I have found out recently that if someone confesses a crime to a priest the priest has no legal obligation to report the crime.
Instead of being an accessory after the fact.
I guess they believe they have special privileges, power to hide the truth. it's beyond belief to me how another human would confess their 'wrongdoings' to someone sitting in a little cubicle. I don't get it.
nothing against anyone, just questioning how this makes any rational sense.
It is proof that men can not be denied their basic instinct to breed.
I also think they choose young boys, because young boys won't talk it about it or report it as much. This I hope will soon change, when our children learn that they need to report sexual assault- regardless of their sexual origin. It is so sad. Very sad for the Catholic faith.
This pope is a joke, and he should be punished accordingly. He knew this was going on. He knew it. I'm surprised that he hasn't be formerly accused. He just looks like a predator.
Honestly, as a Catholic I do not see God's grace illuminating from this man, like that which could be seen of Pope John Paul 1 and 11, or Paul the VI.
He must go.
because priests, like everybody else, are humans first and foremost, religious or not.
First of all the (catholic) church(es) hasnt got the monopoly on abuse; the same thing happened in residential schools (religious or not), chidren's homes, scouts, ordinary schools.. you name it and still happens.
The second thing is that it is easy to look at what happened yesterday through the lense of today. And, I dont know what it was like in the US or Canada; I do know that the legal situation was very different in Holland and no doubt elsewhere. It wasn't until the late 1990's that, if you know something is happening you not only have the duty to inform police etc, but actually the right to do so which, prior to that was limited to a very select group (the child itself, parents or a special government body which was also in charge itself of supervision of residential schools and ran them) and even then there are some severe limitations. Up to that point the official line was very much a case of solve it yourself and solve it within the family/group/organisation it was happening (although some help was available in certain cases). There were (perhaps good) reasons for why that was the legal position (albeit naive)but society has moved on and our expectations have changed.
So in the cases I am thinking of (and I know some) it wasn't a cover-up: it was how things were done and expected to be done in those days - keep it within and solve it!
If the church (and residential schools and schools and scouts etc) failed in something in those days, it was "solving it, preventing it from happening again", not in not posting it on the internet (which didnt exist) or informing the police (which it didnt have the right to in many cases... and nothing to do with the confessional; that was the legal position). It would be interesting to hear how the situation was (and is) in other countries before we judge based on today's norms and feelings.
True pedophiles - the rarest type of child abuser, but the most prolific by number of victims - deliberately choose careers like the priesthood that will put them in positions of power and authority over children, and positions of trust for children's parents. This behavior is well documented.
Obviously the vast majority of priests, pastors, rabbis, teachers, school principals, youth group leaders, pediatricians and other professionals working with children are good people with no ulterior motives, but parents still need to be aware that there are MORE pedophiles in these types of positions than there are in the general population and pay attention to their gut instincts. If something seems off, it may be.
This is the story worthy of covering up!
Why does any pedophile molest kids?
It's an illness and an addiction based on a twisted deviance within the individual.
Why do they cover it up?
Because they are in denial and it's a taboo and they want to keep it that way.
Are you sure about priests not having to confess crimes?
I thought they had to, but I have never really verified it!
To the OP poster though, I think you are asking the wrong quetion, why does anyone molest Kids.
The church covering up child molestation cases is a related problem on top of that.
Priesthood, like paedophilia, is sometimes aposition of power which is abused.
Why just kids ? These type of priest keep eye on anything that gives them pleasure. Just because they talk and preach about god doesn't give them control over their temptation.It's common belief in society that "anyone who is god believer or preacher is not harmful in anyway" but that's not the case. And church cover it up to preserve faith or to keep number of people in religion,just imagine those who believe in their god and attack others for their belief will do if they lose faith on church(some examples in this forum as well) what they'll do if they lose their confidence on priest ? So let's just make a cover up and say they do this to wipe out liberal sin in the society.
1. Repression. These people are repressed and ashamed of their natural drives. They hide their desires and in the shadows those desires become twisted and perverted.
2. They are in a position of power and trust. People don't expect them to do evil things to children, so they have lots of opportunities to act out their sickness.
