Ladies - why are you going against the word of god?

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Mark Knowlesposted 15 years ago
I see we have a bunch of female religionists preaching what we should be doing, but I am confused. God made it pretty clear that women were to be seen and not heard - they are, after all, subservient to men and should do as their husbands tell them. They are expressly forbidden from teaching and preaching:

"Let your women keep silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak; but they are to be submissive, as the law also says. And if they want to learn something, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is shameful for women to speak in church, for Adam was formed first, then Eve." 1 Corinthians 14:34-36

"Unto the woman He said: your desire shall be to your husband, and he shall rule over you."Genesis 3:16

"Let a woman learn in silence with all submission. And I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, but to be in silence For Adam was first formed, then Eve."1 Timothy 2:11-13

So - why do you go against the word of god and seek to teach men what they should do?

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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  As usual you have taken the lesson out of context,and I thought you were pretty clued up on cultures Mark
  disappointing ,but what would you say -oh well
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  darksideposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Please put them in context for us.
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  danny heimposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  wow, that's a trip, who are you dude?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I guess you could call me a "militant atheist," asking why the female religionists pushing their brand of salvation are not following the word of their god. Who are you?
  
  Dude.
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  RKHenryposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Has he really? All I see here is the man quoting scripture accurately. So what's the matter, don't like what the bible truly says? He didn't take nothing out of context. Maybe, its just that you don't actually want to follow the Christian bible honestly.
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  nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Theology from an atheist. I love HubPages!
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  dennisemattposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  how am I supposed to answer this silently?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are not. You either answer and go against the word of god. Or shut up and do as you are told. Simple no?
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I am just gonna guess, because religion is originally "mans idea", if a woman starts to act like a man, play man games, do manly things then she it is expected that she will also be treated like a man.
  
  Plus the bible also says that woman are the "rock" of their households, even though the man is the head of the house, guess what? If his wife disagrees with good reason, the man is also expected to listen to his wife.
  
  I forget which story it comes from but it says something to the effect of God saying, "why didn't listen to your wife when she told you...?" I do believe that these things were to free woman of the same oppressions that had taken men.
  
  - now do you believe that woman are still equal to men? (in this context of course) I mean, do you believe that if a woman hits a man and the man hits her back, is the man wrong to do it?
  
  - they use to not allow women to serve in military front lines because women physically are less capable and it was viewed as wrong to allow woman to be shot up in "mans" war but woman complained, we want to be treated as equals, we want to also fight in these wars, we want to also work etc...
  
  But happened? Woman got there way, they want to be viewed as equals and while I can understand the freedom to work if you want to, go to school etc... those things, I for one do not believe that woman are equal to men, in our civil rights yes we are but physically and emotionally no.
  
  Physically men are stronger and emotionally (no matter how much emotion we tend to show) woman are emotionally stronger then men. Women have something like a 20% greater pain threshold then men... anyways I'll stop before I start an argument, which I may have already, sorry.
  
  Woman and men equal and different. I do not want to be treated like a man and I don't think any man wants to be treated like a woman.
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  Leta Sposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  OMG. lol Well, you know, it's just a bunch of manuscripts, the way I see it, written by people who lived a thousand years ago or so and put their own slant on things - women didn't live very long; men were the one's who could write. (I probably would have offed myself, lol, or ran away and become part of a traveling group of performers or something.)
  
  Yeah, frightening.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Or become a nun.
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  Leta Sposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Well, they did live longer. And got to read and write. lol
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  Alexander Markposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Mark, you're on target, although I know your aim in presenting this hypocrisy, I appreciate you bringing it up. It is true that women are not to preach. But it is more a matter of form and how the man / woman relationship represents God's relationship with us.
  
  We all recognize that men and women are flawed, but in trying to reach a state more resembling Godliness, we must try and keep things in order, and God made it clear how he wanted it.
  
  But it does not mean that men are so supposed to abuse their wives. In fact, the Bible has a lot to say about how husbands are supposed to treat their wives, and we have a lot more to be responsible for than just: "woman, where's mah dinner." Both parties have roles to play, and one of them is respect for each other.
  
  Although to you and other atheists this seems like two sides of the same coin, I will clarify that the woman is supposed to defer to the man, not be his slave.
  
  When I get married, I want someone who will make me think and keep me on my toes - but I will wear the pants in the family, even if she wears them too :-)
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Very nicely put. Thank you for this.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It was nicely put - but has little to do with the original question - which got lost in the morass of religionist anti-freemason paranoid delusions. LOL
  
  I was hoping our resident female preachers would stop by and explain why they are going against the word of god.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  But ISLAM encourages women to become educated.
  
  According to Sahih Bukhari, the women were very enthusiastic to acquire knowledge, and they once told the Prophet… ‘You are usually surrounded by men - why do not you give us one particular day so that we too can ask you questions’ - And the Prophet agreed.
  
  Beside he himself going, he sent many other of his Sahabas to the women, to give them education.
  
  We have examples of several Muslim women who are scholars
  And the best example I can give you is of Bibi Ayaisha (may Allah be pleased with her), who was the daughter of Hazrat Abubaker, the first Khalifa of Islam, (may Allah be pleased with him), and the wife of our beloved Prophet Muhammed (may peace be upon him)
  
  She gave guidance even to the Sahabas (companions of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)) and to the Khalifas - One of her famous student Urwah-Ibn-Zubair
  
  She said that… ‘I have not seen a greater scholar than Ayaisha in the field of learning of the Qur’an, in obligatory duties, in lawful and unlawful matters, in literature and poetry, in Arab history’
  
  She was not only expert in the Religious field, she had profound knowledge of medicine - Whenever the foreign delegates came to the Prophet and discussed, she used to memorize the remedies. She was well versed in the field of math, and many times the companions came to her to ask problems of ‘Mirath’ that is, ‘Inheritance’. She is said to have guided all the four Khalifas, including the companions.
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  nyliramposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It is true, Islam produces fine surgeons, lawyers. The wearing of a traditional Head scarf is no different,and does little to affect that persons ability. than many Western religions such as the Exclusive Brethren, it is a Headscarf. It is sad that Western perceptions of Islam are so biased.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  They created mass propaganda against ISLAM
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  CORBETTLEEposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  this i beleaveis a first for me so if i mess up forgive please more of a question than a reply have you read the book of Ruth
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  AEvansposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Who speaks against? I believe it was the ironclad Angels and woman's rights that allowed us to speak. mmmmm....interesting question to defend.
  
  I don't believe that it was meant to be submissive, it was meant not to argue with them in a public forum. It was meant to speak with them behind closed doors and to make decisions. Today there are more women in the work force then men, and our World would not completely function without us. If were not for women speaking many things would not have been accomplished.
  
  Eph: 5:25 Husbands, love your wives even as Christ loved the church and gave himself for it.
  Col: 3:19 Husbands, love your wives and be not bitter against them.
  Eph: 5:28 So ought men to love there wives as there own bodies. He that loveth his wife, love himself.
  1Peter 3:7 Likewise ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honor unto his wife.....
  
  Husbands as well are to show honor to their wives as they know she is the weaker sex, therefore he is to shower her and love her and protect her. So in the Bible we are also equal. We should respect our husbands as they respect us.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hey - I did not write this BS - just asking how come it only applies in certain circumstances.
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  AEvansposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  God only knows.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I must be God then.
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  AEvansposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Aren't you funny?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No - honest.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Remember the phrase in there "as the law also says". There is no law today like this. In fact, with salvation through Jesus Christ, the Word says "There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female", that we are one in Christ Jesus (Galatians 3:28). Also, the Word says, "In the last days, I will pour out my Spirit upon all flesh, and your sons and your DAUGHTERS shall prophesy" (Acts 2:17). And in the entire passage of wives submitting to their husbands, look at verse 32 in Ephesians 5 "I speak concerning Christ and the church."
  
  So men, if you are saved, you are the bride of Christ and must submit to HIM as we women do. In this, the two are one in marriage and are EQUALLY yoked. AMEN.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  These kind of statements can be traced to an utterance of Paul found in his books of Corinthians, Phillipians, Galatians, Thessolanians, etc., in the Bible. As against the teaching of the Master (Jesus) that salvation only comes through keeping of the commandments (Mathew 19:16-17), Paul nails the law and the commandments to the cross (Colossians 2:14) and claims that salvation can only be obtained through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ:-
  
  "If Christ be not risen from the dead, then our preaching is vain, and your faith is also vain."
  
  (1 Corinthians 15:14)
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  In that case you're well out of luck..
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  Make Moneyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Never mind Mark, usmanali81 has the second reading right here for us.
  
  That's right, Paul was telling the Corinthians that his preaching and their faith was not in vain because Jesus Christ died and was resurrected to fulfill the Mosaic Law. In Romans 13, Luke 18 and Matthew 19 Jesus repeats the ten commandments for us. Salvation comes through Jesus Christ.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No. You are interpreting it to mean that. He clearly states that there was no one coming back from the dead, and therefore your irrational beliefs and hypocritical preaching are, in the words of Paul himself, "in vain." Too bad.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  According to Jesus (peace be upon him), salvation is through commandments but according to Paul, salvation is through the death and resurrection of Jesus (pbuh). Why Paul is against Jesus (pbuh)???
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  sounds like the only one being "saved" here is Jesus.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, he is safe, alive and up into the heavens and will return very soon to prove that he was not crucified, he was not dead, he was not divine rather the ONE God and there is no such thing as TRINITY, even your corrupted Bibles do not have this word. The following will be his statment on his return to the Popes, Priests, Missionaries
  
  Gospel of Mathew: Ch 7:V 22
  22. "Many will say to me on that day, 'My Lord, my Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name cast out demons and in your name perform great powers?'
  23. "And then I will declare to them that, I never knew you, go away from me, workers of abomination.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Before Jesus came, there was God the Father. When Jesus came, there was God the Son, and now that Jesus returned to His Father, there is God the Holy Spirit. This is the ONE GOD. I have a hub explaining this three = 1 as in 1x1x1=1.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If a group of 3 friends plan to visit your home in the evening, they will not call you and say we are 1 (1*1*1) rather they will tell you, we are 3 (1+1+1), Ali, Usman and Umer, so prepare the dinner for 3 not 1.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Let's look at the actual Hebrew meaning for God, who created the heavens and the earth: It is #430 elohiym (el-o-heem’); PLURAL of 433; gods in the ordinary sense; but spec. used (in the plural, thus especially with the article “the”) of the supreme God.
  
  Now, let's look at the Greek meaning for Jesus (and you shall call His name Jesus in the New Testament): It is #2424 Iesous (ee-ay-sooce') meaning Jehoshua, the name of our Lord and two (three); same as Hebrew H3091 Yehowshuwa meaning Jehovah saved.
  
  In the Old Testament, we only knew God the Father. In the New Testament, we knew God WITH us, Jesus Christ. After Jesus ascended into heaven, we now have God IN us, the Holy Spirit. Read my hub. God is ONE: The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. AMEN.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Don't even try to decieve me with your own interpretations in parenthesis. Elohem is specifically used for the supreme God.
  
  Regarding the meaning of Jesus = saved (now this saved does not mean God or worship me)
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Respectfully, I didn't put in the parenthases. They are in the definition. I would ask that you look up the words yourself. I am fully accountable. If you want the truth, look it up! That's my motto!
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  Make Moneyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hi usmanali81. Does the Quaran have the story of the valley of the dry bones in it like the Jewish and Christian Bibles do?
  
  The story of the valley of the dry bones is in Ezechiel 37. Verse 13 says this "And you shall know that I am the Lord, when I shall have opened your sepulchres, and shall have brought you out of your graves, O my people".
  
  Well 1 Corinthians 15 is saying the same as Ezechiel 37. Note the similarities between Ezechiel 37 and 1 Corinthians 15 that speaks of not only the resurrection of Jesus Christ but also the resurrection of "they that are of Christ".
  
  1 Corinthians 15:20 "But now Christ is risen from the dead, the firstfruits of them that sleep: 21 For by a man came death, and by a man the resurrection of the dead. 22 And as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all shall be made alive. 23 But every one in his own order: the firstfruits Christ, then they that are of Christ, who have believed in his coming."
  
  Salvation is through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ but we also have to follow the 10 commandments that Jesus reminds us of in Romans 13, Luke 18 and Matthew 19.
  
  I hope that helps you understand this usmanali81. You too Sandra.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Dear, why you quoted all this out of context. All the verses you described are related to the judgment day when all will be risen from death, even you and me.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Regarding the 10 Commandments and the Old Testament Law: Romans 7:4-6 NIV "So, my brothers, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit to God. For when we were controlled by the sinful nature,[a] the sinful passions aroused by the law were at work in our bodies, so that we bore fruit for death. But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code."
  
  Romans 10:4 NIV "Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes."
  
  Galatians 2:16 NIV "know that a man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified."
  
