The Dumbocrats are at it again. Now they have hurried through a vote to repeal the "Dopn't Ask, Don't Tell" policy. What do these people think with? It sure isn't the brains the Good Lord gave them. Do these people know or care what they aqre doing? I served in the military for 25 years and if a person was gay, they kept their mouth shut because they knew if it was found oth that they were gay they were in for a rough time and that meant mostly that they would get themself beat up. If gays are allowed to openly serve I can see some of these people (men and women) getting killed. Most folks in the military are very conservative and the conservative point of view clashes entirely with the liberal, "we don't care" of the Dumbocrats and their gay and lesbian friends. The militayr chiefs don't want gays in the military because they know what will happen. The large percentage of American people do not want gays in their military.
Troops will leave by the droves if we allow gays and lesbians to openly serve in the military. And just how arrogant is the Democratic Party anyhow? With leadership like Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, John Kerry and the like I can see why they are so self-centered and so egotistical. They think they are smarter than the rest of the country and I hope the people of this country get good and mad and vote these egotistical snaobs out of office in the upcoming elections and for ones to come in the future until we've weeded them completely out of our political system. It is time the people took back the running of this country and not let a group of egomaniacs tell us how we are going to think and act. The President and his whole adminsitration is the biggest group of liars and cheats we have had in DC ever in the history of this country.
Even more liars and cheats than in the Bush-Cheney administration. Wow!
Gays are employed in every occupation with few or no problems. What's so unique about the military? The problems are greatly exaggerated.
1 thought that comes to mind is the military doesn't have co-ed sleeping quarters - should the military be expected to have separate sleeping quarters for those who are gay?
I'm undecided about the Don't Ask Don't Tell policy revocation. It makes sense to me to keep it but then again if gay marriage is legal then the military would have to honor it too & provide benefits to all married couples whether or not they're gay.
You forgot to mention that a Democratic Pennsylvania Senator is trying to get legislation passed that has you and I the taxpayers bailout unions for their pension funds. At least we have not got our taxes raised right ?
I'm glad we have you to regurgitate verbatim whatever you see on Fox News.
Vs. whatever you see one every other channel?
No matter the source which was actually the drudge report it does not change the fact.
So...you learn more by not watching the news? I'm not sure I understand your point. It's a fact that the Senator is trying to do so, no matter what the source may be.
Didn't a load of people in the army jsut make a music video supporting the gays that had come out in the military, all I see here is a personal phobia.
Laws like "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" are exactly the kind of thing that make it okay for people to continue to think like as*holes, beat people up, and murder them for no reason other than who they're attracted to. Laws like that silently support that kind of evil, and need to be stopped.
What if the tables were turned?? What if being heterosexual was the "odd" thing and someone told you "Don't ask, don't tell." What if were you getting beat up and possibly killed for mentioning your significant other or spouse? What would you think then?
There ya go feeding into the twisted version of what's right and what's wrong.
fallsfella and all your like-minded homo-phobes,
What are you thinking with... "it sure isn't the brains the Good Lord gave (you)". You might concern yourself with the fact that if the world finds out what narrow-minded, bigots you are and you don't keep your "mouth(s) shut " you may be in for a very "rough time and... get (yourselves) beat up" and it would be ashame if "some of (you) people (men and women)... (get) killed"
"The military chiefs" have promoted, given medals to and buried with full service honors many gay men and women who died honorably for our country... in every war since The Revolution.
And you are absolutely wrong about "the large percentage of American people (not wanting) gays in their military"... and troops will not leave their posts in "droves", because unlike you they are commited to their country and its constitution, and each other. I'll bet you can't name one single gay man or women who didn't wear the uniform proudly and didn't serve their country with honor and courage.
You are indeed "self-centered and egotistical" if you think intelligence is elitist and respect for all individuals is snobbery. You don't need to " take back the running of this country"... you only need to open your heart, your narrow-mind, and pray to your Good Lord for forgiveness and participate fully as the constitution permits all Americans to do without prejudice.
It's hard to be civil when ignorance is spewed in such reckless, distorted fabrications (lies) as... "The President and his whole adminsitration is the biggest group of liars and cheats we have had in DC ever in the history of this country."
You are speaking about my President and I take great offense!
You are welcome to your illiterate and fictional opinion, but DO NOT mistake the importance of your opinion, or imply that you could possibly speak for others.
YOU DO NOT SPEAK FOR ME!
