And out right refusal to believe what other people say, would be a justified approach to not knowing. Because, for the most part, you can never tell when people are lying.
You can also never tell if they know their lying or spreading, poisoning minds.
If a person doesn't know they are lying, then apparently they have a very, very, very low level of awareness.
Or have been lying so long even they are deceived and no longer aware of their lies.
I have met liars who truly believe what they say.
Oh John, I have met a lot of them. There are simply too many stories to be told about how people have no ability to see that they are lying.
You have just described the condition of fundamental religion.
Or someone's personal self belief that they alone control their world, it's a double edged sword!
And what part of your life are you not in control of John?
You alone control what you do. So, how are you not in control?
No one tries to control the world. There are plenty of people who are trying to dominate the world. But, controlling it? Nope. None.
Ah yes, the old "Devil made me do it" excuse!
Ray, in my business life I am controlled by (ultimately) the Rothschild's banking cartel, who demand KYC at every turn I make, and will only allow me to function if I play by their rules, in the political frame I am controlled by laws made to suit the 1% and designed to keep the 99% in servitude, and in my personal life (and in all things I do) I am controlled by God, to whom I have submitted authority over my life, because following His plan for my life is better than fighting against it. I get to choose which coffe I can order at Starbucks and what we have for supper tonight, and even then my wife controls what I eat to a degree, as she wants me healthy!
Yes, I understand this clearly and where you are coming from.
Interesting. Speaks volumes. Thank you.
So in other words, you have a god for some things and a goddess for others. But I'll bet they let you go to the bathroom when YOU want to, right? Believers call this "free will."
Yeah, very funny Randy!
I can do whatever I like, I choose to do what suits me best, and satisfying God and my wife are good ways to have a contented life, so it is in some respects a dedicated self interest that means I choose liberty over freedom.
I made the choice, it was my free will, and Christ gave us the 'heads up' when He said "Nevertheless, not my will but yours Lord"
So? He fixed our deficit and we actually had a surplus. He repaired our foreign affairs. So what if he lied? He did his best for this country and that's all that should matter.
But Dubya lied as a matter of course. I doubt he knew it, though!
I would suppose. Theists were convinced by someone that something exists, beyond the sensory experience. It is not their fault their gullible, the blame should fall on whoever started and propagated it.
Umm...let's not get ahead of ourselves. Theists were not convinced by someone else. It's that they never had gotten over the initial "shock and awe" of consciousness and reality.
No one had to start it. It's a theory just like everything else. But that it, a theory. It cannot even considered a hypothesis because there's nothing to actually back it up.
It wasn't a theory. If someone is spreading a lie, chances are, they picked it up from another person.
Hey nonto, and what's a theory? A theory is a thought/idea in combination of other thoughts an ideas, leading to a conclusion.
If a person is unable to break the "shock and awe" of consciousness, then they are likely to believe anything from almost anyone. When you look at our bodies, the chemical make up, DNA, the Universe, the planet and then try to fathom how it could have come about? Aside from humankind already knows, then you would likely believe in a God or a Creator.
Einstein said he believe in a Higher Power and could prove a Higher power exists through physics, simply because of the complexity of physics. However, he denied that his Higher Power was described by any of the world's religions.
That's because, no matter the belief, it's a seemingly personal one. I've had christians say "from my experience". That's when I'd say "exactly, it was your experience and only your experience". I do realize that there are theories but, there are also physical observations. A physical observation requires no theory, only a good set of sensory organs.
Really? Any observation requires a subconscious and conscious interaction to develop your perception of said observation.
You are required to use your sensory organ in combination with what you know and experience. Beliefs are a waste a time, unless you want to believe your favorite sports team will take home a title.
Life is ever changing and any belief that is solidified is dangerous if left in place for too long. It has a detrimental affect on the individual's life and effect the people around them.
With this understanding, I hold few beliefs.
That's what makes me an atheist; a lack of belief. I go by what I can readily observe and what seems like relevant information. The belief that it is right for me is apparent, though I have a lack of belief in what I cannot observe.
And then you make this statement? Please re-read your sentence.
You formed a belief, about having a lack of belief in a God.
And, people think I'm screwed up?
Everyone (as you stated before) "unless you want to believe your favorite sports team will take home a title". But that's not really a belief, it's an aspiration, in the form of optimism.
John 8;31 The truth will (always) set one free!
The only answer to lies and deception is "TRUTH"!
If you never hear it, you will never know it!
At one time there was 5 times more Native American than Europeans. The Columbus came over and began Christianity, Columbus brought natives slavery, gold rush and piracy and great wars. There after the greatest human genocide that has ever happened in Human history. I and America natives often still think Christian often speck with two faces and fork tongue.
They did not know what hell was about, until we showed them
Thank you DJ. But, yes I have heard truth and it sounds nothing like anything more believers spout off.
Cags, you said "If a person doesn't know they are lying, then apparently they have a very, very, very low level of awareness."
Here's looking at you, kid!
It might be nice if you put your ego aside, which is usually your problem. The fact that you making the inference that I'm the one with low awareness is actually just your reflection. Good show.
You've still not learned anything at all, have you? Amazing, just simply amazing.
That is funny
not true. According to Catholic teaching you'd still go there, for not (seeking the truth)
Default clause, we are destined for one destination, but we can choose to change destination, provided we are able to meet the entry requirements, which are not difficult to fulfil.
