I'll Have the Swine Flu and a Side of Fries, Please

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  1. profile image0
    pgrundyposted 14 years ago

    I spent the day in Indiana taking my 23-year-old son to the doctor. He's been deathly ill for two weeks and has taken a turn for the worse over the last couple days. He has no health insurance, so I went so he could get treated. (I paid.)

    The doctor said he probably had flu the first week, possibly Swine Flu but they are no longer testing because so many people have it and the treatment is the same. But now he has secondary infections in his sinuses and chest. So he got some antibiotics and a note to take to his job, with instructions from the doctor that he is NOT to go to work until he is better. The note excuses him through Saturday night, when he is scheduled.

    He's a COOK in a local sports bar right next to a BIG BIG BIG college football school. So TONS of rich people come in on game weekends, get drunk, eat stuff, get drunker, and so forth.

    Here's the thing--Most of the staff is deathly ill and has been coming in ill for fear of losing their jobs. He worked three nights of the last two weeks with SWINE FLU cooking people's FOOD and now he's sick as hell.

    So he drops off the note and the kitchen manager throws his clipboard at him and starts freaking out. This same guy was off for over a week with the same damn thing.

    What do you think of this? How many sick people are serving our food, cutting our meat, running up our groceries, and so on and so forth.

    I was gonna write a hub but I decided to just vent here instead. sad

    1. dutchman1951 profile image60
      dutchman1951posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I see a new commercial comming......

      "They gave us the H1N1, so we...can give you...McCafe!....lol

      this is a scarry thought

    2. emdi profile image63
      emdiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      this is one of the pathetic situation of  US healthcare system. In Germany, even if I am a foreigner, but working here, healthcare is almost free, we just need to pay 10 euro for each quarter and 5 euro for medicine. I can tell that, if the employer does the same thing here in Germany, this is his last day in business.

      1. profile image0
        pgrundyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        Here you just pay off the health inspector.

        End of story.

        If they fire my son though, I'm sending articles about it to every major paper in the midwest, the CDC, the mayor's office, and the health inspector. Honestly, it isn't just about my son. We're in the middle of a pandemic, and the 'plan' most U.S. businesses have for coping with it is, spread the disease faster.

        That's insane.

        1. emdi profile image63
          emdiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          I think its a good idea. You can also write a hub about it. I hope Obama will bring some change.

    3. Sufidreamer profile image81
      Sufidreamerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Other comments have addressed the sickness part, but that bit really gets to me. The prick has no justification for throwing things at your son, however bad his weekend is.

      That crosses the line mad

      LondonGirl - A few years ago, my chef friend contracted Paratyphoid whilst on holiday in India. He was paid, by the government, to take six months off work and he was not allowed to use public toilets.

      Seems a little cheaper than dealing with an outbreak smile

      1. Amanda Severn profile image96
        Amanda Severnposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        Perhaps the swine flu epidemic should be regarded as a dry run for something a little more scary and life-threatening. Judging by the stories posted here, it would be round the globe and back by lunchtime next Tuesday!

    4. Daniel Carter profile image64
      Daniel Carterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Having read several of the comments, I think really that if we put on your son's shoes for about a millisecond, we would want the restaurant to be responsible in helping preserve public health. But we are all afraid of this meltdown over the past year and people act like there isn't a dollar on the planet.

      The truth is, in the face of fear, we actually in many cases need to act the opposite of what our fear tells us. For example, the way to get the economy going is for us to loosen up a little (of what we reasonably can) and "invest" in each other by buying/hiring goods and services.

      The fear of swine flu is that if we shut down the business, we go under. Well, if you kill all your clients with it, you go under. Duh. And even IF you don't die, and you figure out (finally) that sports bar gave it to me, where's the loyalty in returning business?

      "I got food poisoning at...." is a HUGE business referral for the negative.

      "I got swine flu at..." is the same thing.

      Call the board of health, whatever, but the best, most powerful referral is word of mouth. Put that in a blog somewhere, tell your friends and neighbors everyone's got swine flu at the sports bar and watch them shut down voluntarily.

    5. profile image52
      0129kittyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      OMG what is going on with this swine flu.... I think it's more than they're telling us.  That's crazy that some people are dying and some are not; what's going on....I don't know whether to immunize my family or not; some people say not to and others say to go ahead and get it done.  I'm afraid of side effects that can also kill you.  So what are we supposed to do.  I agree about all those employers making employees come to work when they're ill...that's exactly how the illness is spread; don't they understand that????????

    6. staceyleah74 profile image60
      staceyleah74posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      i keep telling everyone i know...the best protection during swine flu season is to stay home as much as possible. when you have to go out...wash, wash, wash your hands!

      now i can mark eating out off my list of good reasons to go out! lol

      thanks for the info

  2. jiberish profile image82
    jiberishposted 14 years ago

    This is a scary thought.  I'm never eating out again.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Yeah! I mean, these alumni have money coming out there ears, and they're going to be sucking down germs without even knowing it. I hope they drink A LOT so they can kill those germs.

