I really would hate to be a woman..
Here's the thing..........
No woman president yet....religious ridicule.........no power..
Men making a complete mess of things and coming up with different forms of bull every day and all you do is follow.
It's a man's world and you lot are second class citizens
50% of humanity are silent voters.
What kind of a democracy is that.
We need a civil war and I volunteer to be a spy for your side.
Help me help you!
For someone who defends women’s rights it seems like you haven’t done your homework.
There have been several female presidents in history. Just to mention a few:
Ms McAleese, Ireland's second female president (first elected president in 1997 and won a second term, without a contest, in 2004).
Dilma Vana Rousseff, current President-elect of Brazil.
Laura Chinchilla Miranda, the first female President of Costa Rica.
Violeta Barrios Torres de Chamorro, former Nicaraguan president (elected 1990)
For more female leaders (going back to the 1040s) you can check http://www.guide2womenleaders.com/Presi … ogical.htm
anath try and follow a thread
my personal favourites would be Elizabeth 1/Queen Maeve/Boadicea/etc
makes you long for the Celts or even a Monarchy
get real lets talk percentages not anomolies
it's a mans world and you lot are second class citizens and the trouble is that you believe it
why are there not enough public toiiets for women
is it a conspiracy
riddle me this one if you can
Here are a few more women heads of state:
Yulia Tymoshenko, Ukraine
Angela Merkel, Germany
Michele Bachelet, Chile
Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner, Argentina
Tarsa Halonen, Finland
In the U.S. a higher percentage of women are going to college and their numbers in medical and law schools equal or exceed men, as I recall.
thanks for bringing knowledge to this discussion
women are achieving in academics in the western world /no argument there
alot of women succeeding in a man's world
lets get a woman president
lets get at least 50% of public office into the hands of females
lets activate women power globally
A dilemma faced by growing numbers of career women is how to achieve balance between their careers and care for their children and attention to their husbands, or how to divide family responsibilities between the spouses. More and more families don't seem to be able to get by with only one wage earner, husband or wife.
The male gender is already becoming sissified enough.
I want men to step up and be the men they're supposed to be.
And we women should be able to rest assured our men will provide for us and protect us to the best of their abilities.
Men, be men. Women, be women.
Great idea Brenda
just how many centuries are you going to give them?
As long as it takes.
God's mercy endures forever, so mine must too!
Doesn't mean I won't pop 'em upside the head with a skillet to make 'em do their roles properly! HAA
You wish to be provided for?
In the world where men provide for women, women work about ten times as much and have no success to show for it other than the success of others, their "men" their boy children, and the fact that they believe that their female children are successful if they also allow a man to provide for them.
Women are better than second class citizens. We are smart, capable, and should be given independent right with total equality with men.
Provide for? I, ME, *I* provide for my family, my household, my life. I depend on no one.
In much of the world... yeah, women are still second class citizens and it's absolutely detestable.
Certain Islamic nations come to mind.
However, here in the states, I'm not so sure your argument holds it weight.
Look up misandry or masculism and you'll see that things aren't quite the way you portray them to be.
1. Violence against men minimalized or taken less seriously than violence against women.
2. Depiction of violence against men as humorous, in the media and elsewhere (see Boys are stupid, throw rocks at them!), when women are also violent.
3. Assumption of female innocence or sympathy for women, which may result in problems such as disproportionate penalties for men and women for similar crimes, lack of sympathy for male victims in domestic violence cases, and dismissal of female-on-male rape cases.
4. Only men are called up during a military draft.
5. A 1992 study found that boys are subject to the stereotype that they need significantly less protection against sexual abuse compared to girls. It also found that this leads to less reporting of abuse and to discrimination in which victims receive less treatment and less support from others if they are male.
6. Discrimination with regard to child custody.
7. Unfairness in the way the alimony and child support systems are structured.
8. Pregnancies carried to term despite agreements ahead of time that they would not be, subjecting men to unwanted parental responsibilities and/or child support expectations.
9. The opposite of the above, where a man who wants to have a child has no say in whether his partner aborts their child and is not even notified if the abortion takes place.
10. Legislation that addresses women's needs without considering the corresponding need in men. (e.g., Women, Infants, and Children Act; Violence Against Women Act)
11. Biases in the justice system against men, such as higher incarceration rates and longer sentences for men (compared to women) for the same crimes.
12. Statutory rape laws enforced more vehemently in instances where the victim is female and/or the perpetrator is male.
The list goes on and on.
I believe in TOTAL equality. I think that men and women should be treated EXACTLY the same. Sadly, we still have a long way to go towards this end.
Keep in mind, I am NOT saying that women don't have it rough. They do, but it's not as clear cut as you pretend it to be.
Also, suggesting a Civil War as the answer is asinine.
*edited for content* LOL
Extremely stupid or foolish-asinine
So foolish, unreasonable, or out of place as to be amusing-ludicrous
not much of a gap beteen these two jake
did you swallow a thesaurus
a war between factions in the same country-civil war
the waging of armed conflict against an enemy-war
i was exaggerating/you thought i was serious?
You said, and I quote, "We need a civil war..."
