Why are Hubbers deleting hubs?
Some may be moving them to more lucrative venues, such as their own sites. Why would that be a problem, Sid? Surely you don't won't someone to keep their work here when it may do better elsewhere, do you?
Well, if some are deleting what they consider less than satisfactory articles, then this would only help the quality of HP, wouldn't it? And like UW, some may be deleting duplicate content.
I do understand your fears, though. Desperate times call for desperate measures, as the old saying goes. Many seem to be running around like a chicken with it's head cut off! It will settle down eventually. I hope! Obviously, they found a better place for them. This is one of the main benefits of writing here. If you get a better offer, or want to use your hubs on your own site, you can do so.
I lost over 100 articles on another site when I was banned for blowing the whistle on them. The other site refuses to take them down or pay me for their use, so if I try to use them elsewhere it will be duplicate content. It isn't unusual for hubbers to delete their entire account, so don't worry about these Hub deletions too much.
Me either.
Thanks for that...now I know I don't have to go through each of my Hubs looking for internal broken links.
Helium doesn't allow deletions, Lynne. But I think they are considering letting some "trusted" members delete a few per month now. The new exclusivity rule is causing problems as some of the Marketplace articles are only paying $5 to the lucky chosen one and $1 to a couple of lucky also-rans.
Even this is slated to change soon with the runners-up to receive nothing but give up exclusive rights for a year. During this time Helium can do anything they wish with the material and give the writer nothing but their version of page views if they so choose. None of their revenue share info is open for inspection. You have to just trust them!
Your wheel too!
Your articles make Helium much more than they make you, Susan. I was making a few bucks there before being banned, so I know they've made a fair amount on my articles since they haven't had to share any of it with me anymore.
They've also sold one of my short stories now found on Kindle. A disreputable company which deserves to fail. (too harsh?)
Even before the big "shake up" I'd been trimming out a few Hubs regularly, but only enough that my number of Hubs didn't get too close the the flat 300. I'd delete until the number of them got too low - then I'd write and add a few more. The "delete-ees" were either stuff I'd written when I was new, or else stuff that seemed like a good idea at the time. I had a handful of duplicate-contents that I'd posted when I was new, but that I thought made my profile have better stuff in it than the stuff I wrote because I didn't know what a Hub was supposed to be. Since the shake up I've deleted those. Other than that, I'm not deleting anything because my stuff on here has been "spare-time", what-I-feel-like-writing, stuff.
Whether it would be better moved is something that depends on any direction HP takes. Some stuff could serve my purposes better (or even be incorporated into my "serious" writing) by being moved. Some might serve "overall HP-site aims" better (and therefore me, as well) better by being moved. It's all case-by-case, because even though I've usually aimed to produce "decent quality" writing, how casual or whether it would be qualify as "professional done" in some places (lots of first-person, and assimilated-knowledge Hubs here) would depend exactly on whatever place was involved.
For now, in view of the fact that I don't really know what to be doing or not doing these days (and to somehow have a sense of grounding), I've gone back to my original thing that my HP writing is, in fact, my spare-time writing and, if I write now (while I'm waiting to see what direction things take) at all, I'm just writing what I feel like writing.
My big "mental challenge" about knowing what to do right now is that I've had Hubs that earned (and earned really well) without my ever trying. I've got some that have earned pennies. Then some started to pick up (nothing big) to the point where my earnings had grown because of volume. In fact, I'd just started getting to where the combined earnings for a lot of those previously non-earners were catching up with some of my bigger earners; and I was thinking that was good (because I figured a big earner or two may not always do so well, and I was seeing signs that if/when that happened it wouldn't affect my monthly payment too much). I always knew I could be earning more with those low-earners/no-earners if I'd done a few SEO-type things with them but, again - spare-time thing.
As it is now, I'm seeing more potential for those low-earners/no-earners (at least as long as I continue with the minimal-to-no SEO efforts of my HP past). I've seen a major, major, drop with the earlier, better, earners; and I'm not sure how permanent that is or isn't (or whether those Hubs would do better somewhere else, or under "the old plan/program").
As it is now, I really don't think a lot of those Hubs with improved earnings would do any better anywhere else. Some are just too "casual" in terms of writing. What I don't know, though, is whether those same casual-type Hubs would continue to earn if they weren't among a bunch of my other, more "serious", higher-quality writing, Hubs (so I don't know whether moving the better-piece-of-writing Hubs would hurt my earnings on here very much). I've always aimed for decent grammar, and I've never knowingly done anything spammy; so it isn't as if the actual wording of those "lower quality" Hubs is less than the more "serious-writing" ones. It's just all about level of polish and professionalism. Even with that, though, some of the more folksy-type of Hubs are actually ones that reach readers in a meaningful way - so that goes back to the "what is quality on this particular site these days" question.
