What Would You Do If You Found Out Jesus Was Evil?
Just a thought, what would you do if you discovered Jesus was actually evil and people were forced to record him doing all these good deeds? Please keep religious flaming to a non-existent form by the way.
What a bizarre question!
"Please keep religious flaming to a non-existent form by the way."
Seriously? You realize this whole question is an invitation to just that, don't you?
But to answer anyway, such a discovery would have no effect on my behavior because my ethics (such as they are) are based on my own reflections, experience (and probably, as suggested by some recent research) genetic inheritance--not a collection of accounts alleged by some to represent divine revelation.
I know that the chances of people actually not being religious biggots and insulting each other randomly in the comments of each others questions is quite small. One can hope though right?
Good that someone is an independent and unconventional thinker. Such a person sees all sides of the equation.May/may not agree with the question at hand but CrescentSkies has the COURAGE to ask the question.Individuality is ALIVE and WELL!
Really small when you start out calling people bigots yourself.
I'm missing something, That Grrl. Who's the one starting out calling people bigots?
Ponder as quoted from some hubbers hub what the numinous experience is. Consider the third point of this quote. The quote alludes to the numinous experience allegorically as a rope of one with four strands of many threads.
"Strand one is the observer or experience(r) realizes or feels (not necessarily of emotion) an infinite dependence, of self, as well as the world or environment, as insignificant or mundane.
Strand two is mystery or contemplative miracle. This event is beyond measure of explanation and storytelling thusly left in a fog of mystery or simply explained away as “it was a miracle.”
Next, thirdly a strand is woven from terror. A realization encompassed by emotion that what is known by or of the observer or experience(r) or self is not. Analogously one may say, from a theological perspective, whether this theology is of any of those mentioned earlier or not, that evil does exist, it was created and there is one creator.
The fourth and final strand is bliss. The experience(r) or observer or self discovers not necessarily a perception of life, yet more so satisfaction of the yearnings of the human heart, an enveloping of all love, a supreme fulfillment, which can be described as Nirvana, Heaven, Paradise, Salvation, or a “shift.”
From "some hubbers hub"? You quoted that much of their post and could not even give their name? Not good.
Hello That Grrl. If I remember correctly, although memory does fade, an practice of etiquette is not to openly promote one's own hub. I did a "sneaky Pete." That term is from the movie Silverado with Kevin Costner as rookie acting. So, as is = tsmog
If you believe in the Holy Trinity, i.e., God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are one and the same, then you can't help but realize God has a serious mean streak -- just read the Old Testament. I don't think Jesus was perfect - I remember he turned over a few tables which some might classify as an evil act. I just think it was a human act, and all of us exhibit good and evil behaviors. So to answer your question, it wouldn't shock me! What would shock me: is if Jesus while dying on the cross said "Behead them all," instead of "Father forgive them for they know not what they do." Of course, history never gave him the chance to be in a leadership position where heads could be ordered to roll. We leave that to the those that call themselves "Kings." There is a certain irony in all of this, wouldn't you say?
Jesus the man could actually "lose it" and trash a room?! Nice. And I say that to celebrate that you don't have o have a perfect temper to have a perfect soul!
To stanwshura, So what if Jesus trashed a room; that doesn't make him evil.
That is my point, SandCastles. Cliff Notes version of my post: you can "lose it" and still have a perfect soul. Gotta read the whole post before you can make a cogent reply.
Getting angry and mad isn't evil. Rebuking people to not turn God's place in to a marketplace isn't. He just imposed an act of discipline towards people.
What is evil is if you've murdered someone because you didn't managed to control your anger.
Wow, what an odd and intereting question. I truly can't answer it but it is a unique, thought provoking question.
Yes, it is a very thought provoking question.Proves that CrescentSkies is an independent thinker who thinks beyond the sanctioned parameters.I like those kind of people-I am THAT way MYSELF.
gmwilliams, your statement would have looked better if you did not capitalize THAT and MYSELF. 'I am that way myself' sounds confident, the other looks like you are thumping yourself on the chest.