    2. geminimoon profile image60
      geminimoonposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Same here!

  3. profile image0
    pgrundyposted 14 years ago

    One more thing:

    Aren't there laws against this? Like, health or sanitation laws? What is the matter with these people?

    Right now, Swine Flu is unpleasant but not lethal in most cases. But if it does turn lethal, this is what we're dealing with: Lots of employers with skeleton crews that they pressure to work sick, which only spreads the disease.

    Seriously, I think it's a public health issue, not just a personal issue.

  4. profile image0
    lynnechandlerposted 14 years ago

    I completely understand where you are coming from for me it is my daughter. She teaches at a day care and they threatened her today after being out for two days that if she did not return or go to the doc and get a note they would fire her.

    She can't afford health insurance and I am not able to pay her bills to take her to the doc. We did call our local physician but they only offered up the usual juice and rest scenario for it.

    She went back to work in fear of losing her job. The age group she takes care of is in the 1yr range.

    It isn't right to be made to feel this way just because you can't get to the doc or afford to go.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      OMG That's even more horrifying than the restaurant scenario. Kids and young people are the most vulnerable. Do these people not worry about being shut down? Why is this being allowed to happen? They should say to each parent who drops off a child, "Half of our staff has Swine Flu but don't worry, we pressured them to come in."

    2. frogdropping profile image78
      frogdroppingposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Jesus - were the hell do you live? You get sick and can't avail yourself of health care because you can't afford it? What the hell government allows that to happen?

      1. profile image0
        pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        You're making a wry joke, right?

        Those were my exact thoughts. His doc was very nice though and charged us half of her normal fee. Still, the whole thing sucks. His job wants all this loyalty from the employees but they pay them for crap, no benefits, and throw things at them. Nice.

      2. Marisa Wright profile image88
        Marisa Wrightposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        I had that reaction too.

    3. nicomp profile image67
      nicompposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I'm curious how much health insurance would cost for your daughter. Have you looked into it?

      1. profile image0
        pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        My daughter doesn't need health insurance. This thread is about my son. If you are curious about what it would cost why don't YOU look into it?

        1. nicomp profile image67
          nicompposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Sorry, someone wrote (see above) that "she can't afford health insurance." I have no clue what it might cost for her; I couldn't possibly look into it.

  5. Flightkeeper profile image68
    Flightkeeperposted 14 years ago

    I would say so.  Shouldn' the food inspector or some official be informed? Especially if it's most of the kitchen and wait staff.

  6. Jane@CM profile image61
    Jane@CMposted 14 years ago

    I'm scared to even think about it.  I read an article earlier in the week stating several things.  Parents are sending their kids back to school before their flu is over, because said parents can't afford to take anymore time off.  Many people are continuing to go to work with flu symptoms and temps, for the reason you stated, afraid they'll loose their jobs.

    I think I'll eat in for awhile, we are one of the states that has "wide spread H1N1" and they believe it will be an epidemic before the vaccination even gets here.

    Hope your son feels better soon.  His manager should be _______.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks Jane. All the way down there I was thinking things like, "OK, if they have to hospitalize him, how do we do this? He has no property, so we'll put him as the responsible party, plus he can always go bankrupt but I can't," and so on and so forth. It's sickening to be thinking those kinds of things AND be worrying about your kid.

      Indiana isn't one of the widespread H1N1 states--it's just below that--but apparently it is very, very contagious. It doesn't take long once it shows up for tons of people to get it.

      1. jiberish profile image82
        jiberishposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        I wonder if mandatory wearing of gloves would make a difference?

        1. profile image0
          pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          I don't know. Would you want your meal prepared by someone with Swine Flu who was wearing gloves? Would you eat that meal?

          1. jiberish profile image82
            jiberishposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            No, but if aren't willing to send those people home at least they could do something.

      2. Jennifer Banks profile image60
        Jennifer Banksposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        I can not believe a health care system would bankrupt a young man in the event he may need to have treatment as an inpatient!
        I live in Ireland and i have 24hr home visit support by my Doctor if needed; maximum charge $100 approx. If I required treatment in hospital I would pay a maximum of $500, regardless of what treatment or tests I require. Like any health care system we have some problems, but i could never fault the doctors, nurses or hospital; when your ill they take care of you.

      3. LondonGirl profile image81
        LondonGirlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        That's awful, on top of all the horrible thoughts when someone is ill.

  7. frogdropping profile image78
    frogdroppingposted 14 years ago

    Pam ... seriously - I'm disgusted to hear how your son has been treated by his superior. What an arsehole. And I would imagine there are specific laws.

    In the UK you can't handle food etc when you're ill with something that you can pass on. And I agree with you, it's a public health issue. I'd be looking into the issue, in your shoes. Then making some feetmarks about it.

