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Mark of the beast

  1. Cleanclover profile image62
    Cleancloverposted 7 years ago

    What is the mark of the beast? Which is this beast?

    1. kirstenblog profile image74
      kirstenblogposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      The beast = Anti-Christ

      Mark of the beast, well some think it might be implants in the skin that would do away with money, all digital. It would make you trackable at all times. I love these kinds of doomsday stories smile

      1. ksha16 profile image61
        ksha16posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Well kirstenblog looks like a beast to me.

        1. kirstenblog profile image74
          kirstenblogposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Yeah, I wouldn't trust me if I was you roll lol wink

          1. Cagsil profile image59
            Cagsilposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            roll lol lol smile yikes tongue

            1. kirstenblog profile image74
              kirstenblogposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Good thing I can take a joke, even if it was not intended as a joke big_smile

              1. maven101 profile image75
                maven101posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                And such a cute little beast too.....

                1. kirstenblog profile image74
                  kirstenblogposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Awww Thank You Maven101 - from a blushing raccoon big_smile

    2. JesusYourSavior profile image54
      JesusYourSaviorposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      You may be referring to 616. Which incidentally is Satan's zip code.

      1. docrehab profile image60
        docrehabposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        666 or 616 ?

      2. profile image0
        lyricsingrayposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        big_smile

    3. Tom Cornett profile image58
      Tom Cornettposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Bar code....mankind.  Whore(church) rides on beast(population) smile

    4. tantrum profile image60
      tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Is the mark that will give you a free ride to Hell .

    5. terced ojos profile image58
      terced ojosposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Sings:  IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD AS WE KNOW IT; IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD AS WE KNOW IT; IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD AS WE KNOW IT.......AND I FEEL FIIIINE....I SAID I FEEL FIIINE. smile

      1. Davidsonofjesie profile image60
        Davidsonofjesieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        is that R.E.M

      2. terced ojos profile image58
        terced ojosposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        The mark of the beast according to the bible is the number of a man. This number is 666.  I doubt anyone really knows what it refers to; there are plenty of theories but no real answer.

    6. wsp2469 profile image61
      wsp2469posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      666 is the mark of the beast and the beast is Satan.
      Now go read some of my hubs, okay/

    7. tantrum profile image60
      tantrumposted 7 years ago in reply to this
      1. Jerami profile image73
        Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            All that ya gotta do is to blink twice around here and ya just missed something.
             Thanks Ms 'T'  I woulda missed this one.
              Who woulda thunk it

    8. Elijah Returns profile image58
      Elijah Returnsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Your willingness to serve him, and acknowledging him as King, doing his will during his reign..he is Antichrist, so those that accept his mark so as to save their souls actually lose them because Gods wrath is stored up for Antichrist and those receiving his mark. But those that don't, well they cant buy or sell and will perish for it, but in losing their souls for Christ they actually find them and gain life.

    9. mohitmisra profile image54
      mohitmisraposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      888 is to do with god consciousness and 666 is to do with those on
      a lower consciousness level.

      1. profile image61
        (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        And, a 311 is indecent exposure while a 459 is a burglary in progress. 1+1=2.

        Fascinating, numbers are.

        1. mohitmisra profile image54
          mohitmisraposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Yes very fascinating as this universe is build on pure mathematics.

        2. TMMason profile image62
          TMMasonposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Actually Q the numurology of the Biblical texts is fascinating.

          It is quite precise in its devotion to acurracy within the formatting of the text itself. And the exegesis of true intent within the books of God. It has been use for mellenia to verify grammaticism in the Bible. To purify and prove authenticity of the chain of trainsmission throughout the ages.

          Here is some source material in regards to it. The sources are rather extensive and abtuse reads, unless you are in love with numbers, I am not. But it was interesting for some time anyway.

          http://www.answering-islam.org/Religion … books.html

          1. profile image61
            (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

            You know, I get that, TMMason. I also get the fact that one number has little if no more significance than another other than simply representing a value.

            Most certainly, there are numbers that are derived from mathematics that are ingrained into our minds only because they happen to be the values derived.

            For example, pi: 3.14..., the speed of light: 300,000 kps, 1: representing 100% or the whole part of a set of values, are numbers we see and use consistently in those maths.

            It always, and I mean ALWAYS ceases to amaze me how some numbers are ingrained into our society with so much significance attached to them, the numbers themselves begin taking on a life of their own.

            4 and 8 are numbers in Chinese culture considered unlucky and lucky, respectively.

            13 is considered an unlucky number and has its own phobia associated with it.

            666 is a beaut. This number seems to have had more cause of frenzied zealotry and mass hysteria than any other.

            Now you tell me, do you really think any of these numbers have any significance beyond their values or are they numbers that have such supernatural powers their usage could bring and end to civilization as we know it?

    10. profile image44
      arsmithposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Many believe that the anti-Christ will be the Maddi, Islamic for savour.

      1. earnestshub profile image87
        earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        How many believe that? smile

        1. Jerami profile image73
          Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Gooda Earnest... .

          1. earnestshub profile image87
            earnestshubposted 7 years ago in reply to this
            1. Jerami profile image73
              Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                 Just got home from work.  When I'm working I don't get to sit in this chair very much.  And actually when I'm not working There is plenty I should be doing around the house.

                 OH well here I am for a little while.

  2. kess profile image60
    kessposted 7 years ago

    Christianity with it's bible and doctrine fulfills all the prophecies of the Beast, and the antichrist in scripture.

    Every single one.

    Who have eyes to see will see.

    1. kirstenblog profile image74
      kirstenblogposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I think I see what you are getting at there... thought provoking cool

      1. Jerami profile image73
        Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          I can agree,  depending upon your definition of Christianity.
        Faith in Jesus was the definition of what a Christian was over 1900 years ago.  But then the Roman Empire established a "RELIGION" that took over the known world, and then the "Prophet Muhammad established another "Religion"
            These two entities are going to bring together the kings of the earth to the final battle.   I can see it coming.

        1. kess profile image60
          kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Christianity is all who thinks that Jesus is the Christ and accept the bible as the only infallible "word of God" and is the only and final authority on all things pertaining to life.

          These are the one that negatively fulfills scriptures.
          They are false and the antichrist.

          The bible is the wounded beast recovered.

          The mark on the head is those who follow them within and without their denomination.

          The mark on the right hand is those who  have given their power unto those denominations also.

          666 is christ crucified on the Cross.

          Need further clarification?

          1. Jerami profile image73
            Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

               This is what I feel to be true.
            I think that you are using too broad of a brush.You seem to be using the bible to condemn the bible.
              I agree that the misinterpretation of the bible is a tool by which the beast has been using to gather its followers.
              I suggest that anyone that proclaims to have faith in scripture to first study those things that are said to be the words spoken by Christ. The knowledge of that will expose a multitude of false interpretations. 

               If the lord had wanted to have a "Church building", he would not have allowed or prophesied the destruction of The Temple in Jerusalem. Religion not Christianity is the beast that John saw rising up out of the see in Rev 13.

            1. kess profile image60
              kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              You can't see clearly because you do not yet see the difference between the bible and scriptures.

              Scripture are open always for God gives revelation all the time and will never stop, never ever.

              The bible is a closed book of scriptures. binding men to to only the scripture within.
              This is the deception and death.

              Those who commission the bible were as blind as those who try to live it, so false interpretation of scripture is was inevitable.