So, for now and for any Hubs that have survived earlier trimming efforts (or that don't survive future efforts based only on my earlier reasons for deleting), everything's staying where it is until I see what happens (with guidelines, with "official word", with earnings, etc. etc.) For now, it looks like they'll earn a decent chunk per month. If the Ad Sense earnings go up (even to my earlier, all-time lows), I'll be earning about what (give or take) I was earning before. If the Ad Sense earnings stay super low, I guess I'll continue to be looking at a "bird-in-the-hand" kind of scenario, and having to decide if it's too much of a waste to hang onto that bird in the hand.
Ironically, the big shake-up has forced me to have to stop straddling the fence between being earnings-minded and being enjoyment-writing-minded", and swing the legs over to the "enjoyment-writing" side of the fence. What's that done, however, is make me lean toward not even worrying about pictures (or whatever other capsules are still OK) and just write without worrying about coming up with pictures or videos that don't "come naturally" with the text (because I've never been here to be "all involved with layout", so that aspect of Hubbing has never been one of my "big things" anyway. On the other side, though, if I go with the "enjoyment writing and nothing else thing", I'll be more inclined to writing more "serious" stuff, but I don't know whether de-emphasizing the things like pictures, on even writing that wouldn't necessarily call for it, would result in lower performance on here (in one way or another) or would be counter to what HP sees as the whole idea about what a Hub is. (????)
Since the shake up (actually, in the few weeks following it, and as a result of not really knowing where I should be aiming), I've gone with writing only a few "do-whatever" Hubs just when I've felt like writing. (Well, those and a few Hub-length forum posts - but I don't want a profile full of Hubs about Hub-writing.
) For now, I'm in a holding pattern.
Also ironically, perhaps: As a result of the shake-up, I'm in the process of pulling in every piece of online writing I have (and retain rights to, and when it won't cause conflict with any TOS on any site), and making it all "all the more duplicate content" by posting it (at least temporarily) on a blogger blog (no ads). I'll figure out what to do with it next later. If nothing else, my stuff looks more professional on there than on any writing site, so I can maybe use it as part of my "more serious" writing portfolio.I deleted 20 sales hubs because of non-production for the first year of use. It didn't work out the way I wanted and the URLS were too specific to keep.
Many people are taking their stuff to a different venue. It's understood, they must do what they think is best for them.
I did what I thought I had to do.Counting myself among the "verbose", I can tell you that losing two or three hundred dollars a month (or more) in earnings doesn't feel like a "pat on the head". People with a lot of well written, succinct, but very SEO-focused, Hubs haven't been feeling all that patted on the head in recent days either.
HP is now (as far as I can tell) faced with getting into the better graces of Google and/or doing well in spite of not being in those better graces. It looks to me like all kinds of efforts (from all kinds of people) are being made to one or both of the aims, so I think HP is still very "user friendly". Personally, I'd agree with you about some Hubs that don't have all that many words can be good Hubs if they have the right stuff on them. Then again, it's pretty reasonable for a site that calls itself "a writers' platform" would expect x amount of writing on each Hub.
I don't know... I don't see responding/making adjustments to something that took place outside HubPages as "Draconian". If it makes you feel any better, I took most of my Amazon capsules off (pat-on-the-head that I didn't get, number 2 ).
- Ghost32posted 13 years ago
0Ah, the benefits of being a born loner! Hadn't known about "mass hub deletions" at all.
That said, though: Any time there's change in ANY organization, be it HP, a church group, the military, whatever--there will ALWAYS be a percentage of "defections" that accompany the shift.
Personally, I've got faith in the HP crew. If something isn't working, they'll eventually figure it out and fix it.
Goes back to my old multi level marketing days, when for 20 years I represented a great company...until it eventually imploded, that is. Nothing is forever.
But lots of "broken wing" types, distributors always fearing the worst, would from time to time call me with their concerns. Paraphrased to fit HubPages, my response would be something like:
"I've got two questions and one answer. First question: Does the HP product WORK--that is, are we as authors provided with a workable platform?"
For me, the answer to that would be YES.
"Question #2: When you do earn a paycheck, is the check good and do they send it to you on time?
Again: YES.
"Then...all the rest is SMOKE!"I'd like to "get it on record" (at least on this on "thread-record here") that I've never been at all dissatisfied with HubPages. I've always been dissatisfied with a whole lot of my own Hubs. These days (since the shake-up) I'm still not in the least bit dissatisfied with HubPages. My thing is that, at least for now, I don't know whether to keep doing the same stuff I've always been doing on here or stop writing anything that's written in a more casual style, and only write "professional and polished", objective, articles on this site.