    I hope your son gets well soon - he sounds as though he sorely need some r & r.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Yes, I wanted to contact the Public Health Department right away and he begged me not to. I did tell the doctor and HE told her the name of the restaurant. I think I will send an alert to the CDC though. Not like they care but maybe they care. I don't think it should just be let go either.

      He was so sick he was crying on the phone. I haven't heard him cry since he was 8. I was glad I could help. At least he has some time now to recover and some meds to help. If he isn't better by Monday the doc said to call her.

      1. frogdropping profile image78
        frogdroppingposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Reading that part, about your son crying - that's harsh Pam. he must have been so damn ill. And yet he still went to work, in order to inform his boss of his whereabouts. The mean bastard (I don't swear much, but ...) I sincerely hope he was having a very very bad day and this is not the way he normally treats his staff team.

        And maybe you should hub this. In a very very LOUD way. Make sure the search engines find it too. It's seriously disgusting. Maybe you're highlighting it will help make a difference.

        I'm a mum - I would have been heartbroken in your shoes. And I bet you were when you took the phone call.

        1. profile image0
          pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          I was so upset I ran out of the house in my slippers and had to unlock the door and go in and put on proper shoes. He's an hour and half away, so I really was scared. But now he's on the right track, thank goodness.

          I have to think his boss really was just having the day from hell. This weekend is a big game and his skeleton crew staff is all sick as hell. But that doesn't really excuse it.

          I might hub this. Not tonight though. Maybe tomorrow.

          1. frogdropping profile image78
            frogdroppingposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Truly - I can imagine exactly how you felt. He may not have the money to protect him should he become ill but at least he's got you.

      2. LondonGirl profile image81
        LondonGirlposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        There is nothing like one's Mum when you feel terrible. Glad you could get there for him!

        1. Amanda Severn profile image96
          Amanda Severnposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          I hope he's on the mend now Pam. This whole health insurance thing has ground on for far too long. I'd such great hopes that Obama would deliver on his promises, but it all seems to have gone quiet lately.

  8. profile image0
    lynnechandlerposted 14 years ago

    Either way it is way serious and nothing can be done cause if she loses this job it could be a while before she finds another.

    In the case of your son there are health issues with the state that could get the place shut down for a while. It doesn't help your son cause I'm sure he needs money just like my daughter.

    In my daughters case its like Jane said the parents are just as much to blame cause they can't afford the time off for this bug thus the kids go back to school way too soon.

    Unfortunately, she brings it home to me. I have no immune system due to a severly compromised thyroid and several other issues. When we called the doc last week she sent me a script of a high dose of amoxicillin to start taking as a precaution.

    I hope your son gets better soon.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you. I hope your daughter gets well soon too. And take care of yourself if you can.

      I just think that this isn't really being handled very well. All that hullabaloo about it earlier in the year, and now when the crap hits the fan, as usual, no help, no clue.

  9. frogdropping profile image78
    frogdroppingposted 14 years ago

    I wasn't Pam. I know the US folks have to pay for health insurance and I also realise that many can't afford it. But A) I don't know where lynne lives and B) I figured that when US citizens can't afford health care, there's a free alternative that at least covers the basics?

    Anyway - if it's that bad in the US, I don't know what to say. I honestly can't imagine being that ill and not being able to see a doctor for reassurance/diagnosis simply because I didn't have the money.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Frogdropping, amazing as it sounds, if you have no insurance here there is no option besides find somebody with money to help you or go to the ER of a teaching hospital. If you go to the ER though, you're looking at a wait for 6-8 hours, especially during flu season, and a bill that can be in the thousands of dollars. So it's not a good choice unless you're really in a bind.

      What's especially rough is you can't really buy insurance and it's getting harder and harder to find jobs that offer it. I have no insurance and no one will write me a policy because of my depression and cardiac history. I'm well now, but they don't care--they don't want to insure anyone who might get sick.

      My son could probably buy a policy, but he makes $9 an hour and his share of the rent at his apartment (he shares it with two other waiters at his restaurant) is $250. He could be approved for a policy, but he couldn't afford the premiums.

      So that's how it is here. It was harder when they were younger.

      1. frogdropping profile image78
        frogdroppingposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        This is the second time I've been disgusted while reading through this thread. Like I said - what kind of government allows this to go on? Move to the UK. Rick or poor, you're allocated a GP, have access to medical facilities and so on.

        And yes - I'm being glib. Moving overseas is a big thing. But still. *shakes head*

        1. profile image0
          pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

          Believe it or not, Bill and I have talked about leaving the U.S. We started talking about it while Bush was in, and now things are so bad we don't know what will happen really. We're just taking it day by day. I wouldn't want to leave my kids and my grandson--I have two grown daughters, one grandson, and my son, all in Indiana.

  10. profile image0
    lynnechandlerposted 14 years ago

    I actually went out and bought new sheets and have been sterilizing the crap out of the house. My elderly parents live next door and I am in and out of there a good bit during the week. So I also bought sanitizing wipes to carry every where with me.

