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I appreciate how you explain what tolerance
means from that view.Yes Jesus was skilled in correcting wrong information, he approached others knowing their lifestyle needed adjustments, but he left that up to them to make a choice. We learn from him
Right, God give everyone a choice, but he point only to the right choice for a man to make by showing and correcting the wrongs. When the truth is revealed, choice must be against to the opponent of the truth.
Chris:You're confusing Jesus "allowed free will" vs not condeming!He tore up "religion" when they were buying & selling in synagogue, didnt He?He always "got angry but didn't sin" bcuz He told them msgs that'd make one better. Matt 23.He is Fathe
To Norine there are no people under that scripture with Jesus Name
But there are people under Jehovah's name. Phophesy is alive.
K&T:I was telling Chris how Jesus despised "religion" Matt 23:39)"Blessed is he that cometh in the NAME of the Lord!" JESUS! Ph 2:9-11!
What people? Scribes & Pharisees? Hypocrites! All Scribes & Pharisees were as "religion" is today, l
Norine that Lord is Jehovah , King James replace the name with Lord,
Notice he himself thought he should omit what he thought was appropriate at the time of translations under his own religious belief of his church. do some research .
No confusion here , Norine.
K&T:U miss the point!Chris has said truth "Jehovah/God/Whatever we want to call God, is "WHAT" He is NOT "WHO" He is!Google how many Glories He was/is to different people at diff times in OT!He was a diff GLORY 2 people at a given time!Not His Na
Norine Jehovah is the only one that knows the hour of the end, Jesus does not, that also means he still has Authority and position that Jesus respects. By saying so.
K&T, It may be that knowledge of the time of His return was removed during his time on earth but restored after the ascension. Just a thought.
Bill: Yes, he was an "expert!" But what else do you expect from Jesus who was before Abraham? Jesus is God!
Norine who is the our in .let us make man in our image? Please answer.
K&T: The "OUR" in Ge 1:26 is ALL of JESUS' GLORIES! U have glories:father,son,husband,brother, but not your NAME! Your name is your legal "name!" Take ck to bank w/father,son,husband on it & see if they'll cash it! Father,Son,HS,etc. NAME is
Why does the Father know when the end and Jesus the Son does not? If they are the same.
Mt 24:36 But as to that day and hour nobody knows, not even the angels of heaven nor the Son, but the Father alone.
K&T: Because He can do what He wants when He wants! When He is ready! He doesn't know but when He decides, He will! Like u don't know when u're going to do something but u know u're going to do it! Who can"hinder Jesus?"Enjoyed "proving" II Tim 3
That's pure folderol. If you don't know what you're going to do, you simply do not know. End of story.
Joe: If you look at God & Jesus as man (father) & son, I can understand why you think it's folderol! SPIRIT! Not a man & son! Spirit can be EVERY place at once man! Come on! Put your Spiritual eyeglasses on!
None of that changes the fact that both Jehovah God and Christ Jesus are spirit beings, spirit persons, distinct and separate from one another, with Christ always being subordinate to his Father and God, Jehovah.
Joe: What's Webster's def of a person or being? Is that Jesus (SPIRIT)? U say there are two Gods? I keep telling u He spoke in layman's terms so "man" could understand, yet u still don't? U didnt answer my question & deleted. Again, where is Jeho
Seeing as personality is the quality or fact of being a person as distinguished from a particular thing or creature it follows that Jehovah God and Christ Jesus are absolutely separate, distinct persons.
Joe: "I and My Father are ONE!" (Personality)
Show me where Jesus said, "I and the Father are the same."
Joe: John 10:30
Norine while Jesus was still teaching he said he did not come to destroy the law But fulfill it , he was a part of the plan to bring New Government in, there are still other things to fulfill, what did that scripture mean Norine.
K&T: Do u live under New Covenant? Sounds not! He DID fulfill law. Now Gal 3:24! Schoolmaster! Are u of those in I Tim 1:3-11? U want to go back? What? Mature in "Faith!" Move fm LAW! Study Jer31:33;Heb8:10:10-16,Jn14:26;16:13;Acts2:2 to see how
RK would you consider the scripture that says one does not know what the other knows, simply to different minds.
King James Version
Mt 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
K&T: I keep telling u He's gathering the church now, but when He decides He will come! Did u read those Scriptures I gave Joe? Study! Nxt you'll be telling me that you should baptize in the name of the Father,Son & HS? That's what "religion"
Norine this tells us the Father still has Authority of the end
He is the only one that knows the hour this system under satan will end.
That means we are to respect Jehovah's position and Authority as Jesus does.
Norine I do not see a dad and boy relationship , you interpet that meaning, , And really you are very disrepectful .concerning this whole subject. You reject truth. You rejected the Father.