  I do believe we need to show our love to the Lord and respect the Old Testament Laws, and indeed the Lord has moved me to worship on Saturdays (Messianic Jewish Synagogue) because of Matthew 24:20-21, showing that we should pray that our "flight" (rapture) not be in the winter or on a Sabbath, then in verse 21 "for then there will a great tribulation"...Praise God. He's coming soon, so love Him with all your hearts!
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Many cite this scripture to prove that the Law of God is no longer in effect. It is important to note that Paul stated, “You…are become dead”
  
  It is the very way in which you view God’s Law—that Christ’s sacrifice eliminated the need for obedience to it.
  
  In no way does Romans 7:4-6 prove that God’s Law is void. There, Paul merely points out that by dying for us, Christ paid the penalty of the Law for us.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No, the law is not dead, but the JUSTIFICATION by the law is dead. Our JUSTIFICATION is now through Jesus Christ, and because we LOVE Him, we should honor His laws, but know we have forgiveness when we fail, because we will as long as we live in a body of sin. Paul said when he sins, it is not he that sins, but the sin of the body in which he lives. This is in the book of Romans. If we say we have no sin, the truth is not in us. But, because of Jesus, we are blameless before God, for Jesus has become our righteousness when we serve Him and love Him with all our hearts.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So, God forbids if any christian rapes you, he will not be punished in heaven, am i right ???
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  "God Forbid!" The only unforgivable sin is to say that which is Holy is unclean (the Holy Spirit). However, if one practices sin on a habitual basis and does not adhere to the leading and obedience in the Holy Spirit, the Word says he has fallen away and it will be impossible to renew him again to repentance (Hebrews 6:4-6). Now, in the case of the man who was going to church and having sex with his father's wife, that man was "turned over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his soul might be saved in the last day." 1 Cor 5:5. God disciplines those He loves. His grace is greater than all our sin, and He will bring healing to the victim of such a crime! The judgment of the sinner in this case is done on earth, while he lives. There is no judgment in heaven. We are either righteous in Christ or condemned without Christ after our physical death.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The judgment of the sinner in not always done on earth. After killing innocents Bush (christian) is still alive and happy. The rapists (christians) of USA are still raping repeatidly and are happy in it.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  God is righteous and if they do not repent, they are not forgiven, thus their fate is that of the Lake of Fire. I was a victim of such things and if you read my hub, "For Victims of Abuse" you will see that God indeed has judged those who victimized me! ON THIS EARTH.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  LOL
  
  Sure.
  
  I notice you did not properly answer the original question though.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Read God's Bible. Not everyone who claims to be a Christian is a Christian. Did you ever hear of the spirit of antichrist? The devil disguises himself as an angel of light? True Christians are led by and are obedient to the Holy Spirit. Such atrocities/habitual sin of a Christian baptized in the Spirit would not be possible, in my opinion.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  There is no God's Bible, even there is no Jesus (peace be upon him)'s Bible. All the Bibles are from John, Mathew, Luke bla bla bla and are changed and interpolated hundred of times.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  2 Timothy 3:16 "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:" I said "God's Bible", not "Man's Bible" because false doctrines have their own interpretations of the Holy Bible that are twisted and corrupt.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  A learned Christian scholar, Kenneth Cragg, the Anglican Bishop of Jerusalem, says on page 277 of his book, "The Call of the Minaret":
  
  "Not so the New Testament . . . There is condensation and editing; there is choice, reproduction and witness. The Gospels have come through the mind of the Church behind the authors. They represent experience and history."
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I'm sorry; what was the original question?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  See the first post. I have read your book thank you and there is no Him.
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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It applies in all circumstances ,all occassions, for all men and all women.
  I believe its called Freedom of Speech ,but Christ liberated women way before mankind did.
  
  That is why I found this thread so silly.
  
  To not understand why advice ,commandments were written or advised for certain occassions is ignorance.
  
  Every situation in our lives has formalities , protocols etc ,what to say ,who to say it do , whos in charge ,who is not in charge etc ,we dont question that ,so why all the fuss about Paul instructing why it was best that women stay silent in church.
  
  ( they had a habit of talking to their family, girl-friends across ,back and in front , while the speaker was trying to preach)...
  Anyway just a shame that people could see the common sense aspect in scripture and not feel threatened by it.
  
  Happy Birthday America!!!, time to make a cake
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  blueraven6posted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  blueraven6posted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I see - so these rules are not the word of god then?
  
  Although I was hoping one of the female preachers would enlighten me.
  
  Not really sure what Jesus having sexual relations has got to do with anything either. Care to add a quote from Jesus where he says that only some of the earlier rules are to be followed and others are to be discarded.
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  blueraven6posted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  lol This does not refer to sexual relations?:
  
  "I'm reminded of a complaint made against Christ because he often kissed Myriam the Magdalene on her lips. "Why do you love her more than us?" The question was asked.
  
  Christ replied: "Should I not love her differently than you?" I can almost see him smile as he says this."
  
  So Genesis and the ten commandments are rubbish and to be discarded. Interesting. I am not really interested in studying your book any further than I already have.
  
  May your invisible super being inspire you to be a tad less condescending. And perhaps even learn how to use the "quote" facility.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Mark, Somehwere in that Bible it does say that the old is not good anymore. Jesus says that the only law is "Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You". He also said that the laws are in the minds and hearts of men (mankind), so we already know the laws and can never forget them. He also said that everything you could ever want or need and all the answers are Within You. Now there are those who do use this against others like a sword to hurt them and make them like them or their religions. You know this.
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  Andrew0208posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  The law of the Spirit of Life has made us(male & female) free from the law of the spirit of sin and death. If you did understand what the first Scripture you quoted, in the Hebrew context, women were not allowed to argue on matters in the church rather should ask their husbands when they get home. These are they days of the Spirit not empty religions that take man for law instead of law for man. God has poured out His Spirit on all flesh including women to witness and preach the gospel in Churches and to the ends of the earth. We're in the New era of God through Christ Who abides and lives in us(believers).
  Religion and religious men will blindly argue this without holding on the relevation of the present move of God thru the Holy Ghost at work in a believer. In fact women are choice anointed ministers of God to the glory of God, this election of the Holy Spirit do not make them husbands but co-labourers with Christ.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Ah - interesting - so this stuff written in the bible is completely open to interpretation to mean whatever you want it to mean and you should not follow these rules. Excellent - thank you - silly me for thinking it was the word of god.
  
  "women are choice anointed ministers of God to the glory of God"
  
  Please provide specific quotes from your book to support this.
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  Andrew0208posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Have you received the Holy Ghost? If you've Him in you, you will know and understand by His Spirit the purpose of Christ and the law. A time came when Jesus told them that they words He spoke to them were Spirit and Life. Find out why? He made that statement in John 6:63. Look, Christianity is more than a mere stinking religion and quoting the Scriptures. It's a Faith and Spirit walk beyond critical reasoning of sensory perception
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry sweetheart - that is all it is. And my question was specifically addressed to the women who do nothing but quote Scripture and "stinking religion" to tell me why I am a bad person. Hypocrites all - not one of them answered my question.
  
  And how do you know I do not speak for Him?
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  Andrew0208posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Mark, you're, remember what I told you earlier last year when I started that life changing thread "Who Is A Christian?" You'll be a tool in God's hand for the gospel despite your present strong profession of atheism. Time will tell. All you see is not all there's, the Spirit rules the physical.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  No - sorry - using a photo of a non-existent dead guy as your avatar will only perpetuate the religiosity. People see what they want to see. No getting away from it.
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  Andrew0208posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Anyway, what counts to me in that avatar is the resurrection power of Christ. Believing is a choice and unbelief is not non existence of a truth. Ignorance is not an excuse.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Unfortunately - you do not see the contradiction in your words - nor are you prepared to accept the religiosity of claiming a god that exists outside of yourself. Believe what you will. Learning for yourself is far more productive.
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  Andrew0208posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hahaha. Nothing can be truer than the truth. Dead or alive, believe it or not; There's God(Spirit). Eternal Truth!
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That works both ways!! Christ would not like to be reminded of the way they put him to death--would you? Rome was a VERY awful place in that day if you car to research your history. What do you think all those people wanted the most--to get out!
  Christ was not the only one on a cross --there were thousands of people on crosses and some were burned on those crosses. Christ was not descriminated against--he ws descriminated becaseu he had a better, more loving way and Rome did not like that--period. Anyone who spoke or even thought against that was put on a cross. Hell was the pit that Rome HAD to bury them in and burn their dead bodies for "sanitation" reasons. Go research that. Being ignorant of the facts is just plain ignorant and calling others ignorant because they do the research is just plain ignorant. It works both ways.
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  Randy Godwinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Cool! I never expected an avatar to have the power to resurrect anyone. This makes my avatar seem weak in comparison. Don't you worry about using Jesus's image to lend credibility to your own ideas about God? Why do you feel you know better than others?
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah Randy! Isn't that being full of pride and Pride goeth before a fall.
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  Randy Godwinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  Randy Godwinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So all this sounds like a commune. If you have Christ in you then you must exhibit totall happiness and not ask questions of others nor get them to realize they don't have him in you? Sounds suspicious to me and I know and I know Mark knows dear one. God doesn't work that way and he isn't some kind of drugged euphoria when he comes to you. Could it possibly occur to you to mean that those who do know the true Christ... ask questions to get others to know Christ and it has nothing to do with doctrination or brainwashing or telling others they are sinners nor putting them on guilt trips ro reading some book about a people's history.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  MEN don't choose who Christ truly reveals himslef too. Those who say they can are liars and have agendas that are not of Christ. Christ is already in EVERYBODY and he does not descriminate nore use sex as a tool--as in sex descrimination. If you can't see that you rae not ready to and Christ has really not called you. The chruch has and the chruch is not of Crhist these days or when Christ was alive.
  He did not like what the clergy were doing in his time and he would never condone what they are doing now. Chruch and religion descriminate in a BIG way.
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  afuaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Women aresupposed to be submissive to their husbands,that is very biblical.However I don't see anything wrong with women preaching. After all the woman at the well went back into her town and told everybody about Jesus. That is a form of preaching.
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  Randy Godwinposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Not exactly, if Satan had been at the well spinning his spell and the women reported this, would this have been considered preaching also? Reporting events and pushing agendas are two different things. Unless of course you are speaking about preaching in a non-religious context.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Satan is a myth propgated by the church to keep their flocks in check.
  There were women preacher in the days of Christ and before. Go back and read the things that Jacobbldder wrote on the Bible and the customs. No that wouldn't be a form of preaching, that be witnessing and that is all Jesus told us to do. Everyone.
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  Jewelsposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Lillith would not agree with that, but if you feel you must be submissive, then I won't stand in your way.
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  Paper Moonposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I was ready to come in and raise caine, but now I see what you were getting at. LOL. (paraglider nailed it from the get go)
  Great title.
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  Jane@CMposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yikes! I am a Christian. I read the Bible, but am not good at memorizing. My husband is the person who introduced me to Christ and I accepted Christ as my Lord and Savior.
  
  I believe the God created me with a brain and I should be using it!
  
  If I submitted to my husband in a sexual manner as often as he'd like, I'd be in bed, naked the entire time he is home. While that is comforting after 21 years of marriage, I can't imagine how sore I'd be each day
  
  While my husband is in upper management, the "He shall rule over me" would never fly. The guy can't make a decision to save his life on the home front. Bills would go unpaid, children would never get to the doctor, my husband would never get to the doctor, our bank accounts would be a mess, I could go on forever. Point being, God gave me a brain for good reason, HE knew I'd marry a man who does not have good decision making skills (snicker).
  
  If I didn't have authority here at home...I might as well wonder around in a mist of clouds.
  
  I tried the whole submissive wife thing when we first got married. Trust me, it didn't work.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I did that too and we ended up in a Debt Counseling Service!
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are right on. The passage in 1 Cor 14:34-36 includes the phrase, "as the law also says" and women in those days were not educated in any manner. Upon salvation in Christ Jesus, the Word says in Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus." We are set free from the curse given to Eve back in the Garden of Eden!
  
  Also, the Word says in Acts 2:17 "And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:" Daughters will indeed prophesy, which is to speak forth the Word of God. Praise God!
  
  The submission passage in Ephesians 5 must be taken in context with verse 32: "This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church." Everyone, including men, who gets saved becomes the Bride of Christ and must submit to HIM. AMEN.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  These passages are great! Now why do you still think that there are othrs who are not saved or not of Jesus or God? This makes no sense.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We have the choice to serve God or not. Not ALL are saved. The gift is there for ALL who will receive it. AMEN.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So it says that Jesus fasted in the wilderness for 40 days and was tempted by Satan. When Satan offered Jesus the world if only Jesus would worship Satan, Jesus refused, right?
  
  Okay so 2000 years later this is the scene... Jesus: I promise you the world if you worship me.
  
  You don't see the problem with this???
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Awesome ! I agree - we can drop the 10 commandments at will - Yay!
  
  Or do you think there are some parts god wanted us to keep?
  
  And you happen to know the parts he wants us to keep by any chance?
  
  ZZZZZZZ. Rewrite it to your heart's content. I agree with you - we should discard the bits we do not agree with and go with the bits we like.
  
