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Can you explain your belief in God

  1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
    DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago

    Without using the bible, nature or any of the other "normal rants" seen around HP.

    Please explain what it is that allows your personal belief in God or what is it that you use as your proof.

    I am not picking or looking for arguments...I am curious as to why you believe the way you do and what it is that gives you your undeniable proof of God.

    1. profile image0
      SirDentposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      I heard His voice calling out to me.

      1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
        DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Actual voice or more of a "guiding" or "feeling"?

        There are people who are supposed to have what is known as "audiovoyance".
        I know that I can hear the 60hz electric running through certain things if the shielding is failing.

        I am curious if it is something like that or more of "your concience" speaking to you?

        EDIT* Sorry forgot to add, Thank you for your post.

        1. profile image0
          SirDentposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          It was an actual voice.  I had never heard of audiovoyance before.  You are welcome.  smile

      2. pedrog profile image58
        pedrogposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Have you saw a psychiatrist, hearing voices its not a good thing...

    2. Pintoman profile image60
      Pintomanposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Logic. There is no other logical answer. God must exist, logically. I also know He exists because I have a personal relationship with Him, through His Son, Jesus. Atheism is absurd logically. I'm not going to argue either. That's my answer. If you want more logic, go look up Dr. Craig on youtube. He is probably the top christian, philosophical apologist alive today.

      1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
        DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Thank you for your post.

    3. pennyofheaven profile image79
      pennyofheavenposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Awww but ranting is my middle name!

      Ok...

      Simply put. I experience.

      Even if I didn't believe in God my experience tends to invalidate what I might be choosing to believe at any given moment.

      There are no adequate words to describe the different experiences. Any attempt will fail more often than not. Like most other peoples experiences of God already written about it...they can send a 'perceiver' into an altogether different direction.

      1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
        DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        You are not the first to speak of experiences...I often wonder...If these experiences we feel or have are in fact something natural that all people have. And some equate it to God or "religiously spiritual" because that is what we have been taught or understand. While others relate it to something different because they have (for them) found that God cannot exist, so that it must be something of the human nature.

    4. tlmcgaa70 profile image66
      tlmcgaa70posted 6 years ago in reply to this

      DoubleScorpion. i will answer your question, but i will not respond to those who wish only to debate. i have no need to prove to anyone anything. my beliefs are as valid to me as anyone elses are to them and i do not insist anyone else accepts my beliefs.
      as for your question. when i was 3 i died. i was brought back, but almost to late. but while i was dead, i experienced...a vision, whatever you want to call it...JESUS met me and took me up onto HIS lap. HE told me it was not my time yet and I could not stay, i had to go back. there is more but that is the important part. that experience...a spiritual experience that transcends the physical world, stayed with me all my life and influenced me. my relationship with GOD did not stop there. HE watched over me, protecting me from many dangers. including keeping me from drowning twice in one day (i was a foolish child who loved adventure...perhaps to much) by causing me to breathe water. when i was old enough to understand, HE began teaching me. HE has guided my footsteps my whole life. I didnt learn about GOD through the Holy Bible...I learned about the Holy Bible through GOD. what I know about GOD most christians deny to be truth. I have been called a member of a cult religion, though i am member of no organized religion at all...GOD is my religion.

      1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
        DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Very Nice. Thanks for posting.

    5. TJenkins602 profile image59
      TJenkins602posted 6 years ago in reply to this

      NO!!! Well, there is no other way to explain all the bad luck I am having so there must be a God :p

      1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
        DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Well. you know what they say...If it wasn't for bad luck...some people wouldn't have any luck at all.  smile

        1. Cagsil profile image60
          Cagsilposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          There's no such thing as luck. lol It's all timing and positioning at that particular time. lol

          1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
            DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Ain't that the truth.

  2. DoubleScorpion profile image83
    DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago

    We have a hurricane coming through my area. So if I don't respond for awhile that would be why.

    1. profile image0
      SirDentposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Keep yourself and your family safe.

  3. Diane Inside profile image82
    Diane Insideposted 6 years ago

    I believe in God, a creator, what ever you may call it. He has many different names to many different people.

