Yet you did not answer the question. In this theory you hold to, if everything comes from something or has a cause then God too, would have to have an origin or creator if you will, and that origin another creator and so on. I am well read on the Laws of causality, and the law of cause and effect both in Newton's view and in relating to Quantum Mechanics, and physics. All reiterate the relationship between an event and its cause or origin, and in turn the relationship of cause to its own cause.
In science and in religion there is a consensus that this Law works well as it is universal and unbiased in its effect and application up to a point then we simply do not know. For instance the Big bang that is so talked about is the most accepted origin of this current Universe and existence, not of existence itself. mathematical equations point to the existence of something before the big bang which from a physics point of view would make since and follow this law. Yet people bend this theory and express it to say something it never did, just as evolution is used to express something it never did. Evolution as Darwin himself stated does not believe men came from Apes, yet popular creationist will tell you this is exactly what it advocates. In Biology We have learned something quite different. In Physics, Chemistry, and geology we learn that under pressure heat and violence that three elements, specifically carbon, Nitrogen, and Oxygen will combine to form Amino Acids, the basic building block of life. We learn all kinds of thing that do not line up with a literal interpretation of the Bible. What does this mean for the Bible then? Nothing because it is a book of moral fables, examples, rules, and suggestions handed down and written by an ancient people to unite them in a common and shared ideology and belief and to guide them in centuries to come. Most of the things we read in the Bible are just good common sense, that someone was bright enough to observe it and write it down is no big mystery.
The day the Bible become the substance of your faith as a believer, and the backbone of it then you have become an idolater and lost. Take away the Bible and belief remains, as should faith, all this insistence on a book is sad and only denying many from experiencing a life, a life that is a gift. This constant need and obsession with labeling enemies and passing on condemnation is only going to find you in a life filled with hate and anger.
There is a plausible idea that when the universe began (Big Bang, I guess, though I am no cosmologist -- I assume that is still the best explanation), this was when *time* came into being. So, at a certain point (the "beginning") there is no "before."
Of course a Christian probably wouldn't like this idea, as I am suggesting God came into being at the same time as the first instant of "Creation", rather than him actually *doing* the creating.....
I'm not a Christian. I've already said I am a Kabbalist Just because someone believes in God doesn't make them a Christian. Did you find this under the Christian category? Fact is you guys love these forums because you love to argue. Your lives are empty and boring.
gee, sorry i didn't get back to you sooner. i was catching up on the latest tiger woods news. did you know he also had sex with a porn star? evidently one of her movies was titled "diary of a horny housewife".
I'm on many forums with no such problems. So this is your idea of a public forum? If we were all in person none of this harsh stuff would be said. This forum is full of people with deep aggression letting it out on people they don't know because they feel they can't let it out in their own surroundings. The other forums are nothing like this.
Do you even read the things you post? Everything you just said applies to yourself so quit your whining and crying and go to another topic thread if you are uncomfortable or unequipped to handle argument and debate, then don't stir up a hornets nest then play the victim. You're an adult so take responsibility for your words And unlike you I have no problem speaking my mind in public or anywhere I certainly wouldn't hide behind a fake name or religion.
I have reason for not using my real name. I used to have my own CMS website with 43000 members. It was called The Light Barrier.org until a hacker got into it and emailed people all over the internet using my system email advertising his business. It got me on a spam black list. I took it down because of this. I had a forum and on that forum a black person said something. People attacked her. When I took up for her and ask them to leave. They started emailing with with photos of black men and white women having sex. Then they threatened my life for "Liking black people" They then used my ID and email address to sign me up on the internet for all kinds of things. They told me they were KKK and watching me. Told me they knew where I lived and to watch over my shoulder. I started using this name and a non existing address for Whois. I need my safety. I'm not a man. You never know why someone does what they do. Usually it is for a good reason. And I started fighting back here after many many attacks. I have a right to defend myself. When defending myself didn't help I started giving back what I got. So stop judging me.
Again I ask....Do you hear yourself? Do you have any idea how crazy you are coming off as? How paranoid and delusional? You're not fighting back, you're having an argument with yourself and its really starting to become frightening.