          2. profile image0
            Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Kess,
            absolutely perfectly stated!!!
            nice to know i am not alone in my 'anti' thinking.
            amen.

    2. ncmonroe1981 profile image60
      ncmonroe1981posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      You're absolutely right. I believe the church as it exists is not what Jesus intended. The exact opposite, as a matter of fact.

      1. TJBaruch profile image81
        TJBaruchposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        If that is true...and I agree there is some truth to what you say...doesn't it mean we should become better followers of Jesus?

        1. ncmonroe1981 profile image60
          ncmonroe1981posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Yup. I'm working on it myself. The first step for me was to avoid church like the plague.

          1. Jerami profile image73
            Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

               My opinion is just that.  Mine..  This is it...
            This situation is one of those oxymoron situations. The beast  that was given 42 months to blaspheme the Lord was the
            church (Christian and muslim). BUT  God also sent his two witnesses down to the earth for approx the same period of time; 1260 days. Also these time periods end at approx the same time. A coincidence I think not. I think that these two witnesses were infiltrators within the Church's.  When Gods timing comes to fulfillment, the Church will be wakened to her error. At this time the ten kings turn against her.
                Just a plausible thought???

  3. sooner than later profile image55
    sooner than laterposted 7 years ago

    I don't believe that the mark is physical. I think it is a descision in your mind + following the false messiah.

    1. Jerami profile image73
      Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I think that I am thinking kinda like you on that one.
      The mark of the beast is a mindset.

      1. sooner than later profile image55
        sooner than laterposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        right. It could be literal- and most would still get it. thats the scary part.

        1. Jerami profile image73
          Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              I do believe that people have been accepting the mark for quite some time.  This beast is given 42 prophetic months. A prophetic month is not an earthly month. Even with the day for a year this would be a long time.

    2. Elijah Returns profile image58
      Elijah Returnsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Yes, its a mental thing, a willingness to serve this last and 8th king who is Antichrist. In Revelation we read of those too who have the mark of Christ and God their father on their foreheads, they don't have a literal sign, but its their willingness to subject themselves to God, just as those willingly will subject themselves to Antichrist. Its a mental agreement.

      1. Jerami profile image73
        Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I just read your hub the two prophets and have a few questions, (1)  Concerning the day for a year in prophesy.  I think that if is to be used once in order to understand prophesy it would have to apply to them all.
           (2)   When reading scripture I see that (Rev 20) at the time of the first resurrection those that did not receive the mark of the beast is seen in heaven where they reign with Christ for a 1000 years. And then after the 1000 years are fulfilled Satan, the Beast and false Prophet are seen when the sixth trumpet is sounded and the Euphrates is dried up.
            Logically speaking we can assume that the 42 months began before the 1000 years began and extended to after the 1000 years are fulfilled.
             This fact raised "many" questions that must be answered before we are to understand prophesy as a whole.

    3. Elijah Returns profile image58
      Elijah Returnsposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Yes, this is true, thats the whole crux of it....and this mark can be as simple as getting a smart card from the government....satan is so very sly..

      Its definitely a mental agreement, a mental decision, and when the Antichrist comes, he will be seen as a Saviour, and as Jesus had said many will be fooled by him, even the holy ones of Jehovah, and Revelation goes on to say that the world follows him in wonderment and awe, but the world separated from Christ, the world of mankind receiving this beasts mark and indeed, wrath of God which follows.

      1. Jerami profile image73
        Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          When we examine what is actually said in the prophesy, we first have to decide if there is a difference between the prophetic timeline and time on earth. If we believe that there is, we must remain consistent and apply it every time that a time frame is mentioned in prophesy.
             I believe that when it is written that the lord is speaking to a man on earth he uses references that are common for us to understand.
             And when The Lord is telling his messenger angel to deliver a message that he uses terms that he normally uses when talking to the angels; making sure that the angel understands it. The angel then goes and delivers that message exactly as it was given to him.
             I think that this is why this issue exists concerning Prophetic timeline and earthly time line.
             This difference causes much confusion.

  4. Gemsong profile image82
    Gemsongposted 7 years ago

    I know I have no business on this thread. However, I have noticed often that the Anti-Christ is referred to as male. He is often portrayed as a white male.

    If I understand it correctly (I can very easily be wrong) the Anti-Christ is supposed to be the opposite of Christ in all ways.

    Does that mean the Anti-Christ is a black woman?


    (flees thread before the projectiles are thrown)

    1. docrehab profile image60
      docrehabposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      lol...You should read the bible...

    2. profile image0
      Deborah Sextonposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Hi
      I read your hub on the Abyss part 1 and in the picture of you and your husband on his left shoulder there appears to be a critter of some sort.
      Is he OK?

    3. sooner than later profile image55
      sooner than laterposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      No, the false messiah will impersinate Jesus closely to what man has created him to be.

      1. profile image0
        lyricsingrayposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        big_smile

  5. profile image0
    sneakorocksolidposted 7 years ago

    The true mark of the beast is evident when doing laundry. It's skid marks so shout'em out!

  6. profile image0
    B.C. BOUTIQUEposted 7 years ago

    I do not even want to touch this topic, sorry for looking...

  7. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    kess said   You can't see clearly because you do not yet see the difference between the bible and scriptures.

    Scripture are open always for God gives revelation all the time and will never stop, never ever.

    The bible is a closed book of scriptures. binding men to to only the scripture within.
    This is the deception and death.

    Those who commission the bible were as blind as those who try to live it, so false interpretation of scripture is was inevitable.


    Jerami   We are not disagreeing as much as it appears that we are.  The new testament consists of a few letters that was chosen out of a vast number to choose from. And then these same men said that these were the only ones that is inspired by God. They said ... That is like saying that we need only to know  addition , multiplication and division. Algebra is blasphemy.

    1. kess profile image60
      kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      I know those who see christianity as some true and some false usually will have a hard time with the things I say.

      For I say they all are false, simply because to be an accepted "christian" you must believe what they say about the bible. Plus teach their major false doctrine like trinity, among a few.

      And since I do not subscribe to none of these and a dey more, I therefore cannot be a christian.

      You see J, the jesus I preach is does not fit into the doctrine of the christian church.

      For they have locked him into the book.   And modified doctrine to suit  that premise.

      Do you understand why I say the bible is the "beast"  while I will still uphold scripture.

      But will still say scripture is nothing, for the Spirit is everything.

      1. Jerami profile image73
        Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          If there is a beast (Rev.13)and I believe that there is. I then would have contend that the scripture written in this book is valid. The beast would have to fit the description given
           Seven heads ten horns and ten crowns.
           In 325 Constantine divided the Roman Empire into seven districts, Seven Popes were assigned to each distict. These districts were then subdivided into three regions. The largest church in each region was assigned authority over the business in that region  and another Pope. The Emperor was still the ultimate authority over it all.
           Seven heads (districts)and ten horns with ten crowns Popes)???
           The beast had a body of a Leopard...   (Gabriel had already identified Greece as the leopard)...  The beast has feet of a bear....(Gabriel Identified as Persia)...And the mouth of a Lion...  (Rome)      The three regional headquarters were Alexandria (built by and predominately populated by Grecians),  Alexandria located in the southern extremity of Persia.
          The Dragon gives this beast his authority and his seat.
        In 325 Constantine gave his palace in Rome to the Pope in Rome.

           There is a lot more that identifies who the beast is, but this is enough to chew on for now.

        1. kess profile image60
          kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this
        2. kess profile image60
          kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Those are the views of the sleepy virgins.

