To Blacks Out There- What is YOUR Assessment of America?
America means many things to different strata of Blacks. Some contend that America is better & more progressive than ever before. There are those who even vouch that America is truly a post-racial, post-Black society free of the discrimination of the past & that the only thing holding Blacks back are....THEMSELVES. Others are maintaining that Blacks are WORSE OFF than in the Jim Crow era, with indiscriminate police shootings & harassment, not to mention more mass incarceration. There are a few who insist that in order for the system to be overturned, there may be a racial revolution. Your thoughts? (Anyone can join in this discussion-in fact, the more, the better)P.S. due to a computer glitch, this post has gone multiple. I have deleted all but one post. Sorry for this. All multiples relating to this post have been deleted. There is only one post of this kind, thank you.
I can speak for blacks because I have some DNA black in my blood, not like all those other white deniers out there.
If whites believe this Country can only be great if it is predominately white, than they are wrong. A skin color is not what makes an individual or culture great, it is the strengthen everyone in their diversity. The country leader that divides and conquer them for a lopsided victories and winners creates a lost for most everyone and their country.
Grace, don't get mad because we have had many good in depth discussions. It is just that for sometime I have suspected that you were not AFRICAN-AMERICAN. I am probably wrong, but after exchanging with you for some time, it is just an intuition based upon experience. This is a question that I could not see another AA posing in this provocative manner. It is something I would expect from whites, if at all. As AA, you would know how most of us are likely to answer, already. I have conferred with conservative black folks before, your approach and points of argument are different from theirs. Why? It has not been so much about the positions you take but how you support them and on what basis.
I had to be honest and I hope that it all stays good.....No, there is no such thing as "sounding black enough"...
enyone dat don't speak in ebonics ain't black...
Like, I said before, you need to travel more and broaden your horizons a bit. I am willing to wager that I have a better grip of the ENGLISH language, grammar and syntax, than you. I am black and while I am not up to speed in Ebonics, I have studied French, Spanish and German. So, how broad is your experience?
I don't know cred. After that post I'm beginning to question your blackness.
ahorse, I agree with Credence completely.
Just like you sound white enough. There is no question in my mind that you are close to 100% white Euro-American.
You've always sounded white to me. Does that make you white?
@ Credence, I am DEFINITELY an African American. In fact, I am a dark skinned African American. My late parents are Blacks from South Carolina and the U.S. Virgin Islands respectively. I thought you knew that I am Black. Again, we as Blacks aren't monolithic in scope. I have been called white by Blacks because I came from a solidly middle class background. I don't subscribe to the so-called prevalent Black view of things. While there is prejudice, there is also Black passivity, negativity, & victimology. More Blacks can succeed if they weren't inculcated w/negative rules by their parents, communities, & peer groups.
Sorry, forget that I said it.... No, you don't subscribe to the typical black viewpoint of things, however that is defined. Perhaps, I need even more exposure to conservative blacks.....
I am NOT a Conservative Black. I classify myself as a Liberal, even Progressive. I am a very unconventional person who refuse to be defined by societal rules. I am.........ME.
I NEVER subscribed to others' definition. I always questioned things. My late father called me hardheaded because I refused to blindly submit. I was never one for obedience. I use intelligence. I also wasn't popular among my peers. I am ME, LIKE OR LEAVE IT.In our conversations I got the distinct impression that your supported arguments that aligned with economic conservatives. Yet, your discourse and views on the social side are consistent with those on the political left.
You are OK, fine as you are....
You are a beautiful individual that does not belong in a box.I can vouch for Grace, she often agrees with my 'progressive' perspective - except on Trump, apparently, LoL! (Wouldn't that make her 'more progressive' than me?
I got stung in a racist situation one day due to my stupid Marine-stepfather and his black-Marine friend who came by our house... It was the early 70's, I was 6ish, and they were stationed at Camp Pendleton, CA - so you know the when/where of things.
The entire time the black guy was at our house, the two of them were having (what appeared to me to be) an absolutely wonderful time whooping it up and calling each other names. My stepfather would call him a 'nigger'; and the guy would return the favor by calling stepdaddy 'honky'. They were BOTH acting like it was the biggest, funnest party...
Later that week at daycare, I decided that the best way to make friends with the new little black girl who had just arrived (with the cute little piggy tails and pretty barrets in her hair); would be to crawl up on top of the monkeybars with her and call her a 'nigger'.
I truly truly thought that I was saying something 'fun' to her that would make her laugh; but the moment I said it and her face fell - I knew it was the wrong thing. I got in SO MUCH trouble (and could not even SORT of explain bcuz of my stepfather's glares).
The worst part - that little girl would never let me apologize to her, they just kept us apart as if I was a notorious racist. Again, I was 6. To this day, that entire scenario sucks to high heaven; and I have NEVER had a 'black friend' (except online) since I pretty much give them a wide berth. I still feel like the biggest racist, LoL!
Blacks, whites & all colors need to demonstrate to their kids at a young age that different colors are NORMAL. I'm not so sure that happenes nearly enough, still.I concur, parents need to adopt a universal perspective on race. We are all one. This insular, tribal consciousness & mindset must cease.
I'm SO sorry this happened to you! Because I was exposed to racism very late, if someone had called me a nigger at age 6, I would have acted puzzled. Most likely, the people around me would have been more hostile than I would have been. Hopefully, the outcome would have been better.
You live in Seattle, right? I think it's safe to say race relations there are quite civil. I used to live in Seattle, and loved it; unfortunately, I had to leave because I kept running into the wrong people, though I doubt racism was much of a reason for that. I've worked with (gasp) Muslims, and never had a problem with them. So I think it's worth your while to try making friends with blacks there.
According to "The Day America Told the Truth", published in 1991, the Deep South has the greatest number of hardcore racists. Even then, they number only 15%. The book said things are getting better, but whites are getting tired of hearing blacks whine - especially since a lot of their problems they bring on themselves, with black-on-black crime, disrespecting women, calling each other n***a, and refusing to learn in school.
I grew up in the section of the country the book listed as the least racist (only 1% hard core), and I learned about racism very late. To this day, I've experienced very little blatant racism from whites. The vast majority of the problems I've experienced have come from blacks, including members of my own family.
Blacks have it great here - far greater than they realize. With Trump in office though, they'd better get their act together, or there may be a nasty backlash. There's an online group called Stormfront, where whites come to unleash their rage against being victimized by blacks and being unable to call it by its real name. Blacks need to read through some of the posts, to see how they're appearing to whites. This is one bomb we want to defuse before it explodes!
P.S. One common sentiment there is, if blacks don't like it here, why don't they go back to Africa?Some people abused the right of speech and words and print to excite the ignorant." say yes to life" and no to a race war. No Race can win a race war in America today. We will all lose because we have a constitutional right to be and talk wrong now but if the war starts all rights will die forever. So there will be no race war just the freedom of speech not war.
@Junko
God, I hope you are right! And in the sense that 'no one will win a race war' is right. But when has 'right' out-paced the inevitable?
Junko - here is a link to a blog article. The original was written by someone who taught for many years at a predominantly black high school. Read it if you dare.
https://www.stormfront.org/forum/blogs/u64037-e3298/One thing I found interesting in your article was about the level of conformity expected within a black community that whites would find difficult to believe. We kind of witnessed it in this thread when two blacks commented that the OP probably wasn't black, since I guess the didn't like the question posed by her. I can't imagine someone white commenting that someone just didn't sound white enough.
This is a fine point of discernment, L to L, and has nothing to do with conformity, there is a subtle difference between arguments put forth by whites who pretend that take on a black persona for whatever reason and those of a generally conservative point of view put forth by a black poster. Even as black men, neither Junko and I can really define it, and we may be wrong, but it is intuition based on experience.
Why would anyone give a 'publication' like the 'The Stormer' any credibility, its articles included, being pure racist rot? Yet, everbody always say that black folks are overreacting on what is to be expected with current regime coming into power.....Intuition, based on experience, of everyone towing the same line? Either way. I've never said blacks were over reacting except when my waitress said if he was elected blacks would go back to slavery. I think you can agree that was over the top. I've said liberals are over reacting.
True, but I say that conservatives overreact as well. Where do you get this idea that WE ALL are towing the same line. That sounds extremist and alarmist for me.
LOL. You complain that someone doesn't sound black enough, I raise an eyebrow, and out of that you get I'm the one expecting you all to tow the same line?
Unbelievable.You're still not getting it, the question is are you misrepresenting one self as black when you actually are not?
First, let me say that I always thought you were a guy. Not sure why. So, I can see where you might find it OK to question another woman as to her race. You might feel that you are in a better position to have an intuition concerning it. I always thought GM was probably raised in a somewhat affluent household and had never encountered any misfortune or disappointment that could be attributed to racism; so probably didn't have the base needed in order to empathize with someone of color who had.
But, my point was that even if you are two black women to think that one's ideas imply that one wasn't black is very odd to me. I think of all of the diverse ideas we are presented every day here on Hub Pages and I don't think there is any other race of people here who insist that there are certain ways those in that race must think.
I simply wonder why one black person thinks if other black people don't present themselves in a certain way they might possibly not be black. As if being black implies that one must be forced into a box containing a certain set of ideas. I remember years ago when someone asked Will Smith if he'd like to be a black man winning some award. He laughed and said something to the effect of he'd just like to be a guy who won that award. Sometimes I think those who complain the most about the fact that society isn't color blind are the ones most unwilling to help achieve it.
L to L - you definitely have a point. Culturally, blacks are harshest on themselves. In college I had a black roommate who was extremely gregarious. As a result, most of her friends were Mexican. No Mexicans protested that, but she got plenty of flack from blacks, including false rumors that she was gay (she had plenty of boyfriends, including black ones).
Crrdence2 - the article is about the writer's experience. This is strictly subjective, not factual. Everyone has the right to speak their experiences. If it doesn't describe you, don't take it personally. If it does, do something about it.I hear you, Yes. But you are never going to get an objective nor favorable view of Blacks from this publication, as it is generally biased. If I took articles from 'The Panther', published by the Black Panther Party, and it had article after article of negativity regarding white people, how much credibility would you give it, and any of its contents?
The article, which describes what it's like to teach at a black high school, is not really suitable for standard publications. It contains a lot of politically incorrect facts, such as black parents using the school for a free babysitting service and the school passing students who don't do the work because the system would be too overwhelmed if they failed everyone who deserved it. One of this teacher's students was a 19 year old junior who only came to school to deal drugs, have sex with girls, and get free meals.
The teacher states many if his colleagues became racist because of this. Ultimately, it is up to the blacks to solve this problem.Yes, in Ghotto like environments people tend to behave in the same way. But, it also up to whites to seriously seek unbiased accounts before making blanket judgements. I am not saying that some of the abuses are not going on, but are there mitigating factors? You are never going to get them from The Stormer.
This all cumulates to the fact as why we don't get along as well as we could.Lower income & underclass Blacks are different entities entirely. They just don't care. There are marked & significant dysfunctions & pathologies in the lower income Black community. There seems to be passive apathy. They are merely acting upon instinct. It is almost dystopic.
It is also generational. Parents act w/o thinking or concern & such attitudes are passed to succedent generations. In the future, lower income & underclass Blacks & non-Blacks for that matter will be locked out of society as it become more advanced & computerized. The future American society will belong to the educated & affluent.I recognize this automation and competively lower priced labor are going to make workers on the lower rung of the employment ladder obsolete. Maybe the white folks, instead of directing their anger regarding their falling standard of living toward affirmative action and immigrants, should ask the corporate structure about robots and 2-3 dollar an hour labor they routinely negotiate for and outsource in underdeveloped and developing societies abroad.
I have often said I grew up in the ghetto, but I realize that is not entirely true. I attended a middle school that was located in one of the nicer sections of Oakland. The classes were quiet, and there were multiple good educational opportunities. In fact, one if my brother's classmates was Daryl Strawberry.
This school, where the population was probably 20% black, is where I suffered a black eye, one of my friends was raped by a couple of 9th graders, and a Chinese boy lost control from too much torment and killed a black girl as a result. This was minor in comparison to another middle school (also in a nice area - ironically named King Junior High) which was notorious for students beating up teachers. Also one of my brother's friends had formerly attended a ghetto school; his face was covered with scars from all the fights he was involved in.
The common sentiment - among blacks as well as whites - is that blacks are fine as long as you only have a few of them, but too many, and you have a ghetto. There are exceptions, but VERY few.There are Blacks who are quite negative. They have the entitlement mentality. I have observed this first hand from poorer Black schoolmates, associates, & family members. They want others to rescue them. They also have a negative attitude towards achievement, success, & education. I STRONGLY believe that for the most part, Blacks hold themselves back from opportunities by their negative passivism in terms of education, success, & doing for self.
Many Blacks, especially in the lower socioeconomic echelons believe that society or THE MAN owes them. They feel & act if they are victims. They also play the blame game when the blame is actually themselves. I have seen lower income Black children debate as to whether they want to attend school that day or not. Many Blacks aren't serious about education & the opportunities it brings. They would rather want to have a good time as studying is too time involving.
It also goes to the point that many Blacks gravitate towards civil service careers because they know that they will be in such jobs until retirement & that they don't have to work that hard to retain such jobs. Many Black parents inculcate their children to be workers instead of bosses & entrepreneurs. This is the Black American mentality. On the other hand, Black Caribbeans & Black Africans imbue their children that education is very important. Not only that, they inculcate their children to attain careers, even entrepreneurship, never settling for that mere job. Black Americans have to wake up before it is too late.
Many Black Americans are in the same place as their ancestors. There hasn't been any marked socioeconomic improvement in many Black American generations. When Black Americans begin to have a more welcoming, positive attitude towards education & achievement, they will go forward. I think I should write a hub on this. I have pontificated enough.Grace you said.....
'It also goes to the point that many Blacks gravitate towards civil service careers because they know that they will be in such jobs until retirement & that they don't have to work that hard to retain such jobs. Many Black parents inculcate their children to be workers instead of bosses & entrepreneurs. This is the Black American mentality. On the other hand, Black Caribbeans & Black Africans imbue their children that education is very important. Not only that, they inculcate their children to attain careers, even entrepreneurship, never settling for that mere job. Black Americans have to wake up before it is to late'
Looking at your bio, you said that you worked for the State of New York for a career. Is that not public sector, similar to the federal civil service?
So, you are saying that YOU gravitated toward your civil service type job because of security and the fact that you would not have to work hard? You say this true of many Blacks, yet your situation is the exception?
I thought that we were contemporaries and as a AFRICAN American women you would know why these jobs are attractive, but if it seems that you have forgotten let me remind you and the forum audience.
We all know that our time is finite and valuable, and for me that means not wasting it.
1. The federal Government has been an equal opportunity employer. I knew that if I applied for a position I would have a better chance of being considered on an equal basis with consideration given to my education and experience, than I would have had in the private sector, particularly during the 1970s and 80s. Black people know that. Whites call that preferential treatment, I call it equal treatment, finally.
2. I had employment advantage as a veteran. I would be a fool to not avail myself of the opportunities relative to a job market where race prejudice still had far too much sway for me to want to be bothered with the private sector.
3. I was given training in my profession with promotion and advancement on an equal footing with anyone else based on my job performance. This was more than something I could only hope for, but was enforced by law and I had recourse in that system if I suspected that My advancement was hindered by anything other than my level of training or job performance.
I liked that, it was a solid guarantee that my career was not subject to the caprice of any one person, who harbored race prejudice, or simply did not like the ties I wore.
4. The leave, annual and sick, pension plans were tough to beat. I was thinking about the enevitability of retirement as early as my late 20s. I was not going to find myself without money after a lifetime of work.
As a Black woman, I wouldn't have to tell you these things. I take offense at the idea that somehow I was trying to avoid meaningful work.
You speak about writing a new hub on the subject, I invite you to read mine "Message to and from Black AMERICA. While we could do better, we have only 10 percent of the net worth of the average white. And much of that has to do with history as wealth has to be accumulated and it was hard to do that in JimCrow AMERICA, the world as recently experienced by my grandfather. It takes money to make money. Without generations of successful people earning good incomes over a considerable period of time, where do you get the money to start a business?
5. You are right about one thing though, we are going to have to do better and in this day and age it is possible. As more time passes since the doors to equality were finally opened, we should be all the more better prepared to get into the mainstream. Your point about the primary importance of education is well taken, as I foresee green ultimately overtaking the significance of either black, white, brown, what have you....GMWilliams - what percentage of blacks would you say are negative / ghetto-like?
By your lead Credence, Let me also invite "SayYes To Life" and Grace to read and if they are as engaging in dialog of others as you and I, maybe they will dare to leave a comment. My last hub at the top of my chart in my profile is "Why Negro Lives Should Matter in The USA " Since you both claim Caribbean Roots I am not sure the information as I viewed it about Slaves in the Caribbean is true to the way you both heard from Family. Help A Brother out, talk to me at my place, come on down here.
Hey, Junko, I need your help will you explain to L and L what it means to us when a poster takes on a black persona is and is not actually black? I don't seem to be getting through.
btW, my spouse has Carribean roots, the State of California was my exotic launch point. So, I am as AMERICAN as apple pie.
I will check into your hub, thanks...Anything you guys say won't matter because my point still stands. Blacks are no different from any other people. Except it appears some have certain expectations which, when not met, culminate in the assumption that the other person just can't be black. It's kind of weird. I'd hate to be black and defend my 'blackness', just because I thought outside of some box.
To me I feel like I am dealing with a coward or a foolish person
I assume that was directed at me. Insults degrade the person making them.
No insult intended, if the cap don't fit don't wear it. You insult without shame millions of descendants of American Slaves (Negroes) and Black Americans but if I am ask to express my feeling about white pretending to be black to insult all Blacks, you are hurt? That is how I feel. You may feel different about a Black doing such a thing.
Point out where I have insulted millions. If not, stop making up falsehoods about me.
Interesting, the company you keep. I'm learning a lot here. Just how low a group of people go to maintain solidarity. I actually held you in higher regard.
I didn't mean to throw dirt. I simply find myself disappointed even though I find my point proven.
I didn't mean you, I meant Junko. He attacked me also.
Oh. Quite right. An insult is usually an admission you don't have a valid argument.
Not in the least. And your third comment to me on this thread reinforces that opinion.
Live, I agree with Credence 100% I think you have seen that Credence and I take different positions on some issues. I consider myself a conservative because of my views. Conservative views should not be denigrating to our people. I like to admit that some could do better and I often suggest things that could help.
When a Black person starts a discussion to criticize Black people with NO solutioins, you are not talking to a Black person. I saw this question and felt the need to comment. I see Say Yes is on here talking the same stuff.
I have been around Klansmen. I was exposed to racism in the 50s and 60s so YES I can say I have the testimony. It doesn't make me bitter. It makes me better.
There are some people on here who, if are not passing for Black, are some sick people.
Peace out!I would laugh, if it wasn't all so very sad and if the trend continues here; typical. If you don't like what they have to say, if you don't agree with it, if there is no solution to the question.....well then they aren't black. Just couldn't be. Won't accept it.
The color of GM's skin ceased to be of relevance the moment Credence said she wasn't black. What became the topic is the need for some in the black community to insist any thought patterns which they find alien are to be removed, silenced and/or negated by ensuring that a cry goes up that the perpetrator isn't black.
As a Christian, I would think you could have figured out how foolish that argument was before you joined it.
Your saying GM isn't black doesn't make it so. It makes you a bully attempting to push those who disagree with you either in line, or out. Junko getting mad and therefor insisting I've insulted millions of blacks doesn't make it so. It just makes his comments ignorant and childish.True, Diane, there is a difference between engaging in serious dialogue seeking to increase understanding as opposed to those who are obsessed with just black bashing. As it is said in scripture, one must separate the wheat from the chaff.
