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What caused Roman sociaty to colapse?

  1. profile image0
    sneakorocksolidposted 7 years ago

    How much does moral behavior affect the social fabric?

    1. Don W profile image83
      Don Wposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      Bad spelling?

      1. profile image0
        sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Probalbly.

        1. Siotosh profile image59
          Siotoshposted 7 years agoin reply to this

          Close but you're all wrong, because it is a known fact that the Roman society evolved, into Christianity ( Bad spelling? ). That is probible the strongest for the evolution  theory. LOL

      2. profile image0
        cosetteposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        big_smile

        p.s. Jeromeo answered the question quite nicely, i think.

      3. mega1 profile image80
        mega1posted 7 years agoin reply to this

        lol lol lol lol lol

      4. tksensei profile image59
        tksenseiposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Aw, I was gonna say that!

        1. profile image0
          sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

          Thanks.

    2. profile image0
      L. Andrew Marrposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      In a way it was all moral and social stuff. In a way it was nothing to do with it.

      The empire tried to expand too quickly (due to greed) so its forces were spread too thinly. This is why society collapses. They, literally, just got wiped out.

    3. Don W profile image83
      Don Wposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      Translation: Modern America is comparable to Ancient Rome. The moral corruption that was rife then is also prevalent now and will cause the collapse of the United States if allowed to go unchecked. You can (and must) stop this by subscribing to the same spiritual/religious and political beliefs I subscribe too. If you don't then we're all going to hell in a communist/atheist hand-basket.

      Summary: Repent, the end is nigh!

      1. mega1 profile image80
        mega1posted 7 years agoin reply to this

        oh, verily, verily, good citizen, it is~! smile

    4. Paraglider profile image89
      Paragliderposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      There's some evidence that lead poisoning was a contributory factor in the decline. Wine acids and lead are a lethal combination. The Roman aristocracy arguably destroyed their own intelligence with poisoned wine and lost the ability and interest to keep on top of matters out in the field.

      I know that sounds like a crazy conspiracy theory, but it's reckoned to have been a factor, if not the whole truth.

      But there's your answer - if overindulging in wine (which they did) is immoral, then yes, immorality was instrumental in the fall of the Roman Empire smile

    5. Rod Marsden profile image75
      Rod Marsdenposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      Roman society collapsed over a long period of time. It didn't just happen over night. The true  wonder is why ancient Rome lasted so long. Christianity was brought in as a state religion to shore up the social decay that was evident. Rome had really grown too big too fast. The city, for example, became dependent on grain from Egypt. When Egypt suffered drought then famine Rome also suffered from lack of grain.

      Christianity didn't help the Roman situation as much as Constantine and the other Roman emperors that came after him were hoping it would. Christian bishops when they came into real power were divided over what Christianity was all about. If Jesus was the equal of his heavenly father doesn't this suggest that there are, in reality, two gods? There were bishops who were all for this two god approach. Constantine, however, went with the idea that Jesus was from the essence of the one and only true god and this belief has come down to us. Divisions in Christianity meant in the end divisions between Eastern style Christianity and what has  become Western Christianity. Dividing the empire into east(Constantinople) and west (Rome) seemed to hold some promise. It worked for a while.

      When the barbarians from the north sacked Roman a number of times I suppose you could then say Rome was finished as a formidable power. These barbarians, especially the Normans, created the holy Roman empire in remembrance in part of the ancient Roman empire but that is another story.

      My take at any rate.     


    6. Presigo profile image52
      Presigoposted 7 years ago

      Don, that was good ! This is a big question with much to comment on, maybe the makings of a new hub !

    7. profile image0
      ralwusposted 7 years ago

      They fell because they too could not spell society or collapse. LOL wink

      1. profile image0
        sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Bite me.

        1. profile image0
          ralwusposted 7 years agoin reply to this

          OK. But I warn you, I have some good canines. LOL Don't cha just hate that ya can't fix that? They need to make a way for us to edit the title too. LOL

          1. profile image0
            sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            I'm going crazy here trying to fix it too! I don't need advertizing to look stupid.

