Should a person get involved?

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   kirstenblogposted 14 years ago

   I have some new neighbours, a mother and daughter, who shout at each other all day long. Hubby says he has heard slamming doors when he steps out often. I wonder if it will get to a point where we both feel we should do something, call the police or go knock on the door and find out if everything is ok.....
   
   What would you guys do? Would you get involved in any way or try to keep out of it?

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      Non-offensiveUserposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I would go over and talk to them if it gets too bad.  Definately talk to them before you call the police though.

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      Flightkeeperposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      You should talk to them as new neighbors, welcome them to the neighborhood, and let them know discreetly how loud they're being and ask if you can help them.  It's your home too and they are messing up your quiet time.

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         TattooVirginposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         I agree, just making them aware that you know their there is the first step.  GIve them the AH HA moment, there are others around...

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      Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Hey Kirsten,
      
      If you're really interested in helping these people get over their problem, then I would suggest befriend them and get to know them similar to Flightkeeper said, and then take it slowly.
      
      Do not let it get to the point where you are at your end of the rope, do it long before.
      
      I've lived next to families like that before and it was in an apartment complex, so I wasn't the only household affected by them. It was much easier to talk to them on a one-to-one basis, when you are able to do so.
      
      The topic, since it truly isn't your place, has to be navigated with civility and compassion, so as to get them to understand.
      
      Hope that helped.

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         SirDentposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         
         
         This is by far the best advice given for your problem. I know this isn't the religion forum but Jesus said, "Love your neighbor as you love yourself."

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            Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            and when you love yourself do you intentionally put yourself in harms way when there is an alternative?

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               SirDentposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Have they threatened to harm anyone besides one another?
               
               There is nothing wrong with being a good neighbor or as Jesus might have put it, "A good Samaritan." As Cags said, it must be done with compassion, not anger or defensiveness.
               
               To be friends, you must show yourself to be friendly.

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                  Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  I would rather choose not to be friends with a toxic person - I don't have the capability of helping them where there is a need for therapy.
                  
                  They aren't showing themselves to be friendly, why would I choose to be friends with them?
                  
                  And what if my knock on the door finds the barrel of a gun in my face?
                  
                  
                  When people are yelling, fighting and slamming doors they aren't exactly interested in being friends with their neighbors (or at least one isn't) The best course of action is to not get involved because you don't know what you'd be getting yourself into.  Calling the police is the only way around it.

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      justomposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      No

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   5. 84

      rebekahELLEposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      do you live in an apartment or a house? if the girl is pre-teen or teen, slamming doors is not too unusual. sad if it happens daily.
      
      if apartment, what can management do other than tell them there has been a complaint?
      
      if a house, I would probably do nothing other than keep an eye on it. I wouldn't go out of my way to befriend them, but I would probably say hello and introduce myself if I saw them outside. everyone's different, you just need to do what you and your husband feel is best for your situation.
      
      if I heard screaming and cries for help, I would definitely call the police. maybe you could even call non-emergency dispatch and ask their advice without giving them the address,although they can see yours with a phone #. I've done that before with another kind of situation involving children, but didn't give their specific address.
      good luck, there are a lot of unhappy, desperate people in our world.

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      double_frickposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      at the point that you think it is an actually violent, dangerous situation.
      
      people are really touchy when it comes to domestic violence, when its yelling and hollering.
      
      when its actually life or death, people unfortunately find it time to mind their own business.
      
      follow your heart, it will tell you the right thing to do in this particular situation.
      
      peace.

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         wychicposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         I'd have to agree with this...people fight, and some fight more loudly than others. If you don't want to talk to them directly, then perhaps a trusted neighbor or the building manager would be willing to. However, once physical violence gets underway, it's time for the police ASAP.

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            Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            (how do you know there isn't any physical violence already?)

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      pisean282311posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      in my country..we would join them ...well on serious notes..if that happens quite often , i would talk to them first..if that doesnot work i would complain to secretary and chairman ..again if that doesnot work , third step is to call general body meeting and pass resolution , warning them..when all fails police is last option..