You are also tiring and boring to me. You are coming across as a person without feelings or understanding of what someone says. Last post to you. You even look kind of mean. Not mean like someone is afraid of you just someone who has aggression inside. An angry person. Sorry about that but it's not my fault.
Do you promise? I would be so happy if you'd actually stop replying and go away that would make my aggressive non-understanding heart leap for joy, and then I wouldn't have to listen to you stoop to criticizing someone's looks and crying about people picking on you. Or would you like to continue on what you look like?
Sorry to burst you're bubble here Deborah, but I beg to differ.
The Universe came to be. The Earth then came to be. Then environmental changes occurred, hence created Human life.
Nothing created Human life, before there was human life. That's what makes US-the Human Race- UNIQUE!
I can see how you arrived at your conclusions, however, it is unfortunate that you have based your conclusions on an untruth.
How I know this untruth, because I've lived through it, practiced it and studied it, in and out, and when all said and done- It's a lie or hoax. However, you choose to look it.
The doctrinations of religions is exclusively meant to enforce a set of unachieveable goals, so that those who follow, will willingly give up their own free will and fight against their own true nature. All because, a higher cause, such as a mystical supposed God.
I've been down that road and I can honestly say, in GOOD conscience, there is no god. There is NO higher power looking out for humans. And, it's really sad to learn of the understanding that Jesus' teachings were specifically driven to get people to be their own GOD in their own life and NOT follow religion's false God. And, That's the truth.
I'm confused. If it is so private why have you been broadcasting it all evening? All I am saying is that, because there exists a word "abolute" with the definition "without limitation" is not proof that there is an Absolute - there *might* be, and there might not (seriously - I am not disputing the possibility); I was just defending the accurate statement of the other poster, that it is a matter of faith, ie unprovable
Well if you take life down to an atomic level you will discover that the same atoms that compose our being were once part of a dying star! That means the very definition of life as we know it is inclusive of objects that may never before considered to be "life".
Yes Chokmah is fire and Binah is water and they are complimentary opposites. But God is Unity. He has both male and female. He created us in his image..Male and female. I am speaking of God not the duality of creation.
It is the most sacred text of the Kabbalah All of these (there are hundreds) agree with me. You can't read a little about the Kabbalah and think you know it I have been studying and practicing it for years http://www.sacred-texts.com/jud/yetzirah.htm
Some of those links are not reliable. the one's that are, as the Zohar ,you have read very lightly ,it seems. If you have read all that, which I think not, you would know that there's a lot of teaching behind some 'obvious' statements. i think you didn't notice this .That's very strange being a Kabbalist as you say and if you are ,you must be very old. I'm not a kabbalist after more than 11 years studying. I couldn't be ,even studying 11 years more !
I do study the Zohar. It agrees with what I have told you. Age has nothing to do with it. I started studying the Kabbalah in the 1990s. Some people absorb and learn faster then others. That's not my fault
In fact the belief that the belief in evolution and the belief in God are mutually exclusive is simply not accurate. For a start, Darwin never suggested this, and he should know! But there are countless thousands (millions) of people who believe in both, some extremely educated, some not...
The bottom line is this: God could have used evolution to perform creation. (I am not sure I believe this, but I mean, of course he/she/it could have, right?)
No one was arguing. You said you don't use scripture because you are a Pantheist which means a doctrine that identifies God with the universe. So that means because I study ancient scripture (Not the English Bible) that I don't identify God with the universe.
If God exists and "wants a relationship with us" then, given that we are all pretty damn different, it makes most sense that "he" would provide lots of different ways to get to "him." I mean, at least this has some kind of consistency to it as an idea -- rather than the "believe my sh*t or else..." line.
this is what i think. god is under attack . religions are making a fool out of the great idea of god. they have made god small petty and hateful . continually pigeon hole it with archaic dogma and out dated scripture . my intent is to free god from the cage religions have placed it in
Well whatever helps you feel good about life I guess. Just don't try and twist a bunch of phrases around and meanings to justify what amounts to little more then bigotry, discrimination and camouflaged hatred of those who feel differently. If you don't like me just say it, but don't hide behind God or anyone's holy scripture, be an adult take ownership of your pettiness and accountability for your words.
