Short and long hubs and bells and whistles. HP should adapt

1. 45

   Ericdierkerposted 10 years ago

   Hubpages needs to make some effort to be inclusive of short thought provoking hubs.
   
   I have been visiting Bubblews and Zurcker and find one factor that is interesting and in keeping what I see as a reality. Many people have really short attention spans -- Twitter and Facebook bear this out. My suggestion is that HP do something to bring those lame readers here.
   
   Here are the arguments against it:
   
   1. HP is a serious writing site and we should not dilute that
   2, HP is not an open social networking site and we do not want that dribble
   3. Hubbers can go elsewhere to engage in such
   4. We do not like change.
   
   Here is the premise. HP has developed excellent and user friendly formats to write engaging and well written hubs complete with bells and whistles. That same ingenuity can be brought to apply to short articles that clearly attract billions of views. And there is a migration away from HP to these other sites which is not good for any of us.
   HP is here to make money and most writers are here to make money -- you do the math.
   
   Pros:
   We keep people and we gain people. And we take views away from competitors gaining a higher market share. We make it so that Hubbers can stay here to read those short articles.
   Many people do not want to read 1400 word articles. In order to be featured many very good writers are adding fluff and redundancy to their articles in order to gain featured status.
   
   The Mechanics and process and safeguards:
   I have not a danged clue.
   
   What do you think?

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      paradigmsearchposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      .
      For what it's worth, I'll mention that several of my older, shorter, hubs do indeed get low, single-digit, daily traffic. Adds up over time...

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      The Examiner-1posted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Eric,
      I write my Hub content aiming for 1150-1250 words. After I have that I add the photos, polls, tables, etc. I have learned how captions, polls, quizzes, tables...they all add words to your Hub without really looking long and boring.
      So when you look at the total words in a Hub, it does not mean that they are all in the boring part.

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         Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         For sure I am just noticing that and I think does really help that and a 300 word disclaimer and with some humor and copycrap something can be used to bump it up on each hub. (boileplate - and I am thinking of footnote stuff that you could use to in order to keep the main text in the 600 range and still be featured.
         The bells and whistles are essential though to readability and entertainment.
         So you could be really getting to the heart of working within and still keeping the thrust short ---- I like it.

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            aa liteposted 10 years agoin reply to this

            I really don't know where you get your idea that a hub needs to be 1000 words to be featured.  Many people have told you that much shorter hubs get featured, I myself have some that are not much longer than 500 words.
            
            Ok, that is still longer than bubblews, but not nearly as long as you seem to think. 
            
            Really I've never had problems with getting my hubs featured, and not all of them are very long, and they often have embarrassing typos. It is no big deal.

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               Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

               I would like to avoid what you are saying as a reality. "featured" we all know is a marketing consideration. And of course small hubs are very often featured I also just did a 516 word one and it was featured but it had two videos, 1 poll, 3 photos, ebay and amazon and ads were enabled. and it had a hard keyword beginning and a hot topic. But no embarrassing typos.
               I must be sensitive it felt like you were just looking to find fault with me and not even the subject -- do not know how I offended you, or maybe you just write this way.

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      Marisa Wrightposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Short articles on Bubblews do not attract huge numbers of views.  On Bubblews, the secret to earning is to write quantities of short articles - some people recommend posting ten a day!   Most articles get a fairly low number of views, it's the number of articles being posted that makes those views add up.  The Bubblews model is built around that constant activity, like Twitter and Facebook.
      
      HubPages has always been about building passive income - ongoing participation in the site is not necessary to make money.  Your articles will go on earning if you go on holiday or even if you die!   For that to happen, you need longer information-rich Hubs.

