Moving the U.S. Embassy to Jerusalem

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  1. peoplepower73 profile image93
    peoplepower73posted 17 months ago

    How does moving the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem and declaring it the Capital of Israel create peace in the region?

    1. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 17 months agoin reply to this

      Which country, outside Israel, has world opinion dictating where they can put their capital?  Which country do we locate our embassy in neither the capital nor a suburb of that capital?  Do we have a right to tell foreign countries where they shall put their capital?  If so can we also dictate the plot of land within the city we choose for them?  Perhaps how large it is, what shape it is, who the architect is, etc.?

      1. peoplepower73 profile image93
        peoplepower73posted 17 months agoin reply to this

        Wilderness:  You didn't answer the question.  I'll ask it again: "How does moving the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem and declaring it the Capital of Israel create peace in the region?"

        By peace in the region, I mean for the Palestinians.  The have been treated lower than dirt by the Israeli's for years.  They believe it is their God-given right to colonize and occupy the Palestinian territory which has been Palestine's homeland for thousands of years. Israel builds walls just like Trump wants to control those people and makes refugees out of them in their own land.  Humans make borders, not nature.

        1. Credence2 profile image81
          Credence2posted 17 months agoin reply to this

          Why is declaring Jerusalem the capital such a big deal?

          The final status of Jerusalem has always been one of the most difficult and sensitive questions in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. For years, US policy has been to avoid declaring Jerusalem the capital of Israel in the absence of an Israeli-Palestinian peace deal, as the Palestinians also claim Jerusalem as their capital. It was argued that a unilateral decision would break with international consensus and prejudge an issue that was supposed to be left to negotiations.

          Recognizing Jerusalem as the capital has also moved the United States a big step closer to relocating the embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem, which would be seen as cementing Israeli sovereignty over the city.

          ----------------

          Leave it to Trump to just trumple over a delicate negotiation situation and ongoing peace efforts by definitively taking a single side and exacerbating matters, unnecessarily.

          Because of this and other recent cases of poor judgement in the realm of international diplomacy, I take my side against him!!

          1. GA Anderson profile image91
            GA Andersonposted 17 months agoin reply to this

            Hey there Cred, let me grab your comment to make a response relative to your thought that Pres. Trump, using poor judgement, just trampled over delicate international negotiations.

            Without going into the details, just take a look at the basics:

            U.S. presidents have been trying to broker a peace deal since Carter's 1978 Camp David effort. Roughly speaking, for 40 years. Some presidents have tried harder than others, but all have tried.

            Generally speaking, each president's efforts traveled the "delicate negotiations" path. Some tried more forceful economic and diplomatic efforts than others, but we know that all have failed, (the reasons are beside the point of the point I am making)

            Our presidents have acknowledged Jerusalem as Israel's capitol since 1995. Over 20+ years, and three presidents.

            So now, a fourth president changes tact, and you can only view it as a trampling of protocol? Do you believe that a fourth president should stick to a policy tact that has shown itself to be a failure for 40 years? I am not certain your poor judgement accusation is pointed in the right direction.It sounds like you would prefer a 'participation trophy' instead of a real effort.

            GA

            1. Credence2 profile image81
              Credence2posted 17 months agoin reply to this

              It is better than clearly antagonizing the other "side" of this. Are we now saying, whatever Israel does were are going to go along with? That is unless you are saying that we should abrogate our traditional role as peace brokers in the region. Clearly taking one side is saying just that.

              1. GA Anderson profile image91
                GA Andersonposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                Well bud, considering that 40 year history of our efforts, I am not sure this antagonism will make any difference at all - negatively, but could there be a chance that a new U.S. stance might at least prompt a new consideration by those you fear antagonizing? Now, that is just a thought, not a position, but ... for 40 years we did this and they did that. We rewrapped the "this" - multiple times, and they still did the same "that."  I don't think I can agree that another rewrap is better than a new effort.

                Sorry if I left a miss-impression, I tried to stick to just two points; 1) we have tried the same policy, (diplomatic negotiations), for 40 years - and they all failed. 2) For 20+ years, (and three presidents), we have committed, as a nation, to recognizing Jerusalem as Israel's capitol - but failed to live-up to our declaration. I don't see anything there that said, or implied, we go along with "... whatever Israel does ..."

                But you are right on your final point. If our traditional role as a peacemaker can only follow a 40 year track record of failure - then maybe we should abrogate it. We sure as hell haven't been very good at it. If we aren't willing to try to achieve, instead of just holding our place as a participant, then maybe it is time to let someone else try.