    Where there is a design---There is a designer.

    I have faith that there is a God.

    The proof I have is my life and yours and everone and everything around us

    I'm not a fanatic, but I believe there is something more than just us here and nothing more.

    1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
      DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Thanks for your post

    2. earnestshub profile image89
      earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Yes I saw the sort of proof you operate under. Received any mail yet? smile

      1. Stevennix2001 profile image83
        Stevennix2001posted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Oh come on Earnest, I'm sure she has her reasons for believing.  Besides, doublescorpion was merely asking everyone why they choose to believe in god, and she was just answering the forum question.  Besides, you heard of Cagsil's patented unwritten forum rule about commenting on other people's posts in forums.  wink  lol

        1. earnestshub profile image89
          earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          I am referring to the blatant lies she told about me and then didn't have the guts to front up to. smile

          1. Stevennix2001 profile image83
            Stevennix2001posted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Oh that.  Well, I can't really comment on it, as I have no idea what that's about.  that's between you two.  However, I'm sure the issue between you both will be resolved shortly.

    3. habee profile image90
      habeeposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      This is pretty much how I feel, too. I don't think our brains are capable of understanding all the wonders of life and the universe.

      I've read the Bible several times, and I admit that I find many parts of the OT troubling. I am, however, inspired by the teachings of Christ in the NT. I like the idea of healing the sick, feeding the hungry, and loving our neighbors. I'm not saying, though, that one must be a Christian to engage in these benevolent actions. I've known some truly altruistic atheists.

  4. MelissaBarrett profile image60
    MelissaBarrettposted 6 years ago

    I go about belief in God/Jesus a little differently.  I have no proof of existence because there is no proof of existence.  None.  Anywhere.  Whatsoever.

    I think that the concept of God is probably pretty accurate inasmuch as there is something higher than us.  Be that collective consciousness, advanced aliens, an omnipotent being, or just the natural order of the universe.  God is just as good of a name to call that force than anything else.  I also believe that force is singular and is the same God of all religions regardless of what each religion calls him.

    I think that the distinction in religions come with the prophets/clergy and ultimately the believers. 

    That being said, I choose to follow Christ as prophet.  I may not agree with the way that a lot of people interpret the Bible, because I don't rely on other people to explain to me what it says.  I am also quite realistic about it's authorship and realize that it was indeed man that wrote it.  Despite a lot of other peoples interpretations, I have yet to see the vileness in the book that everyone else has.  And the story of Christ moves me.  I think the lessons of self-sacrifice, unconditional love, forgiveness, and faith are beautiful and well worth emulation. 

    So while many people may not call me a Christian, I am indeed-by all definitions- a worshiper of Christ.

    1. earnestshub profile image89
      earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Yep! Theres nothing bad in the bible........................ unless you read any of it that is!

          If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, "You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord." When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through.   (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)

      1. Evolution Guy profile image60
        Evolution Guyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        I wonder if they even bother reading this book they claim to follow? Not many of them seem to have bothered. I think the read the Cliff notes instead. lol

        "God made everything. Jesus sacrificed himself so that we are saved. No Majik was involved. The End."

        1. MelissaBarrett profile image60
          MelissaBarrettposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Hi hon, haven't seen you around much.  Thought we lost you.  Good to see you are still fighting the good fight.

          1. Evolution Guy profile image60
            Evolution Guyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Thanks. I am continuing to fight against the ignorance and hatred you perpetuate - yes.

            Read your book. Do some research. Educate yourself. Please.

            1. MelissaBarrett profile image60
              MelissaBarrettposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              I hate it when I perpetuate ignorance and hate accidentally.  Maybe you could tell me again exactly how I do that in my life?  (Now see, that was sarcasm... a little at least)

              1. Evolution Guy profile image60
                Evolution Guyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Your blind belief in a hate filled book that you have not actually read. Try educating yourself. There are some fascinating - and genuine - answers to be had.

                1. MelissaBarrett profile image60
                  MelissaBarrettposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  LOL, where do you get blind faith from?  And why do you assume I haven't read the book? And even if I did have blind faith in the book, how does that affect anyone else.  And what answers am I missing?