You never once alluded to it being an exaggeration, and why would you expect that I would assume it to be? There are crazy-ass people in this world and I have no way to determine if you are one of them or not.
Also, I find it amusing that you would attempt to discredit me by making fun of my use of two "similar" words. So what? I made a mistake.
Anyway, more to the point, I apologize for taking your post seriously (perhaps I'm "slow on the uptake"), and calling your post asinine and thereby insinuating that you are yourself asinine.
BTW, you gave the definition of civil war as:
"a war between factions in the same country"
And then you go on to describe the word war:
"the waging of armed conflict against an enemy"
So... we could say that:
"The waging of armed conflict between factions in the same country."
not at all /you wrote the stuff/it's there for people to read
thats about all there is to say on this jake
war means armed conflict /i included that to be fair
my profile is there to look at if you thought i was a crazy
ya kinda jumped in a bit /maybe
it's hard to imagine a civil war by women against men
maybe civil disobedience/i was exaggerating
nobody asked me why i'd hate to be a woman so i left it down at the bottom
ya jumped in and i defended myself as politely as i could
I "amended" my previous post to make it more "reasonable."
I felt the way that it was originally posted was a bit too emotional.
I apologize if I appear to be attacking you, that's not my intent.
"The waging of armed conflict between factions in the same country."
that's why i included the definition of war/to be fair and explain the exaggeration
I totally agree; only I think I'd hate being a man even more.
There are no Women Gods, they are all men.
Start your protest at the top.~:}
That depends on how you define God, doesn't it? As far as I know, there aren't any female equivalents of Yahweh/God/Allah, but most pagan religions have female deities and in some cases, like the Neopagan Triple Goddess, they're the dominant focus of worship.
I love and happy being a woman, I can do anything same as a man, except to carry heavy objects. Different culture placed different values to women though, but that is their culture, as long as they are happy with what they are doing.
I don't know why I am siding with you. But talk about carrying heavy objects and I think you overlooked your chest.
I suspect as in all things, the grass is also greener here. Obviously, in a broken world (relative) one might assume that women might do a better job than men have done. Perhaps they would do a poorer job. Marriage has taught me that we are both proficient in advancing the cause of chaos and confusion. Fortunately, we are at times capable of the opposite. Accustomed to my own difficiencies and only an observer to hers, I choose to remain where I am and I suspect she feels the same. Spies have not faired very well over the course of history so I with-hold my service, however, If things get better, I will assume you have had your way. If they get worse, I will assume the same. Good luck!
I love to be a woman and I am happy being the woman I am. I accept myself and do the best I can. Not all men are presidents or great in any way and so are women. It is all about doing your best where you are whether you are man or a woman.
...luv bein' a woman....women rock!....women have a lot of power...whether it's up front or behind the scenes....lots of strength......'i'll never be your beast of burden'....
I LOVE being a woman! Carrying a baby and giving birth is a an amazing experience that men will never understand.
Women do have alot of power we just prefer to keep it in the background and let the men have the glory. And Why not? Being in the spotlight all the time can ruin your complexion...what does a man care.
The sun outshines the moon yet the moon has power.
If you understand love, you're already a supporter of women and human rights.
In the end, that's what the "rights" issue is about--human rights. All other issues and causes about "rights" are derivatives, IMO.
what most women get out of this is
the right to remain silent
rights made by men for men with no infrastructure within society to correct the bias
take a simple on the ground example daniel
at every airport in the world women queue for loos while men walk nonchantly past
explain that to me Daniel and stop talking human rights
women have the right to pee without waiting
why don't you ladies invade the mens
is it too over the top for you
The world is unfair. Individuals don't have to be. That's my point. In every place that you can make a difference for the better, make that difference. That's what I'm trying to do.
It's effective. People catch on.
Invading the men's room will get you arrested.
Happened here, in Houston, Tx, during a sports event. The ladies line was super-long, the woman could not wait, the men did not mind, and she did her business.
When she left the men's room she was promptly arrested. Now there are more ladies facilities in the sports complex there.
Women also have the right to pee while standing.
Ppparently as 2uesday wrote abaove somewhere
"Hence we are about to enter a new era of women being able to hold their own."
So not only the right but the ability - gotta see that
I feel it in my water ! How are things in Ireland now, in the context of this thread - have you got a man back in charge of the place yet to fix the woman-handling of hte economy by your Pres
our president is a man...... he is being blamed for everything. He goes on all day time shows and takes a battering, Not really into politics at all, and of course am English not Irish.... Whole world is f up if you ask me... Putting a woman in charge wont help much i dont think... nothing will
easy question daniel
at every airport in the world women queue for loos while men walk nonchantly past
It's probably all depends on your culture. I grew up in a place where women were treated equally, and behaved and worked equally hand in hand with men. And they did hard physical work too! Though sometimes they could not lift heavy things, then men would help them, usually without even asking, because nobody expected them to be able to do that. And if something happened to a man, his woman became the master of the household and continued to govern everything or would hire somebody to help, but she would be the master anyway, and no one would be surprised. I do not feel the need to be a man. I do not see the difference, other than gender. A man has some organs that are shaped differently, some hormones that work differently, so what? I do not want to be a president anyway - too much hassle. I'd better cook dinner.
if you are not happy being a woman you'll be equally unhappy being a man, garanteed! It's not your gender that makes you happy, it's your attitude towards life.
