Today at least 20 innocent people died while going about their daily lives. A 24 year old punk drove 10 hours to carry out his "mission" of hatred. Shortly before he entered a crowded store of people shopping for their children's back to school supplies, he posted a "manifesto" applauding other mass shootings considered hate crimes.
Trump's first term is racking up a number of such shootings inspired by his rhetoric. Or do you see it differently?
Another very sad and disturbing incident. I admit that I have a hard time keeping up with them. So many have happened just this year. Here's a map with details of each incident if anyone is interested:
https://www.abc15.com/news/data/mass-sh … ed-in-2019
I can easily see the racial divide fueled by Trump being a factor. Unfortunately, it seems to be one of many. The US leads by a violent example in its approach to foreign affairs and domestic policing. This is constantly reinforced in media and propaganda. The massive military budget wasn't born out of a culture of peace. Add lack of access to mental healthcare and economic stress to the list, and it's a recipe for disaster.
Thoughts and prayers without action are an insult at this point.
So true. It has got to the point of mere frustration and sadness for those promoting such division in our country.
Agreed. With hundreds of mass shootings already this year and plenty of year left to go, it's almost hard to fathom the depths of these problems. If anything is clear, it's that what we are doing now (which isn't much) isn't working.
Randy: Here is the shooter's manifesto:
WALMART SHOOTER MANIFESTO
Sat Aug 03 2019 22:31:51 ET
The Inconvenient Truth
In general, I support the Christchurch shooter and his manifesto. This attack is a response to the Hispanic invasion of Texas. They are the instigators, not me. I am simply defending my country from cultural and ethnic replacement brought on by an invasion. Some people will think this statement is hypocritical because of the nearly complete ethnic and cultural destruction brought to the Native
Americans by our European ancestors, but this just reinforces my point. The natives didn’t take the invasion of Europeans seriously, and now what’s left is just a shadow of what was. My motives for this attack are not at all personal. Actually the Hispanic community was not my target before I read The Great Replacement. This manifesto will cover the political and economic reasons behind the attack, my gear, my expectations of what response this will generate and my personal motivations and thoughts. Political Reasons In short, America is rotting from the inside out, and peaceful means to stop this seem to be nearly impossible. The inconvenient truth is that our leaders, both Democrat AND Republican, have been failing us for decades. They are either complacent or involved in one of the biggest betrayals of the
American public in our history. The takeover of the United States government by unchecked corporations. I could write a ten page essay on all the damage these corporations have caused, but here is what is important. Due to the death of the baby boomers, the increasingly anti-immigrant rhetoric of the right and the ever increasing Hispanic population, America will soon become a one party-state. The
Democrat party will own America and they know it. They have already begun the transition by pandering heavily to the Hispanic voting bloc in the 1st Democratic Debate. They intend to use open borders, free healthcare for illegals, citizenship
and more to enact a political coup by importing and then legalizing millions of new voters. With policies like these, the Hispanic support for Democrats will likely
become nearly unanimous in the future. The heavy Hispanic population in Texas will make us a Democrat stronghold. Losing Texas and a few other states with heavy Hispanic population to the Democrats is all it would take for them to win nearly every presidential election. Although the Republican Party is also terrible. Many factions within the Republican Party are pro-corporation. Pro-corporation = pro-immigration. But some factions within the Republican Party don’t prioritize corporations over our future. So the Democrats are nearly unanimous with their support of immigration while the Republicans are divided over it. At least
with Republicans, the process of mass immigration and citizenship can be greatly reduced. Economic Reasons In short, immigration can only be detrimental to the future of America. Continued immigration will make one of the biggest issues of our time, automation, so much worse. Some sources say that in under two decades, half of American jobs will be lost to it. Of course some people will be retrained, but most will not. So it makes no sense to keep on letting millions of illegal or legal immigrants flood into the United States, and to keep the tens of millions that are already here. Invaders who also have close to the highest birthrate of all ethnicities in America. In the near future, America will have to initiate a basic universal income to prevent widespread poverty and civil unrest as people lose their jobs. Joblessness in itself is a source of civil unrest. The less dependents on a government welfare system, the better. The lower the unemployment rate, the better. Achieving
ambitions social projects like universal health care and UBI would become far more likely to succeed if tens of millions of dependents are removed.