          You cannot interpret a parable with another parable.
          When you know the truth then all parables are made plain.

          What is the dragon and what is his purpose and how does  he go about  fulfilling his purpose thus blindly fulfilling the purposes of God?

          What is the beast, and how does this beast fulfill the purposes of the dragon?

          What or who is this prostitute, and what make her a prostitute?
          who are her suitors, how and why are they going to forsake her?
          What is this cup of abomination?
          How is  did they profit from her?

          Who is this woman in rev. 12.
          Why did the dragon pursue her?

          You see Jerami , the dragon has changed himself into an angel of light thus completely disguising himself and are deceiving many.

          Christianity is a generation of Idol worshippers from begining months after the death of Jesus.

          And As long as they point their fingers at one another their own eyes will be blinded for they all are the children of the Whore.

  8. earnestshub profile image87
    earnestshubposted 7 years ago

    A non believer here for 16 months with 66 hubs and over 600 fans, I will soon have the religionists pointing to me as the anti christ at least one more time... ho hum. smile

  9. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    K   Those are the views of the sleepy virgins.
    J   The Hebrews of the first century were the sleeping virgins


    K   What is the dragon and what is his purpose and how does  he go about  fulfilling his purpose thus blindly fulfilling the purposes of God?
         What is the beast, and how does this beast fulfill the purposes of the dragon?
    J ...  The Dragon gives his power to the beast to carry on his business while he is bound in the pit for 1000 years
    The Dragons god is unwittingly fulfill Gods purpose.
            The beast is "THE"  False worship!                   


    kess ... What or who is this prostitute, and what make her a prostitute?
    J ...   The Whore is THAT CITY that rules over the kings, where Satans seat is!  Vatican City.  God often called those that worshiped Idols a prostitute. The beast birthed many children.


    kess... Who is this woman in rev. 12
    J ....   This woman WAS that Hebrew Nation that long await the arrival of the Messiah.  I believe it to be blasphemous to say that the Church gave birth to the saviour.
       The Church is said to be the Bride of Christ.You would have to exist first in order to give birth to.
    The Church is also said to be the Bride of Christ. 
    It would just be WRONG to marry your mother!!   

    kess ...Why did the dragon pursue her?
    J....   He wanted to eliminate her off of the face of the earth.  Herod The Great attempted to kill the baby child,
    Hadrian scattered the Hebrew peoples across the rest of the Roman Empire attempting to eliminate any memory of that Hebrew Nation. The dragon cast out of his mouth water as a flood (lies) and the earth swallowed them up. They believed the lies and established a formal RELIGION.

  10. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    I have to share the computer for a little while but will be back shortly.

  11. kess profile image60
    kessposted 7 years ago

    Jerami, let of allow your line of thought for a while.

    The sleepy virgins I will allow to sleep still.

    The woman in rev 12 note that she is in heaven pursued by the dragon.

    Consider the Hebrews are the present Jews and the scribes and pharisees at Jesus time, pendadr Jesus did not have pleasing words for them.

    Common sense tells us that this woman cannot be any organisation on this earth, for none is good. Whether they be religion or nation.

    You may then say that she is within christianity for only Christianity have the name of Jesus vs the rest of religion.
    But that would only mean that the christian "religion" is the woman.

    And christianity is persecuted as a whole, never by  dividing the true from false by outsider.
    Exception is only when the distinction is made by their own selves.

    The identity of the dragon is obvious. The way how and why he works with his beast is what causes the blindness in most.

    If the beast is catholicism then who are her children.
    When was her head wounded nearly to death?
    What are the lies that seek to deceive men so strongly?
    Note Jesus said if the days were not shortened even the very elect would be deceived.

    Remember that all Christianity have a core set of doctrines which they build upon, what if it is these doctrine that are the problem and not the ones they fight over.

    Like I said before, if you know the truth then all the parables will fit, but trying to make sense from a parable by interpreting it with another parable is entertaining deception.   

    If CHRISTIAN knew who is the beast and how it works, then christianity would be on more.

    It is difficult to cast aside that which many have built their lives upon.
    But the call of the Christ is just that.

    Christianity is the blind scribes and pharisees with the name of Jesus.

  12. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    kess  said .. The woman in rev 12 note that she is in heaven pursued by the dragon.
           
         Lets address this one issue before moving on.
      I have not considered this point of interest. So let us follow through this this analogy. With all respect I would like to express my opinion and if you have any clarification it will be appreciated.
      John sees her in heaven waiting to be delivered.And the dragon is waiting for to devour the child. She then delivers the man child (still in heaven?). Then there is war in heaven. Then Satan is cast down to the earth and he persecutes the woman. She must also be on the earth at this stage??? and when she is carried away into the wilderness and hides from the face of the dragon??
       I did not see when this woman changed locations from heaven to the earth?  But .. if the woman was not on the earth she then could not have been the CHURCH cause that is where the CHURCH is.  I do agree that "IF" the church is this woman that gave birth to the man child then Christ was man made.
       I do not believe that. If anything... Christ gave birth to the CHURCH, which I also do not believe.
       Nothing makes sense to me unless the woman in this vision is the same woman that God has many times described as his adulterous WIFE ..(the Hebrew nation) And who better to be the mother of the son of God than his wife.
       Your response will be more than appreciated

    1. kess profile image60
      kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Jerami, the simplest explanation I can give is this.

      Wisdom is the bride of truth the word of God,
      They were both one just as Adam was just one until Eve was taken from him.   
      She wisdom was separated from truth (Christ) so as to become the mother of all living.

      While in this separation, ignorant to Truth, she was accosted by darkness.

      And from that union Darkness the dragon was able to establish his kingdom.
      Kinda like the story of Adam and eve and the serpent noting that Peter I think confirmed that Adam was not deceived into eating the fruit but he ate willing in order to face death to restore Eve.

      It is not that wisdom supposed within herself to commit such an act, but darkness used her vulnerability to establish himself.

      She subsequently repented and was forgiven, and Truth, the first Adam and Christ set about to fully restore her.

      So a place was prepared for her until her restoration is completed and she will be fully reunited to her Groom Christ. 

      Wisdom did bring forth a son, the prince of darkness, and he is the one who pursued the woman in an effort to steal more of her glory.
      And he this deformed  son ( product of light and darkness) is the one who is "god of this deformed world" .

      For from the the light he received from Wisdom he set up this kingdom and establish the fleshy Adam over it to rule it while he will rule over Adam.

      Thus establishing him self as the ruler of darkness above the kingdom of light.

      But In establishing man over his kingdom he of necessity gave the light within himself to Adam,

      The wisdom of darkness is to use good for the purpose of evil.

      Now this is the light we as the fleshy Adam will see with in ourselves and seek the things that are above, while forsaking the things of the flesh. For ar long as we concern ourselves with those things we are subject to the kingdom of darkness.

      Truth on his way downwards into death to retrieve all the light from darkness , became flesh and dwelt among us. That is Jesus the Christ.

      But now he is back with His and our Father and his light is here within Men as the Spirit of truth. Therefore walking in the Spirit is most important for men.

      Also we are the bride of Christ but not only merely the bride we are Gods just as David said, just as Jesus is God for we both have the same Father.
      The sons of God are one with their Father. 

      Note that darkness,ignorance, evil, nothing are all synonymous terms for a total lack of The presence of God the father of all things,  light , knowledge, goodness.

