I don't believe the crap that is being published, and stay published.

1. 60

   LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

   So far this morning:  Forbidden topics with HP and Adsense, Nonsensical, so badly spun, even with the | used for spinning.  Another one gives step by step instructions, etc as to how to do some hacking.
   
   What is funny?  Report a forum post with a link in it and see how fast it disappears! No, I am sick of spam too.  But also sick of crap content that is approved. Yet they want quality content!!

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      The Examiner-1posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Give them time, they remove it but just not immediately because they have so much to read and do besides read the Hubs. They are approving Hubs, fixing problems, etc.

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   2. 87

      Camille Harrisposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Linda,
      
      Thank you for taking the time to report content - I moderated one of the spun Hubs you're referencing here.
      
      I understand that it is frustrating to see this type of junk published on the site, but please know that we are doing our best with the lean staff we have. We hate it as much as (if not more than) you do and are working on ways to detect it earlier and more effectively.
      
      Until the day we can stop it before it starts, we sincerely appreciate your reporting of rule violating content as well as your patience while we review and moderate it.
      
      Thank you,
      
      Camille, Moderator

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      1. 93

         davidlivermoreposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         "Lean staff"?
         
         Didn't you just buy out another site?
         
         So many things on the site are failing.  The stats don't work, the hubs being published are junk, etc.
         
         Maybe money needs to be spent on quality control and hiring staff to improve the existing site before you start buying out other sites.
         
         Just a suggestion.

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      peachpurpleposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      really? I must have missed these type of hubs. I look more on recipes hubs. Yes, i agree that those type of hubs should be flag down

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2. 60

   LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

   The crap being published and showing up on news feed is sickening when so many others work hard at doing it the right way.

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3. 60

   LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

   I have seen some things unpublished, but they allow the same person to do it over and over again. I have begun to recognize names of those who produce this crap.

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      The Examiner-1posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Report him/her so that they know who to watch for and do something about, otherwise this will continue.

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      Sed-meposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      One man's crap is another man's fertilizer? Or something like that...

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         Cardisaposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         OMG, that cracked me up!

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4. 0

   calculus-geometryposted 9 years ago

   Do you have any links?  Put a space after the 'http' so it's not clickable, if you like. Also, how are you finding them? Through email notifications or searching the site? Thanks.

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5. 70

   philosophicalbritposted 9 years ago

   I would like to see some of these 'forbidden' topics, so I can judge for myself. Even so, it does sound like a problem D:

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      The Examiner-1posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      I saw a title, "The Little Black Book of Scams", and so far it has 9 comments on HubPages.

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6. 60

   LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

   Thank you for responding Camille.  I sent a message to you.

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7. 60

   LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

   Examiner: I just found that one.  That one talks about various scams and information about avoiding them.
   
   The one I saw this morning gave instructions on doing something that is illegal to do.

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      The Examiner-1posted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Linda,
      I did not read it, I only saw the title.

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8. 60

   LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

   Oh, okay. It was a how to!

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9. 84

   rebekahELLEposted 9 years ago

   I notice it the most very early in the morning before I leave for work, a lot of it is outside of the US.  (at least what I'm noticing)
   I wish there was a way we could report when we're on a mobile device.  I see it and can't report it if I'm on my phone.

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10. 60

    LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

    rebekahELLE:  Yes it is outside US. Some places, we are going to bed when they are getting up.  Seems to start around 1 am EST and continues until about 9 am EST.

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       rebekahELLEposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       I notice my feed ( I follow a lot of topics) is full of junk in the early AM hours.  I generally check it around 6 AM EST, the west coast isn't up yet.  It would be great if HP could hire a night time spam moderator when most of it gets published.

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11. 60

    LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

    I don't know if they have around the clock staff or not.  Seems as though spammed forums are taken care of quickly. It is the crap hubs that takes awhile.

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       Barbara Kayposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Another thought is that staff is 2 to 3 hours behind most of us time wise. Their working day starts a little later than the rest of us due to the time schedule in California. That is probably why they are catching these right away if they are written early in the morning. It makes you wonder how the quality assessors are doing though and if they are getting approved or not.