                  I think you are making some assumptions about me, which is fine I guess.  If you don't mind being wrong.

                  1. earnestshub profile image89
                    earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    You have made plenty of assumptions about me that were wrong, and when I bought it up you did the usual christian thing and ignored it.

                    Have you even read the OT?

                    It is chocka with hate, threats and a tiny god who if not worshipped wipes out almost all of mankind, yet somehow you don't see it. Why would that be?

                  2. Evolution Guy profile image60
                    Evolution Guyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    There is only blind faith. It is not possible to have any other sort. You have clearly not read your book - or you choose to lie about what is in it. 

                    You are missing ALL the answers.

                    Perpetuating ignorance and hatred does affect other people. I am not making any assumptions.

                    You have proven me right. Jesus was not an actual person. There was no fervor at the time he existed - because he never existed.

                    Do some research. Educate yourself. It is awesome how much information there actually is instead of the lazy answer you swallowed.

      2. MelissaBarrett profile image60
        MelissaBarrettposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Thanks for giving me eyestrain.

        Anyway from what I get that isn't an order so much as a prophesy. Its speaking about Christs return to earth and what will happen to those who say that he isn't the true second coming.  *Shrugs*  I can see where it could happen.  Given the fervor over his appearance 2000 years ago, if Christianity was given a walking breathing Messiah I can easily see parents killing their kids if they speak against him.  I'm pretty sure some of the more overzealous would do it now.

        You know earnest, for someone that doesn't believe in the bible you spend an awfully lot of time reading it.  And your ability to see evil in it is matched only by the conservative christian zealots.  Ever wonder why you and them see the same thing?  *ducks*

        1. Evolution Guy profile image60
          Evolution Guyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          There was no fervor. There is no contemporary evidence at all. None. If you bothered to research this - you would discover that fact. This is the problem with your blind faith. It came too easy. Believers are intellectually lazy.

          1. MelissaBarrett profile image60
            MelissaBarrettposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Wow, I have no idea what you are talking about. 

            What fervor? Contemporary evidence of what?  I was just telling what I got from the verse after I read it in context. 

            Maybe its just my intellectual laziness, but could you put your statements into context for me please? 

            And no that wasn't sarcasm.

        2. earnestshub profile image89
          earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Ex christian.
          Lots of study.
          No point wasting it.

          I have a lot of curiosity about life that I don't like to see reduced to goddunnit. smile
          As for the hate in the bible, almost impossible to avoid..... unless wilfully.

          "I will sweep away everything in all your land," says the LORD.  "I will sweep away both people and animals alike. Even the birds of the air and the fish in the sea will die.  I will reduce the wicked to heaps of rubble, along with the rest of humanity," says the LORD.  "I will crush Judah and Jerusalem with my fist and destroy every last trace of their Baal worship.  I will put an end to all the idolatrous priests, so that even the memory of them will disappear.  For they go up to their roofs and bow to the sun, moon, and stars.  They claim to follow the LORD, but then they worship Molech, too.  So now I will destroy them!  And I will destroy those who used to worship me but now no longer do.  They no longer ask for the LORD's guidance or seek my blessings."   (Zephaniah 1:2-6 NLT)"

          Seeing requires looking. Hate is what it looks like, hate.

          1. aka-dj profile image76
            aka-djposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            You pick the negative.
            I prefer the positive!

            1If I could speak all the languages of earth and of angels, but didn’t love others, I would only be a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I had the gift of prophecy, and if I understood all of God’s secret plans and possessed all knowledge, and if I had such faith that I could move mountains, but didn’t love others, I would be nothing. 3If I gave everything I have to the poor and even sacrificed my body, I could boast about it;a but if I didn’t love others, I would have gained nothing.

            4Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous or boastful or proud 5or rude. It does not demand its own way. It is not irritable, and it keeps no record of being wronged. 6It does not rejoice about injustice but rejoices whenever the truth wins out. 7Love never gives up, never loses faith, is always hopeful, and endures through every circumstance.

            8Prophecy and speaking in unknown languages and special knowledge will become useless. But love will last forever! 9Now our knowledge is partial and incomplete, and even the gift of prophecy reveals only part of the whole picture! 10But when the time of perfection comes, these partial things will become useless.