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      Pearldiverposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Stop stressing yourself mate... just hope that one of them doesn't knock on your door covered in blood and asking for a cup of sugar or a rubbish bag

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      psycheskinnerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Honestly I would ignore shouting and slamming doors. But if it sounds like threats, abuse or violence that would be different.

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2. 60

   tobey100posted 14 years ago

   Now you know why I live in the sticks.  The nearest neighbor's door that's slammable is about a mile away and I couldn't hear a yell if they used a bullhorn.
   
   I'd meet 'em and welcome them to your neck of the woods.  let 'em know you're there and aware.  Then, if the ruckus continues, tell 'em to knock it off cause you got no problem going back to prison.  they'll either shutup or move.

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3. 82

   Rafiniposted 14 years ago

   Being from the other side of the fence, I'd suggest calling the police.  You don't really need to get yourself involved by becoming friends with people who can't get along.
   
   It happened to me & my ex - someone threatened to call the police because of our fighting (they yelled it into the building hallway rather than confronting us) and it solidified my belief that we weren't meant to be a couple, we were never going to come to terms.  It took 2 more years before I left & filed for divorce.

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      Lisa HWposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      People shouldn't be too concerned the police are going to do anything other than knock on their door and ask what's going on.  Even when the yelling is one sided (as in classic abuse), the police ask the non-yeller if she (or he) wants to follow up.  A lot of times the victim won't.  Whether it's a kid, a parent, or a spouse who is being "verbally battered", even if the victim tells the police, the police often can't/won't do anything "unless the person feared for his life".    So, for the most part, calling the police gets them a knock on their door and a short-term reason to shut up for another day and a half.

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         Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         It starts a paper trail for the VICTIM.

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   Lisa HWposted 14 years ago

   I'm not a fan of that kind of relationship or of anyone else having to listen to it, but a lot of people just have that kind of relationship.  They yell.  They slam doors.  If the two of the do the yelling it doesn't sound like the one-sided kind of yelling that goes on when one person is being abused.  I know someone who has been through a couple of those neighbors, and it seems to me people who live in that kind of havoc and drama all the time don't usually live in one place for too long either.    Maybe there are exceptions, but often it kind of all goes under the one, big, umbrella as "unstable family". 
   
   I wouldn't get involved if it sounds like nothing but verbal fighting.  At some point, if it sounds so bad it makes you think you need to call police, they shouldn't blame you if you do.

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   lorlie6posted 14 years ago

   I think I'd call the police.  I was a young girl living with an alcoholic mother long ago and we raged back and forth for a long time before the police were phoned by neighbors.  I wish they'd called sooner.

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6. 68

   Cagsilposted 14 years ago

   The biggest problem with this whole situation is the driving force behind it? Which is unknown.

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      Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I don't see the driving force having anything to do with it.  Yelling and fighting and slamming doors is an unhealthy relationship whether it's one sided or two people actively involved.

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         Lisa HWposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         It's unhealthy when it's a regular thing, but the difference is when it's one-sided someone may be being abused in ways beyond just verbal.  If it's a two-way-sounding fight, it's unhealthy but it isn't really anybody else's business (beyond whether the yelling is keeping their baby from sleeping).

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            Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            a two way fight can be just as abusive as a single sided one.  You never know what goes on behind closed doors, regular or not.

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         Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         You do not? Hmmm....and why is it that you do not see a driving force behind it? There is a driving force behind every action taken by anyone.
         The point is what brought the yelling and fighting? The driving force behind it. Is it ego? Is it drugs? Is is alcohol? Is it that these people are normally that way and have been all their life? Or is it something else?
         
         It is important to figure out what the "driving force" is before you attempt to address the problem.

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            Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            but it isn't a neighbors problem to solve.  the neighbors problem is the yelling, fighting, slamming doors is Disturbing Their Peace.

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            1. 68

               Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Okay, let's see if we can straighten out the line of thought here, because you seem to be way outside the lines.
               
               First off, you have a neighbor who is always yelling and fighting, slamming doors in their place. Regardless, of an apartment complex or individual house, it makes no difference.
               