You think that you are learning a lot, L and L, but it is hardly enough. It is the height of arrogance to assume that just because something is outside of your experience, that it does not exist. That is like me saying that monthly periods are figments of a woman's imagination just because I don't experience it. So, it ain't 'The World According to L to L'. We were sharing with you the little things that WE usually always recognize but generally keep to ourselves. So, whether you recognize it or not, you still have a lot to learn.
Diane and Junko have tried to explain the nature of this complaint, are we all addled and you solely are the exclusive source of level headedness?
Diane and I confer and she is much more politically conservative then I. But she is not misrepresenting herself. So, this idea of a black speak is just another fanciful red herring to explain why we are not on board with Rush Limbaugh?If GM says she's black and you say she isn't I tend to think the individual knows what they are. If she is proven to be black, what does that say of this ridiculous attack?
Either way. You replied to a comment about a hateful individual attacking me for having an opinion. If that is acceptable to you, my comment stands.You have an opinion, but others have opinions as well. This is not about Grace anymore. I told Her that I suspected that she was misrepresenting herself. I did not say that I knew for certain, as I cannot know. I also told her, that if I was in fact in error, I apologize. But I am honest with my outlook and point of view. Grace and I have have conferred often and because we have, I felt that I could share this concern with her.
Misreprentation is not an unheard of concept in the internet universe. You considered this person's comments hateful, while I consider yours in regards to this topic conversation flippant and casually dismissive.I am Black. Because I am Black, I am free to critique the Black condition in the United States. I know the Black condition although I am a middle class(now middling class), educated Black woman. There is a firsthand observation on the Black experience based upon my Blackness. What other race can dissect the condition & psychology of Blacks than another Black person. Continue w/the discussion. Yes, I am as Black as they get. I should begin another thread based upon this discussion!
P.S. I JUST DID!The only way I would be flippant and casually dismissive is if I believed a black was not human, in the way others are. If I thought blacks were not capable of thinking for themselves. Stand on their own as the island good and honest people do. And forming a unique and valid opinion.
If I believed black people needed to be handed their opinions and should accept them, without thought, and stand firmly as one behind that one opinion then, of course my attitude would be flippant and casually dismissive. As I would be with any indoctrinated child attempting to participate in an adult discussion.
Just a few months ago after I made a comment in a forum post that I was a professional musician, you informed us all that being a professional musician wasn't a job but just a "hobby". But if this is a hobby I don't think I could handle a "real job" since a 40 hour week is like a long weekend to me. It is very rare that I can actually sleep for 8 hours. I am working right now. I make these posts when I am taking a break. Presently, I have been awake for over 24 hours. But according to you I have simply imagined the whole thing.
Now you are throwing stones at Creedence for the lesser of two evils. How so? Here so: You claimed that being a professional musician was not a job. However, I have credibility all over the internet. I have songs I have written and recorded posted on YouTube, SoundCloud, Twitter, and here on Hubpages. Anyone who looked just a little would understand that someone who spends so much time making music videos and writing music just might also be a professional musician. And of course I can prove it because I can write a song for you today and post it to my Soundcloud account tomorrow. However, I can't prove my race to you in such a manner. We can post any image that we choose and say "That's me!" And therein lies the difference.
I have had my doubts about the race of several individuals on Hubpages because when their rhetoric doesn't match their image then it does make one pause to consider. In other words, because of the problem of verification, he is more justified than you were. You didn't even ask me to verify anything, as you were apparently more interested in vilifying a legend, and painting me down as a weekend warrior.Well, well. You claim to be a musician. I didn't question that. I simply define the word job differently than you. Credence is welcome to question anyone's race. It's the reason why he/she questioned it. Because a black person had a different opinion? I'm afraid that sounds like a type of slavery to me. Agree, or deny your ethnicity. Of all the races in America today it is sad that it is the black race allowing this attempt at censorship of freedom of thought.
That's alright. I am very used to this from childhood. Called a white girl by classmates because I loved classical music & was a teacher's pet. In college, I stated that if Blacks wanted to succeed, they had to stop the blame & victim game & help themselves. After class, another Black student indicated that she should have slapped my face for stating this. I believe that most of the problems Blacks have, they brought it among themselves. There is such much pathology in many Black communities. I am going to think outside the proverbial societal box here.
Now, you got me started. NOW LET'S START:
(1) There is a high anti-intellectualism in many Black communities. Many intellectual Blacks are derided because they aren't social. I was one of those. People have told me to hang out, be more social. Two of my maternal aunts derided me because I loved to read. Many times in all Black environments, being smart & intelligent isn't viewed positively. Many of the most popular children in black school environments WEREN'T the smart ones. As an introverted Black, I experienced this firsthand.
(2) The devaluing of education in many Black communities. To be educated is analogous to being a nerd. The main thing is to be street & cool which is sad. Also, many Blacks gravitate towards the easier subjects instead of math, science, technology, medicine, & engineering. To some Blacks, concentrating on education will take away from their social life & partying.
(3) The poverty/struggle consciousness & mentality. It seems that many Blacks wear poverty & struggle as a badge of honor. Somehow, socioeconomic affluence is a foreign language to them. Affluent & middle class Blacks are called bougie. Many Blacks contend that affluent & middle class Blacks aren't authentic Blacks. To such Blacks, being Black means socioeconomic poverty & struggle. There is a strong jealousy, even hatred of affluent & middle class Blacks by poor Blacks. Many Blacks don't want to improve themselves because such would mean sacrifice-curtailing leisure & social time. They are loath to work smart & plan for their success yet complain about being poor & hate Blacks who are more successful.
(4) Having children before they are emotionally, psychologically, & socioeconomically ready. Many Blacks have children before they are emotionally, psychologically, & socioeconomically ready yet wonder why they are in dire straits. Many act w/o thinking of future ramifications for their acts. If Blacks want to create socioeconomic advancement for themselves & for their children, act strategically, not on impulse!
(5) Having more children than they can afford. Many Blacks have larger families & wonder why things are a constant struggle. More children means money is stretched to the limit w/o little monies for necessities, let alone anything else. Also large families are synonymous w/being poor & impoverished. Why have more children than one can afford, reducing the family to poverty, struggle, & diminished opportunities. Use family planning & have small families for the betterment of oneself & one's children.Wow, I'm going to take a hopefully not-too-unsettling take on your perspective: Blacks DID 'bring it on themselves'; and they DO need to 'stop the blame & victim game & help themselves'. However, (knowing that I'm going to get a lecture from Wrenchbiscuit); the reasons why any race has a hard time pulling themselves out of an oppressive situation is because they seldom have the understanding and/or compassion needed by others for them to DESIRE to join the rest of the world. You have to be motivated to WANT to be a part of it. It sounds like you had more motivation than most others do...
Its just easier to remain a close-knit, exclusive community to keep obvious racial distortions from slipping in. For instance, the little girl that I was talking about above would not have had to deal with being called a 'n*gger' if she had been in the safety of her community. Is that not why black Americans & indigineous Indian peoples keep themselves to themselves for the most part?
Sure they rub shoulders with white Americans; and we even work together and have BFF's of every color, sometimes - but, those are 'special' friendships, right? They're not 'normal'; and if you're 'the white one' - your white friends & family view you as being 'progressive' for having friends (an Indian and a Mexican, in this case) of a different color; and praise you for having such a lovely, open mind - when it should be NORMAL!
Racism still exists in ways that probably seem more subtle (at least to whites - we think we're 'acting equal', we want to, and most DO try) than living during history's segregation era. But quite honestly, with what I see around me from white people - I think if I was black or indian, I would probably still be at least a little resentful and not be all that thrilled about participating with white society, either. (Hell, I'm white and not all that thrilled about participating in it at the moment, LoL!)
I read an article a few years back, about the incredible differences between American Blacks & African Blacks: they are relatives and yet do not even sort of see themselves the same way. A black person from Africa actually acts way more 'white' or 'normal' to white Americans - simply because they don't have the same kind of hangups about their individuality or their place in the world. They KNOW they 'belong', and the color of their skin makes no difference.
The day black people & indians, etc. can see themselves through their own eyes again - instead of practically being forced to look at themselves through the filter of white people, is when things will start to change 'racially' across the board. They can't wait for white people to change - cuz frankly, they've tried and they don't know how to change without making things worse; plus, if Trump's supporters are any indicator: there are still many white people who don't want things to change.
So yeah, blacks & indians may need to work for whatever more; but the headbeating judgments don't help. When do they ever? Just do your own thing to inspire as many 'up' with you as you can - but, this world is a learning playground for us all; and we're all responsible for carving out our own life path. Not being motivated to embrace an education that leads to high-paying job is not a bad thing, its just where people are and life goes on and on. Judgments are one of the things that harms people the most and keeps them from reaching for their dreams - or even having them.Exactly, I have encountered many Caribbean Blacks & African Blacks. They are very achievement oriented, believe in education & sacrifice to attain their goals. For example, my father is a Black Caribbean from the U.S. Virgin Islands & very poor; however, he refused to use his race & socioeconomic class as an excuse. His family were poor but they achieved. They acquired good jobs, mostly in the civil service. All are independent & didn't believe in handouts. Their children are highly successful professionals & entrepreneurs.
By contrast, my mother's family. My mother is a Black Southerner & also from a very poor family. Out of ten children, only 3 elected to become successful. The rest decided to be socioeconomically parasitic. In other words, they coasted along on the coattails of the more successful siblings & relatives. My father even suggested to one of my aunts to take a civil service job; however, she refused to heed the advice. She elected to be a maid at a subpar salary but elected to continuous complain & lived off other relatives. My middle aunt had several promotional opportunities at department stores (managerial & executive positions) but she elected to be a clerk. (See where I am going here). My second youngest aunt elected to have menial jobs as did my four uncles. My mother, my youngest aunt, & middle uncle were the most successful out of ten siblings. All had opportunities. My mother MADE hers. However, the less successful siblings, like many Black Americans, believe that things are OWED them. This generational OWE ME pathology continues to yet another generation, only a few in the succedent generation are successful (including myself). They are lazy, want good times, & refuse to sacrifice to be successful.
By my analysis, Black Americans are happy in their lot. They simply don't have the ambition that Caribbean & African Blacks have. Many Black Americans that I worked with have taken me for a Caribbean. It seems to me that many Black Americans are quite satisfied being in the subordinate & struggling role. If they weren't, they would be more socioeconomically advanced than they already are. They even acknowledge themselves that they aren't about to sacrifice to be more affluent. They have the good time, live for today mentality.
There you go again, your limited perspective on a topic does not constitute a universal truth. WB definition of a 'job' is no less valid than yours. For him to be good and successful at his chosen profession, he doesn't just play the piano after Chritmas dinner.
People like him and, you too, 'work' much harder than those that merely go to a place of employment, do 9-5 and go home. I bet for every 8 hours your employees work, you work 12. Entrepreneurial people always work harder, having to be clever and resourceful, reinventing themselves everyday to continue to attract a paying audience or customers. And that, L to L,is work and a job. Just because I did not see you running around frantically within your establishment serving customers, can I assume that you did not 'work'?
So, why do I question it? Black bashing is easier to disguise as constructive criticism from one that is a member of the target group. No more than I like the idea of adults misrepresenting themselves as children in an adolescent forum. Of course, here there is nothing unlawful. But it is dishonest and discourteous. I have seen this in other forum venues, so that when these imposters say that THOSE black people are thugs, it is not an attack. But, it always they and them and never us and we. That has nothing to do with slavery. I don't trust conservatives and their ideology and you can rest assured it has come from years of education and experience. I and most of the rest of us do our own thinking, thank you.
Diane has a different opinion, I respect it and we do fine, misrepresentation is another matter. It speaks to people who refer as reference in a civil conversation to clearly racists publications to support a point, but want to be seen as engaging in impartial dialogue. People wear many masks to conceal their true intent.I do get what you're saying but that doesn't negate the possibility that GM is black. I can certainly see where a black person raised by color blind parents who had fully immersed themselves in the American dream, who has been given an upbringing in a diverse community where she was not treated differently by whites within her community, having also been exposed to the things she says she has been by other blacks could come to the conclusions she shares.
I also find many of her opinions harsh and unforgiving but I don't necessarily see that as an indication she isn't black. Just that she could benefit from a day of walking in another person's shoes. But, those who wallow in self pity instead of pulling themselves up by their bootstraps could certainly benefit from taking one of her kicks in the butt to heart."I do get what you're saying but that doesn't negate the possibility that GM is black."
You're right, it doesn't.
"I can certainly see where a black person raised by color blind parents who had fully immersed themselves in the American dream, who has been given an upbringing in a diverse community where she was not treated differently by whites within her community, having also been exposed to the things she says she has been by other blacks could come to the conclusions she shares."
That is true also, as much of what she says has happened to me. It is not so much what she says, but the manner that she says it. It is just intuition and I am the first to acknowledge that it may well be incorrect. I certainly do not preclude that outcome.My father & mother raised me w/no excuses & to aim high. The word impossibility was foreign in my immediate family. As an only child, I was expected to achieve & to attain at least a college education. My father was strict regarding social life. He felt that social life was a waste of time & only education mattered. Failure wasn't an option, if I failed, I heard about it for days. My father didn't believe in handouts. He believed that people who wanted handouts were parasites. He was of the school that one should help oneself. He also believed in small families.
Regardless of your true identity, all you are doing is promoting racial stereotypes. And that is easy for many Americans to do because they are too lazy to read and explore any given issue. It is simply too much work. And although you have maintained that you have always aimed high, it appears you have reached an all time low with this, your latest offering to the forums.
In light of the historical record your grand proclamations, and condemnation of your own race is nothing less than an outrage. I don't expect that you will read any of what follows, or follow the link provided, but I would be remiss not to challenge the distortions, and the outright fiction presented here. The following excerpt is from an article that details how white Americans have always been the biggest recipients of welfare and government hand outs in the United States. It clearly identifies white privilege and leaves no stone unturned. Let all racists beware: We have come to tear your playhouse down!
excerpt from: A Long History of Affirmative Action - For Whites
http://newsreel.org/guides/race/whiteadv.htm
"... Less known are more recent government racial preferences, first enacted during the New Deal, that directed wealth to white families and continue to shape life opportunities and chances.
The landmark Social Security Act of 1935 provided a safety net for millions of workers, guaranteeing them an income after retirement. But the act specifically excluded two occupations: agricultural workers and domestic servants, who were predominately African American, Mexican, and Asian. As low-income workers, they also had the least opportunity to save for their retirement. They couldn't pass wealth on to their children. Just the opposite. Their children had to support them.
Like Social Security, the 1935 Wagner Act helped establish an important new right for white people. By granting unions the power of collective bargaining, it helped millions of white workers gain entry into the middle class over the next 30 years. But the Wagner Act permitted unions to exclude non-whites and deny them access to better paid jobs and union protections and benefits such as health care, job security, and pensions. Many craft unions remained nearly all-white well into the 1970s. In 1972, for example, every single one of the 3,000 members of Los Angeles Steam Fitters Local #250 was still white.
But it was another racialized New Deal program, the Federal Housing Administration, that helped generate much of the wealth that so many white families enjoy today. These revolutionary programs made it possible for millions of average white Americans - but not others - to own a home for the first time. The government set up a national neighborhood appraisal system, explicitly tying mortgage eligibility to race. Integrated communities were ipso facto deemed a financial risk and made ineligible for home loans, a policy known today as "redlining." Between 1934 and 1962, the federal government backed $120 billion of home loans. More than 98% went to whites. Of the 350,000 new homes built with federal support in northern California between 1946 and 1960, fewer than 100 went to African Americans.
These government programs made possible the new segregated white suburbs that sprang up around the country after World War II. Government subsidies for municipal services helped develop and enhance these suburbs further, in turn fueling commercial investments. Freeways tied the new suburbs to central business districts, but they often cut through and destroyed the vitality of non-white neighborhoods in the central city.
Today, Black and Latino mortgage applicants are still 60% more likely than whites to be turned down for a loan, even after controlling for employment, financial, and neighborhood factors. According to the Census, whites are more likely to be segregated than any other group. As recently as 1993, 86% of suburban whites still lived in neighborhoods with a black population of less than 1%."I understand, your situation, fortunately for you is the exception for most families, black or white, rather than the rule. It is just that because of historical disadvantages and vestiges of racism that still exist in our society, we don't have the resources white folks have fall back on to afford to make such mistakes.
I have only seen such structure consistently within Japanese culture, having lived in Hawaii, where if you fall off the wagon, your family may just disown you. I have never seen any of their kids in trouble. I have actually read stories in Silicon Valley newspapers where white parents were saying that schools with a overwhelming number of ASIAN students needlessly downplay the importance of extracurricular activities and sports. While the white parents wanted a proper balance, ASIAN parents and students had their eyes on the prize, exclusive focus on academic excellence. So, the Asian have the same complaint toward whites as Whites have toward Blacks regarding public schools.
While I have seen the difference in the attitudes between Black AMERICANs and those here from Africa in regards to focus and determination to succeed, living FLORIDA, I have not been impressed by those that have come from the Carribean.
My point is that not ALL these economic disparities are due solely to Black shortcomings. Other People want to hear Black people say that it all their fault to relieve them of their obligations to continue to make racism less of a concern within our general society. Black bashers attack Black people without giving consideration to contributing factors for the problems that are outside their control. The problem is more complex than simply saying that all Black people are content to be slaves. I hear that kind of rationale from Sean Hannity or Rush Limbaugh
Apparently, y'all thinks gmwilliams is too intelligent to be knee-grow...
Junko - I read your hub. You no doubt are aware high crime areas tend to have lax laws and corruption. Since inner city black communities tend to have high crime, it is safe to say laws there tend to be lax, and there is corruption - right?
Regarding Black Lives Matter, check out this article about Baltimore after the riots:
http://www.npr.org/2015/06/04/411917414 … -baltimore
Let me add that Freddie Gray himself was a criminal. No doubt most of the crimes he committed was against other blacks.
I fully agree black lives matter. Let's prove it by being responsible, practicing decent morals, and not producing thugs like Freddie Gray - or Rodney King (who won a $3.7 million lawsuit against LA county - and BLEW IT!!!).I doubt you read or have the education to comprehend that hub. Your response is proof positive that you have no personal opinions and you are just a mud slinger with no knowledge of self much less anybody else. In the early 20th Century Millions of European immigrants left Europe for White Privilege in The New World. Soon White Immigrants out numbered the entire population Whites and people of color that was in America during and before the Civil War. The cities of America was full of White crime and corruption, poverty and violence. You ever heard about The Gangs of New York or Chicago. The drive by White on White killings with Machine Guns all over America ? All people people of all races act the same when there is no hope in a Land of Plenty. It has nothing to do with color. If you read what i ask you to read , Why should Negro live matter? I didn't write that Black Lives matter, reread and make an intelligent comment, no parroting. What about your take on Caribbean Slaves? C'mon Man.
Have you ever been a slave? Have you even MET one? Have you ever dealt with a Klansman? What is the number one killer of black men today?
Tell you what - after you get mugged by black thugs a few times, come back to me and show me how your defense of them still stands. As for passing judgement on my intelligence and education - the fact that you're doing this while knowing nothing about my background says far worse about you than me.Have your family ever owned slaves? Have anybody in your family ever met an African Slave or or your family part of the Great Migration of those seeking White Privilege? My intelligence and education make me not want to stunt your growth. If doing this while not knowing about you is like doing what you are doing to the Black race knowing nothing about them, I want no part of it. So I am going to leave you young folk alone. I'll stand down.