                GA

                1. Credence2 profile image81
                  Credence2posted 17 months agoin reply to this

                  GA, the antagonism has been evident in region already, the "new consideration" will most likely be entirely negative. We have not a good track record trying to reconcile irreconcilable parties, I acknowledge that. The 1995 agreement or pledge was not carried out for legitimate reasons, theneed for a settlement as to who can get to claim Jerusalem as capital.


                  Obviously, Trump has given up on the prospect, but I think he is just ideologically hostile to the cause of the Palestinian and want to suck up to his Evangelical following. It has nothing to do with fatigue in regards to the negotiation accords.

                  This "recognition" is what Israel wanted, isn't it? Trump is saying "to hell with it, let the chips fall where they may". This outcome, in my opinion, is only going to make a bad situation worse, and Trump broke it so now he owns it. So we resign to letting helter skelter rule the day?

                  1. GA Anderson profile image91
                    GA Andersonposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                    Hi Cred,

                    I know the answer is "politics," (the reason for the acknowledgement, and the postponement), but, think about you just said: We acknowledged Jerusalem as Israel's capital for legitimate reasons, but didn't follow through because whose capitol it was hadn't been settled.

                    Well, if our words mean nothing, (they didn't "settle" the issue), then why say them? That was rhetorical of course, I know the answer is "politics," but shouldn't our word as a nation mean something?

                    If we didn't have the courage of our words, then we should have eaten them, and rescinded the pledge. That would have taken presidential courage. So now, a president comes along and abides by the pledge. And for that he is a trampling fool with poor judgement.

                    Geesh!

                    ps. A Wilderness comment had me scrambling to look-up "Dane-geld," you should take a look at the idea.

                    GA

            2. Don W profile image83
              Don Wposted 17 months agoin reply to this

              It took over 80 years for sectarian violence between Irish Republicans, Loyalists and the British government to be brought to an end in Northern Ireland. It took over 40 years for apartheid to be brought to an end in South Africa.

              Why would the Israeli-Palestinian conflict be resolved faster than any other intractable, socio-political conflict with deeply embedded historical, religious, racial components? Do you think that's a reasonable expectation? What part of human history is that expectation based on?

              1. GA Anderson profile image91
                GA Andersonposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                Hi Don W., I don't know the details of either of your examples, so I am unable to make comparisons, but, my "40 year" point was not a reference that the issue should have been resolved by then, but that we had been trying the same method for that amount of time, and it repeatedly failed.

                Based on that point,  no, I don't know what time-frame a "reasonable expectation" would/should  encompass. But I do know that old adage about the definition of insanity.

                GA

                1. Don W profile image83
                  Don Wposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                  Sure, I guess the point is that there are examples in history of similar intractable conflicts which were eventually successfully resolved through the "delicate negotiations path".

                  These historical examples (the disbanding of the terrorist group ETA in Spain is another) all included moments of progress and failure over the course of multiple decades.

                  With hindsight we can look back on some of those moments of failure as being part of an iterative process that eventually enabled peace. Is it possible that, because of their nature, these types of conflicts are only resolvable through this type of iterative process, which will inevitably include failures along the way? 

                  If so, perhaps it's not yet time to abandon the delicate negotiations path. Doing the same thing and expecting a different result is only insanity if there is no evidence that it brings about the desired result. We know that sensible diplomacy has resolved conflicts of this type in the past.

                  You're absolutely right, the current president has changed tack. But is that part of a well thought out strategy that considers all the pros and cons, or is it because he only has one tack: brash? Based on everything I've seen I think the latter is more likely.

                  Brash is great when needed. But just as brash was not what lead to peace in Northern Ireland, or the  end of apartheid, or the disbanding of ETA, perhaps brash isn't what's needed in the Middle East right now either. Brash often leads to bloodshed.

                  A 10 lb hammer is great if you need to smash things. Not so useful if you need to fix a Swiss watch. The Middles East has been smashed already. I don't think Trump has the necessary tools to help fix it.

                  1. GA Anderson profile image91
                    GA Andersonposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                    Don, those are all valid points - probably. But I don't know if they are or aren't. The first question that comes to mind is what broke the stalemate in your examples? For apartheid was it a breakthrough in negotiations, or was it Mandela? The ETA, The IRA, what turned the tide? Did one side just outlast the other?

                    I would have the same question concerning mediation participants. Did any declare an official position, and then ignore it? Was such action a benefit or detriment to negotiations? Were any of your examples turned by a bold move by either side, or just a continuous plodding of massaging previous offers?