Hey, not all countries are as backward as the USA when it comes to gender equality!
We've had a woman as head of state for at least 25 years before I was born until date, for example. And she's not the first. And we had a woman PM for all of the 1980s, too.
london girl hi
stay with this /we all read the papers
you will still stand in the queue for the loo at Heathrow while I walk nonchantly by.
I never stand in the queue at Heathrow. I try to avoid the place.
Is there a queue?
A few ago months during a party in London, I was going to the toilet when a man came out -leaving it dirty- I ordered him to clean it up for me, before I went in. (just in case you are wondering, yes he did it, and I went in to use a spotless toilet)
Did I mention that he was 1.90cm and I am only 1.60cm...?
Want to talk about girl power?
BTW, the only reason why you would walk nonchantly infront of me would be bad manners!
good on ya girl / good example
exactly the real conversation i am trying to start here
sort these out for me anath
why don't women vote for women?
why are gynaecologists in the western world mostly men?
why is equality taking so long?
why are most religions trying to demean women?
why do women in the first world not stand up for women in the third world?
why are there no purely female issues or parties in politics
why why why
hi london girl
the lady at the top ot the page is English /want to guess?
Yeah and don't forget the Queen.
Actually we're not as backward as that...I can do anything I want to do and still wear my mini-skirt without being stoned to death.
By-the-bye...sometimes men come in handy
P.S. Speaking of power, my mini-skirt has stopped trucks.
There is enough name calling between those who believe they are smarter and therefore in charge.
I am not backwards, and do not appreciate the offense of being told my country is.
Thank you very much.
Londongirl - I love that you see the U.S. as backwards. The word backwards may be a misnomer but I take your point. The U.S. is still only 235 years old and has a lot to catch up on though I'm sure you will admit they have started some great world trends in many respects.
Anyone who thinks men rule anything, no matter how strong or violent they are, hasn't read Wuthering Heights very closely.
why are there not enough women's toilets at most international airports or public buidings/ who is doing this
you don't follow/ do you queue?
its not a hard question/nobody even attempted to answer it yet
best answer so far
i don't use that airport
luabu - you seem obsessed with the lack of women't toilets. Perhaps you might consider coming up with a plan to alleviate this dilemma to the benefit of all mankind. P.S. - love the pop-up urinals in the middle of London city.
I don't queue any more than men overall as far as I have observed. And I have used toilets in dozens of airports with no problem. The fact that men can pee standing up is just a matter of anatomy, not discrimination.
Besides, I question the idea that women do nothing but follow, and you respond is queuing for the toilet? Not terribly strong evidence for XX=hell IMHO. I follow people when driving on the freeway too, that doesn't make whoever is ahead of me my master.
i pass women queuing for loos everywhere i go
Faro Airport/Rome Airport/neil young rock concert /O2 Centre Dublin
Leoparstown Races etc etc etc/Disney World et...............
We live in different worlds /mines the real one
am i seeing things or are you telling porky pies
what do other poeple think
I'll bow to their accumulated wisdom
I think you're a bit crazy. Also you don't seem to consider the option we live in different places and have different experiences. For a start, I have the experience of actually being a woman.
Bottom line, if the only thing wrong with being a female is the line for the loo, I can live with that. Everything has pros and cons and I would take loo lines over male pattern baldness.
Besides, the point you were actually making was that women do nothing but follow, that is still untrue. For a start I am not following you, I am not agreeing with you and I am not accepting that a man can or should define what being a woman is really like.
There may not be a female pres, but plenty of Prime Ministers, Secretary of State, High Court Judges etc. The rest will come with a little more time.
I love being a woman, mostly. I suspect if I were a man I would love it similarly. I think we get to hung up on the battle of the sexes. If we balanced power between the sexes we might find things work more smoothly and fairly as we would function on more of a middle ground area. Operating to one extreme or another never ends well
Bottom line, if the only thing wrong with being a female is the line for the loo, I can live with that. Everything has pros and cons and I would take loo lines over male pattern baldness
do you get this cos i don't
architects design airports and i assume someone approves the plans
this should not be a battle
its about fair play for women
we haven't even got to the third world or religion yet
I think you're a bit crazy.
you may have said this because you don't get where i'm coming from psycheskinner
are you going to follow time until things get better?
i struggle to get you but i don't think you are crazy
Funny *you* seem to expect women to be obedient. But it ain't happening.
so far among other things you have said
I assure you I don't just "follow
The fact that men can pee standing up is just a matter of anatomy, not discrimination
I think you're a bit crazy
I don't follow any more than men do.