No, my family has never owned slaves or met any. The Great Migration happened before I was born, but I have some experience with it; I was born and raised in one of its destination cities, Oakland. You know what Oakland is famous for, right? I have experienced enough of that to make me want to tear out of there soon as I was old enough. Diane knows some of my story. She seemed sympathetic; I'm not sure how much.
I admit, I have never met a Klansman, so it's not my place to judge there. I do find it significant there has never been a Klan chapter in Oakland. That's because they don't need one!What you told us about a FEW Black people doing things to you sounds horrible. I can't help but wonder if you told us that to engender sympathy for your cause. You don't just talk about what they did to you, you indict the Black race for what some have done to you.
I'm proud to say I don't carry that baggage. It is the season to think about peace, joy, love and forever.
I can't hate and, thank God, I don't have to participate in this farce.
Write you later Credence!
Diane - I was simply stating a fact. I didn't tell you my story to make you pity me. Besides, you can be sure there are plenty of stories like mine, many even worse.
A common sentiment is that blacks who act ghetto are "uneducated". Stormfront's backlash to this bulls**t is that blacks must have an average IQ of 85. Let's face it; the real issue is not education, but morality. You don't need a PhD to know how to treat people nicely, and not attack them. Get married before you have kids, have them by choice rather than chance, do right by your spouse, and take an active role in raising your kids. Even toddlers, who can't yet recite their ABCs, can be taught to share their toys and not say mean things or hit others.
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Type your title
@Credence
Considering the value of the dollar, my two cents is worthless .002 percent, but here goes anyway.
You say "Many Black parents inculcate their children to be workers instead of bosses & entrepreneurs. This is the Black American mentality." Is not entirely accurate, the fact is that it is the schools that teach our children in the way laborers, not managers or executives. It's called "The Hidden Curriculum." There is a vast amount of studies done on this issue. Learning to learn or learning to labor is the question we must ask ourselves.
Think about all the things we learn through the rules and structure of schools that is valued by American culture. For example, consider how difficult it would be to maintain an efficient society if some schools taught students to be punctual and others didn’t. At some point when these students got together, whether at a college or in the workplace, these different socialization experiences would lead to inevitable conflicts. In 1968 sociologist Phillip Jackson described this nonacademic and less overt [phonomenone] socialization functions of schooling. According to Roland Meighan (1981), "The hidden curriculum." is taught by schools, not by any teacher ... [S]omething is coming across to the pupils which may never be spoken in the English lessor or prayed about in an assembly. They are picking up and approach to living and an attitude to learning.
@Credence
Considering the value of the dollar, my two cents is worthless .002 percent, but here goes anyway.
You say "Many Black parents inculcate their children to be workers instead of bosses & entrepreneurs. This is the Black American mentality." Is not entirely accurate, the fact is that it is the schools that teach our children in the way laborers, not managers or executives. It's called "The Hidden Curriculum." There is a vast amount of studies done on this issue. Learning to learn or learning to labor is the question we must ask ourselves.
Think about all the things we learn through the rules and structure of schools that is valued by American culture. For example, consider how difficult it would be to maintain an efficient society if some schools taught students to be punctual and others didn’t. At some point when these students got together, whether at a college or in the workplace, these different socialization experiences would lead to inevitable conflicts. In 1968 sociologist Phillip Jackson described this nonacademic and less overt [phonomenone] socialization functions of schooling. According to Roland Meighan (1981), "The hidden curriculum." is taught by schools, not by any teacher ... [S]omething is coming across to the pupils which may never be spoken in the English lessor or prayed about in an assembly. They are picking up and approach to living and an attitude to learning.
And, whether you believe, accept or not, the hidden curriculum is aimed at minority children.Too many parents fail to teach their children to be either good workers or managers. The responsiblity starts with the parents to train children with the goal toward excellence. That proper attitude would be passed on to school boards, demanding that through their presence and involvement, the education of their children is first and formost. We have to expect more of each other within the community. It it like a snowball that starts small and gains in mass and acceleration to where it cannot be stopped. Such is the nature of how we address Black people and their problem. The establishment abuses us because we are complicit and/or apathetic to their designs.
@Credence
The "Hidden Curriculum" is not the responsibility of any school board; it is an institutionalized educational system policy of the U.S. Department of education. The only way around it is Montessori schooling, Islamic or 'home-schooling' all of which places an emphasis on independence, freedom within limits, and respect for a child’s natural psychological, physical, and social development.
Sure, parents have an extensive charge of rearing the child when at home, but cannot control governmental policies at the School Board level.
I am very much interested in reading your hub. One thing I need to note: if Africans and Caribbeans are so superior, why are their countries in such a state? I ask partly because of what people say on Stormfront, and partly because my ancestry is Caribbean. My family is just as immoral as American blacks; they just hide it behind culture, good manners, and a charming accent.
There is also a common sentiment among educated people of color. If the racists are tired of hearing us :"whine", which is code for "telling the truth", then why don't they go back to Europa? I would even be willing to pitch in and help buy a ticket or two.
Unless those who expect others to leave would be willing to reimburse for all of the infrastructure, all technological developments over all of the time this country has been a free nation, all of the monetary benefits all those who are whining have received and that of their ancestors, reimburse any money put out by the government for any property and reimburse the individuals who have invested in it, then it just sounds like a request for a hand out.
While I am not black, I grew up in interracial schools and have always had black friends up until I went to college (which should tell you something) not because I didn't want black friend, but because my intersection with black people just diminished greatly.
I certainly don't claim to have any special insight into black people other than knowing that trying to classify any large group of people is a mistake. Black people differ from other black people just as they differ from white people in their assessment of America.
That said, and contrary to what some have asserted, there still is no equality of opportunity and I'm sure that frustrates many black folks. However, I think other black folks are frustrated by some using that as a crutch. Still, most data collected on the subject suggests that black people don't get a fair shake in society and are discriminated against over and over in a wide variety of ways.
I am personally offended though, at how many whites feel the need to attack the Black Lives Matter movement because they think that it's meant to elevate black lives over others when it's merely meant to point out that society seems to accept and treat black lives as if they don't matter.To Blacks Out There- What is YOUR Assessment of America - HubPages Blog
America the materialistic; America the Ethnocentric; America the xenophobic; and America the perverted also describes the plight of our Country. There will not be a change in the American state of affairs any time soon, only the fall of what could have been a great empire that never attained the spirit of greatness, only greed.
What used to be a plight for a better life, the American dream, is now a quest for material gain, consumerism is the rule of the day. The state of inequality in America is staggering as elitist are the jet-setters, societal fashionable social elites who set the rules, composed of wealthy people who frequently travel by jetliner to parties and resorts. i.e., The days of pre-Constitution when wealthy British colonist believed that landowners were better rulers over uneducated, less well-off people. Hence, the time of President-Elect Donald Trump have been waiting in the wings of Congress since 1776; the ‘haves will have more, the have-nots will have less and women will be forced to take their proper place behind men.’ All while we convert to a police state to enforce social controls of social norms set by White America who put material above environment.
America believes that Europid ethnicity (White people) are better than all other people and may ultimately prove the downfall of America because they are not. That even though European Spaniards were the first to arrive in the Americas and despite the fact that Natives were here first, that prosperity was achieved on the sweaty backs of African slaves, Whites claim that their brutal force of conquest makes them masters over all other people in America, indeed the world. Even the most educated and informed, especially them, believe they are better than others and thus more deserving of protection and greater wealth. White people think that they are the ‘first’ among equals. Even the children are reared with attitudes of White Supremacy.
America reject and are afraid, with great, distain, of peoples who are not American. Or is fear of competition?
From the LGBT community to President-Elect Donald Trump, our sense of social relations seeking sexual satisfaction with the same and/or opposite sex to which even children are fair game. We are a drug and alcohol induced nation, distracted from intoxication to notice the world falling apart around us.
My American peers, people, old and young, nothing permanent or good can come from this!!!@Credence2
Your view appears to be that of the ‘functionalist’ approach, which is useful for gathering qualitative data. I am not a FUNCTIONALIST, rather I prefer the ‘applied’ crisis theory approach, Credence. One of the facts of this matter is, Black folks today act as the Native Americans did when Europeans first came to the Americas. “All smiles and friendly’ that is, until the children sitting at the dinner table ask where the food is; then Black folks take the route of the survivalist, sell-out and/or give in.
Furthermore, you are correct in your assertion that Asian cultures have a robust structured culture unaffected by American culture, at least where one or the other is concerned. Not Black folks, we have traded-in our culture and replaced it with American culture, hence, African American, of more than just birthright identity. We judge ourselves by White America, their material possessions, and their intellect. American jails and prisons are filled with average Black young men who are desiring finer things they see other own, hence dealers of illicit drugs and pilferage. Our young females blinded by vanity while all others seek to satisfy urges of sexual gratification. Like the song goes, “If there’s a hell below, we’ll gonna go,” Black folks too.
I myself, am not currently located in the United States, I am here in Jerusalem, Israel, I am able to stand back and see the picture from an entirely different angle while observing humanity from the place it all started. And matters are not so different here than they are there, except for geography. You are aware of part of the problem facing Black folks in America; it would serve your understanding well to look closer at the whole picture without your ‘sociological’ spectacles on, be careful not to trip.
White Supremacy is alive and well just is racism, and Black socioeconomic disparities are. Now, my point is, there can be no happy ending!!!Pleasure to make your acquaintance, Kenneth.
"Your view appears to be that of the ‘functionalist’ approach, which is useful for gathering qualitative data. I am not a FUNCTIONALIST, rather I prefer the ‘applied’ crisis theory approach, Credence. One of the facts of this matter is, Black folks today act as the Native Americans did when Europeans first came to the Americas. “All smiles and friendly’ that is, until the children sitting at the dinner table ask where the food is; then Black folks take the route of the survivalist, sell-out and/or give in."
In an attempt to take what you say and respond, I offer this. We want to avert the crisis situation. I have to work within the constructs of this system as I don't have the luxury of being a revolutionary. I have to feed my family and put a roof over their heads and and stay away from the all too present vices and its subsequent outcomes of incarceration. To operate in a perpetual crisis mode is not going to benefit any of us. I like to think that I have lived my life having neither sold out nor gave in. I don't have to do either to avoid a crisis lifestyle. But, I continue to agitate for the needed corrections within our society in every way practical.
"Furthermore, you are correct in your assertion that Asian cultures have a robust structured culture unaffected by American culture, at least where one or the other is concerned. Not Black folks, we have traded-in our culture and replaced it with American culture, hence, African American, of more than just birthright identity."
Malcolm X once said that almalgamation may well not be a worthy goal, as you are being 'brought in' with the privilege of now having the right to treat other people the way you have been treated. People castigate the Muslims as a racist organization, but back in the day, the weekly Publication 'Mohammed Speaks' called Black people to a better way. Economic self reliance, respect for your women and an obsession with being intact as a example for your children. You were to swear off all vices and defilement of the flesh, such discipline and self control gives you an advantage against those who are lacking, despite their advantage in numbers. That is why J. Edgar Hoover made the destruction of the group his priority, while he reluctantly tolerated the standard Civil Rights advocacy of that era.
"We judge ourselves by White America, their material possessions, and their intellect. American jails and prisons are filled with average Black young men who are desiring finer things they see other own, hence dealers of illicit drugs and pilferage. Our young females blinded by vanity while all others seek to satisfy urges of sexual gratification. Like the song goes, “If there’s a hell below, we’ll gonna go,” Black folks too."
There are two extremes; you could live without self discipline or self control or you could have the relative stoic lives lived by the Japanese, for example.
I loathe people without self control and self discipline and there is too much of that within the Black community here. On the the other hand, I don't think that one can fully enjoy his or her life living solely under the expectations of others. We are not machines, regimentation is not desirable as a life course. But, WE as a group could stand moving a bit more substantially in that direction, without completely submerging ones individually within the needs of the group.
"I myself, am not currently located in the United States, I am here in Jerusalem, Israel, I am able to stand back and see the picture from an entirely different angle while observing humanity from the place it all started. And matters are not so different here than they are there, except for geography. You are aware of part of the problem facing Black folks in America; it would serve your understanding well to look closer at the whole picture without your ‘sociological’ spectacles on, be careful not to trip. "
I would certainly like to learn more about how these kinds of issues play out in Israeli society? I haven't given up yet because over my lifetime there has been positive change, it just needs to keep moving in the right direction. White supremacy is still here, but it is not monolithic and can be broken or made ineffective at its soft underbelly or along pressure points. But, only focus and disciplined people are truly in a position to take advantage of this reality."White Supremacy is alive and well just is racism, and Black socioeconomic disparities are. Now, my point is, there can be no happy ending!!!"
I believe there can be a happy ending - but blacks need to seriously consider how they contribute to the problem. Out of wedlock births, trashing property, doing poorly in school, rampant crime, and just plain refusing to take responsibility for one's actions (blaming on racism instead) is not going to endear blacks to whites. Obviously, if whites had no conscience about hating blacks, they never would have ended slavery in the first place.@Say Yes To Life
You are looking at the symptoms and not the cause, Factor in U.S. leadership, corporate agendas of regimes worldwide and then speak of the result(s).
Of course, Black Folks are part of the problem, they must be part of it because we are in the mix of matter, willingly or unwillingly. One cannot enjoy wealth without fear of losing it, bake a cake without a pitch of salt; or live in a society without some 'have nots' or elderly.
Exactly what would you define as a happy ending or better life for African Americans, You May Ask Yourself?The problems I listed above, only African Americans can solve them. They can choose to do well in school, be conscientious about having children, stop committing crimes, and take care of their properties. Also, check out this article about the destruction of Detroit:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/on- … c7a919c51e
Ultimately, it was corruption of black politicians that did it in, rather than white flight. Think about it; does a place HAVE to be inferior just because most people who live there are black???
P.S. I graduated from a Christian high school that was 80% black. It SAVED MY LIFE!!!
@Credence
I understand perfectly, Credence if you can’t beat them, join them seems to be the essence of your response, and that’s fine.
Revolution is not a rebel (seeking to destroy a system), it is a method to bring about change ‘radically.’ Did you know that most of ‘all’ change was never meant to be? The Emancipation Proclamation was never meant to free African slaves it was a method to build fighting forces against the South. The needed fight from Black folks, so whoever enlisted and Black would be free; what came out of it is what is called ‘radical change’ only such may not be the case this time.
You say you want to work within the constructs of the system; well, the constructs are a system that recognizes Europid decedents first, over all others, especially within our judiciary, Congress and the social norms of America are designed by White folks for White folks. Our social controls are enforced by White folks to protect White folks from all other whose behavior deviants from those norms. Unfortunately, those ‘gatekeepers’ are also White Supremacists who firmly believe their way of life is the best way to live and that they are better humans than all others. White America will not give up their special privileges just because some, or even most, do not have. So, good luck with that work!
In fact, ‘functionalists’ believes that inequality is a good thing and keeps the system functioning; the crisis theorist attempts to demonstrate that it is inequality that can the system to break down altogether. And it is true. Indeed, brother Malcolm X, Dr. King and others of our Black so-called leaders had this optimistic view of life for Black folks in America, what was unseen, because of the time, was that the advantages for White America were already in place as if written in stone. They could not foresee that ‘charisma’ of politicians could take precedence over qualifications, or that there would be such a thing as poor White folks. Which is the case today?
And, to make sure no one gets in their way, ‘conceal and carry’ which is most difficult for Black folks to get. Are your children really safe in school? What if some (armed) White mom takes offense to your child making her child angry or cry?
I often ask myself if there is really anything that can’t be fixed, and even during this writing, I abstain from the painstaking truth. Finally, yes, my present location offers much in the way of understanding how matters are playing out there in the U.S. However, here is where the ‘sociological imagination’ is a must and must useful too as it is said the Middle East is the cradle of civilization, and metropolitan center of the world."I understand perfectly, Credence if you can’t beat them, join them seems to be the essence of your response, and that’s fine."
I know that you are not implying that 'radical' means war or bloodshed? Yes, the Emancipation Proclamation only freed slaves in the rebellous Southern States. But, what did we have before that? Nothing, just a future of chattel slavery in one region, and an existence that passed for relative freedom in the other. What was the impetus for ever changing that arrangement? The War against secession produced an opportunity that may not otherwise have come for decades after. Since, WE were not in control of the circumstances, WE took half a loaf as a step in the right direction. The goal of maintaining Union happened to include changes that were to our benefit. There was more to be done, but slavery had to be abolished, first. The change that came was radical, yes.
I have to work within the constructs of the system, what is the alternative? We have had court rulings during the last century breaking down the legal structure of Jim Crow and segregation as mandated by law. What did I have before that? We had racial bigotry that was legal, lynchings that were routine, allowing us no legal recourse. White Supremacy is powerful, but not absolute. Otherwise, we would still be picking cotton to the rhythm of 'old negro spirituals'. I don't care what the White Supremists believe as long as their ability to adversely affect my life is constrained to the power that I allow them to have only from my fear. They are nothing more than scarecrows in the cornfield. Imagine, if we removed our own self imposed shackles and manacles, how much we could accomplish? Up, Mighty Race!!! The Japanse and ASIAN community do better than Anglos economically if one looks at family incomes, education, etc. If they can beat the odds, minimizing the effects of White Supremacy, so can we. Future demographics points to more diversity within this society further taking the wind from the White Supremist construct. They will change in a evolutionary way without a shot fired or blood shed.
Racists and racism are generally stupid. Stupid people and things are naturally, always vulnerable. Just find the appropriate button or lever to get your way, in spite of it.
The reality is that the White Supremist thing is promoted by nuts who know that to get what they want the society has to literally turned upside down. The Green Supremacists those with the money are not going to let 'fools' rock the apple cart. The reality is that all the 'have nots' are in the same boat and the distinctions some whites have that they really are better, is just an illusion, Albeit, a powerful one. I never say that inequality is a good thing. Yes, inequality can break the entire system down, but who has the tools to start breaking it down?
"And, to make sure no one gets in their way, ‘conceal and carry’ which is most difficult for Black folks to get. Are your children really safe in school? What if some (armed) White mom takes offense to your child making her child angry or cry? "
These are hypothetical questions that are difficult to answer on its face. I have to carry firearms and get a conceal to carry permit, if I wanted. No one has stood at the door and said, 'No'. Are anybody's kids safe in school? Unlike times past, it is not easy to excuse what is now unlawful behavior simply because the victim is the wrong color.
With time, changing demographics and agitation we will continue to accept these half loaves, taking us closer to the ideal for this culture.Well said Credence, you defined The Bloodless Revolution Malcolm X spoke about, It needed to be put in words
@Credence
I do appreciate your resolve in the way of how you think of America, Credence, and ask that you not misunderstand my argument.
I am not saying sit and wait in the way of an effort; I am saying that what you call progress is not progress. A step at a time is nothing more than a slow pace destined to arrive at the door of where they are and ultimately become what they represent. I am older than you, I am sure, do you remember the African American saying ‘soul brother and soul sister?’ I often remind people that it meant that Black folks are not racist, ethnocentric or greedy in the face or ample reason. Black children are going to school in $100 jogging suits and shoes, and failing every class. It is the social comparison to the ‘haves’ or, the same privileges White Americans have. The “tale-tale-heart” of taking matters personally dictate that you think that perhaps continuous working within “constructs’ of the system will pay off “if we only hang in there.” I do hope you are right; we shall wait and see, while I will be waiting for you. Because as turning out, Black folks are just dishonest (with ourselves mostly), egotistic, and materialistic as White folks.
Please do not get me wrong when I assert that the inevitable is unavoidable. White folks had enjoyed unfettered privileges since they arrived in the Americas, except when their British overlords threatened their sense of being special, and today their exclusive rights are again being threatened by poverty and misinformation for which they are fighting against, in the form of President-Elect Donald Trump and the Republican party. They do not know it, yet, but what almost happened to Whites way back when is about to happen again!