  Same as everyone else. God's word .
  
  Thanks.........
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I see - so you have rewritten the entire thing to suit what you want. Excellent. I don't blame you one bit - I never listen to this BS either. Just do not tell me you are speaking the word of god.
  
  Just your word - which bears no relation to what it says in the bible.
  
  Good for you - I think it is garbage also.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Get over yourself, you male cheauvanist pig! Yes, I rebuke you in Jesus' name! Read 'em and weep!
  The passage in 1 Cor 14:34-36 includes the phrase, "as the law also says" and women in those days were not educated in any manner. Upon salvation in Christ Jesus, the Word says in Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus." We are set free from the curse given to Eve back in the Garden of Eden!
  
  Also, the Word says in Acts 2:17 "And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:" Daughters will indeed prophesy, which is to speak forth the Word of God. Praise God!
  
  The passage in Ephesians 5 that speaks of submission of the bride, read it in context ~ verse 32: "This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church." If you're saved, you as the bride of Christ must submit to HIM! How do you feel about that?!
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Male chauvenist pig?
  
  You have obviously never read a word I have written......
  
  Oh well, you have god speaking into your head so.........
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The passage in Ephesians 5 regarding submission of the bride must be taken as proof in its context as well: Look at verse 32 "This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church." If you claim to be saved, you are the bride of Christ and YOU must submit to HIM! How do you feel about that?
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Save you from His fire right?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  How do I feel? Hmmmm - I guess I am laughing at your religionist crap that goes against what it says in the bible. To suit yourself.
  
  "Let a woman learn in silence with all submission. And I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, but to be in silence For Adam was first formed, then Eve."1 Timothy 2:11-13
  
  Not a lot of room for interpretation here. Sorry. You are subservient - says it right there.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Again, your quoting the curse of Eve, which we are set free of! Get your head out of your behind!
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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You go girl
  Non-believers just love to get nasty,you just maybe the only action they get ...in the written form.
  And I wouldnt be too worried about your spelling ,specially rich coming from ms spellcheck herself..lol
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We stand united and liberated in Jesus' holy NAME! Hallelujiah! The adversary is destroyed, amen!
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Honey.... Jesus is Satan.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I'm insulted to even have to read your stupidity.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Awwww. Now you are getting nasty. Surely that goes against Jesus' word also?
  
  You are going to hell for sure.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  LOL. Jesus rebuked Peter and yet He never sinned. I rebuke you openly, and I am not sinning in doing so. Stupid is as stupid writes.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  LOL
  
  It always goes there. Thanks for reminding me why I am not interested in your offensive, hate-filled religion.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, I find you exquisitely insulting.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus is not Satan. Jesus said there is only ONE UNFORGIVABLE SIN and it is found in Mark 3:29-30 "But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation. Because they said, He hath an unclean spirit." They said, Satan cast out Satan. Read it for yourself. Jesus is NOT Satan.
  
  Luke 12:10 "And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven."
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Right I know, so who does all the casting out of Satan? Jesus caste out Satan... Jesus says, "Get ye behind me Satan." to Peter. Jesus caste out Satan when the little kids were being obnoxious in ? Leviticus.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Because Jesus in not Satan. Jesus is greater than Satan. The Words says in 1 John 4:4 "You are from God, little children, and have overcome them; because greater is He who is in you than he who is in the world." Look at Luke 10:17-20 "The seventy returned with joy, saying, 'Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name'. And He said to them, 'I was watching Satan fall from heaven like lightning.' Behold, I have given you authority to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing will injure you. Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rejoice that your names are recorded in heaven." Hallelujiah!
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You really can't see what you are writing here? Jesus is not good. He rules demons but wont make them go away, he anoints you to be "his dominion" so that you can too, tread on people you think are evil...
  
  it's evil.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are calling that which is holy evil and your fate will be sealed if you continue to do so, as the Word says.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  ummm.... yeaahhhh.... sure.... Jesus is the Great Deceiver. Sorry to break it to you, you might want to go and figure it out for yourself. But you might be too afraid of the god you call love to ever know that fear and love are not one in the same.
  
  1John 4:18. Quickly, go get your Bible, ask Jesus for forgiveness and turn away from you wicked ways for even Jesus' Bride is asleep.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If the Holy ghost is in you how do you do that? Don't answer it will be just more of your scripture that you take out of context.......booooring
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  YOU wish!! Each time you bring him up you just cause more crap. What you focus on will come back to you---says that in the Bible----Oh I forgot you dont read it for yourself so you wouldn't know.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  LG, we are adversaries because you don't believe Jesus Christ is the only way to heaven. You wish to continue hostility, do it somewhere else. You just bring down the body of Christ here in this forum.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  LOL
  
  As opposed to attacking scientific proof that there is no god. Oh well...........
  
  You should go against the word of god and preach too. Oh wait.....
  
  Adam came first. Then the chicks.
  
  Second.............
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  dinosaurs!
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  And you inherited the brains of dinosaurs.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Oh so you believe that the dinosaurs existed and were here long before humans? Good for you!
  
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Read about Leviathan in the Bible. If you even know where to find it; I shouldn't teach you, so you say, lol.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You should read His book.
  
  Darwin that is. Maybe then you will understand. Or not.....
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  you mean Jesus?
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I apologize if I was responding harshly to a child of God. It gets confusing here as to who's writing responses. Leviathan is written about in Job 41. Pretty scary!
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What makes her the Child of God and no one else?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  awww. but if you know the truth , its really wont bother you what she implies...( God never said that)
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Wow, you guys are becoming really good at calling people satan's children without having to say it.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You shall know them by their fruits (Matthew 7:16), amen.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  ....and what kinds of fruits are you showing there Carrie? It isn't LOVE.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus loved Peter and yet rebuked the spirit of Satan influencing him. Likewise, I do the same.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So your God gave you the tools to know who is who by what they say? Well you should be in the courts then and ---were you there when the Witches were sentence to hang--I bet you were and you knew exactly what a witch is.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hebrews 4:12 "For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart." God's children have the gift of discerning of spirits: 1 Cor 12:10 "To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:"
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Use the whole paragraph if you will. God didn't speak in short verses and neither did Jesus.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Why not read the whole Bible, LG? It will definitely do you some good.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are so condescending! You can't read either. You are ASS-U-ME ing the wrong things dear lady. You don't even want to know anything about me or how I came to where I am today. All you want to do is shove that Bible of Yours down people's throats and make sure they know that YOU think they are not saved and so you MUST save them.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  According to you we are all god's children.
  
  And I discern your spirit to be bad. Going to hell for sure. Too bad. Maybe if you stopped preaching against the word of god?
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Were you looking in the mirror when you had this discernment?
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Now who is egging for an argument. Proof is on the page!
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  Mishaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Ms Spllcheck Herelf:
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That is soooo hot!
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes we know that you think with your "little head". Shame on you!
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  Mishaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Of course you always know what others think, your god gave you this power
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Misha... she was attacking your man parts.
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  Mishaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Oh, I am quite aware of this Sandy, I love it when women attack my man parts...oh...oh...oh...yes baby... yes Carrie... aaaaaaaaaaaaaaa yes!
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It doesn't take God to see how corrupt you are! Duhhhh....brains of a dinosaur, as I said.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Wait just a moment there!!! nNon-beleivers don't stoop tot the lowerst level and call others names and become nasty when put on the spot with what really is in that Bible.
  She threw the first name calling, not Mark. I guess Jesus said that it was OK for his children to call people nasty names? Is that right?
  hmmmmmmm................
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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  oh Mark would never call names...c'mon
  he said /she said
  no more xbox for either of you
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  And Jesus healed on the Sabbath. My goodness, you throw the baby out with the bathwater all the time, LG.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus also told you to honor the Sabbath yet Jesus couldn't honor the tradition himself.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  And yet Jesus called THEM "Hyprocrites".
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  exactly! Now your getting it.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Oh dear yourself...when is the true Sabbath? Do you know and do you do anything on that day--even eat or sleep or wash dishes? What does the Bibel say about that and what was Jesus's response.
  You think you know everything and you delight in the name calling--how very Christian of you.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The Sabbath is the seventh day and we keep it holy.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  ah so you don't know. Fancy that!
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are a silly woman as described in the Bible, LG 2 Timothy 3:6 "For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts"
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  And Jesus healed on the Sabbath. My goodness, you throw the baby out with the bathwater all the time, LG.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  And Jesus healed on the Sabbath. My goodness, you throw the baby out with the bathwater all the time, LG.
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  Mishaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Bva-ha-ha-ha-ha
  
  It sounds even better than condescending vagina, right Mark?
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Wha????? The vagina speaks?
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You make your cheauvanistic spirit more evident with every stroke of your keyboard!
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  Mishaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  L@@K Sandy, now you are male chauvinist
  
  Carrie, please note the correct spelling
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Penis envy I guess.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus was chauvinistic too! He loved women
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, chivalry is not dead in Christ Jesus! He gave Himself for us and set us free, praise God! Romans 7:6 "But now we have been released from the Law, having died to that by which we were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter." 2 Corinthians 3:6 "Who also made us sufficient as ministers of a new covenant; not of the letter [of the law], but of the spirit: for the letter [of the law] killeth, but the spirit giveth life." AMEN!
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  At least she didn't write a hub...........
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You make your cheauvanistic spirit more evident with every stroke of your keyboard!
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  TrinaLynneposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No woman is subservient to any man. We cannot preach and teach to men but we can help other women. This just proves your insecurities.
  
  I'm actually not going to say anything more because Mark your views can be rather offensive and self centered.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So your saying that woman are stupid and not self sufficient so they need to be helped or taught?
  
  You sound pretty chauvinist too.
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  TrinaLynneposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No. I'm saying that we can help one another as women. Who said women were stupid. Everyone needs help and to be taught. We don't know everything you know. How are you going to learn if you don't learn from a book (written by someone), a website (also written by someone), a friend. So your comment was just really baseless because you took the wrong out of it and I can't even see where you got it from.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Sure I can, I got it from you. Someone who wrote it who learned it from someone else, who learned it from someone else...
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Proof again that you dont read the Bible. Jesus stated that people should not go by the book, but what is in your heart. I have heard the heart is bad and evil. So I guess you listen to that too----hmmmmm? You have no idea where Jesus said the Word, Law or Kingdom of God is becaseu you don't sit and read that book you claim that you know. I can assure you that all those things he talks about are not in that book!
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Self centered. OK - That is because you do not understand where I am coming from. Read your bible and you will understand. Maybe.
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  TrinaLynneposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Daughter of a minister, granddaughter of a minister. Convert to Islam. I have read the bible. And I love the way people use it out of context to feel right. It should be used for worship, not for getting your point across sweetie.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  LOL
  
  Another religionist. One that can't make her mind up apparently. You would not be preaching to any of the muslimists I know......
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You get 100 score in ignorance.
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  TrinaLynneposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I'm not preaching at all hun. How do you figure I'm confused? I grew up Christian. I converted 2 years ago. Where is the confusion. Regardless of what my religion is, the bible should not be used for getting ones point across is all I'm saying.
  
  And I've noticed something Mark. You don't like when people have a difference of opinion. Otherwise you would take other people's opinion as such instead of insulting them and their intelligence.
  
  I have spent too much of my time on this particular thread. Everyone have a great day.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Opinion? Surely there is just the WORD of GOD?
  
  I did not realize it was open to opinions. Apparently it is.....
  
  Guess that makes it worthless.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Honey, Take a look in the mirror...
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Oooooooo, the same goes for you tooo "sweetie".
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  Lucky120posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  WOW!!! That is what it says,but if you believe that God speaks to everyone then you would know that this is how women end up preaching in the first place. My whole family are ministers. Ya know when judgement day comes God will ask " WHAT DID I TELL YOU TO DO?" When you ever ask that question again think about the question I just quoted.
  
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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  But - this is what he told you to do:
  
  "Let your women keep silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak; but they are to be submissive, as the law also says. And if they want to learn something, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is shameful for women to speak in church, for Adam was formed first, then Eve." 1 Corinthians 14:34-36
  
  "Unto the woman He said: your desire shall be to your husband, and he shall rule over you."Genesis 3:16
  
  "Let a woman learn in silence with all submission. And I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, but to be in silence For Adam was first formed, then Eve."1 Timothy 2:11-13
  
  So - why do you go against the word of god and seek to teach men what they should do?
  
  Oh dear. You are go9ing to burn in hell.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No God or Jesus does not ask you any of those kinds of questions at all.
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  Davinagirl3posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I hope you are being sarcastic, but you won't hear me preach, anyway.
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  Vladimir Uhriposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Mark, my friend. You are a materialist and you are not qualify to interpret the Bible. You do not have anything to do with spiritual. You just cannot see it. More you look to material things less you can see the heavens. The quotation you used was specifically to Corinthians. They had to be straight, that's all. The Bible is clear how many ladies were very special for the church and Old Covenant people. Many were prophetess. Of course there were also false prophetess (Jezabel).
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Vladimir - You are a fascist, religionist and therefore your opinion is worthless. Too bad. Oh well......
  