               By all accounts, it would be better if the people around them got involved, used compassion to solve the problem, so as to stop it from happening, so the police do not have to waste their time(which is resources) to deal with the problem.
               
               By finding the driving force behind why it happens is important so you can know and understand the best course of action to take, and yes if the police are to be notified then call them, but exhaust other available avenues before deciding on ruining someone's life by police involvement.
               
               The police should not be at someone's home at any time, unless there happens to be a serious(murder, suicide or major event) problem. Disturbing the peace? Is a waste of valuable resources and time, better spent on other things, like real criminals, when all it takes is compassion from one person.

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                  Daniel Carterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  I do disagree. Disturbing the peace could be an argument, or a huge party complete with drugs and booze. I've lived in that complex too. Try knocking on that door and see what happens.
                  
                  I agree there are many suitable approaches to this, and it should be tailored for the situation and people involved. Compassion is a nice thing. I do believe in it. But I've been burned by parents, exwives, neighbors, with my "compassion" and had to learn some very tough lessons about who to trust and at what level I get involved.
                  
                  To each his own. Ultimately, we must each be responsible for our own lives. Depending on others to fix our messes is never going to work. Helping *temporarily* in an effort to show compassion and understanding is good, but too often we are sucked into the deep stuff of rescuing people who need to learn to rescue themselves.
                  
                  Those are my final thoughts. And there are many good thoughts here. I would like to be neighbors with all of you (even though you may have second thoughts about me!) LOL

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                     Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     Been there, done that. It worked out well.
                     Unfortunately Daniel, you seem to still be living in the past and having a problem with it. Sorry to hear that.
                     It is not about depending on others to fix our messes. It has never been about that and why you would bring it up is odd?
                     Ignorance is always going to be a problem, however, it does have to be shown to some for what it is. Don't you think?

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                     justomposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     Amen Daniel!!

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                  Lisa HWposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Cagsil, I agree that aiming to get a reading on how bad things may really be can be a good (maybe the best) way, but not everyone is open to having neighbors "get involved" (even to the extent of asking whether there's reason to be concerned about "last night's screaming and furniture-throwing".  If they're neighbors you don't know at all and never talk to, knocking on the door and asking if there's reason to be concerned isn't going to be all the effective.  Even if they're people you talk to once in awhile, you're likely to get a "Oh, it was nothing.  We were just fighting."  If you try to probe beyond that they're not likely to give an honest answer anyway.  If they're people you're at least kind of friends with, it may be more effective to just ask.  Other than that, though, best case it won't get an honest answer.  Worst case, they'll hate you.
                  
                  I suppose, another "best case" may be that if they're bordering on some normal version of having enough self-respect not to want become the talk of the neighborhood, maybe they'll keep it down a little more when they fight in the future. 

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                     Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     The best case scenario if you 'talk' to your fighting neighbors is - they move away and you don't have to deal with it anymore.
                     
                     The worst case scenario of you 'talk' to your fighting neighbors is - someone gets killed.

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                  Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  You think I'm way out of the box and I think your thinking is too narrow.
                  
                  The neighbors problem is Their Peace is Disturbed by the Fighting of New Neighbors.  Why should the neighbors risk their lives by confronting the new neighbors?  (I don't know if my fighting neighbors own a gun!!)  There is no guarantee that by confronting the new neighbors that the problem will be solved, in fact it could escalate an abusive situation. 
                  
                  The main responsibilities of a Police Officer is to Uphold the Law and Maintain Peace.  In other words, do their best to stop and prevent crime - which domestic violence is defined as.
                  
                  I think by calling the police on my yelling, fighting neighbors who are slamming doors I would be showing compassion as well as protecting myself from possible harm thereby helping the police force further.

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7. 61

   Daniel Carterposted 14 years ago

   I wouldn't approach them. I've been that moving target before, and I won't allow myself to do it again. Unstable people are stressed enough to take out their anger and aggression on strangers, including neighbors they may see as "nosey" or a "threat." I would steer clear. Don't invite unnecessary trouble. Additionally, such people are usually very victimized and codependent, and if you befriend them, they often will expect you to rescue and protect them. That's not a neighbor's job. They should be responsible for their own lives. I've been through all of that trouble and pain, and I no longer am interested.
   