      2. mythbuster profile image85
        mythbusterposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Their grammar may have been atrocious too?

        smile

    8. Jeromeo profile image62
      Jeromeoposted 7 years ago

      Greed,moral/political corruption, & being extended to far militarily.

      1. profile image0
        sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        I guess we got them all working about now.

        1. sooner than later profile image55
          sooner than laterposted 7 years agoin reply to this

          Its interesting that some notice what the romans did wrong, but they don't see the comparison. Good answer btw Jeromeo

          1. profile image0
            sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            My point.

            1. drej2522 profile image85
              drej2522posted 7 years agoin reply to this

              Are 'we' saying the United States is on a verge of colapse?...I mean, collapse lol

              1. profile image0
                sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                Bite me.smile

          2. Presigo profile image52
            Presigoposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            Sooner,
            you are absolutley right. They had a large welfare state as each roman citizen was guaranteed certain amounts ofgrain and meat, which caused incredible entitlement. They could no longer afford their society. The moral and political corruption was immense.  It is a story that could be told of us in the future

            1. sooner than later profile image55
              sooner than laterposted 7 years agoin reply to this



              I read today that half of american children are fed by welfare.

      2. profile image67
        logic,commonsenseposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Sound familiar!

    9. dyonder profile image79
      dyonderposted 7 years ago

      According to Rousseau's 'War & the Lasting State of Peace' Rome never collapsed - the senators just swapped their gowns for clerics' robes

      1. mikelong profile image73
        mikelongposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Nice post. 

        Roman elites would use the church and state to their advantage. While one family member may stand to inherit the family wealth, other siblings would often join the clergy, therefore keeping family wealth centralised. At the same time the families would give money, lands, etc, to the church....

        The non-church administration, however, lost its tax base over time.

        The prestige of being a Roman elite had to do with service to community. The town council, per se, would be responsible for paying taxes to the center (Rome). Yet, over time this feeling of civil pride faded as tax demands from Rome increased.  People, more and more, would hide their wealth, and therefore keep from having to serve on the town council (and be liable for tax payments).

        They would sell their lands to others (while secretly retaining them for themselves) in order to show the state that they were poor, and therefore unable to serve their communities.

        The Roman elite in the church never had this problem, and through their missionary work with the Germannic peoples they came in contact with, whether in the territory that would become England, or France, or Germany, to keep their status intact.



        Too few have read Rousseau.......

    10. sooner than later profile image55
      sooner than laterposted 7 years ago

      I thought so. smile

    11. mega1 profile image80
      mega1posted 7 years ago

      But seriously, if you see the world the way I do, Rome didn't collapse and is still collapsing, as is all the world we know as Earth, the Universe and Infinity.

    12. profile image0
      ralwusposted 7 years ago

      No problem Sneak, we all have been there. I did a porate thread, shoulda been pirate. The Roman Civilization fell because of corruption, and bad spelling, you ever try spelling Latin? LOL

      1. profile image0
        sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        I really do suck at spelling! It's the one thing I just don't get right.smile

    13. Nell Rose profile image90
      Nell Roseposted 7 years ago

      It was probably because of Boudicca our most famous Celtic queen, she wipped their a...s. and after she fought them and they eventually killed her, they thought to themselves, my God do we have to live in britain and marry women like that? Bright red hair streaming out behind her, screaming and wipping the horses in her chariot, stabbing and swinging a sword in every direction. and that was on a good day! imagine if they asked her for a cup of coffee, and if she woke up in a bad mood! A mad English woman chasing them around the bedroom with a machete... does'nt bear thinking about, the Romans being so refined and all!

    14. Ron Montgomery profile image60
      Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years ago

      Gay marriage and gun control.

      Oh yeah, and socialized medicine.

    15. Daniel Carter profile image87
      Daniel Carterposted 7 years ago

      I think the Roman Empire fell because the big money machines of the day were in bed with the government.  Just sayin'.