Funny how little the God said it was okay defense holds up in a court of law and facts. Then again religion will just counter with something about persecution and agents of this Satan controlled world and on and on.
No I mean "You" as in general when people start these threads to promote their belief. I know what your beliefs or lack there of are. I have noticed a surge recently of so called followers of "faith" trying to quote poorly twisted scientific data to somehow prove their faith, and legitimize their own beliefs, and its just puzzling to me. If this is a belief based on faith why the need to prove it using science?
I posted this on a religious forum, where it belongs. I'm not trying to promote my beliefs. I don't care what you believe. Take it or leave it. However I have freedom of speech as long as I am not abusive or unkind. What I posted is true. it also does not have anything to do with the nature of God. God is above it all. Don't make yourself equal.
You tell me what not to do then talk about freedom of speech? Get a clue sister and take a walk. What you post is true to you not the world and if you don't like it I suggest you take it or leave it. If you're not promoting your belief then what's all the typing and posting for, I hate to say it but Mark is right you are way out there...
I post to give. When I see something I want to freely give. That's all just in case someone wants it., I want to give and my intentions are all good. You get offended because I say I don't care if you believe it. How is that taking away your freedom of speech? Not once did I say your opinions stink the way you have about my opinions.
When you say take a walk, are you saying to leave the forum? You came in here. If you disagree that's your choice. If I offer someone money and they don't want it, they reject wealth not me. Your ego is surely acting up to get so offended all just because I said I don't care. Other people mirror us so we can see who we are. I am tired of the mark thing too.
You're not a mirror of me, the fact that you would think that, shows just how lost you are. Telling people what they should think isn't giving its forcing, and selfish. What makes you think that people want your gift at all yet you assume they do, and then talk to me about ego. I get offended because you presume to tell me what the truth is and what I should believe. Your ego is colossal and out of control lady.
What is wrong with believing in something by Faith? Copyright Mark Knowles
Because I was (and am) genuinely puzzled. And - no one really answered the question. What I got was 11 pages of people trying to persuade me that they had "proof" or "evidence" and their "faith" was the same as my "faith" in my car brakes working when I had just had them serviced.
I honestly feel that this is where a lot of the ill feeling towards religion is coming from at the moment.
Take this religionist here as an example. It (don't think it is actually female) has twisted the meaning of evolution, used semantics to try and prove an unprovable point and created nothing but ill will and arguments.
Why? because if its/her "interpretation" of science is right - that means my education was wasted and all the knowledge I have garnered is a lie.
She is telling everyone here they are idiots. No wonder there is ill will.
All to shout it's point that GOD LIVES!, which is meaningless.
We live in an age where faith is derided and where so many 'authorities' insist that science is the only path to truth. It's not the religious who are persecuting unbelievers these days its the unbelievers who are persecuting those with faith in their religions. The rationalists have set the agenda hence the craving for proof and certainty.
Sadly you are part of that, Mark.
If you were to take issue with those Christians who want to ban the teaching of Darwin in biology classes, you would get my full support. If you had points to argue in favour of abortion, sex education for teenagers or any other locus for fundamentalist Christian activity, I'm sure you would get a decent hearing.
When you round on all Christians and suggest there is something dangerous, unhealthy or crazy about them you leave me far behind.
Attacking Christians as a group is no better than attacking any other group (race, religion, ethnic group) simply for being who they are.
You are very observant Will. Well I guess it's what everyone else has been observing too though. It is very clear with Mark and his little cabal.
Anyway thanks and you have my respect whether we are on different sides of an issue or not. This would have been better said in a Christian thread but we can always copy and paste it. Thanks again. Mike
Mark, I first took issue with you for a really humourless 'joke' (read attack) on the French. You defended yourself my saying some of your best friends were French (where have we heard that line before?)