  More you imagine there is something invisible, less you appreciate there is a real world.
  
  See you in hell.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Well Mark, you've spoken one word of truth...that is your own fate. Vladimir is a son of God, a child of God and will not see you there, except in the presence of the Lamb. I assure you, neither of us will be laughing at your fate. We love you and are telling you the truth, in God's love.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  In gods love but not your own? Surly the Lamb will be roasting by the fire.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, God's love, agape love. Because we love God, we react to the "enemies" of God in our flesh, rather than the Spirit. For this, God is growing me to love in His love.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  and that is why god said it was okay to kill people? So it is okay to do whatever you want to yourself and others as long as god knows you love him more than anyone else right?
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Regarding killing, the word "kill" in the 10 commandments is that of murder. We kill animals for food. God's Word says, if you do something YOU know is wrong, to YOU it is sin. God judges the motives behind the action, so action in itself is not the sin, but the motive behind it, that comes from the heart.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So when my heart is telling me that what you believe is a murderer then he is going to kill me because of it?
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Ah - so "killing" doesn't mean killing. Just like "love" doesn't mean love.
  
  And therein lies the problem. You say "love" everyone else hears, "you are wrong and will suffer eternally."
  
  Scum religionist. Female religionist at that - going against the word of god. I "love" you so much, I feel I must tell you - you are going to burn in hellfire for all eternity. Oh well, if only you had listened to the TRUTH.
  
  Just for your own good of course................. Because I "love" you.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  At least I will know I'm not guilty for not telling you, as so many modern day "man love me" religious people refuse to do. I won't have your blood on my hands.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  LOL - As I said - because I "love" you so much, I feel obliged to point out the error of your ways. Now,m I can not be held responsible for your inevitable eternity in hell - for going against the written WORD of GOD.
  
  Sorry - there is no blood on my hands either - it is your free will to do this. Even though the scripture states quite clearly that you are subservient to me. Oh well. I tried. No matter - you are just female and worthless. We men came first. So it is written......
  
  Ramen
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The head of every man is Christ. Do you claim Him as your Lord? I am not your wife, but His, and thus I don't submit to you, but Him. AMEN.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You mean I am not a son of god. Oh dear......
  
  Female religionists going against the word of god. See you in hell also..........
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  yeah, how can you be, Jesus was a virgin.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  LOL
  Not what I heard...........
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  eh, wha'd you hear? lol
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The word "son" as in children of God, refers to both men and women, even children. I'm sorry you feel you are going to hell. God has made the way for you, if you only accept it. It's free.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  so now you are a god-transvestite who sometimes accepts children who makes the way for people to go to hell?
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  He made hell, not the way to hell. He made the way to prevent those who believe in Him from going there.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So god made everything but the way to hell?
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  God is just and is much wiser than any man (we only use 10% of our brains). Because He is just, only He can judge and we know of His judgment through the the Bible. Man chooses his own way ~ the path to judgment, or man chooses God's way ~ the path to escape judgment.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  God is just what? Can you finish the sentence or should I teach you how to use another percent of your brain to complete a sentence?
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  JUST mean RIGHTEOUS. That's where we get the word Justice. I didn't leave out anything; I apologize you didn't understand.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  yes, please keep apologizing it just might take away your sins.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  As we are forgiven, so must we forgive; amen.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Really because I forgive you for being a *fill in the blank* because I know your just scared and unloved by the god you hold so dear who doesn't seem to care that much about you other then to make you feel like you simple must justify yourself and your beliefs by making nasty remarks to people who simply do not believe in a god damning god who loves no one but other god damning people.
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  While I can appreciate your viewpoint, Jesus came not to judge at His time, and I am learning to not take the responsibility of others' decisions upon myself. If I continue in the example of Jesus, I will focus more on loving and the good news, rather than His future judgment. Each man has their own will and mind to do as he pleases and will only be judged by God Himself, which will happen when it's time, as prophesied in the Bible. I am consistenly being transformed into His image, His will, not my own. Likewise, it is He who will do the same for others.
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Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years ago
Thank you for the reminder, Mark Another good reason I've been staying out of this forum!
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  cheaptrickposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  i think burkhas are a good idea,only,without a bra or panties cause that leaves something to the imagination...WOMEN are the most beutiful gift men have been given and after thousands of years of being dominated by big strong(insecure)men have developed very sharp minds as a matter of survival(i'm not forgeting adout those sweet curves)so lighten up guys cause without women we'd be having sex with each otherOHHH i just got the creeps!...feed your head...
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No without women you wouldn't even exist!
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are right at this.
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Eaglekiwiposted 15 years ago
Mark would have us all wear burkhas next, and muzzles..
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  Paragliderposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No. He would have you tear up the sexist 'scriptures' and respect yourselves as freethinking human beings.
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I have been compulsively researching Islam lately. I can't seem to stop myself from doing it. The more I explore, the more that I discover that Muslim women in general appear to feel that their covering (whether Hijab, Niqab, etc) brings them more freedom, at least in their individual culture.
  
  I don't personally feel that being spiritual or religious and being free-thinking are necessarily mutually exclusive.
  
  I honestly think that in some ways I've grown through this forum, I just haven't really allowed myself to notice the personal growth. It took me a while to learn to be confident in what I believed, but it has been in large part due to the challenges that Mark presents that I have gained confidence in my beliefs (spiritual and personal).
  
  I respect everybody here, though there are times that I get angry. I don't want to argue about religion because I don't like the way that arguing makes me feel. And because honestly, Mark has a good point. I like being a submissive woman: for me it offers significant freedom that I have been unsuccessful finding anywhere else in my life.
  
  But I did choose submission long before I chose Christianity
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  Paragliderposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  In many Arab countries it does indeed bring them more freedom, not least because many Arab men see women who wear immodest (i.e. western) dress as whores and therefore as 'fair game'. Hijab frees women from that particular oppression. (And I know that's not the whole story, but it is certainly a part of it).
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  Eng.Mposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  surely you worked in some Arab parts . .
  
  how did know it's part of it ?
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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I think its called a human ignorance , to not understand other cultures,or at least to not attempt too.
  But it goes both ways,enlightenment.
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  LondonGirlposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  In many countries, such as Iran, Saudi or Afghanistan, wearing all-over blackout kit gives you freedom, sure enough. THe freedom not to have the living daylights kicked out of you for not wearing it.
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  Barb Hposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Good point. Very funny
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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If you really knew the "Spirit Of The Law" you would know that Christ has liberated women NOT as you understand it all.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No sweetheart - just practice what you preach.
  
  Or as Paraglider pointed out - my real intention.
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Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years ago
Kiwi, I do wear hijab, or at least I am at the moment. At different times I tie my scarves differently, but I do keep my head covered in accordance with the Bible and where I feel that God has led me with regard to this.

It isn't for everyone, but I feel great about it!
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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Good for you , life is about choices and when Jesus said
  I have come that you might life , in ALL its abundance' I celebrated that fact too.
  I have a voice
  I have a mind
  God expects me to use it in 'all its abundance' not to say I do as much as I should , in fact my mind has been sluggish lately.
  I do respect man in authority if he is performing according to the scriptures...As Christ is Head Of The Church...So Man Is To be Head Of His Household...
  That is the whole concept.
  Problems arise when man misquotes or uses scripture to 'tear down' Salvation and (whole) Truth. and EM Ive missed your prescence on HB , I wish you well.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No one is tearing anything down. You are going against the word of god and twisting to suit. Why?
  
  "Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die"Ecclesiasticus, 25:18, 19 & 33
  
  "And I find more bitter than death the woman, whose heart is snares and nets, and her hands as bands: whoso pleaseth God shall escape from her; but the sinner shall be taken by her.Ecclesiastes 7:26
  
  It is not open to debate or "interpretation."
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  Eaglekiwiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Good, because the suns out and I feel like cake later gaters
  (EM if ya get a minute,check out my latest hub(short one) on Why Do Americans Celebrate July 4th- my first lesson as an Immigrant Alien,somethin?) lol anyway it was all because of the cake!!!).....
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  Make Moneyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That is cool EM. When I was a kid most women wore a scarf at one time or another. They look good on women.
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I love the way it looks! Strange how my husband doesn't, but I'm covering up a lot of thick, curly red hair, too lol
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  Make Moneyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I bet a green scarf would look good on you.
  
  This is quite the sermon that Mark started, isn't it?
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  LondonGirlposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I wear hats quite a lot. They keep my head warm in the winter, and keep the sun off my face in the summer. And I like the way they look, too. But I only wear them outside.
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  Maddie Ruudposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I covered my head for a while, but not for religious reasons. It was interesting how people assumed I would be shy and quiet and not stick up for myself--they treated me like crap, in fact ('twas Texas)... holding a door open for a woman in front of me and then letting it slam in my face... trying to cut me in line... even making obnoxious comments to me. Boy, were they surprised when I talked back or flipped 'em off! Although, really, my favorite response (on my more patient days), was to say "As-Salaamu Alaykum" to them. More often than not, that scared 'em out of their wits.
  
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  For a while I chose plain dress, before I dug deeper into the Bible and was able to establish my own personal understanding of the passages that have lent themselves to it (plain dress). It was amazing to see the reactions I got when people caught sight of my wedding ring or heard me interacting with my husband! Our relationship, for being so traditional, is *very* egalitarian. No decision is made in our home without my input (or at least I can't remember one that was unless I chose to back off without making a stand for any number of reasons).
  
  It is often amusing to see the way that people respond. I have chosen not to wear a scarf in hijab style in public just because I don't feel like dealing with the questions. I did a lot of research before I made this decision. The style I wear mostly resembles what one will see most often in traditional Jewish women more than in Christian or Muslim women. I'm happy with it, though DH prefers the Amish or Mennonite Cap. I just think it is remarkably incongruous with my normal style of dress.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  lol - I bet it did. One of my ex girlfriends wore a head scarf for a long time because she had lost her hair. It was quite amazing the conclusions a lot of people jumped to.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry you are wrong, HIJAB is for everyone.
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Where I live we have religious freedom, which allows us to make the choice of which religion to practice and how to practice it. I am in obedience to 1 Corinthians 11 and meant only that I wear the Hijab style. As a Christian I wear it for a different reason than Muslim women do -- for me it is as a sign of deference to my husband.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I think that wearing something over the head really means hair and to no shave it off as there were some that did that way, way, way back when these scripts were written. We are not given the whole story though and where some of this information or MIS information becasue MAN decided what when in the bible and why it was taken our or excluded. That is for another HUB or Forum.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We also have religious freedom in our territory but it's my humble advice to follow the religion as per the religious scripture and the related Prophets and companions. If you are wearing a scarf for differing yourself from your husband then it's not the religious theme and ultimatly you are not following your religion as a whole.
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  apekshaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  agreed..but the same god might had given justice to bad people..
  Now I dont believe on GOD and all that...
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  1 Cor 11:15 "But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering."
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  apekshaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  women should feel proud of long hair and her beauty.
  In India anybody said that nothing is beautiful like women..God made her with his own time and very carefully...
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  Carrie Bradshawposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Amen, just know that the Bible does not require a woman to cover her head, nor a man for that matter. In that same passage the Bible says in 1 Corinthians 11:7 "For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man."
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  apekshaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I haven't read that and I don't believe on religions...I am hindu but I respect all..I am not catholic..How come I know that line numbers...
  but thanks..n agreed to that ...
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countrywomenposted 15 years ago
Mark- Almost every religion would have some Achilles heel. It is true some folks tend to selectively pick and choose what to follow and what to conveniently ignore. I prefer common sense and understanding a better guide for improving ourselves but that is just me. I have a neighbor who insists on me to be "saved" which I find irritating sometimes. Anyway the golden rule of "live and let live" would be a good practice.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It's the golden rule by Freemasons, get rid of it.
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  countrywomenposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Sir, I am an adult now and know what rules to follow and what to get rid of. FYI before joining hub pages I wasn't aware of Freemasons but the rule I mentioned "live and let live" I have been aware (and believe in practicing) since my childhood. I am not a member of any such organization. I am noticing you are trying to find issues with me even of my harmless mention of quotes(and also when they are not directed at you in the first place). If I have hurt you in the past please forgive me.
  
  PS: I have a lot of respect for Islam and even have a hub about (Are Muslims against terrorists?). Have a good day.
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  LondonGirlposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  CW, he's an outright nutter. Don't waste brain power on him.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Dear CW,
  
  Scriptures whether it be Qur'an or Bible are meant for adults not for toddlers. Regarding Freemasons, they are older than your parents, even grand parents.
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Mrvoodooposted 15 years ago
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Okay, now that is hot, darnit! LOL
  
  I guess I haven't mentioned I like dominant women as much as dominant men
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  Mrvoodooposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  grrrrrr, now where did I put those cuffs and gag.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  A hot smilie? Who would have thought?
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The images it evokes, silly
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  Raven Kingposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Where did you pick this little smilie?
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Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years ago
Hmmmm....

