On Facebook I know of at least two profiles where the people running them have offended some Pagans by comments they have made from a Christian viewpoint and links they have posted. I have seen this sort of problem before. So my question is: can Christians and Pagans be friends or do the belief systems cause antagonism and division?
The beliefs certainly offend, especially if they condemn the other party to a life in hell!
It's possible to be friends, but not close friends. I know 'cause I've tried it. Each "side" has an agenda; Christians want to see pagans' souls saved; pagans want to have unconditional love but never have to hear the Truth.
And....lol.....where's your mention of the Pagans offending Christians??
In a world where the pagans and christian have no clear distinction, they can only have a chaotic agreement.
Jesus is God, in case you don't know that.....
I participate in a spiritual community that has Pagans, Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, Agnostics and more. I'm close friends with many people who do not share my specific religious beliefs and have been for my entire life.
It's not the belief systems that causes antagonism and division: it's an individual's own choices and actions.
But some religions are based in making differences between followers and the rest, which become sinners or lost souls.
I totally agree; tolerance and respect is the answer.
The same here - I count Pagans, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, atheists and others amongst my friends. It makes little difference to me what religion somebody follows, only that they are true friends
Hear Hear!! I couldn't have said it better myself. That sounds like a very special group you're a part of; I'd love to know more about it...if you're inclined to share.
In my opinion...There is only one religion in this world which can bring true peace and happiness within yourself and that is the religion of Love.If you start loving those around you regardless of their race language or religion ( pagan or christianity) thats when you take the first step towards the kingdom of GOD... : cheers
People can choose to be offended or not. I believe things that are contrary to paganism. Pagans believe things contrary to what I believe. We don't have to agree to get along.
Misty Horizon and I are great friends, though she is quite pagan and I am quite Christian.
As a Christian, I must recognize that all people, even those I disagree with, are made in God's image. That doesn't mean I have to agree with them, and that doesn't mean I have to believe what they believe and it doesn't mean that they allowed to instruct or teach me.
Deliberately taking offense is a form of petty tyranny. It is an attempt turn someone's natural empathy and compassion to the offendee's advantage.
Taking offense when none is intended is, itself offensive. Refusing to take offense when offense is intended is mature.
I think if we want world peace and love, we have to learn to be tolerant of all individual views. Just because a point of view conflicts with our own, doesnt mean that it is wrong. It just means it is a different point of view. x
Personally I can agree to disagree and be good friends with many different views on any subject Adds to life's spice rack.
I think true Christians and true Pagans can be friends quite easily. Those who use their religion to offend people of other religions and claim to be better than them because of it don't deserve any friends at all.
Christianity and Paganism are both religions of peace. If people would actually follow their religions, we would all get along much better than we do today.
Until people get over this whole "I'm better than you" complex, humanity is doomed to a world of war and hatred.
When there's a belief that makes differences in who is going to Heaven and who is going to Hell, without realising that people that don't believe are going nowhere,there will always be a lot of 'problems'
That's why the war and hatred.
So very true and such an insightful comment. Well said
True morality is required. Anything less is meaningless.
Bard of Ely
It makes me sad to think that a) people get upset at what a faceless person posts on a www. The saying goes..."to your own self be true" believe this and get on with life. End of any war of words.
b) this day and age we still place so much credence in other peoples belief system and we have not seriously thought through our own. Many people have been "raised" into "their" (term use loosely) beliefs and will not go against the family.
Lets stop worrying about what others say, do and believe and we can have peace.
Ah! who am I kidding...the world will always have wars, physical or words, but I can dream....lolol
It shows a major ignorance on behalf of the poster. Pagans were the original Christians and their beliefs and practices and respect and knowledge of spirituality and it's link to this planet far outweigh what is currently borne out of Christian teachings.
You can clearly see how Separation and not Unity is the purpose of some religions. Disgraceful ignorance.
Most of my friends when I was a young man were pagans and wiccans, and along the line I also developed those traits.
When I came to faith in Christ, I still had friends who were pagans and wiccans, but it was difficult to stay friendly, as what they believed was diametrically opposed to Christ.
Christians by default accept Christ as God, pagans de facto do not.
Pagans also believe that their paganism is harmless and has no Satanic roots.
Christians understand it differently.