Funny *you* seem to expect women to be obedient. But it ain't happening
Bottom line, if the only thing wrong with being a female is the line for the loo, I can live with that. Everything has pros and cons and I would take loo lines over male pattern baldness.
maybe you're losing it just a bit
I do not hate being a woman one bit! Even with all your reasons listed that is a bit ridiculous to say if you were a woman living today that you would hate it. I can only speak for myself and growing up in the US though. Hate is a strong word and I might hate it in some other countries. To hear about how women are treated there is sickening and I would hate it. Here in America I will say that most woman do not follow but I think I see what you are trying to say. I think the answer is time! Things are changing everyday but it will take more time. We just had our first African American President so I do feel that this country is lacking in some ways. It was formed by white men who saw African Americans and woman as second class citizens and it really hurt us all with this type of thinking. Woman have fought for many many years now and all I can really say is that everything is still not totally equal but it will be. Woman have proved they are just as smart and capable. Things have certainly changed but a little more time is needed before we 100 percent notice it. I'm talking as a whole. I could list many many powerful women who men couldn't even come close to but again as a whole this country is not there yet. As far as bathrooms lol I haven't really noticed the injustice there. They seem fine to me.
habee's mini democracy sounds like a template for a global concept
i agree with you lifeallstar1 it's not there yet why
There is a need for revolution/women have all the power but they never use it
Organise boycotts of badly designed public places/get them modified
Women should vote for women until the bias is addressed
You have consumer power/don't buy from countries that degrade women on that principle alone
confront the injustice of these man religions before the put you under a cart
organise and i'll be your spy
the world needs women to get out of the passenger seat
habee's world but on a global scale
My husband runs things around our house: the dishwasher, the washing machine, the dryer, the vacuum cleaner...Kidding! We don't have a vacuum cleaner - all our floors are oak. lol
I'd love to vote for a woman for POTUS, but it ain't gonna be Palin. lol
Come to Dublin Airport, there is never a queue at the womens toilets. That's all i have to say really you can say the rest..... can't you?????
joy56 i sure can
the world is in a complete mess
it is wasteful violent unjust and ready to crash
it runs on pure testosterone
we have one card left to play
50% of the world are subservient and undermotivated
you want the man to drive for selfish reasons
you think he will do less damage if you can see him
you think he's cute with his little steering wheel
fasten your seat belts girls
we're all going to crash
men are idiots
Ok, luabu, you've tipped your hand. I've been saying the world is full of idiots for some time now. Don't throw yourself into that pot, please. The reason 50% of the world is undermotivated by comparison is because they don't have the testosterone level of men. I do all my own driving. Men want to drive my Jeep but, no, sorry. I bought it, I drive it. I drive my world, no one else. The reason women's toilets are backed up (pun unintended) is partly because of our anatomy and partly because men can 'go in the woods'. You're right about the people who design these facilities, though. They haven't figured it out yet. So you're on a man-hating kick right now. You're not the first and you won't be the last. Do something about it procedurally and move on. Make it you're life's work. Run for president if you think you've got the cahones. You seem a bit out of touch with the average woman of age and experience. You are very in touch with toilets, however.
hi joy 56
new grand canal theatre dublin just built
a queue for the ladies down the corridor for the Hairspray show recently
the O2 is even worse
Ireland is a joke for women in this regard
tell it like it is
I just got done writing a paper on issues of gender in education.
Here's a good video:
http://fora.tv/2010/03/31/Dr_Louann_Bri … Male_Brain
Evan i watched a good bit of this
it was the intro from hell before the speech
heres the word that is rattling in my head
that's how it was for me/others might disagree
God ,your nothinig in america without a few qualifications/it was like reading out tiger woods acomplishments before the first tee at Augusta
up my way we have a saying
Brag is a bad dog ..............ever heard of it/let me know
thanks for info Evan
LOL, I thought I am very slow with this..
i assure you you are not slow
my post was vague at best/it referred to Evan's link which is worth a look
it states that men and women's brains are fundamentally and physically different which is a good watch
have a look and maybe offer an opinion
Seriously, queues are not a #1 human rights issue. Sense of perspective required here.
That is how it is.
Women can work, vote, get educated and do whatever they want in most 1st world countries.
Yay for being a woman!!!
Thousands of years of patriarchy do not vanish overnight. Honestly, I'm pretty pleased with how far we've come, considering that there are still people alive today who were born when women didn't even have the right to vote.
As for the OP's strange obsession with bathroom lines, if he's really so concerned about women's rights, minor inconveniences like that should be the least of his worries.
does this bit about the bathrooms make any sense to anyone
it's people i love who are in the queue being treated like second class citizens
Thousands of years of patriarchy do not vanish overnight
that bit i agree with/we have to vanish it asap
thats my point
"we have to vanish it asap"
By insulting and belittling the opinions of the female contributors to this thread, you're not exactly helping the cause.
Yes, there is such a thing as internalized misogyny. That's why it's generally women who arrange for their daughters to be mutilated in societies that practice FGM, women who order their daughters-in-law to be burned in dowry murders, and so forth.
But if a bunch of different women from a bunch of different backgrounds, countries, and positions on gender equality (including both rabid feminists such as myself and rabid non-feminists such as Brenda) are telling you that the public toilets thing isn't nearly as big a deal as you're making it out to be, maybe you should consider that it's not as big a deal as you're making it out to be.