I will only say one thing, what a bizarre question. Even leaving the Bible out of the equation, history proves this to be outlandish.
I don't think Jesus is a big part of history outside of the bible. Christianity was a small religion, not well known, in history. It took a long time to make Hell a big enough threat to get people praying to the Christian god.
History says that Jesus was actually put to death by his own people (the Jewish "government" in power in his area) while a lot of people think it's the Romans who killed him. History is written by the literate victors.
Silly question. History does have a way of being distorted though. J.C. was not evil, but he was passionate in his stance against the governmental exploitation of the people.
I cannot believe he was anything more than a passionate man who was elevated to a position of deity by people who were in dire need of being saved from the oppressiveness of government. The only "evidence" of being anything more than a man came from writings by others who wanted to fuel the people's passions for reform and change.
If he were deemed evil today for any reason, that would never change the adoration of people who believe as they do. We have people today that think Hitler was a "good" man. Go figure.
History judges people in unfair ways. Even Hitler was just one man. All the awful things he did could have been stopped by the people around him. People should never have blind faith in anything. Isn't that what this topic is about?
Jesus was more than a man; he healed people. It's documented that he healed the blind and the deaf and the lame. How does a regular guy do that?
I guess I would still follow him like I have always followed him. But then there are people who don't think Satan is evil.
There are people who don't believe in Satan, Hell or God. It's very liberating and makes you far more aware of being responsible for your own actions - when you stop blaming "evil" as if it's something outside of yourself.
@That Grrl & Lady Guinevere -
We either choose to follow Jesus or Satan. It is written in the Bible Revelation 3:16
- "So, because you are lukewarm (neutral)--neither hot nor cold--I am about to spit you out of my mouth."
Jesus did not say that evil was outside of ourselves. He said it was inside us and told us to guard our thoughts.
The whole book of Revelations was about the Eruption of Mt. Vesuvius in 79 AD
yank: get UR facts straight. J.C. never wrote anything that is in UR bible. All quotes were written by those whose writing were chosen 2 make up the book U quote from. A book produced by the Roman Government.
I invite you to read more on the Holy Bible my friend and pray that the Holy Spirit may guide you and see the truth in Jesus. Blessings.
How do you know the Holy Spirit is not working in anyone?
@Lady Guinevere- If you have been shared that Jesus will save your soul once you die if you only follow and believe him yet you still refuse to believe and don't want to repent.The Holy Spirit guides believers to understand the Bible.
LadyG - the Holy Spirit sees the Holy Spirit. Whenever we allow the Holy Spirit to work in us and see through our eyes, we see everywhere that the Holy Spirit is, and everywhere that the Holy Spirit is not appears empty to us.
SidKemp, who says? When you are born you take in that first breath--that is the Holy Spirit and it does not have a religion or a preference as to what it enters as in human or animal. The Narrow gate is the birth canal and the experience of death..
Lady: sometimes we have 2 let people have their unfounded beliefs. Their fear is real 2 them so we can do no more than state facts as we logically see them. There is no logic in superstition or mysticism.Blind faith is just that-blind
@LadyG, I agree with all you said. The Holy Spirit is in every living thing in every breath. & if we people allow the Holy Spirit to see through our eyes we can learn to see with the loving eyes of the Holy Spirit. I know this from my own experi
@Sidkemp- But for the people who are skeptical and refuse to believe no matter how much you explain the good news of salvation through Jesus Christ, I think you just have to let them go. Let them have their own choice. Spiritual blindness has no cure
Spiritual blindness has no cure? Neither does misguided spirituality as many seem to posses when it comes to the ill conceived bible, et al. You need some psychological help.
If the holy spirit is within us and so the Kingdom of God and everything then there is no allowing for anything. It is already there and cannot be stopped no matter what. It already is the proper vision FROM THE FIRST BREATH WE TAKE..
@d.william- 1Corinthians1:18-"For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God."
@Lady Guinevere-the Holy Spirit is only within the believers in Christ, not for the doubters.