Democrats are no worse then Republicans
they all lie, cheat, and then take our money and do the same thing they did they year before, "NOTHING"
They had to vote before the mid term elections if they wanted to pass it. They know they are going to lose a lot of seats. I think the chances are pretty good that the republicans will take both the house and the senate and once again, all will be right with the universe.
Why should they care if they're alienating people who're seeking to change our military into a demoralized unit?
At least they're standing up for a rule of thumb that made perfectly good sense. It kept our soldiers focused on what's important---defending our nation, instead of on who had a fetish for same-sex activities.
Being a soldier is about being a protector of this country, not about protecting wrong ideas hidden under a twisted "pursuit of happiness" interpretation.
No wonder our soldiers have low morale. This issue should've stayed in the bedrooms instead of in our politics, and especially it should've stayed out of the faces of our military people who have more important things on their minds.
Why should they care? Votes?
I served 8 years in the Army Reserves, and the gay people I encountered didn't demoralize anybody. Soldiers are judged by how well they perform their duties.
Then why has this issue even been inserted into our military?
No one should be beaten up just because they're gay.
At the same time, for gays to be in the military simply puts an extra temptation and hardship on both them and other soldiers.
Many soldiers have to go for long periods of time without their wives or girlfriends' company. I see no good reason that a gay person would even want to put himself in the situation where men are lonely for companionship and where he is likely to lust after the other soldiers, and where other soldiers might have to be subjected to listening to the desires or sexual innuendos or advances of a homosexual.
?? What are you suggesting? That joining the army is strictly a choice? Check again - when my son was 18 law required he register with the military and may be drafted at any time.
I understand that.
But at least for now it is a choice. And the issue here is homosexuality in the military.
That's an issue that should never rear its ugly head in a group of soldiers who're not only fighting for this country's safety but also, given the way military conditions are, for ways to maintain their sense of reality and morale individually and as a group. Being a soldier surely can't be easy.
I don't understand what you are claiming to be a choice. Registering and being Drafted are not choices - they are law.
Homosexuals have served in the military but under the 'don't ask don't tell' assumption. What's expected to change if the 'don't ask don't tell' assumption is repealed?
I don't see a difference except for the benefits homosexual couples have been fighting a long time to gain - such as 'spousal/partner' benefits, or insurance. You know, the life partner benefits a married heterosexual couple has.
Do you suppose heterosexual men and women in the service might "lust after each other." Why do you think gays are any different, and why would their activity cause any more of a problem than equivalent activity by heterosexuals? You seem to assume that gays go around molesting other soldiers. They don't do this in other occupations so why would the military be any different. I wonder where you got that idea?
OMG! Quick - somebody write this down! I agree with Ralph! I have great respect for anyone serving in our military, and I don't care if they're heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, transexual, or asexual!
Is that one of the signs of the apocolypse?
I do think that since we have a military of professional soldiers, that they can deal with whatever issues might arise from serving with those who are openly gay just as they do with all of the other situation, as proud, professional heros.
The "rule of thumb" is an expression that referred to how big a cane one could use to beat one's wife.....it could be no bigger around than one's thumb. Let's bring back that rule....or perhaps you are proposing it just for gays?
What do you know about that? Not much I'd say.
Discriminating against Americans because it makes sense to YOU does not make sense. And believe me, when bullets and artillery shells start flying no one is thinking about sexual orientation unless they are just plain nuts.
Yes, it's about protecting the country, not about trying not to offend a tiny minority who are homophobic.
I'd say it's because they've been sent back to Iraq three and four times with no hope of being discharged. But hell, what do I know?
Too many ignorant people in society and too many useless politicians in office. A bad mix.
My dad told me how people were SURE the military would come unglued when the army was desegreaged (by presidential order). In my lifetime, I have seen women move from an 'auxialiary' status to full command. They now fly planes in combat - serve on the front lines, and actually give binding legal orders to men. The militay adjusted to that, too. All (or almost all) GIs have passed High School. They weren't grown in Brenda's christian turnip patch away from the real world. They will adjust to openly gay men and women serving. Some folks outside the militat will resist because they see barriers going down all over and wonder how the WASP empire can be saved.
Desegregated? You talkin' by race or by gender?
In my "turnip patch", Doug, skin color isn't in the same category as sexual habits. And neither is gender. The homosexual issue is about sex habits, not gender, and definitely not civil rights issues.
But in your briar patch, Doug, I guess it's safe to assume you're not quite up on the facts of life, huh?