            11When I was a child, I spoke and thought and reasoned as a child. But when I grew up, I put away childish things. 12Now we see things imperfectly, like puzzling reflections in a mirror, but then we will see everything with perfect clarity.c All that I know now is partial and incomplete, but then I will know everything completely, just as God now knows me completely.

            13Three things will last forever—faith, hope, and love—and the greatest of these is love.
            (emphasis mine)

            big_smile

            1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
              DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this



              There is both positive and negative in all things. We can't have one without the other.

              I wonder if more people looked for and found the more positive things in life, if this world wouldn't be just a little bit better.

              Many only see the positive of their "religion", but seeing, knowing and acceptance of the negative allows one to avoid those things. The same as in life itself.

          2. MelissaBarrett profile image60
            MelissaBarrettposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            *shrugs*  I guess maybe I do tend to willfully ignore hate.  I don't seek it out so that's not what I focus on.  I seek love, I find love.  Tell me how that is bad again?

            I mean if we are reading the same book and I am getting a positive message that inspires me to be a better person... why would you try to convince me that it is wrong?

            And I am an extremely curious person.  I need to know how and why things work.  My intellect is not at all challenged by my faith. I'm not really a Goddunnit kinda chick.

      3. livelonger profile image89
        livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Do you think parents treat little children differently than they do older children, and use different language when they do? Do parents ever tell "white lies" or gross simplifications to their children for any constructive purpose?

        Are you under the illusion that everywhere outside the Hebrews' domain in 500BCE was peaceful and rational?

        1. earnestshub profile image89
          earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Unrelated. You seem to be under the delusion that a psychopathic invisible unproven unlikely in the extreme fairy told his "kids" lies?

          goddunnit innit?

          1. livelonger profile image89
            livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Occasionally you act like a decent person here. This is not a good example.

            1. earnestshub profile image89
              earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Occasionally I am well over being given the "word" by a bunch of hypocrites who imply they are better people than others, and have the inside running on life because some psychotic tome told them so.

              1. livelonger profile image89
                livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Well, I have never said that, because I don't believe that to be true. That's frankly really insulting to both me and those that I love (the vast majority of whom are not religious at all) that you would accuse me of that.

    2. DoubleScorpion profile image83
      DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Very nice. Thanks for the post.

  5. Jerami profile image72
    Jeramiposted 6 years ago

    can i splain it  ?????     ""   


        Could "!


          Wont thoug; cause  ....    you dont't wamt to hear it so you won'r!



         So    I       cain't.


          or I'd cheapen it    for me



            find your own.

    1. Jerami profile image72
      Jeramiposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Good night yawl     just coning in long enouh to say Ha

    2. DoubleScorpion profile image83
      DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      A very personal experience for you. Good. Thanks for the post.

  6. pisean282311 profile image53
    pisean282311posted 6 years ago

    my belief comes from observation of nature ..and belief is that religious good and books are man creation...god has nothing to do with , nor does it interfere and day to day affair of humans..

  7. earnestshub profile image89
    earnestshubposted 6 years ago

    A very good post Melissa. I also seek guidance, and fear the gods that are archetypal and with good reason.
    They are a part of my psyche.
    No person escapes religiosity or the seeking of gods entirely and that is a conversation best had on a psychology forum as I see it.
    What we can do is recognise it's subconscious existence, and expose it to self thus enabling an entirely different way of seeing it to that of a "believer"
    If you base your beliefs on the good things said to be said by Jesus, (or take your pick of whichever if you do the research)then that is in line with a lot of rational thinking.

    The mistake I see is that when one takes on the christian title, the OT comes with it, as do many anomalies in what Jesus is supposed to have said, the rivals of his at the time, the same jesus that came before jesus that said the same or similar things, none of them very profound anyway, and all of the little bits bolted on as you have accurately described. (I'm impressed.)

    A Zealous christian will use every passage from wherever it came from historically to support what they believe, and there is something wrong with that. I see you recognise what that is. They do not know the history of their religion as well as you do in most cases, and I find their arguments faulty in facts.