    Here in GA they are supposed to wear gloves when handling any kind of food whether they actually are is uncertain.

    The daycare has mandates in place but when only a certain portion of the staff follows the rules and the office staff doesn't enforce it then there is a problem with the break down of the chain of command.

  11. lrohner profile image69
    lrohnerposted 14 years ago

    I hope your son feels better very, very soon. (And you're such a good mom.....)

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks lrohner. smile

  12. profile image0
    lynnechandlerposted 14 years ago

    We have not been able to get on any kind of assistance because they consider me able bodied to work even though I am in the process of trying to get my disablility. That one has been a hard road because I can't get to the doc as often as I need.

    She can't afford health care or insurance and her employer offers none. She makes just enough for gov. assisted programs not to apply to her. It is almost enough to make you want to quit and pop out babies just to be able to get some help.

    GA has got to be one of the most bass akwards places when it comes to helping those in need. Anyways off my soap box I hope no one else has to deal with this and that everyone's loved ones gets the help they need and feels better soon.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      That really, really sucks but it's not uncommon. It's hard to get disability. Here in MI, the state is so broke they are cutting the clothing allowance for poor kids from $85 a year to $40 a year. It was in the paper last night. Seriously, I it's getting ugly out there.

      1. Jane@CM profile image61
        Jane@CMposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Many of my hubby's co-workers just moved to MI - they transferred from the facility here to the one just north of Detroit.  They all seem to think they'll be immune there because the state is building them a multi million dollar facility.  We are not going to MI.

      2. nicomp profile image67
        nicompposted 14 years agoin reply to this

        Why should the state buy clothes for poor children? How did we get to the point that people feel entitled to government clothes?

  13. profile image0
    pgrundyposted 14 years ago

    Also when I did have insurance, it left me with over $5000 of bills for a single ER visit even after the insurance paid. So it's not like it was all that helpful.

  14. ediggity profile image60
    ediggityposted 14 years ago

    For those who don't have health insurance, and are concerned with illnesses such as the flue, I suggest looking into natural anti virals.  Some effective supplements include Echinacea, Allicin (Garlic Bulb), Pure Vitamin C, Coconut Oil.  There are many other natural supplements that can also be found with a little research.  However, I also caution that your initial reaction to the sups may vary, especially if you are allergic.  Ex. don't take Allicin if you are allergic to Garlic.  Additionally, what you may percieve as a negative reaction to the sup may actually be the toxins released from the supplement killing off bacteria or virus.  Just food for thought to give people another option.

  15. ~Stacey~ profile image61
    ~Stacey~posted 14 years ago

    Wow, thats really scary! I have a REAL big issue with people dealing with my food as a large percent of people DO NOT wash their hands. There are so many people out there that go to work sick and deal with the public. It is terrifying. I understand your Frustration.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Yes I did call center work for almost 8 years, and people would come in sick as hell because of the attendance policy. They'd have used up their allowed days ill on their kids so that when THEY got sick, they just came in and then it would sweep through the center so fast---I mean you're packed in there like sardines. People would be proud of working sick. I always thought it was so screwed up.

  16. Jane@CM profile image61
    Jane@CMposted 14 years ago

    I would call the health department, in secret.

    Thankfully here we have MNHealth, which is for people who have jobs but no health insurance.

    My daughter's BF just moved out west for school (2 weeks ago) and is now quarantined to her room, she tested positive for H1N1 today.  Has two room mates in her dorm room.

    I am giving a kudos to my son's middle school team, because so many kids are out sick, they are emailing out homework everyday to all the kids on his team.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      That's a good idea.

      It's been all over the news that only about 30% of all businesses say they would be able to stay open if half their employees came down with Swine Flu. Apparently companies are dealing with this by having people work when they have Swine Flu. That's a plan I guess. Not a good one, but that seems to be what is happening.

      What's scary is, if we ever did have a very serious contagious illness we have a perfect set up for spreading it very fast. Swine Flu isn't fun, but it kills fewer people than regular flu...so far. But they still are worried about it combining with a more deadly virus. We're not prepared at all. They put all this BS on the news, but there's no preparation. IF it happened we'd see something truly horrendous and we'd see it fast.

  17. profile image57
    C.J. Wrightposted 14 years ago

    My company has sent out a letter to all employees that if you or a loved one is sick with flu like symptoms, do not come to work. Now this is a fortune 100 company.  Many smaller companies may not be able to sustain such an increase in absentee workers. Also the school district is sending students home when they present with flu like symptoms. Those children sent home can not return for 24hrs and must bring a doctor's note. They must be tested for the flu. This is causing some what of a problem as doctor's offices are being over run with patients.