    16. drej2522 profile image85
      drej2522posted 7 years ago

      (shrugs) I think they had a good run...time eventually caught up to the corruption and internal struggles...because, lets face it, people suck! smile

    17. profile image0
      worried manposted 7 years ago

      The same inevitable proccesses that erode every culture.

    18. Valerie F profile image61
      Valerie Fposted 7 years ago

      It certainly didn't help that the Roman government couldn't come up with the right answer to a relative no-brainer question, "Those Goths want equal treatment, and they're getting restless. What should we do?"

      1. Paraglider profile image89
        Paragliderposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Maybe if they'd laid off the poisonous wine they could have thought that one through!

    19. David Bowman profile image60
      David Bowmanposted 7 years ago

      There are many theories about what led to the collapse of the Roman Empire. Some say that constant barbarian incursions into Roman territory had a lot to do with it. Overextension of military forces and the maintenance of said forces became too much of a burden.

      I think I've heard some experts say that bad governance by tyranical emperors and their extravagant spending on various building projects for the purposes of self-glorification is said to have been a factor.

      Then again, it could have just been tainted wine as Paraglider has suggested.

      Perhaps all of the above contributed in some way to the fall of the Roman Empire.

      1. Paraglider profile image89
        Paragliderposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Like Dubai, you mean?! Especially the self-glorifying building projects - man made islands, world's tallest tower etc...

        Plus ca change smile

        1. Dame Scribe profile image61
          Dame Scribeposted 7 years agoin reply to this

          lol is strange, a wealthy nation looking to add assistance for their future tongue

          1. Paraglider profile image89
            Paragliderposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            Dubai isn't naturally rich. It built its real estate, commerce & tourism empire on borrowed money and inflation. It doesn't have its own oil or gas, unlike Abu Dhabi or Qatar. It's now a burst bubble, dependent on Abu Dhabi to bail it out.

    20. AEvans profile image72
      AEvansposted 7 years ago

      I wrote about this from my point of view it is here on HP smile

    21. WriteAngled profile image91
      WriteAngledposted 7 years ago

      The Romans were unimaginative bureaucrats, like the UK government today. Their society inevitably became stale and started to moulder away.

    22. VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA profile image58
      VENUGOPAL SIVAGNAposted 7 years ago

      The Roman empire lasted for nearly 2000 years. It itself is a great thing. As generations pass by, people tend to become heroes themself, instead of glorifying their elders.

      In the case of Rome, the neighbouring countries improved enormously. England established monarchy and annexed neighbouring states of Scotland, Wales and Ireland. It became powerful and had more influence on other European countries. That is one reason.

      The discovery of new lands in east, west and Africa made Rome lose its importance. With new colonies and new sources of revenue, the European countries stopped caring about Rome. That is another reason.

      As long as the Christian influence ruled over the Romans, they were strong intact. After the founding of Protestant sect, the original religion, which later became Catholic lost its glory. With religious glory vanishing, Rome lost its supremacy. That is the third and final reason.

      1. Ron Montgomery profile image60
        Ron Montgomeryposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Your timeline is skewed.  Adopting Christianity as a state religion coincided precisely with the beginning of the fall of the empire.  There's a lesson there for the U.S.  Of course you would have to be able to read to learn the lesson...........

        1. Valerie F profile image61
          Valerie Fposted 7 years agoin reply to this

          So skewed, I don't know where to begin. Suffice to say, England didn't annex anybody during the Roman Empire. It was itself part of the Roman Empire. The Scots were also so feared that Hadrian's Wall was built to keep them out of Brittania. Upon rumors that the Irish were even crazier, the Romans opted to simply not bother with them.

          As for adopting Christianity, I think there were indicators that Rome was declining well before Constantine's time, such as the persecution of the Church. Whenever a government puts so much effort into targeting one particular group, it's obvious they only want a scapegoat for their own problems.