I can be friends with anyone, but once we speak together, many non believers decide they cannot be my friend, for they will not want to hear what I say.
The spirit in pagans cannot bear to be in proximity of the spirit in believers in Christ.
I hope you do understand that darkness also stick together for it's common purpose though in the entirety of it's nature is chaotic. For within it each element is repulsive to each other.
It's all the way around. The error Christians tend to do, is belittle other creeds stating they're satanic. When they're not.
With you on that, Misty - it is not a view that I share. I have been to many Pagan ceremonies and enjoyed them, as I enjoyed Jewish, Muslim and Hindu ceremonies and celebrations. I was fortunate to meet many wonderfully kind and caring people whilst doing so, which is always nice
I agree with your statement totally, and object to the assumption by certain Christians that Pagans don't believe in a Christ. Much of the time what they don't believe in is the misinterpretation and mistranslation and alteration of the so called Bible, (written by men and not by God by the way). Infuriating when Pagans in general have a huge love of nature and the planet and the creatures on it (and have a need to protect same), yet are accused of being "Satanic" why exactly???
Because they didn't accet Jesus??? Thats how things are right? No matter how good you are, if you don't accept Christ then you are evil????? Hi Miss Misty:)
Weird logic huh Ashwin, especially when many Pagans do accept Christ, just not in the "brainwashed" sense of the word? Actually all the Pagans I know are animal lovers, planet lovers, want to look after the environment and try to help and support others. It is very un-Christian behaviour for such people to be told they are essentially following Satan... Golly, if that is what Satan wants I have previously misjudged him totally, and he isn't such a bad bloke after all LOL!
Yes Miss Misty. its a really wierd world we a living in. Would Heaven close its doors on me just because i did'nt accept Christ? Even if i lived my life being a good person?
Well I sure hope not Ashwin, in much the same way as if my pets won't be there when I pass I have no desire to be there either, (send me to where my pets and fellow Pagan's are.... i.e. where the truly loving God is located).
Bible claims ALL humans are sinners. Hence, evil.
How can a newborn baby be evil when it's born? It's already deemed evil before it ever acts?
I think not.
Sorry My friend but i kind of miss your point here.
I didn't miss any point.
You're telling someone that even if they spend their entire life good, based on morality, never harming a soul, ever...that they wouldn't get into Heaven?
That is absolutely absurd. And, ANY pathetic god that would turn someone away of that caliber.....isn't worth my faith.
You can keep it.
It was you, who missed the point. See...now?
Because Christianity is based on marking the difference between followers and non followers. Non followers have to be Satanic and wrong.
LOL, that sounds about right... "it's our way or the highway"
Sounds rather like more of a cult than a religion then. All the genuine Christians I have met never take this attitude, and are kind unselfish people ... e.g. fellow Hubber Mike107, a Christian who is not forcefeeding his interpretation of the Bible on anyone, and is a truly likeable and a kind and genuine person.
Of course I have Christian friends that are not like that at all ! but I find here in the forums a great majority of this kind of 'christians'
The world should have more people like us hehe
I can safely say that I meet few Christians like that in the real world.
Mind you, it is seen as very impolite to ask somebody their religious beliefs in Greece - there are plenty of other things to talk about and debate
Hi Sufi, ditto your observations too. The Christians I know are far nicer than the zealots we see on here so much of the time, and honestly speaking behave more like you would expect of a Christian, God-fearing person of pure soul and spiritual wisdom.
Hehe - I have been called a demonic, idol-worshipper on here, so I know how the Pagans feel. Such is the narrow mindedness, but I long ago came to realise that they are not interested in saving my soul, only their own
Yep, shame they may actually be achieving the exact opposite eh!
I tend to ignore them as background noise - if anybody claims to have THE answer, then I move away. Nothing to do with being afraid of the Word of God, more that they are mind-numbingly boring and I would rather hammer nails into my eyeballs than listen to them rant on and on
Misha: We take requests - how would you like us to sacrifice the next goat? Luckily, Ron isn't here so we can keep the conversation clean
Only kidding, Denno - I am veggie, so only carrots have to fear sacrifice on the altar
There you are, Denno, just for you:
Now I can sit back and wait for more jokes from Misha.
Where is Ron, anyway? Not like him to miss out on the Friday night insanity
What!? Do you **** carrots, too?!