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         Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         This is correct and a reasonable business model. However as you say: "built around that constant activity, like ......."
         No doubt the information-rich Hubs with a sincere and sustained effort is the business model for any writer on HP and we want to keep it that way.
         I am talking about allowing a "marketing draw" like constant traffic to give those rich hubs more exposure and increase revenue.
         For instance,,, too many great authors here right that short stuff elsewhere in order to drive traffic here. Let us cut out the middle man. And keep those hubbers here.
         (something I think will happen is that the quality of our people is very high and if they participated in a "division" here writing the short stuff, our short stuff would be better than anyone else's

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         JoeYoung22posted 10 years agoin reply to this

         This is true. On Bubblews, as soon as a post is nudged off your five most recent, it basically vanishes into the heap, and it will earn no more. This can be frustrating when a post you are pleased with drops off the screen into oblivion, having only garnered  a handful of views/likes/comments.
         
         Here on HP, my hubs haven't had a great deal of traffic, but they are all still there to be read.

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      misterhollywoodposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I like your list a great deal and makes sense with the pros and cons!
      
      - Mister Hollywood

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      Nadine Mayposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      You do have a point about the attention span of the readers on the internet. If the first and second text box is not inspiring, yes then you do lose a reader. So yes I agree that the minimal word count of 400 I believe on bubblews works well, but there the problem is that after the 5th article they vanish, unless you create links in every article that relates to the past articles. I stay with hub pages due to the quality content that bubblews sadly does not have.

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   SmartAndFunposted 10 years ago

   Sadly, I am just a girl in a cubicle, so I won't bother you with my inept opinion.

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      paradigmsearchposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Are you a cute girl in a cubicle?

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         SmartAndFunposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         Used to be. Too old now to be cute.

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            paradigmsearchposted 10 years agoin reply to this

            Same here. But at least I'm still fuzzy.

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               SmartAndFunposted 10 years agoin reply to this

               At least we had our day in the sun. It was fun while it lasted. *sigh*

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                  paradigmsearchposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                  There are some more days left. It ain't over 'til it's over.

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      Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Whoa a writer who gets their own cubicle -- gives me something to shoot for!!

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   rebekahELLEposted 10 years ago

   No, HP shouldn't adapt.  Let those who want to read short mindless posts about nothing frequent those kind of sites.
   
   In regard to your Pros statement:
   We keep people and we gain people. And we take views away from competitors gaining a higher market share. We make it so that Hubbers can stay here to read those short articles. 
   I don't regard hubbers as my targeted audience, nor do I consider the two sites that you listed as my competitors.  I assume many people writing on HP do so for search engine traffic, to provide information for those seeking specific info.

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      LuisEGonzalezposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      But he does have a valid point worth looking into.

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         rebekahELLEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         I disagree.  HP is not a 'social media' site.

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            Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

            "social Media" is a concept not a dirty word.
            And for several hundred of us - especially on the Questions and Forums it sure quacks like a SM site

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               psycheskinnerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

               How so?  It is a content site.  It does not even meet the requirements of being a blog let alone a fully functional social media site (i.e. a site with the primary aim of networking registered users together).

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               Marisa Wrightposted 10 years agoin reply to this

               HubPages has a social aspect, but NONE of the social features - following, commenting, forums - contribute in any way to earning income.  That's deliberate.

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      Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Rekah thank you for commenting in such a direct conservative way. But the curse beginning statement is a deathnell to business.
      This is the real world not adapting is ostrich like.

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4. 85

   aa liteposted 10 years ago

   HP claims to have done the research (they actually have access to huge amounts of traffic data), and they find that, on average, long hubs (over 1000 words) with bells and whistles get considerably more traffic than short hubs.
   
   You can argue about people's attention span as much as you like, but empirical data beats any amount of theorising.
   
   Of course you could say that HP is lying……but why would they?
   
   If you do want to keep people on a long hub, you have to put some effort into making it "not scary", break it up into sections, use subtitles, throw around some eye candy (images).
   
   One thing I really wish that HP would do is give us an easy way of adding a "table of contents" at the top of the hub.  Yes I know that we can do this ourselves, but it would be nice if it was automated.

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      randomcreativeposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I agree with you about the table of contents. I often use the table feature to highlight the sections of an article, but a formal table of contents would be preferable.

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         Barbara Kayposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         I agree. This was discussed at one time, but never added.