                    To the final "10 lb. hammer" thought ... comes another question, "Is living up to a national declaration brash or bold?"

                    I don't know the answers to those questions - my list is already too long to research those first questions, and I only have an opinion on the last one.

                    GA

                  2. wilderness profile image96
                    wildernessposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                    No, Trump doesn't have the tools to fix it.  Neither did Obama, or anyone in Europe.  The only people in the world that have the tools to fix the middle are those living in the middle east.

        2. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 17 months agoin reply to this

          It won't stop it, it won't exacerbate it.

          "Which country do we locate our embassy in neither the capital nor a suburb of that capital?  Do we have a right to tell foreign countries where they shall put their capital?"

        3. Kenny MG profile image69
          Kenny MGposted 17 months agoin reply to this

          Not true, not Palestinians but Israelite's for thousands of years. I don't know who you got your history from but hear this. That is if you will be brave and put prejudice aside! The people of Israel lived in the land from as early as 1000 BC. They were removed from the land by the Assyrians in the 8 century BC, and people from Jordan, Babylon, Arabia etc., Arabs from all over the region placed there. This was the policy of the Assyrians under King Sennacherib, when they capture a land they remove the dwellers and repopulated by foreigners. The land was first called Canaan, but when the Israelite dwell there it, it changed to Israel under King David. Successive Empires Persians, Greeks, Romans suppressed the Jews. With the exception of Cyrus the great of Persia who gave the Jews limited access of return. When the Roman Empire defeated the Greeks, they ruled the area. The Jews petition them for independence and was refused. The Jews then raged guerrilla war against the Romans, who as an insult to the Israelite renamed the area Palestine. This was because the Romans sought to know who was against Israel and history reveal their ancient enemy was the Philistines. This is where the name Palestine came from! In 70 AD, the Romans, under General Titus, destroyed the Jewish temple, a temple where Christ had worshipped. The Jews were slaughtered by the Thousands, so they were very much there throughout. The Ottoman Turks, that tried to invade Europe, occupied the land for over 4 hundred years until they were defeated by the British in WWI and later was given mandate over what now is Palestine. The Arabs built their Mosque on the site of the Jewish Temple built by King Solomon of Israel, because they claim Mohammad replaced Christianity and is the final messenger. Under the Turks and other empires the Jews were always suppressed and the Arabs given more opportunity. The crusades which fought against Muslim Saladin tried to remove the Arabs from the Holy Land, failed but they were not sympathetic to the Jews either. The British was petitioned by the Jews for independence, but they too refused the Jews and offer the Arabs more freedom in the land because the Arabs have Oil. Yasser Arafat nor Arabs never lay claim to Jerusalem in his 1960 article of memorandum. Until it became a political issue, Arafat rewrite the article to include Jerusalem as his capital. Europeans has never been sympathetic to the Jews, and in every country was abused and killed. Hitler would never have the Jews to kill if successive empires never keep them from their original homeland, Israel. It was never Palestinians!. Europeans always voted in the UN against the Jews. There can be peace when the world see through the Arabs lies, and stop using the UN to punish Israel in occupying their homeland that has been stolen for centuries! When the Arabs stop claiming Jerusalem and enter genuine peace talks, it will have positive results. When the world stop listening to the Terrorist, Hamas etc. who swore to the total annihilation of Israel, and talk peace.

          1. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 17 months agoin reply to this

            LOL  As the tale goes, when Israel first came to the "promised land" (now the country of Israel) they found the Canaanites already living there.  They told the Canaanites that their god had give it to them - get out.  When (of course) the Canaanites refused to leave their farms, their cities and their homes, Israel waged war, through a series of battles beginning with Jericho, and eventually drove the owners (those that survived multiple attacks from a foreign people) out of their lands.

            If you're going to go back to ancient history to prove ownership, better tell the whole story, don't you think?

            1. profile image0
              ahorsebackposted 17 months agoin reply to this

              Doesn't that then go right back to the other half of all geo -political  stories - colonization ? And  if it does we will all be playing  regional "musical chairs"all OVER the world ?  Lets give America back to who then ?  The vikings or the land bridge transient natives ?

              1. peoplepower73 profile image93
                peoplepower73posted 17 months agoin reply to this

                ahorseback:  Let's just  destroy your neighborhood and build new settlements for the Native Americans, make you and your neighbors refugees and build walls so that you can't get back to your old neighborhood, then kill anybody who approaches the settlements.   