Your attacks on Christians are similar. They are a group you feel safe in attacking. The question is why do you need any group to attack?
Usually, this kind of thing is do with splitting and projection (I am all goodness so they must be all badness). Sometimes it is a self worth issue. (I'm not worth much but at least I am British, German, American, White, a member of some master race or other).
It's disturbing, like some horrible echo from the thirties and forties.
Yes according to the bible you cannot show your body. As one other religionist has said here many times, you risk rape wearing a bikini. (No doubt from some sexually bent religionist) God does not care if anyone is raped so I guess that scares the bejeezuz out of them!
From the bible.
If within the city a man comes upon a maiden who is betrothed, and has relations with her, you shall bring them both out of the gate of the city and there stone them to death: the girl because she did not cry out for help though she was in the city, and the man because he violated his neighbors wife.
Better yet since you're so tired of being ridiculed for sharing then stop sharing, there's an old saying...if you don't want flies in your face then don't stir the crap. You got hounded yesterday and most of last night for this and what do you do? You come back and start it again. What do you expect to happen when you do this?
Creation and separation are a part of Yesod in Malkuth. Not in God. Elohim has no beginning or end. Just unity. El is not a human. Elohim can not be compared to humans. We are small. Elohim is the light. When the universe was created God did not have to separate from anyone. Ain Sof is the Absolute. Keter is unity. The law of separation began only after creation. Below God. Because we have to come from someone in our 3 dimensional world is the nature of mankind not God. Belief has nothing to do with it. Many people believe but it doesn't mean they work to rise above their true nature. I go by the Hebrew scripture not the English Bible. Semantics does matter. Humans are animals with egos. Everything was unity until creation then everything emanated from God. Because of creation (natural laws) everything separated from each other. A woman can not create another human until it is separated from her body. Male from female, complimentary opposites. You can't have one without the other. Up from down also complimentary opposites. Elohim the giver humans the receiver. Man can not receive the light of AhoVah, because they want to only receive pleasure. Mankind is the real creation and all the other things are made for man. The animals go by natural instinct and the thing that separates us from animals is that we can receive illumination, but the ego stands in the way, pleasure and urges. In other words we want to receive but for our own pleasure not for illumination or unity with AhoVah.
I know nothing of Madonna. I don't follow her and the red string.
The gates and lights and worlds are too complex to write them here. There is a simple expression and there is the complex expression. Yes I am in a hurry. I have Progressive Relapsing Multiple Sclerosis. It is hard for me to type because I have Neuropathy with extreme Parathesis and my hands and fingers hurt.
And you wrote this where you in a hurry?? lol This is my last post to you. Very elemental Kabbalah
Didn't you mean "WERE" not "WHERE" Were you in a hurry? Karma and even more...if you get my point.
Nothing I said was wrong. If you knew the Kabbalah you wouldn't express dislike of everyone as you do. I haven't copied anything. You say I offend. Where, because I have freedom to speak? because I defend myself? Everyone defends themselves. Even after you said it is the last post to me, you come back to defend yourself and to try to offend me. Why do you expect more from me? I see double standards here on the forums all the time. You go to every forum and say unkind things to everyone.
All you guys here want to be who you are. I have a right to start a forum for those interested, You have a right not to read what I post. I don't understand your problem (everyone's) When I see a topic an atheist posts, I don't go in and tell them they are wrong. It is always the other way around. None of you will run me off.
I see you the same way. Coming in and instantly attacking someone you don't even know. What you really don't like is that I don't say "YES DEAR, whatever you say" People on the other sites have a lot of respect for me and love what I write. This forum is full of different people then I am use to. People who have no respect for people's opinions.
you're only talking about the four elements, which is irrelevant for Kabbalah
I'm sure you know That each Sephirot has the whole 10 Sphirot inside and each of them the 10 Sephirot again and on and on and on ad infinitum that's all I'm going to say you're so childish I can't believe you're a true Kabbalist Maybe My Madonna's standards you are !!