We are getting nowhere here. Take care Norine.
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What definition of "religion" are you working with because everything you described about Christ's teachings constitutes a religious system of worship.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/religion : anything relating to definitions 2-7 has very little to do with God. They are ways that people express how they are "morally superior" to someone else. Jesus didn't come with a new set of rules
What, then, would you call what's recorded at John 13:34 if it wasn't a new rule?
The concept of love, and a loving God whom we should follow-- was not a new testament concept. This is one reason why the Holy Spirit lives inside of each believer-- to give us discernment and to help us to love. Do you know Greek or Aramaic?
Thank you for sharing those thoughts, however, I don't see how that answers my question. Here it is again: "What, then, would you call what's recorded at John 13:34 if it wasn't a new rule?"
Wait, so Jesus wasn't Jewish?
I am most appeciative of how you compared others , because even humans can stand in another direction away from the heavenly Father.
And many do not know it or want to know truth.
Thanks, Kiss :D
Why cant you just say Jehovah that is what is written in the King James , scriptures
What does that have to do ? You should know!
The term "Jehovah" is actually derived from the consonants YHWH, from whence "Yahweh" comes. So there really isn't a difference in meaning. Just a different cultural "lens" through which the same four letters are interpreted.
Yes , all over the world people still say Jehovah , he knows what we mean, like a baby that tries to say your name but pronounce it in his voice .RK. I used your space talking to Norine. , She will not admit in her bible Jehovah’s name. Sad.
K&T: Did Christ die in vain?As we do not bring lambs to altar anymore, the law was fulfilled & we now recognize THE NAME-JESUS! You are still under Old Covenant! If ANYONE still call Him Jehovah, r under the law (Gal 4) & nailed back to
See 1 Cor. 11:3. Christ continues to humbly submit to his God and Father, Jehovah. Why aren't you doing the same?
Joe I Cor 11:3? Joe: Allegory! Jesus is God!
Prove it. Prove that it's just symbolic in meaning.
Joe: Did you read those Scriptures? Proof's there! You don't want to accept Scripture? I didn't write it! II Cor 3:18-18;4-6"..the glory of the Lord, are chgd into the same image FROM GLORY TO GLORY" like Jesus! 4:6"..to give us..the knowledge of
Norine Now you are admitting JEHOVAH in Hebrew, very true, but notice he says this is my name forever
King James Version
Ex 3:15 And God (Jehovah) this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.
we are a generation if 21cent
Not to butt in, but I don't really feel that God cares which of His names we use. He has many titles--just in Hebrew. I don't think the all-knowing God has a problem knowing our heart enough to understand who we're talking about. Just an opinion.
To RK when people get married the name changes why ?
To Identify you belong to each other and not another, satan is a god too ! and we must be Identified with the true God.
He revealed his name for that purpose.
I do not agree that Satan is a god. He is lesser to God, as there is only one God. But when you say Jehovah, I say Yahweh, and someone else says El Shaddai--it's all the same God, just different versions of His name/titles
RK. King James Version
2Co 4:4In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
Satan is worshiped, that makes him one.
I'll concede that he's a "god" in the sense than any worshiped idol is a "god". But that doesn't make him a deity or any sort of equal opposite to God. Satan is still a created, lesser being--which is why victory could only ever belong to God alone.
RK:He cares!He died for us & Chgd everything just as K&T said in a marriage! WE are under NEW COVENANT!Satan is a god II Cor 4:4.Yes RK titles, roles not NAMES! K&T:U thk Scripture is for me only?Phil 2:9-11 ALWAYS remember! t's a NEW DAY
Norine, don't presume to know me or my relationship with my God. You don't know me. And I am under the New Covenant (as are you) through the blood of Christ, not because I decided to call God by a different name. Also, I can hear you w/o allcaps. :)
RK I totally agree with you , he could never be equal to the true God Jehovah.
Norine Jehovah is not Jesus , because that is his name forever.
Jesus updated the law , we do not need to sacrifice animals for forgiveness. Because he was the last
RK: Rt, I don't no u, just speaking Word! It DOES matter what for He said so in Script(Phil 2:9-11). No matter how "intentional" one's heart is, We MUST follow the Word!(Matt 7:22-23) Instruct have been left. Study! I Cor 12:2-27!Who is Lord (v3)?
New World Translation
Ro 10:13 For “everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will be saved.”