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      Nadine Mayposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Yes that is a great tool to have, an automatic table of content . It could very well sit on the left of the first capsule below the photo capsule. We had that feature in our monthly newsletter and that worked well, especially if the title heading of each capsule is interesting.

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   ktnptlposted 10 years ago

   Hubpages have it's own standard, Bubblews allows short posts but it has no value compare to hubpages featured articles. I think for long run, hubpages doing the right thing.

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   Traci Ruffnerposted 10 years ago

   On the one hand, I am glad that HP has a higher set of standards for what gets featured.  It feels like much more of an accomplishment when your work is featured.  I do, however, write for Bubblews and do not feel that, just because my work there is less formal and shorter, that it should be considered "mindless" and "about nothing".  It is just a different type of forum and I believe writing for both allows me to explore different types of writing.

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      Nadine Mayposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I agree Traci

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      Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Traci  -- That is what I hear every day. Although you said it better!
      
      My thought is that by using magical technical prowess we could build an Iron curtain right here, so we would not need to go "there -wherever there is" to do both.
      Kind of like a family restaurant where the men can slip into the other room to have a brew and watch some sport for ten minutes while waiting for food, while the ladies do what ladies do.
      Like those old homes that were noble and respected, but the men have a den so they do not need to leave the house to be pigs.

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         Traci Ruffnerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         I have taken to posting short stories on Bubblews.  People seem to enjoy them and it gets my creativity flowing.   By the way, I love a good brew.  Why can't the ladies have a brew?  Lol

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            Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

            In my case the ladies have hard liquor when we step out! They need it putting up with me. And most of them know more about TV sports than me. Thanks for the fun.

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   psycheskinnerposted 10 years ago

   How would they measure "thought provoking" and does it correlated with "people google for it"?  Because that is the end goal here
   
   It seems to me hubpages already allows short. I get hubs under 400 words past Qap all the time. You just have to meet the requirements for content

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8. 93

   ziyenaposted 10 years ago

   Hey Eric ... gonna have to disagree with you.  Bubble Bust is a social networking site more than anything ... the Hub is a completely different model ... as for me ... I'd rather not have  trashy traffic coming here

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      ziyenaposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I prefer intellectually stimulating interaction than what is offered there ... and BTW ... I'm so sick and tired of reading non-stop forum topics about Bubbleblews it's beyond ridiculous ... if you all like that platform so much then STAY there lol

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         Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

         I am with you! I made a mistake even using the name in passing while grouping it for examples. I have never and will never write a word there. (except whatever it took me to get in to have a look)
         Let us give our friends a word of caution -- just call it: the B word site.
         I wish I had a mulligan on this one. Yikes.
         It also made folks immediately hate my thought provoking notion and knee jerk react and oppose it. Had I left out the B word it would have been more intellectual and less hate speech.
         Thanks

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   lovebuglenaposted 10 years ago

   People do write shorter hubs here and they are featured and accessible to anyone... Main reason people are going to Bubblews is 'cause they earn there much faster than they do on here...

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    Mark Ewbieposted 10 years ago

    Until they ban the subject people will write and respond, especially to mindless barbs about it.
    
    Short does not mean any lessening of quality.  Bubblews gave me back my love for writing after HP and QAP had near destroyed it.
    
    The reason being that the 'mindless' rules on HP where  length is everything do not allow for quality content that is shorter. 
    
    Now I accept that.  Short goes on Bubblews.  Medium goes on Blog.  Long goes on HP.  Everyone happy.
    
    But I will say that Bubblews is far hotter on plagiarised photos than HP is.  There are so many hubs where 'writers' are ripping off photos from all over the net.  Bit mindless you might say.

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       SmartAndFunposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       I agree. The sites are different and serve different purposes. People need to quit trying to make Bubblews into HubPages, and HubPages into Bubblews.
       
       edited to add: People can post about whatever they want on the forums, that I do not care about.