                If you are going to conquer a country or a people, then conquer it for God's sake and let the people assimilate into the new country.  Don't make refugees out them and put them on reservations.  That is what we did and it is not right.

              2. wilderness profile image96
                wildernessposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                I wouldn't say "colonization" so much as "conquering.  As of 10,000 years ago, nearly all the land on earth had been colonized.  To be sure, much of it was pretty thin, but colonized.

                1. peoplepower73 profile image93
                  peoplepower73posted 17 months agoin reply to this

                  wilderness:  I agree with you.  I shouldn't have used the word colonize.  The Israeli's have built settlements in the Palestinian territories.  The Palestinians are not conquered.  They have been made refugees on their own land.

              3. Kenny MG profile image69
                Kenny MGposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                The limited space in a hub cannot give the total picture of any people or country. But Israel have more history than any other, in fact being invaded and its people suppressed more than 44 times. If all the powers that invade the land lay claim,today, Israel would still have right of land. The Canaanites cease to exist, and Israel continues to live their even if only a remnant, during the periods of invasion.Before you should want to ask a question you should present the historical facts. So, yes, now we start to get things straight. But even your question and subsequent answer is bot cynical and and an attempt to hide the historical facts. And mentioning the true history of the Canaanites from who the land was taken means now you are focusing.

                First you seem cynical about the biblical records, but history and secular records, British Museum, Egyptian Museum and  hieroglyphics, thousands of records in existence prove the accuracy of the bible. Second, the Canaanites were not Arabs, and certainly not Palestinians! Yes historically people travel, invade land, took it over and rule it. With Israel it was a case of God given the land, because the Canaanites were so evil, God had to remove them.  Every people and nation have an history, we need to know where are coming from and where we are going. But to deny a people a homeland is shear cruelty! Look on the size of the nations where these Palestinian Arabs came from to flock into Israel. Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Jordan, even Syrians have flocked into the land. Yet it is a tiny strip in comparison to those lands, why would they leave it to fight over Israel, a land 10 times smaller than Florida? Why then don't we address the issue of them leaving those vast lands to fight over a tiny landscape? Can you and the world not see that this is politics?

                To repeat myself, the Arabs historically never like Israel. One reason was, because they have polytheism worship and have a Panthian of gods, and Israel preach one God! The first set of wars was to prove their many gods was stronger than Israel one God. Only when Mohammad started preaching a single god in line with Israel that they gave up polytheism. However that does not mean that Israel's God has now abandon Israel and chose the Arabs. So that building their Mosque on the temple mound where Israel had their Temple don't mean their religion is authentic!

                But not to go on repeating history, the Arabs were never claiming Israel until western powers got involved. So this became part of the geopolitics of the world. If they Arabs were not keeping Israel out, If the Romans, Turks and British had given the people independence we would not be in this situation today. Other people returning to their lands are far and few between.

                So Europeans occupying Indian lands in North and South America does not apply, because I don't see vast numbers of Indians waging war on America, or calling for their total annihilation! The west needs to get out of those peoples affairs and let them settle their issue. Peace will come when the Arabs, under the guise of Palestinians stop calling for the total annihilation of Israel. They have the power to solve it, but stop using Jerusalem as a bargaining chip.

                So though you may pose a meaningful question, the answers you expected may not be the ones that you have got.

                1. wilderness profile image96
                  wildernessposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                  That's what I said, isn't it?  The Isaraelites claimed their god gave them the land that others (Canaanites) lived on, the others refused to leave so the Israelites killed them and took the land by force.

                  Now they want to cry "unfair" when somebody else does it to them, saying it was their land that they won by killing the rightful owners.

                  1. Kenny MG profile image69
                    Kenny MGposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                    Wilderness, the only 'unfair' Israel is crying is first, why the facts of history is not being told? Second why, the west, Europeans and Americans, such as yourself hates them so much? Why that western media are so easily swayed by the Palestinian and Arabs, that all you see is Palestinians sufferings. Hamas, declared terrorist swear the total annihilation of Israel, and when it defends itself it is accused by the western media as heavy handed. Yet Hamas execute more Palestinians weekly, than those who  dies in clashes with Israel yearly. Whats their crime? They collude with the enemy Israel! But the western media ignores and fail to report this. Just before the 1948 Balfour declarations, the Arabs saw it coming, and so more Arabs flood the land of Israel, to prevent it being declared the new state of Israel. That led the nations from where they came, Egypt, Jordan, Syria among others to launch all out war, but they were defeated.