K&T:Rd ALL of Rms 10 (v2)Yes, U have a zeal!(v4)Christ is the end of LAW!(Jm 2:10)Rd Rm 14:10-12 Jdgment Seat of CHRIST, giving acct to GOD? Ph 2:11: "that Jesus Christ is Lord (God) to the glory of God, the Father! I Cor 12:2;12.v12 "So also is
Norine we are to recognize Jesus he is the New Covenant. But because the Father Jehovah worked out this sacred secret that he Jesus is his own son the Messiah. Notice his value .
He was sent , the one who sends is greater , the Father Jehovah!
K&T:He sent HIMSELF!(SPIRIT)Jn1:14!I Tim 3:16 "AND W/O CONTROVERSY great is the MYSTERY of godliness:GOD was MANIFESTED IN THE "FLESH," justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the nations, belvd on in the world, received up into GL
Norine notice King James Version Mt 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Jesus did his part , but that is not all that will be fulfilled, he said so.
Daniel 2:44 has to be.
K&T: While I do believe that Jesus and God the Father (Jehovah) are distinctly different, they are both equally vital aspects of one triune God. Jesus is unique in that he is also fully man, but before that the Word was with God and the Word was
K&T: He DIDN'T DESTROY the law, He fulfilled! Did you not hear Gal 3:27? Are u "just" coming into Christ? Stop sounding like it using WHAT HE IS for the Name rather than WHO (the name He came and DIED in to estab NEW COV-JESUS) HE IS="I AM!"
Norine, I don't think you read KT's last response carefully. She did not say that she believed Jesus destroyed the Law. She was quoting the very verse in which Jesus said he was not destroying the Law, but fulfilling it.
RK: I understood what that Script! True, & we aren't under law! Under New Cov w/name chg for Jehovah (aka God). God is "WHAT" He is, NOT "WHO" He is! Under New Cov His NAME is JESUS is what Scripture says. "Triune?" You "LIMIT" God (Jesus)? Jn 10
I feel I'm going to call it quits discussing with you. There seems to be something about the Trinity you misunderstand. Understanding God to be triune in nature doesn't limit Jesus' divinity. It just recognizes him as one of three yet one of one.
RK:You believe as "religion" does there r 3 "persons" or "beings" which defiles Scripture.You've never came into Jn 4:24 to see the ALLEGORY of Father & Son but Scripture said ppl would do that! I Tim 3:16!"God was manifested in the flesh.." Exp
Actually 1 Tim 3:16 correctly reads, "καὶ ὁμολογουμένως μέγα ἐστὶν τὸ τῆς εὐσεβείας μυστήριον· Ὃς ἐφανερώθη ἐν σαρκί, ἐδικαιώθη ἐν πνεύματι, ὤφθη ἀγγέλοις, ἐκηρύχθη ἐν ἔθνεσιν, ἐπιστεύθη ἐν κόσμῳ, ἀνελήμφθη ἐν δόξῃ." So you see,Jesus is NOT Jehovah.
English "Indeed,the sacred secret of this godly devotion is admittedly great:‘He was made manifest in flesh,was declared righteous in spirit,appeared to angels,was preached about among nations,was believed upon in the world,was received up in glory’"
Regarding the idea of no trinity and that Jesus was the same "person" as the Father..That would mean that in the garden, Jesus was not praying to the Father but talking to Himself. Also, "Not my will but yours be done" becomes a ridiculous statement.
Chris: Jesus Christ was God manifested in the flesh! He is not a "person" but a Spirit! The "only time" He was "a person" was during God's manifestation in the flesh! I loathe grocery shoppin & have said TO MYSELF many times not my will but let's
I already proved that claim false w/ Scripture. Try again.
Jesus said he would get rid of sin. Odin said he would get rid of the frost giants.
And I sure don't see any frost giants...
K&T: Read my response! The Holy Spirit(JESUS) spoke thru the Apostles telling them what to do under the New Covenant! We should do as they did! (Matt 28:20 & Acts 2:42); otherwise, we err!
Who is the us here ? King James Version Ge 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
K&T: Same Jesus! GLORIES!
Except that God's name is not Jesus, it's Jehovah.
Norine American Standard Version Ex 3:15Jehovah, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name forever,and this is my memorial unto all generations. KJV replaces with LORD
K&T: Computer repairman just left. Sorry I took so long responding. Let us move to NEW COVENANT! Phil 2:10! "at the name of JESUS every knee will bow" not Jehovah! How does Jn 20:28 read in that version?
King James Version
1Co 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son (Jesus)also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God(Jehovah) may be all in all.
The point is Jehovah will be over us all.
K&T: He operates in ALL "GLORIES" simultaneously if He desires! Col 2:9. Wil subdue All thgs to Himself! His Name is JESUS in the dispensation in which we NOW live! We will bow to that Name & that Name ONLY! (Phil 2:9-11) Come out fm the law
You're directly contradicting God Himself @ 1 Cor. 15:28 for He is the Grand Author of all the Bible.