This is utter nonsense and merely serves to demonstrate that you have absolutely no understanding of the beliefs you shout out as true. Regurgitated garbage - as usual from some one with minimal understanding and insight.
GOD DOES NOT LIVE!!!
Plus - you are a thief and incapable of apologizing - or backing up your attack on me. Charlatan. I do now see you have credited a link to the work you stole.
What a shame - now you have probably pushed a large group of people away from what I find to be an interesting if difficult to decipher religion.
I would stick to the Tarot if I were you, although I very much doubt your readings would be of any value as your ego is so large. No doubt you would tell a client all about you.
Your "interpretations" are contradictory and based solely on your own personal opinions. Any way - you were telling us we had stopped evolving - now it seems you do not understand how we evolved.
Please explain the theory of evolution and then you can explain why the theory must be rejected if there was a developmental destination.
Tribal thinking that will be the downfall of humanity.
"all the other things are made for man" Copyright Deborah Sexton.
I see you are making lots of friends and influencing people though.
Look at what you have said to me since I came in here (hubpages, forums) . Never a welcome here, always a "you don't know what you are talking about" And yes Karma, Kabbalah didn't want to teach the Kabbalah because they knew anyone who used it could be hurt by it. Same Ideal as Karma, use it for evil, reap evil. Cause and effect, reap what you sow..all the same concept. Gagging at a gnat and swallowing at a camel?
Assuming you know what's going on?. If religion offends you and you have a choice to read something or not and you choose to read it, how is it I am pushing anything on anyone? Not logical. I know you don't agree with me, but why always so unkind to me?
Tantrum, you don't know what you are talking about. I've never cheapened anything. If I said the deep things of the Kabbalah no one would understand. The Kabbalah is for everyone. Freely I receive and freely I give. I thought you were done with me.
It started out milder, however after about 90 posts of darts and arrows, it is time to fight back. I had to enter Geburah. I know this isn't the place for me, although there could be a great work here. I've never seen a place like this. Because it could be a great place, that's exactly why the attacks come. Darkness trying to stop light.
No. It is because umpteen evangelicals have come before you -- and their message is normally that non-believers are going to hell, are sinners, are debauched, and so on, often for believing such things as the geological record of the earth's true age, and other "horrors" -- you probably weren't to know, but any whiff of dogmatism can't help but remind of that...
For your knowledge, you never entered Geburah In Geburah there's no bitterness . No small talk. In Geburah there's Divine Justice. someone that can enter Geburah, wouldn't be wasting time in a forum You're still cheapening Kabbalah.
It looks to me like it started out as you baiting the trap which worked and it was sprung as intended. Saying that after 90 posts its time to fight back is a little misleadig that you werent fighting back from the start.
Please. This is an internet debate. You cant make someone else look bad or prove someone's beliefs are wrong. You can only make yourself look good or bad and show everyone your own character.
I have different beliefs from you and your belief is right over mine because it is your belief. However, you along with everyone else is insane. So everyone has an insane belief. Nice St. Bernard in the picture! Have a sane day. lol
@ Deborah Why don't you admit you want to teach the same Kabbalah Madonna learned. And lets finish this stupid debate. you just said that deep Kabbalah no one will understand. That's true. So why go on ?? I don't understand you !
There are a lot of codes in Kabbalah. I Don't acknowledge yours.
Anyway, you know ,I'm sure ,that codes are rather personal,so I assume that's not a code at all. If not you're making a very bad mistake. As codes in the Kabbalah refer to different parts and different learnings, could you please tell me where that code belongs ? If that code has to do with your personal researches ,of course I will never know what you're talking about.
And anyway ,codes in the Kabbalah are written in Hebrew. So again, I'm assuming you're translating it ? So how can I guess what you're talking about ?
I agree there is much bickering on here, most people do not express themselves freely unless they are behind a computer, we need to have some coutesy for each other, then maybe we could learn from each other.
I've never said I wouldn't. You on the other hand have said you would not reply to me again. If I'm not mistaken, you've promised it twice. Please keep your promise. Otherwise it appears your dual minds are in constant conflict.
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