I'm thinking about putting together such a draft code of conduct. The basic idea is to make the forum rules more transparent and specific, which should make it easy for everyone to see what is allowed and what is prohibited.
It would be voluntary for people to sign up to it, of course - at least to begin with. If it gained traction, it might end up becoming official policy, who knows....
Does this idea have any merit? If it does, what would you like to see in it? If not, then why not?
I have been wondering whether the recent Clarification to the rules that management announced should become integrated into the official rules of conduct somehow. I could not find any such direct reference.
I do not agree with your characterization. If the Clarification was to become explicitly an integral part of the official forum rules, then I guess that would make it much easier for everyone to understand what the rules are. I cannot see why that should make anybody less free, only more informed.
Read what you wrote and look at your title above. Here's what you said. "I'm thinking about putting together such a draft code of conduct. The basic idea is to make the forum rules more transparent and specific, which should make it easy for everyone to see what is allowed and what is prohibited."
From this and your title you want to create a NEW code of conduct to suit you. Again, please explain to us..we deserve to know what your reason really is.
I have been looking in vain to see whether the Clarification that management posted in a forum thread is formally linked with the official forum rules. If the Clarification is important, which supposedly it is, then at least the official rules should provide a link to it. Or even better incorporate it somehow. Otherwise, many people may not even know about its existence. That was primarily what I had in mind.
Inane? -- maybe not if it makes people think. However, I think it might be best if people were clear in their own minds about their own personal'code of conduct' and just decide which topics and threads they will avoid.
The rules are pretty clear.. but a lot of people may want to remind themselves that whatever they say in the forums tends to live on. . . and on.
If you wouldn't shout it on a mountaintop with all of the people you know and love, and all of your children, grandchildren and etc. listening in... bite your tongue, or fingers.
Are you thinking of putting together a draft of rules that already exist? I really don't see any point to that. Or are you thinking of putting together a draft of the existing rules in language that people actually understand? If that's it, I'm speechless, to say the very least. And as for 'It would be voluntary for people to sign up to it, of course - at least to begin with. If it gained traction, it might end up becoming official policy, who knows....', I really don't understand the mentality here. Or maybe I'm just confused ... as most others appear to be with regard to this.
In my opinion, the Clarification management issued in a forum post should be embedded into the official forum rules. That would make it official policy for all to see. You cannot expect people to search the forum logs to find the Clarification on their own. If a sufficient number of people were to agree with me on this, it would be gaining traction, and if management agreed, then the policy would be clearer and a lot better than it is today.
Personally, I find it more confusing if the important rules are spread among different places.
As I now understand, you feel the rules should be listed in one place, where everyone can see them. Okay. But what is this 'draft' about. Unless you're planning on making new rules, you don't need to 'draft' anything.
Well, I think it does no harm to write it down, just in case management gets busy with other things before they decide to list the rules in one place. Also, I would imagine that management's enthusiasm might depend upon how many people supported such a draft. So I would think it prudent to write it down.
Management, in making their announcement of the Clarification, said that now It was part of their policy. But in my opinion, it does not carry the same weight as the official forum rules, which are the ones that anybody can see. Therefore, if the Clarification becomes embedded into - or linked from - the official forum rules, then that is a new code of conduct technically speaking. Also, I would be surprised if management in that connection would not have to look closer at the clarification, and maybe modify it. So it would be a bit different than today.
Apparently, there are unofficial rules and yes I read the hubpages faqs, but find things do crop up that aren't listed there. Thanks for your response Misha. Haven't heard from you in quite a while. Where you been hiding your cheery face?
That may be true. However the title says NEW code of conduct, not clarification of the existing one. Some people like to get back at others once their feelings are hurt or they disagree with someone's views.
Deborah, the OP's intentions are not to change the rules, rather he intends to make the existing ones easier to understand. Now - that's his intention. No one said that he was rewriting the rule book and let's not forget that HP can accept or decline his offer.
I'd imagine he is going to create something that leaves no room for confusion, as often happens when it comes to rules, laws and legalese.
Don't forget how you were dealt with by some hubbers, when you kindly offered free readings a few weeks ago. At the time, I felt you were unduly mauled by a few individuals.