K&T:Jehovah is Hebrew for God. God is WHAT HE is, JESUS is WHO HE IS in the dispensation we now live in. OT fufilled. Under NEW COVENANT! Crucifying JESUS again if you stay under law(OT)! JOE: "Subdue to HIMSELF" if u look @ Scripture IN THE SPI
"Jehovah is Hebrew for God."
Aija. I agree with you accept the last part that's all we need , you left out endurance , Reference Bible
Mt 24:13 but he that has endured to the end is the one that will be
Very well stated. However, He did speak about idolatry and false worship. In that way, I would not say that He was tolerant, and this is exactly why He was crucified.
If you start a statment in the beginning ,you are saying it had a start,
King James Version Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Ge 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image.
Who is the our?
K&T: "OUR" is all of His GLORIES! Col 2:9
Where does it say all his glories what scripture says that. Prove it.
I believe these are your own words.
K&T: John 17:5; Heb 1:3; Exd 24:17; Ps 72:19; Exd 40:34-35; Eph 1:17-21; Habakkuk 2:14; Col 1:27 (My favorite); Is 58:8; so many more! Jesus chgs fm Glory to Glory for HIS WILL to be accomplished! U do, don't u? Father role, husband role, etc. gl
My last post to you.
Joe: My God! I didn't realize "the world" had created so many versions of Trinitrianism! What a mess! John 10:10. Thanks Joe! I will study these "man-made" beliefs but fm my postings, you know there is no Trinity in Scripture so I blv all r false!
You lost me. Isn't it your claim that God the Father is the same as the Son is the same as the holy spirit?
Joe: Not my "claim" it is WRITTEN in Scripture! Col 2:9
Then please answer the question I posted here: https://josephopolanco.hubpages.com/question/25567...
Joe: How can I speak to ANY form of Trinitarism when the word "Trinity" does not appear in Scripture? I can "only" speak fm Scripture which says the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are One and His Name is JESUS! Otherwise, speaking lies!
Because you've made over and over and over again a Trinitarian claim. All I'm asking is for you to clarify for me which version of the many Trinitarian claims that exist is the correct one. Can you do that?
Joe: I stated facts fm Scripture - THERE IS NO TRINITY in Scripture! There are some questions I leave alone for they are not Scriptural! How can I tell u which is right when NONE exists in Scripture? It's as if asking which form of "lying" is right!
Now you're just talking in circles. First you claim that God the Father is the same as the Son is the same as the holy spirit. Now you reverse yourself and claim "THERE IS NO TRINITY in Scripture!" So which is it?
Joe: If I misled you to believe that there is a "trinity" I apologize! Again, There is NO TRINITY in Scripture; therefore, I cannot say which is right for all forms are wrong according to Scripture! They ALL are ONE (SPIRIT) & ALL's NAME IS JES
"They ALL are ONE (SPIRIT) & ALL's NAME IS JES."
That's the very definition of the Trinity!
Joe: The Spirit is not "three persons" or "beings" as described in "trinity!" Spirit is just that Spirit - Not persons nor beings. You know that as you are "well learned" in books! God is not the author of confession. So, again I "CAN NOT" respond!
But, as I explicate in this hub, God most certainly IS a person: http://hub.me/ajreq
Joe:You say Jesus lied when He said "God = Spirit?" Jn 4:24. I have Scripture only & if you don't want to here WHAT IS WRITTEN, it stops here! Give Script ea time u give me a response, otherwise not responding! II Cor 2:11 "I am not ignorant!
You most certainly are not ignorant but you are misrepresenting what the Bible actually teaches about God as I explain in my Hub: http://hub.me/ajreq
Read it only if you're interested in preaching what the Bible actually teaches :)
Joe: That's where we differ! The bible didn't teach me this, the Holy Spirit did! U go on believing "man" rather than the HS u err! If told Black is Green long enough, anyone will be believe!
Then why do you quote the Bible at all?
Joe: I read Scripture which is Truth! The Holy Spirit "teaches" not the Words for they are "hidden messages!" The Words therein are not in a "literal" sense which most don't understand! It is a Mystery that only the HS can reveal! II Cor 4:3-4!
But, like Apollos (See Acts 18), you too are misrepresenting what God has actually taught. I've been trying to help you see where you went off track but,unlike Apollos, you insist that everything you've been preaching has been the whole truth
Joe: The Holy Spirit tells me that you were not "sent" to preach. Rm 10:15 Guess who's guiding me? Good night!
Joe: Confirmation! "You'll know them by their fruit!" Matt 7:15-23
Satan it is, then.