Not so much into the gags... Small mouth But we have a nice set of locking cuffs somewhere around here Custom fit, too

Haha, TMI!
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Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years ago
Thank you, Kiwi. I just haven't been feeling overly confident lately. Every now and again I notice just how poor my writing is and then when on top of that my keywords are garbage I tend to get a bit discouraged lol

No matter! I've been around, doing some commenting and some editing, but not so much on the forums I wish that edited hubs went out to fans like new ones though!
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Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years ago
Mark, good trip-up! I went straight for my Bible and not being Catholic, couldn't find your quotes!

PG, that is the whole story as I can find it, which for me is frustrating. I am a (relatively) modest-dressing Christian (not plain, but modest), and I can understand how this is freeing. I, for one, am self-conscious about certain parts of my body and keeping them covered prevents me from having to worry about what other people think.

I enjoy submission for many reasons, and sexuality isn't the least of those reasons (I'm being honest here!). I tried to explore the issue more deeply in one of my hubs but I butchered it and will be doing an entire re-write on it at some point. What I would like to address is that although submission is biblical, it works for me for so many other reasons as well.

A personal choice.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  lol - Yes, that is right - there is more than one version of the word of god. Odd that. Personal choice - exactly.
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Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years ago
Glad you made that point, Mark, because I was going to point it out if your passage from Ecclesiastes didn't match what was in my Bible. Oddly, it sounded as though it came from The Message, but I haven't been reading as much as I should (oops). And yes, it matched what mine says

I want to learn how to read the original biblical languages in order to get the most out of it. Much of the reason for Christian infighting is due to the various translations (and therefore interpretations) of the Bible. Dreadful!

Funny, you nearly came up in conversation with a (Christian) girlfriend this morning, Mark. I was thinking about your statements about the infighting I just mentioned because she and I were arguing about biblical interpretation. Made me think of you
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  Sufidreamerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Good luck with that, although you will still have arguments about translation with the Ancient Greek version - it is impossible to translate Greek directly into English, so you still have to add some personal interpretation.
  
  Very impressed with that
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Heh, that honestly wasn't my intention (to impress), but thanks.
  
  Hebrew is interesting because it is very, very lyrical. I am hoping to have luck with Latin as someone who speaks reasonable French and a bit of Italian. As for Greek, I do know a native speaker. Not sure how much that might possibly help. You'd know better than me
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  Sufidreamerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I know you weren't - you are far too modest for that!
  
  It will help you with the pronunciation and alphabet, but bear in mind that Ancient Greek and Modern Greek are different languages - one of my friends estimated that, if an Ancient Greek-speaking Spartan was dropped in the modern town, people would understand about 20%.
  
  Might be as well to go straight for the Ancient, and consult with your friend. Mind you, as a native speaker, they may well have a different take.
  
  Latin - beautiful language, although I have forgotten most of mine over the years. Might be best to go for that first, because the grammar will help with the Greek!
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  LondonGirlposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It is - to say, "I am 23 years old", for example, the literal translation is, "I am the daughter of 23 years".
  
  But it is also, suprisingly, a very blunt and loud language, and an Israeli missing an arm has a speech impediment.
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  LondonGirlposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Speaking from experience, learning Hebrew is a bitch. And reading and writing is worse - they miss out all the vowels in written language, and you have to guess what they are.
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\Brenda Scullyposted 15 years ago
AMEN....in my religion, men take the responsibility for teaching at the place of worship.... I am glad about that and I would hate to have to do it......

I dont know why people go on and on and on ranting at people it gives submissive women like me a bad name.....

I am getting to know you Mark, your bark is worse than your bite, and although you rub people up the wrong way, Some of what you say is spot on, and hey you got your bible out, more than I have done today good man...
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  Ladybird33posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Well, he scares me, Mark that is However, Brenda makes an excellent point, you did get out your bible and I learned something new today.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No need to be scared - they are only words.
  
  @ nicomp - you assume because I do not believe in god, that I have not read and studied the bible.
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  This may be the first time I have heard another woman (other than me) come straight up and say this. I don't know if perhaps I have been unsuccessful in articulating the way that I feel about women teaching in the church and submission, but much of it is, for me, a relief that I am not the one who is having to do it.
  
  In the church that my family attends, we have a remarkable female pastor. She is one of the best speakers I have ever had the pleasure of listening to. Nevertheless, I disagree with the place that she takes in the church.
  
  My husband feels that it would be disrespectful of God's gifts if she were to stop teaching. He could be right, but there are certainly places for the women to teach to other women (the Bible tells us not to prophecy to the men, but not to hold off with one another).
  
  DH would one day like to plant a church (probably a Vinyard) and I know that he will be wanting me to help him out as much as possible. But he knows that I won't stand up and speak unless it is in a dramatic skit
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  \Brenda Scullyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  are there men there able to do it....
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, but not with the same talent and skill that she possesses. We have one (associate) pastor who is a brilliant teacher but not so much a speaker. One pastor (senior) who is a brilliant speaker but I don't always feel that his message hits the marks. The woman's husband just flops for us big time, but there are those who are huge fans of his (so I don't know what the deal is -- maybe we're too picky or something?). This one pastor is just so amazing, and she speaks well to everybody in the congregation, mature Christians, new Christians, men and women alike. Even DH liked her a lot which is saying something. He's not so sure about this church in the first place!
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  LondonGirlposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  But you think she shouldn't execise that talent and skill, because her plumbing is wrong?
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No, but I do believe that there is a time and a place for a woman to share her gifts, just as there is a time and a place for a man to do so. I *also* do not feel that it is *my* place to tell her what she can and cannot do. The Bible gives us a guidebook for life: some choose to follow what it says and others choose not to do so. I have done my best to make my preferences clear without cutting others off from their ability or right to do the same for themselves. This is clearly a decision that our lady pastor has had to make for herself. You don't see me leaving the church environment because of her, do you?
  
  As for your other comments, I have been gifted with a relatively quick ability to learn languages provided I have a certain degree of exposure. I'm sure that I will do fine, though I fear that writing and reading might be an obstacle considering that I mostly have learned French from hearing it more than from reading or writing it (and still struggle with the latter at times).
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  LondonGirlposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Good for you - I'm thick as two short planks when it comes to languages. Mind you, Isaac and his Abba were having a long discussion about what to have for dinner, and I followed all of it this evening (-:
  
  The reading and writing is very different from English. Hebrew's my other half's first language, but he's pretty slow reading and writing.
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\Brenda Scullyposted 15 years ago
no no no I did not assume that, I just thought maybe it was a long time ago when you read it .... maybe we have been putting you off is that right????? I'd say you would read toilet paper if it had words on, whatever that is supposed to mean.....

read us some more verses the psalms are my favourite...
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  Make Moneyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah some verses from the Psalms would be nice now Mark.
  
  The second reading for today is ...
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Lady Guinevereposted 15 years ago
Scriptures and what Mark points out is true and I believe I do know what Mark is telling you all. Those who say that he is twisting the scriptures are looking in the mirror on that. GOD didn't say any of those things--MAN did because it was MAN and HIS concept that put that Bible together. God has nothing to do with it. I know some of you will come crashing down around me, but remember the culture at the time of Jesus--it was MAN who ruled the world then. Keeping us strict to those scriptures prevents growth and Jesus never said not to grow or read other things besides that Bible of yours. There are many sexist remarks and cultural implications in the Bible and most of the things that it speaks Christians do not adhere to. Don't go blaming it on us unbelievers, it is your rules.
Mark has a very good point.
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Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years ago
LG -- I tried Japenese in college. I found the reading and the writing easy enough (well, perhaps a bit illegible when I wrote, but that's not the point). It was the vocab that got me hung up every single time! It was terrible! But then, Hebrew looks completely different than the Hirigana that I was using during that first year!
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fortunerepposted 15 years ago
Mark, are you trying to get attacked by a bunch of women? lol
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No - we have several ladies here who consistently preach to us about hell, damnation etc - and I wondered why they were choosing to ignore these clear and simple instructions.
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fortunerepposted 15 years ago
I'm gonna make like a baby and head out of this one. Good Luck my friend.
dori
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earnestshubposted 15 years ago
After seeing children whipped, and women abused on TV it is little wonder that people feel that way.
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  nyliramposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What you do read is bias towards Islamic people,
  you really are quoting only the worst.
  I live in Auckland New Zealand, and have read reports of young children and beatings in domestic incidences it happens worldwide. Mostly people just want to get on with their lives.
  You do not seem to see these acts actually being performed in the Western Countries, but nevertheless, people are arrested daily for such crimes as murder stabbings, it is really bad I think.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I agree abuse happens everywhere, but I do not see it being condoned as it is with these extremists, and our press report any abuse in western society.
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  nyliramposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I have noticed that alot here anyway gets swept under the carpet, or you may say Rug. I have a pretty good insight, into the way things are done, and it just seems, Islam is viewed in a very negative way.
  It is sad, as it is just another religion, just people wanting their Country and their lives to be the same as any other
  Problem is we get what is called fundamentalist, extremists and fanatics same as exist elsewhere. The Q'ran and the Bible were both written many many years ago, and yet bioth are still followed. Live and let live that is what I think i am trying to say.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Agreed, that's the point
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  nyliramposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We at least agree. Have agood night earnest Hub and usmanali
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, it's very natural but you are also aware that this Taliban thing was created by Zionists and Freemasons of USA. Osama Bin Laden had a close relationship with Bush family.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I know Bin Laden was an American product at least in part, but the taliban have had their agenda for light years before any contact with the west.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  proof ???
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What is this war about ? How can you ask for proof don't you read the newspapers or watch the news on television?
  Thousands of American troops are there in Afghanistan and and Pakistan and you say what is the proof, Strange. Th biggest news in the world today and you say show me proof ha.
  
  Earlier on the Mujaheddin were supplied arms by the US to fight against the Soviet Union but today its very different.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Today, Freemasons and Zionits are providing the same stuff to Taliban for developing unrest in the territory-an old Masonic tactic just as they used in French and Italian Revolutions.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You got a serious problem with the Freemasons that's all I can see. What was it -they didn't invite you or accept you that's makes you have such hatred towards the.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  This
  
  http://hubpages.com/hub/FREEMASONS-IN-A-NUTSHELL
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You will never know the truth about them ,will you?
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  nyliramposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  In the Western World the Freemasons control many, many things, it is a very secretive society, one only a select few are invited to join. They have been in the past linked to many controversial cover-ups, even rumoured to have helped clear the Duke of Clarence from being "Jack the Ripper, Mostly made up of as Mark Knowles says Policeman, usually Higher ranking ones, not too many Constables/Rookies are members, but Police Instectors Commissioners, members of the Judiciary, and a fair few lawyers.
  So they do have clout believe it or not.
  They are supposed to take an Oath to help each other, to what degree this is limited, I am unsure. Likewise they are also supposed to help each other in times of trouble. ie if a Mason is made Bankrupt the others would bail him out. So technically Freemasons are a protected species. Osama Bin Ladens, gransdson is educated in the ways of the West, as are most of his family.
  He would not be invited to join as he is Islamic.
  I really think secret societies are a little sick and am certain usmanali, harbours no grudge as to being not invited, he is entitled to dislike what he wants, as is everyone else.
  Just my thoughts.
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  LondonGirlposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Not true, a lot of people join. My grandfather was a Mason, in his case, he just liked the regular piss-ups and communal life insurance.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  hhmmmm, here i caught you ... that's the reason you become offensive when i gave you little facts about them.
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  My father was a mason, and I've known several others. He used to love the social side of it, but seriously, it was no more harmful than the Round Table or the Lions Club here in the UK.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Dear Amanda,
  
  Join Freemasonry, attain a degree higher than 20 and then see how evil their plots are and how they decieve ordianry people. http://hubpages.com/hub/FREEMASONS-IN-A-NUTSHELL
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Freemasonery, or at least the brand that I've encountered, is an exclusively male preserve. Insulting my intellect is hardly likely to persuade me that your argument is a valid one.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Amanada ,usmanali is a fanatic .
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  i am fanatically TRUE, fanatically HONEST, fanatically JUST, so what's wrong in being fanatic
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Its fanatics like you who create ugly wars in the name of god.
  Everyone should convert to Islam- you call that just.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Being Just would be seeing the oneness of all religions and prophets.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  All major religions command to obey only ONE God and follow Prophet Muhammad (pbuh), why are you not doing the same???
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I am god and I don't take orders from anyone.My religions never told me to take orders from Muhammad.Do you understand the meaning of enlightenment-please answer this question.
  Do you think Muhammad, Jesus and Buddha took orders from anyone?
  