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12. 88

    Kathleen Odenthalposted 9 years ago

    ive been ranting about this since the day I started writing.

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13. 60

    LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

    I have been here 3 years and the older hubbers were ranting about it back then.

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       Venkatachari Mposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Anyhow, it has been resolved now and we should think about other ways to stop such craps in future. I hope we can't put the whole responsibility on staff itself. We also should keep vigil or whenever we come across them, we should immediately report such matters to hubpages, just like our this responsible hubber Linda Smith. I appreciate you Linda.

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14. 88

    Kathleen Odenthalposted 9 years ago

    Why is it not the staffs responsibility to ensure quality content on their own site Venkatachari? Thats ridiculous. Thats why they get a salary and we get pennies.

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15. 61

    taiwokareemposted 9 years ago

    I once asked a question about Hubpagrs app for windows phone and I was shocked to see it deleted. Ever since then, I hardly participated in forum posts

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16. 60

    LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

    Exactly Kathleen.  I didn't even try to make sense out of that one.

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17. 94

    SmartAndFunposted 9 years ago

    If a new hub shows up on our feed, does that mean it has gone through QAP? Or do they show up on the feed immediately, and then go to the QAP? I would think QAP would be catching lots of the junk and spam, so maybe hubs show up on our feed before they've been reviewed for quality. (?)

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       The Examiner-1posted 9 years agoin reply to this

       On the Hub Hopper it is read by a certain amount of Hubbers who see it on there, and then I think it goes through a machine for the final check for its ranking to be featured. To be checked by a human it has to be reported after it has been read on screen.

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          SmartAndFunposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          But do new hubs show up on our feed page immediately upon the author hitting "publish," or do they stay off of our feed until after they have been reviewed by the QAP people (not hub hopping)? It seems that the feed page is where people are seeing the spammy articles, so I'm wondering if articles show up on the feed before it has been determined by QAP whether they will be featured or unfeatured.

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             The Examiner-1posted 9 years agoin reply to this

             Well I can tell you that I have published Hubs and they are pending on my stats page, but I get comments on them. I found out that these come from my followers, but I have not seen my new Hubs appear before they are featured. So unless there is a way to get around this, which I doubt very much, I do not think so.
             It just depends on how many followers that you have. The comments, and your replies, for your new Hub will show up but as far as I know your Hub does not until after it is featured. Just the comments from your followers showing the title, summary and intro picture of your Hub.

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          2. 84

             rebekahELLEposted 9 years agoin reply to this

             It appears that they show up as soon as they're published.  When I go to the author profile, numerous times the hub is not listed, or there is no featured content.  Some of it is published within minutes of the author becoming a member.

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          3. 92

             Phyllis Doyleposted 9 years agoin reply to this

             S&F, I have had comments on hubs long before they are featured and it has happened often. So, I know new hubs appear on the news feed before they go through QAP.

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                oceansnsunsetsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                This has happened to me before as well.  Not often, but it has. My schedule is allowing me to post more hubs again, which makes me happy.  I feel a little out of the loop in regards to what hubs are being talked about, but I am getting an idea.

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18. 60

    fpherj48posted 9 years ago

    Linda, I hear you loudly and clearly.  I can also feel for all of the writers here who work so hard to present excellent hubs, within all the guidelines, yet we have to come across such garbage on our site.  At this point, my feeling is that all the flagging I've done complete with valid info and explanations, has not done a single thing  to rid our site of the garbage, I'm tired of pointing things out to staff. 
    Perhaps I'll become motivated again, but it really is a sad state of affairs and I agree with you and the others on your thread.
    We're busy individuals, doing our best to put out quality hubs.  We all have the best interests of our site in mind.  Hubpages success helps our success.and vice versa.
    The reality is, it isn't part of our description to police the site.  HP makes the big bucks, while we make.....can I say it?  Pennies.  Sadly, the writers have to knock themselves out silly to make some money, because HP sure as hell doesn't pay. The least they can do is "listen" to us and make the changes that have been necessary for so long.