   I would file a complaint to rental management first, asking them to address the issue with them. Let management know that you intend to file a report with the police if it continues. Calling the police isn't the first and best thing to do, however, if given fair warning, calling the police is completely appropriate.

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      Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I'm not sure about calling management, because they would most likely reveal who complained - the police wont.

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         Daniel Carterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Rental management would be foolish to reveal who has complained. That would be a potential lawsuit if things escalated. I've made complaints to management and police. Management were very formal and very protective of my identity. I realize that may not be the case everywhere, but it should be.
         
         If there really is a concern about management handling the complaint, you shouldn't be living there to begin with. They are incompetent and don't have your best interests.

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            Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Hey Daniel, I would like to just point out something. Some people are forced into taking whatever is available to them because of money constraints.
            
            Example: Over 20 years ago, I was forced out of my apartment, because I was unable to keep up with my bills and my landlord was kicking me out onto the streets.
            
            He didn't care that I had no place else to go. He just wanted to get paid. So, I was forced to moved out and into whatever I could afford. I didn't have much of choice on landlords.

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            Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Yes Daniel, it may not be in your best interest to rent from poor management, but not everyone can afford to live in the best apartment complex in town.

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      Mishaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I'm with Daniel. They disturb you - you report them to the management, if this does not help - you report them to police. No need to get involved - unless you want to

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   Lisa HWposted 14 years ago

   Daniel, here's the gray area on calling the rental people, though:  Susie and Fred next door are nice people, but Fred's mother just died, Susie got laid off from her job, and they didn't have the most solid marriage in the world in the first place.  Sometimes people don't want to do something that might get Susie and Fred a "black mark" with someone like rental people.  I think the police often won't tell people who called, which can leave "half-crazy" people to guess and assume, of course.  Still, if you live within ear-shot of neighbors, you probably have more than one nearby neighbor.
   
   I don't think there's necessarily one right answer on something like this, because it always depends on the people and the situation (and nobody outside knows enough to do more than guess about what they ought to do or not do).  Of course, if the police are showing up at the door to often the rental people are going to find out about it.  Still, though, I lean toward a) not getting involved at all (unless it gets really extreme sounding) or b) calling the police.   I don't know...   there's something kind of sneaky/behind-the-back-seeming to me to complain to the rental people.  It just kind of seems more "straight-and-to-the-point" to call police and kind of "establish", "Hey, if you sound like you're going to kill each other, you get the police called." 
   
   It wasn't a matter of yelling at anyone, but I've been on the receiving end of people making calls and talking behind closed doors, building a whole case against me without my even having a clue about it, and having horrible consequences result.  I'm more a fan of being out-in-the-open and not going the behind-the-scenes route.  People who are generally OK/decent enough people but may be in a relationship that needs to end can become innocent victims when the behind-closed-doors approach is used.  I just kind of lean toward "bring it out in the open, and let the chips fall where they may".

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   Ohmaposted 14 years ago

   People who can not get along with their own families tend to have more drama in their lives than I need. I would not get involved unless I seriously felt someone was in danger and then I would contact the authorities.

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      Daniel Carterposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks for summarizing what I tried to say, but didn't do a very good job.
      
      
      You always rock.
      
      @Rafini and Cagsil: regarding rental management. I get exactly what you're saying, that people can't always live in the best places in town. I've moved 10 times in the last 9 years. But I think renters can be smart about who and where they rent. That's my experience.
      
      I also believe in compassion, but neither do I want to invite more needless drama in my life, hence I keep my distance. Ohma said it nicely.

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         Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         ----But I think renters can be smart about who and where they rent. That's my experience.----
         
         
         I have a huge issue with this statement.  Not all renters can have a choice.  Especially someone without a job (whether or not they're receiving Aid) or someone with a special needs child, someone who's low income prevents them from being qualified to live in a decent apartment, someone who's credit check prevents them from being approved by rental management, someone who doesn't have a co-signer, someone who is disabled and unable to function 'properly', or maybe even someone with all of the above issues.
         