Even though new migrants do the dirty work, their kids typically don’t. They want to live the American Dream which is why they get college degrees and fill higher-paying skilled positions. This is why corporations lobby for even more illegal immigration even after decades of it of happening. They need to keep replenishing the low-skilled labor pool. Even as migrant children flood skilled jobs, Corporations make this worse by lobbying for even more work visas to be issued for skilled foreign workers to come here. Recently, the senate under a REPUBLICAN administration has greatly increased the number of foreign workers that will take American jobs. Remember that both Democrats and Republicans support immigration and work visas. Corporations need to keep replenishing the labor pool for both skilled and unskilled jobs to keep wages down. So Automation is a good thing as it will eliminate the need for new migrants to fill unskilled jobs. Jobs that Americans can’t survive on anyway. Automation can and would replace millions of low-skilled jobs if immigrants
were deported. This source of competition for skilled labor from immigrants and visa holders around the world has made a very difficult situation even worse for natives as they compete in the skilled job market. To compete, people have to get better credentials by spending more time in college. It used to be that a high school degree was worth something. Now a bachelor’s degree is what’s recommended to be competitive in the job market. The cost of college degrees has exploded as their value has plummeted. This has led to a generation of indebted, overqualified students filling menial, low paying and unfulfilling jobs. Of course these migrants and their children have contributed to the problem, but are not the sole cause of it.
The American lifestyle affords our citizens an incredible quality of life. However, our lifestyle is destroying the environment of our country. The decimation of the environment is creating a massive burden for future generations. Corporations are heaing the destruction of our environment by shamelessly over harvesting resources. This has beena problem for decades. For example, this
phenomenon is brilliantly portrayed in the decades old classic “The Lorax”. Water sheds around the country, especially in agricultural areas, are being depleted. Fresh water is being polluted from farming and oil drilling operations. Consumer culture is creating thousands of tons of unnecessary plastic waste and electronic waste, and recycling to help slow this down is almost non-existent. Urban sprawl creates inefficient cities which unnecessarily destroys millions of acres of land. We even use god knows how many trees worth of paper towels just wipe water off our hands. Everything I have seen and heard in my short life has led me to believe that the average American isn’t willing to change their lifestyle, even if the changes only cause a slight inconvenience. The government is unwilling to tackle these issues
beyond empty promises since they are owned by corporations. Corporations that also like immigration because more people means a bigger market for their
products. I just want to say that I love the people of this country, but god damn most of y’all are just too stubborn to change your lifestyle. So the next logical step is to decrease the number of people in America using resources. If we can get rid of enough people, then our way of life can become more sustainable.
Gear Main gun: AK47 (WASR 10) – I realized pretty quickly that this isn’t a great choice since it’s the civilian version of the ak47. It’s not designed to shoot rounds quickly, so it overheats massively after about 100 shots fired in quick succession. I’ll have to use a heat-resistant glove to get around this. 8m3 bullet: This bullet, unlike pretty much any other 7.62x39 bullet, actually fragments like a pistol hollow point when shot out of an ak47 at the cost of penetration. Penetration is still reasonable, but not nearly as high as a normal ak47 bullet. The ak47 is definitely a bad choice without this bullet design, and may still be with it.
Other gun(if I get one): Ar15 – Pretty much any variation of this gun doesn’t heat up nearly as fast as the
AK47. The round of this gun isn’t designed to fragment, but instead tumbles inside a target causing lethal wounding. This gun is probably better, but Iwanted to explore different options. The ar15 is probably the best gun for military applications but this isn’t a military application.
This will be a test of which is more lethal, either it’s fragmentation or tumbling.