  Hindu and Parsee prophets explained the truth about god much before Muhammad did but same were too foolish and were unable to comprehend.
  I prefer many other Holy books over the Quran.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  hhmmm, you are claiming to be god, then you must visit a PSYCHIATIRIST immediatly
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Do you understand the meaning of an enlightened one who writes and gets ranked alongside the Quran?
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Why? Does it not say that we are all gods. We are all from the SAME source which makes us all of that SAME source, nothing lower or higher.
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  chukra Gposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  you said the thruth just now.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  My Father is Greater than I – John 14:28
  My Father is Greater than all – John 10:29
  
  Na tasya pratima asti
  “There is no image of Him" - Yajurved 32:3
  
  Ma chidanyadvi shansata
  “O friends, do not worship any body but Him, the Divine One.” - Rigveda Book 8:1:1
  
  What most of christians and hindus are duing is totally opposite to their scriptures as mentioned above.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Where do you think man comes from?
  
  Aham brahmasmi- I am Brahma
  
  Shiv Ho Hum- I am shiva
  
  "Me and my father are one" Jesus.
  
  What do you think these mean?
  
  What you are doing is totally opposite to what Muhammad taught.He was not a fanatic and none of the other prophets were either.
  Remove the saying All is Allah from your philosophy.
  
  What this means is
  
  My Father is Greater than I – John 14:28
  My Father is Greater than all – John 10:29
  
  Na tasya pratima asti
  “There is no image of Him" - Yajurved 32:3
  
  Ma chidanyadvi shansata
  “O friends, do not worship any body but Him, the Divine One.” - Rigveda Book 8:1:1
  
  Worship the spirit the master of prophet stands for . Similarly worship the spirit Muhammad or Buddha or Jesus stands for and not Muhammad or Jesus or Buddha the persons, the messenger and the message.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We do not have such kind of philosophy rather we believe in "All is Allah's"
  
  Regarding "om namo shiva, shiv ho hum", it's a MANTRA, whom you are trying to decieve. Mantras are not verses of Hindu Scriptures. These are poetic sentences created by Hindus. These mantras are not there in any of the Hindu Scriptures. What i am talking about, are the verses from your scriptures. You follow mantras and not verses, VERY STRANGE.
  
  Regarding John 10:30, I and the Father are one. These popes and priests take verses out of context and give them their own interpretations like christian missionaries take out verses of jihad and others from Qur'an out of context and twist their meanings, consepts and themes. It's their old disease. Even the Bible which they claim to be the so called word of God, undergone, tremendous amounts of changes with the passage of time.
  
  For context you have to go to the Gospel of John, Ch. No.10, Verse No. 23, that ‘Jesus walked into the temple, in Solomon’s porch’.
  
  Verse No. 24 says, and the Jews came around him and asked him. ‘How long does thou make us doubt? - If thou art the Christ, tell us plainly’.
  
  Verse No.25 says, ‘I told you, but you believe me not - the works that I do in my father’s name, - they bear witness of me.
  
  Verse No.26 says that, ‘you believe not because you are not my sheep, as I said unto you’.
  The Jews, they are asking Jesus Christ (peace be upon him) that ‘Why don’t you speak plainly?’. So he tells them that…‘Yes I am the Messiah - I have told you clearly, but because you are not my sheep, you don’t believe in me.
  
  Verse No.27 continues…Jesus Christ (peace be upon him) continues saying that… ‘My sheep - they hear my voice, and I know them - and they follow me.
  
  Verse No.28, that… ‘I give them eternal life - no man can pluck them out of my hand, and they shall not perish’.
  
  Verse No.29 says ‘My father who giveth to me, He is greater than all - No man can pluck them out of my father’s hand. Then
  
  Verse No. 30 says, ‘I and my father are one’ – ‘Any person who has little bit sense can make out, ‘I and my father are one’ doesn’t mean one - as one person. It means one is purpose. Both Jesus Christ (peace be upon him) and Almighty God - they are one in purpose. If I say that my father is an Engineer … and he is an Engineer… Alhamdulillah - Even I am an Engineer. If I say, ‘I and my father are one’ - What does it mean? It means one in purpose - As Engineering profession, my father is an Engineer - Even I am an Engineer. It doesn’t mean that ‘I and my father are one’ -In person. It means my father is an Engineer - even I am an Engineer.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I am trying to teach you the fact that it has a meaning. Why haven't you yet answered me- do you know the meaning of enlightenment.?
  
  Verse No.25 says, ‘I told you, but you believe me not - the works that I do in my father’s name, - they bear witness of me.
  I am telling you the same thing about me and you dont believe me.
  
  ‘I and my father are one’ – ‘Any person who has little bit sense can make out, ‘I and my father are one’ doesn’t mean one - as one person. It means one is purpose
  
  It does mean they are one-this is the reason hindu and christian philosophy relates the prophets with god-I am teaching you the meaning but you keep going back on this profession bullshit- Your understanding is extremely poor.
  
  DO YOU KNOW THE MEANING OF ENLIGHTENMENT?
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  blueraven6posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Blueraven6 replies:
  
  Is it possible Christ meant they are one in spirit? All of his answers were spiritual answers, not physical. One in purpose as well, of course; but one in spirit.
  
  We are One.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes he is talking about his spiritual self, he has merged with god the Holy Spirit.So he is both man and holy spirit. This is what he and many masters mean when then say I am the light or I am god.
  We are One.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Only God-Allah is ONE. We are His creations
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  He is not ready to learn that yet. He has to do something else first in his training. You can't make anyone learn if tit is not their time or they don't have all the tools yet. You are planting seeds though. Be patient.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are right but my blood boils when someone praises his prophet or religion over others.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What we fail t realize is that no prophet is above others and no prophet is below others. All Is LOVE, no sin, not strings attached, no religion and no death or hell or heaven. There is totall compassion and love--nothing else. Those who stoop to calling names and making themselves elite are the ones who will pay dearly for those thoughts and actions. Emotions are part of it too. What you think and how you feel as you think it does come back to you in the way that you gave it.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Dear,
  
  The matter is not realeted to giving them ranks rather the matter is of following them. Their scriptures instructed them to follow Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and they don't. WHY ???
  
  Anyway, it's their choice but they are making wrong choices
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Then you should boil your scriptures as they are praising Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). I just gave you the references.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Did you pay a visit to Psychiatrist ???
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Should someone ranked with the Holy Quran visit a Psychiatrist?
  
  Do you know the meaning of enlightenment .? Do you believe Muhammad was enlightened.?
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Who ranked you with Qur'an ???
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  A Library, was also ranked 1 till date in Poetry-Inspirational and religious books and 2 in Religious -Philosophy.
  Do you know the meaning of enlightenment? Do you believe Muhammad was enlightened?
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  which library and which religious philosophy???
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Look it up have posted it 10 times.
  
  Do you know the meaning of enlightenment? Do you believe Muhammad was enlightened?
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  where ???
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Look it up posted it for you a few times when You told me to see a psychiatrist.
  
  Do you know the meaning of enlightenment? Do you believe Muhammad was enlightened?
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Did'nt find it, where ???
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  Jewelsposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That was disputed and I believe debunked in a previous post. It would take awhile to find it but will if you really need. "A library" could also be understood as just that, one library of many municipal libraries.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You can argue as much as you like but the truth doesn't change.
  Wonder how many libraries your work is ranked over the Holy Quran in?
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  Jewelsposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You're selling yourself again I see. I was just informing usmanali that this conversation (regarding the ranking of your poetry book) has been done to death and the result was not in your favor as I recall. Make sure you stay centered grasshopper.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  outstanding
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Paraglider and Mark congratulated me so what do you mean not in your favor. Again you interfere and abuse , why?
  You feeling left out, no one is giving you any importance , best go and insult Mohit- I will be noticed then?
  Please do let me know If your work ever gets ranked over the Quran and I will congratulate and not insult you as it will be the height of stupidity for me to so do.Learn from the above mentioned names the meaning of decency
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  Jewelsposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Mr Moh, you are indeed having difficulties with this. It is you who needs to compete here and for an enlightened one this is ridiculous. An enlightened one does not need to prove anything, which begs many questions that many here at the forums have already asked. Anyone who publishes any literature deserves congratulations. So well done Mohitmisra on being published.
  
  I am not interfering in a discussion, I am participating. That's what you do in a forum. Unless of course you need to have a monopoly on anything to do with religion. I don't need to do that but I do like to participate. Life is for participation is it not?
  
  I don't need to bring Mark or Paraglider into this discussion as you have done. I don't need them on my side, though I do like their friendship.
  
  Any congratulations you may give to me would be appreciated but not necessary. It's not something I aspire to receive. If I do have a book published I'll be sure to let you know; Though I wouldn't expect to become enlightened because of it.
  
  You must also understand that spirituality is not a competition hence I remind you to remain in your center. There is no need to feel intimidated by anything I say - this is a mark of a person who does stay in one pointed concentration as you put it.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are nasty .
  If I do have a book published I'll be sure to let you know; Though I wouldn't expect to become enlightened because of it.
  Write and get ranked 1 till date in Inspirational and Religious poetry, 2in Religious -Philosophy- top 100 recommended Religion and spirituality and ranked alongside the Bible and Quran I will believe you are enlightened as this is not a normal person cup of tea.
  
  You must also understand that spirituality is not a competition hence I remind you to remain in your center. There is no need to feel intimidated by anything I say - this is a mark of a person who does stay in one pointed concentration as you put it.
  
  I am not sacred or intimidated by you, you are the one scared of me.Again trying to teach an enlightened one - you are very stubborn.
  
  I am not interested in discussing anything with you, so kindly stay out of my debates.You must have noticed I dont answer you at times, juts ignore you and I will do that more often from now on as you are juts looking for a fight and nothing else.
  
  So well done Mohitmisra on being published. - Mrs twisted ,the congratulations was for getting ranked over Bibles and Qurans.
  
  Any congratulations you may give to me would be appreciated but not necessary. It's not something I aspire to receive.
  
  You dont deserve any, you are not ranked so highly, I am.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  who are Mark and Paraglider
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Humans who can see and appreciate.Who are you? What are your qualifications?
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, truth can not be changed and it seems that you are a HONORARY MASON, repeatidly injecting their false and evil doctrines of Materialism and Humanism
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are very , very thick skinned and dumb its unbelievable, again the mason bullshit.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It's a misconception and propaganda, Islam was not spread by sword.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I am a living proof ,we have been through this before.
  Hindus, Parsees and Christians understood the truth of God before Muhammad came on this planet and repeated the same thing.So whats the need to convert and what are you converting to- the same truth.
  
  "There is no need to change your faith,
  And on your old religion lay a wreath. "
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, Hinduism, Parsi and Christianity are older than ISLAM but almost all these old religions prophecised about the comming of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) and insisted on following him. That's the reason it is compulsory to convert. Now if you do not convert then it's your choice, go a head, enjoy.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Christianity did NOT foretell the coming of Mohammed at all. It was Jesus they foretold about. He is not Islam.
  
  No reason to convert at all because "God--The Source--Energy" is is everything and everyone no matter who you are or where you came from or your beliefs or even if you are an animal--which we all are.
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  Make Moneyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  For sure, Christianity did NOT foretell the coming of Muhammad at all.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  God knows which warped books he is reading.And no one says stop following your prophet and follow this other prophet- what a joke.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We are not animals rather humans, the ultimate creation of God-Allah.
  
  Following is for your kind info about Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) being prophecised in Bible.
  
  MUHUMMED (PBUH) IS THE "OTHER"
  The Comforter in (HOLY BIBLE) John 14: 26 had explained by Jesus (pbuh) — "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you Another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever."
  
  Nevertheless, I tell you the truth; it is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
  (HOLY BIBLE) John 16:7
  
  "He (the Spirit of truth) shall Glorify Me (Jesus): for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you." (HOLY BIBLE) John 16:13
  
  "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall Testify of Me." (HOLY BIBLE) John 15:26
  
  This promised Comforter, even the Spirit of Truth in whom Truth is personified, when he comes, will bear witness to the truthfulness of the Messiah and absolve him from the calumnies of his enemies.
  
  This Muhummed (pbuh), Al-Amin, the Prophet of Truth, eminently succeeded in doing. He made it possible that today, a thousand million Muslims believe in Jesus Christ (pbuh) as one of the mightiest Messengers of God. They believe in his miraculous birth, which many modem day Christians, even Bishops do not believe. And they also believe in his many miracles, including those of giving life to the dead by God's leave; and healing those born blind and the lepers by God's leave. What a mighty testimony!
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  In that case why in the world would the Dalai Lama , Buddhist and Hindus be waiting for Materiya the Buddha if he already come 1500 years ago.
  Muhammad is not equated with the Buddha who is expected now.
  Then again the passage I mentioned earlier about the prophet coming at the end of Kali yuga which is now not 15000 years ago.
  Then the prophecy of the age of Aquarius will herald a prophet again means now and not 1500 years ago.
  
  You are a a fanatic with poor understanding of spirituality hoping to get support from numbers, more fanatics like you.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We ARE animals that think we are more intellignet that any other animal. I beg to differ with that one! LOL We think becasue we can think that nothing else thinks or has a soul. We don't know this for absolute, but we think we do. Be an observer and you will begin to see what I mean.
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  sandra rinckposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I know, I was watching the cutest thing ever! You gotta watch this, you will fall in love!
  