I've got stuff that would meet criteria for "essay" or "opinion piece", and I've got personal-experience stuff that I may have written with the idea of sharing what I've learned from an experience (so it isn't as "purely personal" as something like, "I hate my job." Still, it's obviously personal and first-person. Then, too, I don't know whether it would make sense to any of the more search-engine friendly stuff since search-engine "standards" have changed.
For me, this has been my "write-anything" site. Unlike people who have different accounts for different types of writing, I've been dumping a big mish-mosh of all kinds of writing in together on here. Now, I just need to figure out whether I ought to do some sorting out, pick a side ("casual writing" or "professional, polished, articles only"), or (again) just keep doing what I've always been doing.
I don't know about anyone else's being dissatisfied; but, for me, "voicing a dilemma I've facing" as a result of changes isn't the same as being dissatisfied. It's just saying what the latest dilemma/challenge is for someone who wants his stuff to measure up to standards but who also wants to keep earning reasonably well. This is a great place to write as far as writing sites go. My personal "issue" is that I've pretty much always felt kind of suspended between the "earner/money-focused" writers here and the "here-just-to-write-regardless-of-earnings" writers here. Recent changes have just highlighted a need to better define my own efforts here. That kind of thing is going happen any time someone has built up some writing and/or has spent enough time somewhere that inevitable changes have taken place. I'm fine with it and REALLY don't want anyone to think that addressing any latest "dilemma" is a sign of dissatisfaction or is a complaint.
I just posted the above "discussion" because I haven't seen anyone bringing up the effects of the changes from that angle. There's been plenty of discussion from the "business Hubbers", and plenty from, or about, the "poet-hubbers". Nothing much from the "non-descript" (either who earn well or don't earn much) Hubbers like me.
My concern (not that it's really my business) is that there may be a lot of Hubbers with the same kind of questions/dilemma that I have (because of mixed Hub styles) who may not realize that other Hubbers don't quite know what they should be doing right now, who may feel like they're the only ones who have these questions, and who may delete Hubs unnecessarily (or unwisely).Judowolf, good to know I'm not alone in my (relatively minor) wheel-spinning over some Hubs. (It's also kind of good that you didn't have the chance to get too "all tied up with" the old way things were being done. It sure is kind of messy for some of us right now.
)
I might think about experimenting with turning the new ad program off, once I hit payout.
It isn't actually doing that badly, but the rate of exchange of dollars into Euros is very poor at the moment.You have to remember that adsense converts dollar earnings into Euros as well. I will combine it all at the end of the month, switch the HP ads off for next month and compare the two.
It is hard to tell what is going on right now, because the traffic sources changed so drastically - and are still changing - google definitely rolled something back a few days ago - it may be necessary to redo some hubs and aim them at HP ads and adsense instead of Amazon/ebay. My eBay click values have dropped so badly, I may need to take any eBay capsules off and either leave them with adsense only or switch to Amazon, in case they jeopardize my epn account.
What fun!
Yeah like I said, this is the problem I am faced with, I need that monthly payout at the moment. Glad I get my Adsense money each month
This is the best idea I have heard yet. I would guesstimate HP need to delete half the site - as long as they delete the "right" half - we should be good to go.
- ryankettposted 13 years ago0
That article is also grossly inaccurate!
I'm going to be requesting that it is removed, on the basis of it being entirely factually incorrect.
They have taken my 6 months of earnings between September-February, and assumed that they can double it for my annual earnings. With no regard to the algorithm change which occured at the end of February, and with no consideration to November and December being the most lucrative months of the year.
And, if it isn't removed, I will serve a legal notice. It was also nice of them to put the space back in my username
If the taxman got hold of that, it could bring me serious issues, my tax return will be submitted in a couple of weeks and it won't show $27000 of Hubpages earnings.
Sadly, that would probably (just about) represent my total earnings for the tax year from all sources.I'm sure if the algorithm didn't change I would have almost reached that on Hubpages NEXT tax year.... but it did change, so it does kinda make somebody telling the world that I make decent money suck about fifteen times more than it would have sucked if true
Hopefully google will do another update in a few months and decide Hubpages is great again! Would certainly love traffic to return to pre-algo levels for all of us
That article has just been removed
Edit: Oh, nope, it hasn'tWho knows, somebody who was lurking on here at the time, it was a week or so ago when that idiot came on bragging about getting $7 an article. Wouldn't be surprised if it were him, although it could me anybody.
I can envisage somebody knocking on my door with a baseball bat asking for protection money, my address is easily found through whois reports!