The first rule of being an ally is listening. Sailing in as a member of the dominant group and informing us that you know our problems better than we do ourselves is scarcely better than patting us on the head and telling us not to worry our pretty selves about anything because the big strong men will take care of everything for us. It's counter-productive and, frankly, offensive.
did you listen to what kateperez had to say on the toilets thing
thanks for your contribution and information
i think you are saying that input like mine into this whole area is not really helpful
this seems strongly felt and might well be true
my motivation in this is that i think the only really underused resource we have on this earth is the commonsense of women.
this is a man's world and it shouldn't be /it should be shared
women need to be able to live without fear
that's not happening
"my motivation in this is that i think the only really underused resource we have on this earth is the commonsense of women"
I agree completely, but if you really want to be an ally, you need to learn how to listen better.
http://www.beingamberrhea.com/2008/07/1 … nist-ally/
thanks for the links
i got through the first one and half the second one
it's all very logical and precious but jesus it isn't half boring
whats wrong with
asking women to vote for women because they are women
asking women to boycott places publicly because they are inadequate
asking women to organise around exclusively women issues
asking women to protest/students do it /pensioners do it/farmers do it
asking women to step up
asking women to help more around the house
habee's world makes sense to me
sorry but yours just bores me to tears
"whats wrong with asking women to vote for women because they are women"
Internalized misogyny, remember? If I were going to vote for a woman for no other reason than that she's a woman, then I might be stuck voting for women such as Sarah Palin, Christine O'Donnell, Sharon Angle, Meg Whitman, etc. I could hardly disagree more with these women on most issues.
"asking women to boycott places publicly because they are inadequate"
If you gotta go, you gotta go. ~shrugs~ Very few buildings have restrooms inadequate for normal circumstances. Situations such as concert halls, airports immediately after a large flight has deplaned, etc. are exceptions, and financially it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to build and maintain enough restrooms to handle top capacity when they'll only be used to full capacity for a few brief periods during the day, or even just a few times a year.
"asking women to organise around exclusively women issues"
Um, it's called feminism. There are tons of organizations out there dedicated exclusively to women's issues and quite a few of them are politically active.
"asking women to protest/students do it /pensioners do it/farmers do it"
So do women. What on earth makes you think we don't?
"asking women to step up"
To what, exactly?
"asking women to help more around the house"
Ah, the truth comes out.
i commend you for your work on this and bringing knowledge to this hub
the help around the house thing was an obscure reference to running the world
its hard and illogical to vote for some one purely on gendre but my point is
like the toilet situation direct action leads to change
if women vote for women then women will be nominated by all parties /the choice will improve and more women will be elected
you people make up 50% of the world population
men look after themselves /now its your turn
exercise your consumer rights in a more focused way so that you are helping women world wide
don't go with the flow/
it's time to stand up and be counted
the world needs you badly
theres a link on this hub to a lecture which shows that men and womens brains are different
we think in a different way for a whole host of reasons
i agree with this which points to the importance of balanced input from the two types of thinking in world affairs
this is not happening and this is why i suggest urgency and affirmative action
start the war and i will be your spy
men dominate women through religion more than in any other way
women have been filled with fears and self doubts
the dogma of these religions control every aspect of a woman's life
these can not be voted down
i will always speak out against this tyranny and will try to make change but it is bewildering to see these man things being maintained by women themselves/something you said earlier yourself
individual civil rights/constitutional support /education and aid from women to women is the way to go here
this has to be done from the top of the most powerful democracies in the world/ usa / england / eec /australia /canada / etc etc
many men want fair play for women/many many don't
luabu - remember - men's approach to a problem is to give it a fix. You want to fix this. Great. Personally, I suspect you're not really a man, but a woman posing as one on this thread. Just an insight I gather from some of the way you've worded things. Next remember - woman think things through before they find a fix. Hence the delay (albeit years worth) in fixing anything worldly. Perhaps you're tired of waiting for your 'loved ones' while they wait in line?
hi not really , my daughter is a young person starting her life /15/ and i do not want her insulted along with her mother in a line for a loo/it is bad for her spirit and her self esteem/i tell her its not her fault ,its someone elses and it need s to be firxed/i tell her to speak her mind and stand up for her self even when it is hard
I did write those things. Did you have a point there or just think they warranted repeating?
you jumped to the bottom of this thread to get away from your own words
i don't blame you / anyone who wants to see them will have to read upwards
then you give me another classic
That is how it is.
thats reallly really brilliant that is how it is
Just one thing to say here you obviously have not met some of the young women I have.
I think most of us already have hope. I just met a bunch of new graduate veterinarians, mostly female. A wonderful group.
1 thing men cannot do is be a mother.
The strongest bond is mother and child.....it's very special
Didn't eve tempt adam into eating an apple in the garden of eden? He "stupidly" ate it. So maybe we are ahead in the intelligence dept. just not so much as physical and men take advantage of that
Intelligent women do not have to shout to be heard they earn respect by who they are and by working hard, and usually they find partners who respect them.