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       Mark Ewbieposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       I completely agree.

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    2. 87

       Marisa Wrightposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       I have to correct you there.  "HP makes the big bucks" - what makes you think so?
       
       When Panda hit HubPages in early 2011, it was only just about to break even.   Take a look at how drastically traffic, and therefore income, dropped when Panda hit - and how far it has (or rather, hasn't) recovered since then.  Now ask yourself how much profit they're making.
       
       Also remember, if you're making pennies, HubPages is making pennies too - because you're sharing the revenue 60/40.  That is HP's only source of income.  Sure, they're getting those pennies from EVERY author, but it still isn't a fortune.

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       1. 0

          calculus-geometryposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          I always thought the owners of HubPages made most of their money from Yieldbuild, the advertising platform they also own (owned?) and implemented on HubPages. Strangely, the website for YB doesn't work anymore.

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             LindaSmith1posted 9 years agoin reply to this

             Yieldbuild:  Founders: Jay Reitz, Paul Edmondson, Paul Deeds
             
             There is a lot of information about the site, but the site itself does not come up. Get a webpage not available.

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       2. 60

          fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Marissa,  ..I really do not know with certainty that HP Owners make the big bucks, as I stated in my comment.  I base this on the fact that Hp has continued to survive and thrive despite the hurdles.  I know that all of these people are educated professionals who made a wise, joint decision to start HP, all coming from well-paying careers.  Surely in the years since, they have found it "lucrative" enough to continue.  They also recently hired (according to them) top notch "Ace" editors who charge them quite a bit.  They just bought Squidoo.
          It is not  negative nor unwarranted that HP owners would make a lot of money.  That's the American way.  Businesses are for that very purpose:  Making Money.
          My intention was and is to make my point in terms of we writers feeling more responsibility & taking action against the garbage Linda Smith speaks of.....as we all try to keep our Community litter free.
          My point was:  This is their business and they reap (and I'll say it again) the big bucks while we make pennies.  Writers have to hustle like mad and promote themselves and perform magic to increase their earnings.  There really is something a bit wrong with this picture.
          After 3 and a half years, I can honestly say that I have experienced an inordinate amount of disappointment, frustration and exiting by writers based on issues that point directly to management.
          It should be evident to all of us that the vast majority of us stay here because of ONE ANOTHER, as well as our love for the art of writing.
          I did not intend to sway this thread from Linda's point, but only to bolster it with my opinion and agreement.
          BTW.....I'll take those "pennies" that go to HP from HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF WRITERS.  I'm sure it would be a "tad bit" more than what most of earn on our own.  Facts are facts.
          I based my statement on common sense of observation as I stated above...and so although I don't KNOW.....this is what  "Makes me think so."   You obviously have some inside information that perhaps we are not privy to and you are free to interject your comments. You have been here many years and are much more familiar with information than I am.  If I am blatantly wrong, I have no problem standing corrected.   Thank you Marissa. Have a nice Thanksgiving.

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             Jayne Lancerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

             +1

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       3. 84

          rebekahELLEposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Deleted
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             Marisa Wrightposted 9 years agoin reply to this

             It was a statement made by either Paul or Jason in an interview at the time (before Panda).   They shared that information because they were proud of being so close to break-even after such a short time - much shorter than most other dot com businesses.  Of course, they had no idea what was just about to happen.
             
             I've kept it in mind ever since, because it enabled me to be more accepting of the changes that reverberated long after Panda - this was a site fighting for its survival.  I have no idea how their finances are now, but you only have to look at the traffic to make an assessment.
             
             I'll try to find it but unfortunately I can't remember which magazine or site it was with.

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                rebekahELLEposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                Thanks for the info.  I thought you meant it was a statement they made on the HP site itself, which I couldn't recall reading. I know that the kind of traffic a site receives may result in lower value/revenue.
                I do recall this interview from SEL with Paul E. two years after Panda.