    Evil? Evil is me. I am evil, just like every other human being. It's called the human condition for a reason. I am also decent, honest kind and full of love for many people human or otherwise.
    The difference between evil people and good people is the ability of a said person to act out of the right part of themselves, and denying that I am the mass murdering kind only allows me to become one.

    I have benefited from looking at myself, not jesus or any other role model, I only wish to emulate myself, not some external entity that does not appear in any way to exist other than in belief. I believe in self worth, not the apologetic falsely modest bulldust I see here all the time, I mean love for self.

    I believe in me, My curiosity lead me to spend six painful years in psychotherapy because I found an expert in the field I wished to use, and am more than happy to continue learning anything to do with what and how we think.

    My beliefs just ain't sacred, they are ready to be changed in a heartbeat. I am a very simple person in that way. I believe what I believe until something proves it wrong. smile

  8. profile image0
    Emile Rposted 6 years ago

    God is a difficult word, since we all have different definitions. But the force I am aware of and willing to contemplate if it is 'God' or not I know through revelation. I have had experiences that leave no doubt in my mind that we are connected to something. Whether it transcends the physical world and can never be fully known, or it is a part of the universe that we have yet to fully quantify I couldn't say.

    What I use for proof is even more difficult to explain. I start with what I know about it.  I know this force exists here and now, so I can't make a deist argument. I know the force is benign although I have no evidence that is is willing, or able, to influence any more than our hearts and minds; so I can't make a theist argument.

    Contemplating how this force could exist in the world as we have come to know it; I'm still grappling with. But my current musings take into account that we see many patterns within the physical world; so I would assume any answer would mirror patterns we do see. My favorite idea right now revolves around the pattern of the water cycle here on earth. Each of us being a brief manifestation of a separation of a tiny portion of the whole. Each life a singularity, of sorts, by choice or ignorance; separated momentarily but destined to be absorbed upon death. We would all be, in essence, an integral part of God; albeit each of us a very tiny part.

    1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
      DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Very nice Emile. Maybe I am taking you wrong, but it sounds like you have your personal proof of a higher force or "divine power" (of sorts). But that isn't necessarily a/the "God", that everyone believes in.

      It is said that there is energy in everything. Theory would think that the universe has it's unique energy signature, what if that energy is what everyone feels and equates to "God". That might explain why many can feel it, but feel it in different ways. It would also explain why some can't feel it at all. People are different and their perceptions vary.

      1. profile image0
        Emile Rposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        No. You didn't take me wrong. I simply think people are prone to assume an experience or two is license to let their imaginations run wild. I've been a victim of that myself. So, I realized that I needed to back up and start with the premise that what I know is as powerful as it gets. With that in mind, I have to determine how that might be possible.

        Your comments on energy do seem to be one of the possibilities. It's all, unfortunately, idle speculation. Entertaining, of course; but we may never have an answer.

        1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
          DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Sadly this is true. We may never prove anything remotely like this or any other theory, not only in our lifetime, but ever.

          1. livelonger profile image89
            livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            IMHO, that's fine. At least there's the impetus to keep on exploring. It's the exploration that will eventually lead us to an answer.

  9. earnestshub profile image89
    earnestshubposted 6 years ago

    That sounds like a non threatening idea. I like that you said "current musings," as it allows for new thoughts to flow in when we don't put up brick walls. smile

    1. profile image0
      Emile Rposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Drat Ernest. I had namaste and a smiley face ready for people laughing at my pitiful musings. You have to go and be all nice about it.

      But, it's counterproductive to put up a brick wall in a belief system. Information has to be allowed to flow hard and heavy, or you get distracted by make believe. If there is something to figure out, we'll never do it standing in one place.

      1. earnestshub profile image89
        earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Never mind Emile, we all suffer the indignity of someone agreeing with us from time to time. smile

  10. quicksand profile image83
    quicksandposted 6 years ago

    Believer here. The reason to disbelieve in his existance does not exist so I believe he exists! smile ... Er ... quite apart from that ... I have no grudge against GOD ... so I believe that he does exist!  lol

    1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
      DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      No evidence to prove non-existance and no grudge so no reason not to believe? Is that correct from your post?