                    I need not touch what happens to Jews in Europe, during the times of the enlightenment. First the Jews who now accepted and found dwellings in many European states, were now turned against. That caused Hitler to launch the final solution, the death camps. The Arabs turned them out of their homeland, and now Europe didn't want them. Hitler killed them in his gas chambers. The Arabs didn't want them in the Middle East, Europeans and even America refused them at one point, the ship  on which many hundreds were on trying to escape European persecution was diverted to Cuba.

                    Plainly in the 1970's when the Arabs launch their oil embargo, was because the west including America started to show some acceptance of the Jewish nations. The Arabs didn't like it, so they withheld oil and plunge the worlds economy to the brink of disaster.

                    So Wilderness, you know a little history, but you only refer to those which suits your inclinations. You can only see one enemy, and offender and in your case, only Israel fits the bill. The point I made previously, I must make again. The size of Syria, Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia where these people came from yearly to fight against Israel,put together competes with the size of America. Israel in size is 10 times smaller than Florida. So why the fight for such a small piece of land, why does the Arabs want it so badly?

                    I say to you again, it is all about politics! When western, and the UN meddlers stop meddling, stop listen to Palestinians ;lies. peace will come. But the Arabs have oil, Israel don't, so they will always be accused by the western press. They will continue to be painted in a negative light. For the life is a daily struggle for survival against terrorist who are fuelled by Arabic oil money and the western press.

                    For us who believe the bible,it is politics, but much more than that. It boils down to Israel's God verses Mohammad's god! The battle between good and evil. Evil never wins in the end, truth and righteousness will triumph. The times of the gentiles, (quoting Christ), must be fulfilled concerning the Holy Land. Some has and some yet to be fulfilled. So you like the rest can continue to be cynical, The day will come when the smirk will be wiped from your faces.

                2. profile image74
                  Hxprofposted 17 months agoin reply to this

                  You bring up a point that is rarely mentioned: the vast majority of the so called :"Palestinians" (there really is no such nationality) came from surrounding countries after the Balfour Declaration.  Jewish immigration also increased, but they, at the time, had no homeland.  Then when the land was divided by the UN, those that came to Palestine from their homelands decided to fight the Jews over this territory.  It was a colossal blunder which cost them a lot of territory that would otherwise be theirs.

    2. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 17 months agoin reply to this

      A lot of people need to read the history of the Israelis  for one thing , The religion  of Islam was born when , around 700 AD  so they have very little say about who belongs in Jerusalem ,   Also in the beginning  of Israel 1947-1948  Five [5]  leaders of Arab nations told  the Palestinians "Get out of there and make room for the displaced Jews .............

      One question , Does  France , Russia or China  have any say if we wanted to move the US capital from Washington DC.to Biloxi Miss. ?  No ! It would be up to the American people if we wanted to move said capital , no one else in the world has a say .   How many US. presidents in the campaigns have promised to honor Israel's decision to claim Jerusalem as their capital?
      All of them ?

      So, Trump honors his original word ! Wow , let's hang him ?

  2. Wesman Todd Shaw profile image95
    Wesman Todd Shawposted 17 months ago

    Eliminating questions creates stability.

  3. peoplepower73 profile image93
    peoplepower73posted 17 months ago

    ahroseback and Wilderness:  Let's go back a little further than 1947.  Let's go to right after WWI.  After the British and the French carved the mid-east into zones, they didn't know what to do with the Israel/Palestinian territory.

    Foreign Secretary Arthur James Balfour writes an important letter to Britain's most illustrious Jewish citizen, Baron Lionel Walter Rothschild, expressing the British government's support for a Jewish homeland in Palestine. The letter would eventually become known as the Balfour Declaration.

    Here is the Balfour Declaration:

    "His Majesty's government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."

    In other words, "Here Israel, you do with the Palestinians what you will.  It's not my problem."

    It turns out, there was no border between Israel and Palestine, then and to this day, the border does not exists.  Israel annexed it by colonizing the Palestinian territory and stealing it from Palestine.  They actually bulldozed down Palestinian houses and made refugees out the people living in their own homes and territory and then prevented them from becoming citizens of Israel.  You tell me who the biggest terrorist are?

    1. profile image74
      Hxprofposted 17 months agoin reply to this

      As I understand it, in 1947, which is where we have to start to understand current conflicts, Palestine was divided into Israeli and Palestinian (or non-Israeli territory by the UN.  There were borders on the map.  What am I missing?