  Too bad humans elephants and dogs can't get along like this. Oh the many things we can learn from animals.
  
  http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id= … photovideo
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I constantly use to observe and my observation told me that if a scientist does not need to become a computer system himself for creating it and teaching the users how to use it, similarly, God Almighty does not neet to become the creation itself. Just like a scientist He is a creator. We are not in him and he is not in us rather God-Allah has sent Qur'an as the last and final instruction manual for humans to live life peacefully. So God does not need to become a creation and he is NOT.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Observe Nature, not a computer silly. So you lke to eggagerate everything.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  He doesn't understand the essence of god permeates everything and that's why god is called omnipresent. Poor Allah has lost his powers according to Usmanali, he is no longer omnipresent but has a very small space for himself.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Nature and Mother Nature are foolish words used to decieve laymen by Freemasons. Practically what do you want me to observe???
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Can we possibly debate without including the Freemasons in this conversation.The reason I left was for this very reason as I didn't want people to think I used their help or it is because of them that I am ranked so highly. I have god with me and don't need any such organizations.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Have you got any Psychiatrist???
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Do you understand the meaning of enlightenment? Do you believe Muhammad was enlightened? Have you seen my book rankings? Can you ever write a book and get ranked so highly?
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Now Hindus and Parsee prophecies one more if not many more prophets.This prophets job will be to unite the religions and stop this insanity of my religion or prophet is the best.
  Why should I convert when my religions taught this same truth many thousands of years earlier? You were too stupid to understand-that's all.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  where i insulted??? by the way Madonna is also a Freemason
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Good for her.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Harmful for her
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I am sure you would like it if your parents or grand parents are abused but everyone doesn't.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I did not abuse her parents nor did i abuse Freemasonry. I just gave you the history of Freemasonry and their evil plots against humanity. <no links please>
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  countrywomenposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Mr.Usman- I don't know why you tend to assume so much about people. Calling me a "toddler"(and certainly not out of affection) and now making inappropriate remarks about LG being "offensive" when she was just being frank. And FYI your incomplete unverifiable half truth assertions don't qualify as "facts". Few quotes to ponder: “A half-truth is the most cowardly of lies”, “A half-truth is a whole lie”, “People do not believe lies because they have to, but because they want to”. Have a good day.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Dear CW,
  
  I could have used some harsh word or even abusive instead of toddler. But i am bound by my way of life and i could not do that, i respect you and others a lot. Now tell me what's wrong with this word TODDLER???
  
  Regarding facts about Freemasons, you are blaming me as these are half facts or truths, first, you prove that these are half truths and then we will move forward. If you assert an allegation on someone then you must have some facts and figures as i did. Only by saying "you are wrong" "you are false" does not make any sense.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Its doesn't make a difference as to which religion you belong to.Yes they do take an oath to help each other and also not to reveal what goes on.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, it makes a lot of difference. Obeying God - Allah and obeying Evil-Antichrist are differnet things.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So a religious or spiritual poet does work for god and a fanatic like you does?
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You must be the first nut case in the world to say the freemasons and taliban are connected.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Aside from the decieving Masonic poetry based on mother nature, art, love, humanity and other rubbish stuff, pick up some celebrated history for getting enlightened. For free info, you can visit http://hubpages.com/hub/FREEMASONS-IN-A-NUTSHELL
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\Brenda Scullyposted 15 years ago
Mark did you miss my last comment, I am waiting for a reply... Because you are a man and we all have deep respect for you....And you have read the bible, how about your first forum post being a little scripture for us, no personal comments, just read a passage for us..... go on you know you'd love too
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Goodness me no thank you. I rarely quote from the good book because of all the hatred and fighting it was written to invoke. Just look where this thread has gone.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It seems that both you and Mohit are very active Masons because you start a hot issue and Mohit injects his deviated Masonic themes in it, giving hollow messages of mother nature, love, sprituality, art, no religion bla bla bla
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  In that case so does the Quran Wonder why Muslims say "Ponder Awhile" is a better book than the Quran?
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  who said???
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Many Muslims they cannot understand the Quran and neither can you.Everyone is not fanatical like you.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You also did not get your Hindu and Parsee scriptures who command you to obey only ONE God and follow the last and final Messenger Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) but you are doing the opposite
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You dumb, stubborn human the Hindus and Parsees believe the prophet is imminent how many god damn times do I repeat this?
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If i am dumb then your scriptures are also dumb which clearly mentiones the prophecy of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) in the following and you are not following it.
  
  Bhavishya Purana, Parv 3, Khand 3, Adhaya 3, Shloka 5-8
  “A malechha (belonging to a foreign country and speaking foreign language) spiritual teacher will appear with his companions. His name will be Mohammad. Raja (Bhoj) after giving this Maha Dev Arab (of angelic disposition) a both in the ‘Panchgavya’ and the Ganges water (i.e. purging him of all time) offered him the presents of his sincere devotion and showing him all reverence said, “I make obeisance to thee, ‘Oye! The pride of mankind, the dweller in Arabia, Ye have collected a great force to kill the Devil and you yourself have been protected from the malechha opponents.”
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  He is one of the prophets but he doesnt belong to a Brahmin family which disqualifies him from being the last hindu prophet.He hasnt written a book himself or united the religion so once again he is disqualified.Also hindus believe they will be countless number of prophets,there are two beliefs.
  The Dalai Lama is waiting NOW for the Buddha .
  He didnt take a bath in the Ganges so the above paragraph is about someone else and not Muhammad.
  
  He is not a twin so that disqualifies him from being the Parsee prophet. God is not so cruel and has to send more prophets to rectify this madness of my religion is the best- fanatic.
  
  Till humanity exists you will have prophets or enlightened ones showing the rest the way.
  
  http://www.crystalinks.com/avatars.html
  10. Kalki - In Hindu traditions, Kalki (also rendered by some as Kalkin and Kalaki) is the name of the tenth and final Maha Avatara (Great Avatar) of Vishnu the Preserver, who will come to end the current Kali Yuga, (The Age of Darkness and Destruction).
  
  The name Kalki is often a metaphor for "Eternity" or "Time". The origins of the name probably lie in the word Kalka which refers to "dirt", "filth" or "foulness" and hence denotes the "Destroyer of Foulness", "Destroyer of Confusion", "Destroyer of Darkness", or "The Annihilator of Ignorance". In Hindi kal ki avatar means "tomorrow's avatar". Other similar and divergent interpretations (based on varying etymological derivations from the ancient Sanskrit language, including one simply meaning "White Horse") have been made.In the Buddhist Kalachakra tradition, the Kalki (or Kulika) is the ruler of the legendary Kingdom of Shambhala, where the whole of society is enlighted and the Kalachakra tantra is held and widely practiced.
  
  In this form Vishnu will descend when the world is wholly depraved, destroy utterly the wicked, and restore the happy conditions of the Age of Virtue. In Hinduism, Kalki (alt. spelling: Kalaki) ('Time") is the tenth and last avatar of Vishnu. Kalki is expected to appear on Earth at the conclusion of the current Kali Yuga; He will come from the sky on a white horse, brandishing a flaming sword with which to destroy the wicked people of the current world, renew creation and bring righteousness back to Earth.
  
  According to Hindu scripture, Kali Yuga (the Age of Kali) began at the end of Krishna's bodily lifespan near the end of the 15th century BC and will last exactly 432,000 years - placing its conclusion near the middle of the 431st millennium AD. Kalki, the 10th and final avatar of Vishnu, is expected to appear at this time, riding a white horse and wielding a flaming sword with which to strike down the wicked.
  
  We are in Kali Yuga which is ending now.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Dear Mohit,
  
  The Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) did not physically take a bath in Panch gavya and the water of Ganges . Since the water of Ganges is considered holy, taking bath in the Ganges is an idiom meaning washing away or making immune from all sorts of sins. Here the prophecy implies that prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was sinless i.e. ‘Maasoom’ as described by Qur'an.
  
  Further if you read
  
  Bhavishya Purana: Prati Sarag Parv III: Khand 3: Adhyay 3: Shalokas 10 to 27
  
  “The Malechha have spoiled the well-known land of the Arabs. Arya Dharma is not to be found in the country. Before also there appeared a misguided fiend [enemy] whom I had killed; he has now again appeared being sent by a powerful enemy. To show these enemies the right path and to give them guidance the well-known Mahmada (Muhammad) who has been given by me, the epithet of Brahma, is busy in bringing the ‘Pishachas’ to the right path. O Raja, you need not go to the land of the foolish Pishachas, you will be purified through my kindness even where you are. At night, he of the angelic disposition, the shrewd man, in the guise of a pischacha said to Raja Bhoj, O Raja! Your Arya Dharma has been made to prevail over all religions, but according to the commandments of Ishwar Parmatama, I shall enforce the strong creed of the meat eaters. My followers will be men circumcised, without a tail (on his head), keeping beard, creating a revolution announcing Adhan (call for prayer) and will be eating all lawful things. He will eat all sorts of animals except swine. They will not seek purification from the holy shrubs, but will be purified through warfare. On account of their fighting the irreligious nations, they will be known as Musalmaans. I shall be the originator of this religion of the meat-eating nation.”
  
  This Prophecy states:
  
  (I) The evildoers have corrupted the Arab land.
  
  (ii) Arya Dharma is not found in that land.
  
  (iii) The present enemies will be destroyed just as the previous enemies like Abraha had perished. The Qur’an speaks about these sorts of previous enemies: “Seest thou not how thy lord dealt with the Companions of the elephant? Did He not make their treacherous plan go astray? And He sent against them flights of Birds Striking them with stones of baked clay Then did he make them like an empty field Of stalk and straw, (of which the corn) has been eaten up. (Al Qur’an: Surah Al Fi’l: 105: 1 – 5)
  
  (iv) Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) has been given the responsibility to guide the opponents of Divine Truth. Allah testifies the same responsibility in the Qur’an. (Al Qur’an: Surah Al Ma’idah: 5: 67)
  
  (v) The Indian Raja need not go to Arab land since his purification will take place in India after the ‘Musalmaan’ meaning the Muslims will arise in India . This is what is promised by Allah that Islam will not just reach India but will prevail all over the world. (Al Qur’an: Surah Tauba: 9: 32, 33; Surah Fata’h: 48: 28; Surah Saff: 61: 9). Muhammad [pbuh] too commanded in His last sermon to all those present in the sermon to spread on earth wherever possible, in order to convey the Message of Islam in the Light of Qur’an and Authentic hadiths as mentioned in a Hadith recorded in Sahih Bukhari: vol: 4 H: 667
  
  (vi) The coming Prophet Muhammad [pbuh] will attest the Truth of the Aryan faith i.e. Monotheism and will reform the misguided people. This is what the purpose of Muhammad [pbuh] being sent to mankind as Messenger was and as is testified in: (Al Qur’an: Surah Ambiya: 21: 25; Surah An’am: 161 to 165)
  
  (vii) The Prophet’s followers will be circumcised. They will be without a tale on their heads, they will keep beards and they will create a great revolution. A similar message is mentioned in a Hadith recorded in Sahih Bukhari: vol: 7 H: 780, 781
  
  (viii) They will announce the adhan i.e. ‘call for prayer’. Al Qur’an: Sura Ma’idah: 5: 58; Sura Jumu’ah: 62: 9 AND Sahih Bukhari: vol: 1 H: 578
  
  (ix) He will only eat lawful things and animals, but will not eat pork. The Qur’an confirms this in no less than 4 different places: “Forbidden for you for food are dead meat, blood, flesh of swine and that on which had been invoked the name of other than Allah…”. In Surah Al-Baqarah: 2: 173; Sura Al-Ma’idah: 5: 3; Surah Al-An’aam: 6 : 145; Surah Nahl: 16: 115
  
  (x) They will not purify with grass like the Hindus, but by means of sword they will fight the evil-doers. The Qur’an confirms this in Surah Baqarah: 2: 191, 192; Surah Nisa: 4: 74 – 78; Surah Taubah: 9: 111
  
  (xi) They will be called Musalmaan. Similar Message is in Surah Aal-e-Imran: 3: 64; Surah An’aam: 6: 163; Surah Fussilat: 41: 33
  
  (xii) They will be a meat-eating nation. The Qur’an permits humans to eat herbivorous animals in Surah Ma’idah: 5: 1 and in Surah Mu’minoon: 23: 21
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are a fanatic and refuse to accept the fact that there will be more prophets after Muhammad.Many believe Guru Nank, Baha'ullah and Meher Baba to be prophets and they spoke remarkable truths like Muhammad did. You want to live in your irrational world and I cant stop you.You believe you know more than me even though you haven't come across god, you are not enlightened -you are unbelievable. What happened have you started writing a book on god which is going to get ranked over mine.Allah will not let you dream of it, forget doing it.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Is my work ranked with the Quran or is yours?
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  Eng.Mposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  wonderful ..
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  This was only made a "hot issue" by your irrational rants. I know very little of freemasons - other than they are a secret society and every policeman in England is obliged to join.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  instead of making useless posts 8124 times, try reading somehting SOLID like http://hubpages.com/hub/FREEMASONS-IN-A-NUTSHELL and get your facts straight. Moreover, this hub also gives detailed answer to your previous questions about humanism, materialism and evolution.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Dear oh dear - have you seen a doctor for that paranoid delusion?
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  after you
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  Eng.Mposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  loool
  
  this could be deep ~
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  i also respect him, he is an elderly man
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scheinandrasposted 15 years ago
Because that's how god created them:)
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\Brenda Scullyposted 15 years ago
Aw come on Mark read from the Psalms for us please
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\Brenda Scullyposted 15 years ago
now now Mohitmisra chill
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Lady Guinevereposted 15 years ago
Wow what happened overnight?! This morphed from being how Women are supposed to be and act in the Christian Bible to Binladen and the Islamic as seen in a bias way. Oh and I can't forget the spurt of Free Masons etc....