I didn’t spend much time at all preparing for this attack. Maybe a month, probably less. I have do this before I lose my nerve. I figured that an under-prepared attack and a meh manifesto is better than no attack and no manifesto
Reaction Statistically, millions of migrants have returned to their home countries to reunite with the family they lost contact with when they moved to America. They
come here as economic immigrants, not for asylum reasons. This is an encouraging sign that the Hispanic population is willing to return to their home
countries if given the right incentive. An incentive that myself and many other patriotic Americans will provide. This will remove the threat of the Hispanic voting bloc which will make up for the loss of millions of baby boomers. This will also make the elites that run corporations realize that it’s not in their interest to continue piss off Americans. Corporate America doesn’t need to be destroyed, but just
shown that they are on the wrong side of history. That if they don’t bend, they will break. Personal Reasons and Thoughts
My whole life I have been preparing for a future that currently doesn’t exist. The job of my dreams will likely be automated. Hispanics will take control of the local and state government of my beloved Texas, changing policy to better suit their needs. They will turn Texas into an instrument of a political coup
which will hasten the destruction of our country. The environment is getting worse by the year. If you take nothing else from this document, remember this: INACTION IS A CHOICE. I can no longer bear the shame of inaction knowing that our founding fathers have endowed me with the rights needed to save our country from the brink destruction. Our European comrades don’t have the gun rights needed to
repel the millions of invaders that plaque their country. They have no choice but to sit by and watch their countries burn. America can only be destroyed from the inside-out. If our country falls, it will be the fault of traitors. This
is why I see my actions as faultless. Because this isn’t an act of imperialism but an act of preservation. America is full of hypocrites who will blast my actions as the sole result of racism and hatred of other countries, despite the extensive evidence of all the problems these invaders cause and will cause. People who are hypocrites because they support imperialistic wars that have caused the loss of tens of
thousands of American lives and untold numbers of civilian lives. The argument that mass murder is okay when it is state sanctioned is absurd. Our government has killed a whole lot more people for a whole lot less. Even if other non-immigrant targets would have a greater impact, I can’t bring myself to kill my fellow
Americans. Even the Americans that seem hell-bent on destroying our country. Even if they are shameless race mixers, massive polluters, haters of
our collective values, etc. One day they will see error of their ways. Either when American patriots fail to reform our country and it collapses or when we save
it. But they will see the error of their ways. I promise y’all that. I am against race mixing because it destroys genetic diversity and creates identity problems. Also
because it’s completely unnecessary and selfish. 2nd and 3rd generation Hispanics form interracial unions at much higher rates than average. Yet another reason to send them back. Cultural and racial diversity is largely temporary. Cultural diversity diminishes as stronger and/or more appealing cultures overtake weaker and/or undesirable ones. Racial diversity will disappear as either race mixing or genocide will take place. But the idea of deporting or murdering all non-white Americans is horrific. Many have been here at least as long as the whites, and have done
as much to build our country. The best solution to this for now would be to divide America into a confederacy of territories with at least 1 territory for each
race. This physical separation would nearly eliminate race mixing and improve social unity by granting each race self-determination within their respective territory(s).
My death is likely inevitable. If I’m not killed by the police, then I’ll probably be gunned down by one of the invaders. Capture in this case if far worse than dying during the shooting because I’ll get the death penalty anyway. Worse still is that I would live knowing that my family despises me. This is why I’m not going to surrender even if I run out of ammo. If I’m captured, it will be because I was subdued somehow. Remember: it is not cowardly to pick low hanging fruit. AKA Don’t attack heavily guarded areas to fulfll your super soldier COD fantasy. Attack low security targets. Even though you might out gun a security guard or police man, they likely beat you in armor, training and numbers. Do not throw away your life
on an unnecessarily dangerous target. If a target seems too hot, live to fight another day. My ideology has not changed for several years. My opinions on automation, immigration, and the rest predate Trump and his campaign for president. I putting this here because some people will blame the President or certain presidential candidates for the attack. This is not the case. I know that the media will probably call me a white supremacist anyway and blame Trump’s rhetoric. The media is infamous for fake news. Their reaction to this attack will likely just confirm that.
Many people think that the fight for America is already lost. They couldn’t be more wrong. This is just the beginning of the fight for America and Europe.
I am honored to head the fight to reclaim my country from destruction.
Hello, Peoplepower, what a litany, huh?