As far as women in the military, honestly, I don't think they should be there either! But that one's just my personal opinion. I see nothing really wrong with it; I just think personally that most women would serve better by being home with the children or doing what women are more equipped in general to do, because it's MEN who are supposed to be the stronger, braver ones.
News Flash, Brenda!
Sexual orientation IS a Civil Rights issue.
Sorry, it's getting harder and harder to find groups you can openly hate.
You have to hate someone else outwardly if you secretly hate yourself.
The fact that sexual orientation is an issue at all is absurd in the first place.
There is no CIVIL rights issue.
Being gay or straight shouldn't have anything to do with rights.
Everyone has the right to life and right to choose. Therefore, it's not an issue. It's the lunatics who make it an issue.
Too many people getting involved in what other people do in their PRIVATE life. The fact that gays want rights to be open about their private affairs is lunacy in itself, because they are already given both right to life and right to choose, when born.
Again, displaying it in public is no different than a man and a woman kiss in public. If "you" don't like it, then get over yourself. If "you" have a problem with because of religious views, then get over yourself double, first your delusion of god and accept the fact it is just a lonely little human beings and we have to live peacefully.
So, with that said...let the berating begin.
You seem to forget the level of hatred, bigotry, and paranoia used to argue against blacks in the military. Blacks were considered to be a danger to white military personnel, they were believed to carry diseases that would be passed onto white military personnel. The fight for blacks in the military took place during a time when segregation was such a way of life that if a black person touched anything that was white only - it would be closed until it was sanitized for white use.
The comparisons are very similar.
It never ceases to amaze me when people keep paralleling race to sex habits.
Blacks had a legitimate cause to fight for their civil rights.
Gays do not.
They already have all the rights everyone else has.
And if they want to be in the military, they should be focused on PROTECTING our country, not seeking an opportunity to come out of the closet among a bunch of mostly-same-sex soldiers.
I've said before that NO ONE should be beaten up JUST because they're gay.
But you can bet I'd beat up anyone who made unwanted advances toward me, or who even kept making an issue of their personal sex life in a situation where I was trying to do a job, especially serving my country.
The military has a specific job to do. It's really horrible that the gay issue has popped up there. Let our soldier do their jobs!
On the opposite end of it, if a gay person minds his own business and is trying to be a good soldier, and if he/she is beaten up for the simple fact that he's believed to be gay, then he/she surely has advocacy they can go to, just like ANY soldier has the right for advocacy if they're treated wrong.
What's so bad about it is that a comparatively few instances of mistreatment of gays in our society, in or out of the military, are being used to make a widespread change in our society. THAT's the gay agenda, since people keep asking what it is.
Heck, there are people picked-on in all walks of life and situations. But we don't see 'em all using it as an excuse to make a national hoopla out of it. Just go to court and prosecute the offenders and be done with it.
Next thing we know, someone who gets picked on because they're pickin' their nose in public will be whining and demanding a new law that says he and EVERYONE ELSE can pick his nose in public and prosecute anyone who says anything against it. Or masturbating. Or whatever. It's ridiculous how they whine instead of counting their blessings like everyone else has to.
It never ceases to amaze the rest of us that you continue to equate gay relationships with certain sex habits.
"On the opposite end of it, if a gay person minds his own business and is trying to be a good soldier, and if he/she is beaten up for the simple fact that he's believed to be gay, then he/she surely has advocacy they can go to, just like ANY soldier has the right for advocacy if they're treated wrong."
You do understand what "don't tell" means, don't you? Seeking advocacy in this situation would mean revealing sexual orientation, which would violate the "don't tell" policy.
I know you're trying to come up with a rational explanation for continuing a policy of discrimination that reflects your own personal phobia, but it isn't working because discrimination isn't rational.
Edited to add: this was addressed to Brenda, not livelonger.
"Brenda - "It never ceases to amaze me when people keep paralleling race to sex habits."
You are missing the point. We are commenting on people attached to bigotry, whether it's racial or in regards to sexual orientation. Being 'straight' or 'gay' has a lot to do with genetic predispositon.
To put it in terms you would relate to. God made them that way.
It's wrong for society to demand they live with their sexuality a dark sinister secret - that only feeds the stereotypes and paranoia of peole who don't and won't understand or accept a different lifestyle.
Brenda why do you assume that gay people are less able to control their desires than straights? this makes no sense what-so-ever!
I don't assume that at all.
It's not that they can't. It's that many of them refuse to. And refuse to listen to those who've learned to.
And yeah, before anyone brings it up, I know there are gays who get killed because they're gay.