What a thing to say! "I'd hate to be a woman." How much thought went into that, I wonder. And how subjective. Unless you are a woman how could you know it's a hateful situation to be in?
I'm a man. I can honestly say that, in most societies it is far more easy to live as a man than a woman. Fortunately, most Westernized societies are making gradual improvements, but most of the world is still weighted heavily against women. Let's hope that eventually comes to and end.
Point to remember is that Nature did not split the human race into two sexes for no reason. Each should be honoured and valued equally. Each gender has it's own strengths and weaknesses, virtues and shortcomings. It's about time both men and women started to accept that.
why not lower the public speaking tone just a little
after all your only talking to one person me
your soliloquay was a mix of nonsense and the bleeding obvious
i'd hate to be a woman is as you say
And how subjective
the last paragraph will need a strong delivery for it to amount to anything
why didn't you just ask me why i said i'd hate to be a woman instead of lashing into the Gettysburg Address Tom Style
you are in the know about Ireland aren't you... and love to stir the pot..... this thread is hilarious
Well, Canada has already had a female prime minister and many world leaders are women. We have a way to go but we are getting there. I am not going to vote for someone just because they are female.
Women take longer in the bathroom than men...that is just the way it is.
I think you just hate women, but that's your problem not theirs!
how did you come to this conclusion home girl
i'm baffled / the lady who posted first on this thread thought the opposite
'I'd hate to be a woman' is a ridiculous thing to say. Which is why this thread became ridiculous.
Have you not figured out he's (or she's) just baiting?
"i'd hate to be a man and Have to go to war...."
No actually I would like to be a man and have no period...
then again I'd like to be a mom......hmmmmm
maybe men and women have equal issues??hmm
'Schoolgirlforreal' states that there is "No stronger bond than between mother and child." I'm not so sure. A mother I know deserted her 18 month-old baby daughter to run off to live with another guy in a land far away - leaving her baby to be raised by her father - my younger son.
My son has now had sole care, as a single or solo parent, for nearly three of years. The little girl, now four, strongest bond is obviously with her father, not her mother. Mother is a faint memory - if remembered at all.
So although I agree that the bond between mother and child is extremely strong in most circumstances, it is a 'generalization' to assume this is always the case.
There are lots of idiots among both sexes, it's not the point. it is always the case when we are dealing with normal people. Mother would starve but give her last food to her child with a smile. Jumps in front of a speeding car(I did that once) to save her child. Because her child is part of her. If she behaves differently - she is not normal.
How can you hate her?
I am proud to be a mother actually. I am glad I am.
well yes, there are Always exceptions to the rule. sorry to hear your case.
Lets save the world and campaign for more women's toilets in airports
toilets are the tip of the iceberg and just an example
not a laughing matter for the people in the queue
these buildings are designed for purpose
how many consious decisions by architects and planners have ignored female needs completely
how many women have endured this ignomiy without sorting it out why
this is serious as it expresses a mindset in society
it's laughing that has things like this
Perhaps there is another answer than requiring architects to spend large sums of money and valuable building real estate to satisfy women's needs in the loo.
Consider that most men probably spend an average of less than 3 minutes in the room per visit. Can we not convince women to do the same? Don't spend another 3 minutes combing hair or putting makeup on. Don't take time to chat to a friend or stranger. Just go in, do it, and get out!
As Bill Cosby pointed out, women seem to use the restroom as a social gathering place - something men just don't do. What do you all do in there? It can't possibly be simply administering to bodily needs or there wouldn't be a queue to get in!
Just a thought...
the buildings are not designed properly for purpose
you need approx 5 times more cubicles in the ladies
at the moment there are usually the same number or less
use your head /stay serious
5 times!!! Whatever for?
I work in the building trades, and although I have never done a large facility such as an airport, I find that most bathrooms that might have 5 cubicles for men (including urinals) will have about 7 for women plus at least twice as much counter/sink space. That should be plenty.
I wrote my post somewhat tongue in cheek, but only somewhat. I do not notice women at home taking inordinate amounts of time in the loo - why should they do so in a public place where other women are waiting?
Seriously, I understand that physical differences and necessities require more time for women, but 5 times as long? Accompanying children might add to the total, but I find more and more men are taking children/infants with them as well. The only thing I can think of is the beauty parlor syndrome (which the loo is not) and a chat room. Eliminate these two time wasters and perhaps there would be no line.
thanks wilderness for coming back with knowledge
7 fo 5 seems a bit too short especially in places like arrivals at airports or show venues where you expect a rush so to speak at intervals
this is how a lay man sees it
its down to no 1's and 2's
20%of people male and female max are going for no 2's
20%of men do no2's in cublicles 100%of women
7 for 5 wont cut it here
did no architect /planner /surveyor or whatever do research on this
they do it with traffic at traffic lights
how hard can it be
a building should be built for purpose
letting women suffer in silence seems like normal behaviour for both sides
the tip of the iceberg as far as i can make out
someone needs to do the maths on this/maybe a woman
20%of men do no2's in cublicles 100%of women
i'm talking crap here ain't I
which one is a no 1 /its so long since i called them this i can't remember
you know what i mean thanks wilderness
Yes, that took me a minute!