    2. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 17 months agoin reply to this

      Peoplepower ;
      One , Jerusalem could have been divided  between the Palestinians and the Israelis, Israel has even  offered that division  in the efforts to treaty  in the past ,  but when the charter of Palestine  calls for the destruction of the Jews that Hitler  obliterated the other  half of ;  why should Israel  compromise this time?

      Two ,  in ten years time alone over ten thousand rockets and missiles have been fired into the Israeli people's neighborhoods . And yet You and the media want us all to believe that the palestinian children paraded in front of the Al Jazeera cameras are victims ?   What are eight and ten year old kids doing  protesting international borders  ?

      Three , Your biased media is listening to the Palestinians main voice of Al Jazeera  to get all of it's facts , all of it's statistics ,   and then selling them to the western world .  This is nothing but a propaganda war against the Jews , bought and paid for by Iran for one , targeted from Syria with Iranian weapons to "Kill Jews "and has been from the beginning .

      Four , Who's side is the American left and media obviously on ?Syria's , Iran's ? We can't see through the masks , The Palestinians wear the same masks that the deep state left here wears ,the mask of  chaos and  anarchy?

      Tell me I'm wrong !

      1. peoplepower73 profile image93
        peoplepower73posted 17 months agoin reply to this

        ahorseback:

        a: One , Jerusalem could have been divided  between the Palestinians and the Israelis, Israel has even  offered that division  in the efforts to treaty  in the past ,  but when the charter of Palestine  calls for the destruction of the Jews that Hitler  obliterated the other  half of ;  why should Israel  compromise this time?

        M: You are wrong because, Israel never wanted to share the land with them.  If they did, why did they bulldoze down their houses and colonize the Palestinians territory?  That is a game Israel plays, saying they want peace and then continue to colonize the territory.  As far as Hitler goes, that is precisely what Israel has done to the Palestinians..  They have created ghettos out where the Palestinians live.  It they wanted peace why have they created walls and a myriad of checkpoints to keep the Palestinians out  of Israel?  They don't want Hamas to go away.  That is their excuse for continuing to colonize the Palestinian territories.  Pleas show me the "Charter of Palestine."

        a: Two ,  in ten years time alone over ten thousand rockets and missiles have been fired into the Israeli people's neighborhoods . And yet You and the media want us all to believe that the palestinian children paraded in front of the Al Jazeera cameras are victims ?   What are eight and ten year old kids doing  protesting international borders  ?

        M:  What international borders are you talking about?  What would you do as an 8 or 10 year old that had your house and land taken away from you?

        Israel uses military equipment including fighter/bombers  bought from the U.S. to take out the Palestinians including the children.

        a: Three , Your biased media is listening to the Palestinians main voice of Al Jazeera  to get all of it's facts , all of it's statistics ,   and then selling them to the western world .  This is nothing but a propaganda war against the Jews , bought and paid for by Iran for one , targeted from Syria with Iranian weapons to "Kill Jews "and has been from the beginning .

        M:  I don't listen to Al Jezeera, but I do research and analysis and draw my own conclusions.  I have written several articles on the conflict between Israel and Palestine.  It is not based on propaganda.  It is based on my understanding of the region and based on verifiable facts.

        a:  Four , Who's side is the American left and media obviously on ?Syria's , Iran's ? We can't see through the masks , The Palestinians wear the same masks that the deep state left here wears ,the mask of  chaos and  anarchy?

        M:  Now you did it by mentioning the "secret word"...the Deep State.  Now I know you get your information from Trump''s Minister of Propaganda, Sean Hannity. As far as chaos goes, your glorious leader wins the prize for chaos.  He thrives on chaos and drama.

        a; Tell me I'm wrong !

        M:  O.K. You are wrong!!!  Here are my articles on the subject:

        https://hubpages.com/politics/Why-Israe … t-Conflict

        https://hubpages.com/politics/Names-of-Terrorist-Groups

        https://hubpages.com/politics/The-Four- … e-Mid-East


        Tell me I'm wrong !

        1. profile image0
          ahorsebackposted 17 months agoin reply to this

          Peoplepower ; Well you are in great company criticizing Israel , today in fact in Germany Neo -Nazi's  critisized Isreal , In Greece the Communists criticized Israel  . So you are not alone diplomatically !    How conveniently you've  forgetten  WHY Israel and HER children were evicted from their homes all over Europe by Hitler  for one  the communists for another .  Russia , Poland , France ..............name one European nation and name the enemies of the Jewish people .