Instead of us all paying lip service to the right to opinion and free speech, let's deliver instead - and withdraw judgement
I have read some Misha. I'm not saying his idea is wonderful, I'm saying 'let him/her get on with it'. Rewriting or adjusting (or whatever) the codes of conduct (anywhere) is not my cup of tea. I'm assuming it's something the OP enjoys doing. Besides which - that still doesn't mean anything will change
As much as I adore you, I have to disagree with you. When someone attempts to control my life (or a part of it) I prefer to trim the attempt right where it starts, before it develops into something more serious. So no, I won't let them get on with it.
Froggy yes I was treated harshly but not once did I try to change things. If you look at the title "NEW CODE OF CONDUCT" it tells exactly what he had/has in mind. I always try to read between the lines. I do agree there are people who take their insults a little too far. Then there are some who are offended by everything. Judgment? I have not judged anyone. I can only go by his title.
URggg! Not more Rules we are over legislated already. Everyone understands them, a few, choose to break them end of story. Shall we maybe put them in the "Naughty Corner" There is NO NEED FOR MORE TRANSPARENCY! As for sleep loss, hey I'm snoring off right now.
No, I would second this, The Forums are becoming increasingly dull. Possibly Rules would add to this. When I first came on, I had a Chuckle or three, but apart from keeping up to date with the health (now improved of a Star Hubber) I haven't really found much. There does seem to be a Lobby Group that just wants more and more Rules. Perhaps they could have a separate Forum, where they could basically spend their obviously abundant free time, making up rules, which they could then, perhaps Voluntarily sign up to. Then spend every moment ensuring everyone adheres to them. All I can say is glad they aren't in my Circle of Friends.
I do believe the code of conduct should be very boldly stated in one place for everyone but I do not believe ANYONE should be allowed to change the conduct code except for the administrators. Let them take care of the codes of conduct, it is their job and they seem to do a very good job of keeping the codes of conduct inline and fair for all users. Infact I think our moderators and administrators are some of the best on the web!
I think everyone should know the fact that there exists a circle of hubbers who act against every knew idea that pops up in peoples' heads or put down every hubber who asks an honest question, just because it is in their power.
Some act as the big hubpages veterans, the know-it-alls, who take pride in their imagined respectfulness, something that is sustained by another circle of hubbers with a slave mentality.
Some are simple clowns who take great pleasure in mocking and teasing others just because they themselves don't have faith in themselves that they could actually accomplish something worthwhile if they 'manned up'.
For others, it's their default mental state to be againg, question, or criticize everything.
So a list of these people should be composed and made public as a warning to those who are either knew or simply didn't have the time or inclination to really get to know these people: 'Warning hubbers! Please, know that whatever you say I will use against you and twist it and turn it to make a mockery of you!'
So don't get discouraged. The only thing that counts in this case is what the hub-team answered. If you are a professional then you shouldn't care about what people who have no experience in legal issues say.
lol, Misha, Don't ask. It was really annoying that one of the first comments to this thread was a question if he discussed this with the hub-team. Of course not. It's only a forum thread that asks a harmless question. And you know that.
Believe it or not my question was absolutely honest. And there is no coincidence that Paul chimed in with clarification - this does not happen every day. I can't help it if you don't understand why - but somehow I think you do.
You know, I believe it. All I wanted to say was that not everything is perfect around here, so if someone wants to make it better, we could leave it up to him to try. Paul is a smart guy, he does what he does with a purpose. And that's an indication that what I'm saying is true. At least that"s how I see it.
LOL Pacal, seriously, do you think any veteran would let some dark horse control freak to dictate the "Code Of Conduct"? Gimme a break. Some noobs will pick the bait, but veterans will ensure this will not be a big number.
Sure. But that says you don't have much faith in people. People are people. They have their interests, they have their things. If someone wanted to do a new code of conduct, why not let him. They can cause no harm, because the decision is with hubpages.
I don't want to disappoint you, but my real name is not Pacal.
I know it is not, you did not disappoint me. Somehow I like it better than Haunty though, but I can stop using it if you prefer.
And I do have faith in people, that's one of the reasons I asked my first question. If I knew this was authorized by HP, I would take it differently. Otherwise I am just having fun, and invite you to do the same
No, they shouldn't and there isn't any SANE reason to point out other hubbers, simply because of their actions. The forums are a public domain, based on HubPages. These people have just as much right to their own opinions as everyone else does.
There is NO slave mentality. Not unless you feel like you're being treated like a slave for some odd reason.