Too bad, for a demented Rightwinger type, this fellow does have a good point or two.
So, why is it that so many people of this bent, which is pure right wing, happen to be coincidentally involved into these kinds of killings?
I loathe the conservative and rightwing community who continue to downplay the real source and nature of these crimes and instead complain about violence from the left and "Occupy Wall Street".
The Right encourages stupidity and violence in its advocates from the youth up.
Clear white supremacy and a race baiting attitudes and it starts early, doesn't it? As this tells me that I better consider how I may need to "keep my powder dry" in the future?
The usual rightwing cretin panel on the forum can only offer "crickets" in return?
At least 80% of that is like reading more than one hubber. Ugh.
It is social media that is giving these people a platform.
There is nothing that the right would like better than to stifle free expression and muzzle the press. Well, I say a resounding NO!!!!
Trump has a hard-on for Obama because Obama called him out for the birther movement in a Foreign Press event where Obama was the host. I saw Trump go into to a slow burn.
Since then Trump has done everything he can to destroy Obama's policies and legacy. It is his way of counter-punching...What a sick puppy he is.
The sooner we can get rid of him, the better off the country will be. But It is an exercise in futility to impeach him, unless the senate buys into to it. I don't think they will.
I heard this morning there are several gun bills on McConnell's desk waiting for him to act on. Been there for awhile and he doesn't want to bring them to the floor. Moscow Mitch needs to be gone as well or these shootings will continue or even worse.
Any sort of people who kills babies and children, won't stop with mere shootings. I fear for the future....
"Any sort of people who kills babies and children, won't stop with mere shootings. I fear for the future...."
Really? I don't see that happening with your Party.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_ … ted_States
You did say any Party, right.....or does your Party not apply in the case of 45 million babies dead? And did you know even more go unreported?
By the way, the Ohio shooter was a Socialist. Does that mean you fear the elected members of your Party....or are they given a pass, as always?
Yes I would blame anyone who exhorts people to violence, no matter the party, but the right apparently is blind to Trump's animosity to different races of people.
I blame people who piss people off you might find yourself in that category
Do you mean like Omar's animosity towards Jews?
"Yes I would blame anyone who exhorts people to violence, no matter the party, but the right apparently is blind to Trump's animosity to different races of people."
As I see there is enough hate on both sides. So are we 1 to 1? Do you blame anyone that exhorts violence? Does that go for the media that 24/7 Trump bash? Using some very unprofessional verbiage. They stoke hate.
Yes, Trump also uses unprofessional highly questionable verbiage. As some of us hear also stoke the flames. It's very apparent with the insults and innuendoes we are politically divided. Not sure why more don't realize we are all being stoked, and it's leading to nothing but hate.
Trump has many reasons to be bashed by the media, most of his own making. Show where the media is advocating violence against the cretin, Shar?
I was trying to convey that medias 24/7 "reporting" Trump everything and using some very unprofessional verbiage that this stoke hate. On both sides of the aisle. Hate can very quickly turn to violence as we have witnessed this past week. I did not insinuate one way or the other if Trump is deserving of the news reports. The very content barrage of negative non-stop bashing is causing hate. I did not say media is not advocating violence, they are stoking it with stories on both sides in some cases with nothing but "if come" scenarios. All major major networks do this, I am not pointing out anyone network.
Most of the time it's Trump's mouth which gets him in trouble with the media, Shar. But I suppose you believe the media shouldn't show his very words when he say something stupid or racist? If he kept his mouth shut, he would face a lot less criticism.
So far, no media person I'm aware of has attacked anyone, or promoted hate either.
It is not your place to shut anyone up. And Offence is something that is taken. And every single media Outlet Stokes the fire of hatred. Hell you make people hate you all by yourself with hubpage help of course. And you think you're the fucking judge of people?. I have noticed this trend especially in social media of people who make people hate them trying to ban those who hate them. If someone wants to shoot you in the face obviously you want to ban a weapon. The screenplay that I was freeform writing and posting on Twitter Facebook and Instagram . #2020votewithabullet. Pissed the liberals off so they disabled all my accounts for violent organization. And then push their own cheap ass weak ass version of my fucking movie. Switching the combatants.