          1. profile image60
            thetfinposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            Good points all of them! (Especially the one about us Scots being crazy!)

      2. profile image60
        thetfinposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        European colonization occurred long after Rome fell.
        Care to explain how Protestant religion existed before the Catholic one? If I recall correctly, the bible took decades if not a century or more to be completed and distributed. How can a religion base it's teachings solely off of a book when said book has yet to take a completed form? Tradition would seem to be a neccessary element here.

    23. prettydarkhorse profile image65
      prettydarkhorseposted 7 years ago

      they were replaced by a better society, politically, more organized, new religion, fresh new set of world order...the English civilization I call it

      1. kerryg profile image84
        kerrygposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        But bear in mind that England did not become a major world power until after the Norman conquest in 1066, nearly 600 years after the most common date given for the "fall" of Rome, 476 AD, and that it was only one of many European countries jostling for position for another ~600 years after that. It wasn't until the 16th and 17th centuries that England really became a dominant power, and not until the 18th and 19th centuries that it really reached its zenith, about 1500 years after Rome's fall.

        1. prettydarkhorse profile image65
          prettydarkhorseposted 7 years agoin reply to this

          would you call it dark ages after the roman empire fell down

          1. kerryg profile image84
            kerrygposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            "Dark ages" puts it mildly, to be frank.

            It's hard even to fathom how far Europe fell and how long it was stagnant afterwards. Charlemagne made some attempts at improving the situation in the late-8th century - that's 300 years after Rome fell, longer than the United States has been a country. The 600 years from Rome's fall to the Norman conquest of England is longer than Europeans (a few Scandinavian sailors excepted) have known that America existed.

            When you think about how much has happened in those 600 years and how little we know of anything that happened in the 600 years after the fall of Rome, it really puts things into perspective.

          2. AdsenseStrategies profile image69
            AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            Hey, I am English, and I'd say both Rome and England were not exactly "civilized"! I mean, the Romans were a military empire; if someone conquered half the known world today by military might, we wouldn't praise them, would we? Who praises the Soviet Union for example?
            As for the British empire, well, ditto...
            I mean, at least the Americans didn't go marching around the world to achieve the might they did (though native peoples would disagree with me). They've done a fair bit since then, of course, but it's pretty impressive that they were such a power by the middle of twentieth century while they only had a few, small colonies...
            ...I mean, in comparison to the British: who basically stole everything they could find, the world over.
            (Let's see how this one plays out: a Brit defending the US, and a bunch of Yanks leaping to the defence of the English, perhaps?!!!! wink )

            1. profile image0
              sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

              I love the English and I love England!

    24. shazwellyn profile image81
      shazwellynposted 7 years ago

      Being greedy turned on them and led to self destruction.

      It happens in all situations when the fundamentals are greed.

    25. profile image0
      Poppa Bluesposted 7 years ago

      Here's a great web site that outlines the multiple factors that various authors have attributed to the decline.

      http://www.visualstatistics.net/East-We … tivity.htm

      Interestingly, some of those same factors are present in the USA today.

    26. kirstenblog profile image75
      kirstenblogposted 7 years ago

      As far as I was aware I thought a big part was the use of lead, from cosmetics to lead pipes. All that lead poisoning in the higher classes must have been a factor....

      1. AdsenseStrategies profile image69
        AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Sounds right...

    27. helot profile image55
      helotposted 7 years ago

      The use of alchemists to produce gold from lead.  What they ended up doing is producing gold colored lead which was then made into goblets, plates, and other things that the aristocracy used.  This made them dumb and thus they did dumb things.

      Or like any empire, they outgrew themselves and rotted from the inside out.

    28. AdsenseStrategies profile image69
      AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years ago

      Who knows. Who really knows. None of us was there...

      I am pretty sure it wasn't sleeping around though...

    29. profile image0
      sneakorocksolidposted 7 years ago

      Rome fell due to coruption on all levels. The most devastating was moral because it affects all aspects of life.