A major consideration, whether we like it or not, is cost. Considering that a home can run $100 per square foot, it would seem reasonable to find a commercial building at double that, or $200 per foot. Bathroom cubicles are much higher with typically ceramic tile, fixtures, cubicle walls and doors.
I've never been involved in pricing, but it would seem to me that a typical cubicle might cost, at 6X4 space, (non-handicapped) on the order of $7500 to build in a commercial building. I suspect that figure is too low. Add in extra maintenance cost (janitorial, water, repair, etc.) and it quickly becomes a very costly item in the building and pays no return. No one rents it, and no one pays to use it (at least in the US). From a business standpoint it is useless space; necessary, but useless as it generates no income.
hi wilderness /good honest attempt to help
if you start running now you might make the border /doubtful!
....sure it generates income....indirectly....it's all part of overhead....people come into the building to do some sort of biz...and then take a short break to do their 'biz'....btw....if the ladies is busy...i'll pop on by the men's if i don't have time to wait....not a problem for me....get outta of my way i say...i'm next...and then i'm 'outta here'....
Yes, it is overhead. To be kept as low as possible, and that's the point. Compared to the rest of the building a bathroom is very high overhead and I'm sure that's part of the problem. A few places have designed and incorporated bathrooms that draw customers to the building just to see the weird rooms, but they are rare. Mostly they are just cost with no return.
As I say, it's a matter of money here whether we like it or agree with it or not.
Not sure if true or not, but I've heard that some European loos are unisex; perhaps we should use that concept.
While a "surveyor" of bathroom practices, watching exact procedures in both mens and womens rooms, might be valuable I do NOT apply for the job!
Wilderness, women taking inordinate amounts of time at the counter is rarely what holds up the line for the women's bathroom.
Remember, you guys can just unzip and whip it out - we have to shove down our pants and sit, and due to sanitary concerns in public restrooms, many women either put some sort of cover over the toilet seat or squat. Since we can't direct things as well as you guys can, if we squat there is sometimes clean-up to do afterward. And that's not even getting into the necessity of changing pads/tampons, etc. and cleaning yourself up a bit when you're on your period. All of this takes time. The OP is overstating the problem, imho, but there are perfectly legitimate reasons women take longer in the bathroom that have nothing to do with treating it like a beauty parlor.
Indeed there are good reasons. I just don't understand the very large difference. Some difference, yes, and that's why there are typically more women's facilities than mens. The OP has a point though that there is still often a queue to get in in spite of 40% more facility.
Hi wilderness, I have to disagree on this toilet issue, even tough I am a big fan of yours!
I personally witnessed a transformation in wait times at a HWY 400 northern route " restaurant stop" when the complaints from females were heard and they switched the "larger" male washroom with the females. I was appalled the male washroom had been three times as much space and no lines, while the female side had a half hour wait.
The management renovated and switched washrooms... we got more stalls and lo and behold the men are still fine with less (no lines) and now the females have no lines either. No extra space was required!
From personal experience, the females on a trip do not spend a lot of time in grooming. We do not like public washrooms period. We go in and do our business and kerryg is spot on that the logistics. Add winter and it gets worse! Maybe men have to take off their mitts. LOL
BTW, females usually bring the children to the bathroom and that takes inordinate amounts of time! Plus women tend to do hygiene better than men...I have read where a large percentage of men do not wash hands after using the bathroom...ahem (cough, cough)
Then on to luabu...I do enjoy being a woman! Yes the world stinks on the record overall, but if the world was responsible...being female would be celebrated!
What a loveless and harsh world it would be with just men around plundering, conquering and counting their money! ;-)
From your description of the restaurant, I would hazard a guess that it was designed originally more as a truck stop than a family restaurant. Changing clientele or logistics can certainly make a difference and make a change more palatable to management. Or perhaps designers simply guessed wrong about the expected customer base.
Either way it sounds like it's set up correctly now, and at no great cost to the company. That's what it's all about for most businesses - the bottom line.
Yes, I would hazard a guess it was originally designed as a truck stop. Large transports still do stop and park at the service station nearby, so it is a very busy place now!
Fortunately for everyone, all is well now and lineups are a thing of the past...though I do not travel there on holidays, when the crowds swell to the point the old problem may crop up again!
this is hilarious, must go and read your hubs,. r they as funny........ Florence Nightingale sure was a good woman.....
The meeting floor of the U.S. House of Representatives has never had a female bathroom, only a men's room. Luabu may be starting to make some sense to me. OMG!
Hey you know what? I'm a woman hear me roar!!!
Seriously, I am the man in the relationship ;lol:
So maybe, the reason women cannot run a country is she spend too long in queuing for the toilet in her life time therefore she achieves less than a man. This also means that when important decisions are being made women might miss voting on them by being other wise engaged, i.e. waiting at an airport or other toilet to rid herself of excess fluids.