Just have a look at the list below of accusations that have been used against the President. Not pretty, enough to sicken most people.
children in cages
drinking from toilets
caused deaths of children on the border.
None of the above is actually true. No, just rhetoric or one might call it what it is mean to be gas to flame the fires...
Nothing Trump has uttered could come close to this kind of obstructive verbiage.
You intentionally left out Trump referring to illegals as drug smugglers and murderers. And do you have proof none of the things you mentioned aren't true?
Sharlee: See for yourself.
Do you have proof any are true? There are no cages, The president is not a nazi, and he certainly is not exterminating anyone... He has not killed any children at the borders. I have posted previously what caused the death of the 6 children that died while in the custody of the Border patrol. None show any form of negligence on the part of our officials. My point was this kind of words spread hate. Trump did make the statement illegals as drug smugglers and murderers, and rapist. And it can be well-proven many illegals are sitting in our prisons for all of those types of crimes. Facts are facts.
"My point was this kind of words spread hate."
I have begun to wonder if this kind of rhetoric is not at least a part of the spreading violence in our culture. When we see it every day, spread throughout public media, does it sway a mind already far over towards violence? I don't know.
Especially those of us on the left....
But whatever, if people want to believe the words of a POTUS inspires no one to act in any manner, then they can keep fooling themselves until they learn better. And they will eventually...
But, Sherlee, are you getting the whole picture? Of course, there are illegals in our prisons but there are plenty of American citizens there as well. I have read stats that indicate that there are more crime related problems with legal residents than with illegals, allowing for the differences in numbers.
He gives the appearance that this group of people are for the better part, criminals which is the way he worded things. That is not true. This is another way of spreading distrust and hatred. So, how much of it does he (Mr. Trump) contribute to the problem?
I agree with you in regard to Trump's verbiage being nasty and overly dramatic, and in many cases is most certainly hateful. However, nothing comes close to some of the statements the Dem's have been making in the past few weeks. Accusing and blaming Trump for overcrowded border facilities using words such as Concentration camps, extermination,
children in cages. Hitler, Nazi president, made to drink from toilets
responsible for killing children.
This kind of over the top vile rhetoric is uncalled for. It's slanderous and very unfair. This kind of language just shows a form of disparate politicking, I have never witnessed in my lifetime. No Trump in no respect has come close to the Dem's off the wall crazy vile language. Just my opinion.
As President of the United States he needs to set the example, the closing of the spigot from his end.
True, Peoplepower, I don't think impeachment is the right course, you are right as it will never go through the Senate.
I think that it would better to defeat him through the election as I fear that unsupported attempts at impeachment would backfire on progressives.
I don't know, but it seems to me this is a time to make a statement rather than give in to the Right. Otherwise, we'll see the same disdain for the law from future POTUS office holders.
I hear you, Randy, but do we have all of our ducks in a row, for sure?
Trump cannot be allowed to escape like the viper he is, he needs to be gone by Jan 20, 2021,
Without cooperation from a clearly GOP Senate and you know what chicken-s@its they have been regarding their Lord and Master Trump, what can we accomplish except place more egg on our face? We encourage Trump and his supporters if we don't get him out, all the way out the first time.
I like to think that we could be spending our time concentrating on the right candidate and a coherent message for next fall to see that he is truly becomes a 1 term president.
His "manifesto" made it clear this was a hate crime targeting Hispanics. Hate crimes against ethnic and religious minorities are skyrocketing in this country.
I await decisive action from our President -- and less inflammatory rhetoric.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 … -us-report
I'm hoping that the President can reflect on this tragedy (apparently another mass shooting just occurred but there aren't many details yet) and realize it's time to work on unifying the country, rather than dividing it.
What "action" would you propose that is not just more rhetoric?
We have had this debate on here many times. You have made it clear you don't want any gun laws.
Closing the gun show loophole is a start. No sane person can justify a law that allows people to sell assault rifles and other guns to felons and mentally ill people.
Do you favor selling guns to felons and mentally ill people? I seem to recall that you are fine with it.