Yes, there are some people who mock others. Then again, there is also a bunch of hubbers, who will jump into a thread, just to simply HI-JACK the thread and take it off topic. What do you suppose is done with them?
Sorry, if you feel like you're being criticized. There are lots of people who are criticized, but simply go about their business.
No, there shouldn't be a list. Unless YOU want to be at the top of the list yourself. Therefore, we know who to start with first?
Legal issues? There are no legal issues or even laws being broken, by one person voicing their opinion over the other. There is already enough restrictions and clarity about the rules.
This link is highlighted in blue right next to the box I am currently typing in, it is labeled "Forum Rules" why exactly does this need to be changed? I am perfectly happy with this little blue link telling me what I should or should not do in the forum. I don't need a 10,000 page bill from congress about what I can or can't do here.
You can be, Cagsil. With 14583 posts in 4 months (130 posts every day - on average), I am impressed you didn't find a post with a worthy cause. Or did you have no guts to hi-jack it? Come on, say something but don't forget to type many many s
My biggest problem is that I don't trust 95% of the organizations who claim to help people with the money they receive and yet, do very little. Hence, why I started Cagsil and it's basis for helping others.
There was a survey done in 2000(I'm pretty sure it was in 2000), but the TOP 200 U.S. Based non-profit and charitable organizations.......NONE of which fell within the guidelines of the federal requirement of 5% minimum requirement of total revenue generated, was spent on what was claim.
The highest I do believe, if I remember correctly, was 1%.
Yeah, I have a reason not to trust them....and some people wonder why enough isn't being done to help those here, but want help outside the country? Go figure, huh.
So this means you are US too. I thought you were French or something. But now I'm realizing you are US, which is said on your profile anyway.
What I think is if it's about money I will give it to someone that I'm certain will use it for what they say they would. If it's something else, like answering some questions or contributing some other way, I will probably do it without much thinking. I don't know if this is good or not. All I know it might help without costing me. So probably I'm not being deceived.
This sounds a bit like European burocracy, in Europe the European Parliment spends much of its time and energy inventing rules for rules, now you can not buy a funny looking carrot anymore, it must be 10 cm long and straight, no more fun with silly carrots, I am sick of people trying to control cyber space, smells like something from the second world war, people need to start growing up....this is a place for big people with open minds not parochial control freaks........while one understands the need for moderation....control freaks are pushing people off the net and this is not good....well unless your happy reading your own dribble.........
PD I think you need to borrow my invisibility cloak
Rules are always open to personal interpretation or in some cases, abject ignorance.
For my part, I think there's always room for improvement, however small that may be. Of course the same fact remains - even if HP admin rewrote the entire rule book, there'd still be complaints, loopholes exploited etc etc.
It's in our nature to fight among ourselves, rules are kind of superfluous really
http://hubpages.com/help/forum_rulesThe HubPages Discussion Forum is a resource for Hubbers to help each other achieve the most rewarding online publishing experience and to discuss topics of interest.Rules and EtiquetteBelow are some basic guidelines to adhere to: Stick to the topic....
There's been a lot of discussion of forum rules and policies recently, as well as criticism of the HubPages staff, so Paul and I agreed that a thread reiterating our position was in order.The rules are very clear:No personal attacks in the forums. Substantive debate and differences of opinion...
I know you can have more than one account on HubPages. However in talking to someone recently, I realise I'm fuzzy about the rules. Can a staff member comment on the statements below please?I know that when you're posting in a forum thread, you MUST stick to using one...
There are a lot of us who haven't been feeling safe on the forums. They've felt stalked, harassed and browbeaten.Sadly, some folks go with the letter of the law, but not the spirit of it in their posts.For an excellent post on why we need Forum Moderators, check out what Makingamark says here...
In the past many Hubbers, including myself, have seen the "Report a Problem" or "Need Help" threads as a way to either get a policy explained, or as a way to escalate an urgent problem when emails weren't eliciting a response. It is now obvious that is no longer the case,...
Google AdSense Host API
We may use remarketing pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to advertise the HubPages Service to people that have visited our sites.
Conversion Tracking Pixels
We may use conversion tracking pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to identify when an advertisement has successfully resulted in the desired action, such as signing up for the HubPages Service or publishing an article on the HubPages Service.
Author Google Analytics
Amazon Tracking Pixel