      I hope you can get a clearer picture of the issues of this life, and why religion just as goverments are merely tools for the kingdom of darknes so as to Cover and control the Glory of the Sons of God.

      There is a lot more I can tell you but it would be easier if you ask.

  13. profile image0
    ralwusposted 7 years ago

    I know what you’re thinking about, but it isn’t so, no how. Contrarywise, if it was so, it might be, and if it were so, it would be. But as it isn’t, it ain’t. That’s logic.

  14. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    I'm trying to but I can't know, cause I don't know those things that I dont know and I know that I dont know, ya know.

  15. maven101 profile image75
    maven101posted 7 years ago

    Kess said :

    " While in this separation, ignorant to Truth, she was accosted by darkness."

    To be accosted by darkness is sheer hell...I can't imagine the horror...

    1. kess profile image60
      kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      It is impossible for darkness to extinguish light, totally impossible.
      But indeed it is a difficult thing to endure. But you can think of it as the pain of child birth only temporary.

  16. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    I was raised in a world that in most instances, if something broke ya fixed it or did without it. When ya started fixin it you always considered the easiest thing to fix first before ya started using your imagination looking for the complicated solutions.
       I use that same methodology when studying prophesy. When I want to understand a verse or chapter I look first for the simplest understanding before I turn my imagination on full throttle.
       In these prophesy the interpretation of most of the symbols have already been given by prior Prophets such as Daniel. And for further assistance, we were given Jesus's Parables as examples as to how we should interpret what little still remains to be interpreted.  All of the answers are right there to see if we know how to look for them.The first thing that we must do is to keep our wild imagination out of it.

    1. kess profile image60
      kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      It is foolish to discredit something without first understanding it.

      The Blind are always happy not knowing for to know is to demand change.

      It becomes worse when they begin to guide.

      They lay a foundation of lies then spend forever picking and shaping it. Forever learning but never learning truth.

      How long will christianity try to solve these mysteries?
      2000 years and counting.

      I say I know.
      What do you have, unsure half baked theories that Changes with every new event?

  17. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    @ kess       
      I believe in the God of Abraham. The only scripture that I have available for reference is the Bible. I use it to establish a foundation for my faith.
        If I am going to call myself a follower of Christ I should first understand those things that HE taught. Read those things that is written that HE is to have said.
       If this is a half baked Idea then I am guilty.
       
       Jesus was talking about the impending completion of those prophesy that was previously given to those people and the urgency for THIS message to be delivered. For them to repent and be prepared for the "end is near".

       The book of Daniel reveals the interpretations of those "BEASTS" that are described in the Revelation of Jesus that was given to John when he was on the Isle of Patmos.
       These facts need no further Interpretation.
       These things are what my faith is built upon.

      To change the meanings of the word of GOD by interpreting the truth out of them is misguided.

       If you are a non believer, keep spreading your interpretations. If you are a believer; read the word of God as it is written and keep it the way that it is.
       I believe that the misguided belief that a day = a year prophetically ; is the most damaging "Interpretation" invented in all of the Church age.
       When we begin reading, all of those interpretations that we Believe are in the back of our mind; influencing what we think that we are about to read, before we actually finish reading it.
       We are blinded by ourselves with our preconceived ideas.

  18. aware profile image71
    awareposted 7 years ago

    i rode the beast at six flags in ohio

  19. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    kess said   It is foolish to discredit something without first understanding it
       Jerami      I couldn't agree more

       kess      The Blind are always happy not knowing for to know is to demand change.
       Jeramy     True

       kess       How long will Christianity try to solve these  mysteries? 2000 years and counting.
       Jeramy     Until they learn to stop interpreting the written word of God.

       kess said   I say I know.
    What do you have, unsure half baked theories that Changes with every new event?

       Jerami says   I have ten years of rebuilding my belief system.
       I began with one simply written message from God delivered by Gabriel. I accepted this one message as fact and began a study of end time prophesy based upon this message delivered by Gabriel to be fact. It took almost ten years for me to deprogram myself from preconceived ideas that I was getting from those false interpretations that I had been taught.
       This journey that I embarked upon seemed to have many dead ends.  Many times I would come upon a verse that if true would debunk every conclusion that I had reached up to that point in time.  Upon further study I would discover that I was still holding onto yet another false interpretation that I was taught in my youth.
        After ten years of taking out the trash, I concluded that the end time prophesy makes total sense, exactly as written if we can get rid of false interpretations and read scripture as if we had never never heard them before;   
       If we could pretend that we did not think that we were  smarter than GOD. If we could pretend that we thought that "HE" was smart enough to say exactly what he intended to say; no more and no less than he intended to say. Then we will find that private interpretation of prophesy was not only forbidden, but a requirement in understanding them.  Interpretation was forbidden for a reason. Cause once ya start doin it ya gotta keep doin it, in order to think that ya know  what ya think that ya want to know.   YA   KNOW?
        AND THATS  THA  TRUTH   THA WHOLE  TRUTH !!   
               and nuttin but  tha  truth

  20. earnestshub profile image87
    earnestshubposted 7 years ago

    What a pile of neurotic clap trap! lol

    1. aguasilver profile image89
      aguasilverposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      http://www.waxmansrugs.com/images/whatever.jpg

  21. aka-dj profile image78
    aka-djposted 7 years ago

    What's "clap trap"?
    How does it get "piled"?
    I know what neurotic is.
    Need more info to put it all together, (PLEASE). hmm

    1. kirstenblog profile image74
      kirstenblogposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Being curious I went to have a look and found the definition of claptrap
      Noun
      absurd or nonsensical talk or ideas : such sentiments are just pious claptrap

      Origin mid 18th cent. (denoting something designed to elicit applause) from Clap + Trap

      How one piles this is unclear to me smile

      1. blue dog profile image73
        blue dogposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        it gets piled in the religious forum.  that's obvious. 

        it gets deeper by the day.

        1. TMMason profile image62
          TMMasonposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          If you don't believe, blu.

          Then why do you bother?

          If you don't mind me asking?

  22. Will Apse profile image89
    Will Apseposted 7 years ago

    Beasts have been a lot less scary since the invention of gun powder.

  23. profile image0
    Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago

    the letter kills, the Spirit brings Life.

    1. Jerami profile image73
      Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          We have to read the law the before we can see the spirit of that law.

      1. profile image0
        Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        untrue.
        before the law was grace then came the law.
        grace which is by faith.
        faith is the alpha/omega.
        law is knowledge of right wrong and the consequences.
        thus the law was fulfilled so man would again live IN and BY grace.

        1. Jerami profile image73
          Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

               Without some kind of written word we would know nothing of who the Lord is unless he came to, walked with, spoke to everyone from birth. He may have done this before sin entered into the world. But then??  The average person is introduced to or made aware of him through the written word. Then the connection between him and us can be recognized and utalized. The relationship grows from there.
              At least this the best that I can describe it from my prospective.

          1. profile image0
            Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Yet even with the written text, men denied the Truth and sought to kill the author of all Life...

            Enoch -who was before the law or written word, knew.
            As did Abram (called Abraham) and others.

            Even more was Ad`am, who lived in fullness with the Word.

            Even further is this: the Word himself -it was said He did so many works that there would not be enough books to write it down.