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    erikdierkerposted 10 years ago

    Bubblews pays everyone $50 a week.  I did the math and assuming they make 75% proffit that means they are making over $6.9 million a year.  Hubpages cannot copy their success unless they reclaim these lost bubbles and get them to write about their breakfast on hubpages!  Go listen to Britanny Spears if you don't like what I say!  you need to think out side your cubicle of bells and whistles and get with the program
    
    this is christian country.  why cannot I copy the bible on Hubpages.  In bits and pieces, each one is a bubble of chapter and verse.  do you want to post that on bubbles.  God is not a bubble! God is a hub of light and love and positive energy.  Go listen to Shakira if you don;t like what I have to say!
    
    Get these bubbles back.  Make them work for hubpages.  We will be rich in Google.  It's not rocket scients.  It's SEO-ology technology biology.  Oh gee!  Now you are excused and you can resume listening to Milie Cyrus in your cubicle.

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       lovebuglenaposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       Bubblews DOES NOT pay everyone $50/week. And I know that because I am on Bubblews and I've not yet reached $50.

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          erikdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

          I went to the bubblews retreat in virginia.  nice folks.  powerpoint slide with screenshot of their Adsense earnings, these boys are on fire! Hootenany!

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             Barbara Kayposted 10 years agoin reply to this

             I'm not earning $50 a week there either.

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       lovebuglenaposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       I mean I've not yet reached the new $50 minimum and last time I redeemed was in November. Before when the minimum was $25 it took me about a month to earn that. I'd say not that many people earn $50/week on there.

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          Traci Ruffnerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

          I have only been writing on Bubblews for 3 weeks.  Pretty much the same amount of time I have been on here.  I learned something new today though.  Originally, I thought the rule was your post had to be a minimum of 400 words.  Nope.  It only has to be a minimum of 400 characters.  That is kind of lowering the bar a little bit.  It's disappointing and explains why some "writers" on Bubblews "articles" look more like facebook statuses.

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             Nadine Mayposted 10 years agoin reply to this

             Oh really? Then I also made that mistake

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       SmartAndFunposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       You're right, it's not rocket scients.

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          erikdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

          writers! I love you guys! You can learn a lot from a packet of bubble gum an the lyrics on a Miely Cyrus CD case.  When you're in you're cubicle at night do you bubble?  Do you think about scients? You could be writing a hub about bells and whistles with three poles and two maps and a photo at the top but you are just a puppy dog! This is a site for serious writers, even if they are puppies. Most puppies can't even even read cursive.  You are an asset to hubpages!

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             SmartAndFunposted 10 years agoin reply to this

             Hootenanny indeed!

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       aa liteposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       I'm pretty sure that Bubblews makes its main money not from advertising but from the captchas that we fill every time we post a bubble.  So the model is completely different.
       
       They rely a lot more on internal traffic, that is really bad for advertisers who really value organic traffic, a completely different earning model from HubPages.

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          SmartAndFunposted 10 years agoin reply to this

          Careful there, aa.

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             aa liteposted 10 years agoin reply to this

             ? What have I said?

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          erikdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

          Whether it is you or the frog on your head speaking these words, they are true! Writing a captcha is true creative writing at its finest.  Why doesn't Hubpages embrace its poets and captcha writers and reward them with hubber scores?  I have seen so-called writers with their maps and poles and quizes with scores over 100.  but can they write a captcha?  Not while they are singing along to Demi Lovato!
          
          Go ahead, paste photos of  Selena Gomez and Justin Bieber on your cubical walls! They broke up along time ago and are Never Ever Getting Back Together.

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             HollieTposted 10 years agoin reply to this

             I have pictures of Julio Iglesias and Shaking Stevens on my cubicle wall, this is where I find my inspiration.

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                SmartAndFunposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                I have Jack White.

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                   HollieTposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                   I've just had to look who Jack White is. Think my cubicle wall needs more images. :0

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                      SmartAndFunposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                      

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                         erikdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                         Rekah thank you for commenting in such a direct conservative way. But the curse beginning statement is a deathnell to business.
                         This is the real world not adapting is ostrich like. Potatoes for everyone!

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                            SmartAndFunposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                            Fiddlesticks. Its not such a complete matter of when or how, but of circumventing the obvious. Please.