Truth is I'm pretty skint to be honest, it came at the wrong time really, I would have given it a wry smile if it were posted in December
The point is that I earnt nowhere near $27000 in the past 12 months, I had a few months of good earnings and then the whole thing went pop.
I would be very happy with $27000 from Hubpages this year, but the way things are going, and with Panda Global coming, I would take $18000 and wouldn't be suprised if I only took $15000!
Excerptz will reach the top 20000 I reckon, but it has taken me four months to get that site even slightly moving, so Extractz will probably be one which works for me in 2012
Fair enough, although you can define the geographical location on the keyword tool right?
At the end of the day, only you can know what is working for you, and only I can know what is working for me.
I have sussed out that the HubAd program is working for me, probably due to one or two particular Hubpages (which you can guess, secretly).
You just need to worry about what is working for you, which you already are doing of course
Now, if HubAd could defined to be turned off and on on a hub-by-hub basis then we could have a REAL conversation, and really use it to our advantage, couldn't we?
That way, you could leave it off of your important eBay hubs, I could work out whether it is a handful of hubs making me all this HubAd dosh.
That is probably the real solution, irrespective of how they have programmed it. Just like Kontera, on or off, not all or nothing.
Im sure any publisher can work out how to make HPads work for them. A CPM ad program is not a new marvel and creating new content or repurposing/retitling old content to best optimize to it is not a mind boggler for me.
Just pointing out that any Hp claims that they have a tool that can compare potential adsense ads cant be taken at face value, until they are either more forthcoming about the "hows" or they show more technical prowess in other basics.
As of now , a 12 year old with an imacro program can autopost to HP all day and their revenue potential tool is about as accurate as rolling chicken bones.
maybe its a reference to the original post - why ...hubs , and I would say its because experienced publishers are yet to be impressed by the Hp reaction and communication skills. Ive been waiting 36 hours to see 5 hubs that just needed a few amazon capsules removed to be republished. yet somehow, staff has time to be writing in a staff challenge?
Im surprised that no one else is bothered by the conflict of interest that staff even writing hubs suggests. especially, considering all the asinine conspiracy theories always thrown aroundWell, now that I know this thread is being monitored by staff, I'll ask a question, Maddie. Most of the badly written hubs I find are in the "latest" hubs. Most of the time they are written by new foreign writers without a firm grasp of the English language.
Usually if one of their hubs is bad, they all are. Why in the heck don't you guys make these folks submit a sample of their writing so we won't have to spend unnecessary time removing hubs which shouldn't ever be allowed to be published in the first place? Is this such a complicated task to perform? Or what is the deal?
I look forward to your response.
The snakeWe speak the language from birth, Izzy. Sure, there are some who can contribute well written articles despite English not being their native tongue, but I find them to be the exception, rather than the rule.
Besides, I would have no problem if ALL new writers were placed on probation before given free reign to publish. Old writers too, if that's what it takes to prevent some of the junk we have to sort through.
Is it wrong to want to prevent articles, which may give HP a bad rep, from being published? Isn't it harder to find them once they get through the door? Unbelievable!
I did not mean to hurt your heart, i did notice that many of you mentioned being to busy to participate, but qualifying my statement would have not helped me vent.
Its obvious that you work hard.
When mine come up in the queue just skip em, 48 hours of being unpublished will have killed them as they will have been reindexed as being "not found"I must be terrible at typing "sincere" as I meant that at face value.
I really care less about the pittance those 5 articles may make or lose compared to making someone feel unappreciated, your effort are/were appreciated. I do think at an individual level staff interaction at this site is very impressive, it seems you just need more of you!
I am highly critical and near impossible to please in matters of business, it works for me...but it prob comes off much harsher in text than I intend. I do appreciate your individual effort and often mention how staff response is reasonable and punctual when discussing hubpages
You can't please all of the people all of time, but you can please some of the people some of the time. Many of us can appreciate that things aren't easy in the Hubpages office right now, and personally I can wait much longer than a month for the site to change the course that it has taken over 5 years. People should be more patience.
But, I doubt that Sunforged actually subscribes to that theory, I noticed a clear shift in his feelings towards staff when his blog posts were censored. I don't know who did that, and whether that was an official Hubpages policy or the choice of one individual, but he was probably right to feel a bit murked by that. His comment could have been published but ignored. Irrespective of whether it was felt that his comment was counter-productive, he has offered his fair share to the community since he popped onto the scene.
Hope that your thingy went well
If you genuinely think that the more impressions = more money with the HubAd program, then you and me both know that we could rinse out on this.
I will be starting a new account with "Who is the wife of....", "how tall is....", etc as titles
- Nelle Hoxieposted 13 years ago0
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