      1. AdsenseStrategies profile image69
        AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Possibly true. It seems reasonable that a widespread lack of stability in the family unit could erode a civil society, for example (if that is what they had). But, again, none of us here (I assume) is a professional ancient historian, so...

        1. profile image0
          sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

          I wouldn't listen to me I don't know much of anything.

          1. AdsenseStrategies profile image69
            AdsenseStrategiesposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            But for us amateurs it doesn't sound so bad as a part of the reason, perhaps...

            1. profile image0
              sneakorocksolidposted 7 years agoin reply to this

              I like you! But I need a shower so I'll leave you here, we both wouldn't fit.smile

    30. Make  Money profile image75
      Make Moneyposted 7 years ago

      When asked how long did the Roman empire last for this site says this.


      Romulus Augustus was deposed by the Germanic chieftain Odoacer. (Source)

      This map fairly clearly shows that the Western Roman Empire fell to Germanic tribes such as the Ostrogoths, Visigoths, Vandals and Huns.  The British Isles were not invaded by the Angles, Saxons and Jutes (the English) until after the Romans left the British Isles in the 5th century AD.
      http://static.newworldencyclopedia.org/thumb/2/2d/Invasions_of_the_Roman_Empire_1.png/500px-Invasions_of_the_Roman_Empire_1.png
      Map source

      From 610 with the birth of Islam the Eastern Roman Empire fell to the Islamic sword.  Note in the first map below how the middle east was Christian before the birth of Islam.  This gives a clearer meaning to the Crusades when you consider they were just meant to secure a safe passage for pilgrims to the Holy Land.
      http://tonova.typepad.com/thesuddencurve/ad_600.jpg
      http://tonova.typepad.com/thesuddencurve/626_ad.jpg
      http://tonova.typepad.com/thesuddencurve/737_ad.jpg
      The above 3 maps are taken from this Source under the title of 'Whom invaded Whom, again?"

      Note the Khazar Khanate in the above map.  This was a powerful kingdom in the 700s made up of Aryan Turkic tribes.  In 740 the Khazarian King had his whole empire convert to Judaism.  They are now know as Ashkenazi Jews and make up the majority of the Jews today. (Source)

    31. brimancandy profile image81
      brimancandyposted 7 years ago

      This just a comment, so don't dump all over me.

      The reason societies fall, is because they are too convinced that changing anything in the way they live will somehow greatly
      effect them. Like they might suddenly all drop dead if thier Capitalist country suddenly became a socialist or communist country. They are so full of their old ideas, that anyone who threatens that idea needs to be taken out with war.

      If it isn't government related, societies continue to fight over religion. And, back then, if your were an emporer, you considered yourself a god, and whomever did not obey your wishes was executed on the spot. I would assume it was more than likely a war over religion that was their downfall.

      One thing I have always loved came from "John Lennon."
      The song was "imagine". A world with no governments, no religions, no money. What would that be like?

      The problem is a lot of people can't imagine. And those who are in power wouldn't even dream of it. That is why a great society falls, because they eventually get so stuck in their ways, that when they can't do any better, they lash out, and go out looking for people whom they think are less than them and try to convert them to their ways. Usually with bad results.

      Obviously nothing has changed, and we are the new Romans.

      1. mythbuster profile image85
        mythbusterposted 7 years agoin reply to this

        Ah - just condensing here - but if I get what you're saying correctly - "failure to adapt/inability to adapt/refusal to adapt" causes collapse - both for the Romans and any society?

    32. JON EWALL profile image45
      JON EWALLposted 7 years ago

      hubbers
      Let's all hope that history will not repeat itself in our generation. The greatest empire on earth at that time was not defeated by their enemies.
      The empire collapsed from within the government, the political needs for power and greed.

      Sounds a little like what is happening today.Time will only tell if history will repeat itself?

    33. Padrino profile image56
      Padrinoposted 7 years ago

      "What caused Roman sociaty to colapse?"

      Romans!

     
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