Joe: The Holy Spirit NEVER lies! He REVEALS all as He did you! You have been identified by your fruit! Can't run or hide! You're out there! I pray, don't hold it against him Lord for he is "ignorant" to You! I Cor 14:38. AMEN!
Except you behave as if possessed by another spirit, not God's holy spirit. That's why your claims fail to persuade.
Joe: Not here to gain "friends" just stating Scripture! Meat too strong for you? Can't leave "tradition" & get into Spirit thinking! This is not "literal" but Spiritual. Read those Scriptures! Don't just talk! Study!
Norine listen to what you are saying the beginning and the end. Jesus had a beginning true.The first creation. But the Father is eternal no beginning and no end.he grants mortality .
K&T: listen to yourself! Jesus is the Creator or Jn 1:10 lied! Watch what u say! Did u read those Scriptures I gave Joe? Study!
Read Genesis. Jehovah God is the Creator, not Jesus. (Cf. Matthew 19:4-6)
Joe:The SPIRIT was the Creator (aka God),name JESUS! Jn 1:10!Read those Scriptures! Matt 19:4-6:Do u really thk Jesus would get "man" to believe He was God (as they don't today) when speaking there?They wntd to kill Him bcz He said God was His Father
When Created Angelic sons. Jesus being the first as Micheal.we exist
We exist, and so does his first born creation.
K&T: Col 1:16! Jesus created ALL THINGS! (v17) And He was BEFORE ALL THINGS & BY HIM all things consist! "Religion" didn't teach me this! Gal 1:12 Thank you Jesus that you choose this "nobody!"
The truth of God and his his son Jesus is very important.
What did people believe before he arrived? What was The name of God being used by Moses ?
Brilliant question! Let's see if Norine will answer or resort to more misdirection ...
K&T: The ALLEGORY of Father and Son is very important! Jesus was always there Spirit/God! Moses "I AM!!" Sorry you can't "see." I Pray your "heart" be enlightened!
Norine before Jesus Arrival on earth what was his name then. The name he revealed to moses?
Php 2:6 who, when he was in the form of God, did not regard equality with God as a prize,
Php 2:6 who, although he was existing in God’s form, gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God
simple never equal.
K&T: I have repeatedly said You MUST "look" w/Spiritual "eyes." Of course, He thought Himself "equal" for He is God! (v7) "But made himself of no reputation...a servant,& n the likeness of men(v8)humbled himself & became obedient unto de
Norine you can not even agree on what's written in your KJV. bible , Jehovah ' s. Name, and you will not let his name come out your mouth.
We can not continue to talk about the scriptures because you have made it all about you .not what is written.
Notice why Jehovah’s name is vital, King James Version
Ac 15:14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
And King James Version
Chris I really appreciate your comment on the subject, why do certain people not think that if we exist , why can God also make a Son exist his Angelic first Son. Why would he need to talk to self he has them..
K&T: I don't deny the FACT that God (aka Jesus) created Himself! Why in Gen 1:26 did He talk to Himself saying "Let US!" He has talked to Himself from the beginning & still does! Gen 22:16 "God swore to Himself" Why? NO ONE Greater! Always di
God created HIMSELF?!?! God existed before he existed!?!? That just makes no sense whatsoever!
What's more it's ANTI-SCRIPTURAL since at Ps 90:2 God Himself reveals that He has always been and will always be; he NEVER began to exist.
Joe: Tell GOD "it makes no sense" I didn't say IT (I Tim 3:16)! "...rec'd up into glory?" Unscriptural?
It seems you have a problem w/the MESSAGE not the messenger! So tell GOD "it doesn't make sense!"
This Is Jehovah's name forever as written. But the name of Jesus is his son
And given this name as the messiah.generations have came and gone, we are part of a generation as well ,Angels praise that name, And we are to respect it .
K&T:Do we still take lambs to the altar?It's a NEW DAY!We are under a NEW COVENANT!In THIS dispensation-it's ALL JESUS!JESUS is manifestation of (Holy) Flesh so u could relate! You still can't? "At the name of JESUS every knee will bow" not Othe
Except that Jesus taught that all worship must be directed to Jehovah, his Father, God and Creator:
"Jesus said to him: “It is written, ‘It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.’”" - Lk 4:8
Joe: My bible says "..worship the Lord, thy God.." Satan was "testing" Jesus & He replied (v12) "Thou shalt not put the Lord, thy God, to the test." What? Jesus said He was "..the Lord, thy God..?" To Satan in Lk 4:12? Will u kill Him as they did
Also Norine The heavenly Father created the family arrangement , Father , Mothers and sons and daughters, we are made in their image.