To have one of their own place profit before White privilege is soon-to-be unacceptable and something to carry hatred and anger out on, everything and everyone, especially Blacks.
If I sound pessimistic to you, then it is a relatively accurate summation on your part. Instead of speaking of ‘turning the tide’ why aren’t we discussing dodging the bullets that are about fly. We are living in the calm while the storm is in full swing and no one seems to notice, not even White America. Should we be looking at this in ‘Biblical’ proportions, or just dust blowing?Gone With The Wind again ? O'k I see... The First time there were 40 million people here and now over 300 million people and over 40 million of them are Black. Would the fall of America cancel The Constitution ?
The fall of America would cancel everything!
@Credence
"I am not saying sit and wait in the way of an effort; I am saying that what you call progress is not progress"
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If you are less than 60 years, than I am older than you. I grew up during the Sixties and I am well verse in the lexicon of the black community during the period.
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' I often remind people that it meant that Black folks are not racist, ethnocentric or greedy in the face or ample reason.'
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Anybody can be racist, but as WE do not control the wealth of this society, my opinion of them can be brushed aside, while theirs may well determine whether you have a job or not.
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Black children are going to school in $100 jogging suits and shoes, and failing every class. It is the social comparison to the ‘haves’ or, the same privileges White Americans have. The “tale-tale-heart” of taking matters personally dictate that you think that perhaps continuous working within “constructs’ of the system will pay off “if we only hang in there.” I do hope you are right; we shall wait and see, while I will be waiting for you. Because as turning out, Black folks are just dishonest (with ourselves mostly), egotistic, and materialistic as White folks.
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But, it is our fault when our priorities are askew. Maybe, if WE took the advice of the Black Muslims, maybe we would to need to the question the very basis of the consumer attitude that drives our culture. Imitating ot trying to attain to their objectives, perhaps should not be our objective. How much aggregate wealth does the Black community control? What are we doing with it besides buying $100.00 tennis shoes? You don't see Japanese families fixated on temporal, superficial values, is there something to learn here? There is room for individual acheivement, but they don't fail to pay attention big picture as to what will advance them as a group relative to others. Could we not take some of these things to heart? Things have improved, great grandad died in 1960, I met him a year prior to his death. He was a sharecropper, there was not much opportunity for him to do anything else. When compared with what I have accomplished and experienced within my life, I say that there has been progress.
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'Please do not get me wrong when I assert that the inevitable is unavoidable. White folks had enjoyed unfettered privileges since they arrived in the Americas, except when their British overlords threatened their sense of being special, and today their exclusive rights are again being threatened by poverty and misinformation for which they are fighting against, in the form of President-Elect Donald Trump and the Republican party. They do not know it, yet, but what almost happened to Whites way back when is about to happen again!'
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Yes, whites have enjoyed unfettered privilege, but not as many and with such certainty as in the past. Trump implies to his more ignorant supporters that hecan take AMERICA back to a time when White Supremacy was more obvious and thus more limiting for Minorities. That, again, is as big an illusion as believing the sun will rise in the west and set into the East.
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To have one of their own place profit before White privilege is soon-to-be unacceptable and something to carry hatred and anger out on, everything and everyone, especially Blacks.
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In America, especially today, profit is always King. White Supremacy is just a tool toward that end. But, if it came down between a choice between the first and the latter, the first will always control.
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If I sound pessimistic to you, then it is a relatively accurate summation on your part. Instead of speaking of ‘turning the tide’ why aren’t we discussing dodging the bullets that are about fly. We are living in the calm while the storm is in full swing and no one seems to notice, not even White America. Should we be looking at this in ‘Biblical’ proportions, or just dust blowing?
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I am not in the least daunted, WE have always had the tools to prevail in this conflict if we only should choose to use them. I like to think that by using our heads and exploiting the fears of our adversaries to our advantage, there would be no need for any bullets to fly. I was just as alarmed by REagan in 1981, but the reality of actually having to Govern forced him and will Trump,as well, to put the pipe dreams of radicals back on the shelf, in the most inaccessible part of the cloak room.@Credence
Your fixation with the Japanese is interesting. I spent several years in Japan and found them to be some of the most elusive criminals on the pacific. All due respect to Japanese culture, of course!
And, in as much as Black Muslims are concerned, it is supposed to be the Religion that keeps them sane, but American ‘so-called’ Muslims do not have the slightest idea of true Islam. Indeed, even the Arabs here in the middle have lost the meaning of Islam as well. I know, I see them every day. They too cheat, lie, and are perverted but not in the same way as Americans. Or, are you simply fishing for my political views? I a man, and I believe a man fights his battles face-to-face with those who oppress him; not hiding behind a bomb or a by taking the lives of innocent children, widows or the elderly. I believe that a man does not sell his soul for a cheap benefit, or to feed his family from spoils stolen from another family’s table. Nor do I believe that a man will not be inhuman toward others just because he is offered a benefit. And a man recognizes folly for what it is!
If you see people on your street selling drugs one day, and giving out turkeys the next day how is it an illusion that they will actually benefit you and your family, or the sun rising in the East? That is the lie you brought, and it’s your money, so please do ask you please with it. Again, your “tale-tale-heat” says much about your view of profit over principle, i.e., “In America, especially today, profit is always King. White Supremacy is just a tool toward that end. But, if it came down to a choice between the first and the latter, the first will always control.” Therein, I rest my case!
Finally, the “tools” at our disposal, as you suggest is like the Bomb that blew up Hiroshima, why use something simply because it’s there, especially when so many may suffer? White folk’s offerings are like the bubonic plague hidden in a warm blanket and given to you as a gift. Frankly ,I could give a toss about prosperity at the miserable price of a human life. As Dr. King once said, “a man who has nothing to die for aught not be living.” That is because I know all too well the disappointment and loss of abused and sold for the benefit of another by one who would call him/herself my friend."Your fixation with the Japanese is interesting. I spent several years in Japan and found them to be some of the most elusive criminals on the pacific. All due respect to Japanese culture, of course!,
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Not a fixation, just the best example of a culture that have aspects that we would do well to imitate more closely. Whatever they put their hands to, they have generally done well.
"And, in as much as Black Muslims are concerned, it is supposed to be the Religion that keeps them sane, but American ‘so-called’ Muslims do not have the slightest idea of true Islam. Indeed, even the Arabs here in the middle have lost the meaning of Islam as well. I know, I see them every day. They too cheat, lie, and are perverted but not in the same way as Americans. Or, are you simply fishing for my political views? I a man, and I believe a man fights his battles face-to-face with those who oppress him; not hiding behind a bomb or a by taking the lives of innocent children, widows or the elderly. I believe that a man does not sell his soul for a cheap benefit, or to feed his family from spoils stolen from another family’s table. Nor do I believe that a man will not be inhuman toward others just because he is offered a benefit. And a man recognizes folly for what it is!"
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I do not subscribe to Islam beliefs, but there are aspects of that belief that include self discipline, self control and self reliance, that are more relevant as a message for our folks today than those given by Baptist preachers. I don't want to give you the impression that I Am 'fishing' for anything. I review and study many cultures and take the best of those to incorporate as to how I live my life and conduct my affairs. Morality and principle always works well when you have a full belly. But there are those that will forfeit their humanity in exchanges that have nothing to do with their immediate survival. I wish not to be one of those.
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"If you see people on your street selling drugs one day, and giving out turkeys the next day how is it an illusion that they will actually benefit you and your family, or the sun rising in the East? That is the lie you brought, and it’s your money, so please do ask you please with it. Again, your “tale-tale-heat” says much about your view of profit over principle, i.e., “In America, especially today, profit is always King. White Supremacy is just a tool toward that end. But, if it came down to a choice between the first and the latter, the first will always control.” Therein, I rest my case"
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I did not say that I personally value profit over principle. But, I can't live here for as long as I have without being aware that that is the way the SYSTEM works.
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"Finally, the “tools” at our disposal, as you suggest is like the Bomb that blew up Hiroshima, why use something simply because it’s there, especially when so many may suffer? White folk’s offerings are like the bubonic plague hidden in a warm blanket and given to you as a gift. Frankly ,I could give a toss about prosperity at the miserable price of a human life. As Dr. King once said, “a man who has nothing to die for aught not be living.” That is because I know all too well the disappointment and loss of abused and sold for the benefit of another by one who would call him/herself my friend."
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You can take that disease ridden blanket or choose to freeze to death on the prairie. One is almost a certain death, the other may allow options for your survival so that you may live another day to figure out how to keep warm without 'his blankets', next time. Of course, Dr. King's quote is correct. But one has to learn to carefully pick his or her own battles to determine whether each and every altercation with the system have to be resolved by making the ultimate sacrifice.@Credence
Fair enough argument, and I personally accept all your resolve as reasonable, not that it matters of course. I am now very, very curious concerning your true identity, Credence. Though none of my business, your subtle complicity seem more of a beckoning call for or to 'something' than a personal position, to inform us or a call to action. In any case, you are definitely not anti-African Amercian or pro-White Supremacist, and for that I thank you.
I only suspect this because of my familiarity with a recent issue of the NAACP leadership being infiltrated by an, actually, wonder non-Black person who paraded as a Black woman for years without detection in the organization, that and a general suspicion of the vulnerableness of facelessness on social media sites.
Thanks for clarifying your posts to this thread@Credence
Fair enough argument, and I personally accept all your resolve as reasonable, not that it matters of course.
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Of course it matters. I would not have spent the time in discourse with you if it didn't.
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I am now very, very curious concerning your true identity, Credence.
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I am as I described myself in my profile, no more, no less. I am an open book and have nothing to hide. I don't like to use my True name as I can stir people up to the point of reprisals in some of these forums. The missus will take my computer away, if I don't play nice. The power and reach of the Internet is nothing to be underestimated.
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Though none of my business, your subtle complicity seem more of a beckoning call for or to 'something' than a personal position, to inform us or a call to action.
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I would like to think that my position on things has been of benefit to me and if others want to see it as a call to action, I certainly hope that they do. I am not a Messiah, just a regular Joe throwing out a few ideas for consideration.
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In any case, you are definitely not anti-African Amercian or pro-White Supremacist, and for that I thank you.
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This is true....
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I only suspect this because of my familiarity with a recent issue of the NAACP leadership being infiltrated by an, actually, wonder non-Black person who paraded as a Black woman for years without detection in the organization, that and a general suspicion of the vulnerableness of facelessness on social media sites.
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I recall the instance of a woman in the Spokane, Wa. Area, if memory serves. I say if the woman was holding the position to showboat or merely for financial gain, I object. My idea is that someone does not necessarily have to be my enemy just because their skin another color. They choose to be based on their actions and attitude. People cannot change the way they were born or how they look. If this woman, although White, had the correct intent as that leader for NAACP in that area, and she was so moved to take on my problem as if it were hers, she is to be commended. Perhaps, she needed to do the cornroll thing to have credibility with other blacks? Credibility is based on action and not appearances. The struggle that we are engaged in is broader than just the debate as to who is black enough. And under those circumstances, it really does not matter what she looked like.
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Thanks for clarifying your posts to this thread
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You are welcome.@credence
I shall pry no more.
Thanks again
And, as a research question to you:
If it came down to your family going hungry, would you sell your body, steal from a store or bless the table and tell the family to say Amen?Me, I do whatever is necessary to keep me and family alive, the point is not to put oneself in a situation where it has to come to that, if at all possible.
@Credence
Interesting none answer speaks volumes! No offense intended. In case you ask the same question directed at me: I would bless the table and demand the family say 'Amen' that's what we'll have for dinner Amen.
Agendas of the so called, White supremacist, far right ideologists who reject mainstream conservatism, and Nationalist social movement's established organizational structure function serve as a call for mass collective action. In that, [these] people aren’t physically together, [they] “act as part of a group against expected social norms” ethnocentric, xenophobic ideas of which permeated premodern times. The shared disdain of big government, beliefs that nation is more important than family and culture embolden groups.
White Supremacy in America is a ‘mass action’ group. Social movements are motivated by a social or political aim. They achieve these objectives through conflict and action directed at particular opponents, not just through consensus and compromise. The participants in a social movement share a collective identity, but though they organize meetings and coordinate action, the tie that binds participants together in a social movement is a joint commitment to social change. In the initial stages of social movements, individuals participate primarily through informal social networks. “As the movement develops, the institutions grow more formal and structured. Even in later phases, the movement is united by a shared commitment to social or political change.
This way of doing politics is not new; today’s politics is bringing into the mainstream a strain of for-profit bigotry and pessimism benefiting certain groups who believes life in the world’s richest, most powerful country at the beginning of the 21st century could not possibly get any worse (see Schumpeter). On this view, it is not specific policies that are at fault, but the system itself, which must be broken in order recognize the problem and to solve America’s problems - is the functionalist’s perspective. What current events have done is create an ambiguity about how dangerous America’s state of affairs is, and how seriously the people need to take it. With each deviant act involving White supremacy with an iota of plausible deniability (it is just America being America!). With each sign that something is wrong, some White supremacy supporters can cling to an alternative reality (they believe America is a tolerant Country, optimistically, there will be equality for all, so just be patient).
The ideological, commands of America’s White dominate groups stem from socioeconomic neglect and not quickly disowned. An ideology is a system of thoughts, values, and beliefs that provide a comprehensive way to understand some broad area of the world. They are holistic and comprehensive systems of belief about the proper organization of social relations. Extreme ideologies are difficult to change. This is because adhering to a radical ideology is not merely a cognitive process; it is a socioemotional process of identification motivated by concerns related to individual and group identity. Ideologies are composed of cognitive, moral, motivational, emotional, and programmatic and solidarity aspects. Extreme ideologies Extreme ideas take many forms that are organized around racial superiority, hate, political and religious beliefs, terrorism, and armed political resistance.
It is well known but rarely recognized as a problem that issues of social class and socioeconomic status are mostly invisible in the discussions, teaching, and research within substantive areas in the field social psychology. “Whereas gender, race/ethnicity, sexual orientation, and disability have begun to gain some recognition as independent variables that can potentially have enormous significance for behavior, but this is not yet the case for social class”.
American citizens, regardless of political party affiliation, who seek alternatives to ‘doing business as usual’ in government, and unhappy with America’s state of affairs are easily “swept up in [the White supremacist] social movement whether [they] like or [realize] it.” White ethnocentrism, xenophobia, and ideas of patriarchy emerge as the ‘fine print’ of alternatives for change in government and re-direction of national priorities. Meanwhile, struggles and priorities of less powerful groups, especially ethnic minorities, become stagnant or unrealized.
Hate, however, has only destruction as an ultimate objective, cannot be reasoned with nor rehabilitated. Even reformed White Supremacist admit to little change in their beliefs of superiority to other races. A country divided is not the same as a country undivided; cohesion falls apart and distraction ignores security; and with no security matters worse.References
Berkeley, JON. 2016. "The debasing of American politics." The Economist, October 15.
Conley, Dalton. [2011] 2015. You may ask yourself
Crossman, Ashley. 2016. "Understanding Functionalist theory an overview."
Lott, Bernice, Martha Bergen, Hal Bertilson, Crystal Blount, Lina Chhun, Larry Gainor, Keri "Report of the task force on resources for the inclusion of social
class in psychology curricula."
Mascolo, Michael F. 2016. "The transformation of a white Supremacist: A dialectical-developmental analysis." Qualitative Psychology.
Pease, John, William H Form, and Joan Huber Rytina. 1970. "Ideological currents in American stratification literature." The American Sociologist
Stanley, Dick. 2003. "What do we know about social cohesion: The research perspective of the federal government’s social cohesion research network."I hear you, but I think that you give White Supremacist much more influence than they actually have.
White Supremists are just a subset of the group who were opposed to Government as usual, and generally voted for Trump. The are content with playing in the bushes and burning fires therein. If they are SO influential, how is it that a Black man could be elected to the highest office in the country, regardless of their extreme rage and organizational structure?
Such types have always been been on the periphery of AMERICAN life, and their influence is less and less relevant while they can continue to make noise. They are, in actuality, powerless as the Green Supremicist can't afford to have AMERICA, Inc. project the image of a morally bankrupt society around the world. It is not good for business. So, the resistance to them will not come just Minority groups but from 'the establishment' who are complicit in the system of inequity, but don't want it obvious or irrefutable from the view outside. Remember South Africa?@Credence
That is a well thought out, informed comment, one that is not only one of the paradoxes of Political/Social Sciences but also not easily understood. Though I have a right to my conspiracy theory too, I will keep this discussion factual.
White Supremacy in America is bigger than just a 'subset of a whole, ' and their influence is significantly underestimated. Take your pet pea for instance, Japan, a major supporter of White rule, not only in America but the world, while maintaining their own stable culture. But of course they would be, after Hiroshima and Camp Harmony their fear of White Folks has transformed to ultimate respect for Whites. Remember, power is the ability to force cooperation against ones will whether it be through military force, economic force or otherwise.
America's White Supremacists have the authority to force cooperation against one's will to do otherwise. That is why they call it 'Authority.' because it is they who set the rules. Social norms, etc., and they are enforcers of those rules and standards. Underestimating the oppressor is the first step to ultimate self-defeat. By no means am I insinuating that Whites are the ultimate power, the nuclear boom holds that right.
To enhance my understanding of social groups, total institutions, authority, and social identity, several months ago, I purchased seven books; one of the books was entitled "Hotel on the Corner of Bitter and Sweet" by Jamie Ford. You may have already read it with your interest in Japanese American affairs. What I found after several reads are that it does not matter, in some instances, that socioeconomic condition of concern when it comes to social stratification. Economics is taken for granted as White America no longer have to appreciate, or act familiar with what they are confident they control.
And as far as South Africa is concerned, they had already firmly planted their rule to the point where it no longer mattered whether thy occupied the Country. Just look at it today, social unrest, and unmovable regimes will always serve their inhumane end(s).
In other words, things are not so easily understood, or simple as we would like them to be. White America are the 'gatekeepers, ' and nothing short of radical mass social change will alter that fact. And even then there remain the question of whether there will be anything left to salvage. Can Donald Trump initiate another world war?
@Everyone
What is [MY] Assessment of America?
I'll let you all know in a few days after the Electoral College cast the final decision. Because if they vote their conscience, now allowed, and deny Trump the White House, White Americans is going to tear America up to pieces. And, I could be wrong!!! He might become the President, in which case, there will be a little loss for Black folks because we already know what to expect.I actually think this the last desperate attempt for the white race to keep majority white rule in America by the Whitehouse and white Congress and white Christmas and white Jesus. Like General Custer last stand, except people of color will end up the Majority in America.
If they loose the white jewish Israel and the white America rule, then they could loose NWO rule in white hands too.
The fact is the world is made up of 86% non whites. When blacks and Muslims are doubling white population growth on the earth. Then the high numbers always shows that groups will always win the war, long term in human history. The whites and white Zionist are on their desperate run, not the other way round.
Trump lopsided white male Christians campaign is evidences of that. The Majority of Babies born in America today,are non white, there is no reversing that fact. If Trump ideas of tearing down the Statue of Liberty to discourage immigration. Building a huge Mexican wall with to stop Latinos. Incarnation of more blacks into prison will slow down black births. Or stop trade international will lower non white population.
If Trumps beating of a dead horse proves anything, it proves that he is just a fu_ker.@Castiepaloma
Interesting observation. Tsk Tsk about Israel, take it from me, I know what you probably do not know. Bondage in Egypt beyond imagination and 6000+ years planning is something not to take likely.