...it became repression, only after they lost their truly holy sense of communion with God and themselves. That is one of the main problems on a spiritual path...keeping your energy holy, raised up in union with God/Universal Energy.
lazy indulgence in ego physical desire
First off, not Every Priest is a child molester.
Why do Child Molesters choose the priesthood? Obviously for access to the kids. Some and maybe all of these molesters are Satanists, what better way to ruin the church and hurt God?
The real question is How could the 'Priesthood' not be aware of the possibilty of infiltration by evil people? Why don't they have safe guards in place to protect kids from evil people that pretend to be good honest God loving Priests?
The Sacredness of the Confessional not with standing, they need to figure out someway to prevent evil and protect the innocent and good, which is their entire reason for existing isn't it? I mean isn't that thier job?
Lack of accountability is part of it. Those who are in careers with constant exposure to kids rack up hundreds of victims. What if priests, etc had to pass a polygraph yearly to maintain their positions? Harsh perhaps but it would hopefully deter some perverts. Those who hide it and allow it to continue are just as guilty to me.
The cover up problem within a church or religious organization escapes me. Almost all christians I know believe in confessing of sins. This helps with accountability, too. Why do they hide something that can only get worse?
The cover ups, I'm sure have to do with not wanting dirty laundry aired publicly. I mean one bad apple can make the entire group look bad in the public eye. Which the situation they are in proves. The percentage of Priests that are also child molesters is pretty small I'm sure, compared to the whole of the Priesthood. But when anyone sees a Priest now a days they think first, I wonder if he is a child molester... To avoid this loss of trust for the church, is one reason they covered it up.
The money they stand to lose in law suits is another reason why they cover up the truth.
The sacredness of the confessional is a third reason. Anything confessed to a Priest is to be kept secret by the Priest. It is one of the most profound rules of the church. A rule that if they break can only be confessed to and forgiven by the Pope.
Sounds like they have a lot of "extra" rules which help keep dirty laundry in house. I am not catholic and I do not understand how they ended up with more rules than is in the Bible. Holly
Since they are the ones that wrote the 'Bible', and decided what to put in it and what to keep out it doesn't really surprise me. They wouldn't have simply thrown out what they didn't include, like the rules for priests/clergy.
The Bible has no such rules. I mean confessing to the Pope.
BTW, they, the priests and the Pope, didn't write the Bible either.
I beg to differ, they weren't called the Pope or the Priests when they sat in Rome to write the Bible and decide the rules of the new church they were creating...but they are the ones that wrote it.
Why do you suppose the Vatican is in Rome? as opposed to Jerusalem...or Bethlehem...
Mikel says "Some and maybe all of these molesters are Satanists, what better way to ruin the church and hurt God?"
The truth is, the very priesthood is a doctrine of the devil.
1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh clearly, that in latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils. 2 Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as in a hot iron. 3 Forbidding to marry and commanding to abstain from meat, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and who know the truth.
What do you expect.
They aren't Satanists ... They're perverts taking advantage of a public trust. And not all priests are child molesters ... I do back you up on that one.
If we look at them as if they were Satanists then we absolve blame on some unknown force and fall into the belief that they can ask for forgiveness and receive it ... rather than remove them from the problem and see to it they get intense counseling.
This whole 'Satanist' thing is why this problem exists in the first place. By the church believing they can 'convert' these 'wayward sheep' they expose more children to the same pervert, all the while turning their heads and believing God will deal with this person's perversion.
They need counseling and they need to be removed from any post concerning children. If the church wants to cover up such issues then fine - just see to it these people receive proper medical treatment, they are kept away from children, and other parishes are told of these issues prior to any transfer, so they can't go on elsewhere to repeat their sick practices.
Of course, there's another solution that would end much of this ... return to priests the right to marry. At one point (actually several) they had this right and I do believe it would help clamp down on a lot of this as I believe much of it is caused by suppressing a male's most primitive urge - the urge to procreate.
And why don't we hear of nuns doing the same thing? The drive is 400% stronger in males so they are more likely to falter, but I suppose it is possible for a nun to have faltered as well, though it would be covered up much the same.
Also, women have a maternal instinct that is more likely to kick in and tell them what they are doing is wrong, so they are more likely to stop before completing the act. Whereas a male would not only complete the act, it would embolden his belief that he could do so again without being caught.