So why is it you refuse to recognize God he created his first born as written , here man can birth another.
K&T: Jn 4:24 You MUST "look" @ Script in the Spirit not as father/son! The only way He spoke of Father & Son is so "mere man" could relate. II Cor 4:3 Look @ the Script! Look Spiritually! Not as father/son! Did you read those Script given Jo
Why can God not create a first born son , we birth first borns
New World Translation
Mt 19:26 Looking at them intently, Jesus said to them: “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
God can do what ever he pleases.
K&T: He did create Himself! SPIRIT got into Mary & since Jesus was there from "the beginning," He made Himself! Plain & Simple! All other beliefs god's have names, & and ours do too, JESUS! Phil 2:9-11! Acts 2:38
Norine you brought the name up, bringing up what they believe, and commented saying contradiction your personal opinion.
I never brought up your religions name nore have I spoken negative about it, but we are talking one on one about scriptures .
K&T:It doesn't matter what one's "denomination" is if they don't believe in Jesus' Doctrine, they need to do as they did in Acts 2:38! Jesus is God! Err if any other gospel! That's what I've been saying indirectly all alone! Gal 1:6-9
God CREATED himself?!?! That makes no sense whatsoever since Jehovah God, the Father, is from past eternal to eternity; he has no beginning and no end. You're going against Scripture. See Ps 90:2; Hab 1:12; 1Ti 1:17.
Joe:Precisely!Same as Jesus; no beginning nor end; Alpha & Omega, beginning & end! Read those Scritpures!God is WHAT He is; JESUS is WHO He is!God is not a Name! That is WHAT He is! His Name is JESUS! If Jesus there fm beginning, He Fathered
King James Exodus 6:3 And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them
This name Norine
K&T: In the OT God's name was WHATEVER He WAS at the time! It's a NEW DAY under New COV! He came & died for us! I say so again, His Name is Jesus in the dispensation in which we live! Phil 2:9-11.
"In the OT God's name was WHATEVER He WAS at the time!"
Prove it. Prove your outrageous claim.
You express this in part truth, I so agree what Jesus has established,
Joh 14:6 Jesus said to him: “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
He did not say through religion , or a church
Exactly. Jesus did gave warnings to us that such things (religion) will come, but He said also may we stand firm in our faith. Trust in the almighty God and trust in Jesus finished work on the cross. That is all we need.
Aija saved from what. Reference Bible
Mt 16:24 then Jesus said to his disciples: “If anyone wants to come after me,let him disown himself and pick up his torture stake and continually follow me.Believing is important but enduring prosecution is vital
Star: Yes, the only way to Him is through Him! John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the WORD WAS GOD." (v3) All things were made by Him.." V14) He was IN THE WORLD, & the world WAS MADE BY HIM.." And still don'
That scripture was translated by King James,1600's in error ,you quoted a scripture you are not really hearing,"In the beginning"was the word, and the word was with God.
That is the error,in the beginning was his son.God is eternal with no beginning
K&T:And the Word was God! Spirit has nothing but Word speaking to our hearts!U said "Jesus was there in beginning" I do too! He created ALL things Jn 1:3! You deny this?Jesus said in Rev 1:8 "He's beginning & end, 1st & last.."Before Abrh
Norine Jesus name was not established until he was born on earth.
He was a sacred secret.
There you go about all glories, simple there is more then one person at the scene. now you are talking nonsense .
K&T: Did he lie "Before Abraham was I AM?" Did he lie "I & my Father are One?" Did he lie "I'm Alpha & Omega?" Did he lie Col 2:9? Don't u hv diff glories? Ur still 1 being! So is Jesus! John 17:5! I didn't spk of Glories, He did! Bfore w
Jehovah and Jesus do not lie but when people are persistent to believe what they want not according to scripture the fault lies with you. Stop quoting other scriptures when you can not honestly answer the one I requested. Pride leads to nothing.
K&T: "At the NAME of JESUS every knee will bow..." Not Jehovah, Not Father, Not Son, Not Holy Spirit BUT JESUS! "...Jesus is Lord (God) to the glory of God, the Father." Jn 17:5! I didn't write it! U can't "see" it, ask Jesus (Holy Spirit)! Stud
King James Version
Joh 17:5And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was
he is praying to The Father
Simple. Why would he pray to his self.
K&T: Can't u look at the Word in the Spirit and not father & son? Spirit (Jesus) fills heaven & earth! Yes, praying to Himself! Don't u talk to urself? U should now say "Let me see if this "fool" is right?" I admire you for seeking "truth
I have a question I need your help with:
Joe: See comment below!