            The letter kills, the Spirit is Life

            1. Jerami profile image73
              Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                 The lord revealed himself to Abraham and a very few others. They told their story and they were written down so that later generations would know of the story. This was important that the story was written. It is also important that we have read about them.  I do agree with you that after having read the scripture we are not to worship them. They were an introduction as to who he is. With this foreknowledge of him we can then seek him.  Seek and yea shall find. After you have found him you no longer have need for the map that lead you to him.
                  Some people worship the map.... and not the prize.


                   Hay Ms "T"    Mornin to ya.

              1. profile image0
                Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                He is not a respecter of persons. He revealed himself because they sought after him
                - though a warrior and murderer, David had a heart for Him.

                The stories of Torah were not written down until Moses, until the law came. Men were governed by the law because they refused to see the Truth for their hearts were hard, their eyes blinded.
                But it was not always this way. For the men of Faith in those stories never knew those words in text form, they knew the living Spirit. He Himself spoke words, not those of men.

                Many ministers today continue to crow about quoting the "Good Book" and proof, you will know Him and increase your faith.
                That is false. For the Author of the Book specifically stated not to do so and even told the teachers of the text that they were misguided.

                If He commanded me to speak only that written text, then I would do so.

                In my own opinion: Just because I can quote Shakespeare, doesn't mean I know Shakespeare. It just means I can memorize lines and verses, pretend I am Shakespearian -even dress the parts and act out my lines.

                I must admit, truly, men have not changed in thousands of years, for they still look to something else instead of the Source of that is everything.

                Yes, all those books & letters were given by inspiration of Him and are profitable for knowledge, etc. But the reality is, those words -in present day- are keeping them in chains...

                1. kess profile image60
                  kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  You have correctly identified the Antichrist and his beast.

                  Now I wonder why people who have seen that truth, still see the need to search their false doctrine for the truth?

                  1. Jerami profile image73
                    Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                       

                    You both are close... The WHOLE TRUTH as to the identity of the beast is revealed in scripture when examined  correctly.
                       There are certain parts of the OT that was too well known and accepted to leave out. The book of Daniel contains all of the information necessary to properly understand the book of Revelation. All that is necessary is to read it and not change the clearly written message.
                        When we do not interpret this book, we then see all of scripture with a diffrent perspective.
                        It is written that prophesy has no personal interpretation yet everyone does it.

  24. TMMason profile image62
    TMMasonposted 7 years ago

    The Septuagint says, 666

    The latin Vulgate says, 616

    Alot of Scolars and Theologions say it is the numerical equivolent of "Nero Dividavis", "Nero Reborn", or something...

    Or it matches Culiglia, and a few others from what I understand.

    That is why alot of Historians, and the above, say the book of Revalation is not, "literal", but figurative.

    Nothing more that a raging rant against the persecution inflicted by Rome on the Jews, and then the Christians.

    I believe it symbolizes the rise of a Politcal/socio/Religous state,(Sound familiar?).

    Which will rule , invoking a religion and forcing it's belief on all, through the use of death and terror, making all bow before it, and worship it's god and his power.

    Placing itself above all, and demanding the whole world act as it says too, in every way and form.(again, sound familiar?)

    While... I won't rant.

    But thats some of it, as I see and interpret it.

  25. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    When we interpret the book of Revelation as though this was a dream,which it was. This dream that was brought from the Lord to John through a dream. If we use Gabriel's interpretations that was given to Daniel for these same symbols then, we would be able to understand the book of Rev. better than we do.

    1. TMMason profile image62
      TMMasonposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Daniel, Ezekial, Joel, and a couple more.

      Yes you do.

      And the sycronicity and accuracy of all those in that extended period of time to different prophets of God, is a marvolous wonder, and stunning.

      1. Jerami profile image73
        Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

           It appears that most people can not agree when I say that when we eliminate previously learned interpretation of scripture, there are no contradictions and no need to interpret any of them. It does take great effort to purge oneself from preconceived ideas when reading these prophesy.

  26. Sufidreamer profile image79
    Sufidreamerposted 7 years ago

    I currently have 666 followers and 66 Hubs.

    For some strange reason, I feel the urge to harvest souls - any takers?

    1. EmpressFelicity profile image79
      EmpressFelicityposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      No, but I'd be happy to become your familiar lol

      1. Sufidreamer profile image79
        Sufidreamerposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Consider yourself hired big_smile

        Going to make the most of this before somebody follows me and spoils the laugh.

        I never liked the term 'followers,' but now it makes sense, my disciples...muhaha big_smile

        1. EmpressFelicity profile image79
          EmpressFelicityposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Let me start my term of employment by helping you out with some "muhahahahaha" smileys:

          http://www.modernmuscleforum.com/images/smilies/mwahaha.gifhttp://www.modernmuscleforum.com/images/smilies/mwahaha.gifhttp://www.modernmuscleforum.com/images/smilies/mwahaha.gifhttp://www.modernmuscleforum.com/images/smilies/mwahaha.gifhttp://www.modernmuscleforum.com/images/smilies/mwahaha.gifhttp://www.modernmuscleforum.com/images/smilies/mwahaha.gifhttp://www.modernmuscleforum.com/images/smilies/mwahaha.gifhttp://www.modernmuscleforum.com/images/smilies/mwahaha.gifhttp://www.modernmuscleforum.com/images/smilies/mwahaha.gif

          1. Sufidreamer profile image79
            Sufidreamerposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            hehe - I like those little guys. Just what I need in my quest to dominate the entire multiverse (except Belgium).

            @Mo - Great, thanks - we went to our friend's taverna and had an evening of food, wine and song. Getting back into the swing of this work thing, now smile

    2. kirstenblog profile image74
      kirstenblogposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      You so evil tongue

      1. Sa Toya profile image74
        Sa Toyaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Haha ha aha ah that's so funny
        666 followers and 66 hubs...hhehehehe don't write another hub till some fanatic points out your propensity to be the anti christ.
        smile

        1. Sufidreamer profile image79
          Sufidreamerposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Hehe - apparently Obama already has that job, so I must settle for a lesser place in the hierarchy of Ultimate Evil. Now, I must head off and inspire Celine Dion to write another song that will torture millions of listeners...big_smile

          1. Sa Toya profile image74
            Sa Toyaposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            Hahahaha lol

            Good luck with that...

            Get some earplugs before you do!

            1. Sufidreamer profile image79
              Sufidreamerposted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Curses - a Hot Indian Girls hubber on a fanning spree has ruined the comedy. sad

              Might keep Dave Grohl as an avatar for a while, though big_smile

              Hey Mo, how is life treating you?

              1. mohitmisra profile image54
                mohitmisraposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                Hi Sufi doing god, how about you? Happy New Year.

    3. habee profile image89
      habeeposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      What's a good used soul going for these days??

      1. Sufidreamer profile image79
        Sufidreamerposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        $6.66 big_smile

        Due to the economic crisis, we are prepared to barter - alcoholic donations gratefully accepted smile

    4. mohitmisra profile image54
      mohitmisraposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      The umber 66 is of Allahs or god.smile

  27. earnestshub profile image87
    earnestshubposted 7 years ago

    I still have a religious book here somewhere that "proves" the bible is true through using numbers.

    It handles the "truth" loosely enough to fit an elephant or an ant! When examined it is a source of great amusement! Some people are not just born gullible but insist on their right to continue being gullible their whole life! lol

    1. Davidsonofjesie profile image60
      Davidsonofjesieposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Hi earnest glad to see your still yanking chains,I still have a few science books in the basement that handels {truth}loosely enough to fit an elephant or a ant,when examined its a great source of amusment to.You was rite about gullible people!!!