Corinthians was written by Paul, the deceiver to HIS church, not Jesus or about him. I discredit him. Doubters..are those who doubt themselves per Jesus. Not by MAN. So says that Bible if you read it without other interpretation.
@LadyG - agreed again. The Holy Spirit is everywhere and always sees correctly. And so workinrg in each of us. If we allow the Holy Spirit to guide us, we will learn to hear her still small voice and see truly with her eyes. (Shekhina: feminine Heb.)
It truly saddens my heart to see people so entrenched in false teachings by men with agendas that lived 2000 years ago. Religious fear is one of the worst types of mental defect present today
@LadyG I think I interpreted your question differently than you intended. The Holy Spirit indeed works in all people & living things. I took your "how do you know" as "How can we know / see that this is true." Pls re-read my answers in that light
@d.william- That's resembles what the Pharisees told to Christ.That he was insane,their spiritual blindness caused them to their unbelief.
Life here on earth is just preparation to the after life. Either to eternal life or eternal damnation in hell
yank: U have my deepest sympathy for UR misguided beliefs. U cannot judge others by UR own personal beliefs. U can only judge yourself. UR beliefs have nothing 2 do with the fate of others with different views. Nor does ur religion.
It would defy the very principle of spirituality for Jesus to be evil.
I am strongly spiritual of a person and believe as many do that the essence of Jesus is identical to the essence of my higher self. This makes them one and the same.
So for me to believe that Jesus is evil would dictate that I too must therefore be evil. I refuse to believe it.
Spirituality is about your beliefs, however you choose them. Satanists call themselves spiritual too. It's not about good versus evil, just about having faith or beliefs of some kind.
@ That Grrl, yes that is very true. But you must choose wisely what you are in to. Because not all spirituality are equal, there are ones that leads you to the right path and ones that will lead you to destruction.
If He is evil, nothing ever existed was good enough. He inspired and anointed people in all walks in life to write the Bible through the help of the Holy Spirit.
The Bible teaches us every goodness God has thought us. If you think that obeying your parents. loving your fellow, treat people with gentleness,not stealing, not killing, not committing adultery, doing charity, helping the needy, treating you husband or wife with honor, being disciplined, being a wisdom seeker, being fair, giving and sharing to your neighbor is evil. Then nothing ever existed really is good enough.
What would you rather choose, to obey these good things or to be lawless at all?
Were people are free to kill, to steal, have promiscuous intent with your neighbor's wife, to be rude, to cheat and to lie.
What really is evil is your hypothetical question, because you are using the Lord's name in vain. It is clear as a bright sunny day the Jesus is the essence of the ultimate goodness in life.
So there was nothing good until the bible came along?
@ That Girl, yes there is, but the Bible perfected it. It's should be the main foundation, and instructional "how to" manual on how to live a good life ordained by God. The problem is, people rather choose evil than follow Jesus' example.
Mass killing and infanticide should be the norm and done?? Oh come on!
I choose to do my best to live a life dedicated to the Good, and to do that effectively, meticulously, and with humility. This would not change if it turned out that Jesus was not good, or Buddha was not good, or any other person was not good. I'll just keep doing my best.
I have met many a good and even great person who turned out to have an evil side. So, if we think of Jesus as a person, been there, done that.
If you asked, "What if Christ were actuallly evil?" Or, "What if God were actually evil?", that would be a different question. But even if I learned that the world and its creator were fundamentally evil, I would not change what I do. I choose to allow Love and Wisdom to flow through me from its Source and to help all beings be healthy, happy, and harmless.
I would say that in that case, Jesus was no different from other human beings. However, it would not shake my faith in God.
Sorry, But I beg to disagree ms.Wolf, as far as my faith dictates. Jesus wasn't just an ordinary man, He was God made into flesh and blood for the salvation of mankind, clean and pure. He died as a sacrificial lamb. He didn't die just for nothing.
Same thing as if I found out he was good. As far as I'm concerned, it's never been about what Jesus DID, but what he's doing NOW, which currently is nothing. There are a lot of things out there that people SAY he's doing, but they are indistinguishable from random chance to those of us who don't believe, so evil or good, he's pretty much staying out of the way, so I wouldn't give him much thought. I DO happen to believe that Jesus is kind of a prick, but then most people can be that way from time to time, so I won't hold that against him. His Dad though... THAT guy is REALLY evil.