         A few years ago I was receiving assistance of $675 per month and no child support.  My last rental was as good as it could get. $600 per month for a tiny house of less than 500 sq feet owned by a slumlord.  Fortunately, the house was on the outskirts of the bad area and not in the center (the landlord owns a significant number of homes in the county) but my next door neighbor was up until 1 am blasting music from their vehicle every night.  Until I called the police for them disturbing the peace. (I couldn't get to sleep!!) 
         
         Was  I smart about who to rent from or which of his houses to rent?  I don't think so...as I didn't have much of a choice.  Apartments in my area range from $680 - $1000 per month, and houses typically begin around $1000 per month.

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            Mishaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            I would think your situation was a result of some of your previous choices? And you still had a choice btw - moving to a cheaper area.
            
            That said I do agree that there are situations when you are better off not bothering with a landlord and calling police right away, and yours is a good example. Yet this is an exception for "civilized" countries IMO

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               ProfessorProveItposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               While I agree with Misha how did this get so personal?

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                  Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  When I have something to say, I say it.  Personal or not. 

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               Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Maybe I should have included the fact I didn't have a car at the time?  lol  It wasn't a good period of time for me.  Anyway...I appreciate your response.

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    ProfessorProveItposted 14 years ago

    Unless they disturb you--as in during the hours when you can get cited for disturbing the peace--I would not bother.
    Also, you must be careful not to assume anything.
    People are often hurt by the incorrect assumptions of others.
    Trust me, I know what I'm talking about here.
    Mark my words . . .

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       Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       in this case, it's best to go by What is their norm?  Or, what is the frequency?  What does it sound like to you?  Would you be afraid if it were you?

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          ProfessorProveItposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          I don't have answers to those specific questions but I personally fear nothing.

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             Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

             to fear nothing is unhealthy.  fear is instilled in the human psyche for a reason....

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                ProfessorProveItposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                No I am at a point in my life when I fear nothing for myself.
                I fear the future regarding how the world will be for my kids but that is more likely a concern and not a fear.
                I fear nothing.

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                   Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                   to fear nothing for the self is unhealthy and dangerous.  fear exists for a reason.
                   
                   
                   if you were not afraid you'd be hit by a car you would cross the street when traffic had a green light.
                   
                   It isn't possible to know the outcome of each and every situation before it occurs therefor fear is there to guide us into making the right decisions when the time comes.

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                      ProfessorProveItposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                      Being aware of things is not the same thing as actually fearing things.
                      I am just telling you how I feel and how I am.
                      I didn't mean to waste your time with debates.
                      I have no fear but I am not stupid.
                      In fact, I am educated.

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                         Rafiniposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                         it's an interesting stance you're taking. 
                         
                         (at one time you were afraid of being hit by a car and in turn learned to wait for the red light - fear taught you a valuable lesson and will continue to do so)
                         
                         didn't mean for you to be insulted.

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    Precious Williamsposted 14 years ago

    Hi Kirstenblog
    Many years ago we had problems with neighbours who were always screaming at each other with their windows open.  Because our houses were so close we were able to record an argument.  When they were quiet the following day we played it back through their open window.  We never heard them argue again.  I'm not for a moment suggesting that you do this - this was thirty years ago. I mention it because actually to shout and slam doors is some people's way of life - it doesn't necessarily mean there is anything seriously wrong.  If you believe there is something seriously wrong (ie someone is in danger)then as some of the others have suggested you should report it to the authorities.
    
    If the noise actually disturbs you regularly and you are finding it difficult to deal with this, then you will have to take a judgement call on what you can do.  Eg could you invite the wife in for a cup of tea, and subtly mention how thin some of the walls are - and you hope you don't disturb them! That could be an opening.  If they ignore it - then it's up to you, depending on how friendly she seems to whether you want to go any further with it.  However, I would never raise that you are worried because they shout.  I don't suggest you knock on their door at all.  You never know who is inside or what the reaction might be.  You could put a note under the door - but as we know from these forums, people get quite cross with each other as we interpret things differently and being unable to see each other can have it's advantages but writing things can make a situation worse.
    