          Yes , 10,000 rockets and missiles in ten years Peoplepower .  WHY DO YOU think the US does supply Israel with planes , patriot missiles  , defensive weaponry , and diplomatic support ? Because no one else does !

          Stop and imagine Iranian , Syrian and so Palestinian rockets  being thrown into your neighborhood  since the beginning of Israel , for over half a century .   Still you side with the likes of Iran over Israel ?   Why ,  perhaps you were bullied by a Jewish kid in kindergarten ?    I thought you were a veteran of the US military  or was it the one on the other side ?

          Have you read a history book yet ? You obviously suffer the liberal "History of Today  " not acknowledging any of the past history  that I've accused you of before and that liberals seem to suffer from today. .

          1. peoplepower73 profile image93
            peoplepower73posted 17 months agoin reply to this

            ahorseback:  I haven't forgotten about how the NAZIs committed genocide of the Jews.  Have you ever heard Netanyahu  use the term "transport."  Do you even know what that means? He wants to transport the Palestinians to an Island some place. He would love to be able to kill all the Palestinians, but he knows he could never get away with it. 

            You don't get it do you? Stop and Imagine your house being destroyed by Israeli soldiers so that the Israeli's can colonize where you live.  You, your family, and neighbors are left without homes and become refugees in your own country as you watch new homes being built where you once lived.  I don't side with Iran.  Did your read my articles yet?  Why would Netanyahu want peace?  He would have to give up land and colonies to the Palestinians. 

            There is no way of putting the toothpaste back in the tube.  You are going to have to stop making false assumptions about me.  You are so far off base.  I don't hate the Jewish people per se, but I do think Netanyahu is evil and very one sided about Israel.   Even while prior peace talks were taking place, he continued to develop colonies in Palestine.  Yes, it's supposed to be their God given right, but if you read my articles, you will know that Jews and Arabs both came from Abraham.

  4. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 17 months ago

    https://usercontent1.hubstatic.com/14041390.jpg


    https://usercontent2.hubstatic.com/14041391.jpg


    https://usercontent1.hubstatic.com/14041392.jpg

    Peoplepower ; These pictures show the cannon fodder that you want us to believe is fair rule as to all these protesters , This is the "diplomacy" that you defend of Hamas , Palestine , Syria and Iran ?   Who do you think put's these kids in uniform and the subsequent dead victims up in front of the camera's ?  But it's Israeli that's at fault here ? Perhaps Peoplepower , You need to go and read a real history book of Israel , of Palestine , and drop your subscription to Al Jazeera .

    1. Don W profile image83
      Don Wposted 17 months agoin reply to this

      The problem with trying . . .

      https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a5/86/35/a58635e0f56a2fb3dee81635cb9f45bd.gif

      . . . to explain a complex social issue . . .

      https://i.pinimg.com/564x/25/d6/99/25d699d3752a34adf8c40487a0d2242a.jpg

      . . . with nothing but memes or photos . . .

      http://www.palestinechronicle.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/arresting_children_2_intifada.jpg

      . . . is that the images often . . .

      http://saudigazette.com.sa/uploads/imported_images/2015/11/me022.jpg.pagespeed.ce.qq37L-tWMl.jpg

      . . . don't tell the whole  story.

      Do you see how easy it is to create a narrative with images?

    2. peoplepower73 profile image93
      peoplepower73posted 17 months agoin reply to this

      ahorseback:  Sorry, you made the wrong assumptions.  I don't subscribe to Al Jazeera.  But as you will see in my previous reply, I have done the research and analysis of the the conflicts in the mid-east and have drawn my own conclusions, not like you, where you post a picture of armed kids without knowing the back story of why they are armed.  I have read the real history books of Israel and probably know more about the Israeli Palestinian conflict then you ever imagined.

  5. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 17 months ago

    Another Israeli issue that needs addressing   is that the incredible power of the western media is now waging international wars , When western news media incite , promotes and manifests lies on front pages , Just how many palestinian deaths is the western media  directly causing by it's own misleading agenda's of alt-reality ?

    Israel ALSO shows incredible restraint on their borders and deserves credit for not killing more of these border terrorists and protesters  .   When Hamas shields it's terror acts  with armed and uniformed children in the front lines ;  the news media shows the bleeding bodies of  the then "poor victims " ;   The media then displays  IT'S OWN  responsibility  for death and destruction .