      1. profile image61
        (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Brand spanking new books, no doubt. Never been used.

  28. Danny Decay profile image75
    Danny Decayposted 7 years ago

    I bear the mark. It's a Danzig tattoo on my chest, is that it?

  29. tantrum profile image60
    tantrumposted 7 years ago

    I have the mark in one of my arms. Just in case. I don't want to go to Heaven, if Heaven really exists.

  30. Misha profile image73
    Mishaposted 7 years ago

    Mark is the beats? Truly he is! lol

  31. dyonder profile image79
    dyonderposted 7 years ago

    I dunno anything about a mark of the beast (unless it's a vestigal tale) but the Number of the Beast by Heinlein was an exceptional book about right angles.

  32. profile image0
    Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago

    one addition,
    the Gentiles who did not know the law, accepted & received the gift of grace and the Spirit -who is that Great Teacher.

    For the Law of the Spirit is [Abundant] Life.
    The written law is sin and death

  33. tantrum profile image60
    tantrumposted 7 years ago

    That's why I'm an outlaw!

  34. kess profile image60
    kessposted 7 years ago

    Jerami the antichrist is the one who takes the truth and make it into a lie while still  preserving the appearances of truth.

    This lie causes men to do good works upon which the antichrist establishes his kingdom.

    The midst of the lie is the beast, this beast is the heart of the antichrist and gives  it it's life. His head had been wounded as unto death, as was prophesied in Genesis, but he did live unto this day.

    Both have been present from the begining and ruling the hearts of men throughout the ages.

    He has assimilated the truth from each and every generation, race and kingdom and in it's place establish it own kingdom of lies called religion with their present names.

    He was present during the time of the Christ and the apostles, establishing his kingdom.   

    He has establish his seat in this day, assimilating the very name which  men will turn to for salvation, but instead show them another way, which is the gates of death itself.

    I tell you the truth Jerami, the very foundations of Christianity is faulty and if you try to understand all of this without the willingness to relay your foundation, you too will ultimately be deceived.   

    The antichrist and his beast is a system that  have been present from the begining.

  35. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    With all due respect....                     
    In my opinion you are almost there.
       I agree with what you have written more than anything else that I have ever read.  ..  BUT..
    I have to believe that the Antichrist could not have been until after there is a Christ to be anti towards.
        And Revelations says that the beast was given 42 months to blaspheme the Lord, so it could not have been since the beginning.
        This forty two months would HAVE to be "prophetic" months.
    According to Religion, a day = a year in prophesy.
    Based upon all of the Hebrew months having 30 days
    This 42 months would be 1260 years; after it is given its power. 
        I do not agree with religion in this regard.
        Based upon each month having 30 days;
        I will bet my life against a dozen donuts, that this forty two months represents approx. 1640 to 1660 years. 
    And this 1640 plus years is near completion.

  36. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    I do not want to read more into the 42 months coming to an end than is actually written. So This last statement is only talking about the beast "balspheming days" are coming to an end.  Scripture does not say what length of time passes after this, until the battle of Armageddon.
    I do not think that it will be very many years?.

  37. goldenpath profile image73
    goldenpathposted 7 years ago

    I would recommend not playing the "numbers" game.  If scripture has taught us nothing else it would be that times and dates are known to Him and not us.  In my estimation we are to live worthily to enter and rise in the morning of the millenium so that we may prepare the world for the ultimate battle to come after the millenium.

    1. Jerami profile image73
      Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Do you believe that those scripture that gives us a comparison between prophetic timeline and the earthly time line should be totally ignored?
        Do you believe that God sent Gabriel to Daniel to give him this timeline comparison for absolutely no reason?
         We interpret the heck out of the rest of these scripture but we are not to understand the rest of the same message?  I find this timeline comparison of the most importance if we are to understand prophesy,

  38. kess profile image60
    kessposted 7 years ago

    Jerami, you need a big picture before you fit the pieces.
    To get the big picture you must be willing to relay your foundation.

    All things are by Christ.
    The light that cause the begining is Christ.
    The darkness at the begining is the Antichrist.

    His clinging to the Christ is what makes him difficult to decipher to those without Christ.

    The Christ is in the world long before Jesus.

    Note this, who found the Christ at his birth?

    Definitely not those familiar with the written prophecies.
    But little nobody shepherds and foreigners.

    Nevertheless when the "man of sin" the embodiment of the beast appears it will be for 3.5 our years and only at that time there is no more deception.

    I Wish I could tell you things  plainly, even though in a way I did.

    I know that you know it is not wise to pour new wine in old wineskins. 

    There is an invisible Spirit that speaks truth, that is the one Christ.

    1. Jerami profile image73
      Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        We have to have it before we can get it?...  What?
        Where do you get this information that the "MAN OF" sin when he apears, it will be for 3.5 years?

      1. kess profile image60
        kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Jerami the info is common knowledge so maybe I don't quite understand.

        Like I said to you long time ago, because we come from two different foundations,  my answers will make no sense to you.

        1. profile image61
          (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          And, you guys wonder why non-believers don't agree with you. You don't even agree with each other.

          1. Jerami profile image73
            Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                There are many reasons why non believers do not agree with a lot of things. The same reasons as everyone else.
                Our own interpretations of everything that occurs every day affect everything about all of us.  Everything is relative and we just caint comprehend half as much as we would like to or think that we do.

            1. profile image61
              (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              But, if there were only one god with one message, how could believers possibly not agree with each other?

                 

              Wouldn't that make your holy book rather worthless, then, as a life guide, for example?

              1. Jerami profile image73
                Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                    Imagine that you have a number of children. You have diffrent conversations with each one of them.
                    Imagine that each one of them wrote down their understanding of those things that you said to each of them.
                    They all being true from their understanding.
                   And then at some time in the future, someone that never knew you personally wrote a story about you using these diffrent descriptions of who you were.
                    Anyone reading this story would have to remember that diffrent people would have a diffrent prospective.
                    However the prophetic scripture as written concerning the messages delivered by Gabriel should be believed as written and never using our INTERPRETATIONAL skills.

                1. profile image61
                  (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  Are you comparing the so-called wise men of the Bronze Age to children?

                  I can make any comparison of understanding to that of a child, which means I'm talking apples and oranges.




                  That would be Islam.

  39. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    kess wrote:
    Jerami, you need a big picture before you fit the pieces.
    To get the big picture you must be willing to relay your foundation.

       Jerami said...  Do We have to have the big picture before we can piece a big picture together????
      If we have it we don't need to do anything but to see it!

      kess says... Nevertheless when the "man of sin" the embodiment of the beast appears it will be for 3.5 our years and only at that time there is no more deception.Jerami the info is common knowledge so maybe I don't quite understand.
       
      Jerami says...  It is the common knowledge that we need to be most skeptical of.  I ask again; where do you get the fact that the "man of sin" appears and will be with us for 3.5 years?
       When you tell me where you get this information from, I will show you how you have made a gross misinterpretation.

    kiss says ...Note this, who found the Christ at his birth?
    Definitely not those familiar with the written prophecies.
    But little nobody shepherds and foreigners.

      Jerami say ....You are quoting the scripture that you say that we should not live by.     And it was my understand that scripture says that these were three    "wise men"    who said, ...according to scripture ; these are the signs that the Messiah had come??
      It was by their studying scripture that they knew that prophesy had been fulfilled.
        Today,,,  about 95% of those things that the average  BELIEVER believes is based upon Misinterpretation of scripture.
       Interpretations and those things that we have  preconceived ideas of,  are keeping us from understanding what we are actually reading.
       The Great Deceiver has done his job well.
       If a person is deceived will he be aware of the fact that he has been deceived?????
       