There's also a biological difference between what a priest could do to you and what a nun could do to you, and what the priest could do would be far more physical, and much more likely to get reported.
I really wish people would quit blaming Satan for all the bad that happens as the world is full of bad things and this only serves to justify to a populous that God is impotent, as he can do nothing to stop it.
Oh wait! He holds US responsible for our actions! That would mean we have a choice, and it would also mean that Satan can't make us do anything we don't want to do.
Satanists don't defile children ... sick people do ... and they will never get better until something is done about it. These people shouldn't be protected, they should be cast out. Or does the church approve of such practices? If they protect those who perpetrate them, then they become no less than an accomplice in the crime. Are the members more important than the faith they represent? If so, this explains why so many (including I) have turned away from religion as it's become no more than a club that states it does good deeds for the public as it permits evil behind closed doors.
William's post makes sense to me, some/many become that way after living an unnatural lifestyle of no sex, no females around, things like that. I figure many choose the lifestyle because of the "opportunities" it affords them but doesn't that take years? Maybe I'm mixing priests up with monks though, not sure. But I can easily see a man who didn't start out as a pervert becoming one after years of this.
There may be some truth to that. You can only fight nature for so long, and nature always fights back.
Sex is one of the strongest drives in humankind...repressing it completely would be one of the hardest fights a human being could undertake.
All they have to do is step down from the priesthood.
Instead of taking the coward's way and venting their crap onto children.
Check this out--just found it on the net.
The ratio of male victims to female victims is also important. In the 1950's, the ratio was 64% males abused, 34% females. In the 1970's, the worst decade of abuse, the ratio was 86% males, 14% females. The rate of abuse of females essentially declined from the rate of 305 cases reported in the 1960's. The number of cases of abuse of male youths, quite on the contrary, rose from 353 cases in the 1960's -- close to the number for females abused -- to 2,129, an astronomical increase. Thus the first untold story is that this was not a pedophilia crisis. It was a sexual crisis.
The link above is where I got it from. It shows a continuing problem and how long it has been a problem.
So.... Are they actually gay or is it because they are more likely to have access to boys because girls are not generally helpers in the church?
Is this because homosexuality is forbidden in the church and these men became priests because there was no other socially acceptable path to take?
These are all tough questions to understand and it seems only the priests themselves could give the answers.
"Thus the first untold story is that this was not a pedophilia crisis. It was a sexual crisis."
That's total nonsense. True pedophilia is a completely separate sexual orientation, it has nothing to do with homosexuality. Although pedophiles may have a preference for one gender or the other (or one hair color, skin color, eye color, etc.), the age of the victim is the important factor. Pedophiles are not capable of sustaining normal sexual relations with adults, even adults of the same gender they normally prefer in children.
I wrote a hub on the topic awhile back. If any of you are interested in reading it, the link is here: http://hubpages.com/hub/Is-it-safe-to-l … homosexual
Hokey asks ...........
Can anyone answer this? Why does the church cover it up?
Why does everyone keep beating around the bUsh?
Answer the MAN !!
If this church was of God; It wouldn't be allowing these things !! Remember what Earnist keeps showing us what God says to do with these kinds of perverts???
The Church that does things are not of GOD.
Who is left??? THE BEAST
Oh Okay. I will answer. Having it known that priests can be child molesters is really bad for business. Seriously, if you knew there was a good chance your child would be molested by one of the leaders of an organisation, would you give them 10% of your income? No!!!
Knowing that it is possible for a man to be a spiritual leader and yet carry on with evil crumbles the whole basis of religion. Aren't those who lead the church supposed to be close to God? And if with this closeness to God you still can't be a better person than any other man sitting in jail right now, then this closeness to God means nothing.
And if the leaders of the church are willing to commit such grave sins wouldn't it stand to reason that they are simply fallible humans and even possibly not believe in the hell which we they preach to keep others from walking away from the church.
And if the church leaders of today are fallible humans with no real closeness to God, then what does that say about the leaders of the past who created the religions?
Holding the beast accountable for all of man's short comings is really a short sightedness by you. Why do you always credit the BEAST for everything?
Yesterday it is the rain, today it is Child molestation? A man, a human being assaulted an innocent child. A man. A horrible human being. Nothing else.