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                1. 87

                   Marisa Wrightposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                   Yes, I remember that one too.   These two quotes are relevant:
                   
                   "Financially, we had to hire more people to moderate the site’s content. At the same time, revenues were down significantly, and the traffic we were still receiving had a substantially lower value.
                   
                   As subsequent Panda updates further diminished our income, we had to lay off several people and have continued to adjust our cost structure to adjust to the constant fluctuations in traffic."
                   
                   One the positive side, he also says:
                   
                   "We have learned a lot about the character and tenacity of our team and the HubPages community. Despite Google’s constant changes, we persist and are optimistic about the future. We know that there is a way forward, and we will find it."

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                Barbara Kayposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                I remember that article too. I tried to find it and couldn't. Someone shared the link in the forums back when it was on one of the sites.

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19. 88

    Kathleen Odenthalposted 9 years ago

    Hm Marisa, you speak like you know how much the staff makes a bit too well....

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       ThisisMissyMissposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       It's not hard to figure out whether a company is doing okay financially.  You can check SEO reports for the website, plus Google the company to find out whether they're receiving funds from angel investors, etc.  There are other methods as well, but I'm tired and don't feel like delving into it all.

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20. 91

    Millionaire Tipsposted 9 years ago

    My theory is that there is an algorithm that decides what you see in the feed.  Besides the Hubbers and Topics you're following.  I may have even read that sometime, don't remember.
    
    So if you see a hub in the feed, click on it to see if it is a hub with a reportable offense, the algorithm says, "hey, she likes stuff like this."  So then you see more. You keep clicking to keep reporting.  And pretty soon your whole feed is just covered with it.

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21. 0

    M L Morganposted 9 years ago

    I'm following this thread, it's good to take note of other peoples opinions on what consists of a poor topic, or a bad hub. I too have spotted a few poorly written hubs; that look as though they haven't been proof read.
    I came to Hubpages because I thought it was a way to share my passion and to seek a bit of recognition for my efforts. Being published is thrilling, I was so pleased to see my writing featured. But now I'm starting to doubt it's an accomplishment and maybe Hubpages is just another form of blogging, would I be correct? The jury is out for me at the moment

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    1. 91

       Millionaire Tipsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       No, HubPages is not blogging.  We try to write quality, evergreen articles that are a magazine style. 
       There are many more restrictions about the kind of things you can post. 
       
       Although you can post them, they will be unfeatured or unpublished pretty soon.

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22. 71

    Baby-Boomer-58posted 9 years ago

    If we lived in a perfect world it would be realistic to expect hp to be free from all faults.
    
    However this is not a perfect world. I'm not perfect, I doubt any individual hubber is perfect, and it seems a mighty big ask to expect hp and staff to be on top of all things at all times.
    
    The question I find myself asking is 'How much good does it do the site - and therefore the writers - to be constantly talking the site down?'
    
    Writing directly to the team via email every time someone wants to highlight a problem would keep the dirty laundry from public view. I know I would have published a lot more hubs if my confidence wasn't shaken by the negative tone of much of the content in the forums.
    
    The occasional crap hub can slip by unnoticed. Forum threads highlighting them are much more obvious.

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    1. 60

       fpherj48posted 9 years agoin reply to this

       Baby-Boomer58.....I too am a proud baby boomer and feel comfortable speaking peer to peer.  Please keep something in mind, as far as forums are concerned, (just as with anything on this site) HP has the power and control to simply remove/delete whatever they choose.  They may do that with this particular thread, who knows?  but they have the control, nonetheless. 
       
       In terms of "expectations," HP EXPECTS, in fact states clearly the RULES writer's must follow to build and maintain our site, as well as succeed personally.  There are expectations on both sides, as there should be.  I myself have the faith and confidence in HP to "be on top of things" the greater majority of time.  Most especially with thousands of assistants.....that would be US, the writers.
       
       While it can be perceived that these threads are "talking the site down," that may be shallow perception.  This concern and frustration stems from our passion for our site and the desire to improve all aspects.  This should be obvious.
       
