill now languishes in the Senate, awaiting action by the Finance Committee - which has spent the past two weeks focused on a health care reform bill.
I was just wonderin do they address the topic on these things ?
World unemployment will not peak for at least another eight to 12 months at least as the economic recovery takes root, the head of the International Monetary Fund said on Monday, For all countries “ it will take from now on at least 8-12 months before unemployment will decrease”.
Thanks, I thought I might have to resort to begging like so many do on here! Truth is I didn't know I had that many.
I had 500 under BadCompany99 but most were just fan whores, the numbers mean damn all !
What is a fan? Is that the one that rotates on the ceiling ?!
This is officially the weirdest thread around right now. Geez.
This bunch of you tears me away.... like so many other....
Ciao bella and bello!!
(ya know, you are in the phase of pushing people away still, eh?)
Maybe we meet again... I NEVER forget a friend...
Laughing Out loud at ths thread!! How are you Brenda??
You know IT IS GREAT HOW THICK MY SKIN HAS BECOME BEING HERE ON HUBS!
It is good fun sometimes to sharpen our wits against each other...... in the dog house again, i was 5 hours caught up with this s***
Yikes... so to hear. Especially since this subject is the typical broken wheel of continuous need for sucking....lol
Me too. I typically stand clear of conflict as well. I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings either, yet I also feel that friends need to be honest and not just stroking someone, eh!
Well the thing is that, it's the same thing over and over again. We have all been hurt let's face it..... life throws lots of things at all of us it really does........
I believe being 'rich' and 'poor' are terms to better describe ones inner world. Personally, I have lived with large amounts of 'money' and smaller amounts of 'money'. Though in some ways one may feel more free with more, doesn't necessarily say much... Knowing many whom feel losing their 'money' and 'material' things...they already seem to live in a hell state being afraid someone will take it from them...
So my point is this, I think the US and the WORLD is going to see a great sift of liquid money and material possessions, which one could say they are 'poorer'. Yet, I feel we are at a brink of claiming a much more 'rich' mentality and existence...
Does this make any sense??
it makes a lot of sense.......
being rich materially is only a fleeting happiness....... rich emotionally spiritually etc, is far more profitable....... No good putting our trust in riches, cannot save our lives, but at times makes our lives a little nicer........
so we have sorted that out ha ha
Those are nice words, and I don't entirely disagree, but they ring hollow coming from anyone with a certain level of comfort and security. Tell all that to people who are truly poor and know what real hunger feels like and if they are nice enough not to say anything the look on their face will speak volumes.
and what can we do about it....... why are they poor..... i would love to spend all my life helping poor people, i really would, and if you saw some of the people i work with, you would know i am not out for money.... my pay is very low, but i have all the time in the world for people with severe dementia. I can relate and understand them.... i was at the hospital 6 hours with a lady who is so confused yesterday it was such an ordeal for her...... why did she have to wait til the end of the day, because she has m.r.s.a. she is treated like a leper, because she has it, but she picked it up in hospital.... if i catch it and die so be it....... i would not treat any human being badly ever....
by LiveFitForLife 2 years ago
Are you for or against the outsourcing of American jobs and Why?With the upcoming presidential elections it is important to consider some of the country's most controversial issues such as the outsourcing of American jobs. Americans from all different walks of life have a unique voice on these...
by IDONO 3 years ago
If the rich get richer, and the poor get poorer, how does the middle class shrink?Seems like more space is created and with population always increasing, seems like the middle class should expand, not shrink or disappear. Right?
by Sooner28 5 years ago
"I'm going to champion small business. We've got to make it easier for small businesses. Big business is doing fine in many places -– they get the loans they need, they can deal with all the regulation. They know how to find ways to get through the tax code, save money by putting various...
by My Esoteric 3 years ago
Yes, that is true. Assuming 125 million households in America, if National Income (sum of income from wages and capital) increased on average $1,- the top 1% would see a $21.66 rise in income,- the next 9% would get a $3.12 rise in purchasing power- the middle 40% of Americans would only...
by sandra rinck 10 years ago
If you haven't yet heard, Obama is planning on outsoursing with India. This is a red flag to me, not because I don't like India or anything like that, but come on...isn't that furthering the decline of the dollar, isn't that costing Americans jobs, isn't this a bad thing?
by Susan Reid 5 years ago
Apparently 63% of Americans view Romney's business background favorably and think he would be good for the economy.Then I had this "a ha" moment (for me any moment where two thoughts actually connect in my brain is an "a ha" moment).What if... people actually believe that...
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