Such comments could get us censored as I like the idea that I've found a home here among so many (profound) wide awake brothers and sisters."The fact is the world is made up of 86% non whites."
Do you think that is germane? Or do races and racists always simply pick on whoever is handy and is not their own race? In other (simplistic) terms, won't blacks and latinos pick on each other rather than gang up together to pick on whites?When your non white 86% of the population your going to have a higher % of troubles. When I hang out with more whites, most of my troubles are going to be with white people, and rarely with people of Colour. It is the same for blacks or Latino who hang together too.
The difference is US economy and social system would favor whites and is unequal most areas of different races except for Asians.@Wilderness
WOW, among other countries I've lived in, Mexico is one too (Estado De Sinaloa, Qumuchil), and what makes you think Blacks and Mexicans don't pick on each other?
Mexicans are pissed at everyone too, so-called Mexican Rulers have not been of Mexican origin since the Alamo, i think, they are all from Spin, Spinish but not Mexican. Blacks see Mexicans as competiition, Mexican see Blacks as in their way.
Everyone has a story a to tell and no one wants to listen because each has their own agaendas.
@be7434
Forty years ago, let'ss see,
We were at the tail end of the viet Nam conflict (I left military service in 1976);
In 1976, schools were legally desegregated for 22 years, the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was 12 years old, the Voting Rights Act of 1965 had been in place 11 years, and the economy was one year into economic recovery from the recession that lasted from November 1973 to March 1975. Still, Blacks were nearly twice as likely as whites to be unemployed; the median Black household had only 59 cents for every dollar of income in the median white family, and African Americans were three times more likely to live in poverty than whites.
Even if matters for Black folks were better, today 'Trumps' and progress.
Ahh, I don't think so, not really!
I believe that America is a land of great opportunity, much greater opportunities than what you'd fine in other countries. And how did it get this way? By not only it being a physical melting pot, but the psychological melding of ideas from different cultures, races, and people. Being one unified group isn't what makes America great, but it is us being a United States of different cultures contributing to the great American Pie. However, not everyone realizes this, and that's the problem with America currently for Black people.
Many White Americans have fallen for the fear tactics of the corporate elite, making them either A. Blame ethnic groups for their problems if they're poor or B. Making them see ethnic groups as a threat of taking "their born right" to their money and power. Then you have us Black people, who either think A. Selling out and betraying our brothers and sisters is the only way to succeed (See Bow wow, Laila Ali, and Lil' Wayne) or B. There's nothing they can do change things, so they should just look out for #1. In the end, you have Whites AND Blacks devaluing the African America piece of the American pie. Our country has come a long way, but recently we've seen how much MORE progress we need to make, as the darkness that we thought was hidden comes into the light. Countless polices officers facing no jail time for shooting and killing unarmed Black men and children? The election of a president who has shown himself prejudice against minorities and lacks respect for women? No leader rising to quell Black-on-Black violence in their communities, the rioting, or the wave of the Judicial Branch's target on the Black community?
How do I feel about America now? I feel it is a great country that lacks value for its African American citizens, those same citizens who contributed vastly to its greatness. I feel like it's a boxer who has starved himself to make weight when there is no competition. I feel it is a strong bald eagle that is sick. I feel it is an athlete that refuses to go to the doctor after discovering a lump on his body. Yes, America is great, but it has a problem, and it needs to admit it has a problem AND develop a cure to fix it before it becomes overwhelmed by it, and not only for the sake of its Black citizens, but for all its citizens. For the sake of the country.America is a house divided into a two party system with with the Majority of Whites making up The Conservative Republican Party. The Democrats are called Liberals and many other names by Conservatives. The Majority of American people of color vote Democrat and in that reality is The Great Divide and why Trump Won. The them and us ideology keeps America from being as great as it can become if there was as much racial diversity in The Republican Party as there is in the Democratic Party and in America. I think you have a great future in writing if you Write on. Great Hub !
Thanks junko ^_^. I personally believe our bipartisan attitude is making our government diverge from its original purpose: To advance America, in its entirety, as a country. Because people lean towards one political party, it's become about pushing agendas for parties; not in what's best for the American people. We either need: A. For the agendas of both parties to evolve, because I personally think they both have some policies that are backwards as hell. Or B. a third political party to give them competition so they have to evolve. But all this starts with the American people setting the standard first.
@ Zeron87
Your enthusiasm dipping with hope is inspiring. The incarceration rate in America, the highest in the world, at 716 per 100,000 of the national population; Income inequality today is greater in than in any other era and growing; political subversiveness and unaccountability of our politicians is unconscionable, does make a country great.
Donald Trump’s favorite form “Make America Great Again” is proof that White America do not see greatness, Madame Hilary R.Clinton’s platform, notwithstanding the FBI issue, shows that Liberals too see no greatness in America.
American is not a great nation, Zeron87, but it Used to be great.Don't rain on Zeron87 parade let him march on....
@Junko
Parades don't end when it rains as marches are towards the battle. I am simply suggesting that this Brother refrains from thinking of his sentiments as a parade or something other than a battle between realms.
Thank you, JunkoRain stops parades but not the march. You are welcome Brother Man.
@Junko
Love discussions in the 'metaphorical,' Junko! Well, sir, America's parade, an economy losing ground, again; environmental degradation issues returning, and corrupt leadership unchecked have not stopped White America's parade of moving forward with discrimination, xenophobia or ideas of elitism.
But you are right, the Black man' is also moving in spite of the rain. Even better, we shall be forced to confront our fears and plight no matter where it takes us.
Your perception is excellent!It's The God in me that is excellent not I. The Creator has a Master Plan. This fight is not physical it's spiritual.
@Junko
Now that is the discussion part of this I'll like to chat more about!!!
So, please enthrall us with your perception of the State of America's Affair in religious terms.
It is said, in all 'three' of the big books , that the fall of the empire will signal the coming of the anti-Christ who will appear as a World Leader to bring peace to earth and ultimately do battle with Jesus Christ for the fate of mankind who accept or reject the anti-Christ.
What are your thoughts on this?@Credence
Religion, as well as Politics, is allowed here, I presume?This is not Credence's domain, it belong to Grace. I have explored a few religions in my life but I am not religious. What I got out of my religious pursuit is the knowledge that God wasn't up there but in me and The spirit in me is a gift from God which allows me to know right from wrong. No other living thing on earth has the Spirit of God but man. I am not the one to teach.
@Junko
And thank you, Brother Credence.
So, Junko, you do not accept the idea that divine entities is outside human beings? And if so, where do you believe the divine inspiration in you came from or is it innate within all human beings from birth?
Please respondLike Credence said this is not the place for such discussions. I am not a religious teacher I told you that, but I can answer only here that it is innate within all human beings. Now if you want to talk religion, come by me. I have written things you should find interesting. Check out why I believe Negro Live Should Matter in the USA. Leave Grace place and spend your intellect with me far a while.
@Junko
Thanks for the invitation, where can I find you?
Kenneth, I certainly do not set the rules. But there is a place where these topics may be appropriately discussed.
In any case, just let her rip!!
@Junko
I meant no disrespect towards your HubPage, but it offers nothing new, informative or of interest to me; except for why the 'age old argument' continues of people believing the U.S. needs them. "WHY NEGRO LIVES SHOULD MATTER IN THE USA" as if Black lives matter or should matter to the U.S. What can, or want to offer except more servitude and our purchases of their goods, services, and products? The United States of America could less about Black Folks or even their own White Folks.
Black Folks and White Folks lives matter to the U.S., but only for the benefit of those in power, for corporations who want you to buy what they have to sell, and for your labor.
None of this is new or innovative. If it is new to you, then perhaps you should re-title to a question rather than a statement. I write, and I think, about everything, and I exposure myself to as much information as possible, to understand what my own interests mean to me and how my interest affects the world around me, and vice-a-versa.
Black Americans helped to build this Country, labored for this Country and died for this Country. Our purpose to continue doing the same or there is no more use for us. In any case, the U.S. does not need U.S. if we want to live here and, which we do, then we depend on the U.S.
I am not saying this is a bad thing because without (The U.S.) Black Folks would cease to exist overnight, In America that is! But I cannot, as a reasonable Black man, live a lie as if they need me more than I need them.
Therein lay the problem!
We depend on the U.S. to provide jobs because we have little recourse in that area; we depend on the U.S. to educate our children which they the way they see fit, and we rely on the U.S. to provide protection for our families and us and if not, ruffians would eat for dinner.
You have a solution for that that is where my interest lay and would be something new to me. Because I do not pretend to have a solution only more questions.Kenneth Alexander everybody is not as informed as you. The Talented 10% can't teach you nothing you don't know already. There are Negroes who don't know nothing about what is going on today or what went on yesterday they think they are from Mississippi or New York. You should share your brilliance by writing an article enlightening all AMERICANS AND STOP BEING A NAYSAYER and a rain man. I must stand down with a know it all, you don't have to listen, you have nothing to learn from me.. .
@Junko
I am far from how you describe me; your depiction is so off base! I just do not have, within me, what it takes to be a follower, to be a follower takes a certain quality, a particular type of person to follow along. I do not possess such a quality, only God knows I have tried, I get in trouble every time, I mean real trouble, the type of problems most people would shudder just to think about.
Nor am I a leader, never tried or want to be, because I may step into quicksand or a trap. But not the trap followers fall into.
If your perception of me is a 'know-it-all,' i am not impressed or feel complimented.Kenneth, I apologize young brother, a college professor once told me my ignorance was painful. He didn't know what I went through on my way to college. He didn't harm me but helped and eased his pain. I should have said what I said in other words, my bad.
@Junko
Hey, Blackman, you owe me nothing, your offer of an apology is bigger than is bigger than this planet. My shortcomings are my burden, not yours. I sense your heart, Brother, words cannot represent what is there.@Junko
By the way, Brother, thank you for the 'honorific' but what you call young is actually 62-years of age. Older than you, I bet (smile)!
@Everyone
Sorry Brothers and Sisters, but I have my two-cents sat on another HubPage ("What Discrimination Have You Faced as a White Person?") at the present as I cannot permit my natural sense curiosity to ignore the Good Fight.
I know it is a lot to chew, but I have a Big Mouth!Humm, no takers on that HubPage, maybe they will shut down that 'foolishness.'
@ Kenneth Alexander: It's true that our country has a LOONNNGG way to go, I mean, our country is one of the youngest on the planet, but that has given us the opportunity to learn from the mistakes of others (the basis of our Constitution in the first place, to try and and not make the mistakes of the Old World). But don't let the journey discourage you, man. Look at the state of other countries.
If you think you're poor in America, look at the poor in India or Africa. If you think our government is corrupt in America, look at the corruption in Mexico. You think people don't listen to your needs in America, look at how they listen to their people in China and Cuba. America has its faults, but you can't let the barbarians trying to control it make you think its not worth fighting for. If you let your hope dwindle, even if you throw a "punch" at evil and corruption, it'll only be at half-strength. We have to believe in our country to save it.
You think people who shoot unarmed women and children represent America? You think people who rouse their twitter fans to bully people exercising their constitutional rights represent American values? Do you think people who protest by stealing and destroying property represent American values? I think not.Hello, Zeron87, so pleased you responded.
Are we (really) learning from previous human errors, or are we, as Black people, going in the same direction? Have our out-going President Barack Obama avoided repeating debilitating mistakes of former leaders or has his administration repeated those errors?
And the U.S. Constitution was written by ordinary, regular men without the input of women, developed in the best way a human being can view life. We place too much of burden on ordinary people with limited capabilities. I do believe that "All men are created equal and endowed by their creator (life energy) to certain unalienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." Unfortunately, matters are not that clear cut or dry. What the founding fathers did not have in their day was modern day science, the science of psychology, or the breakdown of the science of history.
Please forgive me if I sound discouraged, you have been paying attention indeed; more than just discouraged, I am profoundly pessimistic as to, not only the state of affairs in our Country but globally as well. I have, and I am looking at conditions of other countries and, believe it or not, matters are not that different than those of America's.
Please know, discouragement is not necessarily 'surrender' as it is in discouragement where solutions are found. Countries have evolved during times of adversary more so than at times of prosperity. It is okay, to fail too, how else can we know our weakness or strengths without failure from time to time?
Finally, no, I do not believe that harm of any kind, to any form of life, especially to a human being is acceptable. Unfortunately, there is ample enough aversion to such a belief to call to for a re-order of priorities.@ Kenneth Alexander: You're right, it's good to know our failures and our low points, because how else are we going to know how to improve? However, one of the problems I see with the Black community is it looking at the negative too often, and this is also an agenda racists try to push upon Black people. I believe you have to look down to know where to plant your footing, but you also need to look up to know where you're going, and if we don't look up to solutions and, with hope and zest, implement those solutions, then we won't see the changes made we need done.
Too many Black intellectual and leaders talk about what "Black people are doing wrong," Or "How Black people are being done wrong," but how do we stop it? How do make racists understand racism is not accepted in America, under any circumstance? How do we make it understood that the culture of violence against ourselves in the Black community is not acceptable? How can we end the ghettos and the high prison rates? People want to theorize on the negative, but don't want to work to the positive. I want to see more positive from Black people. I think we have enough negative from the outside. Why can't we build upon the positive to bury the negative, instead of just stacking more papers and theorems and dissertations on the negative? That's where I'm coming from, man.
Also man, I personally think the issue with your negativity is you focus on people too much. People suck. People can disappoint you and let you down. But you want to know what's beautiful? Individuals. And do you want to know what's more beautiful than that? Principles. The Constitution may have been made in the interests of wealthy, White men, but even those men couldn't stop their humanity from slipping into that document. The Constitution was made for one purpose, but I'm personally a New Criticism type of guy: It created it own's purpose upon its inception, and that purpose of principles has allowed good men and women to bend it so Blacks no longer sit on the back of the bus. So that racist rants can end one's career in a heartbeat. So that women have a voice in government.
Based on the evolution of principles, I believe this country has come a long way, Black people especially, but we're currently hitting a snag, man. We Black people have lost direction since the death of the Civil Rights leaders, and racists and the power-elite are enraged at the boom of minority-rights and minority success in America. They're afraid they might not be the face of this great country anymore, when they never were. Peace, equality, and justice are the true face of this country.Zeron87, we need more people like you on the forums. If people just get exposure to people who may not be like them or aren't living under the same conditions as them, hopefully we'll all understand empathy and gain insight into our differences and our similarities and work toward positive solutions.
Thanks crankalicious ^_^, and you're correct, buddy. Too many people live trapped in their own communities and refuse to interact with other races/cultures outside of it, and this isn't a Black/White problem, but an American problem. When we don't interact with people of different cultures but constantly hear or see them, we tend to stereotype or dehumanize them. I think cultural-mixer clubs would be a healthy way to remedy this. It doesn't happen naturally enough.
@Zeron87
I could not agree more, that our community often looks [too] much at the negative. More than that our Black community is more focused on the negative more than the problems. I will attempt to break that down; in a twelve-month research project of Black and White families with school age children (conducted both in the home and school), some families were poor and some wealthy. It was found that school age ‘children’ in the wealthy families owned cell phones and the kids at school admired their peers with mobile phones and/or iPads, they very popular. In interviews with poor parents of poor children, complaints of disadvantage and discrimination echoed emotional depression, anger, and rage in the Black parents because they felt their children were denied equal educational opportunity as their children were unable to compete since they were not as popular as the kids with cell phones and iPads. These are the problems our community have been sucked int
Brother, it is useless for Black folks, as you suggest, to “down to know where to plant your footing, look up to know where you're going … with hope and zest [to] see the changes made [-] we need done.” That is part of the racist agenda ‘you’ should understand, that distraction has deliberately blurred our focus to understand the root of the problems. And even this is more involved and complicated than I care to go into here.
You ask: “Too many Black intellectual and leaders talk about what "Black people are doing wrong," Or "How Black people are being done wrong," but how do we stop it? How do [we] make racists understand racism is not accepted in America, under any circumstance? How do we make it understood that the culture of violence against ourselves in the Black community is not acceptable? How can we end the ghettos and the high prison rates? People want to theorize on the negative, but don't want to work to the positive. I want to see more positive from Black people. I think we have enough negative from the outside. Why can't we build upon the positive to bury the negative, instead of just stacking more papers and theorems and dissertations on the negative? That's where I'm coming from, man.”
And I respond as follows: Our so-called Black leaders are no more - Brother - because we now follow only Whites. Our Black intellectuals have run for the hills, at least those who (really) understand the urgency of the American State of Affairs, the others have chosen a side, their personal side which is motivated by opportunism and they use their intellect to articulate reason in support of our oppressor’s. There is no effective way to tell, make, America understand racism is unacceptable because racism is too deeply embedded in the American way of life. The American Dream is the most misunderstood concept I can think of; a dream that sets one human being apart from another; one over another, one better than the other, more deserving. And every country in the world wants, or want to be a part of it. Or did you think it meant equally the same for all? Finally, our religious leaders are too busy mixing politics with pleasure under the guise of the cloth, and well paid too.
You may want to do some in-depth research on that female statue figure holding a torch setting in the New York harbor, and don’t stop with just the donation from France part either. The questions you put forth are well-intended, I’m sure, but Brother you need to get your head out of the sand and ask the tough question - to yourself, you know, the ones you’re avoiding, or are you too afraid? I am afraid - because if we do they will trace your IP Address, and, well I’m sure you already know!
My view of humanity, now that is one for the books, Brother, we as a race, Black, and White not only suck, as you describe, we are by nature, selfish, ethnocentric, perverted, and greedy to outline a few faults. If the biblical tales of Adam and Eve are not true, it is still an excellent insight into the human psyche something today’s Anthropology can shed more light on and something Black Folks can learn. Contrary to popular esoteric notions of ‘beauty’ and ‘principles’ looking, or trying to look upon anyone other than a child will make you vomit. Even, human form has deteriorated into something unattractive that's why I try not to look at people’s hands, feet, and side images, I always notice fault(s). Principles, to me, is not something that can be described or attributed in praise of a person. Principles are more than fundamental truths, beliefs or behavior or a set of reasoning. I believe ‘principles’ are the result of one’s belief and behavior, i.e. if you say you believe in the Holy Scriptures and pray every day but cause suffering, that is your principle.
Now, I do not mean to offend anyone, but I am contemplating the ‘principle(s)’ of America’s first African-American President, Barack Obama, during his administration how many Black lives have been lost, how much has inequality grown, and much more corrupt is America’s political system? I am not saying he caused these problems, but he is the Commander-in-Chief and heads the largest administrative system in the world.
What might his principles (actually) be?
America has come a long way from what - slavery, poverty, alienation? Is there anything you would trade to go back to slavery, be poor? Think about that question!
How much of our community have focused on Government mandated curriculum’s that is (literally) embedded in a servitude ideology into our children? Not enough to say the least. How much of our community have focused on community oriented policing as opposed to preventive or other policing methods that cause countless questionable deaths within the Black community, or, how much of our community even understand this? Again, not enough.