If you were evil and Jesus was the complete opposite of you, then you might think yourself good and Jesus evil. It's all in your point of view.
though there's no such thing as "evil" just ignorance, weakness and laziness, for which pretty sure Jesus was not too riddled with
I think there is such a thing as evil. Some people are down right mean and they know what they are doing.
I am with you in that there is no evil, only consequences to thoughts and deeds.
really? do you really believe there's no such thing as evil? What if someone robbed, raped and murdered your love one, can you still say that? Most people rather choose evil than good and that's a big problem for the World today.
That is not evil. People seem to think everything that happens to them that they cannot explain or hurts them is evil. That is not the truth.
I cannot give a better answer to this than yansky23, so I won't even try.
What is evil? To a certain extent, evil is in the eye of the beholder. In metaphysics, evil is the absence of light (spiritual light), so the bible establishes that Jesus did not have an absence of light. But for your argument's sake, if Jesus were found to be evil, it would destroy the foundation of Christianity. Chaos would reign within the realm of the Christian empire. Your question, though, was "what would you do if you found out ...?" I wouldn't do anything because my whole metaphysical spirituality is not based on just Jesus.
Unusual outlook. Even Pontius Pilate had second thoughts about executing him, offering Barabbas instead. The crowd was 'stage-managed' perhaps. The theological hierarchy, Pharisees and Saducees, wanted his head because he made them look bad. After all these centuries of tradition in the telling of his 'miracles' (which might have been explainable in another age), the man Jesus whom we know to have been executed for subversion against the Roman state was held up as a paragon of virtue and patience - except maybe for the story of his tipping the tables in the temple. His disciples went out through Rome and Greece and put out the word of all these miracles quoted in the four books of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John as well as Paul.
Paul, ex-Saul is said to have had a sudden conversion on the road to Damascus (there's been a few of them, including Col. T E Lawrence, who also wrote books about it)! So what's this about Jesus being a secret Kim Il Sung (or even Stalin or Hitler character) ? Anything's possible, but less probable. If all the previous stories, parables or what you like to call them, are suddenly wrong the question arises: how could one man force these three disciples (one couldn't write, and one of his colleagues wrote two, making them read more similar to one another than the others) into writing glowing reports about him AFTER he'd died? After all, none of his disciples wrote anything about him whilst still alive. Can a man have so much power after being executed (how many hours on a cross)? Neither Hitler nor Stalin had that much control, nor any other dictator since then, after death. Saddam Hussein's power faded even BEFORE he'd been executed. Monsters tend to be vilified after death, not venerated.
I'm no Christian, but this theory is a bit lopsided. Try another one, CrescentSkies, that might hold water.
Then your have been deceived by the evil one as he has always deceived many of us wearing a mask that is untrue, pretending to help us but in reality, wants to use us in his evil ways.
That's why Jesus has told us to beware of false prophets. They come in woolen clothing, yet out to devour us.
Praying through the Holy Spirit for guidance and discernment may guide us to love and the truth in Jesus.
God knows perfectly what is in everyone's heart and everyone's intention. God in Jesus shows the true way to salvation, along with His faithful disciples and followers, along with His Angels and the Blessed Mother, they are all very much alive in Jesus and with Jesus, as with all our faithfully departed. They all lead us to the love of Jesus, that we may know and realize what power there is in love, humility, charity and forgiveness.
Satan trembles in all these as we do it to glorify God in Jesus, and he remains powerless.
The true Jesus, our Lord, Savior and our God, is always true to us. His love and mercy endures forever.
The maternity ward at the inn got the babies mixed up?? Maybe "Jesus Christ!" was mistaken for "Damn it!". Of course, if Cosby rings true it would be awfully funny to pray "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb: Damn It..."
This is a great question.
It's funny how many people dismiss the question and avoid answering it. Why is it so hard to consider for a minute that some irrefutable evidence surfaces that Jesus slaughtered millions of people or something.