Sorry, could not resist it in the absence of Ron
we could argue all day about who Christ is and when He's coming back, and you'd probably still be stuck in your idea that He's unknowable to everyone except you and a few others.
The Bible is plain.
Christ isn't secretive about who He is.
It would be awesome if you'd accept Him today!
My message is plain if you forsake your false religion christianity and your beast the bible, and serve Christ from with you will inherit the kingdom of God the only true religion.
Then you will say I am,
for you need no religious crutch to identify yourself.
Most certainly, Brenda has encapsulated the problem well.
Although she makes claims of both sides having an agenda, the agenda pagans don't have is to shove their beliefs down everyone's throat which most certainly is the agenda of Christians.
Christians want to change everyone to believe as they do and it is this that us heathens and infidels aren't interested, and it is precisely this that offends the Christians.
Hence, the reason why they can't be "friends" is entirely the fault of Christians, they want nothing to do with anyone who doesn't believe what they believe and will consider you offensive.
The agenda is plain as it is offensive. Because the Christian cannot get past this point, there is no hope for friendship.
A lot of my former friends were pagan, and we never went for each others throats. It's possible to be friends, but a Christian should still be careful.
This song made me happy:
To answer the original question: yes, of course. But there are two prerequisite attributes that both people must have:
1. Knowledge that you do not know everything.
2. Tolerance of those that think differently than you.
Most Christians will rightly acknowledge that truth is not exclusive to the Bible, and that truth comes from other sources as well. Nature, reason, logic - if there is a Creator somewhere, then these are gifts, not detriments. Too often there is the "my way or hell" approach to evangelizing, which is a major reason for the hostility towards Christianity, especially in these forums. "Do not judge, lest..."
Hi Ashwin. Welcome back, did not see you for a while buddy
Hi Misha. Everything went downhill 2009 and i was too busy mending my life. good to be back my friend. thank you so much
Yes. much much better Misha by the grace of God... Thank you very much.
Yes we can get along and it's a two-way street. I get along with Christians who try to live by Christ's example. It's the ones who think they're Christlike but really just stroking their own egos by telling you how inferior you are that I can't abide.
Some Pagans, especially new ones, have Pagan Persecution Syndrome and see Christian stereotypes as the reality for the whole faith. This attitude usually fades, but is annoying nonetheless.
It always helps when we check our preconceived notions at the door.
tell me about the Christ you believe Him to be.
I've talked with other gnostics about this, and they were very much like you, at least so far, in that they claimed Christ as their Master, yet say He's not the Christ of the Bible.
And the worst part is, they, like you so far, were always playing the rotten game of not answering direct questions and not answering questions directly.
So, let's have it-----who and where is the "Christ" you claim to know? Tell me his edicts, his instructions; tell me who his father is, and/or his mother; tell me who his adversaries are; tell me if he's the Son of God the Creator; tell me if he died to save any "whosoever" who would believe in him...
Well I will say that the answer to this question has nothing to do with whether you are a Pagan, Christian, agnostic or nosepicker. Different people get along with different people, depending on more than just beliefs, but also personality type, hobbies, shared opinions and the like.
In fact I have heard is said that 10% of people just won't like you.
I am a Christian, but most of the time find I actually get along with 'pagans' better anyway.
We can not type cast people by their beliefs only, as there are also so many different types of christians.
So much of Christianity is repurposed/renamed pagan myths, rituals and beliefs, I can't see why they couldn't get along if they wanted to.
What a breath of fresh air to see you here Shades.
Wow! G-Ma! Today must be some special day as you appeared on forums. Hugs
LOL David, there are so few of Christians of your kind over here. Most of them around are quite militant, intolerant, and unforgiving. By the way I don't think I welcomed you back - welcome
Hey Misha! Thanks. Don't know how long I'll be around this time, finally got a break and decided to come up for air.
I think I may go and have some red wine, though. Misty's sounded good.
Great to see you BD, I wondered where you had vanished to, and yes, I agree, we are the greatest of friends regardless of our own religious beliefs
I have friends that are pagan, wiccan, christian, nonbelievers, and some that I don't really know where they are on a spiritual path. The friendships are real.