"Our new house is beautiful, it is big and has a big garden. But people are already living there; they are an influential people with many weaknesses, and we may be able to take it from them. We shall continue our survey and make known what we find."@Kenneth Alexander: I've been reading your responses to my posts, man, and I've been trying to understand where you're coming from, and the conclusion I've come to is this: You have no hope in the America we currently live in. It seems you believe the racist agenda of America, on what it was founded, on slavery, on the genocide of Native America, etc, disqualifies America for redemption. You think I have my head in the sand? My head is clear above the clouds, "brother." I just don't care about those things. I don't care about this country's racist agenda against Black people, and how much of that is real or how much is paranoia. It doesn't matter. Heck, I don't care if the true purpose behind the Statue of Liberty is that her robe is a KKK sheet and she has a swastika tattooed on the left butt cheek. What I care about is the broken Black backs this country was built upon. We are a part of this country's history. We helped shape, mold, and create this nation. How can you tell a shoe maker he didn't make his shoes, or a stone mason he didn't make the foundation for his house? Sure, you can take credit for it, but you can NEVER take away that achievement. The racism against Black people, racists are using it to distract you from the part you've played in creating this nation, and you should be proud of it, not bury it in negativity. And more than that, you should use it as a beacon of hope to fight for your rightful place in it, just as Barack Obama did by winning the presidency. So what he was still a cog in the system? So what he didn't accomplish much? Look at the positive. Someone who looked like us became the head of this nation. THAT'S WHY there's such an explosion of racism lately. How do you think that makes the masters behind the racist agenda feel? Why do they think America "isn't great anymore?" You need to think about THAT. You don't call this desperate tantrum of hate progress? Seriously?
@Zeron87
Hello, Brother, I was resting after doing all-nighter until I heard the notice of new alert. I had to read and respond since you took the time to reply. Yes, that's me, 'cynical' old I and it is okay to have your head the clouds if that makes you feel as if Black America is doing better now.
I recently read a 'rather' cynical declaration from the 1st Lady Mrs, Michell Obama, with Oprah about an upcoming appearance. I was taken back to hear her say "The time has come when she knows what it is like to not have hope" because that is an unusual statement coming from the Obamas" or words to that effect. The thing is, Zeron87, hope is all that the Black community in America have for all that slavery and dying for America. Hope is good, I guess, just as a lie helps to forget about the ever sad truth. I retain hope that there is a God and I'll be forgiven for my personal transpasses.
As long as I mistrust the humankind, especially White folks and their motives the safer I am; with most folks thinking the way you are, self-preservation must take precedence to survive or avoid the coming crash. I fear for Black folks who have the hope of winning from within the belly of the beast without first getting digested. It's okay for you to have hope but from where I come from it's hopeless to expect some things in this life. Believing the minds of White folks, and some Black folks will change, is like hoping to live forever.
I understand your mind is made-up about change in America, and I would never attempt to change your thoughts, I am not a Republican, and I question the 'Democrat.' in me. So I am just me with the resources, skills, and motivations to survive and let live.
White folks have even taken the sanctity of death and commercialized it, and that's how dangerous the situation in America is.@ Kenneth Alexander: *Sigh* I gotcha, man. Agree to disagree, I guess. I seriously see where you're coming from man, truly. I have experienced the racist-side of America myself, my family too. It's true there's so much recently in our country to make people give up hope, and most would say hope is useless because of the storm of darkness peeking its ugly head in American society (I'm not saying it never existed, now, just that it's getting ridiculous recently, like Post-Integration ridiculous). A lot of people, especially minorities, are asking themselves: "Is this the true face of America? Is this the country's spirit incarnate?" I'm also personally an avid gamer too, and believe, just like when facing a final video game boss, your opponent fights back the strongest when he's near defeat. If I get your health bar that low, I can get it a little further, and a little further... and if I lack the skill, I can always train someone that brings a different perspective to finish things, like my two younger brothers or best bud.
But now I'm just running on, man. You believe focusing on the negative keeps one from being blinded from the truth or living in La-La Land, and I can respect that. I believe focusing too much on the negative blinds you from what you're doing right, and you need to ride the momentum of your small victories to achieve greater ones, even if you have to see a small win in a huge lost. At least we both want the same thing. I feel you, man.
And that thing with Michelle Obama is just sad. Does she truly feel that way, or is she catering to the current political climate of "Us vs Them" by using fear to keep Democrats united against Republicans? I wonder about that...@Zeron87
You know politics, man, it is all about persuasiveness by any means necessary, no holds barred. All in all, I must say, I am pleased with your personal awareness of Black America's situation and "how can I help you, before you shoot' approach. It's important to maintain a diplomacy 'first' approach if for nothing more than to observe and analyze.
I've got a big mouth and sharp teeth, so I'm told; I never said I didn't have plans to contribute to the struggle, I just said that I am in disagreement with passive, positive outlook approach. Tha best way to gain an edge is to make the oppressor fight your fight 'not' let them make you fight their fight.
The power of words can have whatever effect you desire, especially when it comes to rattling their cages with anger, aggression and with much hatred on their minds, make them chase you deep into the woods, so to speak, then lose them, leave them there. With the madman, they elected and the global hatred they have brought upon themselves.
Push them to push their own 'self-destruct' button which is inevitable' but be prepared for the ultimate fallout. Everyone's going to suffer the punishment of White folks.
Just finished "The UNBAN PATRIOT - Unchained" literary fiction series and turned -Book One - over to my copyeditor while II work on a book cover. and build author website. Publishers want this first book before I demand more money.
https://indd.adobe.com/view/09af4463-95 … 7a65e4f0ce
I hope it pisses a lot of people off unless no one reads it, which is okay too because its a blueprint for me even though I'm getting paid for it.
@sultanachour10
By suffering and 'suffrage.' Is a depressing, inhumane start in sounding Black!
@Everyone
Did I say part of the master plan, "manipulation and control of the masses start with commanding the resources." I must be mistaken.
"US President-elect Donald Trump announces Exxon Mobil chief Rex Tillerson as his choice for secretary of state." Deeply opinionated, but not fake news people (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38301686#")!
I'm sure this means nothing!
I am White. Am I disqualified from this discussion?
I would like to say that slavery is the main issue. Slavery is no more, but as the liberal and progressive policies become more and more widely accepted, isn't it possible that we may be going back to slavery?
The blacks, to save us A L L from slavery, should unify in their stance against liberalism /progressivism and its slide into despotism which will negatively impact us A L L.
Thank you for this freedom of speech.Kathryn, no you aren't disqualified from this discussion. This post is open to all regardless of so-called race. Race is only an artificial construct. We are all ONE RACE- HUMAN!
So it is a myth that blacks put on a layer of white skin and have two languages one black and one white. Then use their white side to help in job interviews in a predominate white America.
?I think the dark side of GM humor will get it, you did not know blacks have their own secret society too?.
@Castiepaloma
How are they recruited?The 10 most dangerous secret society in the world are mostly white man related, good reason to call them the white devils of fear.
Still what keeps the balance in the world is the collective consciousness of most peoples love and kindness. Blacks would create their own culture of similar consciousness in which are the true leaders of this world. Blacks would deal with the white devils for survival in their own way, more so a harmless Secret Society. Like the vas majority of people we are all basically good people.
I don't really think they are white devils, although they do use religion as a tool or weapon of fear. Greed turns to a greater mental illness of megalomaniac physiopathology liars and killers as the people must stop them again, became they are too sick, to stop themselves.
Government are useless, a Peoples Revelation is only way I can imagine would work against an evil so huge and deep over a century in the making.@Castiepaloma
Got to love your curiosity, little brother! Yes, but the secret societies you speak of, and I shutter to say the names, have been at work of thousands of years perfecting man's 'first nature' survival, i.e., breathing, sleeping, eating, etc.
To assure this nature, certain groups, over time and with enough time and desperation devise means to live no matter what the circumstances. However, such measures call for manipulation of other human groups, how to take their resources and learn their human weaknesses. In a word, develop scientific methods to save their own.
That is why it is so important to learn how matters function in society, how to avoid falling a victim without sacrificing your principles and morals of civil behavior. It is easy to fall, victim agendas of intelligent people. For example, control the resources of society, cause for unequal distribution in order to force some groups to scramble for survival and create deviance. Then the means for protection from deviance and place one as overseers with rules of who and how to protect.
You are right; it is a form of 'evil' and an active, intelligent evil at that. Never liked secrets, Castiepaloma because something is always hidden that is detrimental to someone else. We as Black people have an opportunity to show the world how civility and humanity should work, but we cannot join them (evil) to do it. Just remember our first calling, SOUL BROTHERS, AND SOUL SISTERS. A concept of being the world have yet to pick-up on! We do not believe in discriminating, anyone; we do not believe in putting ourselves over another human being and does not believe in greed. Or, at least we should believe this way!
That is the society I want to be associated with, and it does not have to be secret.
Actually , yes, Castiepaloma, I call it a dual personality. W.E. Dubois calls it "Double Conscienceness" because people do adjust their behavior especially when they believe they are observed.
Hah ha!
Knew it !!!, I call it the human chameleon as to blend in, to survive skill. I use it a lot for my worldwide travels or dealing with a very difficult person. When you act like them , they think you are as intelligence as they are.@Castiepaloma
Can't help but notice your 'fair' features as you claim to be part African American. And the other is Jewish, I presume. Not albinal, I'm sure. Please forgive my directness, habit of practice.
And if is none of my business, thats okay toolFrom our ancestors bloodline tree there is one black in our family tree, no sign of jewish. Except my two long term jewish girlfriends relationship.
All human being ancestors originally are from African, all humans have black DNA blood in their lineage. Where all other races blood lines do not cross all other humans like black bloodline. My daughter is half Aztec Mexican, she sometimes has a problem with her being half brown. It came from her Mother who is a pure breed Aztec Mexican who claims she is entirely white. She is 4foot 9' and the tallest in her family and Aztec the shortest tribe of humans on earth. Along with her mother not wanting to work, makes living a lie, painful.
Yes in fact we are all Africans. From Ethiopia to be exact, the navel of the world and humanity.
If you were to put the prime meridian in it's natural place, at the center of the landmass of Earth at the base of the Nile, then 0 Latitude and Longitude would be the exact place of the birth of humanity in Ethiopia. Strange but true. I don't believe in coincidences.@lovetherain
Hello, still catching up the many posts here. Actually, lovetherain, there have scientific tests and experiments that support your argument.
Science has proven that over several generations of breeding black rats with white rats show that over time two blacks rats can produce a white rat, never have two white rats produced a black rat; indicating that it is quite possible that over thousands of years of 'propagating' Black Folks produced the White race. Good point!!!
I am all for the 1st Amendments that conservatives consistently attempt to discard. Of course, your views are always welcome.
Why is slavery a topic? The new slavery will be economic with the plutocrat lording over all the rest of us, keeping the best crumbs of the labor relationship to himself and leaving the AMERICAN worker with the bitter dregs.Credence2 I have for a long time got the same vibes you have about Grace. Its like something I just know but can't explain or prove.
I am not after Grace on this one, Junko. It is nice to have you weigh in. It was a intuitive sense, something difficult to quantify and I certainly have nothing to substatiate it. I fear that I may have opened a Padora's box that is better left closed.
@Credence
Pandora's box is supposed to be a secret, never liked secrets, there is always something hidden, can that be good?
< Why is slavery a topic? >
because slavery is what created the nature of the American Black. African Blacks are not like the American blacks. History matters, but it is in the past. It does not define.
We have been headed toward greater government despotism with increased taxation for quite awhile now. The blacks know what it is like to work for THE MAN!
Trump is on OUR side. He is for freedom, not enslavement, as Granny Clinton and all her crybaby snowflakes apparently are not.This is true, slavery has been primarely responsible for our having a disadvantaged beginning.
Slavery breaks up families and destroy the spirit. Every AFRICAN I met did not begin AMERICAN life with a sense of inadequacy. Only the Native American peoples have been dealt a worse hand.
The MAN is being given a carte blanche with the election of Trump to turn the screws even more tightly than before.
I will reserve my opinion on Trump. I generally don't trust him, but he may surprise me yet. I will believe it, when I see it.@Kathryn L. Hill
In an alternate universe, Trump is perfect, in a perfect a world Trump is needed. We do not live in a perfect world!
@Credence
My sentiments exactly, which makes Trump (possibly) even more dangerous than ever. Chaotic in nature, his unpredictability in the complex system of American politics is interesting but scary.
Trump appears to have two diverse MAIN principles working with the same person; 1) priorities of his business sense and b) his need to try and appease.
What we are witnessing may be the beginning of the age old problem of 'trying to please as many as possible as much as possible" while everyone else takes aim at him. Researching political assassinations around the world, I've found that Trump seems to be displaying traits of leaders who have been assassinated.
Hope that isn't the case, of course, because it would compound resentment towards the U.S. by other countries.Yes, Trump is a clown. I just hope that he is not a malleable one following after the GOP bloodsucking philosophy regarding the middle class and working people. No assassinations please, the last thing I need is Donald Trump as a martyr. Would he earn a statue in Washington? Heaven forbid"........
@Credence
Keep up that kind talk and I am going to ask for hand in marriage (smile)!
Do you ever think that this idea about 'CLASS' is a bit over-rated. Upper class, middle class, lower class? I'd like to think of myself as 'classless' the theory of 'Class' groups, although originated with Karl Max whom America disdained, especially during the Mccarthy era was adopted by American Unions after the great depression. They claimed they were the cause of the American Dream. The upper class looked upon the middle, and the middle class looked down upon the lower class. Aren't the all simply "Working Class?" Oh no! Don't call me working class, I have more money the those below me and that makes me better, they say. Nor the unions, the government, or the banks made some people better than others. What did was offered some more money than to others to sell their products, services, and goods to a bunch of yo-yos too stupid to realize they were being played. Consumerism, not money is the root of evil in America. To participate, people will do anything.
The auto industry is to blame for that!
Since you told Kathryn it was ok for others to chime in I'm going to point out I think we have a level playing field, for the most part. There are pockets within our society who are disenfranchised but no one is chained there. We all have the ability to strive toward the same goals. I do believe it is easy to place blame where it doesn't belong when things don't go well, no matter how hard you struggle; but many face that problem and race has nothing to do with it.
Maybe, since there are more whites than blacks in our nation it's difficult to see those within the white race facing the same trials and tribulations because some prefer to point at those who don't.@Live to Learn
Sorry, but you could not be more wrong about that. The playing has never been level. It has always been lopsided with African Americans on the side furthest from the top. The irony is that Whites, while they have an uncomplicated journey down, down is the only way they can go.
From a sociological perspective, Social Stratification is the permanent 'chain' that eventually forces everyone down, that along with Social Identity Theories pretty much wraps up the psychology human interaction within a complex society.
This non-reality is what he needs to debunk:
<The MAN is being given a carte blanche with the election of Trump to turn the screws even more tightly than before.>
If he doesn't, the majority may become the combination of the Dem.s and Rep.s"carte blanche" - complete freedom to act as one wishes or thinks best.
Trump, has been given the trifecta: the executive, the legislature, and the judicial branch.
He said he didn't think he would be making very many executive orders, because he believes Reps and Dems will go along with him. I was comforted that he will seek for unity of the parties. We can only make something perfect out of something perfect, so I won't set my expectations too high. Big, I'll dream big and keep the faith.
I would oblige everyone to travel. As soon as you leave the cosy environs of your own country you realize that pretty such everything you have absorbed in your experience and education is an invention.
You cross a border and the inside of peoples heads are as different as the road signs and the architecture.
Once you drop the notion that your culturally inherited beliefs are somehow natural, normal and inevitable, you can get a little perspective. You might even get a few insights into how things could change for the better.
Racism is one of those things that is impossible to maintain after a little exposure to other cultures. Mainly because the kindness and decency of ordinary people, everywhere, is undeniable and skin color/religion is irrelevant.
Find yourself alone at night in a Muslim city and ordinary people will go out of their way to make sure you are not lost, can find a place to eat/stay and tell you how to avoid the local villains."Racism is one of those things that is impossible to maintain after a little exposure"
Thanks, Will, this comment is spot on!!!@Will Apse
As our pop-culture youth on social media would say SNAP!
One thing to remember about Black Americans is that are made in the USA. All the issues that white and black Americans have with each other were made in the USA.
White supremacists like to pretend there is some kind of genetic inferiority to justify their hatred but it is all history and politics.@Will Apse
Foul ball, not at all true, ethnocentricism existed since before written history. If anything, it all most likely all started since bondage of Israelites. It worked for Egypt and not Europe?Racism is not inevitable. Prejudice that revolves around religious belief is not inevitable.
These things need to be nurtured, usually by unscrupulous politicians and news media that pander to a group's worst instincts.
If ethnocentrism was some kind of irresistible force we would still be living in small tribes, gathering berries for breakfast, chasing rabbits with sticks and throwing stones at the people across the river.
Cities like London and New York could never exist.@Will Apse
Acceptable observation, Will, however, it isn't that simple. Ethnocentrism is both subjective and objective in nature, meaning that there are ingrained psychological factors that may add up to normal human behavior. Now, the American Psychological Association (of which I am a member) has it that 'ethnocentrism is neither bad nor good, simply a reflection of the way things are. We all have our cultural filters on when we perceive others, that is because we share a set of rules with a certain group of people, we develop a set of expectations about the kinds of behavior others should exhibit.
When others behave in a way we do not consider "normal" or socially appropriate," we have negative reactions (frustration, anger, etc.).
Predictably, these adverse events will be more common toward people of different cultures, i.e., emotional reactions lead to judgments about others. If others behave according to expectation, we think, "This person is right." If others behave in a way we do not expect, we believe, "This person is bad." or "This person is stupid." We often make these judgments without a second thought.
The White Supremacist and racist, discrimination is [a] normal [way of life] you are not going to change that fact. Hell, I doubt if even White Supremacist or racist change who they are. A psychological question for another time and another think tank.
It is a sad truth but it is a reality, accept or not. Aren’t we just a great bunch of poor excuses for human beings?Maybe they should open up again mentally ill Hospitals. It seem too many Americans are living a fictional lifestyle. Congress being the largest mentally ill out patients facility in the world.
Give a gun to a friend for Christmas.@Castiepaloma
Now that is a most profound observation, Castiepaloma, please explain that to Congress.
Yes, Donald Trump has serious psychological issues, so does Paul Ryan and McConell. Psychological issues ranging from ADHD applied to Donald Trump; Anger Fixation, Bullying; compulsive hoarding, and a host of other problems.
Psychologists both nationally and internationally have tried time and again to point this out to the U.S., even alleging possible creation of Hitler 'hybrid' type leader. Thanks, Castiepaloma, I think you just gave me an idea for another chapter for my book.
I don't want to be unkind about the American Psychological Association but it has such an individualistic focus I don't reckon it is necessarily trustworthy in social affairs. From time to time, for example, I read American cognitive research that tries to make sense of altruism. How can altruism exist when it does not always benefit the individual? How mad is that question, lol?
Racism is essentially a social phenomena. Racist ideologies build on human weaknesses like fear of the unknown. Economic insecurities also feed in, but ideologies still need to be invented for racism to really take root.
Deal with the ideologies and you deal with racism. Reducing economic insecurity also helps a great deal. People are a lot more reasonable when they are not scared.@Will Apse
Please visit the (ASA) American Sociological Association ( I hold a membership there too, hopes of becoming a Fellow next year). You'll see the same explanation there.
Additionally, these are some of the most knowledgeable minds in the world; they don't rely on simple phenomenon; they conduct serious quantitative and qualitative methodologies, years and years of empirical observations and research, etc. Or are you one of those fact deniers who also disagree with Climate Change?
No offense, please understand I have a habit using a pick ax instead of a shovel, I love the hard work!
However, I do believe I aware of something as you mention. Unfortunately, scientists can sell-out too for a miserable price. It is Conservatives to assert that "something that does not benefit can not exist." You are right, it is madness, but, I would ask you to back that up with a reputable reference source. I can back up everything I say with reasonably irrefutable source references. And, please do not refer me to 'Wikipedia.'
Furthermore, racism is a social problem because it falls within crisis theories of inequalities in the division of labor, physical injuries to people, and discrimination. Racism causes social issues; it is more than just a social phenomenon. It is a psychological disorder.
@Credence
The "Hidden Curriculum" is not the responsibility of any school board; it is an institutionalized educational system policy of the U.S. Department of education. The only way around it is Montessori schooling, Islamic or 'home-schooling' all of which places an emphasis on independence, freedom within limits, and respect for a child’s natural psychological, physical, and social development.