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                Traci Ruffnerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                I am missing out.  I need a cubicle.

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    frogpatchposted 10 years ago

    More and more people are reading on smart phones and other hand held devices, Longer pages are difficult to read when the text has to be enlarged and slid from side to side,. Internet readers have a tendency to scan rather than read if they are looking for information. While a piece of fiction may hold a readers attention on a tablet, the reader looking for information will get impatient hit the back button. I write mostly web pages and usually keep them to around 500 words due to the increase in small screen usage.
    
    As far as short, thought provoking pages, I agree that provisions should be made for those.

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       Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       That is a really good point and might be just right for HP. Down where they have what kind of article -- they could put in a "hand held" capsule. And it could be designed for that purpose.
       Those of us migrating our smaller hubs could just migrate them there.

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    Suzanne Dayposted 10 years ago

    Well, Hubpages can try and be all things to all people, diluting earnings in the process and attracting all sorts of dubious people who only care about a dollar and pretendy writers who don't care about "good" writing.
    
    Or it can remain specialised, the best in its field of being a writing platform for articles that Google searchers can hunt for and that authors can make a long term passive income stream from.
    
    Hubpages is not against change, they want to make their site better. But it's a bit silly to argue that Facebook should be just like Twitter and copy the tweet limit, just because people are getting on Twitter.
    
    People go on either Facebook or Twitter (or Hubpages or Bubblews) for certain reasons at different times. There is no harm in having alternative ways of communicating on the web, whether it be in a long way or a short way. Websites specialise to become the best in their field in a highly competitive market, so they have to focus tightly on what they are doing - it's marketing 101.
    
    Personally, I am quite surprised the Bubbling site is still making money at all and I'm waiting to see what happens with it, but you won't catch me wasting my time with it when I have other things to do (like working and hubbing for the longer term benefits). Having said that, good luck to those who are on there and good luck to us hubbers too!

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       ziyenaposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       Thanks Suzanne ... one of the few who making sense here

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          Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

          Awesome comment.
          I am so old we used to call that "outstanding thinking in your box".
          Billybuc has written some awesome stuff about finding a niche and sticking to it.
          I am thinking more about Coors marketing and selling Keystone -- if you do not get that just ask,

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             ziyenaposted 10 years agoin reply to this

             It's all piss water to me

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                ziyenaposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                unless we're talking real beer

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                   Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                   Same company two different names for approximately the same beer. One is less in price than the other. Probably some difference in quality and that may determine the which is which but not by much if at all.
                   But the same company selling the same product focuses by branding, target consumers,and demographics.
                   I noted above someone said "marketing 101" and that is about reflective of that expertise espoused. We need to get a little deeper.

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                      Jodahposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                      haha Eric, I thought Coors was an Irish pop group.

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                         Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                         Shoot that ain't nothing, I thought Bastard Ale was a disease old bastards like me got. My son said you have a Bastard Ale so I went to the doctor to get checked out!

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                            Jodahposted 10 years agoin reply to this

                            We have an ale here named Pure Blonde! Get that. Haha on the Bastard Ale.

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    Neews Woorldposted 10 years ago

    Whoa a writer who gets their own cubicle -- gives me something to shoot for!!

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    LongTimeMotherposted 10 years ago

    If it was easy to add a TOC, everyone would be doing it and abusing it. I can think of few things worse than a TOC at the top of every hub.

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       Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       I thought TOC was terms and conditions -- what am I missing.
       
       I just modified them for four ecommerce sites and it was really difficult just writing them -- of course that was in Vietnamese ;-)

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    Richawriterposted 10 years ago

    Same ole same ole. Hubpages goes on both quality AND quantity. If you have written a hub of 1000 words or more, then the chances are it has more of both. Therefore it is providing quality information to those searching through Google.
    
    Personally, I think the types of people trawling through those short posts on places like bubbleyou or whatever it is, are not of the sort seeking major advice, the sort of which can be found here at Hubpages.
    
    If I'm searching for info on fishing for example, I don't want a 200 word post, I want pictures, demonstrations and explanations, preferably with a video or two.
    