    Sorry to go on such a long time.  My view is that unless it is actually impinging on your life in an unbearable way - personally I would do nothing.  I am speaking from experience, where my husband and I lived in fear of our lives for eight years when I did confront a neighbour (very politely) about noise (who turned out to be a drug dealer with some very unpleasant friends). Ear plugs are a great invention - (I jest not!)

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    Lisa HWposted 14 years ago

    There's always banging on the wall and bellowing, "Hey - would you mind keeping it down in there!!!"   

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    Chaotic Chicaposted 14 years ago

    There is a lot of good advice on here, and some that seems a bit misguided if meant well. Either way, the bottom line seems to be that it is unhealthy but is anybody getting hurt physically?  While emotional damage can be just as bad, it could be that the daughter is rebellious and mom is at her wits end trying to control her.  It doesn't make it right but it may not be a situation the state needs to get invloved in.  Because you do not know the whole situation, I would advise against calling the cops except to say that they are disturbing the peace but keep it anonymous. It could really sour things between you guys and that may be burning a bridge you might have to cross later.  It's tricky but nobody can really say what YOU should or should not do.  Follow your gut instinct and good luck!

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    bsscorpio8posted 14 years ago

    It sounds like there is some serious dysfunction going on over there,and it would probably not be in your place to get involved. On the other had,should you decide to get involved,you could be saving a life.

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    D.G. Smithposted 14 years ago

    I would leave it alone unless I saw signs of some sort of abuse. A mother and daughter shouting doesn't

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       D.G. Smithposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       sorry only half the statement posted here is the other half (-;
       
       in and of itself tell you much. I think I would need more before I got involved but then again I am not next door. IF I were I would go with my instincts

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    awoodogposted 14 years ago

    If this kind of disturbance happens on a regular basis my self I would contact the police. I have been in this spot before and tried the be friend and find out what was going on  it had little effect. It made me feel like I was stuck between a rock and a hard place. Maybe the shouting and fighting is thier cry for help? I would rather call in a report and find some peace than not call and hear about an abuse or murder. Whatever you do do what you feel is right.

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    raja013posted 14 years ago

    fear is in nature of every human being

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    kirstenblogposted 14 years ago

    Wow, I sparked quite the discussion last night (my time). It is an uncomfortable situation....
    
    I did get to meet and say hi to the ladies when they first moved in. I am not convinced that their yelling is a sign of danger yet, I just wonder how far it would have to escalate to become a reason to worry about either of their safety. Not to fall for the stereotypes but they are polish and I have heard/seen the yelling everything inside the family as a stereotype within that culture. I kinda suspect they are forced to be living together (both are full grown adults) due to hard times and what not. I also know that on one or two occasions yelling has been heard from MY flat before I get out to go for a walk and cool down. I don't get really angry often but when I do I tend to have a fiery temper
    
    I guess for me its a case that I don't WANT to get involved but at the same time if I ever found out something bad had actually happened I would feel horrible for not saying something to someone who could have helped. By the way the management for this building is the worst!!!!!!! We would move but we have rent control and a protected tenancy agreement. Basically our rent is half of what it would be else where. I would not be surprised if this couple leaves before to long, the land lady is so negligent just about everyone moves out within months of moving in. Currently our intercom system is on the ground outside and anyone visiting has to give a missed call or a text just so we know they are there. It kinda sucks cause we have had a few people move in who were really nice and friendly who left us A nice assuie couple where in the ground floor flat at one point who loved a good party, miss them! And we had a lovely couple with a newborn in the same flat from vietnam and even they found the land lady and rental agency left something to be desired! (oh their baby was sooooooooo cute!)

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    Richieb799posted 14 years ago

    Call that TV show, 'Neighbors from Hell'

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    Home Girlposted 14 years ago

    Not in Canada. See nothing, hear nothing, do nothing, like a mannequin in a store.
    But seriously, for renters on a small income, it's very hard to find a good place. It's not about choice, it's about money. Money again!

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