       If every writer who had any concern or issue sent a private email to the TEAM, they would be buried daily in an avalanche that surely could not be dealt with except to "LISTEN, consider, confer, create solutions, and announce new & better ideas to their writers/members in an ALL-site correspondence."  HP has no difficulty mass producing more rules and/or admonishments or relaying bad news.
       
       Confidence must not be directed by alleged "negative tone" in forums.  Our individual confidence is our very own and is that which WE control. 
       
       Finally, Baby-Boomer, if in fact the sole issue was an "Occasional" crap hub, that would be fine.  All one need do is cruise our site to see that "occasional" is far from accurate. 
       I understand and respect where you may be coming from and only ask that you might try to understand the true meanings within this forum thread.   Peace, Paula

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       Millionaire Tipsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

       When I worked at my former employer, I found that I was constantly criticizing everything about it.  The criticism fed on itself to a point where I could not think of any positive things about the company.  That is why I quit.   I should have left earlier, or kept my thoughts to myself though.  I had helped create a culture where criticizing was the status quo. If I had left earlier, that the negativity wouldn't have remained - most of the people in my unit left soon after I did.
       
       I think it is important to think about the positives about what you are doing.  After all, if there aren't any positives, there's no point in sticking around.

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          Baby-Boomer-58posted 9 years agoin reply to this

          Thank you for sharing your experience MT. I have worked in places where the remaining people achieved great things after the negativity-generators moved on. You clearly illustrate my point.
          
          Thanks again.

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23. 93

    PegCole17posted 9 years ago

    Linda, I'm in agreement that it is frustrating to be barraged with total junk in the feed or elsewhere. It seems ludicrous that Hub Pages has hired editors whose objectives are to "fix" high traffic hubs when we have so many articles of poor quality that need serious work. If we were to raise the perception of the site in the eyes of readers and big G, traffic would improve. It's basic root cause analysis.
    
    If it's a question of making high traffic articles prettier or getting rid of the junk, I opt for junk removal. In the survey asking why I opted out of the HubPro program, I wish the survey addressed the real issues, like those you've mentioned in this thread. HP supports the philosophy that if it isn't broken, it still needs fixing. I fail to see the reasoning behind this.

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24. 60

    LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

    PegCole: Totally agree with you.  The junk was here before I started 3 years ago, and the complaints were being made then and even before I began here.  OOOOPS!!!  This sounds so familiar!   I know another site where writers complained about the quality, the spam, the copied content that was brought here, etc.  What happened to that site?   It no longer exists, other than content has been moved to HP.  Other sites like HP have gone by the wayside!   They like pretty hubs with pretty images, and videos.  That is catching on because now I am seeing hubs that are nothing but a title and photos.
    
    Right now, I am working on sites I haven't done much with for awhile.  Content that would have gone here, is now going to my sites. We have the holidays to get through and winter snow for many.  But I think during the next year, HP is going to see another Exodus of writers.

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25. 94

    SmartAndFunposted 9 years ago

    I, too, hate the junk that spammers try to put up here, but the point I was trying to make is that **hopefully** when we see junky, spammy hubs in our feeds it is because those hubs have just been published and have not yet gone through the QAP process and deemed unfit for the site. I am **hopeful** that none of this junk actually becomes featured content. I believe this is the point of the QAP.
    
    I am not certain this is what is happening, and I do report newly published junk when I see it. I know QAP has cleaned up lots of the older junk, too, but not all of it -- so do keep reporting it when you find spammy older hubs, as well.
    
    My **hope** is that much of the junk we find is not actually featured. I believe this is the purpose of QAP. I'm sure some bad articles slip through, though -- so keep reporting it -- but **hopefully** there is not much of it which actually becomes featured, thanks to QAP. I hope. LOL.

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26. 60

    LindaSmith1posted 9 years ago

    I read a couple of those interviews today.
    
    Famous last words
    We are working on it
    We are getting rid of the spam, copied content.  That was 2 years ago, and the crap keeps on coming on top of the old crap that is still here.

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