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If Montessori schooling is what it takes, then bring it on. We haven't got much of a defence against adversaries on the outside until we have secured the 'home front'.Dr. Maria Montessori was 300 years ahead of her time.
She is misunderstood and misinterpreted. Until teachers read her books and try to understand where she was really coming from, even Montessori schools won't help much.
We are at the lower end of the higher ages. How to bring on the higher ages is the challenge.
It starts with mothers who truly love their children and teachers who truly respect parents and their children and are not just out to make a living via Montessori schools as is currently done now. so ….
Ive been over here in my chair snoring ... so, I have no idea why you are mentioning Montessori, but it woke me up …
was this it?
Credence:
"Too many parents fail to teach their children to be either good workers or managers.
The responsiblity starts with the parents to train children with the goal toward excellence.
That proper attitude would be passed on to school boards, demanding that through their presence and involvement, the education of their children is first and foremost. (what is their attitude / agenda now?)
We have to expect more of each other within the community.
It it like a snowball that starts small and gains in mass and acceleration to where it cannot be stopped. Such is the nature of how we address Black people and their problem.
The establishment abuses us because we are complicit and/or apathetic to their designs."
Kenneth:
"The "Hidden Curriculum" is not the responsibility of any school board; it is an institutionalized educational system policy of the U.S. Department of education. (What is the "Hidden Curriculum?")
The only way around it (what is IT?) is Montessori schooling, Islamic or 'home-schooling' all of which places an emphasis on independence, freedom within limits, and respect for a child’s natural psychological, physical, and social development.
Sure, parents have an extensive charge of rearing the child when at home, but cannot control governmental policies at the School Board level. " (What are the governmental policies you are discussing?)I am not an expert in these schools or their methods. But, if it is as Kenneth described it would be advantageous in our quest for improvements in the educational realm for OUR communities.
To many of OUR parents are distracted, some with apathy and some under the pressure of economic life on the margins.You mean your Black communities ...
"I am not an expert (no one is) in these schools or their methods. But, if it is as Kenneth described it would be advantageous in our quest for improvements in the
*educational realm for Black communities*
Too many Black parents are distracted, some with apathy and some under the pressure of economic life on the margins." (as all parents are.)
Montessori schools/environments are beneficial for any child and every child. They can be mixed with no problem. Older and younger, black, white and all races work together in absolute harmony. How?
Each child works independently pursuing his or her individual interests as driven by subconscious stimulus. A directress does not teach, she introduces self-teaching activities, encourages progress and enables each child to bloom. She guides from behind the scenes with absolute respect for the child allowing him to choose his own activities. The child develops self-control through practicing certain activities he is motivated to do. The Directress sets boundaries which enable freedom. In this way, the child is always in touch with himself and his will.
Montessori knew that mothers would have to work. What she created was an environment which institutionalized the home. What do kids have at HOME? Liberty, boundaries, respect, love.
What makes her environments so beneficial are the self-teaching activities that require the use of all the senses in combination with mind and body.
PRACTICAL LIFE: pouring, sorting, folding, care of environment, washing tables, sweeping floors.
CARE OF PERSON: brushing hair, washing hands and face, buttoning, lacing shoes, etc.
ENGLISH: learning the sound and feel of sandpaper alphabet letters, writing letters, words, vowels consonants and reading, etc.
MATH: addition, subtraction, multiplication, division, geometry, algebra, etc.
ART: practice using pencils and writing tools, colored pencils to design abstract art using geometric templates, color tablets, etc.
MUSIC: listening to musical bells and arranging them by pitch, etc.
Montessori understood that the child is creating itself. "Her whole method is based on a deep understanding of the relationship between these two elements: mind and body." EM Standing author of "Maria Montessori: Her Life and Work."Parents have to be more proactive in their children's education. Some urban Black parents strongly contend that the teachers teach & educate their children, not them. Many urban Black parents are extremely passive regarding their children's education which explains why the educational system is abysmal in the Black community. If Black parents were more involved in their children's education, then their children's education would be much better. Many Black parents are anti-intellectual in terms of their approach to academic & other intellectual pursuits. For example, Asian parents are very pro-education; in fact, they feel that education takes precedence over everything. This attitude explains why Asian American children are on top of their education game. Many Black parents have a quite lackadaisical attitude towards education. Dr. John McWhorter, a Black professor & linguist, discusses the abysmal attitude that Blacks have towards education in his books LOSING THE RACE:SELF-SAB0TAGE IN BLACK AMERICA & WINNING THE RACE: BEYOND THE CRISIS IN BLACK AMERICA.
@Credence
@Kathryn L Hill
@gmwilliams
Hey, guys, I can’t tell how valuable these discussions are to me. I am taken in areas of information I would have thought of going.
Johathon Kozol, who toured public schools, as part of a sociological project, in several large American cities, in recounting his observations in a Book entitled Savage Inequalities recorded some interesting information.
He noticed that Black student was disproportionately ‘sorted’ into special education classes that focused on teaching vocational skills. According to the principal, in additions learning woodworking, the children learn to punch in time cards at the door … to prepare them for employment. Having been sorted, these students, according to Kozol, were taught the skills that the educators thought would best prepare them for their particular futures.
However, and I agree, the fact that these students were mostly in elementary school and mostly African American calls into question the extent to which these were ‘based on the student’s merits.
Now, I think this is boom shell 'in the education system' in America. American ideology tells us that schools are the (one) place where a student from 'all walks of life' get a fair shot at achieving a good education. Little if further from the truth here.
This information reminds me of an old acquaintance who was a lawyer earning $70,00+ a year, and he drove an old beat-up Volkswagen. When I asked why don't a new car he told me that he most of his earnings on his three children's private education, $11,000 per year each and saving for their college education.
I have more data on this issue:
Columbia University sociologist Shamus Khan studied one of the most elite boarding schools in the nation "St. Paul's school," which is about $40,00 per year for a child. This sort of upward mobility and meritocracy is exactly what gives children legitimate functioning in life.
But how in the hell can a less than an average disadvantaged family afford such an education for the children, You May Ask Yourself?
You don't and/or can't afford it. And there no parent, White or Black that can replicate such an education. It must start with legislation, or leave the children behind more fortunate children.
African American children just do not have opportunities that education should offer them, and non-Black children enjoy, and it is not (all) the parents fault!@Credence
@Kathryn L Hill
@gmwilliams
Hey, guys, I can’t tell how valuable these discussions are to me. I am taken in areas of information I would have thought of going.
------------
The feeling is mutual, Kenneth.
----------
Johathon Kozol, who toured public schools, as part of a sociological project, in several large American cities, in recounting his observations in a Book entitled Savage Inequalities recorded some interesting information.
"He noticed that Black student was disproportionately ‘sorted’ into special education classes that focused on teaching vocational skills. According to the principal, in additions learning woodworking, the children learn to punch in time cards at the door … to prepare them for employment. Having been sorted, these students, according to Kozol, were taught the skills that the educators thought would best prepare them for their particular futures."
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That is just another aspect of the racism everyone insists on telling me is just a figment of my imagination. So who gets to so brazenly write off the intellectual potential of the black student? The establishment would just as soon have you believe that these disparities do not exist. We, as Black people needed to ferret our way through the maze of deception regarding the truth as to how our children are being educated. But, as I said before apathy and distraction opens the door for your abuse by others.
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However, and I agree, the fact that these students were mostly in elementary school and mostly African American calls into question the extent to which these were ‘based on the student’s merits.
Now, I think this is boom shell 'in the education system' in America. American ideology tells us that schools are the (one) place where a student from 'all walks of life' get a fair shot at achieving a good education. Little if further from the truth here.
-----------
It may be old fashioned on my part, but I consider education as the great equalizer. Without it, entire masses would be consigned to ultimately little more than slavery. Where the privileged few will be groomed at expensive prep schools in preparation for the So called Ivy League, their advantaged and privileged life not so much the result of hard work more than privilege at the expense of others. I supported Bernie Sanders and the idea of free or low cost education available to the masses. While, I realize that some people would never find the initiative to improve themselves, many locked in cycles of poverty and deprivation would take advantage and pull themselves out, if a viable option were there.
I am reminded of a satirical comedy, a 1983 film with Eddie Murphy and Dan Ackroyd, 'Trading Places'.
Murphy was responsible for much of theme, that the rich and affluent are not just so much intrinsically smarter over the fact that they have had privileged opportunity that almost assured a successful outcome for them. If you have not seen it, check it out sometime.
The trend driven by conservative forces is to discourage people from aspirating above their stations and be content with less as it would be impossible at $40,000.00per year tuitions for them to ever aspire to anything other than unskilled labor. Trade schools are an option, but in a culture that would just as soon invest billions of dollars on planes that do not fly rather than invest in its people, I don't see people willing to go in that direction.With automation and outsourcing, that labor too, becomes less valuable. Those in possession of that lesser value have fewer options; labor protections, wages, etc. will diminish or disappear. Rising costs of living with flat wages could well mean family sweat shops are on the return, much like they were during the turn of the last century. They will come up with some trendy name for it, but we will know it for what it is. In the Ante-Bellum South, the Master knew that to maintain the viabilty of the caste system, the availability of education to the slave had to be eliminated, beyond just that that served him and his interest. So, these new attitudes are taking us backwards?
We are well on the way toward a New Feudalism. Many will be reduced to worshiping their employer, taking of his generosity as a pony would take sugar cubes from your hand. This is the danger.
No it is not all the parents fault, but if more of us got involved, we could make it more difficult for such operations to continue unnoticed and subsequently without consequence. Like Ronald Reagan once said, "turn up the heat and people begin to see the light".@Kathryn Hill
Thanks for the hyperlink, Katy, and the even more sad assessment commentary of the information.
However, the 'establishment' knows what is is doing exactly, is doing it deliberately and is well aware of its effect(s) on the African American community; results they (the establishment) expects.
"All Chiefs and no Indians" theory are at work here.
Katy, let us consider a political science concept for a moment, a concept called 'Totaltarism." can be taken to be ‘a system of rule, driven by ideology. That seeks the direction of all aspects of the public activity, political, economic and social, and uses to spread propaganda and terror.' I am happy to share this with you too.
The word was probably first used by the Italian philosopher, Giovanni Gentile, in 1925, during the earlier years of Italian Fascist rule, to describe a comprehensive socio-political system. Mussolini happily used the word, and while in general it usefully describes Nazism and Stalinism, Hitler avoided its use, and Stalin saw it as applicable to Fascist Italy and Nazi Germany but not to Russia, all Europid White Folks. Sound familiar?
Now, during the Cold War, a time of ideological combat the concepts, totalitarian used by liberal democracies to condemn communist states. While our country wants to deny it, totalitarianism nevertheless uses, even today, to classify social institutions, our Educational Institution is one. Hence, some people must be laborers (the Indians), and some must manage their (establishment of elitists) business (the Chiefs). Are you with me?
It is inconceivable that a person in their right mind would wish to lose two of democracy‘s greatest gifts, pluralism (a plurality of power centers) and the rule of law. To maintain law and social order in our society, Black America are dispensable citizens to enact political philosophers from mad men, called political philosophers, i.e., Italian philosopher, Giovanni Gentile, in 1925, during the earlier years of Italian Fascist rule.
In such a system of governing, the 'Hidden Curriculum' that train Black children, the younger, the better, to be laborers just as Black slavery was a deliberate effort to enact a system where a few would run the entire show, is perfect. Radical change and chaos of the human got in their way. They are trying not to make the same mistake again.
Now the self-defeating problem, as you elegantly point out, is "some (Black) people would never find the initiative to improve themselves. We tend to stand in our own way of progress.
Some Black activists of the 60's (like the watts poets) advocated, in entertainment that we "should shoot them in the head, until they are dead, stack their bodies in nice neat piles [as a sheild] get behind the start the revolution." It is ludicrous of course ever to consider such as a horrific solution. However, we are all familiar with "A Modest Proposal," yes?
Every direction you look, there is a dismal view of America. That is why I am such pessimistic Black man.
But it is encouraging that a Sister has her thinking hat on straight!
Thank youI think you meant gmwillliams. I am just over here advocating Montessori. but most won't get it. No one gets it. They will say, "Oh no we can't have every preschool a Montessori based environment with directresses instead of teachers, with self-teaching learning activities instead of useless toys. So no you were not talking to me. Anyway, I understood almost nothing of what you were talking about.
Today I read about the singer Lena Horn. She had to deal with a lot of discrimination as a performer.
When I was young I had a black rag doll with many braids. I thought she was co cute! I wanted many braids like her. In elementary school we had an assembly which explained to our young minds that some people have dark skin because their ancestors came from Africa where the sun is hot and nature gave them more pigment in their skin to protect them from the sun. I absorbed that and have never felt animosity because of someone's skin color. In fact, my daughter has a best friend who is black. She went to our local high school as almost the only black. Joan is a great girl who eventually moved to Georgia and became a physiologist for troubled women. Her mother still lives in town and is a doctor working for Kaiser. Surely times have changed since Lena Horn had her troubles. Well, they were changing, until we started pinpointing the negativity which I really believe was disappearing. In CA anyway. I recently met a black woman who told me she was a policewoman in south LA. She said things were better when she first started working twenty years ago. She said there is a lot of bad attitude now.KA, you know that the comment that you replied to here was mine?
@Credence
Now I do. I apologize for that, I am multi-tasking here. Working my a book, researching, preparing an extensive ethnography and trying to on top of everything. I get responses confused.
Do you hate me?@Credence
If I have your attention I'd like to ask a question of you. I know that this HubPage consists of both Conservative and Liberal African Americans, how would you define it, though? Just curious!It is difficult as conservatism verses liberal or progressive may have different meaning for Black people in America as opposed to Whites.
There are not a lot of blacks that speak in the tone of Rush Limbaugh or David Duke for obvious reasons, yet they are considered "conservative" by whites. Even the most conservatives Blacks do not want to be marginalized from existence. For the alt-right, that is part of their agenda. We have Diane, her conservatism is based upon her religious faith, but she is keen to racism in society and is not in denial, so she is not exactly an Ann Coulter. Also, there is Grace Williams, an economic conservative, but not a conservative in so many other aspects.
I am left of center, where myself and probably Junko find ourselves. We are not wide eye bomb throwers, nor walk about with flowers in our hair. It is just a commanding world view where we see the same trends, both good and bad.Thank you, Credence - got it! Not that it matters, I just find it interesting as a "world view thing." A consensus of ideas if you will.
Regards
If I were black I would embrace all that America has to offer. I would tell my children that the law protects every person and if there is any unfairness, to stand up for your rights. I would say some people may not understand you, but as long as you understand yourself, everything will be fine. I would help my child make it through school. I would insist they graduate. I would tutor them or find them tutors. The system is not perfect but you can make it work for you. If you just let your kids run wild, thats all they will know how to do. It does take the attention and care of two parents who want the best for their children. It does take knowing how to conform and comply with the system as it is set up. Again, its not perfect but its the best we can do for now. Also, I would foster my children's natural interests and motivations. I would keep them free of negative influences and keep them in touch with the joy which naturally percolates within them. Its what all children have from the time they are born. Joy of life. Protect it. Don't let bad things happen to them. Don't let them watch bad movies or play violent video games. Go to church. Let them feel devotion for the force of goodness which loves them. Children have a natural love for God. They were just there on the astral plane. Now they are here, but they have a sense of His Goodness and Love. Keep it alive.
I watched a good movie recently. It was "Mr. Church" with Eddie Murphy. Mr. Church believed in reading good books. That's also a good idea.Hello again, Kathryn L. Hill, sorry about that, don't how I got responses mixed up.
Anyway, your sincere optimism sounds like a wonderful fairytale. A tale I wish was more apparent the real story, where explanations about the lie is more important tales of the ever-changing truth. You'll get that later, although I hope not!
RegardsGood always outweighs the bad. in every situation.
TWISI
For instance, as a substitute teacher, in every single class I have ever manned, in all my eighteen years of subbing, there might have been one or two bad apples. Maybe up to five. But NEVER, NOT EVER the entire class or even half the class. Just a very small percentage. For some reason, manners, humility, politeness, respect, and kindness is the predominant character of the majority of students. Once, in a high school class, a small fly flew into my mouth and right into my throat as I was explaining the assignment. Did anyone laugh? or tease as I started coughing?
No. They were concerned and one girl immediately offered me her water bottle. My mother taught PE at a Jr. College in LA. She never had any problems as a white teacher in a school where the majority of students were black and other minorities.
This pinpointing the negative and churning up resentments that were disappearing or long gone is not helpful. We really need to stop it. With all this discussion what has been accomplished. That is my question.@Kathryn L. Hill
Surely your experiences as an instructor prepared you to expect periodic issues from outside the box, yes? Good does outweigh the bad but there times when bad wins. Does not have to make us have response in-kind, though.
Kathryn, do you think it is true, that humans are bad by nature or good by nature? Which is learned or innate? I'll like to know your opinion.Humans are perfect at birth. If only we could protect that goodness. There is a way. There really is.
The fight between adults and children is addressed by Montessori. She lights the way in her books, The Secret of Childhood and The Absorbent Mind. Where is the instruction booklet regarding how to raise a child?? Dr. Maria Montessori brought it.
Thanks for asking!@Kathryn L. Hill
Thank you, when I see first selfishness and then conning behavior in children I used to attribute it to innocent adolescent development. Now I understand that these are first steps toward serious deviance later in life. l do not have children myself so I am still learning.
Yes, I endorse Montessori schooling fully, the teachers are well trained and have degrees above that of even high school requirements.How do you know that? To become a Montessori teacher one will pay up to $5,000.00 (no more as far as I know) and it is about a year's worth of training. A directress will learn on the job after that or is expected to mentor with another directress for a year before being given her own class. Universities do not offer Degrees in Montessori Education. In fact Universities tend to downplay the methods and theories of Montessori.
These days one needs a certificate (24 ECE) units in Early Child Education which can be achieved at the Jr. College or University level to teach at any Montessori school. This is unfortunate, actually because the two philosophies do not concur.@Kathryn L. Hill
I dId not know those details, I suspect because I have a Neice attending Montessori in IIllnois and she's a bright little girl. Thank you.@Everyone
Just received the following email:
Dear Kenneth,
My name is Hazel Ingram. I'm 93 years old.
Earlier this year, I was chosen to represent the Working Families Party as one of New York State’s 29 members of the Electoral College. On Monday, I will have the honor of casting my vote.
However, I have become concerned that the Electoral College will not be able to fulfill our duty to ensure that the president meets "requisite qualifications" and to prevent foreign powers from gaining undue influence over our elections or government.
That's why I signed an open letter urging National Intelligence Director James Clapper to provide an intelligence briefing to members of the Electoral College about foreign influence on the election and Trump.1
Will you join me by signing this petition to Director Clapper urging him to brief every member of the Electoral College on Putin’s efforts to put Donald Trump in the White House?
After you sign, please help the petition grow by sharing it on Facebook and emailing it to your friends and family.
Intelligence officials have concluded with "high confidence" that top levels of the Russian government worked to influence the election to benefit Donald Trump.2
Key advisors to Donald Trump, including secretary of state nominee Rex Tillerson, ex-Trump campaign manager Paul Manafort, and Trump foreign policy advisor Carter Page, as well as Trump himself, have close business ties to the Russian government and Vladimir Putin.3,4
And bipartisan ethics experts warn that Trump will be in violation of the Constitution the minute he's sworn in because of payments he receives from foreign governments.5
I'm a proud activist who's been an active member of my union, SEIU 32BJ, for over 60 years. My grandmother was a slave, and for the first 40 years of my life, most African-Americans were not allowed to vote in my home state of Georgia. I marched as a union member with the Rev. Dr. King. I helped elect Shirley Chisholm to Congress.