However now we do not need to use the airport toilets as frequently as we once did because of the restrictions on fluids we can carry on aircrafts, plus the cost of drinks on aircraft. So now when we arrive at airports we no longer need the facilities. Hence we are about to enter a new era of women being able to hold their own.
your having to hold your own at the moment so to speak
better not drink on the plane either
find some sense from somewhere please
wrong you can drink as much as you like in the airports just before boarding the plane. But if you want to rule the world, or country come to Ireland, the queues are short and we need HELP
OK OK OK - I'll pop over and help - didn't read the posts above so just assume it is the Guiness we are talking here right ??
Didn't the U.S. just loan you a bunch of money which we borrowed from China who earned it from much U.S. trade who literally cut their own manufacturing throat? Maybe Ireland can use that money to build bathrooms in the U.S., women can get in and out of the loos faster thereby accomplishing more spending on consumer goods, filling the pockets of China, then we can borrow more money, give it to Ireland, and you can build more bathrooms! Problem solved.
We need a civil war and I volunteer to be a spy for your side.
Help me help you
this job interview is not going well for me / i think
Why i'd hate to be a woman
I imagine my life would be hell
i would be frustrated with the way things are
i would be frustrated with the lack of progress
i would feel insulted and ignored
If i lived in some countries my despair would cause me to cry endlessly
I would feel afraid all the time
My opinions on religion would have me killed in alot of countries
I'd hate it
The lady at the top of the page is Florence Nightingale /a wonder ful woman worth reading about if you get the time
I'm out of here
i'm kinda around if someone wants more of my opinions on this subject
but i'm kinda repeating myself at this stage .
For the record I have never had to wait to use the ladies at Stansted London airport, or Luton.
I have waited to get through security but understand the need to check everything and there are men waiting too. I also have to wait to board the plane but everyone else does.
I fail to understand your preoccupation with toilets being occupied. Women cope with far more problems than that, which is why they are resourceful and good at solving problems.
To some I may appear quite 'helpless' because I am only 5'4" but believe me in a crisis I am a good member to be on a team, as I can move quick and problem solve because I am good at it through practise.
World wide women support families, keep the peace in families and make the world a better place, but then so do men.
That's it on this from me, as I have a full agenda today.
For the record I've used the men's toilets at Landsdowne Park Stadium in Dublin and didn't get arrested. A pint too many of beer seems to be the great equalizer. ;-)
it's as simple as that know one
an internet conspiracy by women to do this and the problem would be solved in a year
men would wet themselves
are you obsessed with toilet issues all the time, or just in the forums????
Perhaps men wouldn't wet themselves - as the female toilets would now be underutilised given the women's campaign to chat, apply makeup, do one's hair, and oh yeah attend to various bodily functions in the mens toilets, they could just pop in to the previous no-go zone for a quick wizz and get on with the job of being glorious males. ;-)
Can you repeat that please luaba not sure i got it first time....
are you a lay man????
just been reading some of comments on this thread. My husband is out working to keep me, as all men should, i will be cooking his tea for him, i used to work hard, but now am enjoying letting him keep me, it is great.... it may even catch on.
I am being ignored.... Am i invisible??????
I love being a woman! Imagine life is equally difficult at times for both sexes, but as women, we are responsible (in most cultures) for raising the future men and women of the world. We should offer our best to both, raising them both to be kind and honest, with character and a sense that we are all equal. If we do a good job as mothers, we will see the next generation become even better people than we are. That is our secret weapon and just ONE way that women have power!
i'm with you in this to a point
unfortunately after you rear them they are destroyed in a world of stupidity
how many mother's reared poets to die in the trenches
you will not change the world from the bottom
you had a go at this
women need to change the world from the top
be a smart focused political movement with agreed purpose
confront men with their limitations
kinda like making him pick up his clothes except global
True, but that is just one area where I believe women have power. I believe that my daughters and my son are equally capable. Granted, there are physical limitations being a woman, but mentally, no. With the right education, my grandchildren (a boy and a girl) will be equal in their abilities. The changes in attitudes and discrimination may not come as quickly as we would all like, but change is inevitable. The progress that I have seen since the 1950's when I was born (a dinosaur, I know) is pretty impressive. It will continue, I am convinced.
However, I do not believe that men will ever learn to pick up their clothes! That is an impossible goal with a less than even possible chance of going global!
this is the bit i don't get
why let men away with being stupid
look at the arms race/that was all about mine's bigger than yours/boys stuff
is it that?
you have given up on men
they are consciously blocking and frustating you
you are afraid of their reaction
you don't feel good enough to do it
its not natural to stop men doing their stuff/like a primal thing
couldn't be bothered
you enjoy watching them
or something else or something of all these things
identify the reason and we can get round the blockage
why do women not butt in and take their place as equals
Oh yeah everyone in Ireland just loves toilets.... I have 3 in my house.
the toilet issue has a thread of its own, now we can debate on the issue about how good bad or indifferent it is to be female.
I love being a womean. yes, some things are unfair in life, but that's jsut a part of life. It's how you deal with it that counts.
But women are fighting everyday against this millenar system with their own hands. They win battles everyday and they don´t need guns to do it.
I see a world controled by women in the future and they just deserve it. Some studies show that they are more intelligent than men so let´s give them a chance. Probably they could change the world and make it a better place!
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