I actually think that most people's answer to the question is this: "I would deny it."
To me, it wouldn't matter much as I'm not a follower. Regardless though, the story of Jesus is a parable and something to learn from. Even if Jesus was evil, it doesn't change the story that preceded the discover. People would still be able to learn from the story.
But there isn't any irrefutable evidence that Jesus slaughtered millions so why ask the question. To pose the question, when Jesus was a good man, is a form of slander to me. People spread rumours and will get accused of things based on speculation.
You missed the point. How do you know Jesus was a good man? Reports from people who wanted him to look good but never actually knew him are not reliable.
Lots of people reported his miracles and not all of them wanted Jesus to look good. Some called him a magician (as a put down). The knowledge of Jesus was passed down via verbal stories from people who did know him. He was good.
What could possibly be evil about someone who heals the sick (without charge), feeds the poor when they come to hear him speak (without an admission charge), seeks no political gain, seeks no financial gain, and seeks no power? It is impossible for me to imagine that anyone could find something evil about Jesus.
I can understand people who may not believe he was the son of God, or who may not choose to believe in his reincarnation. These things are difficult for non-believers to grasp, so I can understand their doubt.
However, to believe that he is evil seems like a total distortion of what it means to be evil. Even if Jesus was just a very kind, compassionate, humble and ordinary man, there is nothing evil in that.
It is typical for people to try to find dirt on a good person. They wan to expose the good man as evil and I think that's evil in itself. They whisper, "what if..."
Funny thing, There are no un-believers in HELL, to bad they believe to late.
This is an insanely stupid question and I can't believe I'm replying to it.
Then don't reply to it, keep your mouth shut, and leave the people who are trying to answer my question honestly alone.
How rude to tell someone to keep their mouth shut. Vocalcoach has a right to her opinion just as you have a right to ask your question.
Vocalcoach wasn't exactly the epitome of etiquette in his/her response. I'd say tat deserved tit.
I wouldn't believe it because you can't force everyone to say that black is white; the truth would come out. How could people be forced to record Jesus's good deeds when they weren't recorded until after he died? His disciples were punished for saying that Jesus was good; followers of Jesus were punished for following him. It wasn't an easy path to take. If anything, anybody who spoke against Jesus in those days would be rewarded. They wouldn't be forced to write good things about him. The fact that his good deeds were recorded at all is remarkable considering so many wanted to stomp him and destroy his legacy because he challenged the order of the day.
I believe Jesus was just an ordinary man. I don't believe people are evil, with very few exceptions. People are basically neutral. It takes something more to push them to make choices which are better or worse than neutral. For most people being "evil" is not worth the animosity and consequences. That's just common sense.
Being neutral is a rarity. People are not ruled by rationality;most people are not like Spock. It doesn't take much to push someone to be evil. It takes envy, jealousy, greed, pettiness, ect...and for some just boredom. Groups can be evil.
Being neutral leads to mediocrity and destruction, Matthew 6:24- "No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other."
I remember reading something about the "sinfulness of a hateful heart". And here is Matthew 6:24 contradicting that. This is why I don't read the Bible anymore. No rational person can read it without getting confused or pissed. No THANK you!
@stanwshura-Matthew 6:24 only tells that you must either choose good or evil. If you love what is Good, it is natural to hate what is evil. Don't be mislead. The word "hate" refers on hating what is evil, but not necessarily means hating your fellow.
Interesting question. I know others have probably mentioned this already but, there is no way to ask a question like this and not expect inflammatory answers. From both sides. People are too deeply married to their beliefs to not do this.
The story of Jesus is far enough in history, we really couldn't verify what happened. Frankly, we can't do much to clarify last week because of perspective differences and bias in news and records. Thousands of years? All we can do is take the accounts we have and do our best.
What would I do? I'd get a bit of a chuckle and know that nothing was going to change because of it.
Those who don't believe would accept it easily and may add the information to their repertoire of information regarding proof that religion is BS.
Those who do believe would refute the evidence and no amount of persuasion would change their minds.