    As far as a person's inability to pay.  In America that should NOT an issue!  No health care provider can refuse you care soley based on your ability to pay. Plain and simple. If you find doctors doing this in your community, you should be reporting them to their state licensing board and the AMA. Its an ethics violation. They can loose their licesnse. If you call the doctors office and are up front with them about your financial situation you will generally be seen. Now, if you make arrangements via a payment plan and don't follow through, the doctor can go after you legally. 
    What does happen is health insurance companies refuse to cover or refuse to pay claims. Not the same issue.
    What the doctor did for you is normal. When people don't have insurance the cost is lower, not because they are doing you a favor, but because the overhead/paperwork is less. When you shop for a doctor, ask if they have different rates for insured and non insured patients. You will be surprised.

    1. nicomp profile image67
      nicompposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Emergency rooms are required to provide treatment, but not private doctors or clinics.

      Overhead, by definition, does not change if a particular patient pays in cash or files an insurance claim. The doc still has to keep the clerks on staff. A doc may charge an out-of-pocket patient less, but that's mostly a goodwill gesture.

      1. profile image57
        C.J. Wrightposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        By legal definition, yes. Only emergency rooms are required by law to see/stabalize any patient that presents. However the medical profession is also self governed. If a doctor continually behaves unethically it will cost them. Basically my point is this, with doctors their can be serious legal and ethical issues with refusing a patient. For example, a doctor accepts me as a patient. I'm under her care for 6 months. I experience a change in income or employment.  I let the office know that I can't pay the full amount. If at that time the doctor refuses care, she can be in legal trouble. She can also be in trouble with the fraternal organizations that govern ethics in the profession.

        In regards to overhead, absolutely not. If the amount of work increases to create a product or service then so does the cost. Do doctors choose to take a loss of profit in order to benifit the patient? Absolutely. To say that every time they reduce the cost, its just good will is overstating.

  18. profile image0
    lynnechandlerposted 14 years ago

    Not to take away from Pgrundy's sons situation but in order to be seen by a doctor here it is a min payment upfront of $40 for a urgent care clinic. It goes up from there depending on what they do to treat you and you must have payment upfront. Not sure if it is the same where PG is or not.

    Also, she has checked into it and it would cost her $160 a month for insurance premiums. She only brings in around $300 every two weeks now because the day care just cut her hours. With rent and her car insurance and phone for emergency purposes only she can't cover that and eat too.

  19. TrueCures profile image57
    TrueCuresposted 14 years ago

    Swine Flu is just a means of weeding out the weak minded, otherwise it is perfectly harmless. 

    If the Swine Flu doesn't get the mindless consumers Hamster Flu will.  smile

    1. profile image0
      Leta Sposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Em, Ok.  I'm all for mind-body medicine, but not looniness.

      Pam- I'd say quit the stupid job if he has to.  A job isn't worth someone's health.  Been there, done that.  He should get better, then get another job...he is young.  That's how we have gotten by with our present health 'system' this many years, btw...on a wing and a prayer.  And by the fact that the young generally (generally) aren't sick.

      I cannot imagine being very, very ill in any situation like this, however.  It is a frightening thought.

      And as for food and restaurants.  Yep.  Matt is always getting sick from this restaurant and that.  And I only eat prepared entrees.  Never from a buffet unless I know it is very fresh food.

      1. emdi profile image63
        emdiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        When I lived in Copenhagen, I had a wonderful, free medical healthcare from Danish gov. Btw, as every other Danish, I also had a personal doctor.

  20. profile image0
    pgrundyposted 13 years ago

    Thanks all.

    I think he will be OK now. What really bothered me about the whole thing was the public health issue of so many people working sick. Swine Flu isn't the plague--or isn't the plague yet--but should the next plague emerge we're toast.

    We've devised a perfect set up for the rapid transmission of disease. And, just to top it off, we basically have no public health system. Nada. Zilch.

    Someone mentioned awhile back that ER's have to treat anyone who walks in. That isn't true everywhere, as lynnechandler points out, and in the city where my son lives, on a GOOD day, you wait 4-6 hours to be seen and get a bill in the thousands of dollars. So...in the case of an an epidemic, what do you think will happen?

    We could address this as a nation but we aren't.

    1. Daniel Carter profile image64
      Daniel Carterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Pam, an additional bit of info about this flu I came across is rather startling. What happens in adolescents and young adult is that their immune system freaks out, goes into overdrive and bascially "cooks" them. While only a few such cases have been reported where the person was otherwise healthy before flu, it may give a clue about how to proceed to recover.

      If you get start treating this viruse IMMEDIATELY, like within the first 24 to 48 hours with anti-viral stuff (colloidal silver, oregano oil, etc.) you can really  make big head way in preventing a lot of damage. The longer you wait, the worse the damage is to the system. The Drs. will at times prescribe anti-viral meds, but not always. However, these alternatives are powerful, and used correctly will do the trick. (Personal experience.)

      That being said, beyond the initial fight of the virus, you really have to push the basics--bed rest, lots of fluids, and start rebuilding your immune system which is totally trashed. Takes months to really get back into it.