      Thanks for the post.

      1. quicksand profile image83
        quicksandposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Yes, DoubleScorpion, I have absolutely no grudge against GOD. He has not broken any promises ... and he never will.  smile

        LOL! He never promises anything to anybody either! It's the ones who "expect" reciprocation for "voluntary" services rendered who feel disappointed.  lol

  11. livelonger profile image89
    livelongerposted 6 years ago

    I don't know about "undeniable proof" because not all people who believe in G-d think that it exists (or that it's necessary), but I have long felt that the universe has an ethos. That ethos is: continuous evolution, change, increasing humanity and love, and slow, gradual achievement of moral behavior alongside greater understanding/revealing of how existence works.

    I do not believe in G-d as a personal being, but rather the name given by people who are struggling to wrap their heads around the divine.

    For context: I was raised very non-religious but nominally Catholic, was secular/agnostic/atheist during most my adult years, and converted to Judaism a couple of years ago.

    1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
      DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Nice post. Thanks

  12. lone77star profile image88
    lone77starposted 6 years ago

    Explain my belief in God?

    Because He Is

    I do not "believe" He is, I know He is. There is a big difference between "belief" and "faith."

    "Belief" is at effect; "faith" is at cause.

    Remember what Rene Descartes said? "I think, therefore I am." He either knew God exists or believed it. Smart man.

    Look-Alikes

    It is naturally difficult for someone who does not have faith to tell the difference between "belief" and "faith." On the surface, they seem to look exactly alike.

    There are many aspects to human nature which have look-alikes that are vastly different.

    Take "shyness," for instance. There are many aspects of that which look like humility. But shyness is all about the "self" (ego). Humility, on the other hand, is all about selflessness.

    The true self (spirit, soul, child of God) cannot awaken so long as we place importance in ego. Ego is the "master" of this world and source of all evil. Think about every evil thing man has done. It all comes back to selfishness (ego).

    Groveling has some similarities with humility, but groveling is also all about the self (ego).

    Being at Effect

    Some use the term "victim" when they talk of someone who commits suicide. Interestingly, though, the suicide is also the perpetrator in the ultimate separation of self from everyone and everything else. Suicide is perhaps the most selfish act anyone can ever do. But the "bite" of the "forbidden fruit" was also an act of suicide. That fruit was no physical plant material, but a matrix of dichotomies which formed the poison we know of as ego. This resulted in a spiritual "death" from which we need to be resurrected. The first dichotomy, good-evil, was mentioned in Genesis. Others include, right-wrong, generous-selfish, compassion-indifference, wisdom-stupidity, etc. Therefore, anyone can remain trapped in ego and seem good, right, generous, compassionate and wise. So, what's the difference? The Buddhists called the difference "paramita" (the other shore or side of existence).

    Paramita generosity is like the Zen "one hand clapping." It is the perfection of generosity, devoid of all selfishness. This is a non-dichotomy. Ego cannot touch this. This resides in the timeless realm of spirit and creation. Ego is made up of time (persistence) and thus will not fit in that realm.

    Sympathy-compassion is another look-alike pair. Sympathy is destructive and, again, all about the self. There is no clean intent to help with sympathy. Any action by the sympathizer tends to suppress and disable the "victim." Compassion, however, is all about generosity. At its most powerful, it is anonymous, so the "self" (ego) is never involved.

    continued...

    1. A Troubled Man profile image59
      A Troubled Manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      There is a big difference between honesty and dishonesty, too. By saying you know God exists you are being dishonest and you know it too. smile

      1. Evolution Guy profile image60
        Evolution Guyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        It is OK he lies - becoz he iz a cho=sen liaR THEREFORE IT IS OK.

        U wouldn't  unerstand. U iz 2 stoopid innit.

        Blue words iz better innit

      2. lone77star profile image88
        lone77starposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        The "all-knowing" and omniscient "Troubled Man" has spoken. Do you think you are only your Homo sapiens body? If so, then I'm not surprised by your response.

        And you too, EG.

        Such "logic"... such grammar and spelling. Such intellect. I am sorely amazed!