Most everyone who commented here or answered the question thought the question was bizzare or weird or some other thing. Clergy only teaches the parts of the Bible that will afford them their parish and un taxable monies. Many books of the Bible were banned at one time and some never even got into the Bible and some were taken out at a later time. There are many stories of Jesus from many other resources. One of which is the Gospel Of Thomas where it is told that Jesus killed a boy when he was young himself. Would you think that evil? Jesus was even in India to learn things and he is said to have some family there while in those years that were no activity about him. He also visited other places that was not told to us in Bible Study or Church. He learned their ways, Pagan cultures and Druids and such that are considered taboo by today's church standards. Religion so indoctrinates their people and followers that they put this maddening fear into them to keep them in their folds. That is evil right there. Jesus was a MAN, a HUMAN and with that he had HUMAN traits. Why is everyone so afraid of where they are going versus what and where they are right now? Why is asking and pondering things so EVIL to begin with? That makes no sense and *I* get pounced on to for just asking simple questions of the Bible. Well you know what...only 10 percent of what is really out there is in that Bible but religious on here seem to think it is totally complete. Where did I get that information...The Bible. Ask Questions, Seek Out Answers and you will receive them. Jesus didn't say that all answers were in that Bible for that Bible was not made while he was alive.
Jesus killed a boy? the Devil can easily spread false information. Satan is the father of liars, he existed to steal and to kill. And many people rather choose to follow him than follow the example of Jesus.
The Infancy Gospel of Thomas is defined as a pseudepigraphical gospel meaning Pseudepigrapha falsely attributed works. It was shown to be b-llsh-t.
The 'Infancy of Gospel of Thomas' and the 'Gospel of Thomas' from the Bible are two different things. It is one Satan's device to erroneously deceive and mislead people.
Really appreciate you posting this answer, been going through a lot of truth searching, found the grail and am currently resisting the easy option of just signing up to a premade chruch and trying to stick to the much harder road of independence.
Yep it is true the church keeps you in the dark at all costs.
Jesus said "Why is my language not clear to you? Because you are unable to hear what I say. You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father's desires."
not a very forgiving message to share, peace and love brother, we're all on a journey, whether it be a humbling pilgrimage or a life devoted to one reigion it's a learning experience imo
Jesus spoke Aramaic and the Bible was Greek, Hebrew and Latin in translations. That verse proves nothing.
The New Testament was written entirely in Greek.
@ mrblueishmouvesky- Jesus said this to the Pharisees, they are religious scholars but are hypocrites and doubts Jesus' power as Lord and Savior.Jesus tried to share the good news of salvation yet they didn't believe him,
Hold on, just to be clear, yansky23, are you saying parts of the bible are the work of the devil?
To coleikird, no yansky is not saying that parts of the bible are from the devil. the Infancy Gospetl is about Thomas the Israelite writing stories about Jesus as a child. No one corroborates these stories. It's not part of the bible.
@coleikerd, there is a false doctrine called "the INFANCY of Gospel of Thomas" were it portrays false stories about Jesus. It was never part of the Bible. It misleads people because those stories are only made up to blemish the Bible's reputation.
It is not possible to find out such a thing! Because someone lies and says He is, will not make it so.
As I have said before, "If you believe, no explanation is necessary, If you don't believe no explanation is possible.
Is this one of those questions where you just want to keep your score up, but can't think of anything relevant to ask ... questions?
After all these years if we find out Jesus is the boogie man ... I guess I'd just dance.
Not a valid question.......Jesus was the SINLESS, SPOTLESS Son of God. He has no sin.......else He wouldn't have been eligible to die on the cross!
Actually, crucifixion was a common method of execution in Jesus' fleshly days. If I recall (and it is a looooong memory from my days of trying to read the Bible), Jesus Christ was *murdered* alongside 2 other "criminals". His glory comes elsewhere.
Hypothetical question deserves a hypothetical answer.
If Jesus was evil there would be no basis for the Christian religions and all would be Muslims.
For me I will do nothing because Jesus is not evil as long as you have faith on him.
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