But there are people who get killed because they're ugly, or pretty, or Christian, or straight, or a prostitute, or a goody-two-shoes, or whatever. The criminal mind and/or prejudiced mind will target whatever it chooses to target.
There was a situation a few years back, and honestly I dunno if the case has ever been solved or not. But it was the "I65" or "I69" killer who killed prostitutes from truck stops.
Should all prostitutes now whine about how they're ALL discriminated against by ANYBODY who doesn't condone their prostituting themselves? NO.
I don't understand why they, the gays, are so offended by don't ask don't tell.
Is it that they want to be able to run around the other countries we are in declaring thier homosexuality?
That could get them hurt or killed by the host contry citizens, alot of countries do not tolerate that shit. And frown harshly, if not fataly on it.
And then what?
All the world see us as promoting that behavour, by military force, throughout the world. They already hate us for our toleration of so much immorality here, now.
I have known gays in the military. They don't want to 'proclaim' anything. They want to do their jobs and (hopefully) live long enough to retire. I'm talking about career professional military. Under the current system, they can get booted if their sexual orientation becomes known. It doesn't have anything to do with whose FAULT it is - or how it becomes known.
This is institutionalized discrimination - sanctioned by the government. If it was happening in any other organization except the military, the courts would strike it down.
"They already hate us for our toleration of so much immorality here, now."
This speaks volumes about where you are coming from. You have EVERY right in your church to decide what's 'moral' - and you have every right in that private club with the cross out front - to exclude or eject anyone who doesn't measure up to that 'morality'. Outside the group who joined your club of bigotry, you have NO authority to decide what's moral.
Are you supporting appeasement to Muslim fundamentalists?
In the first place, who are you addressing this question to?
Second, what does the question have to do with 'Don't Ask - Don't Tell'?
He is asking TM if we should give into what the Muslim terrorists want...in terms of sexual behaviour.
Oh I see - should we adopt the sexual norms of Muslim countries when they coincide with evangelical bias to promote harmony?
On my list of nightmare scenarios that ranks low in probability but high in sheer terror - Evangelical nutballs (not referring to teabaggers here)joining forces with Muslim nutballs to enforce their common sexual norms under penalty of death.
Ha...I'm still laughing over "Dumbocrats"!
Now...that's funny right there...I don't care who you are!
This is a wish dream for all -- that all shall be accepted in all the kinds of prefession they prefer to join irregardless of sexual orientations and various social demographic profile
I'm sure it is.
Just like alcoholics want their behavior to be blindly accepted simply because they're alcoholics, no matter if they drink and drive or whatever.
Yes, except alcoholism hurts the alcoholic and other people, while homosexuality does neither.
Homosexuality hurts homphobes - you have to respect the rights of evanelicals to single out a grooup to persecute - and support thier rights by supporting the persecution.
Yes, I'm afraid you're right. If it weren't for demonizing gays, homophobes might have to >gulp!< focus on making themselves better people.
Especially the gay homophobes. Those people have some SERIOUS issues to work on. But I hope we never run out of them - they are great material for jokes.
Alcoholism is a problem, your orientation is not Mam isn't it? Are you going to kill somebody when you are out and about in the roads if you are a gay? or if you are an alcoholic?
Your analogies are like Fox News opinions; Ugly at first, but upon further review - laughably nonsensical.
You should pick up a different hobby, this one's not working so well.
Thanks for the suggestion, Ron.
I suggest you try knitting; it might be right up your alley.
Another inaccurate assumption on your part. I already knit.
Do you crochet?
I've never had the patience for either. I do like to sew, though, sometimes. I'm pretty good at that.
No, just knitting. I pretty much just do straight lines at this point; I'm hoping to move on to squares by next year.
I'm a bit of an under-achiever.
What you are saying is so far from fact that it is on par with Alice in wonderland. You have no data to back up your claims and what is worse is that you put these ideas out as fact. In truth, the repealing of dont as don't tell will have little or no bearing on anyone in the military. Most gay members (and there are plenty) will continue to do their jobs as they have done for years and nothing will change. As far as our military servicemen killing people when they find out they are gay is just absurd. You claim to have been in the military for 25 years and I am don't question this. What I do question is how in touch you are with todays generation of soldiers. I think you would find that most just don't give a crap and would certainly not act out violently against them. Pick a real issue if you want to take a stand on something.
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by thirdmillenium 2 years ago
It is burgeoing too. Would this lead to a likely groupings within sections or tensions between gays and other members in a section?
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