  6. peoplepower73 profile image93
    peoplepower73posted 17 months ago

    Kenny MG:

    I wrote this article based on my research and analysis. 

    https://hubpages.com/politics/Why-Israe … t-Conflict

  7. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 17 months ago

    Well if , especially as the left whines about constantly , we have to stop manipulating cultures , conquering -colonialism then why all the hype about Israel  , a people most colonized , conquered , shifted , shaken and stirred ? All America has done in Israel is try to save the remaining half of a culture left over from the european Holocaust  .  A holocaust perpetrated by default by not just Hitler  but ALL of Europe and Russia .  A holocaust  encouraged in one way or another  by half of the countries in the world .

    The news media is hyping one more phony outrage and the people here are swallowing it  whole ,   is the story accurrate , fair and balanced ? No.   Is it  somewhat true , of course .   But the greater evil is of the media   manipulated" front lines" where children are marched in front of cameras , where truck loads of humanitarian aid are turned away by soldiers at the gates ,  where ONCE AGAIN , the U.N. stands by in blue helmets and does nothing , all of which  is making the Israeli -Palestine a low ratings soap opera , except of course by Trump resisters .

  8. peoplepower73 profile image93
    peoplepower73posted 17 months ago

    GA:  I never thought I would say this, but thank you.  Here is the elephant in the room that no one sees.

    http://ifamericaknew.org/stat/usaid.html

    1. GA Anderson profile image91
      GA Andersonposted 17 months agoin reply to this

      Oh my, is that like getting the KKK's endorsement? :-)

      I will accept your thanks as directed at the "honest broker" thought. As for the further inferences of your link - no thanks.

      GA

    2. profile image0
      ahorsebackposted 17 months agoin reply to this

      On the other side of your elephant is the fact that you have absolutely no say in the fact that the capital of Israel is Jerusalem , so why not have all embassies in Jerusalem  if Israel wishes it to be so ?
      It's called quite simply "none of our business "! Especially you who are so against our "sticking our noses in where they don't belong" globally .

      1. peoplepower73 profile image93
        peoplepower73posted 17 months agoin reply to this

        ahorsback:  If it's called none of our business, why do you side with Israel?

        1. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 17 months agoin reply to this

          Because it is their business?

        2. profile image0
          ahorsebackposted 17 months agoin reply to this

          Peoplepower , If ever there is a nation , culture or a people more persecuted than the Jewish in this world all through history and deserving of the attentions of a big brother , then Israel is the one and probably the only nation we should be defending  .

          The historians will paint this cooperation between America and Israel any color they wish .  For one , when someone like Israel is attacked on almost a daily basis by rockets  ,  suicide vests or even rocks slung from a slingshot   by all the Islamic hate filled nations at their borders , someone has to step up and at least recognize the state of Israel's wishes for diplomatic locations . Do you realize that within a couple hours drive in any direction there are enemies at Israel's gates .

          Peoplepower , If Canada asked the US to move it's embassy to Victoria B.C  ,  would you have an objection to that ?  If The U.K.   asked us to put our new embassy in Manchester by the sea , would you object to that ? No I didn't think so , ......   perhaps for you it's just that same old leftist prejudged opinion of those offensive  Jews , you know , like most of the Socialist European countries had leading up to WWII ?   Or maybe it's because Obama held such disdain for the Jewish people and you're expressing your Obama loyalties?

          One thing I do know , Trump has shown the REAL support for Israel that at least five other U.S. presidents have continually promised to do while they were campaigning . Including Obama , Clinton and  the Bushes .   get used to the fact that the US no longer kisses the ring of Islam .    I suggest you read more about the Jewish history and the "neighbors " that hate their guts AND imagine that someone from YOUR neighboring town wants to send rockets into YOUR neighborhood daily , "Think globally act locally"  isn't that one of your favorite  liberal sayings ? Try applying that strategy to your learning .

  9. profile image0
    ahorsebackposted 17 months ago

    From well before WWI  the Palestine- Israeli situation and directives of the League of Nations , and the repopulation of Israel by the refugee Jews after WWII  the Jews have been conspired against by Jordan ,Iran , Syria , the Palestinians , ..........The Jewish haven't been allowed a moment of peace within their own country  since the beginning of foreign interventions in decade of the 1910's , ..............

    Yet today , many here are condemning the Jews for defending the UN's  and League of Nation's own  directives ,  It is STILL not fair to hold them as responsible  for the regional violence when they haven't had a year of peace since they arrived .  The 1967 war is the perfect example of the seemingly eternal infractions against the Jews .    Recently , Israel  became the first nation to use the U.S. provided F-35 in the battle for it's own defense. Good for them !

 
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