       Satan does not have to lie to us; We do that to our selves. 
       When we discover that it takes the intellect of a child to understand scripture, We may start gaining wisdom.
         It is "ALMOST" impossible to read scripture without using our own wisdom, and  interpreting the truth right out of those things that we are reading . 
       
        I really do not how to say this any nicer.
       
       I think that we can believe that the Lord knew the human language well enough to say what he meant to say without any help from us and our skills of interpretation.
       2 peter 1:20

  40. kess profile image60
    kessposted 7 years ago

    Jerami you are of the 5% crittersizes the 95 failing to see that the whole 100% are nothing but little blocks crittersizing the rest.

    You try hard to build again on a false foundation. That is foolish.

    In case you do not yet know it, I have  rejected all of christianity as defined by christians.

    To the true christian I am a heretic. And to the true heretic I am a christian. And I reject both in favor of God.

    You keep asking about the 3.5 years, did you not bring it up?
    Therefore I was merely confirming the truth about your enquiry.

    You do not yet understand spiritual principles, for it takes only one word to inspire truth, and if that word came from you?

    Is your words then Scripture? I do not need your answer.

    Jerami go find the scriptures that teaches nothing and learn from it, and then you would understand where I am coming from.

  41. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    @ kiss...  If the god spoken of in the bible is not the god that you serve ??  Who is your God and when or where did you first learn of him of him?

    1. kess profile image60
      kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      There are many goes spoken of in the bible. There is one god of the bible, if you knew him you will quit serving him, he gains followers through deception. 

      There is a God of truth that 's the one I know and serve.

  42. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    We do not have to believe anyone else's perception of the God that is spoken of in scripture in order to believe "That" God exists
      And if we are to believe that "That" God does exist, we would then at least have to believe that the Messenger Angel Gabriel exists and his message is true.
       If We can not do either of these two things we must wonder where our belief in our god came from?
    What is our foundational belief system  made of?

  43. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    Jerami says... Our own interpretations of everything that occurs every day affect everything about all of us.  Everything is relative and we just caint comprehend half as much as we would like to or think that we do.

    Q says...   Wouldn't that make your holy book rather worthless, then, as a life guide, for example?

    Jerami asks..... If you were to write a letter telling people how to do something;  lets say; how to safely fix a flat tire on a car.  If I read your instructions and I do not understand correctly does that make your advice worthless??

    1. profile image61
      (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Clearly, it is worthless to you if you can't understand it.

      Either I wrote it badly or you have a reading comprehension problem.

      So, if I wrote it well enough to understand and you didn't have a reading comprehension problem, would it still be worthless?

      1. Jerami profile image73
        Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

             It seems that you and I  agree then!!!
            Just because people have a reading comprehension problem does not render the scriptures baseless.

        1. profile image61
          (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Then, if everyone who is a believer has a reading comprehension problem, they have misinterpreted the bible completely and are wrong in their beliefs.

          1. Jerami profile image73
            Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

               I believe that non believers have the same comprehension problem. If they read scripture without interpretating the life out of it they might believe also??

            1. profile image61
              (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

              Or, non believers do NOT have a reading comprehension problem and that may very well be the difference. They are comprehending what they read, hence are not convinced.

              1. Jerami profile image73
                Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                   Lets go back to the directions of how to fix a flat.
                The original person that misinterpreted your directions. That person had a reading deficiency.
                   Then another person comes along recognizing that those directions as perceived are false.
                   Then he declared that the flat can not "NEVER" be fixed.
                   He also would be stricken with a reading deficiency; either  by his own misinterpretation or his refusal to decipher the original text.

                1. profile image61
                  (Q)posted 7 years ago in reply to this

                  No Jerami, one simply cannot "declare" something without having a reason to do so. Why did the other person make such a declaration?

                  1. Jerami profile image73
                    Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

                       I think that an Atheists best arguements with a believer is their interpretations of scripture more than scripture itself.
                       If you or I have been properly decieved, we will not be aware of the fact that we have been decieved.
                       Personal interpretation of prophesy of scripture has decieved us all. And this deception over shadows all of scripture.
                      If your only arguement is with the interpretations of others then you also are being decieved by their interpretations.

      2. profile image0
        Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Q, yes it would, in both cases.
        for the writer did not clearly specify the instruction and the reader clearly misinterpreted the instruction.

        your instruction is void should it not enable the reader to clearly define the how-to. and the reader is void because they are unable to understand your written instruction.

        hence both the writer and reader are the same....

        1. kess profile image60
          kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Deleted

          1. kess profile image60
            kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this
  44. profile image0
    Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago

    sorry for not replying, been out of the hub-loop a bit.


    Jeremi, Kess:

    Whether it was Daniel or John, the reality is that we must break away from the "ideology" of salvation that is Christianity, etc and its teachings of ritual practice.

    These are the same things that caused the law to be.
    So much that the heads of the sect, when told that the law they lived by for thousands of years in written form was absolutely worthless (now that the fulfillment of that law had come).
    So enraged were they that someone had the nerve to tell them to stop reading, memorizing, quoting it, that they torn their clothes and hung Him on a tree.

    This antichrist is the opposite of anointed.
    One who appears like the truth but is not truth.
    hat is simply the law of sin & death. The teaching of the law and practicing the rituals of it.
    Christianity defines this and proves this by its own teachings.

    Whats more is back then 95% of the population back then was illiterate.

    The point being is we can 'read' Daniel, Malachi, Paul, Peter or even Pastor Parsley, but nothing they write in letter or books can explain or show the fullness of Truth.

    The fullness must be lived day to day.
    I highly doubt He uses a reference manual when communicating with humans so why should be do any different:

    Since we were -commanded, not requested- to Be, Do and Act as Y`shua. For He said, As I Am (isn't that a familiar quote) so are YOU in this world...

    you are saved, your are blessed, you are free, start living it.
    who cares about beasts and demons and angels and things? we are the offspring of our Creator, the seed of Life.
    Let's live or we will certainly die....

    1. kess profile image60
      kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Christianity is the antichrist,beast and the mark that goes along with it. not a part but the whole of christianity.

      I can give them a million reasons from their bible and a million and one from without.

      But will they ever believe?

      Not until their beast is materialised.

    2. Jerami profile image73
      Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

         I agree completely with most all of the ideologies of Christianity;
         Many Christians follow them and some don't.

         We can be a Christian and not worship Church doctrine.
      My only argument with the Church is that it teaches too many Interpretations of prophetic scripture.
         If we follow the advice of Peter as is written in 2nd Peter 1:20 We would see these prophesy in their true light.
         My only argument with the Church is that it has been disregarding this verse for over 1600 years and are unable to break this habit.
         When we eliminate false interpretation of these prophetic scripture, All of scripture would suddenly comes together eliminating division among the Church.
         
         The true Church began with the disciples in the first century.
        But the Church as we know it today was constructed by Constantine in 326AD.  Is it possible that Satan infiltrated this Church and planted just a few seeds of deception?
         The willingness to interpret the word of God began when Satan interpreted for Eve, as to why God said to not eat of the tree of knowledge. This fault that Adam and Eve was guilty of has been following mankind through out the centuries and is still alive today.
        The enticement to mankind to interpret the word of God was Satan's first tool that he used to cause mankind to fall.
        This is his most effective tool that he still uses today.