    The same goes for any subject. Quality and quantity equals useful and saves people going out and buying a manual. Hubpages is a veritable manual on all things and that is why short posts are completely unacceptable.
    
    Who says we can't do short posts anyway? You can. You just ain't gonna get the views and rightly so!
    
    Hubpages is doing a standup job of providing the best info out there and all these new rules and regs are merely pushing those mediocre writers out or to greater heights as they did me. Thanks to them, I've improved immeasurably as a writer and I'm damned if I'll see them promoting short posts that serve as barely more than glorified spam.
    
    Loving it just as it is!
    
    Change is good, yes, and I have seen LOTS of that here.

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       Jodahposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       I write both long articles up to 2000 words and short (what I call micro-poems) with less than 200 words. All my hubs are featured and get traffic, though my short poems generally get more traffic than my longer articles, even though three of my longer works have been given 'editor's choice'. But then I'm writing to please an audience and for my own personal writing pleasure, not to make money.

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          Richawriterposted 10 years agoin reply to this

          Hey Jodah,
          
          Sorry, I was referring to the informational hubs rather than fiction.
          
          As you know, I myself write fiction and it also tends to be shorter in length than my other works but serves a very different purpose.
          
          The informational stuff though, along with videos, quizzes, polls an pics, can be far far better than any short post that only serves to promote rather than assist.
          
          Forums to me, are almost a complete waste of time because amidst the sea of clamoring opinions of which there are a million, very little progress is made and it tends to collapse into attempts at wit and humor which also tends to be poor at best.
          
          But I had to add my opinion to the ocean as it makes sense, what Hubpages are doing.
          
          They simply do not want this site to deteriorate into just another twitter or facebook where masses upon masses of people flood in order to promote their products and sites with no thought for the welfare of the site. Bubblewrap will disappear because its full of liberty takers (not completely) who will flood it with junk and links and bring it down like so many sites before it. Hubpages has set a standard and quite admirably, despite the echoes of dissent that bounce off these walls day in day out, they adhere to those standards and that is what gives me confidence that in 2 years I'll still be here.
          
          On another note, Jodah, I need to go and read your poems.
          
          Take care buddy.
          
          Rich

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             Jodahposted 10 years agoin reply to this

             I agree Rich, I rarely have an interest in visiting forums unless the topic draws me in. I also have Faith in the management of hub pages to stand firm and be solid in their support of quality rather than quantity. I have no interest of checking "bubble wrap". I have been here four years and no intent of changing allegiances. Please do visit my hubs, I look forward to your comments.

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          Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

          Jodah I seldom if ever follow a writer around but I would follow you anywhere!

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             Jodahposted 10 years agoin reply to this

             Same here Eric. I check your forum topics because they are never dull.

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       Ericdierkerposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       Richiawriter great points to think out.
       
       One thing is for sure: The way it is has also made me a better writer -- still not all that good.  :-)
       And I agree when searching - If it is in depth stuff I want and google tells me it is hubpages - that is where I go first.

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       1. 86

          Richawriterposted 10 years agoin reply to this

          But still pretty good!

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17. 87

    IzzyMposted 10 years ago

    I can't believe someone posted in this thread with a hub that consists solely of one video and no words, and no-one noticed  or comented on it.
    Worse, the video is in a foreign language!

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18. 61

    Burntywurntyposted 10 years ago

    Meh, hubpages shouldn't change, every site is different and every site has a different type of audience.
    
    Also I recommend that people stay away from bubblews, the site is maintained in a terrible manner. They only pay people on a random basis while claiming that the people they don't pay broke a rule.
    
    Now this would be acceptable as an explanation, but they never tell you which rule you broke and it is almost impossible to get an answer out of their support team (they only answer 1 question out of the hundreds they get and simply ignore the others)

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    1. 57

       frogpatchposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       I would not write for Bubblews because it sounds like a pre-schoolers TV show, like Bug a Loos. Would you want to send a potential client there to view your writing?  Not me. I have no problem sending them here.

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