Rich thank you for that comment, it makes sense that they are not the same beings. Two different as Father and the Father created a son his firstborn known by his heavenly name Michael. The earthy name Jesus as the Messiah
K&T: Listen to yourself! "They are two beings?" We have two Gods? Stop! We are talking about THE ALMIGHTY SPIRIT! He's in ALL believers, but He can't walk on earth, while in heaven, and be in believers on earth simultaneously? We're talking "I AM
Not recognizing the Father Jehovah puts you in danger of this. KJV Re 3:5 the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.
Spirit persons, spirit beings, yes. See 1 Cor. 15:44.
K&T:Jehovah's not the NAME you'll bow to!There is ONE Spirit JESUS who was on earth while His SPIRIT was everywhere else He desired! He's talking to "man" the 7 churches n Rev.Still talking so "man" can relate! Reconciliation!U thk He'll kill JES
Correction. I think you meant to say is that "Jehovah is not the PERSON you'll bow to" and he most certainly is. See Fil 2:9-11.
Joe:How does your Phil 2:9-11 read?What translation? I Tim 3:16"AND W/O CONTROVERSY GRT IS THE MYSTERY OF GODLINESS: "GOD" WAS MANIFEST IN THE FLESH,.REC'D UP INTO "GLORY!" (K&T)What God was manifest in the "FLESH?"Look at Jesus! Don't crucify ag
New World Translation
Joh 17:1Jesus spoke these things, and raising his eyes to heaven, he said: “Father, the hour has come. Glorify your son so that your son may glorify you.
Jesus looked up in heaven to talk to his Father. Not to himself.
K&T: Yes, speaking to Himself! (v3) "..that they might know thee, the only true God, AND Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. Fathered Himself!(v 5) "..with the glory which I had with thee BEFORE the world was." What? BEFORE the world was? Jesus is
King James Version
Mt 17:5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.
Are you listening Norine .the Father said it!
K&T: You no the Holy Spirit can be in more than one place at a time? He's in ALL believers isn't He?We're talking SPIRIT who fills heaven & earth!Stop looking as daddy/son!This is JESUS we're talking about!Man has LIMITED GOD whose name is J
Norine holy spirit of the Father made a son Named Michael, and
Earth name Jesus. That is truth .
Norine you want to totally disregard the OT where does it say do that?
Jesus was our cure, does that mean we should disown the one who sent the cure ? Did Jesus also read from the scrolls ? From a little boy he did. If not important he would say so.
K&T: He FULFILLED OT/LAW! Gal 3:24-25! Read all of Galatains 3 and 4! Gal 4:16? Law & Grace CANNOT co-exist! Gal 4:19-31! ALLEGORY, as is FATHER & SON! "MYSTERY!" I Timothy 3:16!
Norine notice King James uses all capital letters for Jehovah's name , to show Father and Son
K&T: I cant repeat enough that Jehovah is WHAT He is, NOT WHO He is! His Name Chgd under NEW COV! We're no longer under LAW! I Tim 1:3-11.Gal 3:24-25! Did Christ die in vain?
RK notice two different minds King James Version
Mt 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only..
The Father know things the Son does not. They are separate.
Cam 8510 My eyes mistaken your name of Chris , your comment insightful and true. Forgive my error of your name please.
cam and Chris, both. c-a-m are my initials and screen name.
"His Name Chgd under NEW COV!"
Prove it. Prove that Jehovah God changed his name.
Remember, all non-answers will be removed.
Funny story: Baal isn't a demon--Baal is the god of rain, and he was one of the major deities of the ancient Canaanites and (are you sitting down?) the ancient Hebrews. Baal was instrumental to early Judaism until Moses came along.
@ Joe: Rem "I AM?" If Script says GOD was "manifested in the flesh (JESUS)," (I Tim 3:16) why do u disagree?
Eph 4:4-6 is tooooo much for "Christians!" ONE SPIRIT= GOD, JESUS, HOLY SPIRIT, "AND" any other GLORY He desires! For He is "I AM!"
Fee: He was the Father!
You are right, Norine, and thank you very much for correcting me.
Norine read verse 2 King James Version Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God. He was with God ,the same as saying my daughter was with me. Two different beings ,yet King James error in first should have a small god.
Fee: Ur welcome! Jer 23:1! I believe! K&T: Stop putn flesh n Spiritual things!God is Spirit/Word/Creator/whose NAME is JESUS! There is no other god/God besides Him Isaiah 43:11;45:5-6! No other being! No other God!
Man was made in their image but all of us have separate bodies ,we are not connected .as glories.
K&T: Man was made in God's (Jesus') image initially (sinless)! Jn 17:5. Jesus doesn't have "separate bodies" as "man" for He is Spirit! If in Jesus, we are connected! II Cor 3:18 "But WE all...r chgd into the same image from "glory to glory"...