Atheists like you have murdered 150 million innocent people in the last 100 years. I'd say no other group will never match your record of hatred, slavery, suffering, starvation, and mass murder.
And believers in an invisible god are completely innocent, James. 29 murders in 13 hours with dozens wounded instigated by Trump's words. He claims to be a Xtian as well, does he not?
Those who put the lying cretin in office bear part of the responsibility of these murders and this includes those who defend him.
Can you prove this, sir? Present some evidence that your statement has veracity.
Athiesm has never been a motivation for killing people, but religion certainly has.
You must be joking.
If you are going to blame Christianity for murder, then you have to accept they controlled the government, institutions and armies during that time. Atheistic regimes would be the other side of that coin.
?? While it has generally been true (but not always) that religious based killings have come from a religion controlled government, that has nothing to do with the motivation behind murders.
More than a few atheistic governments have committed genocide or mass murder, but never with their lack of religious belief being the driving factor - atheism was not the motivator. While religion (of any type, from Christianity to Islam to that of the Aztecs) has been the motivation for mass murders, atheism never has. No one has ever declared that they would now kill because their lack of belief instructs them to.
Would you not agree that it is a lack of belief in the sanctity of human life which allowed such atrocities?
Who blamed Christianity? Where was Christianity mentioned? Did I miss something?
I apologize. Where were you headed with that? Jainism? But, the point is the same, whatever the religion or political stand. You let a group of zealots grab political power, you create an environment where criticism of that group is banned, and you've got a recipe for disaster.
I am curious of something.
The Dayton Shooter was a huge fan of and very pro Bernie and Elizabeth Warren...
Who's rhetoric do we blame for his actions?
Or the mass shootings in Chicago over the weekend?
Who gets the blame for those?
Any mass shooting is a sad thing...but it is the person doing the shooting who is to blame. How, where or why they make the decision or choice to do what they do is on them and no-one else.
Just like the man who drove through a group of motorcycle riders killing 7, due to being under the influence. He made the choice to drive while under the influence...
I seriously don't understand why we have to make this a political thing...Some people are just evil and do evil things and they will use any means to justify their actions as being noble or right.
Mass shootings have been around more than the last 2-3 years...and if we are going to blame politicians for the actions of killers...then we are going to be going back a good 20-30 years.
Extreme idealism (of all types) happens pretty much everywhere, but only a few of the more "weak-minded" followers happen to go out and actually murder people in "support" of those views.
Wasn't it Maxine Waters that called for violence against the opposing party supporters?
If we are going to blame politicians, then we need to blame all of them...and not be hypocrites and only blame the ones we don't like. Because this division crap is coming from both sides...
Where do you get "the Dayton Shooter was a huge fan of and very pro Bernie and Elizabeth Warren."
I can't find any references other than right-wing propaganda sites claiming that he might vote for Warren.
No question and no DEBATE, Donald Trump and Communist Russian Loving Republicans are enablers of those who commit Horrific "Mass Shootings": Can you believe Trump and republicans actually did this in the year 2016 ?? President Obama tries to CURB gun violence and Bozo Trump undoes it: UNREAL:
"Trump Signs Bill Revoking Obama-Era Gun Checks for People With Mental Illnesses"
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/tr … al-n727221
This question should be directed to Mitch McConnell and the senate.
Moscow Mitch does what little Donnie tells him to do, Kat!
Lol. Mitch McConnell is one of the most powerful men in the country, long before Trump came along. And I am glad of it. How very little you know.
You have no clue what I know about Mitch, SD. I doubt very seriously. you've ever had a Savvy Date either.
Ooookay...now you're just being silly. But I'm not offended, dear Randy. I know how sensitive you are. But I do believe your passion is misplaced.
At any rate, Trump should thank his lucky stars that McConnell is the Majority Leader of the United States Senate.
Not sensitive in the least as any of my friends would tell you, but if it makes you feel better you can think so. After all, you think Trump is an honest man...
And you're correct about Moscow Mitch. He'll cover for the cretin as long as Donnie needs him...or they both get voted out of office, or Trump is found guilty.
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