      The reason older adults don't go through the severity (in many cases) is because for some reason their immune systems don't (not always, anyway) go into total overdrive. So for some reason, they can cope with the virus a little better. But it depends so much on the condition of the body, so there are tons of variables.

      Thought I'd pass that along in case it helps anyone.

      Hoping your son has a speedy recovery. This stuff is just evil, and requires lots of patience to get through.

  21. Eaglekiwi profile image76
    Eaglekiwiposted 13 years ago

    Its not just restaurants guys ,c'mon work it out.
    Where do many of the lower socio ecominics employ people from ?

    And hubby works at a food factory and they couldnt care less who washes their hands or not, its disgusting...apathy abounds.

    Supermarkets , sweet girl I talked to in the deli, had been sick for 4 days, no way could she take time off.

    Our food comes from several different sources.

  22. LondonGirl profile image81
    LondonGirlposted 13 years ago

    I spoke to OH about it (he's an employment law barrister) and he reckons that here in the UK, and employer who has someone at work with Swine Flu would be committing a nice range of criminal offences, and health & safety violations, too.

    An employer here has the power to suspend someone for medical reasons, on full pay.

  23. LondonGirl profile image81
    LondonGirlposted 13 years ago

    Sounds much more sensible, Sufi.

  24. edguider profile image64
    edguiderposted 13 years ago

    Wow interesting thread. I work at a restaurant on weekends and never even thought of this. Will need to be extra careful.

  25. Jane@CM profile image61
    Jane@CMposted 13 years ago

    I'm glad he is on the mend!

    My 13 year old is home again today.  He has an on again/off again sore throat, fever, cough, etc. This has been going on for two weeks.  Called doctor & they said keep him home & in bed.  BUT if his throat gets any worse I AM taking him in for a throat culture.

    1. profile image52
      0129kittyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      If he has a fever and it doesn't go away; I would definately take him in.

  26. pageantgirl31413 profile image78
    pageantgirl31413posted 13 years ago

    Health insurance is horrible. Even if you have it, you still end up spending a ton. When I was hospitalized with my son for 2 weeks before I delivered him and his stay in the NICU, if it weren't for being in the military, I would of had to pay $60,000 after the insurance. Can you believe that! It's ridiculous!

  27. Rochelle Frank profile image91
    Rochelle Frankposted 13 years ago

    I think employees who are required to report for work while sick, should wear a mask and gloves, have their pockets stuffed with sanitizer and anti-bac wipes (which they can pass around to others) and pin a large biohazard logo on their shirt.

    1. profile image0
      A Texanposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Or maybe those employees should just stay home instead of going to work ill and possibly infecting many others, irregardless of what the employer says or does.

      1. Rochelle Frank profile image91
        Rochelle Frankposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        That might work too-- but I was hoping the suggested strategy might get the boss to re-think.

        1. profile image0
          A Texanposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          I doubt a boss requiring you to work ill is thinking at all!

  28. Bard of Ely profile image81
    Bard of Elyposted 13 years ago

    Pam, I say you should make a hub about this too! If you do I will share it at Facebook etc because I think people need to know what's going on. As I am sure you've seen I am one of the people campaigning against the mandatory vaccinations and in my head I had been thinking it wasn't a serious illness which many campaigners and conspiracy people are saying - no worse that ordinary flu etc. What you say here shows that it IS a serious problem!

    Where I am currently I haven't heard of any cases of it but I am going back for a week to the UK next week where it is going about. I can only hope I don't get it - I have no doctor and no health insurance and if I get it it is me versus the virus!

    I am very sorry to hear about what your son and you have been going through!

  29. Herald Daily profile image60
    Herald Dailyposted 13 years ago

    I love your writing style, Pam.  I think that if you do a hub about this situation, it would be read by many and probably even get picked up and blogged about, going viral but in a good way. smile

  30. LondonGirl profile image81
    LondonGirlposted 13 years ago

    How is your son now, Pam? On the mend?

  31. JonSterling profile image60
    JonSterlingposted 13 years ago

    I feel for your son - personally I make a living demoing food as a seafood chef daily - and have been out of work for 10 days - I show up everyday so not to lose my job and am sent home.

    Have Blue Cross Blue Shield but cannot afford the 20 percent copay or the 300.00 deductible...so I am out of work until this pandemic stuff leaves yours truly.

    1. staceyleah74 profile image60
      staceyleah74posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      i hope youre better soon! seafood...YUM!!

    2. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      The last time I had insurance it wasn't very helpful. I had a $2500 deductible and 80/20 after that. One trip to the ER left me with over $5,000 in bills AFTER insurance paid. When I lost my job I had the opportunity to continue this crappy policy for $768 a month on COBRA. Since I was out of work I didn't really have $768 a month.

      It was weird--my boss put me in an ambulance and the insurance company made the bank pay for the ambulance. They subrogated against their own client. That was kind of weird.