The OP by Mark is being taken over my over zealous MEN.....LOL

Do Men think that they know what is good for everyone and every Sex and why is that so?
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Scientifically men have got a large brain size as compared to women, that's the reason
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Now now you don't want to be called the wrong kind of names do you? Be nice and nice will come back to you.
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
I think that women should adore their men and work a full day to help earn money for the family, then clean the house while the husband watches TV. They should make sure hubby is comfortable and has a cold beer. Then they must cook dinner. I really believe that this is every woman's duty and what we've been born for. Of course, if hubby wants sex before and after dinner, it is our duty to meet his needs.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Cindy you are a very funny girl! That was great!
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  love it.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Freemasons always praise illegitmate sex
  
  When the obelisk is depicted within a circle, the Freemasons are depicting the sex act between male and female. In Washington, D.C., the Washington Monument is sitting within a circle. Freemasonry planned, designed, and created the Washington Monument. The obelisk is greatly revered in Masonry.
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You have a very sad sense of humor or rather no sense of humor.
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  Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Good old fashioned family values.
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  Sufidreamerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Correct - that is how it should be.
  
  Better hope that my other half does not read this comment, or I am a dead man
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  Lisa HWposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  cindyvine, don't forget too: Even if women know more about any particular subject they should keep their knowledge/opinions to themselves. If they happen to have a better knowledge of money management, that should be a secret. Let their husbands blow the retirement savings. If they happen to have a better understanding of children and child development, they should keep it to themselves. Fathers have a right to mess up the kids if they want to. Common sense about letting the person who is better at any one thing manage it should never, ever, be used.
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Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years ago
Mark -- I know! Crazy... I had been quite enjoying the discourse because I didn't feel that it had degenerated into argumentative BS like it sometimes does in here, and then... BOOM!

NOBODY likes to be preached at, and frankly, that includes me. No thanks!

"Taught" is different than "preached at." Though you had to know that this would turn into an "Islam gives women freedom and Christianity oppresses them" argument, didn't you?

Lady Guin -- Starting a different thread to allow the extremists to have their argument
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Extremeist? I think those who say go by the Bible in exactly the way it was done way back then in another cultural cenario is exremist. Not reading other things bsides the Bible, that is extreme and telling others that they MUST obey and worship the same GOD and believe the SAME exact things--that is extremist!
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hmmmm... Not exactly sure that's what I'm doing here, LG...
  
  Yes, I am a Bible-believing Christian. I have also read parts of the Quran (and plan to read all of it at some point), have read religious texts from several Eastern religions and spent the majority of my life as a pagan.
  
  I have consistently said that individuals need to make their choices. I have shared what my beliefs are, but I have not pressured others to share in those beliefs. I believe in free will and that each individual must make their choice. And I don't feel that I have preached at anyone, merely attempted to continue to share of myself freely.
  
  If I am being an "extremist" and offensive, then I will remove myself from Hubpages again, because I genuinely am not here to offend anyone. I apologize if I have.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I didn't say you in particular, I said "THOSE, not Your name.
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  Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I apologize, I thought that was why you were quoting me
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
And weekends we should mow the lawn while hubby lies in and then make him breakfast in bed. We can do our shopping when he goes off to watch the game, then prepare the snacks for his mates when they come over to watch the footie on TV. During half-time, if our hubby's are excited because their team is winning, we should remove our aprons and pleasure them.
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Only our aprons?
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  mohitmisraposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Such beautiful understanding ,every woman should be like you
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
Will she pleasure you to death then, Sufi?
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Sufidreamerposted 15 years ago
@cindyvine: If you can call being battered to death with a rolling pin pleasurable, then yes
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
So LG, would you then term a Jehovah's Witness an extremist?
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If they do as I stated then yes. I don't think that I descrminated and I don't think Jesus did either.
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
Well Sufi, whatever floats yer boat and blows your hair back. She might get the kitchen table ready for her man!
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  Sufidreamerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We actually fight over whose turn it is to cook - we both enjoy it!
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  Lisa HWposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If either of you is missing your opportunity to cook when it's not your turn, feel free to cook up a vegetarian dinner and forward it to my house, please. I hate cooking. Win/win/win.
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  Sufidreamerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No problem, Lisa - I baked some bread yesterday, so will pack some up with a Greek salad and spinach with rice
  
  Everybody is happy!
  
  @cindy - only vegetarian food, I am afraid - you will have to cook your own sausages
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\Brenda Scullyposted 15 years ago
And if you chose not to have a hubby you should get a servant or slave to do all your work, young men are a different breed..... my boys do so many things there dad would never do.... They are trying to educate him into cooking, etc etc etc,he is experimenting, but the young women have a charmed life now......... bet this starts some discussion
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
Yeah Lisa, we also need to make sure all our money is paid into our hubby's bank account, and he can give us pocket money if we've fulfilled our duty and completed our chores. Sufi, you sound like a dream man.
LG, didn't the Jehovah witnesses say only 100 000 people will be raptured and taken up to heaven?
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It is 144,000. So I aksed them what is the rest of the population going to do. I think this is the number in the Bible tha was used on how many souls are born or made or something like that. It was years ago that I learned that.
  This doesn't make sense with the now over 6 Billion people on earth at this time.
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That's why their busily scurrying around, knocking on doors no doubt. I assume that it's a kind of league table where the people who sign up the most get the biggest reward. A bit like tupperware parties.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Kudos in heaven LOL
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  \Brenda Scullyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  no you have got all that wrong
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry Brenda - I've no wish to offend. If you have the low-down on this, please share.
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  \Brenda Scullyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  hi no offense. I am a Jehovah's Witness, always have been always will be..... The good thing about hub pages is no one has judged me and decided they dont like me because I am a member of some nutty religion, as they think. I really dont want to start posting things about my religion on here, I cannot take the abuse that I get everywhere else. One thing I will say is that we really do not go round trying to convert people. We try to get people to read the bible, as we feel all the answers are in there. People join us and start going round telling people things within a few weeks when they themselves don't really know all the facts, and sometimes get it wrong. It does hurt a lot, when people say horrible things about my religion as though having a Jehovah's Witness in your house, street, or anywhere around you is the worst thing in the world. That is only because I am ultra sensitive. I really am not going to discuss my beliefs on here though.
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Fair enough Brenda. All those that have ever knocked on my door have been polite, if persistant. I have my own ideas about religion, and I'm sure plenty of people here wouldn't agree with me either!
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  \Brenda Scullyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  wouldn't agree or would agree.....
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Well that is fine if you want mis information passed around like it is and you neded to get that information correct. We will just get that info elsewhere.
  When you spread the word of the lord in a book the book may not have the factual information and then you spread that and that gets spread out more and --well have you heard of the game children play that they tell the first person the message and by the time it gets to the last person it is not like the original message. Oral Tradtion and also many other kinds of traditions do get messed up. I have two hubs on the Book of Enoch that Make Money gave me some very good information and history on and why it didn't make it into the Bible. Now questions why and what others are out there that are lost just as that book was.
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  \Brenda Scullyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  are you talking to me
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If you said that you were a JW, then yes it is to you. Before you get all upset like EM did in her little thread about Headressing, I assure you I am not going for an argument, just stating some facts as how people work. I like getting people to think about what is around them, not just from them.
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  Vladimir Uhriposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are guessing and not reading the Bible. 144,000 is talking about the Jewish new believes who would be rapture in the mid of tribulation. ...not or something.
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah right. You just said that it was new. How new? I learned this way back in the 70's perhaps. You read your own Bible.
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
Brenda, male slaves to keep us entertained while hubby is sleeping in on a weekend!
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  LOL that would be great! My husband can sit down and within 5 minutes be sound asleep. No kidding! It is difficult to watch a movie with him.
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
Well, we have to do the pleasuring quickly before the snacks burn and his mates need us to bring them another beer. Can only remove apron in that short time
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So we can keep on our fishnets and stillettos then?
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Everyday Miraclesposted 15 years ago
I fear that "submissive" has become such a "catch word" in our modern society that we forget what it means. I share knowledge with my husband all the time. If I feel that he is making a bad decision, I speak up (and he usually changes his mind based on my input). The final decision is always his, but I do have a say and I do speak my mind.

Have a look at Ephesians 5 and please do look past "wives, submit to your husbands." There is a lot of wisdom just in the bit about marriage in this epistle and it is one of my favorite chapters of the Bible.

I personally believe that "loving your wife" means "in the way she needs to be loved." I have noticed a tendency by religious groups in general to paint everyone with the same brush and I don't think that is possible. I tend to be a very independent and even dominant-natured woman: to be painted with the brush of "doormat" wouldn't be appropriate. I couldn't be with a man who didn't love my mind -- I'm too opinionated!
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
Yeah LG, if you bring that up with them when they pound on your door at 8am on a saturday, they leave very quickly
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
Sufi, I've made bloody awesome veggie sausages
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  Sufidreamerposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If you are happy to eat veggie food, I'm there! - your sausages are legendary
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Lady Guinevereposted 15 years ago
What I almost would give to have a hubby that would cook dinner once in a while. He used to cook very good meals when he was single--so says his two siser. He said that he would not do that now that he has someone else to do that for him. He is Catholic and this was never discussed prior to our wedding. If I am sick he will go to a restaraunt and get food and bring it home. It has been this way for the last 11 years. I am kind of not complaining but sort of am--if you get my drift....
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Sufidreamerposted 15 years ago
My partner likes to make friends - she invited a couple to the house, and they are visiting next Monday.

We have since found out that they are JW - should be interesting
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Lisa HWposted 15 years ago
Excluding people tends to be a big part of a lot of religions. Someone else can have my place in that whole rapture thing. I'd rather my decomposed remains stay where they are.
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cindyvineposted 15 years ago
Yes Amanda, fishnets and stilettos are fine. Maybe we need to go commando for easy access
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  Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Sounds sensible to me, if a little draughty!
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\Brenda Scullyposted 15 years ago
who said what about jehovah's witnesses i missed it... Sufi you will have a great afternoon,
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Make Moneyposted 15 years ago
Nyliram the Islamic world is far from being free of freemasonry. Lots of Muslims are freemasons. There's a lot of writings on it. Check out what this pro-masonic site says. http://www.dailygrail.com/node/5752
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Lady Guinevereposted 15 years ago
The Masons aren't the only big Organziation. Here is another: http://hubpages.com/hub/A-Knights-Wife
The Knight's of Columbus is truly a religious group that has it's presence in almost all countries and growing.
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SweetiePieposted 15 years ago
I was invited to join Job's Daughters, but I had to have my great-uncle fill out a form saying he was a mason. After all of that my mom would not let me join because she said it was a waste of money.
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  usmanali81posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  your mom is briliant
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Make Moneyposted 15 years ago
That was a good 'reason' your mother gave you SweetiePie.
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Amanda Severnposted 15 years ago
Would and wouldn't. I used to look at the religious hubs all the time when I first joined, but I weaned myself off them. The arguments go round in circles. People don't visit the religious threads for enlightenment. They mostly come either for a bit of light-hearted fun, or because they have an agenda to promote/share.
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\Brenda Scullyposted 15 years ago
I was very surprised to see how much ranting about religion went on here, and indeed discussion, I suppose because it is from all over the world it does give a different look at things... I have learnt a lot about others faith but am looking to discuss other more light hearted things now.....
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Amanda Severnposted 15 years ago
Lad G. I've always admired your religious convictions and the open way in which you discuss them, but to be fair to Brenda, I think she would have stayed silent about being a JW if I hadn't pushed her on the subject.
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\Brenda Scullyposted 15 years ago
I was never going to mention it, I did not come on here to preach at all..... I just felt like defending myself a bit, when something was said about tupperware parties.

Lady G. you spoke to me a manner I did not really like, and I actually do not have to explain anything to anyone.....
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  Lady Guinevereposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That is quite fine with me. I wasn't expecting you the "preach" at all. Things happen for a reason and why you did bring it up is for something or another. I am not sorry that I asked though.
  BTW I know how you feel in your not telling and the crap you get back for posting them. I have been there many times.
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Irene McManmanposted 15 years ago
I’m sorry. I don’t think it was said about blondes…I’m blond by choice not by nature. Does it mean I practice exactly what I preach?
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