  45. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    twenty one days  says ..
      Whether it was Daniel or John, the reality is that we must break away from the "ideology" of salvation that is Christianity, etc and its teachings of ritual practice.

      Jerami says... I agree that Religion or its rituals  are not what we are to have faith in.
      I do not think that Jesus had a problem with reading and understanding the writings of the Prophets. It was all of those man made rules and rituals and interpretations that was being added to the word of God that Jesus chastised.
       
       I was suggesting for those that do preach the prophesy, that they begin their understanding at the beginning of the story and build a belief from there.
       It is futile to begin in the middle of a story, working our way back in time; interpreting  scripture to fit our preconcieved ideas as to what we want the ending to be.

    1. profile image0
      Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Jeremi, exactly. why quote in the first place. Leave the dead behind, shake off the golden shackles and be children of time no more, but living proof of All that is all, yes?

      Kess, this beast has materialized and nearly 7 billion worship it daily from offices, front porches, churches, mosques and synagogues. It is the belief that we are limited to sin and death.

  46. kess profile image60
    kessposted 7 years ago

    Jerami you are stuck in a rut as all other christians and as I was.

    For one To live the bible one must first interpret it. And  any string of letters forms a word and can carry many interpretations, much more strings of words.

    The very nature of a letter is ambiguous, for they are formed from the combination of the contrasting. ( Light on dark)

    Therefore throw out that which is ambiguous and follow that which is all light.

    That light is truth.

    Never the less the children of God were constrained to write for all writing is good and they are for the fulfillment of all things.

    But he that finds truth in nothing finds truth is all things.

  47. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    @ kess ...For one To live the bible one must first interpret it.

    Jerami says ...   That is my point. We do not have to nor should we interpret scripture. We must make every effort to NOT interpret the word of God because when we do, we change their meaning.
      If it were not for the written word of the prophets we would be left completely in the dark. These written words of the prophets is the only light left in this world.
      And we must not change these meaning.
      We must not interpret them.

    1. mohitmisra profile image54
      mohitmisraposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Kess is correct spiritual texts have great depth and most do not understand their real meaning.
      Correct interpretation is the key.
      Take for example the way is narrow and when thy eye be single, one Christian said it has nothing to do with meditation like meditation is something evil.

      Then Jesus couldnt get more direct when he said the kingdom of god is within and you are all gods, how many understand this?

      There are mutliple meanings as well where some texts are concerned.

      Then Kess, Jerami has a pretty good understanding of spirituality. smile

    2. kess profile image60
      kessposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      No Jerami, my point is always this,

      One can not and should not even attempt to live by any written text  what so ever,
      With that the need to interpret them is non existant.

      The Spirit is the guide, the one and only guide to men.

      Show me a man who boast  about knowing and interpreting scriptures and I will show you a hypocrite.

      The one who live by the Spirit knows all scriptures whether he reads them or not.

      There are two "word of god", one from heaven and one from beneath. One is life and the other is death.

      This is the one point that both twenty one and I make.

      Enquire of the way and nature of the moon Jerami, and the Spirit of Truth will teach you.

      1. profile image0
        Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago in reply to this

        Well Said !!!

      2. Jerami profile image73
        Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

            I do not know exactly how much I agree with what you are saying. I do see your point and in a diffrent way am saying something very similar.
            I do know that there is truth written by the prophets that Religion has refused to recognize. For example; the truth that is written in the book of Daniel has been Interpreted beyond recognition. The truth that is in your comments are revealed After reading Gabriel's message to Daniel. 
           I think that the best way to reveal the truth to self professing Christians is to show them that the messages of their own prophets as they are written in their own bible.
        does not say what they have been taught that it says.

  48. Jerami profile image73
    Jeramiposted 7 years ago

    Good morning Mohitmisra ...  Phone seems to ring when I'm trying to make a post.  Business!! so I can not ignore them.
       I must admitt that I am unfamiliar with other writings other than the bible.
       My point is that understanding seems to be clear enough in the written scriptures of the KJV, when hundreds of years of misinterpretations are removed from our belief system.
       I am not saying that there is not more to be learned after we reach this place of understanding.
       I am saying that as a Christian, this is the first hurdle that we must to overcome.

    1. mohitmisra profile image54
      mohitmisraposted 7 years ago in reply to this

      Hi Jerami , good evening from India wink
      I admit you have a good understanding of spirituality but lets be honest how many other Christians can understand the Bible.

      Truthfully I found it a difficult book to read after enlightenment.Very often I would have to stop and contemplate on the words and believe me I lap up spiritual books really fast as I can relate with them, people get surprised at the speed with which I finish a book.

      It depends on the frequency one is in, everyone is not in your frequency.

      1. Jerami profile image73
        Jeramiposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Thank you for the compliment.  I have said on many occasions that Interpretation of scripture depends upon not interpreting prophesy.
          I believe that the hidden secret to understanding scripture as written in the KJV. is hiding in plain sight.
          To believe the writings of Daniel chapter 9 without interpreting one single thing. When reading what it actually says we will see that 62 prophetic weeks is the same period of time as approx 565 years on earth. Proper application of this equation when studying the prophetic scripture opens a doorway to a diffrent understanding of all of scripture as written in the KJV.  A prophetic week equals approx 9.1 to 9.2 of our years. By doing this one thing,all of prophesy falls into agreement.  There is a lot of trash (in he form of false interpretation) that must be taken out.
           I must add that this is only an opinion and I'm sticking with it.

           Time for me to go make a living. will check back later.

        1. mohitmisra profile image54
          mohitmisraposted 7 years ago in reply to this

          Its the truth I have had nice debates with you.
          I look at the spiritual messages of Jesus in the Bible, dont pay much attention to the rest.

          So you do agree correct interpretation is the key to understanding. smile

  49. profile image0
    Twenty One Daysposted 7 years ago

    what i was driving at regarding written word v. living word is the same thing Y`shua was driving at. You get caught up in the words that the Word cannot manifest in you.


    The words desire from the beginning was to fill each of us with All-in-all. If we continue to 'educate' ourselves in universities, libraries, Google, church doctrines, etc etc, we can never be full of the Word.
    It is impossible.

    This was the problem with Adam/Eve.
    They were deceived into thinking they could do it on their own.
    What the Word said to them was manipulated, and appeared to make sense -a truth, logical- so they bought into it.
    With it came the logic, knowledge, understanding of their own humanity and weakness -without the Word.

    The protective covering of the power of the Word (Grace) was lifted from them and they were plunged into a sea of intellectual chaos.
    No longer living the Spirit, could no longer commune properly with the Word and were driven out of 'Eden'.
    Since that moment, humans have been trying to 'think' of ways to survive, equate, reason their way.

    So no matter what letter, line, verse, chapter, book or library concordance, it all comes back to this:

    Seek FIRST the Kingdom of G-d and ALL things will be added.
    All things means all things
    (how to build a rocket ship, swim without air, run 50 miles in under an hour, call fire from heaven, seal up the sky, stop the sun, walk through fire, heal the sick with just your shadow....etc etc etc)

    What is the kingdom:
    1. righteousness: the understanding of the creation you were made to be and accepting it. You are the seed of Life.
    2. peace: the unity of spirit, mind & body that is evident in the covering of grace, full of assurance.
    3. joy: the endless, conscious action of expressing the fullness of Him who is in you, with you, through you and all around you.

 
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