One of my dearest friends is a nonbeliever and I am grateful for her. Her knowledge of medical things saved my life twice. She never says I believe in a sky fairy or a psychotic little god, and I never try to save her soul.
I have attended weddings that were either pagan or wiccan - not sure which - when they married. I am respectful and honored to be there for them.
My "godson" is catholic and I attended all his rites through the church. I was the one in the back of the church the nuns thought was a lost soul.
And my online friends are all over too. We don't keep our belief secret - it is in the open, but they don't drag what I hold dear in the mud nor would I do that to them.
On these forums there are zealots of all kinds who cannot just allow others to be different from them. I was floored when I made my first post admitting I was a christian. I didn't tell anyone else they should be, or that they were going to hell or anything, yet I felt assaulted. And it bothered me. Now I just defend myself and I am ok with that.
I certainly wish there was more tolerance and true debating rather than the attacking though. Holly
Red one is always good, especially when it comes with Cindy. Hope you stay for a while.
um, I thought christians were friends with all people? Confused.
Totally possible and common. Jesus had lots of pagan friends. Christians who can't befriend pagans and look down their noses at them are not representing their leader.
SSSSHHHHH!!! Don't say that we can still find an angle here!
However, I do not think most Christians are this way. It is the loud few that give the entire group the negative stereotype. Whether you agree with the belief system or not, respect and tolerance is due to Christians as well. It is a two way street. Christians simply happen to be notorious for demanding that it be a one way boulevard.
Thank you, everyone, for all your responses!
The site that started me thinking about all this calls witches "sick people" and then lists pagan and occult groups such as the Children of Artemis warning against them. I had a friend who is a Wiccan mail me to complain about this site and he had posted on it calling for "tolerance." Another witch had been upset by this and has posted saying so in great detail.
The other site is by a fundamentalist Christian who goes as far as finding fault with countless Christians and their preachers for not following the correct ways of Christ. She also condemns witches and pagans and has upset an archdruidess who now has a thread going about this.
I am involved in it because I know all the people involved: the ones causing the offence and those who are offended. And as I say I actually had one of the offended people emailing me to express his upset.
Personally I think it is all a load of nonsense.
Nobody can claim single ownership to the 'Man Upstairs' I agree, keep religion to yourself and we can get along quite well.
Tolerance: sucks "I hate you but I will tolerate you" Yeah no thanks
Acceptance: "I disagree with you but I accept that we think differently"
But as they're blinded by Religion, they will never see.
Hate is the twin of murder
I dont hate anyone enough to murder them (maybe just rough the up a bit ,or alot)
Yep and I love God too guess Im human
What type of people check the religion before being or making friends ?
Well funnily enough I have ...and I havent
For instance I think all of us enjoy being around people more for have something in common with, but that doesnt need to be inclusive , ya know black n white.
My sister does not belive in God ( I do) but we have the most hilarious fun when we get together , maybe its our similar sense of humor ,but we laugh and think some similar things.
Then theres my new landlord , totally into Gothic and the paranormal ( Im not ) but hes helping me with some gardening tips ( because I suck basically ) , but when he talks about certain topics I disagree with , I just say , its not for me and asked him what interests him so much about it etc...
He has told us so much about his past and even though he doesnt see God as I do .. he has knowledge I respect him for..
Lifes too short to have enemies ,and I prefer to use my energy for peace and eating lol
Oh I thought youd never ask..those 'all you can eat places' call to me ,caress my senses at least once a month ,and must be obeyed
( See my greedy pagan side is never far away , just try to keep it in check) lol
Its possible for Christians to be friends with Pagans.
It's just "friends".
I'm a Christian and have friends who are Muslims, Hindu etc it doesn't get in the way of our friendship.
Some of the best people I know are roman catholics. They know I am a pagan. We get along just fine. Now newborn Christians I don't think, but I don't know any so not sure.
Yes, it is possible. Christmas is a good example of what can happen when the two religions are combined.
I like Christmas. I just don't pay any attention to
the Christian part.
I am neither Christian or pagan, but enjoy both aspects of Christmas, everything from the pagan symbols of holly and ivy to the story of the nativity. To my Christian friends, I send Christmas cards, to my pagan ones, I wish them a merry yule. Christmas is such a mix of celtic paganism, Judaism, Christianity, Saturnalia and the celebration of the birth of Mithras.
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