      I don't think doctors are usually all that helpful unless you need antibiotics or emergency care. Anything else they seem to muck it up. Maybe it's just the docs around here...it's not all that good, although my son's doctor was awesome.

      I wish I could see my vet. Vet's are nice and more affordable.

      1. staceyleah74 profile image60
        staceyleah74posted 13 years agoin reply to this

        lol i know this sounds funny, but i have known people (yes, more than 1 person) who have taken antibiotics given to their dog because they were cheaper to refill! its a sad day when we must resort to that sort of thing!!

        1. profile image0
          pgrundyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          My partner Bill used to be married to a woman who worked for a vet, and then later, for a lab that did animal testing. She always had all kinds of antibiotics and other drugs for animals that they both used when to save money on medical expenses.

          It sounds bad (OK it IS bad) but it's WAY cheaper and it's the same drugs.

          If you need an antibiotic the visit to the GP will cost you $80 and then you still have to buy the drug, so you are into it for $80-$100 minimum the minute you walk in the door sick.

          With the vet you are talking a buck or two for the pills, $40 for the visit.

          If you already have the pills, of course you're gonna use them.

          I'll bet it happens a LOT.

          1. Uninvited Writer profile image76
            Uninvited Writerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            That's funny...well, not too funny. Vets are more expensive here in Canada and drugs for pets cost more too. Thank goodness for health care coverage smile

          2. LondonGirl profile image81
            LondonGirlposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Bloody hell, that's absolutely terrible!

            If I were in the same position as your poor son, the whole medical-treatment-thang would set me back about £7 ($11.50) for the antibiotics, and that's all. Going to the vet would cost a lot more than that!

            Glad to hear he's feeling better, hope you are fit as a fiddle soon, too.

            1. staceyleah74 profile image60
              staceyleah74posted 13 years agoin reply to this

              Insurance companies have driven the prices out of control! The fight has begun to bring some relief to those who can't afford it. My family has wonderful insurance. THANKFULLY! Its nearly the best you can buy and we have still had to pay $1700.00 for a dental visit recently. Its crazy.

  32. profile image0
    pgrundyposted 13 years ago

    Hi everyone,

    Well, my son is much better. He had a secondary infection in his sinuses and chest and once he got on the antibiotics he started to turn around. He got the pill Thursday and by Saturday he was feeling pretty good.

    On the down side, I got sick Saturday, but like Dan Carter mentioned, I jumped on it immediately and I don't feel too bad today. Had a bad two days and now not so much--so I don't know what that was. I had bad pains in my chest and head, breathing trouble, fever--now I feel OK, just tired.

    I think swine flu mostly hits younger people--and it's actually milder than regular flu in most cases. My son got really sick because he got a secondary infection that he couldn't get treatment for until I showed up with money.

    What bothers me is that even though we don't have a killer pandemic at the moment, what we do have is the perfect set-up to SPREAD the plague fast should it appear.

    I agree with Dan too in that we are all acting like there isn't a spare dollar in the country and so we are too willing to do exactly the wrong thing out of panic, and that just makes the downward spiral worse.

  33. profile image0
    pgrundyposted 13 years ago

    BTW--If there wasn't the possibility of bankruptcy hanging over you every time you walk into a real doctor's office or an ER, people might not do these crazy things.

    Seriously, it's always out there--like, will this be a C-spot or my house? Which one am I looking at here?

  34. profile image0
    sneakorocksolidposted 13 years ago

    I'm glad to hear your son is feeling better. The cost of healthcare is outrageous and we have an awesome plan. We still get hugh bills but we can pay them but not easily.(my wife is an executive for an oil company) I don't know what the solution is if it was up to me to pay we'd be in trouble. Our system is so big and there are so many who would drain the system without contributing. I could support a national heathcare system without illegals using it(no amnesty), and no cosmetic surgery and no abortions. I just don't see where there's room for a compromise. So we all face finacial ruin at the drop of a cough.

  35. profile image0
    sneakorocksolidposted 13 years ago

    You live in Indiana! You need to move! Indiana?

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      My son and daughters live there. I live in Michigan now, just south of Kalamazoo.

      Northern Indiana is where I grew up but it's really declined over the past 20 years. The town I grew up in is starting to look like Flint or Detroit.

      Kalamazoo is actually a really nice place to live. It has poor areas and problems, but compared to Indiana it's like a resort town.

      1. profile image0
        sneakorocksolidposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        Michigans better the farther you go north but, families family!

  36. KCC Big Country profile image86
    KCC Big Countryposted 13 years ago

    I just found this thread, I'm only a few days late! Glad to hear your son is doing better Pgrundy!

    Luckily, where I work, in a building of 400 employees, we've had one confirmed case of the swine flu from an employee, but now probably a dozen kids of employees with it.  Our company sent out an email last week that if you or someone in your family has swine flu, you should stay at home and they have even authorized the use of CAT (Catostrophic) time for it instead of having to use your regular sick time or vacation.