        1. A Troubled Man profile image59
          A Troubled Manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Yes, we both are and you know that too. smile

          1. Evolution Guy profile image60
            Evolution Guyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            No - he can do majik and understands stuff u r 2 stoopid 2 understand. LOL

            He sez majik.

            N when he do it in blue wurds - it iz special reel wot u int gettin.

  13. lone77star profile image88
    lone77starposted 6 years ago

    Continued:

    Powers of Perception

    Honing one's own powers of perception, especially with self-awareness, is key to being able to recognize the subtle differences.

    With such refinement, anyone would be able to recognize the mechanics of creation and perform any manner of extraordinary miracle (cause-and-effect coincidence or circumvention of physical law). With such refinement, one might find their true self outside of their body with full visual ability -- an ability to see details, even to the point of reading private mail or sneaking into private places. That which travels and perceives has nothing to do with Homo sapiens and its limited abilities. The physical body is merely a tool facilitating our ability to discuss these philosophical issues.

    I have done these things because of faith. Requiring "proof" first prevents the acquisition of faith. So, if one adheres to the scientific approach to the exclusion of all else, then they will miss out. This is similar to Einstein's challenge more than a century ago. All other scientists were stuck in Newtonian simplicity. Einstein was able to imagine possibilities outside of that box, and he did not need proof to find himself out on that limb. He let his faith guide him. He knew that there was an answer outside of current law. Many scientists do not have the bravery or imagination to visit that realm.

    Being at Cause

    And to think that there might be mechanisms at work underlying reality that are not subject to the laws of science, some scientists cannot fathom such a possibility. But these answer the questions of what is "time," "space," and "cause."

    God is "cause." Every effect requires one. And for those who might quip, "who created God?" The answer is quite simple: "God is cause, not effect."

    1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
      DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Thanks for the post. A little on the long side, but I understand the context.

      1. lone77star profile image88
        lone77starposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Pithy one-liners really don't hold my interest.

        Thanks, Double, for adding such an interesting forum question, but I was hoping for a more engaging discussion.

        Oh, well.

        1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
          DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          I didn't what to "pick" or "debate" this particular question. I am curious of the responses. And there have been a few really good responses.

          I could debate the point of views offered, but that would defeat the purpose of what I am trying to learn from this question.

          1. lone77star profile image88
            lone77starposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            I understand, Double. I wasn't even talking about "debate." A simple discussion would allow me to learn, too. And I continue to hunger for learning.

            Good luck with your research. An admirable task.

            1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
              DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Would you like to discuss your thoughts and mine? Or would you like to see a complete thread discussing the explainations of our belief in God? That is something we could do. There are a few folks on here that I would really enjoy sitting down with in real life and have a friendly discussion on religion and philosophy. I think some have a really good outlook on things, but written words lack the voice and body language interactions of a real live discussion.

            2. Evolution Guy profile image60
              Evolution Guyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              How can you have a hunger for learning exactly? You already claim to do majik and have knowledge above and beyond reality.

              You think we are stupid enough to swallow this lie? lol

              1. tlmcgaa70 profile image66
                tlmcgaa70posted 6 years ago in reply to this

                evolution guy...i am curious why it is if people can believe in a GOD, and that belief does not harm you personally, what problem do you have allowing them the freedom to believe as they like. i admit there are to many who try to force their belief on others. but surely you have the intelligence, when faced with those who do not, to treat them with the same respect as they treat you. i personally believe evolution is flawed...but i am not going to tell you you believe a lie. people are free to follow whom they will follow and believe what they will believe.

  14. thisspice profile image69
    thisspiceposted 6 years ago

    I didn't read through all of the comments, but I think in a simple fashion of explaining to someone why you believe in God would be to ask them if they can see the wind. Someone might state that yes, they can see the wind because they can see the leaves moving on a tree, or the ripples on top of a pond... But is that really the wind you are seeing, or the effects of the wind?

    Can we actually see God? Physically no, but we can see the effects of his greatness. A baby being born, a person who is cured of cancer, an accident survivor...