I am excited to cast my own vote for Hillary Clinton on Monday. But I believe every Elector deserves to know the full facts about the Russian government’s connections to Trump and his campaign before we undertake our constitutional duties.
The odds of the Electoral College rejecting Trump are tiny. But if even a handful of Conscientious Electors break with Trump, it will help confirm across America that he has no mandate.
Will you stand with me and my fellow Electors by signing our petition to Director Clapper today?
Link:
https://actionnetwork.org/forms/us-inte … -sign-thisI am leery about subverting the standard procedure of the Electoral College without just cause. I find the College archaic and irrelevant when the popular vote can now be tallied with relative speed and reliability as opposed to the past. I don't necessarily care to give an unjustified advantage to more sparsely populated areas simply on the basis that they exist, which has been the argument of those who support the College. But, until it is formally replaced, disavowing the results at this time may create more problems than we would solve.
If there are substantive issues regarding Trump and his fitness for the office that are focused on issues that are neither politically biased nor ideological, the College should proceed addressing matters of fitness for office within that purview. We all have to make certain that the substantive charges as determined by the College that would deny Trump the Presidency are accurate and irrefutable.@Credence
I agree, the Electoral Colleg was formed as a 'backup' of sorts, just in case an unpopular candidate falls through the 'cracks' of requisite qualifications mandates. I also agree that this 2016 election is (actually) the reason(s) the college was formed in the first place.
As much as I'd love to see the Electoral College (totally) eliminated, all indicators show the opposite. The way the college does its job is exercising their 'Vote' with their conscience which has recently been adjudged legal and expected. Only Congress can repeal or replace it.
However, I have little faith in the resolve of the college, this all could be just a move to satisfy the people to push him through to the Presidency. But is the issue that White America could face if this guy gets in as well as Congress and American capitalists would have to kiss their agendas goodbye; that is, considering Trump's loyalties. The Russians and Chinese are as, if not more, intelligent than our Government.
As I said before, these are exciting times to be alive, but scary too!The real reason it was created was due to a fear and suspicion of popular sovereignty by the Founding Fathers who did not trust the rabble from being unduly influenced by a demogogue.
This election has provided evidence as to why the Electoral College should be either abolished or changed substantially. Clinton's popular vote tally exceeds Trumps by over 2 millions, that is more than just incidental. The extent of the difference between the popular vote outcome and the finding of the Electoral College are more stark they they have ever been.
Because it would take a Constitutional Covention to make substantial change and the 'fly over' or sparsely populated states are not going to sign off on something not to their advantage, we may well be stuck with it.
All of this angst could be a play to make Trump and his election win more legitimate to just that many more.Yeah, Credence, that is true.
I don't know; maybe it is true that "what people see is biased by what they can do," in which the case the opposite may also be true. When you (literally) look at everything, I mean the whole picture (it is little wonder) that our perceived limitations have any stream at all, so to speak. Almost helpless in the face of so much! complexity, so much opposition, little and no support from our own.
Personally, I've allowed my creative juices run away with me, what else is there to loss; when Children are crying, politicians lying and innocent people dying is more than one can bare. Or, am I just dissatisfied for selfish reasons. I don't know; I'm all screwed up too!Credence, please don't downplay your sense your sense reason and logic, I've taken the time to study all your posts and I think you are one of the few people here, among others, who think critically and speculatively.
Perhaps we all attempt to form a "think tank" to research social policies, culture as it is related to Black folks? Couldn't hurt, could it?@Credence
Sorry about that, I was alerted to your post awhile ago, but I was fighting with my copyeditor, again, took longer to explain how I want him to proceed. Anyway.
I've identified 15+ policies of what most Blacks believe have changed and impacted the African-American community for better or for the poor, ranging affirmation, to Black profiling statues, etc. Contrary to popular opinions, matters for the Black communities have improved much.
Okay, currently I am investigating several policies affecting the Black communities concerning education and gives credence to I believe happening in today's politics.
While searching my journals reference points, I found something of interest in "The Journal of Blacks in Higher Education" I think is important, this was from 2007, it did not get them the presidency, but it did help the retain control of the house. This time around it worked:
"Most African Americans are unaware of the importance of a movement afoot to gerrymander the presidential election to retain [control of the] White House for the GOP in 2008 [and] in all future elections. The plan wide-reaching implications for future legislation, Supreme Court appointments, and presidential policies affecting African Americans."
It's worth checking out!
Now, "[In] California a public initiative called the Presidential Election Reform Act has been proposed by officials ... " with also promotes the popular vote process as opposed to the Electorial College method. Somebody saw this coming and tried to prevent it.
Also, I am researching several other less known policies I am willing to share once my analysis is complete.
Most, if not all of the information, will be presented in my Literary Fiction Series of the "The URBAN PATRIOT Unchained - Book One" and on my website "Black Perspectives"Kenneth, yes I am aware of GOP gerrymandering as how it works against minority communities, based on the latest census, GOP would use their control of far too many state legislatures to fix the game in their favor. Could I have expected anything else? Only if minorities and other progressive leaning people close ranks can the GOP stranglehold on the districting process be broken. But, everyone needs to be on the same page and see the adversary in the same way. Through divide and conquer the GOP have enjoyed much success.
As I said earlier changing the method of the Electoral College will prove difficult based on it Constitutional moorings as well as getting enough states on board for such a change. Regardless, of the fact I find it increasingly archaic and contrary to the will of the majority. People should be electing the President, not the States.
@Credence
Couldn't agree with you more. I regularly communicate with certain American's here in Israel who also take advantage of "American Aboard" voting programs; I am informed, with great disappointment, how so many Blacks voted against Hilary or didn't vote at all.
Do you really that it is possible to get Blacks on the same page. If it is possible I doubt it'll happen until we see the affects of Trump's administration in the Black community.
There is one part of me, the cynical part, that rejoice in Trump's victory, maybe this is the punishment America has been waiting for, maybe this is what America deserves. But the more skeptical part of me says all we can do is wait and see and organize in the meantime. To what end I don't know, but perhaps fear of the worse, or appearance of the worse will wake us up.
What say you?Hillary had fatal flaws
She took a great deal for granted.
She does not listen well and was interminably stubborn
She simply lacked the charm of Obama or the keen political empathy and style of Bill Clinton
She had far too many contentious issues during the campaign with questions constantly being asked as to how many times has she been caught in the cookie jar.
When she won against Bernie, she merely grasped defeat from the jaws of victory. She was far less accommodating in recognizing the significance of Bernie supporters and their message to the establishment and to figure how to better compromise and conduct a campaign inclusive of these voters.
Trump has a uphill battle before getting any credibility from me. It is not impossible, but burden of proof is on him to convince me that he is not the monster that he portrayed himself as during the campaign.
Trump is more punishment than America or any Western Democracy deserves and that concerns me deeply. We need to organize, march, demonstrate, keeping the pressure on Trump and his every action. The moment he is out of line, let it be revealed all over the world. We have no choice but to wait, but while we wait, let us be making preparations to counter Trump and his agenda, once it is clear in which direction he is taking us.
@Credence
If I didn't know any better, I'd say you are looking over my shoulders; and it all adds up to few allies in Washington for Black Folks, and that spells trouble for progress made - if we can call it that.
I began to mistrust HRC the moment she flip-flopped from a prior statement a year ago that she would not run for the Presidency. Or was it her silence when Benjamin Netanyahu told her, during a press conference in 2014, that he was not concerned for lives of children and sick people boomed in schools and hospitals in the West Bank as America did? I also agree that it was her who engineered sabotage of Sander's campaign, and her evil lashing out at Monica Lewinsky that ruined the life and career of a victim sat the tone of who she is long before her initial run against Obama in 2008.
The GOP set-up in Washington is against Black progressives nationwide; our movement lacking trust-worthy Black leadership is already a pain in the butt for Trump, his new administration, and the GOP they cannot allow to gain any more momentum that it already has.
The next steps of planning and organizing are the parts I'm most concerned with as tactical tools of the new administration, and the GOP are unlimited if they entertain notions of civil unrest in the nation starting with the Black Lives Matter movement. Tensions may become compounded as non-Blacks take an interest in Black movements. However, I will not allow my skepticism to interfere with my part in this, sure to fail, struggle.
I appreciate your imput into this most timely topic.
"This pinpointing the negative and churning up resentments that were disappearing or long gone is not helpful. We really need to stop it. With all this discussion what has been accomplished. That is my question."
Here is my answer. The problem of Black underachievement in Education is a long term and a festering one. It's going to require coordination between Black students, the parents and the community. It can never happen with a 'it's all going to work out' attitude. In the Age of Trump, things are only going to become more difficult. A certain militancy among our people is going to be needed to successfully herd cats so that is what we must do. Is that intimidating? It is not meant to be, but it IS necessary. What's been accomplished is an agreed upon course discussed by intelligent people, relieving us of the sense of futility of being condemned to an untenable situation forever. Where and when I can, I will promote such attitudes and values among those that I come into contact with that will listen. That is the least of my obligation to our children. The conversation and debate will and must continue, because not seriously considering the road that we are traveling on will be of great detriment. I am not sure just how 'much of this stuff is gone'. Repackaged is probably more accurate.
BTW, I subbed in SAN Bernadine public schools in 1981, it was one of the best jobs that I have ever served in.@Credence
My, my, you do get emotional, and that is the spirit we need to rally attention, and solutions, to the plight of our Black children.
Now, to take a page from another group, I'll call them group 'X,' it may be effective to drum up much-needed support from the U.S. Supreme Court rather than continue the fruitless battle with Congress. Congress may fall in-line if we could inclusively rally the real keepers of the law of the land the U.S.C. Additionally, strong backup support from another Country could bring within inclusive of the United Nations, Afterall they have a sincere interest in Africa, why not exclusively American Black children.
This scheme is impossible only in the sense of what is will take to pull it off, not to mention a Federal Reserve size funding, plot-oriented lobbyists who can offer incentives for private support, and some backstabbing, or front stabbing. Something has to be done!
Just a thought!I don't have to be emotional to be in earnest. I don't scream about problems and merely tickle the ears of others as a solution.
I am not sure that I am following what you write in the succeding paragraphs, please elaborate?
I am still of the mind that the greatest step toward a solution rests within US.@Credence
Although I may be construed suggesting as solutions other than the U.S., I am not. The succeeding paragraph is nothing more than an idea, a possible starting point for discussing a solution.Kenneth ,We must Identify the problems before finding a solution to the problem. The sharing of ideas is a good way to identify solutions. Asking " Now how did this or that, made you feel " is the question asked by a 500 dollar an hour Therapist. He ask the question and the person identify the problems and pays the cost. Like you said about my writings you found no interest in my old and worn ideas but rather talk what you know. Sometimes and all the time solution are found in the words of others in other words. I am 7 years ahead of you young man.
@Junko
Even if you weren't my elder you still have my respect because you are Black. And I'll tell you the same as I told my older brother (also seven years older than me), a therapist for VA, It is not that my problem is with me as it is to the world I must in. I enjoy a very comfortable life and yet it isn't enough because so many others don't live as well.
I was not always a 'people' person, but my experiences and academic exposure would not allow to strub off problems faced by Blacks. I'm not blind or confused about who I am, Brother, I am perplexed by the self-centered, ignorant people in the world. That's not a problem; it is something I am unable to close my eyes on.
Thanks for your comment.
<Surely your experiences as an instructor prepared you to expect periodic issues from
outside the box?> Yes, all the time it happens. I like the kids who respond outside the box. I get them totally. I do not believe anyone is naturally bad. Even Hitler had issues stemming from his childhood. to what extent he lost his soul to drugs/ Speed is the reality, I would guess.
<Good does outweigh the bad but there are times when bad wins.> Maybe temporarily.
But "bad" teaches us lessons. We always have to ask ourselves Bad for what? Good for what? Usually the answer is survival. For instance: what will help us survive in the long run: socialism or republicanism/free market within boundaries? I would say time will prove it is the latter.
No, we do not have to respond in-kind. Why would we?<When I observe selfishness
and conning behavior
in teens I attribute it to
innocent adolescent (teen) development.
Now I understand that these are first steps toward serious,
deviance (the fact or state of departing from usual or accepted standards, esp. in social behavior.)>
Usually, kids can get off track but can get back on track with the right treatment. Briefly, some teens aren't given the proper boundaries and may become spoiled. Also, they could be acting or acting out because of feeling abandoned, lonely or overly controlled or stressed due to imposed pressures by parents or teachers. Nevertheless, love is very powerful and healing is always possible. Appropriate boundaries need to be understood and consistently enforced.
Boundary setting is the new science: Why and how.For instance: my parents believed in freedom for me. Unfortunately I needed to be reigned in when I was sixteen and seventeen. I needed guidance! I needed to be talked to realistically about what I could do with my life. No one explained a thing to us teenagers back then. We were all running amuck in the seventies. Grades were not important as the future didn't seem to be a concern. When I graduated high school I knew I wanted independence sooner rather than later and I had NO SKILLS to survive on my own. I had listened, obeyed, did the best I could with the little motivation that remained intact within me and got through school because it was expected of me. Then what ???
No one seemed to know back then. My family did not have money for me to go to University, nor did I have the grades. My sat scores were not especially high and I could not get a scholarship as a mere swimmer. So I taught swimming and lifeguarded as soon as I realized there was not much else to do. Aquatics, however, is poverty city. I made $1.35 an hour back in 1974. Today YMCA lifeguards earn $11.00 an hour. I went to a local community college because going to school was all I knew.
Then after ending up with enough units to transfer I wandered over to a state college for another couple of years. Finally, I earned my degree because one art professor realized I was just drifting along taking art classes and having way too much fun. He said, "You need to graduate." So I did.
My point is adults can do better than this and they must. Adults are are dropping the ball. Adults need to offer more input and guidance. If a parent realizes an aptitude in his child, do what you can to facilitate it! If a parent hears their child whining for art lessons, or coaching in a particular sport go the extra mile and provide them with their requests. Parents can't just live their adult lives and shut out their kids. Remember your days as a youth and give them what you would have liked. You know yourself and you know your child. Act on what you know. Its not enough to just put food on the table. Your kids need encouragement to follow their wills toward goals, dreams and ambitions. Work with them to discover what they are. And do it before they graduate high school.
One more thing:
School is one thing, life is another. Don't think school will be of much help. Mostly it isn't. Its just a holding tank so you can work. Unfortunately.
Your "answer" brings more questions than answers:
How does Black under-achievement manifest?
What will require coordination between black students, parents and their communities?
What can never happen with a 'it's all going to work out' attitude? and why not?
How, in the "Age of Trump," will things become more difficult?
What sort of militancy among blacks is necessary and to what end??
What's been accomplished (?)
is an agreed upon course
discussed by intelligent people, (who?)
relieving us of the sense of futility
of being condemned
to an untenable situation (which looks like what) forever.
What attitudes and values do you communicate among those that you "come into contact with and those who will listen?"
<That (?) is the least of my obligation to our children.>
<The conversation and debate will and must continue, because
not seriously considering the road that we are traveling on (?)
will be of great detriment. >
<I am not sure just how 'much of this stuff ? is gone'> what stuff?
How has it (?) been repackaged?You are mocking me. I have explained my course of action as best I can. You will have to figure it out on your own henceforth.
A N D
How have "white folks" commercialized the sanctity (importance?) of
D E A T H ! ???Major African American Office Holders Since 1641
First Person of African Ancestry Elected to a Public Office in British North America:
Matthias de Souza, Colonial Maryland Legislature, 1641-1642
First Person of African Ancestry Elected to a State Office in the United States:
Alexander Twilight, Vermont Legislature, 1836-1837
First African American Woman Elected to a State Legislature:
Crystal Bird Fauset, Pennsylvania House of Representatives, 1938-1940
First African American Woman Elected to a State Senate:
Cora Brown, Michigan State Senate, 1953-1956
FEDERAL OFFICIALS
President of the United States:
Barack Obama, 2009--
United States Senate:
Hiram Rhodes Revels, Mississippi, 1870-1871
Blanche K. Bruce, Mississippi, 1875-1881
Edward W. Brooke, Massachusetts, 1967-1979
Carol Moseley Braun, Illinois, 1993-1999
Barack Obama, Illinois, 2005-2009
Roland Burris, Illinois, 2009-2011
Tim Scott, South Carolina, 2013--
Cory Booker, New Jersey, 2013--
William "Mo" Cowan, Massachusetts, 2013-2013
United States House of Representatives:
ETC
- See more at: http://www.blackpast.org/aah/major-afri … ce-holdersThe George W. Bush Administration, 2001-2009
David Satcher, U.S. Surgeon General, 2001-2002
Rod Paige, Secretary of Education, 2001-2005
Colin Powell, Secretary of State, 2001-2005
Alphonso Jackson, Secretary of Housing and Urban Development 2004-2008
Condoleezza Rice, Secretary of State, 2005-2009
The Barack Obama Administration, 2009
Eric Holder, Attorney General, 2009--
Lisa Perez Jackson, Environmental Protection Agency Administrator, 2009--
Ron Kirk, U.S. Trade Representative, 2009--
Susan Rice, U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations, 2009--
Regina Marcia Benjamin, U.S. Surge - See more at: http://www.blackpast.org/aah/major-afri … ce-holdersGood Gosh Amighty! Get a Grip!
(so many clicks. you're welcome!)MUNICIPAL OFFICIALS: Big City Mayors - First Black Elected Mayors in Cities of 300,000 or More:
Carl Stokes, Cleveland, Ohio, 1967-1971
Kenneth Gibson, Newark, New Jersey, 1970-1986
Thomas Bradley, Los Angeles, 1973-1993
Coleman Young, Detroit, Michigan, 1973-1993
Maynard Jackson, Atlanta, Georgia, 1973-1982, 1990-1994
Walter Washington, Washington, D.C., 1975-1979*
Lionel J. Wilson, Oakland California, 1978-1990
Ernest Nathan Morial, New Orleans, Louisiana, 1978-1986
Richard Arrington, Jr., Birmingham, Alabama, 1979-1999
Harold Washington, Chicago, 1983-1987
Harvey Gantt, Charlotte, North Carolina, 1983-1987
Wilson Goode, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, 1984-1992
Kurt Schmoke, Baltimore, Maryland 1987-1999
David Dinkins, New York, New York, 1990-1993
Norm Rice, Seattle, Washington, 1989-1997
Sharon Pratt Dixon Kelly, Washington, D.C., 1991-1995**
Willie W. Herenton, Memphis, Tennessee, 1991--2009
Wellington Webb, Denver, Colorado, 1991-2003
Emanuel Cleaver, Kansas City, Missouri, 1991-1999
Freeman Bosley, Jr., St. Louis, Missouri, 1993-1997
Ron Kirk, Dallas, Texas, 1993-2001
Sharon Sayles Belton, Minneapolis, Minnesota, 1994-2001
Willie Brown, San Francisco, California, 1996-2003
Lee P. Brown, Houston, Texas, 1997-2004
Preston A. Daniels, Des Moines, Iowa, 1997-2004
Michael B. Coleman, Columbus, Ohio, 2000--
Shirley Clarke Franklin, Atlanta, 2002--2010***
Mark Mallory, Cincinnati, Ohio, 2005—
Sheila Ann Dixon, Baltimore, 2007--2010****
Carl Brewer, Wichita, 2007--
Kevin Johnson, Sacramento, California, 2008--
- See more at: http://www.blackpast.org/aah/major-afri … ce-holders
I'm so sorry. I couldn't pass that up.
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