    For years they have given annual flu (regular) shots at no cost to their employees.  We'll be taking them on Wednesday.  They have installed units on the wall that dispense alcohol based santizers and cans of Lysol are available in every department. 

    I really appreciate their approach.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      I never go to work sick. Well, now I never go to work, but I mean, I think it's so inconsiderate of others to drag your germs in and share them. Some people are such martyrs about it, and I always think, wow, nice to share, huh?

      My son and his coworkers are so on the edge though--I mean, come on! $9 an hour and no benefits, you don't have much wiggle room there. It doesn't take much to knock you over at that pay level. YOu miss two weeks work with no pay and need money for medicine and a doctor too, that's harsh.

      I'm glad I could at least help, but it scares me if I think about it too hard.

      1. profile image0
        sneakorocksolidposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        I have to be on deaths bed to miss work! I'm the owner and when I'm not there we don't make money! And I'm serious! It's like their brains fall out and run away never to be seen again!

    2. earnestshub profile image84
      earnestshubposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      I think it is very smart for a company to treat it's employees like this. I feel sure they appreciate it. Good for productivity too! smile

  37. profile image0
    pgrundyposted 13 years ago

    I was in call centers for 8 years, so there, if you come in sick, you make EVERYBODY sick because so many people are crammed into such a small space. I've been working for myself since losing my job in a financial call center last October. I make less money, but weirdly, we are doing better. I think it's because it's easier to spend money when you're at work--weird as that sounds. More likely to eat out, buy lunch instead of make it, you need office clothes, etc and so on.

    Of course now I can 'go to work' in my PJs and often do, so I guess I could go to work sick. Happily I rarely get sick these days. It's unusual when I do.

    If I owned my own business I'd do the same as you. The call centers--ugh.

    1. LondonGirl profile image81
      LondonGirlposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Working is expensive - as you say, work clothes, work shoes, travel, dry cleaning, childcare (for some) and all the rest of it.

      1. profile image0
        pgrundyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

        You know, it really is! I sat down and figured out what I spent each week at the vending machines alone--I always got an iced tea for my morning and afternoon break and a bag of pretzels, and it cam to $4 a day or $1,040 a week. After that I brought my own tea and pretzels, but there are a ton of little things like that and if you aren't making a lot to begin with they really add up fast.

        1. LondonGirl profile image81
          LondonGirlposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          More like $1,000 odd a year, surely? Otherwise, that's serious tea drinking (-:

  38. delungleapero profile image34
    delungleaperoposted 13 years ago

    swine flu felt just like a cold. not sweat to get it over from

  39. profile image0
    pgrundyposted 13 years ago

    LOL! Yes of course, $1,040 per year. Yikes. lol

  40. profile image0
    sneakorocksolidposted 13 years ago

    When you work at home you also miss the stuff going around. Lets hope we find some middle ground on healthcare that we all can live with, because this has to change.

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      We actually agree on that. I don't want to be forced to buy a crappy policy like I had at the bank. I'd rather see the whole thing go down than be forced into that.

      What I wish is that somehow we could pay reasonable amounts in cash or make direct payments to GPs for regular care, and then carry insurance for the catastrophic stuff only. When I was a kid, it was like that. You didn't go broke going to your GP. It was only surgeries and so forth that were hard. Now you can't walk into the waiting room without thinking about whether you will get to keep your house. That's just so jacked up.

      I don't mind paying out of pocket. But I can't pay current fees, they're nuts. It costs $80 to walk into my GPs exam room. That's the flag drop.

  41. Mighty Mom profile image79
    Mighty Momposted 13 years ago

    Hi Pam,
    Did your son get better?

    1. profile image0
      pgrundyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      He did. Just needed the antibiotic for the bronchitis and sinus infection. He's already up and about again. Thanks for asking. smile

  42. fortunerep profile image69
    fortunerepposted 13 years ago

    I was reading this yesterday and I am sorry pgrundy for your son.  My three year old had the swine flu last week.  I had to take her to the doctor 3 times before they tested her, now my niece who lives in the same house has it as well and she had to go twice.  That means that during the time of not knowing they could have spread it, I did not send them to school or daycare, I am fortunate to be able to work for myself and I have a partner so that was no problem, but there is always that "what if"  I am in NC and it is widespread, as well as Georgia and Indiana is not far behind.  It is all about the money, and what a way to boost the economy than for pharm. companies to rake it in.  The Tamiflu was $51 bucks for the small child and 86 for the 8 year old.  To me, that's a chunk of change. They have insurance but if we didn't, I don't know what we would have done.  There are so many people that will probably die just because they don't have the money to see a doc or buy the meds.  You would think our President would make allowances for those in this situation.  Maybe he is too busy figuring out what he is going to do with the kickbabk money from the pharmacutical companies, or worrying about Kanye West.



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