    Another example would be a watch. A basic pocket watch can contain many complications which are made up of many gears and pieces. If you took all of those pieces and put them in a box and then shook the box, more than likely, you would end up with what your started off with - a box full of gears and pieces. But if you put those pieces in front of a skilled engineer, he would be able to create a working pocket watch. Without that creator, you would've had all of the makings to have something great, but would have never have gotten what those pieces could have been if put together in the right order and in the right places.

    1. A Troubled Man profile image59
      A Troubled Manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      It is the atmosphere in motion, and yes, we can see the atmosphere, we know exactly what it is made of and how it works. Your exmaple is tired, old and pointless.



      Those are the effects of nature, not gods. What about babies that don't make it through birth, all the people who die of cancer, who die in accidents? Where is God then?



      Another tired, old and pointless example that has been shown to be a faulty analogy.  Fractals are complex patterns that emerge naturally from simple systems showing easily that complexity is not a valid argument for a designer.

      1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
        DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Some things can just never be explained or proven. Apologetics are founded in these types of arguments. Some just have a refusal to see anything past their own beliefs. Education must be a sin to some people I am starting to think.
        Education and understanding sciences does not mean one has to change their faith or belief, although it seems like some feel that it does.

        Maybe some fear that science will prove their faith or beliefs wrong and they wouldn't be able to handle that. Seems that they aren't to sure of their faith or beliefs.

        1. tlmcgaa70 profile image66
          tlmcgaa70posted 6 years ago in reply to this

          for me, i dont fear science at all.  science can be very educational, beneficial, even fascinating. but then, i dont consider the theory of evolution to be very scientific either. there is no threat in science...science has no power over GOD. there is no worry on my part that science can ever prove either my faith or my beliefs wrong. nothing on earth can shake what I know to be true.
          i do not expect anyone else to hold these same truths or beliefs. it is not my place to convince anyone they are right or wrong in their own beliefs.

          evolution guy...dont you have anything to contribute to a conversation or discussion than insults? or is that the only reason you hang out in religion forums...to insult believers?

          1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
            DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Things do evolve though...That has been proven by science. And the Theory of Human evolution is just that...A Theory...It does have supporting evidence, but as with many other things, cannot be completely proven as fact...Yet...the facts change as new evidence or knowledge is gained.

            Even religion and faith and beliefs evolve. As one gains new insights into these fields, their faith, beliefs and even the religion can change.

            1. A Troubled Man profile image59
              A Troubled Manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Evolution has already been proven as fact because the science of microbiology would not exist if it were not fact.

              Not only that, but the two primary requirements of evolution have been shown to be fact; natural selection and generation of diversity can be demonstrated using simple common examples that follow the laws of thermodynamics and statistical mechanics.

              1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
                DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Evolution I agree...Human Evolution (as in from monkeys) is still not concrete...All things evolve, but proving humans came from monkeys or the primival ooze is still a work in progress (from what I understand).

                1. A Troubled Man profile image59
                  A Troubled Manposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  I didn't know humans came from monkeys, perhaps that is my misunderstanding of human evolution.

                  1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
                    DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    To be completely honest, I don't know how humans came about. Science makes the most sense to me overall. I just can't believe that "God" created, as the bible claims.
                    In my humble opinion, science just hasn't concretely confirmed anything yet. But, it is highly likely based off of the information and studies we currently have.
                    Who knows maybe one day, someone will find proof that we can from another planet and migrated here because we managed to kill off our old world, like we seem to be doing to this one scarily fast.

  15. Bard of Ely profile image86
    Bard of Elyposted 6 years ago

    For me it is a combination of two things: an inner feeling that cannot be explained and the amazing complexity of the universe we live in which is more and more mind-boggling the more you look into its wonders.

    1. Evolution Guy profile image60
      Evolution Guyposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Wow - Profound BS. LOLOL

  16. Missing Link profile image80
    Missing Linkposted 6 years ago

    I agree with Bard of Ely.  God speaks to me mostly through nature and the passage of time.  You see a wrench or a bottle or an exquisite watch and you know it was created....that it did not just spring into existence or evolve from primordial mud.

    1. DoubleScorpion profile image83
      DoubleScorpionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      These items may not have sprung from the "primordial mud", but the idea that created them, did in fact just "spring into existance"

 
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