Hey John, you seem to be a bit confused. If the destination is destined, then no choice you make will change it. You would still arrive at your destination whether or not of the choices you make throughout your life. So, choice doesn't play a factor in your statement.
Confused no, possibly too tired when I wrote, I had been up for the best part of 48 hours with a couple of three hour sleeps!
Perhaps I should have said we are all destined UNLESS we change the destination?
To be destined for something John is something you cannot change, yet you keep on saying it. Destiny happens whether or not you want it to happen. It's kind like the BS of Fate.
But we can change our destiny, if I fall or jump out of a plane and do not pull the ripcord on the parachute I am wearing, I am destined to die when I hit the ground, but if I pull the ripcord....
That's free will. What does destiny mean, when free will is the term you refer to?
Destined is the final outcome of your overall life John. It's nothing to do with a situation or circumstance. It's "what, where, who, how and why" you arrived at that destined moment.
Destiny isn't affected/effected by choice because all choices one would make are already included.
You don't seem to get it. Irony at it's best.
Maybe we are destined to misunderstand each other!
I understand what you're saying John. I really do, but "destiny" does have it's definition. And choices are included already and change nothing about the end result.
In order for destiny to be something that is real, then choice would not be an option. Because, technically, you will be compelled from inside to take a specific path. You won't fight the feeling/compulsion.
We are born, we sin, by sinning we become destined to death and separation from God.
You will see that destined has two options:
1. (of a person's future) Developing as though according to a plan.
2. Certain to meet (a particular fate).
Number one "Developing as though according to a plan." is what I refer to, by sinning we are 'developing as though according to a plan' that our enemy has contrived for us.
When we exercise our free will and place ourselves under the authority of Christ, we change that destined plan of the enemy for the destiny that God affords us when we place ourselves under the authority of Christ.
A plan? You're claiming a plan by a G/god. Which is destiny.
You don't actually have free will or choice, even though you've been told you do. God's plan is going to work out regardless of what you do, think or anything else.
I thought that by living, I was subject to death.
There's nothing a religion can change about dying. It just aleviates a bit of the sting of knowing it.
I think he made the point rather well.
No confusion in what he said.
If you are falling, and destined to hi the ground, but fail to open your parachute (free will choice) you will indeed meet your destiny!
Either way you land, but one is DEAD, the other is ALIVE.
Yes, Cags. That says it all. Some priests lie. Tsk, tsk, tsk!
And Christianity is a rescue mission.
If you're on a sinking ship, you can decide: Do I go for the rescue or go down with the ship?
Some people are so convinced that the ship is safe and they find its familiarity and comforts so appealing that they cannot let go of it. But when the ship goes down, it's their decision to stay.
Does it matter if someone goes down with the ship and didn't know it was sinking? Would they be just as dead either way? See? Your priest was lying. The Eskimo would've died whether he was told or not.
Going down with the ship... that's Hell.
God created "man" in His own image and likeness. And God is not Homo sapiens.
That means Cagsil , me and and most people on earth will be sailing on a ship of fools to our death forever or an option where most will be torture for eternity, God knows.
Where Christian will be overly comfortable and over obedience in heaven above , well above the mountain tops 30,000 foot , smiling down on our hell from being extremely happy,
Send my love to Yahweh, and his insane plan because he will need most of love down here.
Yes, Priests lie. It's the only way to perpetuate the hoax of a G/god. How else do you think it would be accomplished? It certainly isn't made of truth.
Yeah I know. It rescues wealth and power from the simpletons who would give it to them.
If you're on a sinking ship, the ship is going down regardless of what you do. If you sacrifice your life to save that of someone else so they don't go down with the ship but you do. Then and only then, do you truly understand love. Until then, you must learn to love yourself until you do.
Only someone already dead would never know the ship was sinking. Otherwise, not possible. Consciousness would ensure a person would know.
Yes, dead either way.
You know you're not helping yourself here, right? Anything but life is hell. So get real.
Yeah, I've heard the tale. It's not believable by and rhyme or reason.
Am I going somewhere I don't know as of yet? Or are you going somewhere which you haven't yet told me?
Me. My ISP is paid through July 4th. I'm totally out of money. The park manager has given me food through a food bank, so I wont starve. But my internet access ends on July 4th. July 4th is a holiday, so I'm taking my modem to the cable company on July 3rd. And that is that.
Bush is better than Quayle...remember Quayle? When serving Quayle, a crisp white wine is preferable...but bush goes with any wine! Recently the U.S. Gov decided that previous administrations had short changed the tribes on what were basic treaty elements, and are making reparations to the tribes to the tune of $90 million dollars. This just happened and concerns the period of time going back to the early 1990's...not 1890's. Thanks for the cash, guys...!
So if we can change destinations perhaps there was no one destination as we once might of thought.
Yes it is.
Even if that neighborhood is a global community.
Everything falls into place...click....click....click, like the fall of dominoes. We are also dominoes, click, click, click.Now who set up the damned dominoes?
You're alive aren't you?
So then, what does having a God matter?
Are we all not in the same boat?
Are we all not quivering bags of skin?
Haha sorry but you made me laugh with the term quivering bags of skin. Never heard it put quite like that before. Hehe.
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