Joh 5:22, 23 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent him.
Norine you are not answering the questions. , you are just saying things just to answer , but not the question. You do not and will not admit the truth .the Father and son are two different beings.even in spirit.
There are many Angels also.
K&T Two diff beings means 2 diff persons! That's a lie according to Scripture! Did u not rd Isaiah 43:10 "none after" 11 no savior (Jesus) 13 before the day was,I am he, who shall hinder it?" None Other! I "plant the seed, God gives inc"I Cor 3:6
Except that the Scriptures tell us that God IS a person. See: http://hub.me/ajreq
Joe: God, Whose Name is JESUS, is a SPIRIT! Not like your spirit, but THE SPIRIT who can do ALL THINGS and not a being/person! So says Scripture! If u continue to look at Scripture "literally" & not "Spiritually" you will remain as you are!
Now I know you don't know what you're talking about:
"There is actually to us one God the Father." - 1 Corinthians 8:6
"And now, O Jehovah, you are our Father." - Isaiah 64:8
"Know that Jehovah is God." - Psalm 100:3
Joe:Is 43:10-11-Rev 1:17-18;2:8;Is 44:24- Jn1:3;Col1:16;Jn1:1;1:14:Jn 8:24;58;Jn10:30-33;14:6-7;9-11;20:28;Act4:12;20:28-Rev1:5-6;8-9; 1Tim3:16Tit2:13;Heb1:8-9;2Jn1:7;I Tim6:14-16;Heb2:17-18;4:15-16
Jn15:13-Rm5:8. Read these an explain!
These all prove that Jehovah is God, Christ Jesus is his Son and that he is subordinate to his God and Father in every way.
Joe: If you look at God & Jesus as man (father) & son, I can understand why you think it's folderol! Do you know how to look Spiritually? Spirit not a man & son! Spirit can be EVERY place at once man! Come on! Put your Spiritual eyeglasse
Joe: U didn't read? U can't understand or don't "want to" understand? Who is Jehovah? Now under New Covenant. Matt 28:18. ALL power? Where is Jehovah?
If Jesus is God and the holy Spirit is God, and the Holy Spirit is Jesus, why is speaking against Jesus, who is God, a sin that can be forgiven, but speaking against the holy Spirit, who is Jesus and God, is a sin that can never be forgiven?
You have no answer so you point to the questioner?
The Father sent the HS on behalf of Jesus His son. Prove that didn't happen.
Perfect question! What precise reasoning you exhibit! :)
Answer his question or bow out. All non-answers will be deleted.
Someone else that has seen this very same deception before came up with the question, not me, I just found it. Others that read but don't comment need to know that God is not a God of confusion.
You are rambling, and not answering the question.
diversions again you are not answering.
The Holy Spirit is with us, God is on His throne and Jesus is seated at the right Hand of the Father. Where did "All power in heaven and on the earth" that was given to Jesus come from?(His Father God.)
Norine as Ref notice King James Version
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Simple first born of every creation..this proves A Father who created a first Son .
K&T: God is a SPIRIT! Of course Jesus is the "image" (semilie) of God for He was "seen" in Flesh! Of course firstborn of ALL "creation" for He was there in the beginning! (v16) "For by Him WERE ALL THINGS created.." What? Jesus created ALL things
Norine you have faith in Jesus and the holy spirit , so now you have no faith to say he can not create what he wants, next did I name your faith,
or belief as to call you out, I am reasoning from scriptures that should be enough ,
K&T: Did I mention you? I said, "Yeah? Jehova Witnesses believe this! Contradicts Scripture!" That's a denomonation, not you? Oneness denom blv as I do re:Jesus is God, but I'm not Oneness! Yes, Scripture is enough!
Norine Daniel 2;44 says no more Governments will be run by humans , Jesus is Our New enthronement of Government .
King James Version Ps 110:1 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool .LORD.
K&T: Yes, Jesus is Our New enthronement of Government, He's EVERYTHING under NEW COV! Rm 7:4-14(v)7 "I had not known coveting except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet." SCHOOLMASTER! Gal 3:24! God is a SPIRIT! "Right HAND"=RIGHTEOUSNESS!
Norine where did you get coveting from. That word has nothing to do with subject
I wonder how he sits at his own right hand? Now there's a trick for you.
Jesus knew what was going to happen, but the players of the scene had to be manifest. Like you go to the store and merchants already know so many of their stock will be sold, but do they know the exact customer? If you Volunteer your patronage
What happened was, the powers that have been knew who was coming and did everything possible to demonize that person. Few on earth know the real story.
Where was my mind when I wrote this? What a condescending jerk.