Sometimes, you really must give credit where credit is do. Seriously. You do this to a fault my friend.
Just got home again. I apologize for being too blunt. I agree that, what an individual does is upon him. No one else. But when the Higharchy of the institution is aware and covers up this behaveior; it does become another issue on a diffrent level.
Sanctioned, covered up and allowed to continue.
For how long has it been being on and being covered up ??
Maybe I should not have jumped on it,but this was a perfect oppertunity to make a point.
Though I believe in God and Jesus and try to be the best person that know how to be. My beliefs about the church that the Roman Empire built is less than Ideal. I believe that it fits quite nicely in prophesy as the Beast mentioned in Rev. 13. If this is true why should the curent scandlal suprise anyone? Again I am talking about the administration and not the folks in the pews.
One church is particularly known for molestation charges. that church seats satan and those in it should leave. those men and women attempt abstinent living(pagan) which in turn drives their already confused understanding into meeting their sexual needs with those most vulnerable. Get out of that church, there is no truth there.
why? why are children treated like crap? why are they looked at as possessions and property? why are they whole sale slaughtered by the tens of millions every frigging year? why is their worth reduced to a dollar amount? its because of choice. i think. its not their right to chose. thats been taken from them by all those molesting there importance
The church covers up child abuse by priests up for the same reason just about all organizations cover up issues they perceive as a threat to the organizations. This applies to government agencies, office holders, automobile companies, and so forth. Moreover, I heard a Catholic cleric say that another reason the church is reluctant to report them to law enforcement is that the church believes in redemption and forgiveness--hence the practice of sending priests away for rehabilitation and then reassignment to another parish, sometimes with the understanding, apparently not well observed, that they not have contact with children. Of course the problem is that pedophiles are quite hard to rehabilitate. They tend to be repeat offenders. Many people think that allowing priests to marry would help attract more normal heterosexuals and fewer pedophiles.
Apocalyptica's "I'm not Jesus"
Corey Taylor from Slipknot is the vocalist and I think that's why many people think this song is anti-christian.
It is not.
I thought you were a good man
I thought you talked to god
You hippocratic messianic
child abusing, turned satanic
The band sounds like a guitar heavy hard rock band but they are all playing cellos.
The sound quality is not great here but it displays the lyrics.
Great song thanks for the link.
Slipknot is one of my fav bands. The lyrics are great.
While it's fairly obvious that pedophilia exists in the church, it isn't fair to compare the church to other institutions that also harbor pedophiles. The church is supposed to be the ultimate moral compass for it's followers, unlike those other organizations.
Perhaps, another question that needs to be answered is whether or not the cleric in question was a pedophile before they became a cleric or did it happen afterward?
Why do priests molest kids and why does the church cover it up?
Certain priests molest kids because they are just pervert pedophiles and they would molest kids no matter if they were teachers, coaches, doctors, or step-fathers. The church covers it up because they are afraid of the scandal, I suppose. And I guess that if you are religious enough to become a priest in the first place, you probably believe on some level that eventually these bad priests will get their punishment in the hereafter.
Personally, I think they should just be made to disappear in some remote wooded area and buried deep enough so that the animals can't dig them back up again.
I think the issue of molestation among the clergy mostly stems from the fact energy, by its very nature, must transfer itself from one form to another, sexual energy notwithstanding. Energy of any type will be released in some way, shape, or form, and if it is not given a NATURAL outlet, it will find an UNnatural path. A river naturally makes it way downhill. Sure, you can dam it up wherever you like, but this doesn't stop the flow of water. The water will simply flood the surrounding area, eventually rushing over or around the dam, or pressing through cracks in the wall. These vows of celibacy and dogmatic sexual repressions violate the natural order of things in much the same way a dam suppresses the water. The natural outlet is blocked, so an unnatural outlet is forced upon it. I would wager my right arm that if these arcane practices of celibacy and abstinence went the route of the dodo birds and witch burning, you would see an instant and dramatic drop in the number of cases or clerical abuse.
me too..i agree with what pay2cEM's point of view with what's happening inside the church..too much of anything is not good, at all..too much restraint from things you want to do or have will cause you to be too stressed and let's you find a way to fulfill that want or longing, either in a good way or wrong way..
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